OverUnity Research

Hi everyone,
  I have a new idea I should share with all of you.  In order not to impede the very good work and ideas of others I have decided to call this something different, it will become apparent what devices it is similar to very soon. I am working on building a prototype as I write this so I do not yet know if the idea works. I will document it here.

This idea does not change physics or bring into the picture exotic things such as zero point or reactive energy.  There is a source for the energy that can be named.
What I am proposing is a method of CONVERTING an existing energy source into USABLE electricity.  Using common electronics, no 'Magic' tricks and standard physics I believe we can tap this energy source. In order to differentiate what I am doing and what others are doing I am calling this a Large Signal Receiver or LSR.

The source I am proposing to use is Schuman Resonance, the approximately 8 Hz signal that covers the earth.  This signal is created by the wave guide characteristics of the space between the earths surface and the ionosphere. The space is just right to allow a 8 Hz resonance wave to form in it.  That could be a lot of energy just hanging around all day and night waiting to be used by someone.

(Signal strength has been measured at about 300 uv/meter.  I'm not sure if it is usable or not? Not as much energy as I thought. )


The idea is to use two frequencies and beat them together to create two other frequencies.  A beat frequency of of their sum and difference.  If I use a 1st freq. like 2000 Hz and a second freq. of 2008 Hz I will get beat frequencies of 8 Hz and 4008 Hz, very much like a radio receiver. In this case I am trying to build a receiver of Schuman resonance signals but I could just as easily tune this receiver to 60 Hz if so desired.  That would work well under power lines but not so well for airplanes.

In this device, unlike a radio, the signal being tuned into is also the power feed.  No laws of physics to be broken here, just harvesting available energy.

I believe this gets my idea across so I will leave it here for now.  To be continued.

Room3327

Edit: Added line in parentheses above.

There is a huge potential difference between the ionosphere and ground, but the question is, does voltage equate to power?

I would suggest that unless one can place a huge conductive plate up in the ionosphere, it will be difficult to extract much power. This of course excludes lightning storms.

Apart from this, I'm not clear on how you propose to receive 8Hz? A radio receiver uses heterodyning to mix down a carrier, where the carrier frequency is >> than the frequency of interest. Perhaps you could elaborate a little in your next post ;)

.99

Hi .99
  Why would voltage not equate to power?  I guess I don't get that question. If that voltage is stepped down to usable levels the current goes up. I don't know what you mean there.

I think there are other ways to extract energy from Schuman resonance then just plates up in the ionosphere and that is exactly what I am working on and will be talking about in the future.

I plan on doing it by using almost every trick I know in electronics but hay I'm not a wizard and I may fail but I bring a fresh idea to OUR forum that may or may not go somewhere.  I'm just trying like everyone else to find an answer.  But I will be posting a lot more soon.

Room

Great idea room, I wonder if there is some kind of vortex generator in this one? Lightning becomes your enemy so we will soon see whats up your sleeve on this.
Besr of luck, Steve.

Hi szaxx,
  Thanks for the encouragement.  What I plan on doing to start with is use a toroidal and solenoid wound multi-coil device which will be fed two frequencies.  Each frequency will be a 2 phase signal that will cause a rotating NS polarity in the device.  The two signals will counter rotate canceling each other out except for the 8 HZ frequency and 4008 Hz as per the example above.  2 KHz is arbitrary, In tuning it I plan on finding  a nice resonant point with the first frequency then adding the second frequency.  Now this 8 Hz beat freq. is coupled to the output or collector windings (solenoidal) turning the collector into a powered antenna at 8 Hz if the phasing is off between the two the 8 Hz Schuman resonance should be pulled into the collector coils as if it had a huge effective aperture.  Keeping the collector coils short should be like a stepdown transformer to it and only allow or provide a lower voltage at a greater current.  This is my basic concept on this device, but there are probably many other ways to realize the same objective just like there are many ways to build radio circuits.

I am sorry it is not real simple and may not be able to be constructed by just anybody if it even works, but I think anyone here or most here should be able to handle it if it pans out.

Room3327:

I think that there is a lot of misunderstanding about the Schuman resonance.  It is a resonant cavity between the surface of the Earth and the ionosphere.  That does not mean that there is automatically a source of energy there though.  What it means is that if you generate an 8 Hz broadcast signal the Schuman resonant cavity will start to resonate and store the 8 Hz excitation energy.  Most likely within a few tens of seconds or less the energy that you pump into the cavity will decay almost to zero.  That's because the cavity is lossy, it does not store the energy that you pump into it indefinitely.

It's an interesting property of the Earth system.

Here is a similar thought:  Tesla's Wardenclyffe Tower is often referred to as the system for delivering high power through the air so anybody can access it.  Suppose that's true, and you could set up an antenna anywhere and power your TV, etc.

The follow-on thought that nobody seems to discuss is okay, now we have to build coal/oil/nuke power plants to feed the power into Wardenclyffe Tower in order to broadcast all of that energy to the people.  So if you want to power the world, what do you do, build 500 massive power plants around the tower?

Just some food for thought!

MileHigh

Hi Room,
MH has a point, hopefully theres enough noise inherent for a useful result.
You are aware of the D,E F1 and F2 layers in the ionosphere? If they are active the height of each is different and the cavity formed may require  your device to be tunable.
I can assume the solenoids will be quite large and resonant, are these to be tuned to the shuman freq?
If you're not familiar with the magnetic loop antenna then it may be worth a looking at, this may help as the magnetic part of an EMF wave is pronounced more at low freq's.

Hopefully helpful to you with your build.

ionospherics link,
http://www.astrosurf.com/luxorion/qsl-propa2.htm

magnetic loop link,
http://www.magneticloopantenna.com/


Cheers Steve.

Well thats interesting MH, but as far as I know Schuman resonance is always there, how did Schuman measure it?  I thought this 8 Hz frequency of the earth was getting to be well known especially since it has been linked to alpha brain waves and other things.  Why do I keep hearing about Schuman resonance if I have to create it or beam it into the atmosphere.  It wouldn't be Schuman resonance at all if you have to provide it.  What you say makes no sense to me. But that don't mean I'm right if there is no Schuman resonance then they really got me good.  If that is the case then I guess I only have 60 HZ power lines to tap for energy.  Or maybe I should just forget this altogether, another bad idea.  Or is it?  Should I keep going or give up already you tell me? :-\

Thanks for the info szaxx I will read when I get a chance.

Keep pursuing the idea Room. MH and I are simply pointing out some things that may or may not be obvious.

Of course SR exists. There is no disputing that. The difficulty lays in how or if it is possible to extract any energy from it.

Are you proposing an energy-sucking antenna (http://amasci.com/tesla/tesceive.html) of sorts?

.99

Hi poynt,
  Basically yes an energy sucking antenna is pretty much what I am proposing, I think it may be a little more complicated then that but that is the basic idea.  And I thought using some radio techniques might help us get there. Remember I don't have all the answers to this so I am open to help but a lot of the obvious stuff I already know, I am not an amateur.

QuoteThe difficulty lays in how or if it is possible to extract any energy from it.

This is the question and what I am working on.  Part of what brought me to this idea was working with my Agentgates coil, at certain frequencies with it I found large signals on the output coil at 8 Hz, 60 Hz and about 200 HZ?  I could see them on the scope, that started me thinking about pulling these freq.s in with something like a radio type circuit.  Wether it will work or not that is another question, but I won't know if I don't try.

Quote from: Room3327 on 2010.06.11, 17:51:48
Wether it will work or not that is another question, but I won't know if I don't try.

Indeed. Let's see where it goes ;)

.99

Howdy,
in reading ESA doco the section that really drove this concept home was the paragraph:
Ears as antisound-emitters
and that is just doesn't happen with the ears but other parts of the body at different frequencies. The blood coursing through our veins creates a thumping beat freat frequency on its own or base. It seems that hearing is the reflection or interference on the waves transmitted by the outer edge of our ear cartilage.
And such http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bone_Anchored_Hearing_Aid the skull vibrates.

Fascinating.


Also in the myoelectric sensors I used on the prosthetic hand injected a signal into the skin and flesh. Then listened for that signal coming back mixed with noise and reflection to measure and signify the muscle flexation and extension. The echo / signal strenth was then converted to 0 - +5 volts and used to drive motors.

Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.06.11, 12:35:41
Keep pursuing the idea Room. MH and I are simply pointing out some things that may or may not be obvious.

Of course SR exists. There is no disputing that. The difficulty lays in how or if it is possible to extract any energy from it.

Are you proposing an energy-sucking antenna (http://amasci.com/tesla/tesceive.html) of sorts?

.99

Do we have to pull energy in from around us when it already everywhere?

Do I need huge generators to send a non-particulate signal to a distant location and then convert it to conduction current?

I don't buy it.

What is current in the first place and how might we produce it with the least expenditure of energy?

Well instead of moving electrons great distances we can produce a potental kinetically by moving an electron into the next one. Isn't this what electrostatics does?

Quote from: giantkiller on 2010.06.11, 20:02:02
Well instead of moving electrons great distances we can produce a potental kinetically by moving an electron into the next one. Isn't this what electrostatics does?

Why don't we just create the necessary conditions and let nature do the rest for us.  That is the lesson of the TPU.  You don't have to pull energy in, just tell it to move in a subtle way.

About the SR:

A tuning fork is a mechanical LC resonator.  A tuning fork that produces middle C, 440 Hz, can be held in your hand.  Make the tuning fork big enough and it will resonate at 8 Hz.  You have to strike the tuning fork and put energy into it to get the "ball rolling" so to speak.

Now, if you bring your middle C tuning fork close to a beer bottle, and experiment with the level of water (or beer!) in the beer bottle, eventually the beer bottle can be tuned to middle C.  The beer bottle is a resonant air cavity.  It has inherent LC characteristics that tune the resonant air cavity to a given frequency.  Change the level of water in the beer bottle and you are changing the "L" and thus changing the resonant frequency of the resonant cavity.

Now think of a breadbox made of metal.  The inside of the breadbox is also an electromagnetic resonant cavity.  You can set up very high frequency electromagnetic wave to resonate inside the resonant cavity.  The resonant frequency of the resonant cavity is determined by the dimensions of the breadbox.  The bigger the breadbox the lower the resonant frequency.

You have to have an external power source powering an antenna to set up resonating electromagnetic waves inside the breadbox.  A fraction of a second after you switch off the power to the transmitting antenna the resonating electromagnetic waves inside the breadbox disappear because the breadbox cavity is lossy.

So the Earth's Schuman resonance is akin to a giant breadbox with metal sides where the resonant frequency of the resonant cavity is about 8 Hz.  It is simply "available to resonate."  If there is no power source it doesn't do anything.

There is a kind of "Cult of Personality" about the Schuman resonance.  Perhaps I shed a bit of light on it.

MileHigh

I almost forgot:  Almost certainly the frequency of the Earth's Schuman resonance was calculated on paper.  It's all based on the speed of light and the geometry and the dimensions of the cavity, which is spherical in shape.  Subsequently it was probably measured by someone to confirm its existence.  Every now and then there is probably a big enough bolt of lightning to excite the SR and measure it's frequency.  There is nothing to get excited about here though.  You know that only a minuscule proportion of the energy in the lightning bolt could excite the SR.  Then with very sensitive listening apparatus you could probably pick up the resonance.  You have to remember that the entire surface of the Earth is being struck by lightning at about 1 KHz and any SR excitation energy available will tend to cancel itself because the lightning bolts are not in sync, they are random.  Hence my reasoning about an occasional lightning bolt that stands out in the crowd.  I read once that about one in a million lightning bolts is a "positive giant" that goes the other way.

Quote from: MileHigh on 2010.06.11, 22:40:47
About the SR:

So the Earth's Schuman resonance is akin to a giant breadbox with metal sides where the resonant frequency of the resonant cavity is about 8 Hz.  It is simply "available to resonate."  If there is no power source it doesn't do anything.

MileHigh

Indeed, however, I think Room is looking at this from the perspective that there is energy going in to excite the SR, and this energy comes from the multitude of constant lightning strikes occurring around the globe.

The trick is to somehow tune in to this excitation at a distance and concentrate it to a lower voltage/higher current. I think it's quite a challenge.  8)

.99

Hi everyone,

Here is some interesting reading on Schumann resonance.  As far as I can tell it is pretty much always there.

http://www.quake.geo.berkeley.edu/ncedc/em.intro.html

http://www.earthbreathing.co.uk/sr.htm

http://sedonanomalies.com/Schumann.htm

yeah the SR is interesting, but the energy comes from ightning - try pulling that in...ouch....

the caries of current, electrons, are already in the wire - tell them to move

I have always wondered if the lightning is only disturbing the magnetic field that naturally exists on a number of frequencies.
I never thought the power was from the lightning.
I just think we can measure it because of the lightning.
The lightning gives it more than a magnetic signature.
Without the lightning we would need a meter and an antenna with a rapidly spinning and downward spiraling motion

Quote from: darkspeed on 2010.06.12, 05:03:38

Without the lightning we would need a meter and an antenna with a rapidly spinning and downward spiraling motion

Markovich  (or something like that?)

No i dont think so..

If there is a downward spiral - and it has a self organization effect on electron flow..

I am guessing that because of its wavelength it would be a large diameter spiral with closely stacked rings ' think slinki '

So if you wanted to receive you would need a fast downward motion to match the decay of the spiral and a very fast spin to equate to the distance traveled on the diameter of each ring.

I hope that made sence

Thats funny Grumpy  ;D  I can see a lightning sucking machine coming soon. Wouldn't that be fun to build?
Actually I was thinking more of trying to avoid lightning and just try to pick up the signal, if this was a 20Khz or 100Khz or a 1Mhz signal no one would be questioning it, but 8 Hz, why can't this be treated just like any other signal?  It is just slow but it's hanging around waiting to be used for free.  I personally don't care if it's slow I'm getting a bit slow myself.  :D


I see we got some brainstorming going on here, this is good, probably the only way were going to get somewhere

Electrons, which drift and constitute a conduction current, are already in our circuits.

Find a way to tell them to drift that doesn't require moving a lot of mass (like magnets).

Yea, that idea is in my head too Grumpy. Thats one of the reasons I like motionless projects the best.

From SM:

QuoteHe [Tesla] noticed that most of the time the magnetometers stayed relatively sedate and
around the same level. They would fluctuate just slightly. However one day he noticed
that the meters jumped quite unpredictably.  It attracted his attention and he began to
find that the meters were reacting to a thunderstorm many hundreds of miles away.
Interesting isn't it?  
Then he continued his experiments and found that as a thunderstorm moved closer the
magnetometers would register larger and larger fluctuations until they were off the scale
and useless.  
He was fascinated and consumed by this. He acquired better magnetometers and his
research found that you could tune the magnetometers to certain specific frequencies
and tap directly into large magnetic waves. When I say large, I am referring to huge.
That was useable power.  
However, you had to find a circuit potential in order for the electrons to flow. That was
the difficulty which he overcame to produce his famous demonstrations of power from
nowhere.

.99

poynt,
  This quote is great, I have read it many times, and it helped me to formulate this idea.  Not only that quote but all except a few sentences of Marks quotes make sense to me now.  And I believe the few excepted sentences of quote's that don't fit are the only misdirection on his part.

Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.06.12, 15:14:09
From SM:

QuoteHe [Tesla] noticed that most of the time the magnetometers stayed relatively sedate and
around the same level. They would fluctuate just slightly. However one day he noticed
that the meters jumped quite unpredictably.  It attracted his attention and he began to
find that the meters were reacting to a thunderstorm many hundreds of miles away.
Interesting isn't it?  
Then he continued his experiments and found that as a thunderstorm moved closer the
magnetometers would register larger and larger fluctuations until they were off the scale
and useless.  
He was fascinated and consumed by this. He acquired better magnetometers and his
research found that you could tune the magnetometers to certain specific frequencies
and tap directly into large magnetic waves. When I say large, I am referring to huge.
That was useable power.  
However, you had to find a circuit potential in order for the electrons to flow. That was
the difficulty which he overcame to produce his famous demonstrations of power from
nowhere.

.99

All electric currents have an associated magnetic field.

What type of current do you think Tesla was detecting in these experiments?

Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.06.12, 18:31:22
.99


All electric currents have an associated magnetic field.

What type of current do you think Tesla was detecting in these experiments?

longitudinal magnetic

Quote from: darkspeed on 2010.06.12, 18:34:37

longitudinal magnetic

A longitudinal electric current with an associated magnetic field or a magnetic current?

Just an update, I am preparing schematics and pictures to post very soon.  These will be mainly to give me direction for the building of this and may not be what I end up with, or I may have to add to it.  They will just be a starting point for me and an initial configuration, I have to start somewhere.

What I am going to try to do is get a heterodyne going between 2 different frequencies to create a 3rd freqency of interest to me.  While at the same time all of these frequencies will be rotating, and I will see where that leads me, and go on from there.

Wavewatcher,  If you wait to post until you have something, and I have also been there, we here, lose all the knowledge of what you are doing, even if it doesn't work knowing what you did will prevent others from wasting there time trying to figure out what you already have.  If you have a new idea put it out there, give it a shot what have you got to lose who knows it may work or someone else may get a better idea from yours.

Room 

OK here is the basic circuit I am going to start with.  It is built on a circuit I already designed for another project and I have proven to myself it works. Yes I know the parts are obsolete but I already have them why not use them.  Many parts will work to do the same thing and yes I can design newer and more available parts into this but then so can anybody.  It is a sine wave generator (X2) driving a phase splitter and an amplifier powering the converter coils. I hope this doesn't get to complicated.

And here are pictures of the converter coil, I am sorry I can't find pictures of the core windings in the center.  The few pictures I have are of the secondary (output)winding almost finished being taped with fiberglass tape, then the finished taping and lastly the finished coil with the bifilar wound primary and some of the connections.  That is a 12 inch ruler laying in front of it.

QuoteIf you wait to post until you have something, and I have also been there, we here, lose all the knowledge of what you are doing, even if it doesn't work knowing what you did will prevent others from wasting there time trying to figure out what you already have.  If you have a new idea put it out there, give it a shot what have you got to lose who knows it may work or someone else may get a better idea from yours.

Room great work, and a great policy above, as you say it doesn't matter what the outcome is everyone learns from this, and these build projects in the open allow other's to join in and suggest possible ways and things to try as well.

Thanks for sharing your work.

Thanks for the encouragement Peterae, I think sharing our work is the main function of a site like this.  Open source is the only alternative and the only chance we have of changing things. Keeping things to ourselves will not help get it out and in some cases is not good for our health.

Just an update, I am still building circuits, tested one phase of the converter and my circuit drives it very nicely. I have had some thoughts about the output and have a different circuit idea for it, but until I get to that point there is no sense in getting ahead of myself.
I found a paper that seems to be very pertinant to what I am trying to do. Worth taking a read.

http://amasci.com/tesla/tescieve.html

Sorry I lost interest in this, been working on hydrogen generator instead and spending time with grandkids.

Got this built but went over the deep end with three channels into the realm of Pied Piper. Created the S)olfeggio H)armonic I)ntegration T)ransmitter and have been shooting the voles in the back yard. I shoot them with harmonic frequencies on a quartly basis. I expect to see birth defects in the litters this spring. :o

Guess I should bring the initial build out and regroup on this. It did create some amazing effects with my Bose output using hardly any volume at all. This might be the ticket in the field generation instead of sound. And that would coincide with the effective aperture process. I have been looking at the use of 2 phased sines also currently. Moab stated poetry instead of sledging. After all, utility transformers explode from sine harmonics.

Hi GK,
Thanks for the laugh I needed it. Those poor Voles  :(

Yea I guess I should get back on this thing too, I actually did do some testing on the new transformer-coil and at this point I am pretty much convinced that it needs a ferrite core to operate properly.  Don't get excited I didn't test for the anomaly I discovered with my first test set up, which I still have and could set it back up but the new coil isn't developing the field that the test setup did. It had a steel wire core in it with 1600 turns of wire around it. I could get a steel rod in the center to rotate like a motor.  This one only has copper poloidal windings for a core and I have not been able to get a rod rotating with it.

So I think I need to build another transformer-coil setup to move on, but I can probably get some more information out of this one too. One thought I had was would it work  to have dual rotation going on in the same direction but at slightly different frequency's.  This should create periodic collisions of peaks which should appear as very large rapid pulses being applied and all the fields are rotating in the same direction one at say 2.5 KHz and one at 2.8KHz this would give us components of 5.3KHz and 300 Hz.  I believe all these frequencies will be rotating in the same direction to give the effect I found, I'm rambling now but I think you see the possibilities. 

Quote from: giantkiller on 2010.12.29, 23:20:41

Created the S)olfeggio H)armonic I)ntegration T)ransmitter and have been shooting the voles in the back yard. I shoot them with harmonic frequencies on a quartly basis. I expect to see birth defects in the litters this spring. :o

You may think about ending that practice when they are standing erect at your back door and offering to be your assistant.

I have some technicians working for me that probably went through that style of development. You can tell by the way they eat their lunch  :o

Hi All,
  I will reopen this thread and post what I found here and answer questions, No I did not find overunity and do not make any such claim, but that doe's not mean I didn't find any interesting things or anything worth looking at.  This device shows and proves that you can have magnetic rotation in a solid toroidal core of ferromagnetic material it also demonstrates the ability to spin a compass in it's magnetic field which I don't think of as a big woopy, but it demonstrates something I haven't quite put my finger on yet and that is the registering of current flow in a clamp on ammeter without being clamped on anything.  I just need to bring it close 6-8 inches from this device to have it start registering current.  It shows the maximum reading at the center of  the toroid, in the middle I got readings as high as 40 amps with 750 ma. input.  I tried many times to get my mechanical d'arsonval movement ammeter to show a reading in all kinds of environments, around transformers, switching supplies etc. the only time it would read anything was by the toroid with the rotating field.

Steven Marks demonstrated this same phenomena in one of his videos, but using a digital clamp on ammeter.  Much has been made of this over the years and I have never seen or heard of anyone duplicating this feat!   In operation this device also exhibits a slight gyroscopic effect and vibration and over many tests it seems to have something continue to rotate after input power is shut off, like the magnetic field continues rotating in the core for a short period of time.

In looking for output I found that I got the biggest readings with coils positioned radially to the toroid.  This testing was done on a single toroid of bailing wire with 4 coils rapped around the core toroidally and connected per my schematic and fed with a 2 phase input.  Using series capacitors of correct size to find resonance at the frequencies I was interested in. I also utilized a piece of copper coated steel welding rod that just fit inside the toroid, hammered a divot in the center of it and balanced it on a small sharpened nail in a block of wood, I raised the toroid up so the rod coincided with the center line of the core.  As long as the frequency was low the rod would spin like a motor, as compasses do, mostly for visual feedback.

A word of warning, when sitting close by this device while operating I would get sick and dizzy feeling, like it was spinning something in my head.  Moving away from it or shutting it off would stop the feelings in just a few minutes.

I think I will leave it here for now.
Room3327

The exact embodiment that I used in testing consisted of about 25 turns around a standard gal. paint can of literally bailing wire.  It was bare steel, magnetic and I am guessing 16 ga. wire making an approximately 1/2 inch dia. steel core.  I then taped the core with mylar transformer tape all the way around. I then drew lines on it dividing it into 4 sections with a perm. marker.  Each 1/4 of the core I wound 1 layer of 29 ga. magnet wire right on top of the tape, tight and orderly, be as accurate as you can.  By calculation the plan was to have each coil be 4 ohms with the goal being 8 ohms for each of the two coil sets, My actual coil measurement came out at 7.8 ohms on both sets and you do want them as balanced as possible.  I started with these numbers because SM said to think of speakers and I thought 8 ohms sounds speakerish, you have to start somewhere and it was a good match for the amplifier.  The distance between coils was the with of the marker I used to divide the core into 4 sections about .1 inch (2.5 mm).  Each coil was 400 turns of 29 ga. magnet wire.  Then I taped it again all around with the mylar tape.  There is no bifilar windings involved with this I just never tried bifilar windings, they may work better.

I tried al sorts of arangements with 2 toroids built as above, one above the other, some tests rotating in the same direction others in opposite directions.  I tried all sorts of output windings wrapped around 1 toroid sometimes rapped around both toroids,  I spent a lot of time with this for several years thinking of different operating modes such as it is very similar to a circular shake flashlight with a N&S pole wizzing around through coils, at any rate it is fun to play with and not that difficult to get working, I didn't use batteries like in my schematic above I used a lab power supply that could only supply 1.6 amps max. my normal draw was between 500 and 750 ma. at 18 V I used 18 V in all my testing my PS will only go to 20 V but in resonance I would have 26 VRMS across ea. coil set. In retrospect I think it may have been too low of voltage to get real good effects.

Getting late I'm rambling enough,
Room

Dear Room3327

Thanks for sharing your work on this. Here are  a few questions should you have the time to answer?

1) What was the final size and weight of your device including all components.

2) Were Pin / Pout measurements taken

3) How would you compare the vibration and it's level

4) Was there an observable washboard effect

5) Was the system able to be looped such that it could operate removed from power supply or battery

6) How sensitive was tuning to operation of the device

7) Did the output fluctuate over e.g one hour

8.) Do you intend to revive this experiment

Thanks in advance  8)

Regards

Note: eight right parenthesis =  8), so I had to add the period

Hi Room

I see you have used iron wire, I tried an iron core and could not get a charge to build on the core coils and so went to copper where I can get very high voltages circulating around as in a mag loop antenna.

I think IMO a magnetic core is counterproductive where the near magnetic field is being eliminated by the magnetic flux in the iron. I now have two mag loops which have a capacitive part between them which charges and circulates, one is positive and the other negative (floating ground) HV measured across the capacitance.

On my STEAP revisited area I have just posted my latest TPU which has no input battery, only a 9v battery for the electronics, this will be tested next week on my return from a short trip.

Sorry to have heard of your heart attack, hope all is now well, I had a few years ago an aneurysm which made me have attacks of seeing double, now take blood-thinning tablets which seem to have cured the problem. Yes, we need to keep fit, I'm an active 68yr old and have to also keep the brain active as well as the body.

Regards

Mike 8)

Hi Ion,
  I will answer your question to the best of my ability.

Quote from: ion on 2019.04.03, 15:45:47
Dear Room3327

Thanks for sharing your work on this. Here are  a few questions should you have the time to answer?

1) What was the final size and weight of your device including all components.
It depends on which one your talking about but the range would be about .5 lb. to 1.5 lb. The above single toroid with no output windings about 14 oz.

2) Were Pin / Pout measurements taken
Yes at many different times and configurations, but I don't recall any being over about 90% efficient.

3) How would you compare the vibration and it's level
Vibration depended on frequency and power input level, not a lot of it but it is there. There is also a very slight gyroscopic feel to it when I would pick it up not strong but it seemed to be there.

4) Was there an observable washboard effect
No not that I ever observed.

5) Was the system able to be looped such that it could operate removed from power supply or battery
No I was never able to get a good output from any configuration I tried, nothing over 100%

6) How sensitive was tuning to operation of the device
It's not too sensitive to the tuning but enough that you have to watch everything, like phase balancing, freq., resonance spots, input current etc.

7) Did the output fluctuate over e.g one hour
Once I tuned it into resonance the output would remain very steady, but after about 20-30 min the drive coils would heat up and I would shut it down and let it cool.

8.) Do you intend to revive this experiment
Good question Ion, maybe, I have a number of other irons on the fire right now but still have all the working parts, all I would have to do is hook it back up but I have still not figured out the way to get maximum output from it or if it could even go over cop 1.

Thanks in advance  8)

Regards

Note: eight right parenthesis =  8), so I had to add the period

Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.04.03, 17:50:47
Hi Room

I see you have used iron wire, I tried an iron core and could not get a charge to build on the core coils and so went to copper where I can get very high voltages circulating around as in a mag loop antenna.

I think IMO a magnetic core is counterproductive where the near magnetic field is being eliminated by the magnetic flux in the iron. I now have two mag loops which have a capacitive part between them which charges and circulates, one is positive and the other negative (floating ground) HV measured across the capacitance.

On my STEAP revisited area I have just posted my latest TPU which has no input battery, only a 9v battery for the electronics, this will be tested next week on my return from a short trip.

Sorry to have heard of your heart attack, hope all is now well, I had a few years ago an aneurysm which made me have attacks of seeing double, now take blood-thinning tablets which seem to have cured the problem. Yes, we need to keep fit, I'm an active 68yr old and have to also keep the brain active as well as the body.

Regards

Mike 8)

Hi Mike,
  Glad your still hanging in there with your health issue's too.  I think you may be right, from what I found at the end, I thought a higher frequency ferrite core would work better.  As far as a copper core I wound 2 or 3 with copper cores and in my testing they didn't seem to work at all for me, but I am sure our circuits are not at all alike and the only capacitors involved with my toroids were the two resonance capacitors and circuit caps.  I don't really know what you are working on, you gave me the old steap circuit but I think there may have been something missing there, all it did for me was produce high voltage which almost blew my scope. Is your steap circuit schematic in your steap thread I will take a look.  Sounds like you may be further along with the TPU then me, good work.

Respectfully
Room

Centraflow,
Mike can I ask where your STEAP revisited thread is? I haven't been able to find it here at OUR? I would be very interested in reading it.

Thank you,
Room

Quote from: Room3327 on 2019.04.04, 16:54:58
Centraflow,
Mike can I ask where your STEAP revisited thread is? I haven't been able to find it here at OUR? I would be very interested in reading it.

Thank you,
Room

Ah,

I will post it here for you.

I have two drive units, one is 3 frequencies at 1st, 3rd and 9th harmonic drives for the 3 mosfets and the other is a single frequency 3 phase drive 0º, 120º and 240º for the 3 mosfets, both give a predominant DC output.

Note the circuit difference between mosfet B and C for the 3 phase board. schematic is dsn (download free Tinycad to open).

Regards

Mike 8)

Added the 3ph circuit as an image here

Regards

Mike 8)

Mike,
  Thank you very much for that, now I can see the similarities of yours and mine.  I knew a 3 phase circuit would work as well as or better then my 2 phase circuit but never got around to trying it.  The biggest difference I see is the capacitor circling around the toroid and being a part of the circuit, I never thought of that.
Questions I would like to ask if you don't mind answering.

Have you ever tried this with a 2 phase circuit?

Is the unmarked inductor a CMC on the schematic?

How did you implement the capacitor and what material did you use?

Doe's the rotating field charge the capacitor or is there another mode of operation I'm not understanding involved?

Is the 3 phase with 3 diff. freqs. better then the 3 phase with 1 freq.? Whats the difference between them?

When you said you used copper wire wire instead of iron, do you mean to wrap a toroidal core and is the core open at one point or multi wrapped? One turn or many?

Doe's the capacitor sandwich the core at the center?

These may all be questions you have already answered, and I may have more. I apologize for not having followed you more closely over the years and maybe I would not have had to ask these questions, but I don't have much to do with other sites like EF and OU so I don't know whats being said at them.

Again Thank you for the info,
Respectfully
Room   

 Hi room,
I am away for a few days, only have my phone to answer and read, will reply on my return.

Regards

Mike

I thought I would add some more information on what I have been trying to do with this project, some may not be following me on rotating magnetic fields, and yes I understand that many do not believe that magnetic fields can rotate, that they may in fact be static even if the magnet creating the field is rotating. But that is not the kind of rotation I am talking about. I am playing with magnetic Pole rotation N & S, which is a fact, or electric motors would not work. In this regard there are multiple ways that poles can be rotated both physically and electrically.  Electrically is what I am working on and there is several ways to do it, see the drawing below.

The kind of rotation my device is using is the first drawing the 2 Phase, this is similar to a bar magnet spinning on a center axis.  A 3 Phase rotation is different as it is similar to a shorter magnet traveling around in a larger circle and the third drawing is similar to a mono-pole moving around in a circle.  These are all used to make electric motors and there may be other ways.

I am mainly concerned with the 2 Phase type of rotation in this thread.  With 2 phase rotation, speed is determined by the input frequency, every cycle is one complete rotation of the N S poles.  As we all know there are 3 ways to increase output of an electric generator, by increasing the magnetic field strength, by increasing the turns of wire or by increasing the speed the generator turns.  Using the 2 phase method of rotation, it is easy to get millions of RPM in the N S poles rotating in a circle.  An input frequency of 5 kHz translates to 300,000 RPM,  20 kHz to 1.2 million RPM much higher speeds then can be achieved by mechanical means.  See the second drawing to understand how the poles progress in a circle with each cycle

Now if we take a look at velocity, the poles travel around the toroid at a rate of 1 turn per cycle.  If the toroid is 8 inches in dia. and the frequency is 5 kHz
the poles are moving 25.1 inches per rotation or 25.1 X 300,000 = 627,500 ft./min. or 10,458 ft/sec which is quite ballistic.   It is this ballistic speed of the magnetic poles traveling in a circle that I believe en-trains the aether and was what made me feel sick and dizzy operating this device so if replicating be careful.

It may also be possible to reach light speed with a setup like this, It would only require a 1.7 mHz 2 phase drive in a 15" dia. toroid.  The larger the toroid the lower the frequency needed to achieve light speed of the rotating poles.  I think it would be very interesting to see what happens in a device like that, and I think there must be more we can do with ballistic speed of magnetic poles in a simple to achieve manner.  All the magnetic field is usually confined to the core inside a toroidal winding of this kind, but not with this 2 phase rotation there is a good deal of external magnetic field outside the toroid during operation.

OK I hope this helps someone in their endeavors. O0

Room3327

 

This is the process that SM alluded to and also stated that his name used to be Markovitch and was changed .
I have kept that secret untill now as it was asked of me at the time .
I never thought much of it but this thread may find it useful in some way.

Keep up the good work ,i wish i could participate more . That sick giddy feeling I can relate to.

At one point i felt the flesh of my hand vibrate .

This area of research is an area that is in my opinion directly related to the devices demonstrated.

I had never seen this thread before .

The trouble is that it is not widely understood but the markovich device could well be an RMF .

He did go on about the need for a ground that was a shorted loop of solder around the outer coils .

The real issue is that this field is not dealt with on a technical level  as it is a new field as far as common knowledge is concened.

Dont be put off by the lack of explanation of the secondary effects but do be careful.

Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2019.10.27, 05:27:52
This is the process that SM alluded to and also stated that his name used to be Markovitch and was changed .
I have kept that secret untill now as it was asked of me at the time .
I never thought much of it but this thread may find it useful in some way.

Keep up the good work ,i wish i could participate more . That sick giddy feeling I can relate to.

At one point i felt the flesh of my hand vibrate .

This area of research is an area that is in my opinion directly related to the devices demonstrated.

I had never seen this thread before .

The trouble is that it is not widely understood but the markovich device could well be an RMF .

He did go on about the need for a ground that was a shorted loop of solder around the outer coils .

The real issue is that this field is not dealt with on a technical level  as it is a new field as far as common knowledge is concened.

Dont be put off by the lack of explanation of the secondary effects but do be careful.

Hi 3D,
Thank you for the additional information, I had never heard that before.  The reason you may have not seen this before is I just, this year, made this thread public, but I always thought the TPU worked something like this. O0

Regards
Room

Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2019.10.27, 05:27:52
This is the process that SM alluded to and also stated that his name used to be Markovitch and was changed .
I have kept that secret untill now as it was asked of me at the time .
I never thought much of it but this thread may find it useful in some way.

Keep up the good work ,i wish i could participate more . That sick giddy feeling I can relate to.

At one point i felt the flesh of my hand vibrate .

This area of research is an area that is in my opinion directly related to the devices demonstrated.

I had never seen this thread before .

The trouble is that it is not widely understood but the markovich device could well be an RMF .

He did go on about the need for a ground that was a shorted loop of solder around the outer coils .

The real issue is that this field is not dealt with on a technical level  as it is a new field as far as common knowledge is concened.

Dont be put off by the lack of explanation of the secondary effects but do be careful.

Dear 3D

That is interesting information, that Stephen Mark changed his name that was priorly Markovitch  or was it Markovich (without the "t") as you have spelled it both ways in your post. Which one is correct?

Any relation to Peter Markovich that also claimed a free energy device?

Any help here on the proper spelling would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Regards

Quote from: ion on 2019.10.29, 13:26:18
Dear 3D

That is interesting information, that Stephen Mark changed his name that was priorly Markovitch  or was it Markovich (without the "t") as you have spelled it both ways in your post. Which one is correct?

Any relation to Peter Markovich that also claimed a free energy device?

Any help here on the proper spelling would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Regards

Hi Ion and 3D,
That is a good question,  I just looked up Peter Markovich and it led me to a very interesting piece at Rexresearch. com on rectifying the ether and which leads us back to Tesla.  I haven't read it all yet but it apparently had DC output.  Thanks men for the information. O0

Room

Hi Room, ion, 3D

I have found some time on my own as my guests have gone to take in some nightlife in Valencia C.C

Interesting topic Room, as some know I have been involved with radio since I was a teenager but for some years now my operating is only on 2mts (145Mhz) with a handheld for repeaters locally, I sort of lost interest and changed to new energies investigation, a big field.

As ion knows, also being a HAM, antennas do bring in energy to a tuned circuit which is then amplified, it is their nature by design. Let us take a magnetic loop antenna which is a copper loop of "wire" where the two ends are connected to a capacitor so giving us an LC resonator. This is connected to a receiver/transmitter by a primary coil, smaller loop, near the opposite side to the capacitor, we now have a transformer.

Well I won't go on about how an antenna works but if I am right the aether is the space between an AC capacitor, ionosphere and ground, which is running at the Earths frequency around 7-16Hz which is a very long wave and could be seen as DC in any one local spot if it was frozen like on your oscilloscope. So how can we extract energy from that wave! the antenna would be so big it would not be practicable, well we could apply a sort of modulation to that wave, treat it as a sub-harmonic of a wave we can deal with which is of a much higher frequency.

SM was into audio modulation in a big way, it was his job. Sub harmonics can be a big problem in power distribution, they create huge reactive currents and voltages especially when switching ^-^ but in the audio business they are of great use in synthesizers. I have shown sub-harmonics in some tests of mine, I have shown the kicks when you get it just right and giving a higher db than the primary signal. I was looking in the beginning at the wrong end of the spectrum, it is not the higher harmonics to be looked at but the lower harmonics, those around 8Hz or so, that's 625 times low than "5kHz".

IMO it is all to do with the higher frequencies we use being modulated by the earth's frequency when it is a lower harmonic of that higher frequency, extracting it using the moving charge within the electric field between a two-loop magnetic loop. The two loops are full loop solenoid coils with the capacitance between them.

Regards

Mike 8)

Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.10.29, 18:46:46
Hi Room, ion, 3D

I have found some time on my own as my guests have gone to take in some nightlife in Valencia C.C

Interesting topic Room, as some know I have been involved with radio since I was a teenager but for some years now my operating is only on 2mts (145Mhz) with a handheld for repeaters locally, I sort of lost interest and changed to new energies investigation, a big field.

As ion knows, also being a HAM, antennas do bring in energy to a tuned circuit which is then amplified, it is their nature by design. Let us take a magnetic loop antenna which is a copper loop of "wire" where the two ends are connected to a capacitor so giving us an LC resonator. This is connected to a receiver/transmitter by a primary coil, smaller loop, near the opposite side to the capacitor, we now have a transformer.

Well I won't go on about how an antenna works but if I am right the aether is the space between an AC capacitor, ionosphere and ground, which is running at the Earths frequency around 7-16Hz which is a very long wave and could be seen as DC in any one local spot if it was frozen like on your oscilloscope. So how can we extract energy from that wave! the antenna would be so big it would not be practicable, well we could apply a sort of modulation to that wave, treat it as a sub-harmonic of a wave we can deal with which is of a much higher frequency.

SM was into audio modulation in a big way, it was his job. Sub harmonics can be a big problem in power distribution, they create huge reactive currents and voltages especially when switching ^-^ but in the audio business they are of great use in synthesizers. I have shown sub-harmonics in some tests of mine, I have shown the kicks when you get it just right and giving a higher db than the primary signal. I was looking in the beginning at the wrong end of the spectrum, it is not the higher harmonics to be looked at but the lower harmonics, those around 8Hz or so, that's 625 times low than "5kHz".

IMO it is all to do with the higher frequencies we use being modulated by the earth's frequency when it is a lower harmonic of that higher frequency, extracting it using the moving electric field between a two-loop magnetic loop. The two loops are full loop solenoid coils with the capacitance between them.

Regards

Mike 8)

Hi Mike,
  Yes sub-harmonics was the main focus of this project, I thought I could create sub-harmonics in the range of 7-16 Hz by beating together two frequencies like 5 kHz and 5.008 kHz using the toroidal windings with a loop antenna core.  I thought maybe I could draw in the Shuman resonance thinking it is this huge signal, but It turns out there is not as much energy there as I thought, I forget how much but I know I give the amount of energy available earlier in this thread somewhere. (300 uv/meter?) I never thought of making the core a bifilar winding for capacitance and trying it but I may in the future. It is a new direction for me to take. O0

Room 8)

Please refrain from mentioning the names spelled corectly  together as this is picked up by bots.

There have been many spelling errors on my part and others, at times , for this reason and as usual the information ,while i have no reason not to believe it to be true ,there is no context and never was.

All of the information given was only designed to become relevant in hindsight as a means of protecting Intelectual property to some small extent, that is how i make sence of it at least.

Please keep on mind that my interest was the discovery process and shared empathy with the real inventors and the distorted path that this may well be part of .

But the concept of rotation and increasing the radius to get more speed ,applied to magnetics/ electron flow /envitonmental interaction/ has to be on the right path.
That is my opinion as is the need for some kind of measuring devise to work with the one known secondary effect of the field rotation extending outwards like a galaxy.

There will be results here but it is known that there are un predictable effects that will never be agreed upon because there is no solid reference .

It seems that what is going in the magnetic delay thread may be relevant to this one .

@ Room if you want to rehide this i would be happier but that is up to you .

Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2019.10.30, 01:00:23

That is my opinion as is the need for some kind of measuring devise to work with the one known secondary effect of the field rotation extending outwards like a galaxy.

The've just detected counter rotation of two discs of gas around NGC 1068 . EU guys are saying maybe evidence of birkeland currents. Could counter rotation of fields play a part?

Jim, that is very likely and fits in with my theory

Regards

Mike 8)

Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.10.30, 08:00:14
Jim, that is very likely and fits in with my theory

Regards

Mike 8)

Is your thinking counter rotation of a secondary field is an effect of generating a primary? Or that we should be thinking of a device designed to create both fields? Thanks

Hi All,

Just a comment by the way. A field does not "rotate" for the reason that a field is not a solid body. A field is a set of scalars that specify the amplitude of the field at any point in space.

If the field amplitude decreases at a location A and increases further at a location B, we tend to say that we have a displacement of the field from A to B whether the movement is a linear displacement or a rotation.
But nothing really moves from A to B: it's like "moving" a light spot along a wall when you turn the light source. Light always goes from the source to the wall, to A then from the source to B, but light does not go from A to B, nothing moves along the wall. Whether the field is light or a magnetic field does not change anything.

The "field rotates" can be a simplifying way of talking, but we have to understand what it means, because the difference is considerable. For example, the momentum that can be associated with the field energy will not be in the direction of apparent displacement or rotation, but always moving from the source, which means for example that although the field "rotates", no inertial effects will affect its energy.

Hi F6FLT

Yes, you are right, and it is the electric charge moving within the electric field that produces the magnetic field.

Regards

Mike 8)

PS I inserted the part I missed out, thanks for the correction O0

The electric field has a direction, positive to negative. This is the direction that the electric field will cause a positive charge to accelerate.
If a positive charge is moving in the same direction as the electric field vector the particle's velocity will increase. If it is moving in the opposite direction it will decelerate.
If a negative charge is moving in the same direction as the electric field vector the particle will decelerate. If it is moving in the opposite direction it will accelerate.

Now if a charged particle is moving between parallel electric plates and its velocity is initially parallel to the plates it will be deflected toward the plate with opposite charge and its velocity vector will increase in magnitude.

Regards

Mike 8)

Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2019.10.30, 01:00:23
@ Room if you want to rehide this i would be happier but that is up to you .

Hi 3D,
I think this topic should be discussed but I understand some things should remain in the dark if there are any posts that you think should be deleted because of the content just let me know and I will delete them.  I believe you can delete any of your own posts if wanted, but I think it is a little late to put this behind the curtain again and make it private. What's private now days anyway, at this point I think everything is hacked and not just by the government, I think China, Russia and many other countries are reading and viewing everything on line regardless of where it is.  There is no more privacy so if were in trouble there is not much we can do about it. :(

Regards
Room

Hi All,
Mike I like how you think! ;)
Good discussion guys, F6 I believe most of us understand what you say and believe the same thing. O0

Room

F6FLT

QuoteJust a comment by the way. A field does not "rotate" for the reason that a field is not a solid body. A field is a set of scalars that specify the amplitude of the field at any point in space.
If the field amplitude decreases at a location A and increases further at a location B, we tend to say that we have a displacement of the field from A to B whether the movement is a linear displacement or a rotation.
But nothing really moves from A to B: it's like "moving" a light spot along a wall when you turn the light source. Light always goes from the source to the wall, to A then from the source to B, but light does not go from A to B, nothing moves along the wall. Whether the field is light or a magnetic field does not change anything.

Another way of looking at it is that the Electric and Magnetic fields are not "something" in itself but a "condition of something". Which is why a magnet can rotate on the N-S axis however the magnetic field does not rotate with it. The magnetic field exists in the space surrounding the magnet however as we know the space is not moving per se. As F6FLT implied, rotating a lightbulb does not produce a rotating field of light for the same reasons.

This is an important concept to remember, "fields being a condition of something not something in itself" because the conditions can be changed which then changes the field structure. For example, a magnet can be brought near to an iron shaft or rod inducing an opposite magnetic field in it. Then the rod is hit extremely hard on one end with a hammer producing a compression wave in the metal. As the induced magnetic field is a "condition" of the metal as the metal contracts the magnetic field contracts, as the metal expands the magnetic field expands producing a magnetic wave phenomena along the rod length.

The same phenomena is true of diamagnetic materials such as copper and the change in internal motion/compression-expansion can produce external field changes. Think of it as an aggregate of particles which carry an induced magnetic field then changing the motion and position of the particles which then changes the magnetic field structure.

An experiment, take an iron shaft with a coil wrapped around it connected to a DSO then strike one end of the shaft. A voltage spike is produced because the Earths magnetic field has induced an opposite magnetic field in the shaft and when we struck it the material of the metal compressed-expanded. This changed the condition of the metal changing the magnetic field which induced a voltage in our coil. Here we can also see how external Electric and Magnetic fields can be utilized to produce electrical energy.

Note it does not matter how or why the material property changed producing a conditional field change... only that it does change. There are countless ways it could be done and how it's done up to you. This is how technology evolves, we take a single phenomena then conceptualize, build and experiment until it yields practical results.

Regards

Really thought provoking stuff and Thanks 6FLT , it really is a condition but perhaps if that condition is manipulated correctly a " situation" where inertia exists and other interactions are possible.
We have to put the cart in front of the horse here so ther will be speculation.
I always go back to the first demo when he had no legal advice and placed the magnet on the centre part ,where it stuck .

This i believe unbalanced the condition and set the oscillation, which was dependant on the magnetic condition, into process.
and i woud say ther was a small battery there

It might have been a simple multivibrator that was dependant on everything being in balance like a magnetic see saw .

The citcuit here could be modified untill it would depend on just the winding length to oscillate then be further reduced by resistor values.

having a cro on each collector and adjusting untill it barely oscillates ....lots of variables but low component count.

It is possible that this arrangement could react correctly to the condition creating a slightly delayed output on the secondary whch could be sent to the outer rim and returned to the primary.

I remain of the view that the centre torroid is multifilar for electric de coupling/isolation .
Litz wire gives many outputs and inputs with capacitive coupling remainig (no way to avoid that)
If this is sequenced properly and matched properly you woud have a device that would react to its own condition to create rotation..?
This stuff does my head in but its close is some respects .

There are better minds than mine here but  its all about hands on and some form of self oscillation .
Using a cap for the 12v charging it and watching the oscillation die slowly or quickly is practical for working in the dark here.
It was this first video that needed to be "overshadowed" with other info that had no context , by the legal side ..i cant say their name .
The curcuit here would only be a guide to explain but agood start.
Perhaps the brains trust could suggest wiring arrangements to ensure rotation .
The lack of capacitors may be important for balancing at least
the centre torroid may just be back and forth whilr the outer rim is sequecial... brain fade now ....

I remember when I was younger messing with transistor radios, with the tune cap in the small clear plastic block, if you short out 2 of the 5 varicap leads you can receive other bands. Also if you tune 2 of those radios to a channel, one radio, affects how the other receives, etc. Those fine wires on the bar core for an ant, I have wondered and posted at ou.com on the idea of what if it were not fine wires but thick wires, etc, to increase the current in the voltage of the signal.  I can imagine more receivers like that in proximity of each other would show some heavy interference with other receivers.  maybe there could be some distance requirements in relation to the transmitter between receivers to avoid this interference, as in signal phasing and such, and since there is this interference, if receivers are in line over a distance, possibly they could act like repeaters to one another.  ??? ;)
Just thoughts on this

Mags

Well I already have one of these wound so I'll have a tinker.

Quote from: JimBoot on 2019.11.02, 02:40:48
Well I already have one of these wound so I'll have a tinker.

Jim

I think that is a two-phase transformer which could be a coverup of a two-phase TPU ;)

Regards

Mike 8)

Quote from: JimBoot on 2019.11.02, 02:40:48
Well I already have one of these wound so I'll have a tinker.

Hi Jim,
I have played with this transformer for many years now, it is the basis for the rotating field I have been discussing in this thread.  This device is what has made me feel sick and dizzy in the past so careful.  I have tried this double, one on top of the other with the same and opposite directions of of rotation.  Very fun to play with but so far I have not been able to find any overunity so have fun maybe you can find the magic configuration. O0

Regards 8)   
Room

Thanks guys for the confirmation

Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2019.10.31, 01:16:02
Really thought provoking stuff and Thanks 6FLT , it really is a condition but perhaps if that condition is manipulated correctly a " situation" where inertia exists and other interactions are possible.
We have to put the cart in front of the horse here so ther will be speculation.
I always go back to the first demo when he had no legal advice and placed the magnet on the centre part ,where it stuck .

This i believe unbalanced the condition and set the oscillation, which was dependant on the magnetic condition, into process.
and i woud say ther was a small battery there

It might have been a simple multivibrator that was dependant on everything being in balance like a magnetic see saw .

The citcuit here could be modified untill it would depend on just the winding length to oscillate then be further reduced by resistor values.

having a cro on each collector and adjusting untill it barely oscillates ....lots of variables but low component count.

It is possible that this arrangement could react correctly to the condition creating a slightly delayed output on the secondary whch could be sent to the outer rim and returned to the primary.

I remain of the view that the centre torroid is multifilar for electric de coupling/isolation .
Litz wire gives many outputs and inputs with capacitive coupling remainig (no way to avoid that)
If this is sequenced properly and matched properly you woud have a device that would react to its own condition to create rotation..?
This stuff does my head in but its close is some respects .

There are better minds than mine here but  its all about hands on and some form of self oscillation .
Using a cap for the 12v charging it and watching the oscillation die slowly or quickly is practical for working in the dark here.
It was this first video that needed to be "overshadowed" with other info that had no context , by the legal side ..i cant say their name .
The curcuit here would only be a guide to explain but agood start.
Perhaps the brains trust could suggest wiring arrangements to ensure rotation .
The lack of capacitors may be important for balancing at least
the centre torroid may just be back and forth whilr the outer rim is sequecial... brain fade now ....

Hi 3D,
You show a basic inverter circuit in your photo's, I don't see any way to get rotation from it using litz wire or any other configuration the driving signals are at 180 degrees to each other which will only cause a back and forth movement (ac), getting rotation is a little trickier.  Even with a 2 phase 90 degree signal if connections are not correct you will only get a back and forth movement, that's why it is important to put the dots on each coil in the schematic for the start of the wind and if not connected the way I show, you will not get rotation. ;)

Regards
Room

PS for Jim, what I say above applies to your transformer, Tesla toroid.  I say this because Tesla himself showed connections incorrectly in one of his patents so you could be confused by Tesla himself, It took me awhile and a lot of head scratching to figure that one out. O0

room3327

QuotePS for Jim, what I say above applies to your transformer, Tesla toroid.  I say this because Tesla himself showed connections incorrectly in one of his patents so you could be confused by Tesla himself, It took me awhile and a lot of head scratching to figure that one out.

I also built Tesla patent #381970 and the connections are correct however as we can see the switching diagram is not shown in the patent. I suspect that you, like myself, may have used alternative connections with different switching to achieve similar results. It was only after the fact that I realized Tesla was correct however as is often the case he left out the most important details. 

You are also correct that simply alternating two coils will not produce a true field rotation because it is no different that alternately blinking two light bulbs. We should understand that alternately blinking Christmas light may appear as moving in our mind but this is not true in reality. As you say, a simple alternation just moves the fields back and forth which will not produce a true field rotation which requires different effects to force the rotation.

I found it really interesting because it would seem to be a riddle with no apparent answer. So the real question is... how do we produce a unidirectional current in coils of wire on a core with an alternating field without using diodes?. It's always apparent and easy after the fact but getting to that point where our understanding allows us to see the solution for what it is... is seldom easy.

My thinking is that it is not necessarily a problem per se but a riddle, a mystery, which makes our journey to finding the answers all that much more enjoyable. Do you understand?, we need to embrace it, make it our own and enjoy what we do right or wrong.

Regards

Quote from: Allcanadian on 2019.11.03, 23:52:13
room3327
I also built Tesla patent #381970 and the connections are correct however as we can see the switching diagram is not shown in the patent. I suspect that you, like myself, may have used alternative connections with different switching to achieve similar results. It was only after the fact that I realized Tesla was correct however as is often the case he left out the most important details. 

You are also correct that simply alternating two coils will not produce a true field rotation because it is no different that alternately blinking two light bulbs. We should understand that alternately blinking Christmas light may appear as moving in our mind but this is not true in reality. As you say, a simple alternation just moves the fields back and forth which will not produce a true field rotation which requires different effects to force the rotation.

I found it really interesting because it would seem to be a riddle with no apparent answer. So the real question is... how do we produce a unidirectional current in coils of wire on a core with an alternating field without using diodes?. It's always apparent and easy after the fact but getting to that point where our understanding allows us to see the solution for what it is... is seldom easy.

My thinking is that it is not necessarily a problem per se but a riddle, a mystery, which makes our journey to finding the answers all that much more enjoyable. Do you understand?, we need to embrace it, make it our own and enjoy what we do right or wrong.

Regards

Hi AC,
I don't remember which patent was wrong and they are on my, now defunct, old computer.  If I remember correctly I think 381,970 had the correct connections but like I said I don't remember, Sunday night, I'm not feeling like looking them up, sorry.  I do know one patent dealing with this same toroid transformer had wrong connections shown and of course I had to go by it on the first one I built and had to disassemble and unwind the entire transformer to correct it when I finally realized there was no rotation.  A 2 phase AC signal is not exactly a switched input, when you talk switching I think of a DC signal being switched on and off. This uses 2 AC signals 90 degrees out of sync with each other to drive it. I'm curious as to what details Tesla left out? At any rate you know you have rotation when compasses start spinning.  ;D

Room

In order for a rotating magnetic field to be produced
there must be stationary "poles" which are driven
by the "out of phase currents."

The Shaded Pole Induction Motor demonstrates one
of the easiest ways to produce the rotating field.

The Automobile Alternator is a bit more complex in
structure but utilizes the same stationary pole
concept.  The new Brushless Three Phase Motors
which are so popular in models and quad-copters
are another great example of how it is done.

To create a rotating magnetic field in a toroid a
system of strategically placed opposing coils
must be used in order to produce distributed
N-N and S-S poles where the coils oppose.

Quote from: muDped on 2019.11.04, 22:41:44
In order for a rotating magnetic field to be produced
there must be stationary "poles" which are driven
by the "out of phase currents."

The Shaded Pole Induction Motor demonstrates one
of the easiest ways to produce the rotating field.

The Automobile Alternator is a bit more complex in
structure but utilizes the same stationary pole
concept.  The new Brushless Three Phase Motors
which are so popular in models and quad-copters
are another great example of how it is done.

To create a rotating magnetic field in a toroid a
system of strategically placed opposing coils
must be used in order to produce distributed
N-N and S-S poles where the coils oppose.

Hi mudped,

I don't know where you get this but you are wrong,  The easiest way to see it is to use a piece of metal (welding rod) balanced on a pin in the center of the toroid made exactly as I describe and watch it spinning like a motor when it is operating.  So try it and then tell me I'm wrong.  Or do you just talk and not experiment.  Yeah that's what I thought. :(

Room

PS Maybe I misunderstood what you were saying, in that case you should try to be more clear, I'm not sure what that post was about or for.?

Quote from: Room
The easiest way to see it is to use a piece of metal (welding rod)
balanced on a pin in the center of the toroid made exactly as I
describe and watch it spinning like a motor when it is operating.

But how much Torque or Force is developed?

How much "slippage?"

There are practical considerations.

Focus is essential.

Quote from: Room
So try it and then tell me I'm wrong.

That is unnecessary and not really my job. ???

You'll arrive at the Truth on your own. ;)

Keep on keepin' on. 8)

Synchro/Servo Systems are based upon the rotating field
principle.  1X is smooth and quite responsive.  36X offers
great precision.

Much used in Military Weapons Systems.

Quote from: muDped on 2019.11.04, 23:47:28
But how much Torque or Force is developed?

How much "slippage?"

There are practical considerations.

Focus is essential.

That is unnecessary and not really my job. ???

You'll arrive at the Truth on your own. ;)

Keep on keepin' on. 8)

Hi Mudped
  This isn't about torque or force I am not building a motor here we have plenty of those, have you read the whole thread?
  What is your job here, to convert us to your religious beliefs? :-\

  If I was building a motor your questions would be great, to answer them torque is dependent on a number of variables, such as distance from the windings amount of steel used or strength of a magnet that could be used in the center instead, the frequency used etc.  Slippage is dependent on load and the freq. used, the higher the freq. and the larger the load the more slippage is present but I think I covered most of this earlier in the thread and again I am not building another motor I'm sure there are better motor designs then this readily available.  This thread is about trying to discover how the TPU functioned and maybe get us a little closer to it if it was ever real in the first place.  ;D

Regards
Room

As it is possible to create rotating magnetic fields from ring cores having phased coils around its periphery, you effectively have N and S pole regions that move at great speed around the ring.  In that case you may be interested in the possibility of an interaction with the Earth's scalar magnetic field.  Here is a paper I wrote back in 2014.  I may have posted this before on one of the many TPU threads.
Smudge

Quote from: Smudge on 2019.11.05, 16:24:43
As it is possible to create rotating magnetic fields from ring cores having phased coils around its periphery, you effectively have N and S pole regions that move at great speed around the ring.  In that case you may be interested in the possibility of an interaction with the Earth's scalar magnetic field.  Here is a paper I wrote back in 2014.  I may have posted this before on one of the many TPU threads.
Smudge

Hi Smudge,
  Thank you very much for that paper, I have never seen it before.  I won't pretend to understand it all after having only read through it once but it is definitely in line with what I have been trying to do here.  Probably the most pertinent thing I have ever seen concerning this, you sir are a towering intellect in my opinion and I salute you. Please don't hesitate to add your opinion on this at any time! O0

Respectfully and Regards
Room

In order to comprehend how the "TPU" ostensibly "worked"
you must first comprehend Daniel Pomerleau.  There is a
connection.  It is a very simple connection.  To most, it is
an unbelievable connection.

You will not find the answers you seek with Electromagnetics.

There are secret government programs which have the TPU
and more.  Those devices and ships seem to be "alive."

Examine the historical record of those devices which have
mysteriously been "invented" and which have indeed produced
observable "Free Energy."  There are common elements in the
stories.

But, why has it (Overunity or Free Energy) not become
commonplace and widespread?

Because it cannot.

Tesla was brought to ruination because he tried albeit in
a primitive way.  He was a threat to the Big Money Interests.

This World is not at all what it is made to seem to be.

Quote from: Room
What is your job here, to convert us to your religious beliefs? :-\

Sadly, "Religions" are naught more than Cults.

TRUTH is not a "religion."

I have not the power nor the inclination to "convert"
anyone to anything.

That is a function that government has taken upon
itself.  It is doing a bang-up job.

Quote from: muDped on 2019.11.06, 00:44:47
In order to comprehend how the "TPU" ostensibly "worked"
you must first comprehend Daniel Pomerleau.  There is a
connection.  It is a very simple connection.  To most, it is
an unbelievable connection.

You will not find the answers you seek with Electromagnetics.

There are secret government programs which have the TPU
and more.  Those devices and ships seem to be "alive."

Examine the historical record of those devices which have
mysteriously been "invented" and which have indeed produced
observable "Free Energy."  There are common elements in the
stories.

But, why has it (Overunity or Free Energy) not become
commonplace and widespread?

Because it cannot.

Tesla was brought to ruination because he tried albeit in
a primitive way.  He was a threat to the Big Money Interests.

This World is not at all what it is made to seem to be.

Sadly, "Religions" are naught more than Cults.

TRUTH is not a "religion."

I have not the power nor the inclination to "convert"
anyone to anything.

That is a function that government has taken upon
itself.  It is doing a bang-up job.

Hi mudped,

  It's taken me awhile to answer your post because how do I answer it?  Daniel Pomerleau is a retarded person unfortunately maybe an idiot savant who doesn't know and can't tell anyone how his devices work, so how on earth is anyone supposed to comprehend anything related to him.  I don't see any connection between his stuff and this project.  It sounds to me like you are a troll trying your best to stop this thread or change the direction of the conversation. I would respectfully ask you to stop posting in my thread, you are not helping, and I will stop posting in your thread or any of your threads for that matter as I don't see that you have anything to offer anyhow except talk.  So if were agreed on this I won't delete your 'contributions' at this time but don't give me reason to do so in the future.

Regards
Room

Room,

You may do as you wish.

My opinion is not a mandate, but rather simply
an opinion to suggest other manifestations may provide
answers.

The initial response is that nobody seems to know
how or where it comes from.

It is known.  But it is not ours.

You might consider these Questions:

Has Trump, or any other U.S. President ever been to Area 51?

Trump and his predecessors could not visit Area 51.

They were not given access to the Security Classification or
the permission to visit.

Area 51 is not ours, yet it has the answers.

Even if muppet is right ,it does not offer any solutions or any experimental paths .

Im convinced that if we all experiment with field rotation/manipulation we may find an answer.

If the answer turned out to be that only some people can manifest this ,then it would be useful.

Giving an unknown unknoun would only be useful if there was just 1 clarified other wise we have infinity .

Any factual information will help unravel this riddle and most if us are prepared to be surprised.

Politics has no solutions here just deeper problems ,but  everybody likes to put all the unknowns in the same box .
And i do love conspiracy theores but they are fun and imaginative, not fact .

I would like to think that we are evolving .
I would like to thank Room for his contribution to pole rotatation and his diagrams which i am constructing .



We are after all looking for something that is real ,however not well understood.  We all love to learn and laugh .

Im having some challenges with my 2 chinese sig gens getting them to synch properly but i will get there .

OK mudped,
You can post here as long as you keep it relevant,  Daniel Pomerleau doesn't help anyone with anything, maybe if he could articulate what he is doing and how, we could all use him. :)

3D,
I agree and you're welcome. O0

Regards
Room

Apparently this thread is hitting a nerve with someone, the trolls, shills and hacks are coming out in full force to stop it and discredit me.
I hope you are all witnessing this.  We must be on the right track lets keep at it!

Room

Not to stop or discredit what is being done, but to caution
that if you really want it - it may be given you.  The cost
to personal welfare is quite high.  Be prepared.

The mysterious energy is from a source outside our
physical reality.  Certain "Agreements" are irrevocable.

Gaining access to "the source" is not dependent upon
any particular Electromagnetic Phenomenon or Circuitry.

It is a Military Program.  Those in control have more
power than the elected government.

Star Wars is not entirely fiction.

Quote from: muDped on 2019.11.08, 19:51:24
Not to stop or discredit what is being done, but to caution
that if you really want it - it may be given you.  The cost
to personal welfare is quite high.  Be prepared.

The mysterious energy is from a source outside our
physical reality.  Certain "Agreements" are irrevocable.

Gaining access to "the source" is not dependent upon
any particular Electromagnetic Phenomenon or Circuitry.

It is a Military Program.  Those in control have more
power than the elected government.

Star Wars is not entirely fiction.

is this help or is this the opposite?

even the bogieman needs to be defined

Please supply facts if there are any available.

You sound like SM's lawyer in some ways.

True
MuDped
This is a bit more factual or specific than your usual musings

And can sound quite like a threat ...to those not familiar with your
History here!

How can you write with such certainty?

What did you do or see on that Navy ship ?

Honestly Rooms contribution to this forum has been wonderful
And much appreciated .

It does seem as if a few here are pressing his buttons with conflict in mind!
Maybe do something else between commercials ...

Back on track , Muped your posts are thought provoking and Usually useful.
I would be happy to hear of things other than un proven ideas of other dimensions .

The effect Room has noted about the remaining persisting field is very similar to the aspden effect .

It is also present with electronic based divining which does involve the human condition and is a facinating thing that is hard to nail down.

That does not mean that it is an alternate reality or another dimension or communication with the dead or any other such explanations .

BUT it may be a side effect that we are not equiped to measure ....yet .

Please offer facts as chet has asked for ...otherwise help the vortex makers have some fun.
If , as you say it does not depend on configs ..why the warnings?

Respectfully
3D

Thanks room have you deviated from the original circuit? Or have changes mainly being in the windings? I'll be winding a new one and just deciding on core type. Even considering moulding something with a metallic powder and sodium silicate.

MuDped

QuoteNot to stop or discredit what is being done, but to caution
that if you really want it - it may be given you.  The cost
to personal welfare is quite high.  Be prepared.

The mysterious energy is from a source outside our
physical reality.  Certain "Agreements" are irrevocable.

Gaining access to "the source" is not dependent upon
any particular Electromagnetic Phenomenon or Circuitry.

As well, Tesla and many others have said this energy is unique and has a specific energy signature to those skilled in the art. Thus when this energy is generated it is not unlike a beacon in the night for all those who have knowledge of it to see. So what recourse do we have?, build smaller, lower voltage, lower frequency devices which are in fact undetectable within the background noise. There is great power in anonymity.

Did SM have any affiliation with Graham Gunderson?

His Patent Application in 2006 (http://web.archive.org/web/20061212232445/http://www.magneticpowerinc.com/mpi-patentapplication.pdf) is an interesting read.

As with all patent applications the explanations offer
several other embodiments with other configurations.
The theory of operation is similar to the MEG.

Seriously guys when people are trying to work these ot discussions are kinda rude. I have many dumb questions which I don't post because I don't want to add noise to threads. Please adjust your signal to noise ratios.

It's pretty obvious who the bad guys are here, go ahead bad mouth me somemore, It only looks bad for you and the rest who are joining in with you.  You really think we don't know who you are and what you are doing?

Ignorant people!