Einstein's revelations are based upon the fact that one of the variables of relativity must be unity(1). c, or the speed of light in a vacuum, was chosen.
Why c?
Energy, mass (not matter) and c. Where is space in the equation?
Isn't it equally plausible that the expansion/contraction of space should be a non-unity factor included in the formula?
If so, then there may be better explanations of things like black holes with no escaping light. In this case, the compression of space would constitute a much longer path for escaping light to travel. Since escaping light would then take longer to travel, the energy of that light would appear to us as a much lower wavelength. To put it simply, the amount of energy doesn't change but something must so frequency does.
Isn't it just as plausible to say space has expanded or compressed and the speed of light is only unity in the view of the observer located in the same frame?
If space dilation/compression is a factor then there is no unity variable except the observer's reference frame and gravity may just be a result of mass and space.
Got Redshift anyone?
:D
P.S.
This is becoming a question for me due to results I see from experiments with pulse compression and 7 minute traverse times for laser pulses in crystal latices.
It could also explain watch speeds/light&temperature shifts while contained in certain controlled fields.
Just one more thought, while the coffee is working.....
The laws of the Universe override the laws of physics(observations of scientists).
The first Universal law is: Nothing can, has or will happen until it does happen.
The second law is: See the first law.
THERE! My coffee is now failing me. :'(
>>Edit:
Been thinking of this idea in mathematical terms today. Even if space and time are added to the formula (not assumed to be integrated with E, m or c as they are now), the rest would not change, just the understanding of the rest.
Space and Time are said to be two sides of the same coin. I think this is correct but one side can warp and take the other with it.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2010.05.08, 15:03:12
Einstein's revelations are based upon the fact that one of the variables of relativity must be unity(1). c, or the speed of light in a vacuum, was chosen.
Why c?
Energy, mass (not matter) and c. Where is space in the equation?
A thought experiment?
Space in the equation comes as a velocity of light (c) moving through space, right? No one can go from point 'A' to point 'B' with no transpired time (instantly). To do this may imply exceeding the speed of light, but that can't be done by any means I know of.
Quote
Isn't it equally plausible that the expansion/contraction of space should be a non-unity factor included in the formula?
Space is black at night because light leaves the universe and doesn't reflect off anything out there, right? Infinity can't 'expand' or 'contract', yes? It's infinite. Does this hypothesis change your question(s) above?
Quote
If so, then there may be better explanations of things like black holes with no escaping light. In this case, the compression of space would constitute a much longer path for escaping light to travel. Since escaping light would then take longer to travel, the energy of that light would appear to us as a much lower wavelength. To put it simply, the amount of energy doesn't change but something must so frequency does.
Galaxies and black holes at the edge of the universe appear red and infrared---Redshift, obviously---because at that distance frequency does change to a lower value. Light is forced to change by the action of traveling through space and time to get here. Space is still infinite, but light isn't.
Quote
Isn't it just as plausible to say space has expanded or compressed and the speed of light is only unity in the view of the observer located in the same frame?
Space in nonphysical, so, assuming it's nothing but empty volume, especially---theoretically and arguably---at the edge (if there is an 'edge' to infinity), it itself can't change, right? Finite things in space change. 'C' is a constant, but that also makes it non-infinite. So, then, 'c' might be view by the observer as a finite constant, but that's all?
Quote
If space dilation/compression is a factor then there is no unity variable except the observer's reference frame and gravity may just be a result of mass and space.
Dilation is a function of time and velocity is as well, and they're not constant the faster you move. 'C' is a constant and not a variable. All else, other than 'c', isn't unity in this thought experiment. Gravity isn't acting on the object moving, is it? Other than acceleration?
I had to think my way through this as I went along in real time. That being so, I may not be able to experimentally prove any of this, so take it for what it's worth: an informal opinion.
--Lee
Quote from: the_big_m_in_ok on 2010.05.08, 23:34:09
A thought experiment?
Space in the equation comes as a velocity of light (c) moving through space, right? No one can go from point 'A' to point 'B' with no transpired time (instantly). To do this may imply exceeding the speed of light, but that can't be done by any means I know of.Space is black at night because light leaves the universe and doesn't reflect off anything out there, right? Infinity can't 'expand' or 'contract', yes? It's infinite. Does this hypothesis change your question(s) above?Galaxies and black holes at the edge of the universe appear red and infrared---Redshift, obviously---because at that distance frequency does change to a lower value. Light is forced to change by the action of traveling through space and time to get here. Space is still infinite, but light isn't.Space in nonphysical, so, assuming it's nothing but empty volume, especially---theoretically and arguably---at the edge (if there is an 'edge' to infinity), it itself can't change, right? Finite things in space change. 'C' is a constant, but that also makes it non-infinite. So, then, 'c' might be view by the observer as a finite constant, but that's all?Dilation is a function of time and velocity is as well, and they're not constant the faster you move. 'C' is a constant and not a variable. All else, other than 'c', isn't unity in this thought experiment. Gravity isn't acting on the object moving, is it? Other than acceleration?
I had to think my way through this as I went along in real time. That being so, I may not be able to experimentally prove any of this, so take it for what it's worth: an informal opinion.
--Lee
Perhaps I used the term 'variable' to match my belief where it is common to call 'c' a constant.
I use Ken's answer most frequently (it's all relative'). This is incorrect by the books but I consider it correct. 'c' is theoretical. I doubt it can be proven as there is no total vacuum. Tests indicate it is probably correct because we can test within an almost complete vacuum.
No. I don't believe 'c' can be called a constant. "C", certainly can't be called a constant.
My replications of Dollard's analog transmission line computer concurs with his results. Wave travel speed can be as high as c x 1.65.
Regardless, there must be a constant or everything is willy-nilly. As a thought experiment I chose space-time. That forced me to separate space and time, otherwise any measurement of speed becomes a problem. Still, the two are hopelessly bound together almost as one.
Space and distance are two facets of the same thing. Lets consider space as volume, for my thought experiment, and distance then length of any path through space.
Lets give space a 1 for what may be called normal space. Call space 's'.
So now it is E=smC
2.
The result is ... no change. No change unless s slides outside the normal range ;)
How can peiople believe in the first few nanoseconds the universe expanded at the same rate it expands now?
Space is space? No, space is all areas occupied by anything or everything. Beyond existing space there is only null existance( for material things or measurable forces).
What it all boils down to is 'it doesn't matter'. That won't change until I can deform space (I suppose I already do that. My mass has gravity. I know that is true because of all the things falling out of me)
Hi
When thinking on time theres space with movement to take into consideration. If you send light from a point source then the shifts are relative to the differing of the source and observed locations if they are travelling in differing directions then the doppler effect is understandable. As the space between changes the timing also changes. The question is if we were to travel near to the speed of light with an identical distant observer in the exact trajectory would there be any shift ? As you approach c if the medium in which light travels is stationary then as with sound would there be a developing bow wave? At c with respect to the medium it travels in if fixed this may occur. If so then wouldnt you expect more red shifts in one direction when viewing the cosmos as we are moving?
Interesting thoughts from all, thanks.
I fear things fit the elastic tape measure idea.
Variations of an experiment were performed in a university in Mexico, Denmark and other not so noteworthy places.
The basic construction was a set of air coils containing a mechanical watch with a second identical control watch outside the influence of the coils. They were synchronized. While the coils were running the contained watch showed a visible lag in time keeping, as well as visible distortion of space and color. As soon as power was removed the contained watch was again in sync with the control watch (without operator intervention).
The Mexican paper disappeared from the website the same day it was posted. The folks in Denmark were laughed out of the University and their reports were removed from the web magazine. One, not so noteworthy, stopped discussing it due to everything from insults to threats from religious zealots.
If the results were true, this would indicate any flexing of space would include flexing of time, from the outside observer's point of view. Not only that but any flexing always snaps back. Einstein would then be wrong about the person returning from the near-light speed flight. He would turn to dust as soon as he applied the brakes -or- he would snap back to his own time.
Wouldn't it be interesting if that base formula also had to include separate factors for variations in time and space?
Then folks could spend all their time trying to create anti-gravity, overunity and time travel. Oops, we are already doing that. ???
Hi
Well observed Ken, two assumed facts but one or the other could be correct.
On Naudins site he has a time energy pump and details given here re time dilation reminded of it. If the elasticity of the ether does affect time then he may be onto something.
Quote from: Ken on 2010.05.09, 19:45:14
So was it a hoax?
I doubt the Mexicans or the Danes had time or the interest in pressing their results as fact. As I recall, both shoved those results aside as part of the reported data. One was trying to prove a rotating charge field, the other was trying to measure group velocity of light packets. Both had trouble with questionable results and reported it was due to space\time dilation with calculations to show the reasoning.
The math was above me but I could follow the reports. When I went back to make copies of the procedures the info was gone.
I do recall posting the Mexican report on OU in coversation with a long-gone user.
Ken,
You have my interest.
Do you know of any expriment to prove Time is the one true constant or one of the constants?
The argument that 'c' is THE constant implies space and time are both constants.
Quote from: Ken on 2010.05.09, 22:29:23
Time is the mechanism that allows 2 objects to occupy the same point in space.
8)
Very ingenious!
And now the definition of space:
Space is the medium which forces an existance into more than one point in time.
Where's the schematic? I want to build this thing! :)
Quote from: Ken on 2010.05.10, 00:54:41
Before the creation of the universe, there was time.
Hmmm.... I think you are leaving me at that statement.
I've been told I'm so old I fart dust from the first debris of the big-bang. Are you older?
I'm afraid you'll never convince me that time is a constant for any combination of universes.
Since there is no chance of anyone proving/disproving the existence of time before and after this universe, I am content in trying to stretch or compress it.
At least there are a few folks thinking they have already done it. 7 minutes for a laser pulse to traverse a crystal lattice? This crystal was a bit shorter than the radius of the Venusian orbit, one was around 60 inches long. There was no attenuation or frequency change of the pulse. It just came out 'late'. ( I think that was a show on PBS hosted by Alan Alda).
My experiments?
I'll stick with pulse compression and delay lines, for now. Maybe some watches later. ;)
I do appreciate the mental exercise!
My freedom ends soon. Off to bed so I can accept the whip tomorrow.
Hi Guys,
Theres an interesting study of the sagnac effect Ive recently read on saying that the doppler effect doesnt apply, its time relative to position which is based on angular velocity re orbits of satellites and this HAS to be taken into consideration or things like satnav would never work. It also applies to linear trajectories.
Im still reading on the effect of shifts based on this theory and if it applies I can see where they are coming from saying c is a constant.
Ive not got to the point of satisfaction over travelling near c as the above would give rise to compression IMHO but as to what this would be and its relative effects to a stationary observer above the shifts is still not answered.
I was on my mobile/cell phone researching and the link isnt available. It wasnt from wiki.
Quote from: WaveWatcher
quote]
The basic construction was a set of air coils containing a mechanical watch with a second identical control watch outside the influence of the coils. They were synchronized. While the coils were running the contained watch showed a visible lag in time keeping, as well as visible distortion of space and color. As soon as power was removed the contained watch was again in sync with the control watch (without operator intervention).
While I was getting ready to wrote this sentence, the thought occurred to me that the "set of air coils" may have been a Caduceus coil.
Take a look at these:
http://www.unexplainable.net/artman/publish/article_1746.shtml
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oBlK9TrlmU
http://www.angelfire.com/un/weirdlabs.com/cad.html
www.stealthskater.com/Documents/TIME/Caduceus.doc
http://jnaudin.free.fr/spgen/index.htm
That's enough of those. There were 11,600 GOOGLE hits for "caduceus coil time" when I looked.
So, then, it appears that time is affected when counter-wound caduceus coils are electrified with pulsating DC. That could be why the clocks ran at different speeds when the coils were charged.
Quote
The Mexican paper disappeared from the website the same day it was posted. The folks in Denmark were laughed out of the University and their reports were removed from the web magazine. One, not so noteworthy, stopped discussing it due to everything from insults to threats from religious zealots.
Criticism from others smacks of an unstated agenda and a desire to withhold accurate information.
Quote
If the results were true, this would indicate any flexing of space would include flexing of time, from the outside observer's point of view. Not only that but any flexing always snaps back. Einstein would then be wrong about the person returning from the near-light speed flight. He would turn to dust as soon as he applied the brakes -or- he would snap back to his own time.
Well, that would be hard to prove, IMHO, but, without personal experience, I can't say for sure. I don't know.
Quote
Wouldn't it be interesting if that base formula also had to include separate factors for variations in time and space?
Then folks could spend all their time trying to create anti-gravity, overunity and time travel. Oops, we are already doing that. ???
That's what we're here for, yes? ;)
--Lee
Hi All,
Thinking on an experiment..
Utilising a laser with a beam splitter sending 2 identical amplitude (or as near as) in a parallel line somewhat apart across a short distance then reflect the beams so as to cause an interference pattern.
This layout sounding familiar?
Then with a high speed motor coupled to a disc with magnets arranged so that when spun the edges of the magnets align with the beams above at a tangent...
The effect we are looking for is a changing interference pattern.
A while ago (forgot the names....) an experiment involving startup times with the motor arrangement above changed.. first time say 2 mins to full speed, if then stopped the next period for full speed was much less....an inertia effect.
If this IS down to the ether then spinning it would affect c as its this medium we assume that light travels in.
We may need to apply an electronic 'spinner' working at a somewhat higher angular velocity but incremental and a VCO would suffice.
I dont have the motor believe it or not but the rest mmmmmmmm.
@WW if it changes we may be on to something if not then this proves the idea needs a little more thought.
szaxx,
Make sure you try radial polarization of the very high-speed electronic magnets, something like the stator of a very small three-phase motor with 6 or 9 poles perhaps? It should be better to shoot only one of the beams through the motor mod before the interferometer.
I would think the three phases should be fired sequentially with overlap and 30/60 deg. between adjacent peaks of alternating sine. The stator of a hard disk motor works well if you secure the shape of the metal form and through-notch between the poles at the inside diameter.
I consider light as the result of compression due to the travel of something else exceeding the maximum expansion speed of current space. I hope this doesn't make your suggested experiment fail.
Hi,
Another six pack required. The link is typed and works on my cell. There is a lot of reading and this has made me think a little more about that suggested experiment.
Http://www.awitness.org/unified/pages/page1/index.html
@WW This is the spanner in the works.
Its a lot of info but seemingly Consistent, not technical, just informative and easy to read.
Hi
Archimedes principle the object needs to float its the upthrust that the weight equals as it is this that causes the displacement of water. What I was reading is that c travels at c even if you are travelling near c yourself. Which is a little confusing it explains the shifts in principle referring to doppler then says theres no doppler effect with it.
The mick morley e experiment is dismissed as its time frame is not changing but doesnt give any follow up for any other related experiment. My suggested idea is based on stirring the ether and sending light through the vortex edge to see if any difference exists.
Ill read more from links first as it may have been already performed.
Szaxx,
My suggested mods for your experiment relate to some magneto-optic methods used in modern harddisks.
The magnetic polarization of a bit is controlled by circular polarization of the laser during read.
I don't know if we ever made the write function work the inverse but all things are reciprocal in one way or another.
.
I had read and write backwards in my previous post. Sorry. I'm killing time and keeping my mind busy in an ER waiting room with my phone.
You must mean 'slicksdexic'.
Still waiting....
Ah! Our wonderful insurance company controller medical system.... Why would anyone wish to change it?
Wound up paying cash just to get it over with. Glad it is over.
Hi ken
The principle is based weight and anything that sinks aint gonna do it. If you can float 60000 tonnes of steel on the ocean 1 gold coin isnt that much of a problem. Lol.
@ WW ok on that, its the length of the light in the active area, there may only be a tiny change and it will require the fringe pattern to be large and bright, as my gas laser is 5 mW at 450nM I hope it will be enough. The other is injection and burns so may use this if not enough light output. It will be spread by 10000000 times or so to see the pattern clearly. I had a sneaky thought as to an electronic Stirrer in using a tetrahedron arrangement for the exiter.
Comments welcome and eventually may make a good unit for any related experiments.
Hi
@ken I agree this guy isnt saying the truth. As I was remembering from the mid 70s, archimedes principle is based on upthrust or if it floats the weight of it is equal to the weight of the water displaced. Something in that order lol.
Coins on the other hand were always an item of mistrust. The size can be measured in water as said for volume but the exact composition could be done by size and weight combined but Id rather use plastic if things are going to get this bad again lol.
In much earlier years, during a longterm isolation (required for my duties), I think my best friend was my imagination.
I had been dabbling with the math to bind the magnetic and gravity fields. At some point things snapped and I heard a repeating song in the whirring and clicking of all the machinery in the station. My mind translated the stanza to "All is one and one is all".
Shortly after that I started to spend more time with the bottle and things became normal again. I've shaken the bottle since then :) So here I am. Back asking silly questions.
I have seen work that suggests there is only one particle (spin) and it exists everywhere at the same time.
Normally, I don't find the need to include aether in my travels. My opinion is it is more likely we have tagged all the fields and forces but don't understand them completely.
Take magnetic (not electromagnetic) for example. Magnetic is the source of electric and electric the source of magnetic? I doubt it.
There are points where they begin to separate and both ends of the EM spectrum are the first two I can think of.
Ah!
An example of what happens when a force exceeds terminal velocity of space. Conversion from unidirectional longitudinal motion to transverse energy. Wave-particle duality. And getting the hell outta Dodge :D
Hi,
According to research at the LHC nothing can travel faster than c. They have recorded a lifetime of a particle to exist 30 times longer than normal at 99.99% of c during tests. As a result the time frame is slowed down that much that 1 hour at this speed would be seen as many times longer in our time as observers. This info is reported by Stephen Hawkin as a means for travelling massive stellar distances. The required energy is enormous. If this is correct then the vehicles passengers would return home after a few years excursion to find a century has passed at home. Its a one way trip and a very good way for a large financial investment! lol.
Quote from: szaxx on 2010.05.16, 21:47:09
Hi,
According to research at the LHC nothing can travel faster than c. They have recorded a lifetime of a particle to exist 30 times longer than normal at 99.99% of c during tests.
I've always been curious about how they single out a particle and watch it travel. Did they find a way around the double slot problem or are they grabbing the little buggers by the wings and marking their backs with a spot of paint?
Maybe they finally realized corpuscular theory is old-hat and they are actually reporting on spin-waves travelling from A to B?
The picture shown as the words emanated was the typical collision shot of a mix of straight lines and spirals. The particular particle has a life of nano seconds which is constant in most conditions. Ive never heard its name before and didnt remember it either. They must keep their integrity in the box as the higher you get in the hierarchical ladder the less postulates are allowed. If you are really guessing at a theory and its disproved then telling an underdog to state it, automatically gives you the right to be the first one to roast him.
If nothing moved relative to anything else, then time would not be meaningful as nothing is changing and it would be like suspended animation.
So, time is "change" relative to something else. Many constants that we rely on are only constants as long as a list of parameters doesn't change.
So, as the watch slowed and the light around it shifted toward red the watch and the relected light from it and the space surrounding it was travelling away aproaching the speed of light. Or, the coil and everything surrounding the coil was travelling away from the watch approaching the speed of light.
Easier to think space was expanding. Then the watch snapping to current time upon shutdown was space relaxing back to original size.
Ill agree with Einstein being wrong or the watch should have indicated the lost time upon shutdown.
Time is just a measured rate of change in regard to a reference.
Take a watch for example, it is designed to move the hands at a certain rate and the rate is fairly constant as long as the environment of the watch doesn't change. Change temperature from 72 degrees F to -30 degrees F and the rate of change of the watch is altered, but the rate of change of the events being measured by the watch may keep going at the same rate as when the temperature of the watch was 72 degrees F. Here the reference has changed, but not the rate of change of everything else.
Regarding time travel:
1. How can you travel to the past if it is not recorded and therefore no longer exists?
2. How can you travel to the future when you can not increase the rate of change for the entire universe? If you alter your rate of change,
like putting yourself in suspended animation for 100 years, the rest of the universe keeps changing at it's own rate. You still existed for the
100 years that it takes everything else to change even though you didn't change.
Hi All,
Temperarure is measured on earth at 20 centigrade or so as standard and light travels at c(1).
In space the temp excluding solar effects is at 4 Kelvin so its a tad colder. If c(2) in space is equal to c(1) then does the temp apply? I think at 0 kelvin this could be interesting.
The other comment on expanding magnetic fields, How do we interpret the RE effect with this. Assuming the energy supplied is utilised instantly so that magnetic maximum velocity is reached and these RE effects are then the result or effect of a slow decay?
It may go towards the stinging effects as matter and energy are related. The generation of charge on metallic objects too. The possible damage to life as the early DC generators were occasionally doing when switched on-line.
Could this be the missing link to OU as the decay normally follows an inverse square law or similar?
The decay is accepted in this way as standard so bend the physics around it to fit and if something doesn't then discussion is not allowed. The rules have already been made.......sounds so familiar...
Keep going its gettin' interestin'
Quote from: Ken on 2010.05.28, 19:19:14
WW,
I agree. Why did the watch in that experiment snap back? Would the man in the ship snap back and age 50 years in a short time once back on earth?
Indeed! If he travelled approaching c for too long he would turn into a pile of dust during deceleration!
Here is more food for thought, along the lines of temperature and space expansion/compression.... the watch experiment included a rapidly falling ambient temperature. Temperature close to the experiment dropped 13 degrees C over three minutes (lab time ;)).
If space was expanding then it would be expected to suck local heat energy. I don't recall if the experiment included a sharp temperature increase upon shutdown.
Fluid dynamics? That is the only way to think of it. :D
A magnetic field could just be nothing more than the wake left by moving charge. Good reason for the magnetic flux to vary in intensity perpendicular to a moving charge. That would explain why an electrostatic charge has no magnetic field unless you move it very fast.
Aether isn't something occupying space. It IS space!
Mass is nothing more than a knot or bunch in the fabric. The only difference between energy and mass is the spin rate......
OK. It is beer-time (don't have any so I'll just pet the dog and beat the wife... maybe the other way around ;D )
Quote from: Ken on 2010.05.29, 01:50:52
I think I may go get beer. You seem to be a bad influence. What is the speed of Bud Light?
Normally Bud Light is incredibly slow. There is no apparent movement.
Then my brother-in-law shows up and it moves so fast it warps beyond the sound barrier.
No theory needed for that problem >:(
Hi,
Ken I agree theres too much unknown and too many telling us all how it is.
Theres the magnetic tubes to consider too from the turn of the century as these didnt fit in they have been ignored....crandall and others similar not included...lol
Baptist? No. I don't think the Church would last long if he set foot into it.
szaxx,
Any sources I can read on magnetic tubes? I haven't heard about these. I'm sure they aren't the ones you'll find on Google.
Not warp, expansion/contraction.
Warp would be folding space.
If you enter space of a different density, your density would change with the space you now occupy. Your view of things wouldn't change, including local time. Local time would always be the same for you.
I suspect if you could look back into your past position, low density space, the light travelling from there would take longer to reach your eyes (redshift). Perhaps you would also sense a drop in temperature at the opening to low density space. Who knows?
Maybe that is why the watch snapped back into sync with the control. It was never out of sync. Only the light reflecting from it was slow due to expanded space within the coil.
OMG! It sounds like I've been riding in a type 40 Tardis!
The universe isn't expanding due to momentum. Space is expanding. There is no Dark Matter or Dark Energy. Instead of throwing in those fudge factors call it what it is - Expanding Space, and I DON'T MEAN distance between two or more points. The canvas is growing and so is everything on it.
Hehehe.... need to catch a ride to outside the universe so I can discover the universal, ever increasing redshift from everything.
If I turn to dust when I open the ship hatch you'll know I was correct :D
@WW
Here is one of the files, Ive not read this one and will do so then find the others... a different computer so hopefully....
[pdf]http://www.grazian-archive.com/quantavolution/QUANTAVOL/sb_docs/sb_4.pdf[/pdf]
Steve
Last I heard, since the creation of Homeland Security, that job was moved back to Ft. Meade and is now called OOIC (Office of Information Correction).
SUPER GOOD Points Ken.
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Ken,
I am not for propaganda! I am against all propaganda for and against, you I feel are giving me propaganda on 9/11. If you do not realize that 9/11 was committed by one organization, ISLAM, you have not been keeping up on things. Where do you think the propaganda you are talking is comming from? If you knew more then you do about Islam you would not be saying the things that you do because these facts are springing from the same well that brought you 9/11. I know it is tough for most of you out there, but you really must do more reading on Islam. And yes there are bad people everywhere, America certainly does not have a monopoly on that but when I look at some of the baddies in other country's, no thank you I'll keep my American baddies. As bad as we are we have never let the world down, our men and women have fought and died to protect freedom all over the world. Freedom of speech, freedom of conscience. We have givin of ourselves and our help freely and with no strings attached, we are the first responders in times of tragedy and natural calamity. We have given Trillion of dollars to most countrys on earth to try and raise the standard of living, where the heck would the world be without America? Now all the things America stands for are being mocked and called a crock, take a good look around you and see what is truly a crock. A few bad leaders and the world is ready to throw America under the bus. We the people of America are still good people we haven't changed, yea we may have some bad leaders but then look at what the rest of the world has for leaders, make ours look like geniuses.
I just don't think this is the place to be discussing this stuff what does this all have to do with Energy? ;D If I'm supposed to hang my head in shame because I'm an American at this forum then I probably won't be here long. :-\
We should center our efforts on free energy.
How about a method or device which collects the energy of elevated blood pressure, respiration, perspiration, urine and flatulence?
To promote energy levels we could feed individuals with a reality full of anger and stress causing data, true or not, it doesn't matter. Bringing the system into highest efficiency would just be a matter of providing input that promotes maximum output. For maximum stress output at the physical level, I volunteer my wife's cooking. The result of every recipe is a translucent lumpy slime.
One problem, folks would get tired of it and try to leave. We could prohibit the freedom of the physical self but we'll have to work on the intellectual portion.
Any ideas?
Hi,
A top American doctor created a chamber in which the patient is subjected to 'scalar' waves. This leaves the patient with lower levels of toxins and a calm intellectual insight in life. It also heals the mind from irrational and war mongering thoughts as a solution to problematic disagreements.
Maybe if there was a massive one in the space station there would be peace.
Its a bad apple that does the damage and once removed from service the errors are histoy.
Thing is it is an AMERICAN doctor one of the good guys you rarely hear about. Depression sells and gets noticed. Good will overcome evil if we all do our bit. So for a few baddies hyped from thenews remember them and leave them to their self destruction. We here share a common interest so lets do it!
Hi
Great but theres still the brainwashed by religion.........
Dont go to the NWO thing its baaad.
A spiritual sensitivity is also needed in this world generally....we seen the film Avatar...they got it right a conceptual positive connectivity.
mmmmmm sounds good but a little crackpot in reality..lol.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2010.06.01, 10:21:41
We should center our efforts on free energy.
How about a method or device which collects the energy of elevated blood pressure, respiration, perspiration, urine and flatulence?
To promote energy levels we could feed individuals with a reality full of anger and stress causing data, true or not, it doesn't matter. Bringing the system into highest efficiency would just be a matter of providing input that promotes maximum output. For maximum stress output at the physical level, I volunteer my wife's cooking. The result of every recipe is a translucent lumpy slime.
One problem, folks would get tired of it and try to leave. We could prohibit the freedom of the physical self but we'll have to work on the intellectual portion.
Any ideas?
LOL WW.
It would be so nice to get this thread back on topic. Really interesting stuff.
Hi,
@Ken
You mentioned six coils in an arrangement. You must account for more than three dimensions with them as the 'in and out' addition to the three dimensions we accept as space may be another element required. Time not included here. Im still trying to obtain more data on an experiment from 1994 (Norm W) utilising a pair of nested tetrahedrons. I could email for help as I may be successful in this approach. If I obtain a response it will help in other interests too. There exists harmonic relationships and ONE key frequency to work from. This I know has come up before in other areas but the experiment was not for OU but should be very interesting as a reverse idea for it. As ether compression and 'extra' energy imho are a cause and effect reaction. There must exist a possibility as six coils keeps recurring in my endeavours for the answer.
one day the answer will come, its what to do with it when found?
Jeez!
Forget the beer. You folks get together and send me a wave-packet of what you are smokin'.
Light is a particle? Light is a wave?
Light is a wave-packet?
My opinions of time, space, aether and light haven't changed.
It is all spin and frequency of spin.
Not more or less.
Light can't escape a black hole, not due to gravity, but due to us not being able to wait long enough to see it escape.
I don't think our disagreement is complete.
Try this on for size:
The actual consist of a black-hole:
An expansion of space beyond our perceivable dimensions.
The shape, as viewed from the perception of an outside viewer capable of perceiving >3 dimensions:
Spherical. The only current view possible, via any part of the spectrum, is similar to a full solar eclipse. It would look the same from any viewing angle.
We would, wrongly, call the precipice an accretion disc. It only looks like a disc by us.
Any claims of finding a black-hole by using theorized light bending will find the light does bend but there is an added bonus. There is a red-shift. The closer to the center of the hole the greater the shift to red and beyond.
The process:
Equalization of energy and pressure. The operation is more by balancing of energy and suction and almost nothing major happens due to gravity.
What does it look like from the space inside the black-hole?
The same as our universe looks to us. There are an almost unlimited number of entry points from other spaces. The very first opening may be called "The Big Bang".
Our space would appear to expand from that point but seem to shift in unexplainable directions or even spiral away from that first opening. This would be due to other openings, later.
Light inside the black-hole, has the same velocity as the light outside. The problem is, the velocity is in the frame of the observer inside the black-hole. From our view, it would move at a much slower velocity due to the ever expanding space it occupies. The only indication we would have of 'light' or any other energy being emitted by a black-hole is down-shift in frequency. The more it shifts downward the faster the inside of the black-hole is expanding.
Particle? Sorry, that makes me laugh :)
Light is exactly the same as all other movement of energy,whether it is electromagnetic or not. One factor is longitudinal, the other is transverse. Wave-packet, particle, wave.... What we call a particle is the longitudinal portion of moving energy. What we call the wave portion is the transverse part. The only close description we have is the wave-packet. At least somebody realized both are facets of one thing.
How we see that moving energy is rooted in our reference frame, compared to that of the moving energy, the velocity of approach and the media which it travels.
I'm done for awhile, my head hurts :D
It would look like the broad side of a disc to us. Slice an apple in the middle but horizontally. Sandwich a sheet of paper between the halves.
Remove the apple halves. Look at the wet mark on the paper.
In shape, that is what a black-hole would look like to us, the shape of the wet mark. Even though the apple is a 3D object, it only leaves a 2D wet mark. 2D folks could only perceive the shape of the wet mark, a slice of the higher dimensional object.
We are only 3D beings. The view will be the same from any angle.
The same math we use to prove a photon proves spin. Full rotation is 720 degrees. If you think it is 360 then your world is still quite flat.
BTW: Light IS manipulated by magnetic fields. Is your hard drive light flashing during use? Chances are pretty good your drive is reading magnetic gradients with a laser light beam. Old news.
Granted, only certain laser polarity will write magnetically stored data on your disc. Only a certain magnetic polarity (not North or South) will deflect the beam so your drive can read the data stored with a light beam.
You may still have a magnetic read/write head but it is less common now.
Until we visit a black-hole with a data collecting probe capable of reporting good data (or I get some more of the good stuff), this is carved in stone for me.
No need. No 'Good Stuff' found here yet.
Rotation of the 4D variety would be more complex than around one axis.
They may have already swallowed our universe. I doubt we would know it.
Quote from: Ken on 2010.06.05, 02:47:54
WW,
I do not see 4D as others do. I see it as 3D plus 1D. and not much more. I do not see anything gained unless one goes all the way to the 6th dimension.
If I chose to follow this particular line of thinking, I wouldn't waste much time on the 4th or 5th. I would jump straight to the 6th.
Generally, I use the KISS method of explanation. Apparently, you don't need that.
In my line of thought the 4th dimension is simply an expansion or contraction of our 3D universe. We see no change as we are part of what we think is 'all'.
Quote
I also have to ask, if there is no emission from a black hole, then why haven't they swallowed the universe and ripped apart all the matter?
I think the black-hole is another arrogance mistake by man. We thought we were the center of the universe, at one time. Now, I think we believe 'OUR' universe is a fixed value or a changing value within our grasp.
I don't think a black-hole will radiate anything except at the interface to our universe. That radiation would only be the result of processing bits of our universe while those bits are still in our universe. Once those bits cross into the black-hole they are part of another universe. The greatest amount of radiation will be on the other side.
We see interesting varieties of radiation from other heavenly bodies. Why does a black-hole have to follow the same process and results?
I think we are in transition. The big bang (white-hole?) may be our entrance into this universe from another. We will exit via another black-hole and have another discussion about this in about 15 billion years.
So, my quick and dirty answer: Give it all time ;)