A bulletproof way to power and measure the input to a motor/generator circuit

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Allcanadian

A bulletproof way to power and measure the input to a motor/generator circuit « on: 2026-01-08, 17:55:58 »

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Re-posted from a different thread.

In my setup I used 10F input and output super capacitor banks. The input caps feed the motor and the discharge goes to the output caps. I then use a small boost converter to send all the output right back to the input closing the loop.

It may help to explain the logic...
-we charge the input cap to 24v
-the input cap current feeds the motor drive circuit
-the discharge from the motor goes to the output cap
-a boost converter/joule thief sends all the energy on the output cap right back to the input caps closing the loop with a known efficiency
-the voltage drop on the input caps represents our real time losses or efficiency
-an Arduino monitors the input cap voltage and continually recharges the input cap to 24v from an external supply using a DC/DC converter
-the DC voltage and current from the DC/DC converter to the input caps represents our real time losses and efficiency
-if all the output goes back to the input in a loop then any extra energy we add to the loop to maintain the 24v input represents our real time losses.

I like this setup because it's bullet proof and there is no room for error. Nobody can say there is a measurement error because the system is closed loop and the only input to the system is the DC voltage and current which is easy to measure. Anything can happen within the system like HV spikes, transient effects or weird switching and the input is always a simple DC measurement. DC volts times amps equals watts input.

We can see from the posts here the most popular criticism is possible measurement errors. This system renders any problems others may have a mute point. What would they claim?, were not measuring a simple DC voltage and current correctly?. So this kind of setup solves a lot of problems in my opinion.

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Comprehend and Copy Nature... Viktor Schauberger

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool.”― Richard P. Feynman

Magluvin	Re: A bulletproof way to power and measure the input to a motor/generator circuit « Reply #1 on: 2026-01-08, 18:43:21 »
Group: Mad Scientist Hero Member Posts: 1105	repeat from Lucs thread.... in his case, wouldnt 10f be overdoing it since he is dealing with very low consumption to begin with? mags

Allcanadian

Re: A bulletproof way to power and measure the input to a motor/generator circuit « Reply #2 on: 2026-01-08, 19:11:09 »

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The capacitors could be other values and I wanted a testing setup which could handle many different power levels up to 1000w circuits. The main goal was to develop an infallible testing setup which leaves no room for error. My actual setup is a little different and reduces the input and output to a DC voltage which an Arduino compares and displays in real time as a COP value.

For example, if we applied this setup to gotoluc's motor and it went COP>1 the extra energy to the output cap would be transferred back to the input cap in the loop which would raise the input cap voltage above the DC supply voltage indicating COP>1. In effect, this tells us the loop is now closed in itself because the DC supply current to the circuit is zero.

---------------------------

Comprehend and Copy Nature... Viktor Schauberger

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool.”― Richard P. Feynman

Verpies

Re: A bulletproof way to power and measure the input to a motor/generator circuit « Reply #3 on: 2026-01-08, 20:26:17 »

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Quote from: Allcanadian on 2026-01-08, 17:55:58

In my setup I used 10F input and output super capacitor banks. The input caps feed the motor and the discharge goes to the output caps. I then use a small boost converter to send all the output right back to the input closing the loop.
...
I like this setup because it's bullet proof ...

Please analyze the caps' dielectric-soak contributions, too.

Also, notice that all C2C energy transfers are inherently 50% efficient, as are all attempts to charge capacitors with constant voltage sources.
Conversely, charging capacitors with constant current sources is theoretically 100% efficient.