Im guessing these are DC filter capacitors with a bleed resistor.. anyone disagree?
Definatley an electrolytic shame we can read those batch codes and manufacturer code.
The device on top is not quiet right for a resistor, may just be a bad or lack of colour but the background colour is too bright for a resistor i know of, but panasonic tv's used a similar device on it's tube base to protect against >200V flashover but it's impossible to be sure.
Also interestingly maybe this gives some clues.
This LTPU seems to have 2 supplys and 2 torroids in the middle, so maybe they need seperate supplys and then uses a single stage output, i think it's less likely this uses 2 supplys for push/pull mode because of the 2 seperate center toroids.
So why does he need 2 isolated drive modules to get a larger output, why not just beef up a single stage, and i guess the answer to this is because he already developed a stage that worked but wasnt easily upable in power because of component limitations, and hence was much easier to just use 2 drive modules, as the wires from each toroid run to different places, i think if i remember correctly one set to left of opening in ring and one set to right side of opening in ring then it maybe the case that one was driving clockwise and the other anti clockwise which created a much larger effect on the output(Guessing)
Could it be a feed-through capacitor? on top of a DC capacitor?
http://www.mgs4u.com/RF-Microwave/pictures/5000pf_feedthrough.jpg
I wouldn't completely discount them as being resistors, either as bleed resistors (I posted such a few years ago as z_p_e), or perhaps equalizing resistors.
Also, they may be some type of diode.
I doubt they would be feedthrough caps., imho.
.99
I could see the importance of bleeding down the filter caps when the device is shut down..
Bleeding resistors would be counter productive in an OU device.
I think it was Giantkiller that confirmed they were diodes. Also, those two caps are in series. Probably 400v each to make the 800 volt rating
If you want a good LTPU diagram, I had made one way back.
Go here;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Steven%20Mark/wattsup-tpu/
and click on the
SM17-WD-1-small.jpg or the bigger ones.
You will have much more there so enjoy.
wattsup
Maybe it is only because I used them back in the 70-80's but it is a diode - no bout a-dout it.
The bands are nearest one end (the cathode). Aerospace and military types usually had a very wide white band with 2, 3 or 4 color bands painted over the white band.
The gold bonded germanium higher current types were quite large and fast. The construction was much like a miniature modern cola can except the cathode end was filled with glass or epoxy. These would have been good at charging a cap with very fast and short duration spikes.
Silicon types looked much the same but I don't recall any that large.
IMO, the caps are storage banks providing power to the two separate mini-TPUs and the diodes keep the caps charged from the mid-level collector.
The caps aren't in series. One terminal of each is tied to a common power bus.
Thanks guys! Big help!
almost...
I've been staring at it since 2007. It has always been a diode in my view.
@WaveWatcher
Thanks for your diode chart that spells out diode very well. But they are in series. I had followed that end of the LTPU with close up motion for so long and had mapped it out on the diagram at the above link. Also, there is no point in having those coils is parallel.
plus, the LTPU voltage rating was in the 800's. Two 400v caps is series makes sense and agrees with the video.
POST 2 by "spherics":
It appears I have been too brief in my presentation. I truly believed that there would be a group here who would be able to make the leap between the Steven Mark devices you are familiar with and the design that I showed.
Firstly although this has been mooted I am not Jack. All I will say is the interview says more about the character of Jack than it does Steven Mark. I will also add that the SM device uses rotation. I say this without doubt and Jack is wrong in saying rotation is not necessary.
I will now talk about the Steven Mark designs you have seen in the videos and the like so you will understand why my design at the start of this message works.
The SM designs all work on the same set of principles. A pulse into a coil generates an expanding magnetic field. The magnetic field comes into being by an underlying patterning of the ether. It is a cascade action on the part of the ether that causes the EFFECT of an expanding magnetic field. If you then cause a second magnetic field to expand through the same space as the already expanding magnetic field, a specific cascading action, a pattern is setup in the ether which is the EQUIVALENT of a magnetic field and has many of the characteristics of a magnetic field. By this I mean it will interact with metals, and cause the EFFECT of a current, IF the field is moving across the metal. I will refer to this field as a COMP field from now on. But please be clear this COMP field is in addition to the expected magnetic field. This COMP field, a patterning in the ether, is dampened and effectively nulled by magnetic metals. This is why if you are using an iron core in the coils named control coils you will never get a working TPU.
No doubt this may be disconcerting to many who have fond references to baling wire, iron wire and the like. I will now digress onto the circumstance surrounding the initial eureka moment as I understand them. Audiophiles who frequent this watering-hole will no doubt have heard of QUAD ESL electrostatic speakers. An essential design element is the incoming signal is sent into, I believe, 7 or 8 progressive delay elements. These elements delay the signal by microseconds each time.
As part of experiments, associated with what would become his 3D spacial control patents, he was using these delay elements with custom made bifilar wound voice coils (i.e. air coils) and unexpectedly detected an anomolous signal on his spectrum analyser.
Steven Mark created his own delay elements using iron wire after several years of intermittent experimentation. The technique was to carefully wrap a bifilar air-coil using copper wire. The longer the length of copper the better but using identical lengths. The two coils were connected to the SAME pulse waveforms in parallel so that the magnetic field is additive NOT cancelling. The delay element was added in series to only one of the coils that made up the bifilar coil. The delay coil was made from insulated iron wire wound into an air coil. An oscilloscope was connected to both COPPER coils. The setup would be pulsed with a dc offset square wave (i.e. 0 to 20V not -10 to 10V) at the resonant frequency of the bifilar coils. The tuning consisted of cutting the iron wire down in length until an unexpected pulse/signal appeared. This pulse is the kick. I will refer to these tuned bifilar coils as kick coils.
You are privy to the information that the COMP field is nulled by iron. Those who so wish may like to take some time to fully comprehend the frustrations of closely packing the delay and bifilar coils together only to find the unexpected pulse was no longer appearing!!! This is what SM had to contend. And Jack says SM was not technical. Bunkum!!
From traditional electrical engineering view point the kick coils for a particular quantity of energy now put out the expected magnetic field but also put out the COMP field which has effects like a magnetic field. In a world that excludes the ether, these coils are overunity. If the world took into account the ether, then the coils would not be thought of as overunity.
The magnetic field is now larger than expected. All that needs to be done is to rotate this field in a circle and intercept the field with an output coil. The captured energy is greater than the input energy because of the energy apparently created by the COMP field. If you arrange all N poles of the kicker coils so that they point towards the center and pulse each coil in turn you will get a rotating magnetic field. There are many ways to create a rotating magnetic field. A secondary effect of a rotating field is the entrainment of the COMP field so that the pattern in the ether is partially additive. A big problem was the iron in the delay coils. It was found that a large solenoid fed with a DC current to produce a static magnetic field around all of the kicker coils allowed the kicker coils to be tuned with the iron delay coils in close proximity.
Intercepting only N poles of the kicker coils means you get a DC output along with a smaller induced ripple from pulsing the kicker coils.
Feedback of the output into the input was achieved using toroidal saturable inductor switches. I've copied the picture from other messages of the inductor switches. Refer to the patent for an example to see how these switches are used. Early designs used a small magnet to bias the saturable inductors.
All SM devices had small batteries to power the LC oscillators. The LC oscillators were used as control pulse currents to the saturable inductors. To start the process high voltage capacitors were step charged, this is why the coils took time to start-up! The first few pulses came from these pre-charged capacitors being switched via saturable inductors. Part of the DC output was feedback to keep the capacitors fully charged.
My design shown at the very start of this message thread eliminated the need for an iron delay coil because the pattern is set up in the ether outside of the influence of copper metal of the control coils. It directly allows the COMP field to be generated IN FREE SPACE. By placing the output toroidal coil within this free space the COMP field is intercepted. The complete lack of any magnetic materials within this design is what allows this to happen.
I do believe there are elements of information here that you will not have been aware of before. I trust this is enough to convince at least some of you to reflect and ponder more seriously on this material.
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19820016542_1982016542.pdf
Grumps and All,
Decisive info as usual thanks for the reminder. Anyone replicating please understand this info. Its in YOUR BEST interests.
Is there a formula to calculate the delay assuming its a magnetic component?
@Grumpy
Check this article.
www.onethingaudio.net/FOR/QUA/63/PDF/9512-QUA-63-REV-RK.pdf
See any parallels?
Added.
About Spherics post, I can say that after a good year of experiments, his depiction does have some tempting aspects that will be tried soon enough.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.04.22, 13:09:04
The SM designs all work on the same set of principles. A pulse into a coil generates an expanding magnetic field. The magnetic field comes into being by an underlying patterning of the ether. It is a cascade action on the part of the ether that causes the EFFECT of an expanding magnetic field. If you then cause a second magnetic field to expand through the same space as the already expanding magnetic field, a specific cascading action, a pattern is setup in the ether which is the EQUIVALENT of a magnetic field and has many of the characteristics of a magnetic field. By this I mean it will interact with metals, and cause the EFFECT of a current, IF the field is moving across the metal. I will refer to this field as a COMP field from now on. But please be clear this COMP field is in addition to the expected magnetic field. This COMP field, a patterning in the ether, is dampened and effectively nulled by magnetic metals. This is why if you are using an iron core in the coils named control coils you will never get a working TPU.
A pulse into a coil creates and expanding magnetic field. How is this possible when the pulse has minimal current?
Hi All
Trying to get a 'feel' of this comp wave. It is analogous to the cracking of a whip but in reverse.
The timing required must be precise and VERY FAST with respect to the expanding energy field. As stated earlier it appears from a expanding fields and the ethers reaction to being disturbed from natural equilibrium imho permits this through its elasticity.
Once the field is expanding a second field requires less energy to continue in the same direction. Think on the cannon hint! as the ether has been pushed slightly forward with the 1st pulse and its elastic like recovery sends it too far in the oppostie direction from equilibrium and at this precise point a second pulse is energised into the ether it will travel (so to speak) a little further away from equilibrium as the first pulse setup, A gain in energy ....
A simple example may be moving your car by pushing it up a slight hill.
If its stationary its much harder than if already moving slowly, the energy required seems easier once it gets going.....
Just a thought...
Steve.
Are you saying there is an EM escape velocity?
One large inital pulse backed up by a pulse train of lower amplitude pulses?
repeated pulses at same amplitude
timed to reinforce the field - similar to a build up of force during resonance
I think it helps to NOT consider it some form of amplification but rather another form of induction that is more effcient than conventional magnetic induction, or conversion of the potential energy of the vacuum, ether, or fields into dynamic energy (electricity).
Some other interesting comments were made about the "Molin-Martinez Device":
QuoteSomeone mentioned the Alberto Molina-Martinez device as being the same. It would appear at a casual glancing at the patent to be chock full to the brim with iron/steel and other magnetic materials which I have said ad nausium is a no-no. Also the 3 phase pickup coils use the same coil structure and location as the 3 phase generating coils. As soon as the pickup coils are induced they will reflect a pattern in the ether back on the generating coils and any advantage will be lost. There are also no pulses timed to cause an overlap of ether waves in the proximity of the pickup coil nor is there any directional biasing.
(Molina-Martinez later came on the forum and stated that his referenced device was operated as a transformer and was not OU as he originally believed when he applied for the patent.)
Ok a wild guess here..
I have a friend who repairs tube amps and I had him look at the photo..
He said siemens made a 500v all black filter capacitor for tube amps that had minimal writing on it, the writing was sideways and one line of the writing was LL LL LL LL which stood for low loss.
He also said that he the part across the cap looks like a fast drain resistor..
A diode across an electrolytic cap is used to prevent reverse bias damage. A zener is used to prevent overvoltage but this is so basic. a diode can be used this way to supply a voltage bias with others for level shifting still basic, question is, is it a diode? Not having much to go on either each idea must be eliminated with known possibilities until the most applicable is left. Assumptions then made of possible operations for the device and when exhausted start again. Oh the enigma, sweet as it is. Is it in all the units? Simple to ask or only in the larger ones? Too many questions not yet answered but a good stab at its operation does exist. Filter caps or HV storage for the pulse would be a good first to find.
The other comment I made would require delay time respect to frequency and the actual size of the coil is important too. Ether and its constants Uo, C, ....would then allow a tangible theoretical outlook for this comp energies OU utilisation.
So much to do but learning all the time.
QuoteAll SM devices had small batteries to power the LC oscillators. The LC oscillators were used as control pulse currents to the saturable inductors. To start the process high voltage capacitors were step charged, this is why the coils took time to start-up! The first few pulses came from these pre-charged capacitors being switched via saturable inductors. Part of the DC output was feedback to keep the capacitors fully charged.
Hi grumps,
Came across a 4 core device for steepening up the pulse rise and fall time and the width of the pulse was shorter too. Ive posted the details a while ago. Came across it when working on kick magnet control units for a certain company (NDC) applies unfortunately.
Saturable inductor control unit .....YOU, will understand.
US 4707619 is the patent number.
From the mid 80's and an interesting item re the pulse amplitude, as a slower pulse is much easier to create, this would UP it somewhat!
Cheers Steve.
Quote from: szaxx on 2010.04.22, 22:44:45
Saturable inductor control unit .....YOU, will understand.
US 4707619 is the patent number.
From the mid 80's and an interesting item re the pulse amplitude, as a slower pulse is much easier to create, this would UP it somewhat!
All who see this:
FYI, download the patent from www.google.com/advanced_patent_search ,
Also,
www.pat2pdf.org
http://www.google.com/patents?id=QlMyAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false
@wattsup,
Please don't connect two 400V caps in series and apply 800V without safety glasses. A 350 or 400V electrolytic is about what I would use on a 150V circuit.
The electrostatic speakers are a wonder. They seem simple but I doubt they are. I really like the delay lines being used to create shaped wave from a flat surface.
@all
One thing bothers me, even on my choice of diode over something else.... how many axial lead diodes, resistors, caps, thermal fuses, delay lines, inductors, etc, etc. do you see with very long lead length? At what point does the lead end and the wire begin?
BTW: What is that white thing (yellow arrow pointing to it)? A SIDAC/DIAC perhaps?
let's take a different approach to the caps:
http://www.google.com/patents?id=FskCAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false
step charging - like he said
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.04.22, 18:06:34
A pulse into a coil creates and expanding magnetic field. How is this possible when the pulse has minimal current?
Think about that for a moment Grumps....you answered your own question.
If there is a changing current (and there is) then there will be a changing magnetic field. Why is it assumed that these fields need to be strong to start the process?
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.04.23, 02:44:37
Think about that for a moment Grumps....you answered your own question.
If there is a changing current (and there is) then there will be a changing magnetic field. Why is it assumed that these fields need to be strong to start the process?
.99
Hydrogen bomb is not one bomb its a lot of bombs... ::)
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.04.23, 02:44:37
Think about that for a moment Grumps....you answered your own question.
If there is a changing current (and there is) then there will be a changing magnetic field. Why is it assumed that these fields need to be strong to start the process?
.99
What I was getting at is that ether rolled back on itself, has a magnetic moment and is therefore inductive when in this form. You can only detect the little ring magnets of curled ether by interacting with them, which interrupts the ring pattern/shape.
setting the next test up today and will try to bring it all to fruition this weekend...
Quote from: darkspeed on 2010.04.23, 05:32:39
Hydrogen bomb is not one bomb its a lot of bombs... ::)
yes, and the RE field is not one field but millions of tiny toroidal magnets - closed loop that is. Look at a cavitation bubble or ring (like a smoke ring). Goes straight and doesn't react with anything that doesn't change the medium (air in smoke ring case).
so, to rotate a field of these little rings - you have to use more little rings
ball lighting is similar
Just a thought, anyone know if anyone in the Audio world would use White Noise generators to test out amp systems.
I know you can buy White Noise Generators but dont know why.
The reason i ask.
When i try to create the Explosion experiment, using a single fet system i only get the noise of the fundamental frequency from the coil when i get re-triggering, but in a 2 fet system i get white noise and explosions.
So maybe he was injecting white noise into his amp system while testing his bifilar coil speakers and found the explosions on his spectrum analyzer.
White noise has a few uses but the one that interests me is where it is used to blank-out (clean) other ambient noise. Brownian(red) noise, and sometimes, white noise, injected into an audio system is said to 'add body or dimension' to the sound. I have read Brownian noise is used to give sound 'direction' or 'shape'.
haven't figured what all that means. My hearing is pretty bad :)
Hi guys,
When white noise is directly fed to one audio channel directly and the other channel has exactly the same signal which has been delayed there exists a spacial effect when listened to. If the delay is slowly varying say at 2Hz the effect is as if the noise is physically moving around. If the 2 signals are evenly combined it creates a deep depression and a boosted signal frequency dependant on the delay. If this combined signals delay is varied at say 2Hz then the sound emulates waves on the beach or even the sound of a jet aircraft passing by. It is used in quality hi fi as a procedure for phase imbalances and setting up parametric equalisers for those nyquists of sonic perfection. Bang and olufsen are a brand where you may find uses of white noise generators. If they still exist.
Hope this enlightens you somewhat.
@szaxx,
Very interesting, indeed!
Quote
phase imbalances and setting up parametric equalisers for those nyquists of sonic perfection
Man Oh Man! That line is a major part of my TPU theory.
Ever hear of white/red noise used to increase the apparent size of an antenna? Say, by a thousand fold?
Or to disorient troops to the point they couldn't tell where they were or which direction was up?
Nah. Me neither ;)
Still amazing stuff for audio. I have wondered if this was a trick on the brain or a measurable effect.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2010.04.24, 20:53:12
Ever hear of white/red noise used to increase the apparent size of an antenna? Say, by a thousand fold?
That is a transmit to receive system. Broadcast out of phase and the desired (received) signal ends up in your amplifier.
ya, never heard of it...
Hi
2 transmitted frequencies antennas spaced at 1/4 wavelength apart have the same frequency but 1transmits at1Hz off frequency the effect of this is a bi planar rotating envelope of RF in a figure 8 formation. No moving parts to this arrangement but the transmitted RF envelope effectively rotates.
Cool stuff this phase fed energies
In jest.
Noise that totally disorientates troops .....
Meet the missis. A whole lotta holorin!
:-).
So there is a good chance SM was using white noise injected into his electrostatic speaker system or the like if he was playing with apatial effects.
Hmm this is sounding like i am on the right track then with these explosions as the retriggering seems to cause it and thats when i get the random explosions appearing.
Quote from: Peterae on 2010.04.24, 21:55:01
So there is a good chance SM was using white noise injected into his electrostatic speaker system or the like if he was playing with apatial effects.
Hmm this is sounding like i am on the right track then with these explosions as the retriggering seems to cause it and thats when i get the random explosions appearing.
Actually there are specific harmonics that you want to suppress and in some systems signal is injected at these frequencies to null them in the output.. or not..
look at why a hammer on a piano wire is located at the 7th harmonic of that wire to suppress that frequency in the wire..
Hi all,
If you wanted to remove a ringing in an audio system you could filter it out. If you wanted to remove say a squeal when receiving morse code then you need a very steep sided notch filter.
To do the notch thing you would delay the signal and feedback this delayed signal to the input of the delay unit, the resulting notch is easily capable of dropping the unwanted noise by over 80dB there is an effect as dropping one freq also increases another all time related to the delay. If SM knew this then this would explain in clear english to me that some harmonics were bad and some were needed. feeding 2 signals into a bifilar with 1 time delayed would have a very distinct effect on the transients when sweeping around the resonance point of that coil. there would be naturally occuring peaks and troughs of several orders of magnitude and its effect is DEFINATELY worth investigating (shock waves in the ether). as to the delay I have thought of using coax as theres no iron but there is the magnetic properties of an iron coil and these would probably not be present.....
Thoughts....
Steve.
RS guru says the part on top of the capacitor is one of these - top right silver part - without the nut
I guess to use as a test point
And here are the magnets..