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Author Topic: Energy from the Ground - Self powered generator by Barbosa and Leal - Clarence  (Read 76025 times)

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Dear Chet.

Many thanks for the map, but I'm not thinking of relocating to the USA just yet!!   :) I will have to see if there's a similar one for the UK.

Well that UFO of Jim's has arrived here so I got out into the garden and placed a random Earth spike, ( rod 2 ) about 18 Feet ( 8 M ) from my established one placed near to the house, ( rod 1). I then ran a 1.5 mm2 fully insulated conductor back to rod 1.

Note 1. Voltage between rods measured 0.257 V DC. The new rod ( rod 2) being +ve. No appreciable current. AC volts range zero.
G
Mr Aking.21 had recently told me about establishing a path, for want of a better word, so I got out my trusty hand cranked 500 VDC MEGGER insulation tester and gave it " what for " ( " the works ") .

Note 2. Voltage between rods measured 1.5 VDC , MEGGER running and then quietly drops back to quiescent. But interestingly there is a small current as well.
As a point of note. Rod 1 has a minimum distance of 40 feet from our Supply Industry aerial ground.

There is much more to come, once my UPS has fully charged. My intention is to try feeding variable frequencies into Rod 2 and see if there is any attenuation of the signal received at Rod 1.

Cheers Grum.


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Dear Chet.

Many thanks for the map, but I'm not thinking of relocating to the USA just yet!!   :) I will have to see if there's a similar one for the UK.

Well that UFO of Jim's has arrived here so I got out into the garden and placed a random Earth spike, ( rod 2 ) about 18 Feet ( 8 M ) from my established one placed near to the house, ( rod 1). I then ran a 1.5 mm2 fully insulated conductor back to rod 1.

Note 1. Voltage between rods measured 0.257 V DC. The new rod ( rod 2) being +ve. No appreciable current. AC volts range zero.
G
Mr Aking.21 had recently told me about establishing a path, for want of a better word, so I got out my trusty hand cranked 500 VDC MEGGER insulation tester and gave it " what for " ( " the works ") .

Note 2. Voltage between rods measured 1.5 VDC , MEGGER running and then quietly drops back to quiescent. But interestingly there is a small current as well.
As a point of note. Rod 1 has a minimum distance of 40 feet from our Supply Industry aerial ground.

There is much more to come, once my UPS has fully charged. My intention is to try feeding variable frequencies into Rod 2 and see if there is any attenuation of the signal received at Rod 1.

Cheers Grum.

You should have LOOPED it! O0


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I have replicated Grumage's experiment.
2  ground rods 10 feet apart.
Initial voltage 0.12 volts between them

Pulsed 2 ground rods at 15 khz approx 11.5 volts.  The voltage started to rise.

On disconnect the voltage was 2.5 volts dropping steadily over several minutes.

Attempt at looping using a high speed HV diode resulted in the voltage dropping to 0.47 volts and staying there for some time.
As this was a surprise I didn't time it .
I haven't completed the experiment. But more to come.

So:  Is the ground acting as a capacitor or are we inducing an ionic pathway for ambient electricity to enter??
Something is happening. That's for  sure.
« Last Edit: 2015-04-22, 01:14:27 by Aking.21 »


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Some preliminary conclusions:

Surprise 1:  The voltage started to rise steadily from 11.5 volts to 12 volts over several minutes.
Surprise 2: On disconnect the voltage fell immediately to 2.5 then slowly declined over several minutes.
Surprise 3: Looping using a HV HF diode resulted in an immediate drop to 0.47 volts steady.

Overall surprise:  the electrical characteristics of the ground was altered by the experiment. :o :o :o


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VAR is just an angle on a scope. Nothing to see here -  move on.
   

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on disconnect: Placing a 100 watt lightbulb across the output of the earth rods reduces the voltage to 0.09 volts

removing the lightbulb and the earth voltage springs back to 1.25. I did this several times with the same result.
So the earth can't be acting as a  capacitor. :o :o :o :o


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Ah Grummage I guess you can't win a coconut with every throw! I've done quite a few batteries but I confess I haven't had one as self willed as that one of yours, on off ,in out is it doing the hokey cokey ? Bless you and Aking for running the experiment though! I can't emphasise enough you can't measure this stuff. I recall one of the guys 3BGS running a 3 Kw fire (off forum) through earth rods looped with an inverter .. he sent pictures of the inside of the battery the main negative post connection was .. I was going to write melted because it looked 'melted' but there was no heat …. no damage to the battery case. but it was destroyed
It is reactive current your collecting I'm sure and capacitive at that (electrostatic)
As I think I explained my chemistry knowledge is woeful . I am spending some time reading through a forum dedicated to batteries ! Batteries ?? (and folks think we are sad messing about with magnets, motors, and coils et-al.)
Being electrically trained Grum you would be as aware as me that a thing with capacitance and inductance is resonant at some frequency although in the case of a LA battery things are always a'changing. Over on this battery forum resonance is in the 'wife's tales' department at best will'o' the wisp. . As you ran a modified SSG for weeks Grum so I have watched a battery ice under load. Bits seemingly unrelated unite . For instance SSG .. good with heavily sulphated batteries not so new batteries. Good with LA batteries not so other types, works well for some folks and has glowing reports' it is a disaster for others.  It's that icing effect and everything that goes with it I'm interested in Grum and much more importantly the why of it. That seems to logically fit to Clarence's machine and many others . Ho hum  Here we go into the hypotheses thing again … I think the sulphated battery is an important part of the equation as the crystals are stable – ish. From the battery boffins over yonder I learn that a battery fully charged or not might be considered to have some level of sulphation. That too fits! As a next stage although It may seem a step backward in time Grum and aking ..  I have sent off for a few odds and sods to knock up the scalar battery charger thing – (or something like) as about 1/2 way down this page

http://www.icehouse.net/john1/tesla.html

It is obvious that  bits of that circuit are wrong particularly the transistor 'charge' switching I am quite sure that John B is wrong in his 3x BC108s I would rather think the charge bit was based on an old push pull circuit … if you regard the transformer less push/pull amplifier on this webpage used in reverse so to speak to charge each capacitor

http://www.learnabout-electronics.org/Amplifiers/amplifiers54.php

and the transistors are a 'complimentary pair' I'm sure you see how both capacitors might be equally charged and then discharged into the battery by the middle transistor then being effectively a closed switch. then the circuit although simple makes perfect sense . consider it for a moment or two and you'll see its just the same circuit ... capacitors in series with a lead acid battery. but one you could adjust to resonance or one of the overtones.
The fact that the radio staff measured the battery as being flat as a pancake means only one thing to me … sulphation , crystals ! Workshops full of  kitchen units and crap but If I can get get some operating space , I intend to revisit that old circuit.
It may not seem to related to Clarence's determined effort or what your seeing happening to your batteries but it seems to mesh together for me . Resonance > crystals> magnetic current AKA reactive current capacitive. I'm not going to put my nadgers on the block just yet but a great deal of reported effects fit and even the effects so far with one component seem worthy of investigation don't you think? If you charge another like this  Grum perhaps on a bit of scrap Granite might be interesting.
Thank you again gents Kind regards Duncan
 
« Last Edit: 2015-04-22, 08:55:23 by Duncan »


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Dear All.

We have become Geologists !!   :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x__NQOtrzf0

Very interesting !! ??

Cheers Grum.


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How many more to be .threatened, abused murdered, Their research in the hands of evil corporations intent on total control ?
http://dnp.s3.amazonaws.com/b/b9/suppressed.pdf
whilst we know little .. friends remember,
In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
D. Erasmus
   

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Dear All.

We have become Geologists !!   :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x__NQOtrzf0

Very interesting !! ??

Cheers Grum.

Grum, a type of pizo electric?????  good old Welsh stone under there maybe!! ;D

regards

Mike 8)


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As a general rule, the most successful person in life is the person that has the best information.
   

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Grum, a type of pizo electric?????  good old Welsh stone under there maybe!! ;D

regards

Mike 8)

Dear Mike.

No, not here  !!  Sat on a Glacial moraine field.  However with such a mish mash of rubbish perhaps Piezo effect is being witnessed. 

I am really getting into this subject, so at great expense another couple of rods were purchased and another placed  1 M further West  and put in parallel with Rod 2. Interestingly a rise in potential is seen, not much but very noticeable non the less.

Just for entertainment !!   :)  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcPu4Ie47vA

Cheers Grum.


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for consideration https://vimeo.com/78669064
and this The energy could light lamps, power machines, inhibit electromagnetic propagation such as radio waves and stop or control electromagnetic induction, and also develop antigravity effects and is involved in the life process from here ..

http://www.rexresearch.com/rota2/rota.htm
« Last Edit: 2015-04-23, 06:21:34 by Duncan »


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How many more to be .threatened, abused murdered, Their research in the hands of evil corporations intent on total control ?
http://dnp.s3.amazonaws.com/b/b9/suppressed.pdf
whilst we know little .. friends remember,
In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
D. Erasmus
   

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Dear All.

Can anyone pick up the gauntlet from me ?

I have just finished an experiment injecting the rod 8 M away with a Sinus wave and looking at the signal at the closest rod.  I saw no unusual signal until the 1 mhz frequency where the received signal appeared to be larger than the applied one.

Unfortunately my FG maxes at 1.6 mhz. I wonder if anyone can push this boundary to see if the effect is both valid and maybe even increases the received signal ?

Cheers Grum.


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member dragon at Energetic has had some interesting experiments
from here post number 339
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20091-barbosa-leal-devices-info-replication-details-12.html
dragon
Quote
I became interested in the B&L device primarily because I was looking for a current source, the basics of this is current. I wound up a toroid and with a little experimentation I found I could generate 400 amps with a mere 15 watt input - beautiful - with some nichrome strands I should be able to heat water with very little energy. I noticed something else from this... I wrapped a coil of 1/0 cable around an 8" PVC form to reduce the draw on the primary of the torroid which dropped the input down to 8 watts, still providing the overall 400 amp/T ratio when I noticed a ceramic magnet more than 6 ft away chattering bringing it close to the coil was amazing - that shouts motor drive quite loudly to me. No magic just plain logic and truth.
   

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member dragon at Energetic has had some interesting experiments
from here post number 339
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20091-barbosa-leal-devices-info-replication-details-12.html
dragon
Quote
I became interested in the B&L device primarily because I was looking for a current source, the basics of this is current. I wound up a toroid and with a little experimentation I found I could generate 400 amps with a mere 15 watt input - beautiful - with some nichrome strands I should be able to heat water with very little energy. I noticed something else from this... I wrapped a coil of 1/0 cable around an 8" PVC form to reduce the draw on the primary of the torroid which dropped the input down to 8 watts, still providing the overall 400 amp/T ratio when I noticed a ceramic magnet more than 6 ft away chattering bringing it close to the coil was amazing - that shouts motor drive quite loudly to me. No magic just plain logic and truth.


I think somebody's gone badly off the rails here. Of course we already know that "Dragon" isn't about to share the details of how he accomplished this miracle of "just plain logic and truth", nor just how the measurements were made.  Has he perhaps confused average power with peak power, RMS current with instantaneous peak current? When will we see the cup of water brought rapidly to boil with the 15, or better 8 Watts input to a coil producing 400 amps output to "some nichrome strands"?

Here's what just 10 Amps RMS current looks like, going through some 5mm Nichrome ribbons:






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HMM
here is a circuit he mentions in regard to a query about the claim.
and some text
dragon
Quote
I haven't built the NiChrome drum to fully test the idea of heating water, only small tests with a 200 watt bulb for heat output - tested but not confirmed. The other is the diagram for the magnetic field. This actually opened a door for some interesting ideas as solutions to some previous projects that have stumped me for some time now... 
end quote

**original post number 342 here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/20091-barbosa-leal-devices-info-replication-details-12.html
   

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Dragon also claimed free energy from a simple three plate capacitor, and also I think from a setup using a plate between two batteries, however there was no evidence to support his claims. That did not stop Patrick Kelly wanting to put the dodgy system in his free energy devices book, just like 99 % of all the other BS in his book it is just a claim with no evidence. The PJK free energy devices book is one of the biggest sources of garbage in these forums, that and the PESWIKI site. Almost everything in the book or on the site is rubbish, better to not read them. They are worse than a waste of time. Dragons words mean very little to me as he makes no sense and provide no evidence for his claims.

..
   

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I can show you 400 amps with only about 8 to 10 watts input. But the 400 amps isn't output is it ? If it was it would be associated with voltage and power value, the 400 amps is just a measured value in the setup. If anyone puts a couple of turns of thick wire around a toroid that has a 220 to 240 volt primary winding on it they can also see some 400 amps or so of current on the wire. It doesn't mean anything. The output power or the energy dissipated in/from the load compared to the input power is what matters. 400 amps so what ? What of it ? What was the load and what was the voltage across the load ? Not to mention those things is leading people up the path. Dragon has no free energy either except for the solar and wind and whatever else he has inputting power to his system batteries, if he did he would not be still on the grid. I'll bet my leftie that the solar and wind are by many magnitudes the biggest inputs to his system.

..
   

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@Grum
 http://www.collective-evolution.com/2015/08/12/see-how-the-dutch-are-generating-100-sustainable-electricity-from-plants/

I think this is what happens when we apply Faraday's thought that--- it does not matter how the change occurs only that it does. Many are simply close minded and cannot seem to understand that the only requirement for a power source of any magnitude is that ... some electrons move. It does not matter how or why only that they move and if we actually open our eyes we find they are always moving everywhere despite our complete lack of a meaningful perspective.

We know "change" is everywhere in everything and it is simply a matter of translating this change to moving electrons and we have a power source...period.


AC


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Everyman decries immorality
We know "change" is everywhere in everything and it is simply a matter of translating this change to moving electrons and we have a power source...period.

AC

Yes, having a potential difference is the key. However, if that potential difference is within a closed system it can only ever be COP<1 (coefficient of performance less than 1).

We can build machines (receivers) to convert environmental energy to useful output energy such as electricity from a solar panel. This is classed as COP = infinity (nonsense term) but has a COP<1 cycle within the solar panel.

Only an open system can be COP>1 (greater than) so it follows that you must couple an environmental source of energy input somehow in your design. (like heat pumps)


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Only an open system can be COP>1 ...

And I will stress, if you are not in control of everything that happens at an atomic level or smaller, all systems composed of matter are in fact open systems.

I have yet to see any device sitting on a workbench that is completely isolated from the environment.  Take just gravity as one example; ambient heat as another.
   

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Quote from: evolvingape on 2015-09-18, 15:17:18
Only an open system can be COP>1 ...

And I will stress, if you are not in control of everything that happens at an atomic level or smaller, all systems composed of matter are in fact open systems.

I have yet to see any device sitting on a workbench that is completely isolated from the environment.  Take just gravity as one example; ambient heat as another.

You can break most systems down into sub systems, which will be either open or closed. The black box approach is most effective at determining a system COP.

The relationship of the fundamental forces to those systems is an open or closed black box approach.

Open system (systems theory)


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_system_%28systems_theory%29

An open system is a system that has external interactions. Such interactions can take the form of information, energy, or material transfers into or out of the system boundary, depending on the discipline which defines the concept. An open system is contrasted with the concept of an isolated system which exchanges neither energy, matter, nor information with its environment. An open system is also known as a constant volume system or a flow system.

The concept of an open system was formalized within a framework that enabled one to interrelate the theory of the organism, thermodynamics, and evolutionary theory.[1] This concept was expanded upon with the advent of information theory and subsequently systems theory. Today the concept has its applications in the natural and social sciences.

In the natural sciences an open system is one whose border is permeable to both energy and mass.[2] In physics a closed system, by contrast, is permeable to energy but not to matter.

Open systems have a number of consequences. A closed system contains limited energies. The definition of an open system assumes that there are supplies of energy that cannot be depleted; in practice, this energy is supplied from some source in the surrounding environment, which can be treated as infinite for the purposes of study. One type of open system is the so-called radiant energy system, which receives its energy from solar radiation – an energy source that can be regarded as inexhaustible for all practical purposes.

Closed system

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_system

A closed system is a physical system which does not allow certain types of transfers (such as transfer of mass) in or out of the system. The specification of what types of transfers are excluded varies in the closed systems of physics, chemistry or engineering.

Isolated system

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isolated_system

In physical science, an isolated system is either (1) a thermodynamic system which is completely enclosed by walls through which can pass neither matter nor energy, though they can move around inside it; or (2) a physical system so far removed from others that it does not interact with them, though it is subject to its own gravity. Usually an isolated system is free from effects of long-range external forces such as gravity. The walls of an isolated thermodynamic system are adiabatic, rigid, and impermeable to matter.

This can be contrasted with what is called a closed system, which is selectively enclosed by walls through which energy but not matter can pass, and with an open system, which both matter and energy can enter or exit, though it may have variously impermeable walls in parts of its boundaries.

An isolated system obeys the conservation law that its total energy–mass stays constant.

Because of the requirement of enclosure, and the near ubiquity of gravity, strictly and ideally isolated systems do not actually occur in experiments or in nature. They are thus hypothetical concepts only.

Black box

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_box

In science, computing, and engineering, a black box is a device, system or object which can be viewed in terms of its inputs and outputs (or transfer characteristics), without any knowledge of its internal workings. Its implementation is "opaque" (black). Almost anything might be referred to as a black box: a transistor, algorithm, or the human brain.

The opposite of a black box is a system where the inner components or logic are available for inspection, which is most commonly referred to as a white box (sometimes also known as a "clear box" or a "glass box").


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Everyman Standing Order 01: In the Face of Tyranny; Everybody Stands, Nobody Runs.
Everyman Standing Order 02: Everyman is Responsible for Energy and Security.
Everyman Standing Order 03: Everyman knows Timing is Critical in any Movement.
   
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