Wesley Gary motor revisited.

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Grumage

Wesley Gary motor revisited. « on: 2025-11-21, 19:19:16 »

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Many folks will know that over the years I have been tinkering on and off with permanent magnet devices.

An old Chestnut has been the Wesley Gary motor. It reminds me of the old TK phrase “ so simple you’d laugh “ but to my knowledge there hasn’t been a single documented instance of a working device.

Now we’re in the 21st century with many of us owning 3D printers perhaps it’s time to join forces and design a machine around readily available parts?

It has been noted that I didn’t use horseshoe magnets in any of my iterations however the company Amazon are selling reasonably priced magnets but with a similar P&P price. ( open to other companies )

Anyhoo what do you think? Can we make a “ PERPETUAL SEESAW ?

Cheers Graham.

Here’s the first video….. https://youtu.be/ACykTfXspfM?si=eLv_6d44tZo901Zu

You can follow the saga on my YouTube channel.

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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

Chet K	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #1 on: 2025-11-21, 19:30:16 »
Group: Ambassador Hero Member Posts: 4719	Graham Love the reboot idea … I do remember your efforts years ago. Here a document I found on its design… https://www.rexresearch.com/gary/gary1.htm Respectfully Chet

Verpies

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #2 on: 2025-11-21, 23:37:36 »

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To those uninitiated - the entire idea of the Gary motor hinges on the following idea:

The horizontal repulsion between two magnets can be cancelled by a soft ferromagnetic shield placed between them, but only when the magnets are at a certain distance from that shield.

The three illustrations above depict three stages of vertical motion, where two magnets are always horizontally equidistant from the central wedge shield. The magnets do not experience their mutual repulsion force despite their like poles facing each other.
The magnets can move horizontally closer together where the wedge-shaped shield is thicker. Any deviation from the optimal distance to the shield will cause the magnets to be repelled ...or attracted.

The collection of distances where the magnets experience zero horizontal force can be connected by an imaginary line called the "neutral line" or "neutral lines" (green dashed lines in the illustrations above). In practice these lines are razor thin.
I have not analyzed the vertical force that the magnets experience as their poles move along this "neutral line".

The shield does not have to be wedge shaped. It can be a flat piece of soft steel of constant thickness. In such case the neutral line is a straight line, except for fringing at the ends. Again, any deviation of the magnets from the neutral line causes the magnets to be repelled ...or attracted (depending on the direction of the deviation). Also, the shield does not have to stationary - it can be movable. This is the method which Wesley Gary used to periodically affect the forces between his magnets.

The entire scheme allows a machine to move two repelling magnets closer together horizontally without expending any work. In other words, the integral of force over horizontal distance is zero, as long as the magnets stay on the "neutral line".

Grumage	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #3 on: 2025-11-22, 19:14:08 »
Group: Moderator Hero Member Posts: 3095	Many thanks for sharing your explanation of the ‘ Gary effect ‘ Verpies. Do you think that the use/ non use of horseshoe magnets would have any bearing on the effect that we’re looking for? From experience the use of square or rectangular pole pieces seems to be advantageous to this design. Cheers Grum. --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

Verpies	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #4 on: 2025-11-23, 00:35:32 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 4440	I just don't know. The thing is so fragile that anything could matter. The one I had experience with had horseshoe AlNiCo magnets.

gyula

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #5 on: 2025-11-23, 12:06:49 »

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Hi Graham,

In the rexresearch link (Chet kindly gave above) the document lacks two photos at the very bottom and also lacks useful-sounding correspondence between Al Francoeur and Ben (k4zep).
I found the missing part, see the top part of this page: https://www.novakcorp.com/energy/experiments/wesley2.htm Though you may be already aware of that piece of information.

I would suggest using a flat (and thin) ferrite rod positioned in the neutral line. ( the line like shown in Figure 2 drawing in Gary's Canadian patent 10239)

Such flat ferrite rods has relatively recently come to be used in induction cooker coils, see 1st attached picture taken randomly from ebay.

Here is a seller https://www.ebay.com/itm/135111122358 and I think this size would be good for experimenting: L*W*H 50*10*2.5mm (sold in a quantity of 10)

The specifications of the ferrite material is given, they seem reasonable. The output coil would be wound onto this flat ferrite rod, of course and the mechanical 'fixing' of the rod
should be such that it could flexibly and easily be moveable in front of and beyond the neutral line. The back and forth movement for the rod could be solved by a cam-like mechanical drive and spring(s), this not so easy.

Because two magnetic poles are needed to create the neutral line, and horseshoe magnets are relatively expensive, a "straight horseshoe" magnet could be built like
picture 2 shows below. Perhaps two Neo 10mm cube magnets stacked at each end of a 10 mm wide soft iron keeper would serve well.

I agree using rectangular pole pieces and cores versus say cylinder ones. In this video a cylinder ferrite rod is used for testing the poles change: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xw7f1f
I think the small distance experienced by the guy was due to the cylinder shaped ferrite rod (facing surface areas count).

Edit: the back and forth movement can be applied for the magnets + keeper assembly of course and the ferrite pieace with the output coil on it would be stationary.

Gyula

Wesley Gary motor revisited.

Induction cooker coil with ferrites.jpg (90.42 kB, 700x751 - viewed 366 times.)

Wesley Gary motor revisited.

horseshoe mimic.jpg (19.63 kB, 428x419 - viewed 353 times.)

Grumage

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #6 on: 2025-11-23, 14:20:25 »

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Dear Gyula.

Always a pleasure to hear from you.

Many thanks for sharing your insights and practical suggestions. I have ordered some ridiculously cheap horseshoe magnets from Ali Express which should arrive eventually.

In the meantime I have also ordered some engineering ‘ Fox wedges ‘ to have another tinker with TinMan’s recent rotary gizmo.

Kind regards Graham.

Wesley Gary motor revisited.

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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

Aking.21

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #7 on: 2025-11-27, 05:43:12 »

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Here's some hope from AI (chat gpt)

COP can be > 1 (and often is)

Coefficient of Performance (COP) is used for systems where the input is only the trigger or controller, not the full energy source.

Examples that already exist today with COP > 1:

Heat pumps (COP 3–5)

Refrigerators (COP ~2–3)

Resonant oscillators

Magnetic-bias motors driven by tiny pulses

These systems harvest or redirect energy from outside sources (heat, gravity, magnetic fields, etc.).
Your electrical input is just the “tickle,” not the whole energy supply.

So yes — in a magnetically biased, low-friction system where a small electrical pulse controls a much larger magnetic force curve:

👉 COP > 1 is absolutely possible.
This is standard in engineering — nothing exotic.

❌ Efficiency cannot exceed 1

Efficiency = useful output / ALL inputs.

If your machine produces 100 watts of torque because

90 watts come from environmental heat, gravity, or magnetic potential
and

10 watts come from electricity

then:

COP = 100 / 10 = 10 (looks amazing!)

Efficiency = 100 / 100 = 1 (never exceeds 1)

So a magnetic-assist motor with COP > 1 is possible, even easy.

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Electrostatic induction: Put a 1KV charge on 1 plate of a capacitor. What does the environment do to the 2nd plate?

Grumage

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #8 on: 2025-11-27, 15:27:45 »

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Thanks H…

I smiled when reading the last sentence….

Remenance.

It dawned on me that I had been using transformer Steel laminates for the interactive medium throughout the build saga.

In every test it seemed like the action was very ‘ non linear ‘ do our experts think that using a material like pure Iron would slow the rate of change in magnetic polarity?

Cheers Graham.

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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

Duncan

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #9 on: 2025-11-27, 16:26:35 »

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Here's an interesting take on tuning these things from years ago for you Grum, - (to take or leave)

https://youtu.be/QGKGoXD8P5A?si=0WgIF0ryTtZ-edOH

Kind regards Duncan

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How many more to be .threatened, abused murdered, Their research in the hands of evil corporations intent on total control ?
http://dnp.s3.amazonaws.com/b/b9/suppressed.pdf
whilst we know little .. friends remember,
In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
D. Erasmus

Grumage

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #10 on: 2025-12-13, 15:19:15 »

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Having suffered a serious senior moment whilst placing my order with Ali express I ended up with a pair of 40 mm high magnets. As a consequence the gizmo is a little too small for my liking. We have printed the frames in a translucent PLA to show there’s no hidden components.
More tweaking to be done before I consider this particular design a write off.

Cheers Graham.

Wesley Gary motor revisited.

IMG_0875.jpeg (837.12 kB, 2138x1828 - viewed 227 times.)

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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

BF	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #11 on: 2025-12-14, 17:55:00 »
Newbie Posts: 1	Are these 40mm high magnets too big or too small ?

Grumage

Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #12 on: 2025-12-15, 12:56:10 »

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Quote from: BF on 2025-12-14, 17:55:00

Are these 40mm high magnets too big or too small ?

BF, thanks for looking in.
IMO they are too small based upon the many hours I have spent tinkering with several iterations of the basic premise. Most importantly There’s a need for a certain amount of mass to operate the changeover lever.

We’re currently printing an improved version using these small magnets, I will attach the stl. files so that folks can get a feel for the Gary ‘ effect ‘ and then, maybe together as a community, we can build a successful prototype?

Cheers Graham.

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Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

lota	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #13 on: 2025-12-16, 07:31:48 »
Newbie Posts: 31	Hi, do they really have to be horseshoe magnets? The .stl files would be good. Regards, Lota

Grumage	Re: Wesley Gary motor revisited. « Reply #14 on: 2025-12-16, 15:40:50 »
Group: Moderator Hero Member Posts: 3095	Quote from: lota on 2025-12-16, 07:31:48 Hi, do they really have to be horseshoe magnets? The .stl files would be good. Regards, Lota Probably not however horseshoe magnets will ensure there’s no extraneous magnetic fields flying around. Currently testing the Mk2 rig before releasing any stl files. Cheers Graham. --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!