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OverUnity Research > Electrical / Electronic Devices > Tariel Kapanadze's Devices (Moderators: verpies, Apecore) > TK Replicates
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img  ion
TK Replicates « on: 2012-10-09, 01:11:33 »
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It's turtles all the way down


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img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #1 on: 2013-04-25, 15:23:21 »
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Here's another recent video of supposed self runner, nice high resolution video, unfortunately poster does not zoom camera out to see whole table and all wires:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz0IPdPbHvA

Schematic attached (this may or not be the schematic of the shown device but looks very close)

Nevertheless interesting because of simple looping circuit for self runner. Poster disconnects startup battery.

Secret sauce? Split aluminum? sheet metal inserted into core, tiny spark gap from flyback transformer (pulsating HV DC at excitation frequency ripple rate), something else inserted into core. (batteries?)

Looks like a lot of replicators are going away from driver chips in favor of bistable multivibrator direct drive of step up device using FET's or transistors for simplicity. This would mean drive frequency is not that critical.

Not very complex, should be easy to crack if real.

Can anyone here please translate the video?
« Last Edit: 2013-04-25, 23:51:56 by ION »


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  cheappower2012
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #2 on: 2013-04-26, 00:14:37 »
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You have to be carefull with the Russian and other guys in this area of the world
they like to fake things.The mostlikely hidding place for a battery is inside the coil,
also another thing that has been done is small hidden wires carriyng power.My
investigation of the
TK device concludes,this applies directly to 2004 and greenbox video's,in my opinion ,TK routes the actual ac power from the real hidden
device thru a Tesla interface,in the 2004 video,the real device is in a sealed can,that consists of a ground ,spark gap, high voltage and coils.
The Tesla interface does nothing so in my opinion,so  any replication using this is fake.In one video ,green box video
the Tesla interface creates pulses on the ac since the ac passes thru a coil subjected to the collapsing field.
These pulses create a false triggering on digital meters,causing failure to read ac voltages,in addition the clampmeter used creates
a false ac  ground current reading.I have a clampmeter that is made by the same manufacture
as the one used by TK,my other clampmeters read zero current.I have done an experiment with a tesla interface,the source
of the ac came from an isolation transformer.Heres  something for you guys to disscuss I tend to create hardware
simmulations because computer simulations in my opinion would not work correctly,since your dealing with the concept of overunity.
I believe certain parts of any true real world overunity device would have ordinary components connected to conventional thinking,
along with some that would appear impossible.In the 2004 TK video,when TK disconnects the ac feed to the device there is a delay along with a strange noise,a frequency increase,
now compare that noise with a simulation I did to show that if a device did work it could be looped.The simulation was more or less thrown togeither from parts I have,it was also done to check
other things to see if the video tracks exactly to what you see compare to what you get in a simulation.In my video you will see that theres no delay or noise.The question is why would TK build
 in such a thing if its fake,I would think he wouldn't, no point in doing something like that.If we assume its real in doing hes setup there could be strange things that could happen
remember,if its a real world device it may not behave in a manner that you may believe it should.
If you were faking my simulation you would put in batteries,I used a power supply,to supply energy.
The purpose of TK in calling hes device a Tesla invention is to draw away attention from him and focus it on Tesla, its misdirection.
   
img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #3 on: 2013-04-26, 01:15:15 »
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cheappower2012;

Thanks for the heads up. I'm very aware of the trickery that might be used and the many ways to fake these devices e.g the latest video link referenced shows a twisted pair of red wires that is way too long for the job and probably meanders over the edge of the table to a power supply or battery below the table.

In my own mind I constantly try to prove and also disprove what I see as it is the required due diligence in both cases.

In the DSRD thread, post #109 user "verpies" posted an interesting paper that could offer a  functional hypothesis of how devices might work. It is a good read.


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #4 on: 2013-04-26, 05:14:07 »
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that's a neat video ION,  I'll assume its authentic, until proven otherwise.
   
img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #5 on: 2013-04-26, 14:41:30 »
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Examining the schematic, key points are:

A pulsating DC driven very small, therefore high frequency spark gap exciting a three turn copper tubing primary (L1).

A bifilar (L2, L3) secondary of 80 turns each. Note since these have the same phase there should be a net zero voltage into the output transformer.
Another coil L4 which is in series with L3 and grounded by 0.5uF 750 volt capacitor.

This would seem to be reminiscent of Spheric's bifilar L2, L3, plus delay element L4.



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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  Groundloop
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #6 on: 2013-04-26, 20:08:07 »
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If you "break" down the circuit and simplifies it, then you end up with something like the attached.
I can see no reason to why this circuit should produce a high output power. Where does the
energy amplification take place? In the spark gap? In the transformer? Any theories?

GL.
   
img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #7 on: 2013-04-26, 22:12:30 »
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Quote from: Groundloop on 2013-04-26, 20:08:07
If you "break" down the circuit and simplifies it, then you end up with something like the attached.
I can see no reason to why this circuit should produce a high output power. Where does the
energy amplification take place? In the spark gap? In the transformer? Any theories?
GL.

If you examine the video carefully you will see that the two 80 turn windings are bifilar and presumably wound in the same direction. This would put the dots at one end of the coil form for these wires. Let us assume the dot wires feed the transformer. This would create a null output for ordinary induction as the pulse voltage would effectively cancel(not counting the smaller winding with the capacitor).

The present hypotheses are:
1)  that some type of NMR and beta capture is occurring of either the copper wires themselves, the aluminum insert or some other material not visible.
2) something closer to the Spheric or TPU i.e. mixing of frequency with a slight delay element, aether effect.
3) another hoax to get hits on youtube.

Food for thought:
If the two 80 turn windings are in series connection (properly phased for normal induction) then all we have is a RF transformer being pinged at the spark gap frequency. This could probably light the bulb shown, but the spark in the gap does not look intense enough to carry that wattage considering the turns ratio 3:160. The flyback transformer HV winding alone is not designed to carry the power being demonstrated. If anyone can estimate the gap distance, we would have a good idea how high the capacitor is charging before discharge in the gap. We can then calculate the energy per pulse (if we knew the cap value) and get the approximate necessary pulse repetition rate to sustain the lamp at some reasonable level of brightness as shown in the video.

Only way to tell is to build it, which I intend to do as time permits.


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #8 on: 2013-04-27, 02:00:26 »
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Quote from: Groundloop on 2013-04-26, 20:08:07
If you "break" down the circuit and simplifies it, then you end up with something like the attached.
I can see no reason to why this circuit should produce a high output power. Where does the
energy amplification take place? In the spark gap? In the transformer? Any theories?

GL.

I think the best source for understanding where the energy comes from is the TK patents.   In one of his patents, he seems to indicate a difference frequency gets set up in the coils, which is 50 Hz,  so this indicates to me that it is a receiver of low frequency stray energy that seems to be everywhere due to the man made power grid.

this guys particular device might very well take advantage of other phenomena, but if it works per the TK patents, that's it.  ( INMO    :D )

EM
   
img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #9 on: 2013-04-28, 16:34:31 »
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Here is a video translated by Wesley of another supposed self runner that is interesting (first view of workshop then outdoor test).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUVvZzeDe5U&feature=youtu.be

and the non translated version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e3RpsEZE14

When discussing please refer to this one as the "akula" video.

The one in the  post reply #1 we will refer to as the "Ikako" video


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  Peterae
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #10 on: 2013-04-28, 16:49:25 »

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Buy me some coffee
Sorry for the bad quality here's the diagram
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #11 on: 2013-04-28, 18:05:29 »
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Way too many people are getting free energy over there, what's going on?   :-\


akula's video is a departure from the typical design, but i think it's more credible.

EM
   
img  ion
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #12 on: 2013-04-28, 20:23:57 »
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Peterae:

Regarding the schematic you posted, although I have seen it, I am not sure it thoroughly represents the "akula" device. Where did you get it?

Here is the schematic of the "Ikako" device. I have traced each wire from the video and it seems to be correct. I do not know of it's origin.

It is totally possible to reverse engineer the "Ikako" device to determine if it is normal induction or something special happening. All we need is the value of C3, and orientation of the phasing dots for L2, L3, L4. Lamp wattage would be a bonus to know.

This would be done by calculating the PRR and estimating the required energy per pulse based on the spark gap firing distance. We also need a estimate of the actual output power. I'm working on this and as time permits it is getting my full attention.


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
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Re: TK Replicates « Reply #13 on: 2013-04-28, 21:29:14 »

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Buy me some coffee
Quote
Regarding the schematic you posted, although I have seen it, I am not sure it thoroughly represents the "akula" device. Where did you get it?

I found it in a frame of that youtube video you posted the link to  O0

Here's the poster's first comment on yiutube
Quote
I have got authorization to copy this video and I have written prove for it.
There is few frames from original Tungus video at the end that does not display any longer with instruction to the schematic. and schematic.
It was showing clear when I start translation but now I see the frames at the end if you hold the slider but does not display it any longer.
If someone has it please give me link to it.
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #14 on: 2013-04-29, 14:21:36 »
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I rewatched the first video, and he does test a number of permutation of the switch and battery conection, and I think it passes legitimacy, however, all the videos trouble me a bit, when the battery is disconnected.  Specifically I expect to see some light bulb intensity change, and I don't see that, clear indication that is running off a stable power source hidden somewhere. :-\

EM
« Last Edit: 2013-05-01, 04:44:08 by EMdevices »
   
img  BEP
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #15 on: 2013-04-29, 17:27:27 »
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EM,

Take the positive outlook.

Maybe, the light didn't change because the battery was under charge after he got the circuit going  ;)

If the thing is legit there should be no change in the light. All the coils aside, this circuit would be constant voltage output and just become hotter when load is applied.
   
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Re: TK Replicates « Reply #16 on: 2013-04-29, 19:50:14 »
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Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2013-04-29, 17:27:27
EM,

Take the positive outlook.

Maybe, the light didn't change because the battery was under charge after he got the circuit going  ;)

If the thing is legit there should be no change in the light. All the coils aside, this circuit would be constant voltage output and just become hotter when load is applied.

I would have to respectfully disagree with the last statement. It is more likely a voltage source with some series impedance, not a constant voltage source, as there is not the required setpoint control and reference voltage to accomplish this.

 The battery can act as a clamp to limit voltage applied to the oscillator e.g. to between 12 to 15v volts depending on initial charge state and charging current. When removed, the voltage can soar to above 15 volts or to some value above the previous  "clamped" voltage. Then the lamp should get a bit brighter as the charging current is no longer being supplied.

We actually see the slight increase in brightness  at the first disconnection at around 2:05. We do not see it at the second disconnection at around 4:55 because the battery has slightly charged to match the disconnect voltage.

There are some other more serious questions that should be asked but I don't see anyone asking them.


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"Secrecy, secret societies and secret groups have always been repugnant to a free and open society"......John F Kennedy
   
img  BEP
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #17 on: 2013-04-29, 21:56:03 »
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ION,

I would agree with you if this device followed the rules we would expect but then there would be no chance of OU if it did  :D

If spin was the main activity then the only voltage drop you would see would be from the wiring and connections. Since I can see no way that spin is used and I may not see it when if it stared me in the face, I'll have to think how it could be used in this configuration.

The serious question I am still asking myself is - how is he faking it? There are a few possibilities but I haven't dug into it deeply enough, so far.
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #18 on: 2013-04-30, 03:24:16 »
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ION brings up a good point.  

The simple power feedback approach (loop back) that these guys are using has no voltage regulation, and that's a dead giveaway that it is faked.  For if the generated voltage was slightly higher, as it would have to be for it to work when looped back, it would continue increasing thus creating a "run-away" event, and we don't see that happening.  ( and it's hard to imagine what dynamic would stop the voltage from climbing )

However,  on closer inspection of the circuit operation,  a counter argument could be made as follows:

The input power is used to drive a high voltage power supply  (push pull config driving the TV high voltage coil) and it goes right to the spark gap.     Let's ask the question, what would a higher input voltage accomplish?   Well,   the voltage would build up faster and the spark gap will trigger at a FASTER FREQUENCY.

So a higher input voltage increases the spark gap firing frequency.   But is that a problem?   Not really, because the spark gap is just a tool to excite the resonant coil (main big coil) to oscillate, and its frequency is not controlled by the spark gap firing frequency.  Moreover,  the regulation mechanism is in the frequency of the spark gap firing.  As we know from Tesla coil operation, each time the spark gap fires energy is transferred to the secondary, but there is an optimum frequency of the spark gap triggering frequency and the resonant frequency of the Tesla coil, and its the harmonic relation, i.e. the coils resonant frequency has to be a higher harmonic of the spark gap triggering frequency, and then the energy is added in phase and builds up faster, assuming the coil is not heavily loaded, but if it is heavily loaded, as in this case, I guess it doesn't matter so much.    :-\

I need to ponder this stuff some more, but I have some doubts here.

EM


PS. I just watched the video again, and yes, the lights do get brighter when battery is disconnected.
« Last Edit: 2013-04-30, 05:31:45 by EMdevices »
   
img  Hoppy
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #19 on: 2013-04-30, 08:18:46 »
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Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2013-04-29, 21:56:03
ION,

The serious question I am still asking myself is - how is he faking it? There are a few possibilities but I haven't dug into it deeply enough, so far.


The easiest way that I can see is to bring a hidden mains live in through the bottom of the air coil and connect to one side of L4. If you watch the manual switching sequence carefully, he accidentally operates the switch with the croc lead disconnected, resulting in no lamp illuminating. This suggests that a power supply is being carried in by the croc lead, probably mains neutral.

Hoppy
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #20 on: 2013-05-01, 02:43:01 »
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Hoppy,

I think he did that on purpose, to show us that the energy comes through one ground wire.   But that does not exclude fakery.  

 I think a lot of people try to "replicate" any way they can, by fakery if they have to,  and just because they fake it, doesn't mean TK's invention was fake.   We've seen that on the TPU topic a lot.

EM
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #21 on: 2013-05-01, 04:52:19 »
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the ikako video is such a fake, and blatantly obvious, I can't believe I didn't see this before.  

Look at the frame I grabbed from the video, and annotated.   The 12 volt circuit is just for show, to excite a spark gap, but does nothing for power.   He has hidden 240 V AC wires and the switch controls that, the transformer is key, it is a 12 Volt AC step down transformer, so what is the chance that his coil outputs 240 Volts AC?  None, it's fake, he brings house electricity to it with hidden wires.


 >:(

EM


[edit:  I appended a composite picture of multiple frame grabs]
« Last Edit: 2013-05-01, 06:07:07 by EMdevices »
   
img  tinman
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #22 on: 2013-05-01, 05:02:32 »
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Quote from: EMdevices on 2013-05-01, 04:52:19
the ikako video is such a fake, and blatantly obvious, I can't believe I didn't see this before.  


 >:(

EM
Bugga
How did we know that was coming.
   
img  EMdevices
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #23 on: 2013-05-01, 05:19:57 »
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Quote from: tinman on 2013-05-01, 05:02:32
Bugga
How did we know that was coming.

tinman, after the RomeroUK debacle,  I'm a lot more skeptical.  Back then, I did not want to believe his motor/generator was fake, I wanted to believe it was real, until wattsup found the infamous "wire-X" and convinced me to analyze it and ponder it, and I did and reluctantly realized it.  It was a very bitter experience for me!


BTW, the other TK replication video is more credible (akula's, taken outside on that chair) but this one can have hidden batteries inside the coil.  However, make no mistake, I think the TK invention is real.

EM

P.S.,  Anybody who talks so softly in a video that shows such amazing results, is giving away the fact that he is not excited because he is faking it.  I would be stuttering with excitement as I show my discovery of free energy, but not this guy.  And, he does not make an effort to film around and prove there are no hidden wires.   The purpose of a video is really to show the world you've done it and bragg,  and of course you will do your best to prove you've done it, and dispel any doubts, but once again, not this guy.    

one other thing, the circuit is not even correct per TK.  the spark gap needs to excite the multi turn coil, not the short and thick copper coil, this coil should really be the output, because its a step down, but of course the kid thinks he is building a Tesla coil, which is not quite it, sorry.

By far the most blatant mistake the kid makes is to light a 240 volt light bulb directly off the wires coming from the coil (connected at the transformer)   The brightness is consistent to being powered from 240 volts, so the question is how come his simple coil conveniently develops 240 volts without any power conditioning electronic?  It does not, it's just wires bringing in 240 volts AC from house wiring, and he hides them somewhere.   If we look at TK's videos he has a lot of electronics there to extract the energy at the output and condition it and send it back to the input, where he has an inverter, that further regulates the input.  This kid has practically nothing, just a simple push pull driver stage for the TV high voltage coil and a spark gap, that much is legitimate, the rest is just bull shit.
« Last Edit: 2013-05-01, 06:04:47 by EMdevices »
   
img  Hoppy
Re: TK Replicates « Reply #24 on: 2013-05-01, 08:59:17 »
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Quote from: EMdevices on 2013-05-01, 05:19:57


BTW, the other TK replication video is more credible (akula's, taken outside on that chair) but this one can have hidden batteries inside the coil.  However, make no mistake, I think the TK invention is real.

EM



EM & all,

Attached is a clip from the Akula 'chair' video showing a twin cable below the demo board. It is sitting on top of the timber traverse under the lower red arrow (ignore the top red arrow). There is also a hint of something poking up out of the crack in the concrete slab near the back RHS leg of the chair but the video quality is too poor to see enough detail at this distance from the camera. Note: The video clip is incorrectly labelled Tungus twin wire.

The Tariel Kapanadze 'Green Box' garden video is IMO almost certainly faked. The guy holding the coils of cable with long black sleeves is 'rigged' and has a wire going up his sleeve and down his clothing to the ground, where it connects to the 'X' wire. The video takes a lot of analysing to appreciate this.

Hoppy
« Last Edit: 2013-05-01, 09:33:20 by Hoppy »
   
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