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Topic: Dr. Stiffler SEC circuits  (Read 20973 times) Print
Groundloop
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« on: 2011-02-07, 06:43:59 »
Has anybody tried to replicate this:

http://www.youtube.com/user/StifflerDr#p/a/u/0/-K5yyQgYdgo

GL.
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MileHigh
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« Reply #1 on: 2011-02-07, 07:01:16 »
Myself and Poynt discussed this earlier this evening.  It doesn't smell right to me at all.  I suspect that his "ground connection" is actually the power input, and the power source is another SEC off-screen.  It's possible that there may be psychological factors at play here.

Along the same lines, there is always the option to take fine magnet wire and route power to the device.  This will simply not be picked up by the camera.  I actually thought that's what Mylow was doing.  As we know, what he did was not done with fine electrical wires that couldn't be picked up by the camera, but it was done with fine fishing line that drove his rotors, and that couldn't (almost) be picked up by the camera.
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darkspeed
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« Reply #2 on: 2011-02-07, 17:13:22 »


I would not be so quick to claim smoke and mirrors on this guy.

He is doing a few things that signals he knows what he is doing.

Choke and carbon resistor to ground - gives the L1 / L2 a ground reference without dragging down the oscillation in the coils.

Variable air cap on the L1 ( I assume ) to fine tune to the inductance of L1

Parts are mounted above the pcb to remove the stray capacitance from screwing with the frequency until the design is perfected where everything can be locked down.

The problems I see are:

Lots of electronic equipment in the near field
Lots of AC in the near field
Dont know how clean that ground line is

Special custom transistor that requires no heat sink - everyone throws one of these in to discourage replicators

Other that the above - I like it..
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Grumpy

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ExB=qr/t

« Reply #3 on: 2011-02-07, 18:31:44 »
Why do people have to make "cold current" sound so mysterious?   It's everywhere, just not at vast amplitudes.

Any non-ionic current does not produce resistive heating since the particles are not flowing through a conductor.  Polar dielectrics may heat up.

What would cause millions of haze lines in a block of acrylic?
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darkspeed
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« Reply #4 on: 2011-02-07, 19:03:14 »

I was surprised it was a transistor and not a tube.

I wonder what the Rtt is on the AV Plug - could use tubes there as well and get a better result - sorry... a more complete result.
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MileHigh
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« Reply #5 on: 2011-02-07, 21:20:29 »

Choke and carbon resistor to ground - gives the L1 / L2 a ground reference without dragging down the oscillation in the coils.

Variable air cap on the L1 ( I assume ) to fine tune to the inductance of L1

Parts are mounted above the pcb to remove the stray capacitance from screwing with the frequency until the design is perfected where everything can be locked down.

The problems I see are:

Lots of electronic equipment in the near field
Lots of AC in the near field
Dont know how clean that ground line is

Special custom transistor that requires no heat sink - everyone throws one of these in to discourage replicators

Other that the above - I like it..

If you assume that the output is feeding back to the input to charge the electrolytic capacitor via the avramenko plug, the you don't need an external ground reference.  The ground of the electrolytic capacitor that allegedly supplies power to the circuit is a perfectly good stand-alone ground reference.  There is a lot of misunderstanding and disinformation out there about grounds and ground references.

You can also assume that he needs the variable air cap to work with L1 to make a tank circuit that resonates with the external excitation signal which may be coming from what he is stating is his external ground reference line.  In other words, it's just a standard "single wire" energy transmission system that needs to be tuned.  I put "single wire" in quotations also because that in itself is a misnomer.

The "special custom transistor" is also a big red flag that should make you very wary of what Mr. Stiffler is saying here.  If he said "specially qualified transistor" that would be a different thing, implying that he had to go through a batch of standard transistors to find one with performance characteristics that met his requirements.  However, I even find that logic to be very weak.  In my opinion there is almost no reason that the normal variability associated with a given transistor part number should pose a major problem for the type of stuff that he is doing.  Finally, if you take the literal interpretation of "special custom transistor" at face value, then that doesn't make much sense either.  Certainly no semiconductor company has made a "special custom transistor" for Mr. Stiffler because he would probably have to buy a million of them to get them to do a custom design just for him.  So that leaves him finding a non-standard transistor at an electronics recycling place and calling it a "special custom transistor."

MileHigh
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Grumpy

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« Reply #6 on: 2011-02-07, 21:44:11 »
I can't see youtube, is he avalanching the transistor?
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Grumpy

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« Reply #7 on: 2011-02-07, 21:48:47 »
Last I looked at Stiffler's stuff it was the same basis as the Avramenko Devices.

Avramenko wrote a paper on the conversion of displacement current to conduction current (via the "plug"), but I have never been able to find a copy of this paper.  Attached is his patent.
-------------------------------
* Avramenko_6104107_Method_and_apparatus_for_single.pdf (75.07 KB - downloaded 374 times.)
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MileHigh
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« Reply #8 on: 2011-02-07, 22:08:12 »
Grumpy:

In his clip it appears that he has a self-sustaining SEC-type circuit lighting up some white LEDs with a wire that ostensibly connects to an external gound.

I looked at the abstract for the Avramenko patent.  Was it granted?  I would be shocked if it was.

There is a simple explanation for the operation of the Avramenko plug.  When the voltage is rising in the wire the diode that points towards the positive terminal of the load briefly conducts a puff of (positive) charge towards the positive terminal.  When the voltage is falling the diode that points away from the negative terminal of the load briefly conducts a puff of charge away from the negative terminal.  This is all due to stray capacitance.  i = C dv/dt.  With a very small C and a very large dv/dt you can still get a substantial amount of current flow.  If the AC frequency is high enough then it looks almost like DC current and can run small electric motors or light LEDs, etc.

The stray capacitance is responsible for your displacement current and the substrate/ground plane forms the "second wire."  There is no such thing as true single wire energy transmission and no electrical engineer would bat an eyelash at an Avramenko plug.  They would take it as a given and not give it a second thought.  In the real world you can't use high frequency AC for power transmission just like you can't use ######-style pulse motors as motors.  All of this stuff produces ridiculous amounts of interfering high-frequency EMI radiation and you wouldn't be able to use your cell phones, radios, or televisions.

MileHigh
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darkspeed
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« Reply #9 on: 2011-02-07, 23:27:44 »
If you assume that the output is feeding back to the input to charge the electrolytic capacitor via the avramenko plug, the you don't need an external ground reference.  The ground of the electrolytic capacitor that allegedly supplies power to the circuit is a perfectly good stand-alone ground reference.  There is a lot of misunderstanding and disinformation out there about grounds and ground references.
MileHigh

Unless he specifically needed to change the coils from 1/2 wave to 1/4 wave in which you would need a true ground reference rather than just a virtual ground capacitance
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Grumpy

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ExB=qr/t

« Reply #10 on: 2011-02-07, 23:50:11 »
Is there any indication that Stiffler is lighting the LEDs with the "cold current" or is it with conventional current?  The common "cold current" demonstration is to light an incandescent lamp and the light will have broad-spectrum white output.  The bulb will also attract conductive objects like a charged sphere does.

Is the light the same as if connected to a common DC supply? Or is it broad spectrum indicative of some sort of deceleration radiation producing visible photons? (like Bremsstrahlung)

Avramenko mentions improved efficiency, but he doesn't say it runs with gain or adds energy in any way.
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darkspeed
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« Reply #11 on: 2011-02-07, 23:51:16 »

I guess he could have killed the transistor " failed open " and is using it for a micro calibrated gap.. would that work?
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MileHigh
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« Reply #12 on: 2011-02-08, 00:09:44 »
Unless he specifically needed to change the coils from 1/2 wave to 1/4 wave in which you would need a true ground reference rather than just a virtual ground capacitance

It sounds to me like you are talking about antenna theory.  Why would that be applicable here unless I am missing something?  BTW, the wavelength in free space for 9.3 MHz is 32.26 meters.  The only issue from what I can see is that if there is indeed a self-powering oscillator in his setup then it needs a source of DC potential difference and that comes from the capacitor that is allegedly being recharged from the oscillator output.  This implies that energy has to materialize out of nowhere if what he is saying is true.

Grumpy:

All that you can see are white LEDs being powered.  Beyond that I don't believe in the concept of "cold current."  That concept only exists in the realm of free energy and whenever I have seen a demonstration clip of "cold current" it was clearly conventional current in action.

MileHigh

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Grumpy

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« Reply #13 on: 2011-02-08, 01:11:35 »
I noticed that Stiffler uses the two diodes like Avramenko, but not the capacitor between the diodes and the load (placed in parallel).  Avramenko also used HV, and had a gap across the capacitor.

So, if I understand this correctly, Stiffler is saying that he has a circuit that generates "cold current", this is converted to conventional current by the diodes, then this is fed back to power the circuit.  

Where is the mechanism for "gain"?

There would have to be a greater amount of current in the portion of the circuit after the transformer, where the "cold current" starts.  So, maybe not all of the cold current is "converted" to light, and enough is left over to power the circuit.  hmmm....

In one of his old articles that I saved, he measured a variable currnet of 105mA to 450mA in the ground connection (earthed).  He felt this was very interesting at the time.  This was back in 2007.

EDIT:
If Stiffler has "gain", why hasn't he scaled this up for a more impressive display?
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poynt99

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It's not as complicated as it may seem...

« Reply #14 on: 2011-02-08, 14:45:20 »
Someone passed on this message to me:

Quote
"The transistor the Doctor is using is not commercially available. The unit was designed in-cooperation with a semiconductor company to construct a unit that improved on the factors present in the MPSA06 that allows a Negative Resistance operation. These units are extremely expensive as the design and production of only one-thousand units for initial research was done. If the work is allowed to progress the transistors may go into a normal production mode by this company - although may be of limited number.

Some basic parms are the average unit has an hfe of 400-750 and a Vbe of as low as 0.17 volts. The units will display an equivalent negative resistance of 0.7 ohm for a voltage of 8.5 volts. As the Doctor states one should stay tuned to what may be coming and again conditions can change this outcome"

He assured me that Doc Stiffler is involved in the development of this transistor. The Joule Thief enthusiasts will be happy if this ever becomes available.

.99
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Grumpy

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« Reply #15 on: 2011-02-08, 16:01:30 »
Too many people equate negative resistance with something for nothing, and it sounds so "Beardenesque"...

On other fronts, I am finding that space can store a lot of energy if you can keep polarizing it.  Like an active capacitor.
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macedonia cd
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« Reply #16 on: 2011-02-08, 19:50:16 »
HELOO TO ALL oh sory my caps lock again Wink
 
beacouse i dont have ansfer on yuotbe from stifleri liketo ask ask him here i to this .. i see spektrum analiser tha has and he say no inputs rf. did is posible   to make anthere test  out of his test room  if is working then  he has something  BUT is no true explane how much we whill have energy from somerf. transmiters  or lets say we hve  1 waat rf transmiter  in on room place and then we have 1000000 recivers whitout batery only on coil and two diodes and tune to that transmiter and pick up enrgy more then the rf transmiter give as   im very interesthing what stifler thing  is posible whit 1 waat rf transmiter to have more then 1 waat to all recivers there if his on reciver there  make to light leds there then  let make 10 recivers to see  did whill have able tolight more leds.
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Chet K
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Posts: 1173
« Reply #17 on: 2011-02-25, 12:07:39 »
Some Brand New, Very informative  Movies from the Doc!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXYY7TqS380

Ben Is very excited about recent developements,
K4Zep
Quote

Well gang, there are 3 more Stiffler videos on YouTube that pretty well show how he does that 3 coil version.  My Hat's off to him for giving everyone this guidance.  Schematic, tips, really first rate information. Emphasis on isolation, position, etc.  

Only thing he doesn't mention but once is that it has to be excited to start it, then it runs, if that is the way I heard it.  I have everything to build it, test it, just have to wind 3, 22uH coils and match them at their approximately 25mhz self resonant frequency.  It appears that the better you match the three coils, the better it will work.  Then too, why not excite the 3 coil system with a SEC board operating in low power mode, feeding power back into the SEC via the AV Plug.  As voltage and power loops back to the power rails and increases, it should then click into high power mode if kept on the right frequency and you have the best of both worlds. Just thinking out loud.

Right ON,
Ben
------------------------------------
And
MH appears to be famous over here,
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3457.2895

Seems Like Wilby wants to "learn" Him a few tings?

Chet

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MileHigh
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« Reply #18 on: 2011-02-25, 12:23:27 »
MH appears to be famous over here,
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3457.2895

Seems Like Wilby wants to "learn" Him a few tings?

Chet

Yeah I followed the link!  WilbyInebriated has been reading me faithfully for years!  He is a fan!  It's so funny because it's a total spin zone sometimes.
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Chet K
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Posts: 1173
« Reply #19 on: 2011-02-25, 12:29:01 »
Mornin MH,
Stiffler Lights any more Leds in that Vid he's Gonna Get a sunburn! [maybe some other kind of Burn]

I Still can't hear vids ,Hows he say he's doing it?

Thanks
Chet
PS
I sure would Love to hear LTbolo's take on this,seems like the Doc is doing Lt's theory?
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MileHigh
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« Reply #20 on: 2011-02-25, 12:51:44 »
Mornin MH,
Stiffler Lights any more Leds in that Vid he's Gonna Get a sunburn! [maybe some other kind of Burn]

I Still can't hear vids ,Hows he say he's doing it?

Thanks
Chet
PS
I sure would Love to hear LTbolo's take on this,seems like the Doc is doing Lt's theory?

Top of the morning to you.  He doesn't say that much about how he is doing it.  He just says it's an extension of the previous clip where he is now lighting more LEDs.  I think it must be smoke and mirrors!

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b4e_1298528078

Yikes!
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Chet K
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« Reply #21 on: 2011-02-25, 13:00:06 »
Thanks MH
Yikes is right!! Yeesh too!
I didn't need sound for that one!
Chet
PS
You Don't think The Doc "edits" too??
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Chet K
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Posts: 1173
« Reply #22 on: 2011-02-25, 17:53:53 »
Ben says
IT WORKS!!
Quote:

Hi Gang,

Stiffler's 3 coil circuit works.  Checked Spectrum analyzer after video and it is Osc. all over the place,  seems to amplify all the signals over
a 2-300mhz band.  IF it locks in on a strong(just a few microvolts!)   enough local signal, lights led.
My coils are a bit smaller in inductance in the L1-3 coils of stiffler and open resonance is almost 50 mhz instead of the 26 to 28 mHz of his but
it definitely works.  Right on Dr. Stiffler.  Enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLl0Vs-vO0w

Ben......from the worlds smallest lab....

--------------------------
And MH
Just for the record,I value your opinion on this!

Chet
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Chet K
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Posts: 1173
« Reply #23 on: 2011-02-26, 02:00:08 »
Ben posted another vid
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAXP-gnjATM
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Chet K
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« Reply #24 on: 2011-02-26, 11:55:57 »
Ben says "High current!",Time to loop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUhLyrDE2qw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUhLyrDE2qw




Chet
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