https://www.newpowerprogress.com/news/holcomb-scientific-research-harnesses-electron-spin-to-deliver-power/8018093.article
"Topic under construction "
Also have info evolving here ( very interesting!!)
https://overunity.com/18815/has-anyone-here-constructed-an-overunity-system-that-works/msg564667/#new
EDIT,Topic locked pending outcome of legal claims
Edit to explain lock topic 12:45 ( eastern time US)pm Dec 14 2023
This is a copy of an interesting patent mentioned above
Quote from: Paul-R on 2022.03.14, 10:57:42
This is a copy of an interesting patent mentioned above
I wonder if there is one in the whole list of Holcomb patents that describes exactly the above solid state generator that is also advertised on Holcomb Energy Systems website.
From many of Holcomb's patents, the term "reduced drag" always comes up.
QuoteThe electric generator utilizes a solid state rotor that does not rotate which allows for power generation without reverse torque or the usual energy required to rotate the rotor inside the stator of the generator
Interesting. Sounds to me like some kind of TPU.
Magpwr has made a few posts at Wesley topic
Suggesting a direction of interest (post 3690 response to Holcomb query ( where's the energy come from
https://overunity.com/17735/wesleys-kapanadze-and-other-fe-discussion-forum/msg564679/#new
Started a new topic for this at Stefan's
https://overunity.com/19069/holcomb-energy-systemsbreakthrough-technology-to-the-world/msg564682/#new
What I thought is unique about there setup is how they integrated the technology into an AC motor topology. The AC motor outer stator is now the motionless rotor then they rewire the armature core as the stator. So there not reinventing the wheel simply rewiring a know commodity and adding specialized electronics. Smart setup...
Any bets on how long they will last?. It's one thing to do research but quite another to go public and start selling working technology. I hope they kick ass...
Regards
AC
I'm kind of pumped about Holocomb, I have seen countless FE startup's come and go but I have a good feeling about this one.
If they can crack the market everything will be blown wide open.
Many people don't realize FE has nothing to do with market saturation like renewables and other energy sources. This is new technology which will produce a paradigm shift in how people see energy. It will mark the move from a primitive hunter/gatherer/burning stuff mind set to "energy as a free commodity" with the only expense being the technology to transform it.
It's a big deal and it only takes one company to crack the market and the whole energy sector will be transformed overnight.
Like a god damn gold rush, lol.
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2022.03.15, 00:44:17
It's a big deal and it only takes one company to crack the market and the whole energy sector will be transformed overnight.
Like a god damn gold rush, lol.
Maybe what we need is a successful open source millionaire to take it up and run it similarly. Mark Shuttleworth made enough open sourcing Ubuntu Linux to visit the ISS. Can anyone reach him if this development comes together and a cooperation can be organised?
Quote from: Paul-R on 2022.03.14, 10:57:42
This is a copy of an interesting patent mentioned above
It's not a patent, it is merely an application for a patent. The patent may not be granted, and having read it I am of the opinion it won't be granted. When you read into the details the motor is something that has been around for years, some permanent magnetic poles on a rotor that is within some stator poles that are sequentially driven with pulses. The so called solid state (SS) generator similarly uses sequential pulsing of a circular array of electromagnets (the SS rotor) that induce voltage into a stator array of coils. The inventor seems to think that when the stator coils deliver current to a load, because the rotor is static the reverse torque that you would get in a normal generator isn't present, hence the system
has to be OU. That is a fallacy, Mr Lenz is till present and there will be voltage induced into the SS rotor coils that will load the current sources. His patent application (WO/2018/065635) for that SS generator is just that, an application, it has not been granted and I guess it won't be.
Smudge
https://holcombenergysystems.com/faq/
Are you protected by patents?
Yes, we currently have 7 patents in the international patent arena.
Quote from: Smudge on 2022.03.15, 15:42:20
It's not a patent, it is merely an application for a patent. The patent may not be granted, and having read it I am of the opinion it won't be granted. When you read into the details the motor is something that has been around for years, some permanent magnetic poles on a rotor that is within some stator poles that are sequentially driven with pulses. The so called solid state (SS) generator similarly uses sequential pulsing of a circular array of electromagnets (the SS rotor) that induce voltage into a stator array of coils. The inventor seems to think that when the stator coils deliver current to a load, because the rotor is static the reverse torque that you would get in a normal generator isn't present, hence the system has to be OU. That is a fallacy, Mr Lenz is till present and there will be voltage induced into the SS rotor coils that will load the current sources. His patent application (WO/2018/065635) for that SS generator is just that, an application, it has not been granted and I guess it won't be.
Smudge
He has filed patents in many countries and just looking at one quickly I found this one is a 'granted' patent regarding the device:
https://patents.google.com/patent/CN110050403B/en?oq=20190238011
That patent is also in many other countries - in the US it appears to be an application. The one above I found was granted in China but I haven't looked at the other countries where it was filed.
Another reason this seems valid is they have had it validated to two major companies including dnv.com. Here is a verification report from DNV attached:
A summary from the report reads:
"The HES efficiency derived from 3 test protocols was:
- 374.1% efficient
- 399.6% efficient
- 489.9% efficient
That is 4.899 units: of power output for every 1 unit of power input.
2. HES self-generating Capacity
The ability of the HES to output 4 times as much power as is required for its operation allows
a continuous self regeneration 'loop' of the entire system while the HES simultaneously
powers an electrical load."
Smudge
QuoteThe so called solid state (SS) generator similarly uses sequential pulsing of a circular array of electromagnets (the SS rotor) that induce voltage into a stator array of coils. The inventor seems to think that when the stator coils deliver current to a load, because the rotor is static the reverse torque that you would get in a normal generator isn't present, hence the system has to be OU. That is a fallacy, Mr Lenz is till present and there will be voltage induced into the SS rotor coils that will load the current sources. His patent application (WO/2018/065635) for that SS generator is just that, an application, it has not been granted and I guess it won't be.
The premise is technically correct and no reverse torque can be present in a non-moving rotor/stator system. However as you imply, Lenz Law should still apply in all conventional systems. As it were the inventor does not mention how his system overcomes Lenz Law if it does. In this respect most patents are useless and the real process is never disclosed and considered intellectual property.
Patents are basically useless and everyone and there dog is going to try to steal the technology anyways. The biggest factor is first to market and production then protecting there intellectual property. A patent application is simply a means to give the investors an impression of security even if there is none. It's always a gamble...
Here's the kicker, the inventor could allow you or others here to test this device for months but they would be no closer to understanding the process. This is true because not only is it unknown in the art but more important it's the last thing anyone would ever be looking for. Do you understand?, it's not on anyone's radar, it doesn't show up in testing and can only be deduced/predicted with electrodynamic theory. So we would need to know exactly where to look and what to look for specifically prior to testing to conclude anything.
Judging from your work I suspect you may be the only one here I have seen who has what it takes to crack the theory behind this technology.
Regards
AC
Perhaps we could discuss ways to effectively remove or cancel the Lenz effect.
1) In a transformer, constant current or constant voltage on the secondary.
2) Rotary PM device, equal and opposite EM/PM interactions.
Anything else........anybody?
Regards,
Pm
No moving parts, just move magnetic field
Quote from: Smudge on 2022.03.15, 15:42:20
It's not a patent, it is merely an application for a patent.
You're quite right. The number is a giveaway. I just wanted to get at the drawings to see what was going on.
Partzman
QuotePerhaps we could discuss ways to effectively remove or cancel the Lenz effect.
This technology does not need to remove or cancel the Lenz effect because it doesn't apply.
It's like trying to debate the aerodynamics of a craft which rarifies or displaces all the air around it thus has no aerodynamics. So even while everyone would keep saying it's a craft and it flies through air so we need to talk about aerodynamics, no we do not, it doesn't apply.
That's the kicker, anyone can habitually repeat everything they have learned or been taught but not repeating it and doing something new is a completely different story.
AC
I have connected with Robert Holcombe on Linkedin where he is posting updates.
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2022.03.15, 21:55:14
Partzman
This technology does not need to remove or cancel the Lenz effect because it doesn't apply.
It's like trying to debate the aerodynamics of a craft which rarifies or displaces all the air around it thus has no aerodynamics. So even while everyone would keep saying it's a craft and it flies through air so we need to talk about aerodynamics, no we do not, it doesn't apply.
That's the kicker, anyone can habitually repeat everything they have learned or been taught but not repeating it and doing something new is a completely different story.
AC
AC,
Well perhaps you would like to explain (at least to me) just exactly what this technology does require?
Pm
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2022.03.15, 00:33:41
Any bets on how long they will last?. It's one thing to do research but quite another to go public and start selling working technology. I hope they kick ass...
Regards
AC
So are you now saying that this would indeed be a great time to release FE devices? Perhaps you will reconsider discussing all those FE devices you have already witnessed??
As far as these HES devices are concerned, I just read the DNV witnessed report (link posted on OU.com thread).
I saw red flags flying throughout...
No instruments were used to measure AC phase angle. Also, there was an "efficiency" calculation made based on how little the input power changed when the output was loaded, as if the unloaded input power was irrelevant.
The battery/cap bank 6 hr run time test with no Vdrop when looped was interesting, but any witness that would agree to AC power calculations using only V and I with no regard for phase angle probably did not fully understand what was or was not disconnected during that portion of the test (other than what he was told by HES).
It would be wonderful if true, but I will add a degree of caution to my optimism...
PW
Looks like the steel architecture may be playing a part in negating/using/avoiding lenz? Those conical stands are for what exactly?
Quote from: picowatt on 2022.03.16, 06:27:40
As far as these HES devices are concerned, I just read the DNV witnessed report (link posted on OU.com thread).
I saw red flags flying throughout...
No instruments were used to measure AC phase angle. Also, there was an "efficiency" calculation made based on how little the input power changed when the output was loaded, as if the unloaded input power was irrelevant.
The battery/cap bank 6 hr run time test with no Vdrop when looped was interesting, but any witness that would agree to AC power calculations using only V and I with no regard for phase angle probably did not fully understand what was or was not disconnected during that portion of the test (other than what he was told by HES).
It would be wonderful if true, but I will add a degree of caution to my optimism...
PW
I would add that for the two standard generators in the test results there is no mention of the loads used. But for the Holcomb device the load included a 1035uF capacitor. That immediately suggests there will be a significant phase between output voltage and output current that should be taken into account.
I would also challenge their view about unpaired electron spins being totally responsible for the Fe magnetization. Certainly Fe being conductive there will be conduction electrons that are partially responsible, but the major contribution is from the atomic electron orbitals. Having said that, Fe is often the material of choice for obtaining spin-polarized electrons for spintronic experiments.
I have spent the last quarter-of-a-century of my life looking for ways of utilising those spin-aligned dipoles in Fe applications and it is just possible that Holcomb have managed to do that. For those spin-polarized conduction electrons to have an anomalous effect there must be some mechanism for them to not be where our classical education tells us they will be, i.e. evenly distributed through the Fe. One possibility is that they collect themselves at one end of the Fe core thus creating greater magnetic field there than is expected. If there is a magnetic field gradient along the core that will do the trick and perhaps that explains why the cores are conical in shape. The actual magnetization within a core depends upon the so-called demagnetization factor that is shape dependent. So a conical core will not have uniform magnetization along its length, hence will not have uniform field. So those pesky conduction electrons (a) get aligned and (b) get pulled towards the maximum field point. I suspect that anomaly could be used to good effect, but maybe not the 300% efficiency as claimed.
Smudge
Here is a quick FEMM simulation showing the field from a conical core and a plot of the field along the centre line. The core is Fe and the coil around it is 100 turns carrying 10 amps. Clearly the conical shape has produced an almost linear gradient, the drop off at the end is due to the hemispherical shape there. There is no doubt in my mind that conduction electrons will be drawn to that sharp end of the cone thus producing anomalous field value there. Whether that effect will produce OU is another matter.
Smudge
Quote from: JimBoot on 2022.03.16, 07:29:42
Looks like the steel architecture may be playing a part in negating/using/avoiding lenz? Those conical stands are for what exactly?
Jimboot,
Can you direct me to where you saw the "conical stands", I must have missed that...
PW
Could someone get a copy of the publication WO/2018/065635 that should give more details of this OU generator? Thanks.
Smudge
I found a pdf of the SS Holcomb generator but it doesn't want to download, it is over 10Mb.
Smudge.
Try this one.
I have read the application carefully and I remain doubtful.
If one understands that the reaction does not take place on the torque, since nothing is actually rotating, there is no reason why Lenz's law should not apply. A rotating field is the resultant of the variable fields created by the currents of the "rotor" coils, whose phases are offset. Seen from each stator coil it is a simple variable field. The current in the stator coils flowing into the load will therefore induce a current opposite to that of the "rotor" coils. So I don't see where the idea is.
Invoking the spin of the unpaired electrons to explain the extra energy, why not, but you would still have to explain how this is possible. An explanation by the spin is not more credible than by a LENR, the neutrinos or the ZPE... If the alignment of electrons in a magnetic domain by a weak field caused a free stronger field, we would have extra energy in all coils with a ferromagnetic core. Holcomb's comparison between a coil with a ferromagnetic core and one with Plexiglas proves nothing. The inductance of the former being much higher than the latter, and the magnetic energy that a coil stores being proportional to L*I² where I is the same in both coils since they are in series, there is no reason to be surprised by the strengthening of the field in the former compared to the latter: its field is stronger, but it is because this coil/core recovers more electrical energy.
So we find ourselves with a new story of an OU machine which is, as usual, either a scam like Perendev's, or a gross error of concept and measurement as with Steorn's, or Holcomb really has something, but obviously he does not understand where the energy comes from and tries to give credibility to his assembly with idle explanations.
I put all the documents found on Holcomb on my catch-all site here: http://exvacuo.free.fr/div/Sciences/NewEnergy/Holcomb/
The patent application is there as well as the 2018 one, which is very similar, but without an explanation of where the OU came from.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.16, 15:41:09
I have read the application carefully and I remain doubtful.
If one understands that the reaction does not take place on the torque, since nothing is actually rotating, there is no reason why Lenz's law should not apply. A rotating field is the resultant of the variable fields created by the currents of the "rotor" coils, whose phases are offset. Seen from each stator coil it is a simple variable field. The current in the stator coils flowing into the load will therefore induce a current opposite to that of the "rotor" coils. So I don't see where the idea is.
Invoking the spin of the unpaired electrons to explain the extra energy, why not, but you would still have to explain how this is possible. An explanation by the spin is not more credible than by a LENR, the neutrinos or the ZPE... If the alignment of electrons in a magnetic domain by a weak field caused a free stronger field, we would have extra energy in all coils with a ferromagnetic core. Holcomb's comparison between a coil with a ferromagnetic core and one with Plexiglas proves nothing. The inductance of the former being much higher than the latter, and the magnetic energy that a coil stores being proportional to L*I² where I is the same in both coils since they are in series, there is no reason to be surprised by the strengthening of the field in the former compared to the latter: its field is stronger, but it is because this coil/core recovers more electrical energy.
So we find ourselves with a new story of an OU machine which is, as usual, either a scam like Perendev's, or a gross error of concept and measurement as with Steorn's, or Holcomb really has something, but obviously he does not understand where the energy comes from and tries to give credibility to his assembly with idle explanations.
I put all the documents found on Holcomb on my catch-all site here: http://exvacuo.free.fr/div/Sciences/NewEnergy/Holcomb/
The patent application is there as well as the 2018 one, which is very similar, but without an explanation of where the OU came from.
Thank you for pulling these documents and video together, F6.
The image below is from Holcomb's video.
1 - Does he have any other videos?
2 - Just what is "electrical steel"?
There is another video but not technical, they celebrate their launch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNxBklaugpg
I didn't know about the term electrical steel either. Wikipedia talks about it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_steel
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.16, 18:24:16
There is another video but not technical, they celebrate their launch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNxBklaugpg
I didn't know about the term electrical steel either. Wikipedia talks about it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_steel
Thanks, F6.
Next question -
3. Does Holcomb have just the one approach, or more than one (for FE)?
Quote from: Smudge on 2022.03.16, 10:59:52
Here is a quick FEMM simulation showing the field from a conical core and a plot of the field along the centre line. The core is Fe and the coil around it is 100 turns carrying 10 amps. Clearly the conical shape has produced an almost linear gradient, the drop off at the end is due to the hemispherical shape there. There is no doubt in my mind that conduction electrons will be drawn to that sharp end of the cone thus producing anomalous field value there. Whether that effect will produce OU is another matter.
Smudge
thanks for this smudge. It looks as though it's only the base of the core that is conical from the vids I've watched. Almost like the inside of a toroid. They have 7 vids on their channel. They have an r&d facility in Florida https://youtube.com/channel/UCUi_RHRrr80Dsa4cnUJlTAw
Seems to be the latest and most relevant:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/eb/0c/07/d463fa60c9f935/WO2021063522A1.pdf
Note the introduction of curved rotor poles and the addition of inner and outer rotors, the outer of which appears to be an adjustable/rotatable flux path that can be tuned (statically or dynamically with loading), as new embodiments.
He is still claiming the excess energy is from electron spin or domain orientation via a relatively small applied current and still uses the plexiglass versus xfmr steel (electrical steel) core as proof, and discusses the S shaped hysteresis curve and saturation (which, if true, begs the question, why aren't all transformers overunity?). He also makes the analogous comparison to a solar cell so as to not be claiming perpetual motion (a patentability issue).
He also discusses automatic switching of capacitors on the output as needed, and again, no mention of phase angle or reactive power.
It does look like he has put a lot of time and money into this, and there is a lot to digest in this rather lengthy patent, but...
PW
The company is an IRISH (Dublin) Ltd company, registered in Dublin, it is not American, that rings alarm bells, STEORN for example.
Well, I really can't go along with the electron spin, eddy currents producing equal and opposite poles, I can, but I do not see any cooling because at the power levels they are talking about something is going to heat up, whatever.
All the units are 3 phase electric motors which I presume have been rewired, and the rotor fixed so it does not move! as can be easily seen in the photos or videos.
Electrical steel (silicon steel) does not hold residual magnetism, as in transformers or motors, but with a coil wound over it and a current passed, it produces a large field through it but is still subject to the amount of current passing through the coil.
The company has the same modus operandum as that Las Vegas company with their permanent magnet generator, what happened to them!!!!
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.03.16, 23:11:54
The company is an IRISH (Dublin) Ltd company, registered in Dublin, it is not American, that rings alarm bells, STEORN for example.
Well, I really can't go along with the electron spin, eddy currents producing equal and opposite poles, I can, but I do not see any cooling because at the power levels they are talking about something is going to heat up, whatever.
All the units are 3 phase electric motors which I presume have been rewired, and the rotor fixed so it does not move! as can be easily seen in the photos or videos.
Electrical steel (silicon steel) does not hold residual magnetism, as in transformers or motors, but with a coil wound over it and a current passed, it produces a large field through it but is still subject to the amount of current passing through the coil.
The company has the same modus operandum as that Las Vegas company with their permanent magnet generator, what happened to them!!!!
Regards
Mike
Gee what do you have against the Irish. Many companies HQ there because of tax incentives. There is also someone building them in Florida apparently
Quote from: JimBoot on 2022.03.17, 01:58:18
Gee what do you have against the Irish. Many companies HQ there because of tax incentives. There is also someone building them in Florida apparently
Well Jim I will tell you a true story.
One of my best friends in the UK is an engineer as well, but he went down the civil engineering route, we both went the university together and he was my best man at my wedding. His first big job was on building the M62 motorway across the north of England, there were many subcontractors as there always is, and many came over from Irland and camped out in caravans alongside the job, that is not a problem. The problem came about when they had the contract to lay the drains for the surface water on the motorway. All looked good, the inspector of the works was also Irish as well, but of course, he was a qualified surveyor, so no problems or there should not have been!!
The first section of the motorway was completed and opened, then there was a big storm and the drains could not take the water away. On inspection, all the drains went nowhere, a short length of pipe to the side of the road and covered up, they should have gone to a collective catchment area where the water would drain away through a laid out stone soakaway like fingers on your hand. The workers had long gone back to Irland, well paid by the subcontractor who had to take the cost of repairing what had not been done.
This is where the name Irish Blarney comes from
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blarney_Stone
Not all Irish are like this, but you have to weed out the good and the bad ;)
Regards
Mike
Just because Steorn failed and Steorn was Irish and Holcomb would be too, does not mean that Holcomb should be suspect.
This reasoning is a fallacy without any logic.
Can we please stick to the topic and avoid unnecessary slanderous digressions against the Irish?
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2022.03.16, 19:24:16
...
3. Does Holcomb have just the one approach, or more than one (for FE)?
I'm not sure I understand the question. Does it concern the pure technique or also the commercial issue to spread their invention? I am not in a better position than anyone to answer because the subject is very recent. One would have to explore Holcomb's past activity to see how he arrived at his current model. But if there really are FE and several approaches, the basic concept and principle is surely unique.
Quote from: JimBoot on 2022.03.16, 20:43:27
thanks for this smudge. It looks as though it's only the base of the core that is conical from the vids I've watched. Almost like the inside of a toroid. They have 7 vids on their channel. They have an r&d facility in Florida https://youtube.com/channel/UCUi_RHRrr80Dsa4cnUJlTAw
Yes, very interesting.
Thanks for the link, JimBoot.
Especially interesting, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUIK1GZSduo
He speaks here of a small home unit, and he says the device is "scale-able". That's good, if true.
And if true, we can expect a BIG company like Google or Musk's Tesla to snatch up the technology... As you may know, Google has sent representatives to LENR conferences in recent years - and supported research - with a hand on the technology.
While the device is still on the market - I wonder if we could BUY one? and then test it ourselves.... I would gladly chip in, especially if there were a money-back guarantee if it failed to run on "no fuel" as advertised.
Jim - can you find out the least expensive (smallest) prototype they have, that we could purchase? (right away, for sure)
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2022.03.17, 11:58:09
- I wonder if we could BUY one? and then test it ourselves.... I would gladly chip in, especially if there were a money-back guarantee if it failed to run on "no fuel" as advertised.
Jim - can you find out the least expensive (smallest) prototype they have, that we could purchase? (right away, for sure)
Initial releases can be expensive. Crowd funding might be successful but an application would need careful wording.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.17, 11:42:08
Just because Steorn failed and Steorn was Irish and Holcomb would be too, does not mean that Holcomb should be suspect.
This reasoning is a fallacy without any logic.
Can we please stick to the topic and avoid unnecessary slanderous digressions against the Irish?
No slander there, read my post better. Slander is when you state something which is not true about a person. As I perfectly said, not all Irish are like that, history shows a lot, it has become a joke.
Holcomb has at least 13 application patents in the area of interest from 2010 to present, many of which are similar to their latest.
Their oldest patents are from 1988, but prior to 2005, they are only for magnet therapy.
I have updated my folder. The documents have been OCRed, the text is searchable.
http://exvacuo.free.fr/div/Sciences/NewEnergy/Holcomb/
Their latest product would have been witnessed-certified by SGS and DNV. We do have the DNV report, but I haven't seen the SGS one anywhere. Does anyone have it?
On their website and in some of their videos, I saw that they emphasize the environment and make many references to a clean world, with photos to stimulate affect. This is often used in scams as conditioning to make it easier to accept their system. It's too early to say that this would be the case here, but it is disturbing.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.03.17, 13:28:03
No slander there, read my post better. Slander is when you state something which is not true about a person. As I perfectly said, not all Irish are like that, history shows a lot, it has become a joke.
If "not all Irish are like that", why talk specifically about the Irish?! This is true for all countries.
Your word was very clear : "
The company is an IRISH (Dublin) Ltd company, registered in Dublin, it is not American, that rings alarm bells"
This is clearly stating your prejudice against the Irish, and your prejudice in favor of the Americans.
You'd better make amends than deny it.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.17, 15:58:01
If "not all Irish are like that", why talk specifically about the Irish?! This is true for all countries.
Your word was very clear : "The company is an IRISH (Dublin) Ltd company, registered in Dublin, it is not American, that rings alarm bells"
This is clearly stating your prejudice against the Irish, and your prejudice in favor of the Americans.
You'd better make amends than deny it.
What do I have to make amends for Milehigh. I am English and not American, my home town is very close to Irland, (North Wales), unlike you on the west side of France. I have Irish friends, quite a few in fact. My father-in-law is French, yes my wife who still works as she is younger than me, has a lorry in your neck of the woods in a couple of weeks "Nante", small world we live in.
Many many Irish in America, or of Irish descent, let's be honest America is a multi-racial country, but the real Americans are the American Indians who still try to keep a pure race going.
Anyway, Southern Irland has one of the largest shell company holdings in Europe because the government opens its arms to incoming money and low tax, but it's not an offshore country, which would ring bigger bells as far as looking for outside investment was concerned.
Now tell me why this company has not raised money from their own bank, I'm sure they would be very interested to be able to print their own money!!!! Ah, the government would shut them down, but not without paying them a handsome amount to keep their mouths shut.
I really really hope I am wrong, but going public on the internet on youtube, etc is asking for problems don't you think!!! more than a decade of investors putting money into a company that's not even American, but now they have to show something, investors getting itchy feet as they say.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.17, 11:42:30
I'm not sure I understand the question. Does it concern the pure technique or also the commercial issue to spread their invention? I am not in a better position than anyone to answer because the subject is very recent. One would have to explore Holcomb's past activity to see how he arrived at his current model. But if there really are FE and several approaches, the basic concept and principle is surely unique.
hi Steve I preempted you question and asked Ellen Holcomb yesterday. Her response was " Hi Jim, it's a pleasure to "meet" you. Thanks so very much for this... we appreciate it.
Thanks, too, for your kind words about our videos and for sharing them. After 15 years in R and D "stealth" mode, we are trying to get the word out about our technology and a better future for the planet, and we appreciate the assist from every corner on earth.
To answer your question, our HES units are not yet available for purchase, but that will soon change.
Thanks again and all the best,
Ellen" I hope they don't get acquired by Google, that would be tragic.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.03.17, 18:18:24
What do I have to make amends for Milehigh. I am English and not American, my home town is very close to Irland, (North Wales), unlike you on the west side of France. I have Irish friends, quite a few in fact. My father-in-law is French, yes my wife who still works as she is younger than me, has a lorry in your neck of the woods in a couple of weeks "Nante", small world we live in.
Many many Irish in America, or of Irish descent, let's be honest America is a multi-racial country, but the real Americans are the American Indians who still try to keep a pure race going.
Anyway, Southern Irland has one of the largest shell company holdings in Europe because the government opens its arms to incoming money and low tax, but it's not an offshore country, which would ring bigger bells as far as looking for outside investment was concerned.
Now tell me why this company has not raised money from their own bank, I'm sure they would be very interested to be able to print their own money!!!! Ah, the government would shut them down, but not without paying them a handsome amount to keep their mouths shut.
I really really hope I am wrong, but going public on the internet on youtube, etc is asking for problems don't you think!!! more than a decade of investors putting money into a company that's not even American, but now they have to show something, investors getting itchy feet as they say.
Regards
Mike
next you'll tell me they all smell like potatoes C.C
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.03.17, 18:18:24
Anyway, Southern Irland has one of the largest ....
Arrrrggghghhhhh........................................... There's no such thing as southern Ireland; there's northern Ireland and there's Ireland.
Quote from: Paul-R on 2022.03.17, 22:02:05
Arrrrggghghhhhh........................................... There's no such thing as southern Ireland; there's northern Ireland and there's Ireland.
You are right Paul, sorry about that, been living in another country for many years, 32 to be exact, even have to think twice when speaking or writing in English, and at 71years of age things do become more difficult. I'm best in the mornings, the afternoons are for a siesta ;D
Well, I'm taking a long break, I have finished my investigative work,
in more ways than one, going to enjoy my family and see what happens over the next few months in the world. I have taken action over various aspects of years of investigation, of which I ask for nothing, it is all free, but I have decided to be responsible for not rocking the world more than it is already.
Free energy is something that has to be integrated little by little or chaos will result, you don't have to think very hard about that one I am sure, and many will not agree with me. But how long would that energy be free for! if you can strap a meter to it, it will be charged for.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.03.17, 23:29:41
if you can strap a meter to it, it will be charged for.
...as Tesla discovered with his universal system. It couldn't be charged for. But a system similar to car and road taxes could have been devised. Right now, FE has a big opportunity with the Ukraine situation and everyone desperate to find an alternative to Russian oil products.
Mike
QuoteFree energy is something that has to be integrated little by little or chaos will result, you don't have to think very hard about that one I am sure, and many will not agree with me.
It's ironic that all of the knowledge and understanding required to build a FE device is often the very thing which prevents it's disclosure.
AC
I find it more than astonishing that in a forum where it is about the development of free energy technology, solutions that are already available are not at least discussed in a private area. Instead, you want to see how the world is doing in a few months.
I promise you, in a year or two the climate crisis will have progressed to the point where we have passed irreversible points.
With that in mind, a global economic crisis caused by the introduction of such technology is really the lesser of two evils.
Nobody forces you to disclose a solution completely. But an open dialogue about where to start (experimentally) would have been nice.
Quote from: Paul-R on 2022.03.17, 22:02:05
Arrrrggghghhhhh........................................... There's no such thing as southern Ireland; there's northern Ireland and there's Ireland.
And more precisely, there is a part subordinated to a kingdom, and a real independent republic! :)
Quote from: Frederik2k1 on 2022.03.18, 08:09:44
...
I promise you, in a year or two the climate crisis will have progressed to the point where we have passed irreversible points.
...
The greatest pollution is that of the minds of the environmental activists who spread their catastrophism and their apocalyptic predictions everywhere, promising climatic hell if one does not adhere to their cause, that of the goddess Nature, as the Catholic religion did for centuries for its own god. The followers of the new sect of environmentalism are constantly blaming man, accusing him of being the cause of all evils, just as religion used to do: a famine, a war, an epidemic, man's fault for having offended God. Now it is man's fault for offending Nature.
Many of these followers are less concerned with Nature than with its instrumentalization to serve their real cause, which is political, their fight against capitalism and the West in general, for degrowth and therefore the return to a few centuries ago that these uneducated people imagine as being pleasant to live when life was much harder than today.
If these people were honest, they would not waste the planet's resources by using massively PCs, smartphones, forums, social networks infrastructures and datacenters that they consider polluting, to spread their propaganda. But they are hypocrites, most of them live like everybody else but like the pedophile priests who however preach the love of the neighbor, they harass us with their message "do as I say, not as I do".
If we take a closer look at the predictions of the IPCC, we can clearly see that their models are regularly wrong by a factor of two to three over periods of only 5 years in the past, that all their models diverge, that the climate sensitivity is constantly corrected, probably according to what there is to prove, and that physicists regularly correct climatologists who have a very poor command of physics, especially thermodynamics and statistical processing, which are key areas of their discipline. Add to this their politicization and their monopoly of the good word, a method that is never seen elsewhere in science where independent teams verify what others assert, and we understand that it is not scientific. Climatology is at best research, and research is not yet science because science is knowledge.
What we can say with certainty is that climatology today does not have the science that could allow it to make long-term predictions, and that the fight against global warming is not only futile but will create far more problems than it solves, collapsing the world economy and impoverishing everyone if the recommended measures are implemented. Those who advocate these drastic methods are neo-Malthusians.
So to come back to the subject, if Holcomb's machine works, it would obviously be a fantastic advance for humanity, with the elimination of fossil fuels and above all the emergence of a considerable number of new technologies, prevented today from existing because of the cost of energy or the difficulty to make it portable. If we can help in this way, we must. Contrary to the followers of the fashionable religion, the religion Nature, if we are here it is I suppose, that we think that the technology can be put at the service of the humanity, that it can progress to improve at the same time our living conditions, comfort, health and environment, and consequently to be a progress not only material but also of ideas as all the technological advances were it in the past (the wheel which improves the transport favoured the exchanges between people, the printing press allowed to democratize the culture, the radio allowed to inform even in the most remote corners of the earth, Internet put at the disposal of all the academic knowledge...).
We benefit today from what our forefathers did and the risks they took to do it. Contrary to the message of the narrow-minded environmentalists who want to impose on future generations their current conception of a supposedly better world, our generation has the same duty as our forefathers towards future generations, not to preserve the heritage but to bring its new contribution, also taking its risk of novelty, all for a future that we do not know, that we build little by little, and that must remain open to the people of the future.
Quote from: JimBoot on 2022.03.17, 20:16:41
hi Steve I preempted you question and asked Ellen Holcomb yesterday. Her response was " Hi Jim, it's a pleasure to "meet" you. Thanks so very much for this... we appreciate it.
Thanks, too, for your kind words about our videos and for sharing them. After 15 years in R and D "stealth" mode, we are trying to get the word out about our technology and a better future for the planet, and we appreciate the assist from every corner on earth.
To answer your question, our HES units are not yet available for purchase, but that will soon change.
Thanks again and all the best,
Ellen" I hope they don't get acquired by Google, that would be tragic.
"better future for the planet", "not yet available for purchase", it's disturbing. I've heard this so many times, and we never saw anything coming afterwards...
I've also seen that most of the sites that talk about Holcomb have conveniently copied their press release word for word. We have no independent source, no journalistic analysis, only Holcomb's word.
So without independent duplication, beware!
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.18, 10:28:27
And more precisely, there is a part subordinated to a kingdom, and a real independent republic! :)
It might pay for you to brush up on your history of "The Troubles".
I don't pretend to understand the science or history ... or predictions .. of the Green movement
I have however wholeheartedly embraced it , from our FE perspective , it is win win and we will have a monstrous
Ally whence we find the FE !
I must add , I loathe burning our atmosphere,flushing or wasting drinking water ,and am genuinely creeped
Out by the mess plastic has made of our planet !
Having an FE point of use power grid available to our planet's inhabitants would spread us out considerably for a few hundred years , and give us incredible economic stimulus !
I suppose I/we could light fires around all sides of this topic ?? ,
here we work towards Finding and open sourcing FE
It's is a plenty big piece to chew on
And the luxury of not presently starving to death or freezing or ...etc etc
Should not hinder our pursuit !
Respectfully
Chet K
Quote from: Paul-R on 2022.03.18, 11:32:01
It might pay for you to brush up on your history of "The Troubles".
Quote from: Chet K on 2022.03.18, 12:22:47
...
I suppose I/we could light fires around all sides of this topic ?? ,
here we work towards Finding and open sourcing FE
...
Current geopolitical situations are always a consequence of the past, so they have explanations.
This does not prevent us from making observations about the present time, such as the two Irelands, nor from questioning the situation.
Of course this is not the place to discuss it, but I am not the one who brought the discussion about Ireland or about the "climate crisis".
If a moderator would remove all these digressions, mine included, I would not mind, but as long as an off-topic is open and visible, contradiction must be possible.
2 or 3 layers of coils? Judging by the attached image from their video, there are 3 concentric layers of coils while the patent only shows 2.
Did I misinterpret something?
Errr, back to the subject of this thread, what do we know in general from Holcomb's patents?
1) Solid state inductive rotor producing a rotating magnetic field by single or multiple phasing.
2) Stator consisting of pickup inductances.
3) Claim of gains in the 300-500% range.
Anyone here have any experience whether or not this type of topology would encounter CEMF or Lenz?
Regards,
Pm
F6FLT
Quote2 or 3 layers of coils? Judging by the attached image from their video, there are 3 concentric layers of coils while the patent only shows 2.
Did I misinterpret something?
The patents are obviously old while the website and video newer. You see real inventors with real intelligence are always making improvements to the art and there thinking. Nothing is static and everything is always evolving and changing unlike many people stuck in the past who cannot change or learn.
AC
F6FLT
You have done much active research here ,and some bench musings
Can I ask to have this board moved to your bench ?
You would be moderator there ?
I have asked for some quick input on this suggestion from experimenters/builders within the open source community !
_Well received _
??
I have to contact Peter on another matter later ?
Can we ask him ?
( not actually certain he can move it there since Forum is in ongoing upgrade mode
However he may be able to just place you as moderator here ?
Respectfully
Chet K
Ps
For clarity... the intent is to go as deep as possible into this claim
And how to manifest it !
Re climate catastrophists; history shows they're always wrong. But so is our stewardship of the planet. Free clean portable unlimited energy is a path to true freedom and prosperity for all as well as being good for the planet. What is unclear to me right now with HES is what is the specific goal of their current promotions. I will ask them soon but there does not seem to be any clear call to action for the vids they are releasing
Quote from: Chet K on 2022.03.18, 16:00:42
F6FLT
You have done much active research here ,and some bench musings
Can I ask to have this board moved to your bench ?
You would be moderator there ?
I have asked for some quick input on this suggestion from experimenters/builders within the open source community !
_Well received _
??
I have to contact Peter on another matter later ?
Can we ask him ?
( not actually certain he can move it there since Forum is in ongoing upgrade mode
However he may be able to just place you as moderator here ?
Respectfully
Chet K
Ps
For clarity... the intent is to go as deep as possible into this claim
And how to manifest it !
im keen to build, I'm very experienced at building motors that won't rotate ;D the conical core ends seem important as well. From the vids he is saying the 4-500% P.O. is because of 4-5x extra flux from the steel. I know a lot of us go "duh" re the stronger flux but if he has what they claim a solid state generator, then the steel as the fuel makes sense to me. Looks like a good learning project
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2022.03.18, 15:24:45
... The patents are obviously old while the website and video newer. ...
The patent that is supposed to match their announcement today is not old at all, it is from April 2021.
This is the 1st one on the list here: http://exvacuo.free.fr/div/Sciences/NewEnergy/Holcomb/
It would be of no interest to Holcomb to release an invention that would not be protected by a patent.
The other ones I've put in, which are close, only serve to eventually understand the intellectual path that Holcomb followed and help determine the basic idea.
Quote from: Chet K on 2022.03.18, 16:00:42
F6FLT
You have done much active research here ,and some bench musings
Can I ask to have this board moved to your bench ?
You would be moderator there ?
I have asked for some quick input on this suggestion from experimenters/builders within the open source community !
_Well received _
??
I have to contact Peter on another matter later ?
Can we ask him ?
( not actually certain he can move it there since Forum is in ongoing upgrade mode
However he may be able to just place you as moderator here ?
Respectfully
Chet K
Ps
For clarity... the intent is to go as deep as possible into this claim
And how to manifest it !
Thanks for your confidence, Chet, but I think a moderator should be independent of the topics, and even not participate in them. When one is judge and party, one tends to do censorship more than moderation. I've been a victim of this a few times on forums, so I wouldn't want to be the one to fall into the same trap.
Quote from: JimBoot on 2022.03.19, 05:59:42
im keen to build, I'm very experienced at building motors that won't rotate ;D
;D O0
Quote
the conical core ends seem important as well. From the vids he is saying the 4-500% P.O. is because of 4-5x extra flux from the steel. I know a lot of us go "duh" re the stronger flux but if he has what they claim a solid state generator, then the steel as the fuel makes sense to me. Looks like a good learning project
The form is certainly important, but what we need to understand is why. The concentration of the flux has never allowed OU, because even if the flux is well concentrated in one place, it does not prevent all the field lines from looping. A flux variation is not a change in level along the loop of field lines, but should be seen as the addition or removal of always looped field lines.
Then we need to know what needs to be built. The model presented in the video does not seem to correspond exactly to the patent.
Finally, it is a very big equipment, it seems to me very difficult to build, even if we had all the details.
But if we understood the idea, we could perhaps build a much simpler proof of principle.
The degree of coupling between 2 circuits will determine the number of common field lines that cross both, and whether the flux is generated by one coil or the other doesn't change anything, it's reciprocal, hence Lenz's law. In the invention here, it obviously doesn't. The key factors that can play a role here are the number of coils, the apparent rotational motion of the field, and the time delays involved in magnetizing the ferromagnetic masses. This gives us degrees of freedom on how to share the magnetic fluxes to perhaps obtain a non-reciprocity between windings. With only 3 coils, maybe we can test some effects, we know the problem of instability and chaotic behavior in the 3 body problem in gravity; in magnetism, it is probably the same, I'm just thinking about it for the moment...
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.19, 10:29:05
;D O0
The form is certainly important, but what we need to understand is why. The concentration of the flux has never allowed OU, because even if the flux is well concentrated in one place, it does not prevent all the field lines from looping. A flux variation is not a change in level along the loop of field lines, but should be seen as the addition or removal of always looped field lines.
Then we need to know what needs to be built. The model presented in the video does not seem to correspond exactly to the patent.
Finally, it is a very big equipment, it seems to me very difficult to build, even if we had all the details.
But if we understood the idea, we could perhaps build a much simpler proof of principle.
The degree of coupling between 2 circuits will determine the number of common field lines that cross both, and whether the flux is generated by one coil or the other doesn't change anything, it's reciprocal, hence Lenz's law. In the invention here, it obviously doesn't. The key factors that can play a role here are the number of coils, the apparent rotational motion of the field, and the time delays involved in magnetizing the ferromagnetic masses. This gives us degrees of freedom on how to share the magnetic fluxes to perhaps obtain a non-reciprocity between windings. With only 3 coils, maybe we can test some effects, we know the problem of instability and chaotic behavior in the 3 body problem in gravity; in magnetism, it is probably the same, I'm just thinking about it for the moment...
Ahh yes, this has been my point all along. Anytime there is induction between two coils whether they are are at right angles, inside out, upside down, etc, there will be a Lenz effect as F6FLT has stated. If there is no Lenz effect in the Holcomb device, then what topology is used to reduce/prevent it?
The primary of a two winding transformer can be shown to be free of Lenz if a current source or voltage sink is used properly on the secondary. If a rotating electromagnetic field is used as the source of induction under these conditions, then little to no Lenz effect will be experienced.
Regards,
Pm
F6 wrote, and I totally agree:
"Finally, it is a very big equipment, it seems to me very difficult to build, even if we had all the details.
But if we understood the idea, we could perhaps build a much simpler proof of principle."
Yes, a small proof-of-principle prototype is an important goal.
Also, small devices like this could be mass-marketed by HES LLC, and getting them needed funds - and at the same time, get the device out to the people before it is/can be squashed.
Quote from: partzman on 2022.03.19, 14:41:36...
The primary of a two winding transformer can be shown to be free of Lenz if a current source or voltage sink is used properly on the secondary.
...
Do you have a set-up and measurements to support such a claim?
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.19, 17:20:08
Do you have a set-up and measurements to support such a claim?
Yes in simulation if that will do. And in practice, a current transformer bench device showing a slight gain.
Regards,
Pm
Here are the sims for elimination of Lenz in a transformer primary by means of constant current and constant voltage in the secondary.
The first is constant current with an ideal current source in the secondary as shown. The theory is quite simple as explained in the attached pdf. If one calculates the inductance of L1 = E*dt/di using the sim's parameters, it will equal 5mH. There are many variations possible with this topology and a few show a small gain even under simulation.
The second is with a constant voltage sink in the secondary that is equal to Epri*k . This again will provide an elimination of Lenz as shown. L1 in this example calculates to be 5.06mH which is greater than the actual value of L1. This is due to the fact we are ignoring the voltage drops in the winding's dcr. Again many variations are possible.
Both of these examples are conservative using their current induced induction source. However, using a PM or rotating field induction source could provide a Lenz free induction source utilizing the concepts shown here. I'm not claiming this is the method the Holcomb device uses, I'm just saying it is one possibility.
Regards,
Pm
Edit:
partzman
The problem I see is that this thread looks exactly like countless others spanning decades. The people may change and some of the terminology however the same old concepts always remain. I noticed this early on in my research that everyone is saying and doing exactly the same things and nothing ever changes.
My solution to this common problem was to not allow myself to follow along or repeat what others do. So if I needed a transformer I wouldn't use one and devise another way to convert the voltage. If I needed something as simple as a transistor I wouldn't use one and think of another way to interrupt the circuit. I would try to never use the same process, concept or idea twice. In this way were not simply going through the same old motions and actually have to think about how stuff works.
This Quote comes to mind...
QuoteThe mind is sharper and keener in seclusion and uninterrupted solitude. No big laboratory is needed in which to think. Originality thrives in seclusion free of outside influences beating upon us to cripple the creative mind. Be alone, that is the secret of invention; be alone, that is when ideas are born. Nikola Tesla
Source:Tesla Sees Evidence Radio And Light Are Sound
AC
This patent submitted in 2017 and published in Dec 2021 explains how he avoids lenz. https://patents.justia.com/patent/11196331 I have not read it all yet but hope to a bit later. He references Tesla unipolar dynamo in it. Edit not solid state and completely different architecture. Still interesting though in the context of their latest vids and how it may relate.
@partzman
I redid your simulation and found the results you indicate.
But an idea as simple as preventing a current variation in the secondary to prevent the application of Lenz's law has no practical application: the result is equivalent to having the secondary in open circuit seen from the primary. No power can be transferred.
What is interesting is to put a load R1 and to make the power balance. Of course it must be put in series and not in parallel on L2 otherwise the current would not be constant in L2. We arrive at the diagram in the attached file.
The circuit is supplied by a voltage generator + a current generator, which gives us the total power supplied to the circuit (in red), while U(R1)*I(R1) gives us the power consumed.
We can see that the consumed power of 0.5W is equal to the supplied power, except on the first 10 µs where the voltage generator supplies the energy W=L*I1² to create the magnetic field stored in the inductance, this without any incidence on the load. Only the current generator supplies the load.
It is clear that an idea as simple as keeping the current constant at the secondary to avoid Lenz's law seems brilliant but would have been seen by generations of engineers who preceded us. We need to get out of electronics and back to physics. Charges do not know if they are in a primary or secondary circuit, they always influence each other by their electric field.
The moving charges create a vector potential at the level of the other moving charges, thus an electric field E=-dA/dt. It is the one that acts by the classical Coulomb force F=q.E. The magnetic field is only a relativistic effect linked to their motion, which simplifies electromagnetism, but to the detriment of understanding the forces really at work, seen in the frame of reference of the moving charges.
Coming back to Holcomb, Holcomb does not need to claim that Lenz's law would be defeated, since he says that the extra energy comes from the spin. This is not consistent. If the OU comes from the spin, Lenz's law can still apply, and it is still free energy.
Jim: Thanks for the link as that doc has considerable info!
F6FLT: Point taken and noted.
Regards,
Pm
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.18, 14:49:11
2 or 3 layers of coils? Judging by the attached image from their video, there are 3 concentric layers of coils while the patent only shows 2.
Did I misinterpret something?
There are three systems being discussed, a high efficiency motor, a single to 3 phase converter, and an overunity energy source.
The image you grabbed from the video animation is, I believe, the high efficiency motor. Elsewhere in that video (or one of the other videos) we see several vertically mounted "motor" shaped units in front of a large control/monitoring panel of sorts. This, I believe, is the three phase converter. I do not think we have seen any images of the overunity "free energy source", although that appears to be, in one embodiment, the complicated system with multiple gears and rotors as seen in patent drawings. What I think are the three phase converters may be a later embodiment of the OU system, but it does not appear to be salient wound as discussed in the patents. What I think are three phase converters look like fairly standard wound rotor synchronous motors with the rotor shaft physically retained to prevent rotation. Sequentially energizing the physically stationary rotor windings with properly wound/sequenced field coils would seem to be a plausible manner with which to make a three phase converter.
Regarding the third set of coils in the center of the animation screen grab you posted, let's call that the physically rotating armature (the patent references are somewhat confusing). The outer most coils are physically stationary field coils. The middle group of coils is referred to as a rotor, albeit physically stationary as well, with its coils driven in sequence to create a rotating magnetic field.
Another embodiment I have seen replaces the rotating armature coils with permanent magnets.
The following patent covers most of this:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/09/e1/22/db3b8980221e4c/WO2010079422A1.pdf
FIG 14 depicts connection to a three phase power source. From the patent text, the rectangular boxes with long and short dashes within are plugs/connectors, the circles with curved top tees are wattmeters.
With all the connections, caps, loads, and windings involved, and no mention so far, that I have seen, of reactive power (I/V phase angles), there seems to be plenty of room for measurement errors.
This is also covered in the following patent:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/88/74/14/b00c916e4df8c4/US10008916.pdf
Note that this patent has an assignee that may, or mat not, be an offshore shell/holding corp which may, or may not, mean anything. From a search result, the assignee may also have been listed in the leaked Panama Papers. Perhaps I am wrong on all this and the companies are not one and the same, so please search the assignee and form an opinion for yourself.
PW
I wonder if they are using Metglas cores since they mention "electrical steel". Metglas is what Tom Bearden used in his "MEG" that claimed an overunity of five. See this site: https://metglas.com/distribution-transformer-electrical-steel/
Quote from: e2matrix on 2022.03.20, 17:31:55
I wonder if they are using Metglas cores since they mention "electrical steel". Metglas is what Tom Bearden used in his "MEG" that claimed an overunity of five. See this site: https://metglas.com/distribution-transformer-electrical-steel/
Electrical steel typically refers to the steel alloys used to cut/stamp traditional motor and xfmr laminations from. Metglas is often moreso made in thin ribbon form and then wound to make cores.
I'd have to search the patents again to find them, but a couple of standard lamination alloy letter/number designations are given as examples.
The alloys may be stated in one of the patents I linked in my recent post/response to F6FLT.
PW
Quote from: e2matrix on 2022.03.20, 17:31:55
I wonder if they are using Metglas cores since they mention "electrical steel". Metglas is what Tom Bearden used in his "MEG" ...
What about black sand?
Quote from: e2matrix on 2022.03.20, 17:31:55
I wonder if they are using Metglas cores since they mention "electrical steel". Metglas is what Tom Bearden used in his "MEG" that claimed an overunity of five. See this site: https://metglas.com/distribution-transformer-electrical-steel/
in that last patent link I posted he used mu metal for shielding. I have not seen metglass mentioned though
Another interesting one in a series
I have added the pdf to the folder http://exvacuo.free.fr/div/Sciences/NewEnergy/Holcomb/ .
It is quite different from the others.
Quote from: picowatt on 2022.03.20, 15:53:00
There are three systems being discussed, a high efficiency motor, a single to 3 phase converter, and an overunity energy source.
The image you grabbed from the video animation is, I believe, the high efficiency motor. Elsewhere in that video (or one of the other videos) we see several vertically mounted "motor" shaped units in front of a large control/monitoring panel of sorts. This, I believe, is the three phase converter. I do not think we have seen any images of the overunity "free energy source", although that appears to be, in one embodiment, the complicated system with multiple gears and rotors as seen in patent drawings. What I think are the three phase converters may be a later embodiment of the OU system, but it does not appear to be salient wound as discussed in the patents. What I think are three phase converters look like fairly standard wound rotor synchronous motors with the rotor shaft physically retained to prevent rotation. Sequentially energizing the physically stationary rotor windings with properly wound/sequenced field coils would seem to be a plausible manner with which to make a three phase converter.
Regarding the third set of coils in the center of the animation screen grab you posted, let's call that the physically rotating armature (the patent references are somewhat confusing). The outer most coils are physically stationary field coils. The middle group of coils is referred to as a rotor, albeit physically stationary as well, with its coils driven in sequence to create a rotating magnetic field.
Another embodiment I have seen replaces the rotating armature coils with permanent magnets.
The following patent covers most of this:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/09/e1/22/db3b8980221e4c/WO2010079422A1.pdf
FIG 14 depicts connection to a three phase power source. From the patent text, the rectangular boxes with long and short dashes within are plugs/connectors, the circles with curved top tees are wattmeters.
With all the connections, caps, loads, and windings involved, and no mention so far, that I have seen, of reactive power (I/V phase angles), there seems to be plenty of room for measurement errors.
This is also covered in the following patent:
https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/88/74/14/b00c916e4df8c4/US10008916.pdf
Note that this patent has an assignee that may, or mat not, be an offshore shell/holding corp which may, or may not, mean anything. From a search result, the assignee may also have been listed in the leaked Panama Papers. Perhaps I am wrong on all this and the companies are not one and the same, so please search the assignee and form an opinion for yourself.
PW
Yes, it's hard to get your head around it, and there are technical inconsistencies in what is said in the patents.
The assignee of the last patent you cited is "Redemptive Technologies Ltd", but you can see that it is also the applicant and there it says "Road Town , Tortola ( VG ) ; Robert Ray Holcomb , Road Town , Tortola ( VG )". The assignee is Holcomb.
All the information we have on his systems comes only from Holcomb. This is not reassuring.
- no third party involved in his case
- only three people on their team
- a multitude of details in the patents without presentation of a general guiding idea
- conditioning speech with lots of references and images of a green world without pollution
- a claimed source of energy, the spin of unpaired electrons, without any explanation of the causal links that would prove it and make the difference with a conventional system
The only positive point is the DNV verification report. But even this one is suspect, since it states "The harnessing of the energy from the spin of these unpaired electrons in the magnetic domains are most certainly the source of energy". But what does it say? No evidence is provided, and a certification body does not usually make such speculations, only measurements.
Finally, it seems to me that in a video (I can't find where), they talked about "SGS" as a second certifying body having verified their system, but no reference to SGS nor report is available on their site, contrary to DNV's, which remains the only one.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.21, 09:22:41
Yes, it's hard to get your head around it, and there are technical inconsistencies in what is said in the patents.
The assignee of the last patent you cited is "Redemptive Technologies Ltd", but you can see that it is also the applicant and there it says "Road Town , Tortola ( VG ) ; Robert Ray Holcomb , Road Town , Tortola ( VG )". The assignee is Holcomb.
All the information we have on his systems comes only from Holcomb. This is not reassuring.
- no third party involved in his case
- only three people on their team
- a multitude of details in the patents without presentation of a general guiding idea
- conditioning speech with lots of references and images of a green world without pollution
- a claimed source of energy, the spin of unpaired electrons, without any explanation of the causal links that would prove it and make the difference with a conventional system
The only positive point is the DNV verification report. But even this one is suspect, since it states "The harnessing of the energy from the spin of these unpaired electrons in the magnetic domains are most certainly the source of energy". But what does it say? No evidence is provided, and a certification body does not usually make such speculations, only measurements.
Finally, it seems to me that in a video (I can't find where), they talked about "SGS" as a second certifying body having verified their system, but no reference to SGS nor report is available on their site, contrary to DNV's, which remains the only one.
In this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUIK1GZSduo
At 00:57 he seems to saying that these are the solid state (non-rotating) "overunity/free energy" devices. At 1:21 the windings shown may or may not be from the devices shown at 00:57, but if they are, the rotor does not appear to be salient wound as in the patents.
Perhaps the solid state system presented is a relatively new embodiment and patents on that system may still be pending or not yet published.
The patents themselves are rather strange. I have never seen so many figures with no description of them in the body of the text. But, as most probably know, the claims are the legal/important part, the rest is pretty much wall paper... (although the description is normally supposed to make an invention obvious to those practiced in the art).
PW
@picowatt
A free energy machine can be mistaken for a type 1 perpetual motion machine, so it is difficult to patent as such. Anyway, even the inventor of such a machine would not believe in it, so he will assume a new energy source at work, and if he does not know it, he will imagine anything. Well, not quite, because if the source is identified later, and does not correspond to what he has indicated, his patent will no longer apply.
If Holcomb has an invention that really works and he doesn't know the source of the energy, claiming as he does that the energy comes from the spin is pretty clever, because that's what's at work in any magnetic device. He is only discreetly evading the real question which becomes: where does the spin take the energy it provides? But the patent can be accepted.
And if Holcomb's invention is a scam, imagining a source of energy like spin is also clever, since it is a recognized electronic property, and this can reassure potential investors.
So we are not much further ahead to know the end of the story.
Faraday laws of induction are pure overunity if we believe Clemente Figuera. Magnetic field is source of energy.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.03.22, 08:34:55
@picowatt
A free energy machine can be mistaken for a type 1 perpetual motion machine, so it is difficult to patent as such. Anyway, even the inventor of such a machine would not believe in it, so he will assume a new energy source at work, and if he does not know it, he will imagine anything. Well, not quite, because if the source is identified later, and does not correspond to what he has indicated, his patent will no longer apply.
If Holcomb has an invention that really works and he doesn't know the source of the energy, claiming as he does that the energy comes from the spin is pretty clever, because that's what's at work in any magnetic device. He is only discreetly evading the real question which becomes: where does the spin take the energy it provides? But the patent can be accepted.
And if Holcomb's invention is a scam, imagining a source of energy like spin is also clever, since it is a recognized electronic property, and this can reassure potential investors.
So we are not much further ahead to know the end of the story.
Clever.
I'm from Missouri, the "Show Me" state. A working, tested and REPLICATED prototype is what I'm looking for...
Quote from: forest on 2022.03.22, 19:03:31
Faraday laws of induction are pure overunity if we believe Clemente Figuera. Magnetic field is source of energy.
Please save us this noise of nonsense and unrelated urban legends, it's childish and off topic.
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2022.03.22, 22:12:07
I'm from Missouri, the "Show Me" state. ...
O0
I'm from France, also a "Show Me" state. Probably a cultural heritage of Descartes... :)
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2022.03.22, 22:12:07
Clever.
I'm from Missouri, the "Show Me" state. A working, tested and REPLICATED prototype is what I'm looking for...
Yeah Prof. You're not the only one....
I'm from Earth. The world led by idiots, and mad men. Where they would tax even the air you breath, if they could. And, free energy is not allowed.
NickZ
@NickZ
Free energy is not only allowed, it is desired.
Just do it.
Just in case some here aren't following the discussion of HES on overunity.com I think you may want to look in on UfoPolitics posts starting at #53 here: https://overunity.com/19069/holcomb-energy-systemsbreakthrough-technology-to-the-world/ on page 4. UfoPolitics has been working with these concepts for decades and is a hands on builder who I'd say is genius on these concepts. I think his posts give some credence to Holcomb's devices.
I guess this is the best place to post the following as it is my first attempt to understand the Holcomb device. I apologize that I applied RLE as part of the solution but I couldn't help it!!
The pix of cores and coils shows the basic setup at present. The two coils are the primaries and the three coils are the secondaries. Only one primary is used for this test and that is the one on the right. The secondaries are all connected in parallel are connected in series with a constant current inductor Lcc with 24.3mH. The ending current in Lcc is clamped at 51.5us and held while the core currents reset back to their starting levels.
The scope channels are CH1(yel) is L1 voltage that is not used, CH2(blu) is the voltage across the primary L2, CH3(pnk) is the voltage across Lcc, and CH4(grn) is the current probe identified with each scope shot.
The 1st pix is Pin shown to be 190.5mW over 108.1us for an input energy Uin = .1905*108.1e-6 = 20.6uJ. CH4 shows the current thru L2 and CH Math(red) shows the average of the sampled instantaneous products of voltage times current over time.
The 2nd and 3rd pix show the starting and ending currents in Lcc of 171.2ma and 180.3ma respectively. This equates to an energy gain in Lcc of (.1803^2-.1712^2)*.0243/2 = 38.8uJ.
The apparent energy gain is 38.8e-6/20.6e-6 = 1.88.
The 4th and 5th pix show the core flux reset back to the initial starting conditions of the L2 primary and L3,4,5 secondaries respectively. No energy is consumed during this process.
Now, I fully realize that this is a single phase, single primary example that you may say doesn't represent the Holcomb device accurately and I would agree. I do have another example using both primaries connected in a buck mode with the EM field moving left to right for delayed single sine pules on the input. What I don't have to demonstrate this at the moment is a fast unipolar switch to clamp Lcc such as a power Jfet or IGBT. A diode is series with a Mosfet drain will not work due to the low voltage at the required clamp time. The preliminary COP calcs for this arrangement is ~6-8.
Please note the staggered cores as this is my interpretation of Holcomb's stator/rotor combo implemented with common ferrite E cores.
Regards,
Pm
Hello
could you show a circuit to it?
Greeting
Lota
Quote from: lota on 2022.03.24, 06:53:21
Hello
could you show a circuit to it?
Greeting
Lota
Yes, see the attached below.
Regards,
Pm
Edit: Added Bias Supply
Edit: L1 is not used.
If this is not an outright scam, and that is a big IF. The only thing that comes to mind here is the delayed magnetization and relaxation time of ferromagnetic materials. They even hint at this in their ridiculous example of using a "plastic core" vs steel core. There is no way simple flux routing will magically produce OU. It has to be an intrinsic and anomalous property of the material itself that allows for possible OU. And that is giving them a lot of credit.
On the business side it makes absolutely no sense for them to sell an "in line" version of the generator when they also offer a complete closed system one. This makes my scam alarms go off hard.
broli
While I am not certain
This _inline_option "may" be a method to circumvent certain approval process's to allow faster
Distribution to market ?
A new Stand alone power source will surely be a big hoop to jump through for insurance
and other concerns?
(Although AllCanadian did mention a possible solution with "grid tie inverter ( I think??"
I do know DC has a simpler path forward ( just example not relevant??)
And yes one concern of great note ...edited test reports ?
I have done decades as freelance for test labs , and it's almost a chain of custody issue
All along the way , there are certain liabilities attached to most Lab testing
Although typically limited to actual test and associated fixtures / device under test within the lab !
Still lab reputations are involved and taken quite seriously by same ..
Edits are ?? ( need explanation IMO ...could be administrative or some proprietary issue ? with claimant, should be noted or signed off by Lab supervisor .
Respectfully
Chet K
Quote from: broli on 2022.03.30, 20:04:26
If this is not an outright scam, and that is a big IF. The only thing that comes to mind here is the delayed magnetization and relaxation time of ferromagnetic materials. They even hint at this in their ridiculous example of using a "plastic core" vs steel core. There is no way simple flux routing will magically produce OU. It has to be an intrinsic and anomalous property of the material itself that allows for possible OU. And that is giving them a lot of credit.
On the business side it makes absolutely no sense for them to sell an "in line" version of the generator when they also offer a complete closed system one. This makes my scam alarms go off hard.
broli,
It may be a scam but it would make a lot of sense to sell an inline version. Take for example the company I work for. We sell and lease a -lot- of 3 phase motor driven equipment to commercial and industrial customers. Some of them only have single phase and a lot of them only 208V 3 phase. With 1 PH we have to use an inverter to convert it to 3 PH and with 208 3 PH the power grid is almost always rural and subject to poor delivery, voltage drop etc. which often requires us to de-rate the performance of our equipment to keep from tripping overloads and the customer's breakers.
On top of that our customers today are very concerned with the cost of energy and if we could offer a product that required half the power of our competitors, well that's a no-brainer. Add onto that our enormous monthly electric bill for our 100+ large mig welders and press brakes and shears and plasma cutters running multiple shifts.
If these reach the market at a reasonable price we will definitely be a customer.
Cadman
Quote from: Cadman on 2022.04.04, 11:58:22
broli,
It may be a scam but it would make a lot of sense to sell an inline version. Take for example the company I work for. We sell and lease a -lot- of 3 phase motor driven equipment to commercial and industrial customers. Some of them only have single phase and a lot of them only 208V 3 phase. With 1 PH we have to use an inverter to convert it to 3 PH and with 208 3 PH the power grid is almost always rural and subject to poor delivery, voltage drop etc. which often requires us to de-rate the performance of our equipment to keep from tripping overloads and the customer's breakers.
On top of that our customers today are very concerned with the cost of energy and if we could offer a product that required half the power of our competitors, well that's a no-brainer. Add onto that our enormous monthly electric bill for our 100+ large mig welders and press brakes and shears and plasma cutters running multiple shifts.
If these reach the market at a reasonable price we will definitely be a customer.
Cadman
Their patent describes nothing novel, in fact they are describing ferromagnetism and how electron spins align in such material as being the "discovery". If this is the real deal it would be reversed engineered so fast and cheaply that it makes any business model they have obsolete within months. Good luck having to protect an IP on "electron spin".
If they had a billionaire dollar to back them up I would understand them coming out of "stealth mode", but there is no indication of that right now so I wonder why they went public at this stage.
Member Goat at Stefan's posted some news
https://overunity.com/19069/holcomb-energy-systemsbreakthrough-technology-to-the-world/msg565950/#new
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8wAMQE3vykE
Livestream interview with Dr Holcomb !
Thanks
Chet
Quote from: Chet K on 2022.04.21, 22:14:57
Member Goat at Stefan's posted some news
https://overunity.com/19069/holcomb-energy-systemsbreakthrough-technology-to-the-world/msg565950/#new
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8wAMQE3vykE
Livestream interview with Dr Holcomb !
Thanks
Chet
Thanks, Chet.
The interview with Dr Holcomb starts at 10 am on 22 April (tomorrow morning):
5 minutes to interview
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8wAMQE3vykE
Have you ever come across such a thing as a homo polar generator used in foundries and welding emporiums that generate thousands of amps ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homopolar_generator Hmm I wonder if people who who dislike them are homo phobic or is that a nasty stop out ?
Apparently a lot of advancements have been made on them in recent years.
Sil
I'm thinking about printing a rotor in iron pla then sintering it for this project. Anyone have any thoughts on the internal fill structure to enhance permeability?
This is the only place I have found that will sell in small quantities. Unfortunately they do not ship outside of the US.
https://sciencekitstore.com/soft-magnetic-iron-powder/
Product Description
SM1001 is an ultra pure soft-magnetic iron powder used to manufacture electromagnet cores, transformer cores and other soft magnetic P/M parts that require high magnetic permeability, high induced magnetization and low coercive force. Apparent density is about 2.92, purity is more than 99%, U.S. Mesh size = about 100.
Supposedly this same iron powder is available from China.
Chet
Quote5 minutes to interview
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8wAMQE3vykE
Thanks for the link to the video.
There are a few things to note which give some credibility to this story.
1)Holcomb comes across as sincere and credible in my opinion.
Most scammers come across like trump, staring down the camera, booming voice always trying to convince someone of something. Where Holcomb comes across as genuine, mild mannered and giving clear explanations as to his work and intent. He also hesitates before giving an answer thinking about what he is going to say. This is how real inventors generally talk.
2)He has the experience growing up working around motors and generators. He also claims to have studied a lot since then adding to his experience. He doesn't come across as a science guy but more so hands on which also adds to his credibility. He's saying all the right stuff, getting up every day trying to solve problems, studying, making things work, this is what a real inventor sounds like.
3)This is speculation on my part but I don't think he fully understand where the energy comes from or how this device works yet. His explanations follow the same transition as many other inventors in the past. Most started exactly where Holcomb has and it was only after many more years of research that they developed better theories. However, I think he is being sincere when explaining his theory that the energy might come from the magnetic domains.
I have a good feeling about the inventor and the technology.
On an off note, there may be another interesting dynamic in the equation. Holcomb comes across as the usual mild mannered inventor but his wife is definitely a go getter. She has that spark in her eyes and she's probably running the whole operation while her husband and others work on the technology. No offense but generally speaking, behind every great man is an even better woman. I suspect she's running this operation and together they may just get this done. I like it...
Regards
AC
Here is the basis for further research. Everyone here should understand this without talking about snowflakes or unicorns:
https://holcombenergysystems.com/technology-breakthrough/ (https://holcombenergysystems.com/technology-breakthrough/)
Quote from: giantkiller on 2022.04.25, 17:56:40
Here is the basis for further research. Everyone here should understand this without talking about snowflakes or unicorns:
https://holcombenergysystems.com/technology-breakthrough/ (https://holcombenergysystems.com/technology-breakthrough/)
Holcomb:
"- uses no fuel
- puts out no emissions
- runs totally silent
- produces no heat
- requires virtually no maintenance"
Unicorn:
- has a long straight horn with spiral grooves
- has cloven hooves
- can be captured only by a virgin
- has the power to make poisoned water drinkable
- has the power to cure diseases
So what?
For both, we are waiting for the demonstration! ;)
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.04.28, 08:59:44
Holcomb:
"- uses no fuel
- puts out no emissions
- runs totally silent
- produces no heat
- requires virtually no maintenance"
Everything uses "fuel" in one form or the other if there is given out energy, something has to be "consumed or converted".
Everything gives out "emissions", even a human gives out emissions.
Nothing runs "totally" silent, that is "if it is running".
If energy is being used then heat will be given off, be it positive or negative.
"Virtually" needs definition.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2022.04.25, 16:41:44
...
Most scammers come across like trump, staring down the camera, booming voice always trying to convince someone of something. Where Holcomb comes across as genuine, mild mannered and giving clear explanations as to his work and intent. He also hesitates before giving an answer thinking about what he is going to say. This is how real inventors generally talk.
...
I agree, but remember Black Light Power and Randell Mills. He too seemed convinced of his discovery, he even had a theory with the hydrino that seemed much more serious than Holcomb's, in addition to the equipment he presented. His story started in 1991, getting $25M in funding in 1999, $60M in 2006, another $1M award in 2013, and today, there is still nothing concrete on the market.
Holcomb is a much smaller company but it's starting out the same way. Unlike Mills, I find Holcomb less credible. He has no theory, and his kind of message with ecological references to a green planet is often used as a means of psychic conditioning.
It's too early to make any predictions about how it will turn out, but as we can see, beware...
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.04.28, 14:42:42
Everything uses "fuel" in one form or the other if there is given out energy, something has to be "consumed or converted".
Everything gives out "emissions", even a human gives out emissions.
Nothing runs "totally" silent, that is "if it is running".
If energy is being used then heat will be given off, be it positive or negative.
"Virtually" needs definition.
Regards
Mike
My quote was from Holcomb's website.
I agree that it's a bit light and I would have much preferred that they provide us with the central idea like we got with Black Light Power and the hydrino, and the proof of concept by a basic assembly, rather than the patent of an industrial machine.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2022.04.28, 19:28:05
My quote was from Holcomb's website.
I agree that it's a bit light and I would have much preferred that they provide us with the central idea like we got with Black Light Power and the hydrino, and the proof of concept by a basic assembly, rather than the patent of an industrial machine.
Yes I know, just agreeing with your sentiment on this one.
Regards
Mike
The Holcombe device is in the Courts at the moment, any threads regarding this device have been locked, Topics are closed for discussion.