Healthy skepticism and critical inquiry is part of the due diligence required in examining any device that claims an abundance of "free energy".
This thread hopes to serve that purpose.
We can simply "fake" a lot of devices like the TK device, with batteries, especially the high capacity low loss technologies that exist today. You can even fake it with a cell phone Lithium battery pack! Who said your cell phone can't light up the world! :o :D
But we need efficiency, and pumping DC through a light bulb is not the way to go. We can make it look like the lightbulb is lit brightly, if it is pulsed. How long the "fake" lasts is another subject. If we just want to make it look like we can light light bulbs, we can do it, but not for too long.
TK, is connected to a source of power, that's evident!
EM
Does everyone remember LaserSabre's power strip plugged into itself and how it was able to appear to light incandescent globes and
heater elements. He won't say how exactly it is done as far as I know. When that happens the person should be hounded until the method is revealed
or alienated from the community. It was quite a good trick but it was a trick and many people were sucked in. I don't mind a trick or two myself I play tricks on people,
but I never leave hem frustrated and stressed because of me I show them what I did so they might be more vigilant. Them being more vigilant might help me.
Lasersabre as a bit of an illusionist could use his talents to help many people rather than use it to get a laugh at others expense.
I get funny feeling about people and sometimes I watch a video and immediately get the feeling it's somehow faked. I feel challenged and my intuition see's alarm bells.
Tariel does give me a funny feeling. I spent quite a bit of time in my younger wild days surrounded by devious dishonest people, I'm not proud of it, it just is how it is,
being in a situation like that teaches one to "read people" or be consistently victimized. I can't say I am right of course and I would hate to make accusations of
a person and be wrong. The stakes are high.
I look at it like this, the circuitry is a minor detail, circuitry can be devised to do almost anything, the basic working principal is where the real value would be,
idea's can't be taken away, they can divulged by force or otherwise but the original possessor still has his knowledge. This is why i believe patents are not really lawful.
I don't see how anyone could hope to go to see a demonstration by Tariel and start demanding to test things or to see in his boxes, he would never allow it, that's how he makes money
it would appear to be worth while.
There is the possibility that he could be transmuting (or whatever it's called) the copper rod, but that is i think already possible and not considered any more OU than any other fuel based device.
Which brings up another problem, once the previously unknown source of the energy is discovered or revealed, is it still over unity ? If not, then was it ever ? Some would say that as long as we don't know
what the energy source is then it's Over Unity. That's not good logic because that means if the source of energy is the grid and we or him don't know that then it's considered Over Unity.
Regardless safe clean energy use is what we need, it does not matter how we define it. I don't think any of the guys like Tesla, Moray ect. ever stated that energy can be created from nothing.
There must be a source of energy.
Without actually testing some idea's I can only speculate, It was my hope that if I show the idea's I get some more experienced folks might consider them and say if the idea's are possible or point out the reasons why not.
High frequency vibrations applied to the Earth are dissipated in a shorter distance but low frequency vibrations can travel great distances through the ground, eg. an electric fence operating at less than one Hz can transfer good energy for long distances. If high energy pulses at 10 Hz or something were applied to the ground what would happen. Is it possible to tap the ULF energy which may be transmitted by the militaries for towed antenna arrays for submarines and such ? I would imagine they would use harmonics of the planet or something. Maybe Tesla's system is in use and we just need to tune in to it. If everyone started doing it they would need to transmitt more power then, and it may become a serious crime to do that. What I think it boils down to is the military already has what we seek, if not they are slackers. I wonder what would happen if I won the lottery and tried to build a full size
resonant transformer to work at lower frequencies like below 15 Khz.
If ULF towed antenna arrays exist and ULF energy is transmitted at high levels of power then why can't we tap the waves ? If Tariel was tapping such an energy source would that be Over Unity considering taxpayers would
pay for the energy to be transmitted.
Many possibilities. Has anyone yet tried to transmit or receive 50/60 Hz resonantly through the ground Tesla style ? Using any steel cored transformer. Or some other way ?
If it's not faked as such, I think Tariel has a known source of energy even if "he" doesn't know it.
Cheers
Taking the 'Green Box' series of seven videos, the array of not very brightly lit lamps are switched on for only very short periods of time. Added to that, there are wires all over the place, including a 'washing line' running from the fence over to trees in the garden, which could well be the cable seen running along the ground (not easily spotted) behind the line of people around the demo table. The cable then runs under the lamp array and disappears from view close to the table. there is far too much going on in this series of videos to rule out faking. Also, we see a guy stripping a wire with what looks like a kitchen knife! He then crudely twists it together with another wire! My intuition certainly shouts that this is not a 'free energy' or 'energy transmutation' demo.
The aqua2 video is a bit more refined but TK refused to allow the visiting inspection team to carry out any meaningful tests, in particular disconnecting the braided 'earth' wire and closely inspecting it for concealed conductors. Although it appears from many other photos that the team were allowed to photograph freely, there have been no high res shots presented to cover the complete length of the 'earth' braid, so it begs the question - was this braid inspected closely along its entire length.
Hoppy
From Hoppy:
QuoteThe aqua2 video is a bit more refined but TK refused to allow the visiting inspection team to carry out any meaningful tests, in particular disconnecting the braided 'earth' wire and closely inspecting it for concealed conductors. Although it appears from many other photos that the team were allowed to photograph freely, there have been no high res shots presented to cover the complete length of the 'earth' braid, so it begs the question - was this braid inspected closely along its entire length.
In some of the videos the ground wire could have been coax with the outer plastic covering removed. It would resemble braid but could have an inner conductor that carries the mains power. A clever system of lugging would make it look like a single grounded wire.
You might say that the ground wire in the aquarium video is too small in diameter and too flexible to be coax.....not so. Quality coax can be made in small diameters with high shield coverage and is quite flexible.
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.07, 21:18:50
...
There is the possibility that he could be transmuting (or whatever it's called) the copper rod, but that is i think already possible and not considered any more OU than any other fuel based device.
Which brings up another problem, once the previously unknown source of the energy is discovered or revealed, is it still over unity ?
...
Interesting question. To answer this question, we need to answer another one: what do we call "over unity"?
For me an "overunity" machine is an
apparently closed system having just an input and an output, and obeying two conditions:
- a quantity of energy X is provided to the input and a quantity of energy Y > X is obtained at the output
AND
- the final state of the machine is strictly identical to the start state (nothing consumed inside).
When this situation appears, we may think that:
- we have a perpetual motion machine of the first kind
OR
- the machine taps an unknown source of energy (it is not really "closed")
the second case being a priori the more likely.
In brief,
apparently the machine doesn't obey the conservation of energy.
When the unknown source is discovered, we are left with an ordinary machine. The "overunity" property can be forgot and replaced by the energy depletion of the source.
If the TK's machine was a nuclear device, it would be no more overunity because it becomes obvious that its internal state would change during the operation, due to transmutations. But we are pragmatic and only the result has to be taken into account: we would have energy at very low price, which is our final goal (imho).
In the TK's first video, I don't see how conventional energy could be stored inside some components of the machine and produce the strong steady brightness of the lamps, question of volume not large enough. But I agree that this can be discussed.
A fake could be made using a hidden cable connected to the mains, or by induction from a big coil hidden in the ground or from a powerful HF transmitter. An HF transmitter is less likely, because the movements of objects or people in the surrounding would absorb a part of the energy and cause changes of the brightness (provided there is no electronics for regulating the output power received from the transmitter, which is also possible).
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.08, 15:32:19
From Hoppy:
In some of the videos the ground wire could have been coax with the outer plastic covering removed. It would resemble braid but could have an inner conductor that carries the mains power. A clever system of lugging would make it look like a single grounded wire.
You might say that the ground wire in the aquarium video is too small in diameter and too flexible to be coax.....not so. Quality coax can be made in small diameters with high shield coverage and is quite flexible.
Looking at the few close-up shots of the braid, shows that it is fairly flat but it does vary slightly in width along its length, so i think it more likely that TK has used braided hose (used to encase conductors for shielding purposes) which has been flattened to give the look of a flat earthing braid. Any inner conductors could be in the form of a ribbon cable.
Hoppy
Quote from: Hoppy on 2012.09.08, 16:48:31
Looking at the few close-up shots of the braid, shows that it is fairly flat but it does vary slightly in width along its length, so i think it more likely that TK has used braided hose (used to encase conductors for shielding purposes) which has been flattened to give the look of a flat earthing braid. Any inner conductors could be in the form of a ribbon cable.
Hoppy
I agree, however the low resolution video and my less than perfect vision cannot resolve what is shown.
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.08, 17:07:37
I agree, however the low resolution video and my less than perfect vision cannot resolve what is shown.
Myself and others on the OU.com forum have requested to see the original high res video and any other photos that show close-ups of the braiding.
Hoppy
Ex, check out these video's ,meet me half way and look at them.
These video's are of the 100kw turkey device built by
TK for the Turks.Notice that they use resistive loads,lights and an
electric motor,they check the input and outputs.It is easy to believe
that the small devices TK made could be fake,this one not so easy.
Ask the question to the non believers how did he fool the Turks,see if they have an answer.
The fat old bald guy in the suit is in the 2004 video,connected to the Turks in some way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtadR0skY00
This video places TK and assistant in the turkey video directly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKFW1uwLN3U&feature=relmfu
I believe only whats in the metal boxes is the real device ,everything else is smoke and mirrors.
If TK can create a 100 kw device then how hard would it be to for him to make a 4kw device.
When the recent new video was posted I saw 2 spark plugs setting on top of a coil not connect to anything just arcing at that point I knew that the level of deception that TK operates under is equal to SM,and he is a pathological liar.
In this forum SM can't lie ,won't lie and wants them to build hes tpu and they believe this like a religion ;D :D
If we look at 3:39 in the video below we see a Tesla coil which has its "primary" connected apparently "difficult to tell" to the silver capacitors or the aluminium box
or both, to me it looks as if it would have a resonant frequency in the low 100's of Khz maybe below. Now please do correct me if I am wrong in my calculations.
At 100 000 Hz if the top capacitance is 1 nF and the received voltage is 50 000 volts then for each second I calculate 125 000 joules could be received.
1 nF at 50 000v = 1.25 joules x 100 000 cycles per second = 125 000 joules per second. Transformed through the primary to whatever storage capacitors
then transformed to whatever flavor of power is desired. The question is where is the 100 kHz transmitter ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtadR0skY00
To my way of thinking that single coil alone could be the receiver of transmitted energy and the energy could be transmitted from a similar arrangement powered from the grid,
the cost of the electricity to do it could be met by the "handlers" and the setup could be to get investment dollars.
If my calculations are correct then what ?
Cheers
The previous post I think describes the effect somewhat as Tesla intended, enormous amounts of energy could be transmitted using fairly small inexpensive equipment,
with the use of HF and high voltage the capacitance need only be relatively small.
With the advances in semiconductors and electronic components the transmitter would not need a spark gap and be better off without one.
With the smaller devices, a resonant receiving coil doesn't need to be a "Tesla" type coil and Tesla mentions near the beginning of his Colorado Springs Notes
that for the transmission of greater amounts of energy a large ratio of transformation alone is actually better, the Magnifying Transmitter being better for smaller amounts of
energy "signals".
He also states, this is just from memory, "that the higher the frequency the more energy can be transmitted" this is true of course theoretically, and he also states
that "the highest practical frequency would be in the order of 35 000 cycles per second", but also that "lower frequencies are more efficient and that higher frequencies can be used"
they are just not as efficient. He says I think 6 cycles per second would be the lowest.
Page 3 line 27 in the patent below has some info.
http://www.google.com/patents?id=oSo_AAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false
More is in his work on alternating currents book. and other sources.
This patent says a lot of good stuff.
http://www.google.com/patents?vid=1119732
And the Colorado Springs Notes I can get a quote from if anyone wants me to.
The point is that the receiving of significant transmitted energy using only a ground connection is entirely possible and Tesla proved it.
The point of the circuit to test would be the ground connection between the receiving coil and the Earth.
I haven't even tried to do any transmission of energy using the ground though because of several reasons. Mainly frequency.
I have done a few experiments though and I think it is possible though the effectiveness "efficiency" could depend on many factors.
I'm not a very technical person, but one of the things I like to do is try to recreate some of the effects Tesla shows in drawings and Photo's
but in miniature, there's one below I think looks a bit like the discharge shown on page 346 of the Colorado Springs Notes I think.
Discharge in bottom right corner from secondary to ground, the top is the extra coil discharge.
(http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/6153/electricflower010.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/521/electricflower010.jpg/)
25 watt bulb lit between the Earth and secondary bottom terminal.
(http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/9401/electricflower022.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/28/electricflower022.jpg/)
Cheers
P.S. Here's a video showing low voltage transmission using a single conductor, because of the frequency and low voltage using the ground for that one conductor is out of the question.
However the transmitter is running from a 12 volt battery and the receiver produces 24 volts which is nothing special, just info. IF I had used lower frequency and higher voltage
I could have used the ground for the single conductor and the receiver would have no apparent source of input if I did not show the transmitter. Even though it is low powered and
dodgy and I am not a professor, probably more so because of my lackings I think that is a demo that speaks volumes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1nfWnjufZo
EDIT: THose coils in the video of mine were operating at between 440 and 460 kHz and developing a few hundred volts at the top terminal maybe 400 or so volts.
Any ground wire that looks like a ground wire could in fact be a transmission wire. And a clamp meter will go silly, it won't read a 100 kHz current well.
Oh and as far as I can tell the transmitter should be producing a continuous wave, which is why I don't think spark gap transmitters are practical, too difficult to get the really nice neat sine wave.
..
I thought deserved it's own post. I not exactly sure what it all means but I think it shows that in some places there would be some good 50 Hz vibes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-wire_earth_return
QuoteSafety
SWER's safety is assured because transformers isolate the ground from both the generator and user. Most electrical systems use a metallic neutral connected directly to the generator or a shared ground. Certain groups claim that stray voltages from SWER can injure livestock.[1]
Grounding is critical. Significant currents on the order of 8 amperes flow through the ground near the earth points. A good-quality earth connection is needed to prevent risk of electric shock due to earth potential rise near this point. Separate grounds for power and safety are also used. Duplication of the ground points assures that the system is still safe if either of the grounds is damaged.
A good earth connection is normally a 6 m stake of copper-clad steel driven vertically into the ground, and bonded to the transformer earth and tank. A good ground resistance is 5–10 ohms. SWER systems are designed to limit the voltage in the earth to 20 volts per meter to avoid shocking people and animals that might be in the area.
Other standard features include automatic reclosing circuit breakers (reclosers). Most faults (overcurrent) are transient. Since the network is rural, most of these faults will be cleared by the recloser. Each service site needs a rewirable drop out fuse for protection and switching of the transformer. The transformer secondary should also be protected by a standard high-rupture capacity (HRC) fuse or low voltage circuit breaker. A surge arrestor (spark gap) on the high voltage side is common, especially in lightning-prone areas.
The official investigation into the Black Saturday bushfires in Victoria, Australia, disclosed that a broken SWER conductor that comes in contact with a return path entry point with resistance similar to the circuit's normal load (such as a tree) can cause large amounts of current to flow to ground without a fault indication.[8] This presents a danger in fire-prone areas where a conductor may snap and current may arc through trees or dry grass.
Bare-wire or ground-return telecommunications can be compromised by the ground-return current if the grounding area is closer than 100 m or sinks more than 10 A of current. Modern radio, optic fibre channels and cell phone systems are unaffected.
After reading that wiki article I was a bit concerned with the safety of my electric fence when it is not turned on for maintenance, I have alternate hot ground wires and some of the ground wires are on insulators so they are not locally Earthed, however all sections of fence do have at least two strands which are grounded to each metal post somewhat but not purposfully. I used alternate hot - ground wires because initially I had concerns of poor Earthing.
My concern would be if there was a fault "fence short" from a wet branch or something to a hot wire, I would turn off the fence energizer where the main Earth stakes are, then go to the short, at this point there would be the hot wires connected to the ground at the short and the ground wires connected to the ground stakes way back where the energizer is, it could be a fair distance. if I touched one with each hand could I get fried ? :o
Oh wow. Is that possible.
"Single wire" transmissions are ordinary circuits looped through the ground.
Tesla resonant circuits that are coupled at a distance are also circuits efficiently looped through the ground and between terminal capacities by displacement currents and/or between coils by magnetic induction. The energy stored and shared in the two circuits can be important if the circuits have a high Q, but this energy comes from smaller quantities of energy added at each period until the expected final condition is reached. Then this enormous energy can be recovered in one shot, but no more than the quantity that we have put step by step.
There is no magic here and I don't see the least clue of extra-energy in any experiment of this kind.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2012.09.08, 22:30:23
Ex, check out these video's ,meet me half way and look at them.
These video's are of the 100kw turkey device built by
TK for the Turks.Notice that they use resistive loads,lights and an
electric motor,they check the input and outputs.It is easy to believe
that the small devices TK made could be fake,this one not so easy.
Ask the question to the non believers how did he fool the Turks,see if they have an answer.
The fat old bald guy in the suit is in the 2004 video,connected to the Turks in some way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtadR0skY00
This video places TK and assistant in the turkey video directly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKFW1uwLN3U&feature=relmfu
I believe only whats in the metal boxes is the real device ,everything else is smoke and mirrors.
If TK can create a 100 kw device then how hard would it be to for him to make a 4kw device.
When the recent new video was posted I saw 2 spark plugs setting on top of a coil not connect to anything just arcing at that point I knew that the level of deception that TK operates under is equal to SM,and he is a pathological liar.
In this forum SM can't lie ,won't lie and wants them to build hes tpu and they believe this like a religion ;D :D
Thanks for the links and the information, cp. Until now I have studied only the first TK's demonstration and the patents, because they are a priori duplicable by anyone (if we had the exact shematics). I was not interested in the turkish device because it was too big and so, further from the fundamental elementary principles and less clear. Nevertheless I agree that I should have a look at it.
I'm always astonished when people who pretend to have a working device at small scale, something that every one could have at home for powering the house, undertake the building of big machines that from my viewpoint, would be useful only for the industry and would provide perhaps a less money return than this obtained from a mass market of smaller devices.
In other cases, this has been the sign of scams: the inventor cheat us by pretexting he is on a big project of scaling, instead of finalizing the demonstration of the small device (which in reality, doesn't work).
From ex:
Quotethe inventor cheat us by pretexting he is on a big project of scaling, instead of finalizing the demonstration of the small device (which in reality, doesn't work).
This is so true, we see it in a certain person whose name we shall not mention that has built something akin to a "ferris wheel".
It is important to recognize the red flags when you see them. A proof of concept need only deliver a few "honest" watts.
No need to dazzle their eyes, just solid proof.
Ex,here is more info
there is a direct connection with the turkey device and that is that its a 3 phase device.
The big mystery in the 2008 turkey video is this ,TK cheated the Turks for a large sum of money,
he then backed out of a deal,my main question is why didn't the Turks simply reverse engineer
what they had and cut him out of the deal.A recent video by a team of people went to
see TK and paid him a lot of
money to make a device,
he was very sick at the time,still he cheated them too,and backed out of a deal.
So they posted a video on the internet here is that video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-NLBSBRsBM&feature=related
The green transformer I believe is the source of the overunity,when you trace the connections
to the heater,the path is between the ground braid
and the transformer
here is the problem,the transformer was made for a Russian clone IBM computer power supply
around 200 watts,around 1982.The transformer is a very strange transformer it appears to be operated on 3 phase ac,and has three low voltage windings in its normal operation,in the device its
reversed,the output is the input and the
input is the output.It has to pass around 9amps,2kw heater,if 220vac,that of course is
impossible,the windings of the transformer would burn up.
This is the end of the line for the overunity group on the TK's device,now the way is its a
fake,or some mystical
theory,or some silly theory or its a Tesla invention.TK has hidden all functional things from view in all other devices,
this is the first
time he has shown what I believe is the
active part.When I first seen the transformer and looked at how the connections are
connected
I figured that this would be the end,it is a very hard bridge for anyone,with a good physics
or electronics backround to cross.
I believe your more objective in this regard than most,however be careful with the patients
as this guys ability to lie and distort truth is amazing,theres a very good chance the patients
are worthless.
This poster is a member of overunity.com and has the exact transformer,and posted a video
also did a very good job of tracing the connections from the heater to the transformer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjExW90EXM8
here is a TK device that was made just before the turkey video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=wNnWSvz1KsQ
The 2 pictures are from this same poster in one I pointed out connections so you know what goes were.
Quotehere is a TK device that was made just before the turkey video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=wNnWSvz1KsQ
Can anyone identify the red meter and the range setting that seems to be in series with the line power input?
Very questionable, to use some cheesy meter to measure input current (that could have been rigged internally to read wrongly) while using quality switchgear type meters on the output.
Why does he not unplug the device from the mains?
On the aquarium unit, I find it hard to believe anyone (in Russia) would use a three phase transformer in any of their PC clones when when a single phase transformer would have sufficed. How many homes in Russia have 3 phase power? This looks like mil surplus gear to me. I could be wrong and am willing to be corrected on this.
However, the black box (not the one with the switches) in the prior video could have been a PC clone power supply
I haven't seen the aquarium video until today. I'm not surprised at their low frequency, it seems to fire at a subharmonic of 50 hz. That ground connection going outside, is truly just one conductor wire. The power is received through that one wire from the stray potentials of the electricity grid.
Or it's a fake (or deceiving) and those black boxes house lots of batteries, and so the device is simply an inverter, albeit one that's very well grounded! ;D
I think it's real.
EM
Quote from: exnihiloest
Tesla resonant circuits that are coupled at a distance are also
circuits efficiently looped through the ground and between
terminal capacities by displacement currents and/or between
coils by magnetic induction. The energy stored and shared in
the two circuits can be important if the circuits have a high Q,
but this energy comes from smaller quantities of energy added
at each period until the expected final condition is reached.
Then this enormous energy can be recovered in one shot, but
no more than the quantity that we have put step by step.
There is no magic here and I don't see the least clue of
extra-energy in any experiment of this kind.
Until the immense atmospheric electrical charge is brought
into play there will not be any "extra-energy" made manifest.
Tap into that and there will be abundant energy...
Quote from: Dumped on 2012.09.09, 18:33:30
Until the immense atmospheric electrical charge is brought
into play there will not be any "extra-energy" made manifest.
Tap into that and there will be abundant energy...
Urban legend. The atmospheric electrical charge is not immense, except during thunderstorms.
Proof: the short waves are reflected by ionospheric layers at alitude between 100-300 Km, not by the atmosphere. The most charged ionospheric layers contain only 10
5 electrons/cm
3. If the atmosphere contained a significative charge, the shortwaves would be reflected at some hundred or thousands meters, and therefore couldn't propagate on long distances.
I don't get your answer Ex. I agree with it though. I did not mention anything about any extra energy in my experiments,
in fact it was quite inefficient. I was merely pointing out that Tariel could receive energy that way.
One thing I will ask you though is. Are you saying that the low voltage setup in my video was transferring energy from one top capacitance
to the other one- capacitively. I would say it is just bouncing the energy back and forth through the single wire between the two that way.
But I do agree there is no extra energy, I have stated before that there is no extra energy, and I did not say that there was in this thread.
Did you think i was implying there was extra energy or something ? If so please point out what made you think that.
My point is that the energy could be received in large amounts by a single ground connection to a HF resonant transformer.
And my calculations say 125 000 joules per second could be received under the conditions i described.
Cheers
P.S. And just as a matter of curiosity, can anyone show me reference to any text where Tesla states his single wire or wireless systems
produce extra energy. Anyone ? Any text ? Anything ? It's a transmission system not a free energy device.
...
This was posted by a member on overunity.com that lives somewhere in Russia in a former
state, same guy that has the transformer.
09/1982 year
block-module power source from industry "EC-0912" 12,6V-2A NK53112
Power source module from the prehistoric USSR computer ES http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ES_EVM
OK a clone of the IBM 360/370 Mainframes the ES-EVM, not PC's...now it makes more sense. Sure the mainframes would probably have three phase power available for the large power supplies and smaller ones for peripheral devices.
Thanks for the info.
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.09, 20:54:51
I don't get your answer Ex. I agree with it though. I did not mention anything about any extra energy in my experiments,
in fact it was quite inefficient. I was merely pointing out that Tariel could receive energy that way.
What reply are you refering to? My previous reply was to Dumped about the atmospheric charge, not about extra-nergy nor TK.
If it is reply #13, which was general, and you would like that I link it to your post #10, I dont agree about this:
Quote
At 100 000 Hz if the top capacitance is 1 nF and the received voltage is 50 000 volts then for each second I calculate 125 000 joules could be received.
1 nF at 50 000v = 1.25 joules x 100 000 cycles per second = 125 000 joules per second.
When the capacitor is charged, you have an energy E=0.5*C*U
2=0.5*10
-9*(5*10
4)
2=1.25 J. You can recover 1.25*100 000 cycles per second only if you can recover 1.25J at each period. But is it possible?
To charge a capacitor at 50 000 volts needs time. You can't charge it in the time of a single period. The higher the Q factor, the longer the time you need. Suppose that the capacitor can be charged in 1s, this means that the input energy is only 1.25 J/s and so, you can't recover more than that. Even if the capacitor was chargeable in 0.01s, this would mean that an input of 125J/s is required and that you will recover 125J/s.
The time for building the charge using resonance is not instantaneous. If you recover 1.25J in one period, then you will have to wait several periods until the charge rebuilds. Therefore the available mean energy/s will be much less than in your calculus.
Quote
One thing I will ask you though is. Are you saying that the low voltage setup in my video was transferring energy from one top capacitance
to the other one- capacitively. I would say it is just bouncing the energy back and forth through the single wire between the two that way.
...
Not only. Any charge displacement, including in the top capacitor, influences the charges everywhere around, these from another capacitor or from the ground. This can be viewed as displacement currents. "Open" circuits carrying current doesn't exist, excepted when they radiate (antennae). The human eye see only an open circuit but the current see a closed circuit and flows along.
Quote
P.S. And just as a matter of curiosity, can anyone show me reference to any text where Tesla states his single wire or wireless systems
produce extra energy. Anyone ? Any text ? Anything ? It's a transmission system not a free energy device.
...
Tesla has certainly never affirmed to produce extra-energy. But there is now a certain mythology around Tesla, spread by unskilled people who say that Tesla was on the way to get it. I'm pleased to see that your are not among them.
@Dumped
QuoteUntil the immense atmospheric electrical charge is brought
into play there will not be any "extra-energy" made manifest.
Tap into that and there will be abundant energy...
I would agree the energy has to come from somewhere and there is evidence that it relates to forms of energy we could call Latent or "Hidden", not unlike the fact that what we call Heat is in fact EM energy and that it is not constant but non-uniform in most media not specifically engineered to be uniform. In a standard volume of air some particles are freezing, some boiling and the actual non-averaged temperature varies drastically. In a standard volume of air the non-averaged ionization varies drastically so we can say as a fact this limited view that there is no energy present is false.
This revolves around the concept of Energy and how on one level we can observe one thing and on another level observe something completely different which also relates back to Maxwells Demon. As such it is generally accepted that there is a massive amount of energy present everywhere in everything however to date we have found no practical method to transform billions of very small changes within ambient conditions into one coherent condition. It's also funny that most argue against a point which has already been proven, we have nano-antenna which transforms "Heat" at the fundamental level (Em waves) directly into a potential difference ... electricity, we have solar cells which are really no different which transforms ambient light(Em waves) indirectly. Now to say we cannot go further is to say we can never learn anything new and to say the energy does not exist is pure delusion because 100 years of science has proven otherwise.
The issue here is perception where many small fast changes can appear as a lack of motion not unlike an airplane propeller which appears solid when stationary but when spinning disappears from sight. Now if we were to poke our propeller with a stick the stick would be chopped off at low RPM however at some excessively high RPM our propeller would appear as a solid invisible disk moving so fast that our stick could not penetrate it nor would it be chopped off. This example is not unlike the form of delusion we suffer where things moving incredibly fast at very small or very large scales appears stationary, we are trapped in a material world which for the most part lacks material substance, we are are trapped in a material world seething with energy and yet we say there is none because we cannot see or feel it directly, it is Latent or hidden from us.
@Farmhand
QuoteAnd just as a matter of curiosity, can anyone show me reference to any text where Tesla states his single wire or wireless systems
produce extra energy. Anyone ? Any text ? Anything ? It's a transmission system not a free energy device.
Tesla stated catagorically in his lectures that in fact he had succeeded in producing extra/excess energy and this energy was from the Ambient or what we consider to be ambient conditions devoid of energy. As well his intentions were outlined in a document ... "The problem of increasing human energy" ... A DEPARTURE FROM KNOWN METHODS—POSSIBILITY OF A "SELF-ACTING" ENGINE OR MACHINE, INANIMATE, YET CAPABLE, LIKE A LIVING BEING, OF DERIVING ENERGY FROM THE MEDIUM—THE IDEAL WAY OF OBTAINING MOTIVE POWER. I believe the title speaks for itself.
Then we have the issue of T.H.Moray and Tariel Kapanadze, two persons who have known devices which have been tested and supposedly verified to produce excessive electrical energy from an unknown source. Both have stated the technology is based solely on the work of one Nikola Tesla and in fact the greater majority of all "claims" concerning excess energy usually relate in some way to the work or thoughts of Tesla. Moray is an exceptional example as his device was supposedly witnessed by engineers and scientists to produce some 20Kw in the middle of nowhere some 50 miles from the nearest power source. As you may well understand 20,000w is not insignificant nor is the fact that an energy source able to provide this amount of power for "Any" amount of time in the middle of nowhere would be fairly large and expensive considering the technology available at that time.
As far as Tesla's single wire or wireless systems are concerned I do not believe a direct reference was every made by Tesla concerning free energy and that most people have implied there is a connection due to the time lines. That is Tesla is making statements within a certain time frame in which he is filing patents on related technologies and because the time frames are so close the connection was assumed and not proven in any way to my knowledge.
Ex. I agree the top capacitance must cause displacement, no doubt, that is how capacitors work.
But the displacement can be local to each of the elements (transformers) and they can be on opposite sides of the planet.
With the calculations I just said that that amount of energy could be received, the transmitter could be producing 400 000 volts
and have a grater capacitance. I was just talking about the receiver. Eg, if a 500 kW transmitter was used then it wouldn't be out
of the realms of possibility to be able to receive 1/5 th of that, also the closer the coupling of the transformer the more energy is transferred from secondary to primary
in less cycles. Tesla used fairly tight coupling in the power transmitter/receivers, and this one of the differences. The looser coupling allows a greater resonant rise but
requires more cycles to transfer relative energy levels. Tesla power and signal systems are different. A loose coupling for 100 volts is not the same distance as a loose coupling for 100 000 volts.
Radio transmitters put energy through the ground, they are designed to radiate from the antenna though is my understanding, but they are ground connected.
Tesla systems of wireless transmission are designed not to radiate from the antenna as I understand it.
AC. I was referring to the transmission systems. They are for transmitting energy. :) Not for collecting or harnessing it.
Cheers
Abstract
When dielectric materials are brought into contact and then separated, they develop static electricity. For centuries, it has been assumed that such contact charging derives from the spatially homogeneous material properties (along the material's surface) and that within a given pair of materials, one charges uniformly positively and the other negatively. We demonstrate that this picture of contact charging is incorrect. Whereas each contact-electrified piece develops a net charge of either positive or negative polarity, each surface supports a random "mosaic" of oppositely charged regions of nanoscopic dimensions. These mosaics of surface charge have the same topological characteristics for different types of electrified dielectrics and accommodate significantly more charge per unit area than previously thought.
The mosaics accommodate significantly more charge per unit area than previously estimated for contact electrification, but the overall/"net" charge on an electrified surface remains relatively small due to the "compensation" between the (+) and the (–) regions.
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/333/6040/308.full
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.10, 19:03:21
...I just said that that amount of energy could be received...
I agree, fh, nevertheless I think it's not the easiest way to fake the system.
Yes I agree it would be a difficult way to fake it, the Tesla coil I mentioned in the Turkey demo, what would be your estimate of it's top terminal capacitance ?
The coupling looks fairly loose as well. One of my questions or wonderings is - Where is the power electronics to create the three phase 50-60 Hz AC ?
Where is the wave form ? Just one real live wave form of the output would be interesting to see. If the wave form is nice neat sine waves and not some kind of beat
frequency wave form there must be either electronics or some kind of conversion device to convert the higher frequency power to 50 - 60 Hz, or a connection to the
grid.
Will the meters used work with "beat" frequencies or other such wave form types.
It would seem to me that any one trying to evaluate the systems power with meters should need to see the wave forms first.
Cheers
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.11, 20:17:07
...
It would seem to me that any one trying to evaluate the systems power with meters should need to see the wave forms first.
...
I agree. Not only ordinary measurement apparatus (power/volt/ampmeter) are granted only for a low frequency range but also high frequency components of the signal can totally disturb their electronics.
There is also the matter of what would be considered as acceptable as a "free" source of energy. In my opinion even if he was tapping
an artificial source of disturbance which is considered as waste then it's ok, but if he is tapping a source of energy which when he does
causes a load on the resources of another man made system then it not truly free.
Things I find strange are,
1, He claims free energy and to know where it comes from and says he is not stealing it, but he cannot get a patent.
2, If he cannot get a patent and it is real why is he not concerned for his safety ?
3, If it is real and he is not concerned for his safety then why not do some "real deals" for real money.
4, He won't even show a scope shot but will draw the wave form ?
5, If the patent application is real it should be demonstrable from what is in the patent application.
Cheers
From Farmhand
QuoteDoes everyone remember LaserSabre's power strip plugged into itself and how it was able to appear to light incandescent globes and
heater elements. He won't say how exactly it is done as far as I know. When that happens the person should be hounded until the method is revealed
Lasersabers original video illusion apparently has been performed by many others on youtube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNpNsWiyZHY&feature=related
I can't find the original, but at that time was easily able to expose it.
He continues these April fools hoaxes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Lmh4X6hiSo&feature=channel&list=UL
This kind of thing and all the other hoaxes give the search for FE a bad name and muddies the water.
Having studied all of TK's videos on his solid state generators, like the mechanical generators, I feel that these were refined as fakes to culminate in the Aqua2 device. I'm reasonably happy that there is just a single braided conductor from the tank housing the device, to an 'earth' rod outside the house. The only way I can see that this is powered, is for there to have been hidden conductors within the braid that carry high voltage, with terminating step-up, step-down transformers. Like in the mechanical versions, there are several boxes to be seen in the aquarium which likely conceal the most important components. Around 2KV @ 800mA would probably be sufficient to power the domestic heater he used as a load. Is it possible that TK used a number of back-to back MOT's paralleled up in two's as a power supply fed from then grid, or is there a better approach along these lines?
Hoppy
Quote from: Hoppy on 2012.09.14, 16:29:09
Having studied all of TK's videos on his solid state generators, like the mechanical generators, I feel that these were refined as fakes to culminate in the Aqua2 device. I'm reasonably happy that there is just a single braided conductor from the tank housing the device, to an 'earth' rod outside the house. The only way I can see that this is powered, is for there to have been hidden conductors within the braid that carry high voltage, with terminating step-up, step-down transformers. Like in the mechanical versions, there are several boxes to be seen in the aquarium which likely conceal the most important components. Around 2KV @ 800mA would probably be sufficient to power the domestic heater he used as a load. Is it possible that TK used a number of back-to back MOT's paralleled up in two's as a power supply fed from then grid, or is there a better approach along these lines?
Hoppy
I agree. Step up / step down would be the way to convey lots of power over thin wires, such as concealed in the braid.
The heater looks to be about 1000 Watts@ 220 V or 4.5 Amps, so assuming reasonable efficiency of step down, carrying 1kV @1 Amp would supply enough juice to fire up the heater. If it used much more, say 1500 Watts it would be closer to your numbers.
He might also use low voltage which is stepped up in the dual ground (original video with the buried radiator) as one ground and the water faucet fed from underground power cable and rubber hose for water/insulation.
That faucet looks mighty shaky for a buried pipe. A watchful accomplice probably switches power on and off at appropriate times to avoid electrocuting anyone.
For Aqua2 lots of MOT's would be fine for source but too heavy for the stepdown. Here is where a spark gap and air coil with the right turns ratio could transform the 2kV down to 220 V. A crude step down switcher. I feel he may have converted to DC at the step up to avoid overly stressing the dielectric in the transmission wire.
In Aqua1 as part of the illusion TK uses a 9 volt battery and relay interlock circuit to switch the main power on and off.
This is totally unnecessary but adds intrigue. He could have just used a switch, but this has become his trademark.
TK carries himself well as showman and master illusionist, but always has a slightly worried look and nervousness as if someone will shortly expose his craft.
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.14, 18:01:42
I agree. Step up / step down would be the way to convey lots of power over thin wires, such as concealed in the braid.
He might also use low voltage which is stepped up in the dual ground original video (with the buried radiator as one ground and the water faucet fed from underground rubber hose (and power cable). That faucet looks mighty shaky for a buried pipe. A watchful accomplice switches power on and off at appropriate times to avoid electrocuting anyone.
For aqua2 lots of MOT's would be too heavy. Here is where a spark gap and air coil with the right turns ratio could transform the 2kV down to 220 V. A crude step down switcher.
As part of the illusion TK uses a 9 volt battery and relay interlock circuit to switch the main power on and off.
This is totally unnecessary but adds intrigue. He could have just used a switch.
ION,
Thanks for your comments. I had not considered an even more basic step-down method using an air cored transformer but it does make sense given that getting hold of co-ax for the air coil was important to him. I'm not sure that its being stepped-down with the coil on view as I cannot remember seeing any sign of a second winding (will look again) but the transformer could be housed in one of the boxes.
Hoppy
Quote from: Hoppy on 2012.09.14, 19:22:14
ION,
Thanks for your comments. I had not considered an even more basic step-down method using an air cored transformer but it does make sense given that getting hold of co-ax for the air coil was important to him. I'm not sure that its being stepped-down with the coil on view as I cannot remember seeing any sign of a second winding (will look again) but the transformer could be housed in one of the boxes.
Hoppy
Yes, there could be a second transformer hidden, but if it were operating at 50 Hz and supplying 1kW or more it would be in the range of 10-20 lbs.
A tap on the primary of the air core at the 20% point would work. (autotransformer)
Alternately a high voltage transistor or FET operated switchmode would only require a relatively small inductor with a ferrite core to get the job done.
There are many ways to slice this.
In the Aqua2 video 1 am more than a bit suspicious of the ground outside the window and how carefully the assistant touches it.
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.14, 20:04:54
Yes, there could be a second transformer hidden, but if it were operating at 50 Hz and supplying 1kW or more it would be in the range of 10-20 lbs.
A tap on the primary of the air core at the 20% point would work. (autotransformer)
Alternately a high voltage transistor or FET operated switchmode would only require a small inductor with a ferrite core to get the job done.
An auto-transformer would tie-up closer with the patent and I can see a more likely possibility for a 3-wire coax coil configuration, so is anyone with more experience with HV experimentation than me, care to put forward a possible practical circuit schematic based on the supply through conductors in the braid carrying HV (around 2-3KV) at 50Hz and using a coax based auto-transformer that ties up with the physical appearance of the one on view in the tank?
Hoppy
I don't have anything much to add, except that I don't think it will matter much if he is outed, it will open the eyes of a few but
the hard core fans probably wouldn't settle for anything less than an admission from Tariel, and even then some would say that he lied when he admitted fakery.
If Tariel is a faker, then he would not be wholly to blame for his fame and fakery, part of the blame should go to all those who promoted him
and pushed the story a bit further, everyone who just believes and talks up a faker gives the faker confidence. If more people questioned and asked for
better proofs the fakers wouldn't be so bold. All the "wanna believe in free energy from nowhere" crowd enable the fakes. If a faker posted a video
and it was ignored, laughed at or the claimant was simply asked to provide better proof then the faker has lost, they require attention for their plans
of getting money from others by deception.
Anyway if he wants me to believe him he needs to be more upfront and show a simple circuit that can be replicated by many to show more out than put in.
If everybody else said and thought the same way there would be no point to fakery like this. No one would be fooled.
There is a knock on effect where if the fans and promoters are made to see they have been duped and they suffer embarrassment from it, then they
might not be so quick to become a fan boy and require more proofs themselves and so everything would get more real,
but if there are no disincentives things will tend to get less real.
The folks who ask for proofs and seek to disadvantage the fakers will never need to be praised for their efforts, it is duty.
There are many truth seekers, the numbers are growing. There is no point to just believing all these claims. The point to this endeavor is
real gains, real gains require real measurements and real proof to be convincing. In my opinion.
Cheers
I feel a bit sorry for TK, as he has dug a hole and now must suffer sleepless nights and bad health due to the stress of the situation.
If he had something real and released it to the world, he would be famous and wanted for interview on many shows, and could command a lot of money for this. He would not remain poor by giving it away.
As it is with most illusionists, they must keep the game going. Their secret ingredient is kept to them only.
I also feel a bit sorry for the young wide eyed folk, the potential investors and actual investors and benefactors that have lost money on this and other such schemes. It is a hard lesson.
There is, however, value in all this if it gets us to think well outside the box.
Farmhand said it well in the entire last post, but this is the best and I quote him:
QuoteThe point to this endeavor is real gains, real gains require real measurements and real proof to be convincing. In my opinion.
Hoppy:
I can offer a few circuits that will get the illusion to work, but outside of hearsay are we sure he used coax in his main coil. Is there visual proof in any of the videos? Also not sure of why you think 3 wire coax is needed, as single conductor plus shield will carry the current.
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.14, 22:44:34
Anyway if he wants me to believe him he needs to be more upfront and show a simple circuit that can be replicated by many to show more out than put in.
If everybody else said and thought the same way there would be no point to fakery like this. No one would be fooled.
So have we now officially relegated TK as a fake?
Steven Mark never provided anything close to a circuit schematic, nor a clear description of his device, yet many still believe it is/was real.
Is there really that much difference between the two in how they present their devices?
Quote from: poynt99 on 2012.09.15, 14:40:44
So have we now officially relegated TK as a fake?
Steven Mark never provided anything close to a circuit schematic, nor a clear description of his device, yet many still believe it is/was real.
Is there really that much difference between the two in how they present their devices?
Nothing is official here. I have prefaced most of my writings with "it is my opinion". There is always a chance it could be real.
Can't speak for others, but prefer to work both sides of the issue, as I also have with the SM devices.
There are numerous red flags that go up for both devices.
Yet both devices are in some ways very intriguing.
The biggest differences between the devices is TK's need for one or more "ground wires" and a spark gap.
Other than that, they both have coils and misc. components and secrecy.
We have a pertinent patent application from TK that to my knowledge, no one has succeeded in replicating to produce any reasonable degree of OU.
We have no such thing (patents) from SM, only the videos and dialog between LM and (?SM?)
Other threads under TK devices dispense with lack of belief and run full force into discussion and attempts at replication. Various hypothesis are bandied about. Nothing producing 2 to 5 kW is demonstrated nor anything near OU.
I feel this thread lends some balance. The jury, however is still out. Only successfully replicated devices going viral will speak the full truth.
P.S. The only thing that keeps me in the game with the SM devices is the witnessed lab reports of Dr Schinzinger.
If these can be proven faked, then I'm out. Considering the dialogue in these, the letters, and the timeline, and Schinzingers expertise, credentials and ethics, I believe them to be real, but will always keep an open mind and consider how it all may have been faked, even enough to fool Dr. Schinzinger.
I agree, all I have is an opinion as well. Without any device to test that is all we can have.
I also agree the Steve Marks device is different because of it's size and what it appears to do.
I have serious doubts about it though, again just an opinion of course.
Anyway I've been thinking about patents and free energy devices. I came to the conclusions that,
1. If a application is made for a device that says it will produce extra energy, then they can't really
grant the patent and say it is ok to make them if the energy source is not known or understood even by the applicant.
If it was dangerous they would be liable somehow I guess.
2. If an application is filed and the source is described by the applicant as a new source of energy
not known or understood by "mainstream science", then they can't really grant that either until the source of energy is
defined or understood by "mainstream science". Same reasons of liability. Imagine if patents were granted for nuclear reactors without anyone
knowing of the consequences, who would be to blame for the damage and responsible for it ?
3. If the source of energy cannot be defined or is not understood then those who make and use them
should probably just do it without the patent, But if it is dangerous and causes health problems or something
then they are the ones liable and they must take responsibility or responsibility must be waived or something.
I don't believe in patents much anyway. If I see someone using something I like and I want one and can make it I will.
The information about the device is given when I see it with my eyes, I then am in possession of the knowledge and can use it
for my own needs. If someone doesn't want anyone else to copy something of theirs they should keep it secret.
Imagine if when the first guy who made a hat seen people copy his hat and ran around trying to tell everyone they could
not make their own hats unless they paid him. :D
If you make something good just use it, let others copy it I say.
The liability issue I mean is "Common Law". If I do something that I know causes harm or loss to another which is avoidable,
then I am responsible and must compensate.
No need for waivers though if you are "up front" and say you don't know if it is dangerous. If you said something was safe
or not dangerous when it actually was then you would be liable. And it could be more serious than just needing to compensate.
Also if you say it is safe and know it is not, then it is even more serious.
Cheers
@fh
I agree with almost everything you say. Nevertheless a patent must just be a description of a technical mean to obtain a useful effect. If there is an underlying unknown theory to explain the effect, it is not required in the patent. If the inventor of a free energy machine knows the theory, he can better protect his invention by describing many ways to obtain the effect. If he is ignoring the theory, he may fear that others find alternative ways to exploit the theory to get the same effects, bypassing his patent. Nevertheless if he files a patent, he takes the risk.
Now if the inventor files a patent while hiding key elements, the patent is not reproducible. Perhaps some investor will contact him to get more information in order to duplicate the machine, but if the inventor give it him, he can earn a little money for that but consequently his problem becomes the same as if he had filed the patent with all the details. And if the inventor doesn't give it him, no one is able to build the machine and so the patent remains unnecessary and the inventor will earn nothing.
So my conclusion is that any patent that is not reproducible is simply either a fraud or a way for egocentric people to leave their name in the "history".
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.15, 13:24:06
Hoppy:
I can offer a few circuits that will get the illusion to work, but outside of hearsay are we sure he used coax in his main coil. Is there visual proof in any of the videos? Also not sure of why you think 3 wire coax is needed, as single conductor plus shield will carry the current.
ION:
No, not 3-wire coax but there could be 3 connections to form an auto-transformer.
No certainty on the use of co-ax but it does look very likely from the hi-res photos. Also, i think he used the stripped-off braided screen for the 'earth' conductor.
Hoppy
Quote from: Hoppy on 2012.09.16, 10:09:06
ION:
No, not 3-wire coax but there could be 3 connections to form an auto-transformer.
No certainty on the use of co-ax but it does look very likely from the hi-res photos. Also, i think he used the stripped-off braided screen for the 'earth' conductor.
Hoppy
Ok, now I understand what you meant.
Could you point me to those high-res photos?
Also, if you think he stripped off the braided screen for the earth conductor, that would leave only the inner conductor. Not a true coaxial transformer then.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On another note completely regarding the purpose of this thread, I believe one should use the full force of their intellect in trying to prove either stance i.e. that it be fake or that it be real.
To be timid about either stance would not allow us to deeply penetrate the mind of the inventor or veracity of the proposed device.
In other words, we need to invest ourselves fully into either position as if it were truth. So sometimes we talk as if it were a truth to bolster our energy to penetrate to the truth.
This happens or should happen in either stance be it real or fake. Sometimes this means holding both stances in our mind at the same time, a difficult situation which can grind our gears and waste our energy.
For me what works best is to invest myself fully in the position that I have temporarily chosen and explore it as fully as possible. When this is fully exhausted, then I go to the opposite stance and do the same. This prevents my energy from being conflicted.
When this process is finished to whatever degree possible based on available evidence, only then I can rest both stances and form an educated opinion.
Quote from: ION on 2012.09.17, 16:00:55
Ok, now I understand what you meant.
Could you point me to those high-res photos?
Also, if you think he stripped off the braided screen for the earth conductor, that would leave only the inner conductor. Not a true coaxial transformer then.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
On another note completely regarding the purpose of this thread, I believe one should use the full force of their intellect in trying to prove either stance i.e. that it be fake or that it be real.
To be timid about either stance would not allow us to deeply penetrate the mind of the inventor or veracity of the proposed device.
In other words, we need to invest ourselves fully into either position as if it were truth. So sometimes we talk as if it were a truth to bolster our energy to penetrate to the truth.
This happens or should happen in either stance be it real or fake. Sometimes this means holding both stances in our mind at the same time, a difficult situation which can grind our gears and waste our energy.
For me what works best is to invest myself fully in the position that I have temporarily chosen and explore it as fully as possible. When this is fully exhausted, then I go to the opposite stance and do the same. This prevents my energy from being conflicted.
When this process is finished to whatever degree possible based on available evidence, only then I can rest both stances and form an educated opinion.
ION:
There are a lot of reasonably good photos (hi res compared to the poor quality video footage) on OU.com in the 'Selfrunning Free Energy devices up to 5 KW from Tariel Kapanadze' thread starting from around post 843.
Its quite possible that he was just using the coil as a choke and using the inner conductor of the coax with its poly insulation for its high insulation property. The prime reason for TK chosing coax may have been to use the braided screen, otherwise why did he not have just chosen an ordinary HV wire for coil and earth conductor, as he had done in previous builds. He apparently reported that it was important that he acquired some co-ax which he had to get hold of before he could finish the Aqua2.
I agree with you that its important to also look at claims as being genuine but in the case of the Aqua2 device, IMO its difficult to progress along this route as there is only photographic evidence and a very sketchy patent document.
Hoppy
Someone posted on one of my youtubes if it is possible to focus the EMP into a singular path of conduction.
I thought 'How interesting'. What would be a way to funnel this radiative emission into a sink? And then use or consume this new flow.
If i am correct in saying that an EMP event is radiant in nature then Tesla already told us to use a metallic shield/plate to dissipate the radiant event across a large surface area think ground planes in pcb's, current can then be piped away using conventional wire, at this point it continues as conventional current for which we can use as per normal.
If coax was used then the radiant producing event could be placed inside the coax preferably where the radiant event is concocted inside the central core of the coax, the resulting charge and current would manifest in the out sheaf of the coax, this only works if you can find the potential or return path for the current, this maybe where displacement current enters.
My preference would be to place a dielectric material over the coax sheaf and then wrap an axial flat shaped wire down over this, the coax sheaf collects the radiant event and cannot pass anyfurther outwards the dielectric begins to take charge, the potential is taken from the resulting capacitor which results from the coax and the flat axially wound wire which also exhibits some inductance.
When i tried this it worked but i could not get a large enough capacitance or surface area, i realize now i should have moved further away from the radiant event.
Quote from: Farmhand on 2012.09.14, 22:44:34
I don't have anything much to add, except that I don't think it will matter much if he is outed, it will open the eyes of a few but
the hard core fans probably wouldn't settle for anything less than an admission from Tariel,
Well, now that will never happen because he is dead.
Quote from: Peterae on 2012.09.17, 20:43:38
If i am correct in saying that an EMP event is radiant in nature then Tesla already told us to use a metallic shield/plate to dissipate the radiant event across a large surface area think ground planes in pcb's, current can then be piped away using conventional wire, at this point it continues as conventional current for which we can use as per normal.
If coax was used then the radiant producing event could be placed inside the coax preferably where the radiant event is concocted inside the central core of the coax, the resulting charge and current would manifest in the out sheaf of the coax, this only works if you can find the potential or return path for the current, this maybe where displacement current enters.
My preference would be to place a dielectric material over the coax sheaf and then wrap an axial flat shaped wire down over this, the coax sheaf collects the radiant event and cannot pass anyfurther outwards the dielectric begins to take charge, the potential is taken from the resulting capacitor which results from the coax and the flat axially wound wire which also exhibits some inductance.
When i tried this it worked but i could not get a large enough capacitance or surface area, i realize now i should have moved further away from the radiant event.
Maybe we are over-complicating things.
If you can extract a tiny amount of energy from your surroundings, then repeating the same process a hundred million times per second might produce kwatts.
The only question is "how fast can the energy in the air be replenished?".
Kapanadze repeatedly told me that his device relied on HF. His patent applications state that he gets the energy from the air.
We know that voltage increases at the rate of 100 volts per metre from the ground upwards. There are youtube vidos of people flying drones and extracting electricity from the atmosphere. None of them are using oscllators to repeat the process at Mhz speed.
Of course we do not need altitude at all - the video link is just to refresh everyone's memory.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HBiX9BT9ME&t=2s
Just saying...
Peter, aking:
Glad to hear you "just saying". Tesla was also saying it. But we need more than what most guys have shown when harvesting energy from thin air.
Kapanadze took his secret with him...He didn't need drones to harvest KWs. Tariel was not the creator of his shown inventions, and he may be dead, but free energy ideas and experiments will never die. As mentioned previously, his son, is where to look for further tests, and or ideas. Yet, he may also not be the actual builder, of any of the devices, either.
So, who is???
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.21, 22:22:32
Peter, aking:
Glad to hear you "just saying". Tesla was also saying it. But we need more than what most guys have shown harvesting energy from thin air.
Kapanadze took his secret with him...He didn't need drones to harvest KWs.
NickZ
May I restate the most important conjecture from my post...
"The only question is "how fast can the energy in the air be replenished?".
Kapanadze repeatedly told me that his device relied on HF. His patent applications state that he gets the energy from the air.
Of course we do not need altitude at all.
(HF = High frequency)."
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.10.21, 22:09:29
The only question is "how fast can the energy in the air be replenished?".
Not very fast. Actually continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.10.21, 22:09:29
None of them are using oscllators to repeat the process at Mhz speed.
You are assuming that more cycles per second would increase the average power, but it doesn't.
The continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.10.21, 22:09:29
Of course we do not need altitude at all...
Correct. It would be easier to perform the following Forest's 6-step scheme on the surface of the Earth:
1) use the electrostatic induction (https://youtu.be/pJ36EtABLAk?t=158) to charge a neutral metal object with a positively charged inducer
* (in proximity, but not touching).
2) discharge the object to ground via a load through conduction while the inducer is still near but not touching (the object will gain electrons from the ground)
3) interrupt the conduction to ground.
4) move the positive inducer far away (that leaves the object negatively charged with excess electrons gained in pt.2)
5) discharge the object to ground via a load again (this time the object will lose electrons to the ground and becomes neutral)
6) interrupt the conduction to ground.
...go to pt.1
* The inducer is always positively charged and never touches the object, thus it never gains or loses electrons.There is only one gotcha in that scheme - the electrostatic attraction force in pt.4.
1) use the electrostatic induction to charge a neutral metal object with a positively charged inducer* (in proximity, but not touching).
using special Tesla coil generating stepped up DC current pulses and electrostatic response in air/ambient
2) discharge the object to ground via a load through conduction while the inducer is still near but not touching (the object will gain electrons from the ground)
not necessary via load
3) interrupt the conduction to ground.
or use diodes
4) move the positive inducer far away (that leaves the object negatively charged with excess electrons gained in pt.2)
turn off Tesla coil ? is that why we need low frequency interruption showed by various persons like Akula, Ruslan ?
5) discharge the object to ground via a load again (this time the object will lose electrons to the ground and becomes neutral)
here is what happens probably in TK "aquarium" device with spark plug
6) interrupt the conduction to ground.
again this maybe possible using diodes or rather avramenko plug with coaxial cable working as capacitor with one side connected to ground using Avramenko plug and also spark gap to ground for discharging excess electrons after a while of operation
...go to pt.1
Quote from: forest on 2023.10.22, 05:23:28
turn off Tesla coil ? is that why we need low frequency interruption showed by various persons like Akula, Ruslan ?
That does not make sense because it is no different than the coil crossing zero electric potential on every cycle of its AC oscillation.
forest:
In the interuptor type of Kacher/grenade/yoke system, it is the push/pull circuits TL494 output circuit that is also controlling the Kacher's HV pulse, being interrupted at the right time. Unless it is a simple Kacher, which is always running, but, also at a tuned frequency, to do the same thing, which is to affect and interrupt the push pull pulse. Why and how that all works, we are all still learning.
NickZ
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.10.21, 22:43:16
May I restate the most important conjecture from my post...
"The only question is "how fast can the energy in the air be replenished?".
Kapanadze repeatedly told me that his device relied on HF. His patent applications state that he gets the energy from the air.
Of course we do not need altitude at all.
(HF = High frequency)."
FWIW I don't think you're too far off the mark.
Don't regenerative & super-regenerative radio receivers operate on a similar principle? They are self powered. The ambient energy received is miniscule, but the energy is amplified in a tuned resonant tank with a little bit of feedback and the output is much higher. This is when used with a transmitter miles away. What if the transmitter were located closer? According to the inverse square law the energy should increase by the power of two as the distance decreases linearly.
At radio frequencies we're talking roughly between 300kHz to 300MHz. That's a lot of cycles per second, even if we are only 'pumping' a small amount each time. I don't think you'd need a particularly large average power level to pump up to a much higher level.
Wasn't Kapanadze a bit paranoid about allowing wireless measurement apparatus near his generator? Maybe he was afraid of someone noticing that he was transmitting / receiving a high frequency.
Quote from: verpies on 2023.10.21, 23:04:44
Not very fast. Actually continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
You are assuming that more cycles per second would increase the average power, but it doesn't.
The continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
Here is why I have doubts about this answer.
Every time we induce a spike into a system we are entering the field of Tesla impulse technology.
A spike disturbs "static" electrons and also "tribo-electrons". This causes more electrons to enter the device from the air around the device.
If we substitute the term "static electricity" for the term "energy from the vacuum" or "zero-point energy" then everything Bearden writes suddenly makes sense.
Bearden went as far as he could (remember he was a CIA asset)
Take a look at this Houdini video. It is the only one worth watching.
I don't have time at the mo to deal with constructing as I am involved in a serious project.
This video is an eye-opener if you consider the electrons in the air being disturbed and entering your device.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrflrgFOU5I
Even though in theory I can accept your idea, I doubt that Tesla would agree with the part about electrons.
There may be more to the surrounding ambient, than just excited electrons to draw into a device. The Aether is not just electrons.
Science may some day decide that they have tricked us long enough. Fat chance???
Ever notice how our greatest inventor is not even mentioned in our schools?
Why is that? Oh, they just forgot... But they didn't forget about his "Death Ray", or weather manipulation, nor his device that can bring down a bridge, or building, his no battery needed electric car, etc.
80 boxes were confiscated from Tesla. Many of which have never been found again. How did many of those same boxes end up in Serbia? But, not all of them.
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.21, 22:22:32
Peter, aking:
Glad to hear you "just saying". Tesla was also saying it. But we need more than what most guys have shown harvesting energy from thin air.
Kapanadze took his secret with him...He didn't need drones to harvest KWs.
NickZ
No but there must be loads of guy's around who know the secret or is it common knowlege
in some parts af the planet.
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.26, 13:17:06
Even though in theory I can accept your idea, I doubt that Tesla would agree with the part about electrons.
There may be more to the surrounding ambient, than just excited electrons to draw into a device. The Aether is not just electrons.
Science may some day decide that they have tricked us long enough. Fat chance???
Ever notice how our greatest inventor is not even mentioned in our schools?
Why is that? Oh, they just forgot... But they didn't forget about his "Death Ray", or weather manipulation, nor his device that can bring down a bridge, or building, his no battery needed electric car, etc.
80 boxes were confiscated from Tesla. Many of which have never been found again. How did many of those same boxes end up in Serbia? But, not all of them.
NickZ
Yeah but according to Steven Greer the illegal shadow government and The FBI only has till January next year
to release all of Tesla's work to main stream. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2VY2oz-S2c
I believe that the Slavs are the only ones that have shown self runners. And know how to make them.
And also, the Pyramid builders here, on the Moon, and on Mars. As there is no smoke marks in their temples and underground tunnels.
We have a lot to learn. And we should stop shooting down UFOs. And playing Star Wars...
Nuclear technologies were provided by ETs to the Germans, as to be used for free energy type devices, for their benefit. Not for producing bombs to kill people.
Two hundred years before that, Germans were living in huts. With fire and candles being their only "fuel".
NickZ
AG: That disclosure will never happen. That's just a smoke screen. We still don't have all the information about Kennedy's death, after almost 60 years.
Did you notice A kings Educational post ? I wonder if it works or if it just comes out of the battery ? ;D
verpies
QuoteNot very fast. Actually continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
You are assuming that more cycles per second would increase the average power, but it doesn't.
The continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
Correct but not entirely correct.
A continuous conduction or direct current is not as fast as it can get because of the conductor/system resistance. Super-conduction which lacks resistance would be much faster.
Here's a clue from nature. Sand on the beach appears as a solid and easily supports a heavy weight due to it's resistance. However if air is injected into the sand or the sand particles are vibrated very fast it becomes a fluid which can flow like water. The concept is so simple one would think anyone could understand it. When material things start oscillating on some level the resistance to motion is reduced on that level.
So we need to stop thinking on such a generalized and superficial level. We're not talking about electrons oscillating back and forth as an alternating current or AC power but the individual electrons oscillating in themselves. Like vibrating sand particles becoming fluid the free electrons within a conductor could become more fluid entering a state of super conduction.
The work of Dr. John Hutchison and his cold melted metals is a good example, http://guns.connect.fi/innoplaza/energy/story/John/.
QuoteNow as the atom is busy oscillating by itself and trying to stay in one piece under the strain of excess energy, it has other things to worry about than trying to keep tight bonds with neighboring atoms. While experimenter turns more power and hits more of it's resonances, the outer electrons responsible for metallic bonds start to shake themselves loose from other atoms and they start to slide past each other. The result is a soft, trembling jelly of metal.
The concept seems so simple even a child could understand it. By oscillating a system on the proper level we can change the fundamental properties of said system.
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2023.10.26, 21:58:56
A continuous conduction or direct current is not as fast as it can get because of the conductor/system resistance. Super-conduction which lacks resistance would be much faster.
While It is true that superconductors transfer DC more efficient than ordinary conductors, the difference is negligible in the case of the HV drom a drone/baloon.
How much i
2R losses do you think that thin copper wire has when it conducts the HV from high altitude ?
Superconductivity is great but it does not generate any energy by itself.
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2023.10.26, 21:58:56
Here's a clue from nature. Sand on the beach appears as a solid and easily supports a heavy weight due to it's resistance. However if air is injected into the sand or the sand particles are vibrated very fast it becomes a fluid which can flow like water. The concept is so simple one would think anyone could understand it.
When material things start oscillating on some level the resistance to motion is reduced on that level.
Resistance to motion is inertia. That does not change in aerated sand.
What changes are its cohesive forces (normally occurring under gravity) and it does not happen for free because compressed air requires a lot of energy to compress.
Anyway your aerated sand example refers to material things and I might even consider it a valid analogy in the Hutchinson experiments, but not in reference to electrons (which are not matter) or air ions (which are).
So I am game with shaking material things loose but I stil think that shaking the ambient particles is not free and hoping that it generates any extra energy is nonsense.
Maybe, just maybe, creating lightning-level arc discharges in air can lead to relativistic runaway breakdown (https://youtu.be/0tTB74wDduk?t=1860) that breaks apart air molecules with a gain of energy, but this requires 16 Megavolts of accelerating potential over at least 80m, which are not to be found anywhere in the devices considered on this forum.
Verpies:
The only thing that is nonsense, is your opinion of free energy from the ambient. As your idea of energy from mass, has not ever shown anything working, ever,
after all these years professor. Talk about trying to discourage testing and experimenting of actual free energy devices, on these forums, which don't need "fuel".
Lets see how well your energy from mass ideas pan out... Can you, or you won't even try? Like Wesley's claim that conventional science is what counts. He was moderated...
NickZ
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.10.21, 22:43:16
May I restate the most important conjecture from my post...
"The only question is "how fast can the energy in the air be replenished?".
Kapanadze repeatedly told me that his device relied on HF. His patent applications state that he gets the energy from the air.
Of course we do not need altitude at all.
(HF = High frequency)."
aking: The most important thing, is not to put a wire in the sky and hope it can light your house. As that is not going to work, and never has. Unless you just want to light up a red led.
The idea is to obtain energy from the surrounding ambient, not needing to put long wires up in the sky. Just imagine, millions of wires in the sky. Is that the solution?
OR, what both Kapanadze and Tesla had mentioned. About tapping into the Cosmic soup...
Why do I continue to bring this up? Just in case someone forgot about it. Like Verpies, Wesley, F6, and others.
Keep them in the dark, and feed them BS, like mushrooms. AG, once said...
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 13:59:25
The only thing that is nonsense, is your opinion of free energy from the ambient.
Because something from nothing (or undefined cosmic soup) is nonsense, while something from something is not. 0:1
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 13:59:25
As your idea of energy from mass, has not ever shown anything working, ever,
Neither has your idea energy of energy from the cosmic soup. 0:0
Quote from: verpies on 2023.10.27, 13:15:42
Superconductivity is great but it does not generate any energy by itself..
Indeed, but this help to reduce the loss in the system. That's another reason HF is employed. And if you remember your answer in another topic zero=infinite as we cannot divide by zero ... you get zero point energy in this equation.
You only need to accept that aether exist and willing to use it in your desired system. Also take in account that any load (that produce desired work/effect) is just a short between + and - and have certain resistance just because is a short. Also, of you provide a path to return unnecessary energy taken form source/circuit to the primary you create an apparent negative resistance and the load will be seen as providing not consuming energy. You need to make sure the circuit have enough capacitance to sustain the load.
Frequency, capacitance, inductance, length of wire O0
Quote from: Classic on 2023.10.27, 18:38:29
Indeed, but this help to reduce the loss in the system.
Reducing the losses gets you closer to unity but not over it.
Quote from: Classic on 2023.10.27, 18:38:29
And if you remember your answer in another topic zero=infinite as we cannot divide by zero ... you get zero point energy in this equation.
It doesn't mean that. It only means that you cannot analyze inductors with emf (voltage) as the current-causing agent, in all cases, because inductors only care about current.
Conversely, capacitors care only about voltage.
That why in order to preserve the energy stored in an inductor, you must close it and and to preserve the energy stored in a capacitor you must open it.
Quote from: Classic on 2023.10.27, 18:38:29
You only need to accept that aether exist and willing to use it in your desired system.
That's how religions work - not science. I don't accept anything without proof.
Quote from: verpies on 2023.10.27, 15:47:55
Because something from nothing (or undefined cosmic soup) is nonsense, while something from something is not. 0:1
Neither has your idea energy of energy from the cosmic soup. 0:0
It's not my idea, it's Teslas. So, you call "nonsense" what Tesla mentioned about the Aether, that is everywhere. And responsible for everything we see, and what we don't see... Right?
It is your opinion, that no free energy exists, nor can exist. So, what you are saying is that you know more, and that he Tesla was wrong, about things like the Cosmic Soup, and that conventional science, which does not believe in free energy, is right. Yawn...
Can I ask how many inventions, patents, and or and science papers you've written??? Especially about free energy, and such.... None?
Tesla had a few hundred inventions, patents, and thousands of notes, experiments and tests. You professor?
You don't have to accept anything without proof. Only classic is asking you to accept it, at least as a theory, to indulge in. But, you can't...
A guy that does not believe in free energy, must be in the wrong place, and wants us to show proof. Good luck with that .
But, there is more to this than meets the eye. And is why these threads just don't go by the wayside, like all the rest.
NickZ
https://youtu.be/Y0mmyNLHJBY?si=sx9IQ2p0dPjiAD8O :D
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 19:20:22
It's not my idea, it's Teslas. So, you call "nonsense" what Tesla mentioned about the Aether, that is everywhere.
I don't do hero worship
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 19:20:22
It is your opinion, that no free energy exists, nor can exist.
It is not. I just reject energy from nothing and without a defined mechanism.
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 19:20:22
So, what you are saying is that you know more, and that he Tesla was wrong, about things like the Cosmic Soup,
I live in the 21 century. Every young stem graduate now knows more than an inventor from the 19th century.
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.27, 19:20:22
Can I ask how many inventions, patents, and or and science papers you've written???
You may not. This is a debate about ideas and phenomena (events) - not about people.
Great Minds Discuss Ideas; Average Minds Discuss Events; Small Minds Discuss People (https://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/11/18/great-minds/)
Quote from: verpies on 2023.10.27, 19:15:03
Reducing the losses gets you closer to unity but not over it.
It doesn't mean that. It only means that you cannot analyze inductors with emf (voltage) as the current-causing agent, in all cases, because inductors only care about current.
Conversely, capacitors care only about voltage.
That why in order to preserve the energy stored in an inductor, you must close it and and to preserve the energy stored in a capacitor you must open it.
That's how religions work - not science. I don't accept anything without proof.
So, capacitance of the system don't play any role in your opinion ? Nor dielectric layers in coils ? Is the apparent negative resistance part of the religious beliefs that you are so keen to dismiss ?
I really don't understand why you don't want to see to relationship between length of wire, frequency, impedance and capacitance for such a system ?
In my opinion length of wire which must be multiple of 1/2 wave length for the frequency of voltage injected into the system is of essence and the higher you go with frequency the higher accuracy is needed for length of wires used.
High frequency will remove most of the ohmic resistance in copper wires reducing the loss and this lead to load having always higher resistance than circuit providing electricity and this must be at least 10 times bigger, so a voltage dependant resistor can be employed as well for final adjustment.
Capacitance of the system must be calculated for desired output and can be quite high if a heavy load is to be powered.
I am pretty sure you already have sufficient knowledge but for those who are looking for a realationship this might be very useful https://electronicsclub.info/impedance.htm#reactance
Four electrical quantities determine the impedance (Z) of a circuit: resistance (R), capacitance (C), inductance (L) and frequency (f).
Square wave should be employed for signal generator.
To have such a generator working someone need to use reactance or parametric excitation.
In order not to draw excessive power from the source secondary coil(s) should have only 1 output wire connected not both. Watch youtube video above where Joel Lagace explains why. And I already mention this long time ago, but probably my lacking skills for explanation where at fault.
"It is so simple that you will laugh" ... how difficult might be to hide a fake connection ? Or to pretend that all wires are connected ?
Open circuit or short circuit, choose one of the methods not both in the same device and work your way.
Verpies:
Although there is no need to answer, you've already said it all.
Hero worship huh...well good luck with your "fuel" tests, you'll need it, your free energy results show just what you really know.
Did you hear that guys, this guy thinks that he is smarter than Tesla. And, he is not even joking.
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.28, 12:40:35
Verpies:
Although there is no need to answer, you've already said it all.
Hero worship huh...well good luck with your "fuel" tests, you'll need it, your free energy results show just what you really know.
Did you hear that guys, this guy thinks that he is smarter than Tesla. And, he is not even joking.
NickZ
It makes me wonder how this concept of energy from nothing has been pushed and whom can benefit from it ?
Of course if someone keep saying you can't get energy from nothing where this "nothing" is nothing just because mainstream science reject it. All devices that are ou and/or exploit FE are not based on exact mainstream science.
Its up to you if you want to get something from "nothing" or nothing from something.
Also, multiple of 1/2 wave length means that we collect electricity from the antinodes, bellies or however you want to call them ... at their maximum amplitudes at high frequency, if you fail to make connections in the exact right place the results will show ... sometimes if everything is built correct in terms of schematic some trimming on ends of wires might just do the wonder especially at high frequency
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.28, 12:40:35
Verpies:
Although there is no need to answer, you've already said it all.
Hero worship huh...well good luck with your "fuel" tests, you'll need it, your free energy results show just what you really know.
Did you hear that guys, this guy thinks that he is smarter than Tesla. And, he is not even joking.
NickZ
So what, he is entitled to his opinion even if it's wrong, don't for get if some one solves it they end as 'brown bread'
and not just the finder but his or her family get's annihilated by the illegal shadow Guv (Steven Greer's words) so until ET or divine intervention gets involved what's next ?
Well, we can all keep guessing...
Kept in the dark and fed, well you know...
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.10.28, 16:04:03
Well, we can all keep guessing...
Kept in the dark and fed, well you know... While waiting for divine intervention... Or more opinions...
NickZ
Quote from: verpies on 2023.10.21, 23:04:44
Not very fast. Actually continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
You are assuming that more cycles per second would increase the average power, but it doesn't.
The continuous conduction from the drone/baloon to ground is as fast as it can get.
Correct. It would be easier to perform the following Forest's 6-step scheme on the surface of the Earth:
1) use the electrostatic induction (https://youtu.be/pJ36EtABLAk?t=158) to charge a neutral metal object with a positively charged inducer* (in proximity, but not touching).
2) discharge the object to ground via a load through conduction while the inducer is still near but not touching (the object will gain electrons from the ground)
3) interrupt the conduction to ground.
4) move the positive inducer far away (that leaves the object negatively charged with excess electrons gained in pt.2)
5) discharge the object to ground via a load again (this time the object will lose electrons to the ground and becomes neutral)
6) interrupt the conduction to ground.
...go to pt.1
* The inducer is always positively charged and never touches the object, thus it never gains or loses electrons.
There is only one gotcha in that scheme - the electrostatic attraction force in pt.4.
Are you sure electrons can move out of a metal and glide along the surface
once the frequency goes above 20khz ?? sounds weierd to me are you sure you don't mean
ions or some other free partical ??? and then there is the tesla coil how do electrons
travel to the grenade again wierd! again are you sure its not ions or electro magnetics
it's a bit like saying fridge magnets use electrons, do they realy ?
On the topic of the thread - fake or not fake ???
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2bn1dnm9q0
Quote from: DELAMORTO on 2023.10.31, 10:35:55
On the topic of the thread - fake or not fake ???
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2bn1dnm9q0
CC is turned off so it's not possible to translate to english
any chance to can reload it and set those perimeters on ? O0
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2023.10.31, 12:47:46
CC is turned off so it's not possible to translate to english
any chance to can reload it and set those perimeters on ? O0
Inspired?
There is also the first episode)))
The simplest electricity generator! NOT FAKE!!! :D
Translation seems to work for subtitles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_z-64YiDYM
Quote from: DELAMORTO on 2023.11.01, 10:47:03
The simplest electricity generator! NOT FAKE!!! :D
Translation seems to work for subtitles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_z-64YiDYM
Great video enjoyed watching it many thanks for sharing it.
I also enjoyed watching that last video, until he showed where the big Tesla coil was located, providing near field low amp pulses. There is NO FREE energy there.
Nor in his other videos, where he is connected to the battery for a total of less than a minute.
I wish that I could say something constructive about that, but, I can't. Sorry.
NickZ
Just watch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1IDC8FEIBU
Sil
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.11.01, 13:05:52
I also enjoyed watching that last video, until he showed where the big Tesla coil was located, providing near field low amp pulses. There is NO FREE energy there.
Nor in his other videos, where he is connected to the battery for a total of less than a minute.
I wish that I could say something constructive about that, but, I can't. Sorry.
NickZ
What arguments do you have that there is no free energy there? Tesla transformer turned on in the background, you think, then it will simply incinerate such a load, but you don't understand this.... ;D Because being an armchair video expert is not the same as winding such a large resonator!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=armxmkIvxBU This is the size of a resonator about the size of a finger, it produces a current for a car light bulb of 12 volts 24 watts
Compare and think again about the difference in power!
A Tesla transformer is a standing wave - one fixed frequency! In the video he moves the coil across the resonator, and there are other places where the LED lights up! This means that there are many sources for excitation of the resonator! This could be either Wifi or radio interference.
In any case, the signal source is low-power. There is no way it could be a Tesla transformer!
Delamorto:
If you think that the big Tesla coil has nothing to do with the led lighting up. Ask him to do the same thing without it. Or being a short distance away. Or even like outside.
Any way, that is what I think.
You can make a test coil with the led on it, and see if it works. It won't, without the Tesla coil transmitting near field wireless. That is not there for nothing.
Nor will that led light up across the street, even with the Tesla coil on. So, it is not a fake, but, it is a deception. As there is no free energy, as the Tesla coil is being powered in order to transmit a wireless pulse. So, try it for yourself. As a Tesla coil can be fired up even using mV inputs, with higher voltages creating further distant near field wireless effects.
NickZ
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.11.02, 15:21:19
Delamorto:
If you think that the big Tesla coil has nothing to do with the led lighting up. Ask him to do the same thing without it. Or being a short distance away. Or even like outside.
Any way, that is what I think.
You can make a test coil with the led on it, and see if it works. It won't, without the Tesla coil transmitting near field wireless. That is not there for nothing.
Nor will that led light up across the street, even with the Tesla coil on. So, it is not a fake, but, it is a deception. As there is no free energy, as the Tesla coil is being powered in order to transmit a wireless pulse. So, try it for yourself. As a Tesla coil can be fired up even using mV inputs, with higher voltages creating further distant near field wireless effects.
NickZ
Unfortunately, I don't have a couple of kilometers of wire for such a resonator... Otherwise, I would be happy to check it.
What this one ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LXEyZhjhfc
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2023.11.03, 00:02:49
What this one ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LXEyZhjhfc
yes
Quote from: DELAMORTO on 2023.11.03, 09:15:56
yes
Delamorto:
The purpose of the "resonator" is to resonate (resound) the big Tesla coil's output. Normally we called that coil the "receiver coil", which picks up the pulses from the main Tesla Coil.
If he is leading you to think that the led is lighting from the ambient. It's not. And is why he is so close to the Tesla coil. Also, his Ground line connection is very close by the big coil as well, just below the big Tesla coil. These are not there by chance.
Check out all the other videos of similar Tesla coils and resonators on youtube. No free energy in any of them.
from what i can see its BEMF thats generating the so called exess energy, so it has to be started first
but if inough energy to self run can be generated olr not thats the question.
I highly doubt that BEMF can allow any device to output more than its input. Just from that alone. The ambient has to be involved, if not, it's no cigar.
My idea is that it may be this same BEMF pulse that may be what Ruslan mentions needs to "shake" (or vibrate) the surrounding ambient. I believe that it's this effect that we may be missing. This HF HV interruption pulse, at just the right frequency. However, that exact frequency has a tiny bandwidth, and very difficult to find and utilize.
NickZ
You are so right 'resonance' Tesla said BEMF is usless with out resonance.
I think it's part of the saga.
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2023.11.03, 16:01:45
You are so right 'resonance' Tesla said BEMF is usless with out resonance.
I think it's rart of the saga.
The simplest thing is to ask him to demonstrate the operation of the resonator on the street or in the field! ;D
Quote from: NickZ on 2023.11.03, 13:56:47
I highly doubt that BEMF can allow any device to output more than its input. Just from that alone. The ambient has to be involved, if not, it's no cigar.
My idea is that it may be this same BEMF pulse that may be what Ruslan mentions needs to "shake" (or vibrate) the surrounding ambient. I believe that it's this effect that we may be missing. This HF HV interruption pulse, at just the right frequency. However, that exact frequency has a tiny bandwidth, and very difficult to find and utilize.
NickZ
There are some clues known in the art relating to vibrations.
I repeated one experiment where I placed an iron core inside a coil which generated a voltage whenever I struck the core with a hammer. It generates a voltage because we are immersed in Earths magnetic field and the impact disrupts the iron cores magnetic domains. Think about that, an impact scatters the magnetic domains changing the magnetic field strength in the core which then induces the coil. Many fail to understand we don't really need to generate or dissipate a magnetic field because were already immersed in an ambient one.
https://fuel-efficient-vehicles.org/energy-news/?page_id=1166
QuoteThe motor, according to its inventor, is without visible means of power. It obtains its initial impulse, Hendershot maintains, from a precharged magnetic core, and its secondary and greatest power impulse by magnetic induction from the earth.
AC