Akula0083 30 watt self running generator.

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Author Topic: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. (Read 933566 times)

NerzhDishual	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #400 on: 2014-03-30, 23:01:41 »
Group: Guest	Hello Everybody, A single picture: J'ai bon? Я хорошо? Cheers, Jean

Matt Watts	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #401 on: 2014-03-30, 23:31:14 »
Group: Guest	Jean, Your schematic is the premise I started from also. I have to assume the RC network paralleled with D2 is significant. My hunch is this causes a delay that prompts the core to begin ringing. In a typical transformer, the ringing initiated by the MOSFET pulse would quickly dampen out, but with the 95% wrapped foil/shield in there, something "magical" happens. Somehow energy that would normally be trapped and dissipated off gets reversed. For grins, lets say it opens a portal; it captures from within the coils, energy that would otherwise get away from us. What I am pretty certain of is that you must continue to pulse the MOSFET, how often and at what duty cycle I am not clear about. Sorry, I wish I could find better terminology to make sense of this phenomena. I think our only hope is to actively build this device and manipulate it until one of us hits the magic combination, then we all attempt to duplicate that. Eventually I think we will come to understand the fundamental principal at work here, or at least the components that seem to be most critical to its operation. What I'm afraid of are components like those diodes, they may have to have very particular characteristics in order to have a working device.

NerzhDishual	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #402 on: 2014-03-31, 01:26:14 »
Group: Guest	Hi EMdevices, "...another joule thief"? Yes, IMHO, an Xtended one. For those who have the ability to synthesize. ----------------- Hi Matt Watts, Thanks++ for your feedback. Quote from: Matt Watts on 2014-03-30, 23:31:14 ......................................... In a typical transformer, the ringing initiated by the MOSFET pulse would quickly dampen out, but with the 95% wrapped foil/shield in there, something "magical" happens. Somehow energy that would normally be trapped and dissipated off gets reversed. For grins, lets say it opens a portal; it captures from within the coils, energy that would otherwise get away from us. .............................................. This is the kind of (Right Brain) "explanation" that I can "understand"/feel. Thanks again! Yes, IMHO, this "95% wrapped foil" is very important but I also beg to think that the "bucking coils" stuff is also a big clue. ---------------------------------------------- About "bucking coils", you can consult: "Bifilar Coils VS Bucking Coils" http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/bifvsbuk.htm And also: http://freenrg.info/Some_Experiments/Bucking_Coils/ I'm not a Scientist. Anyway, as far as I can catch it: a coil is a sort of spring or can be 'modeled' as such. No? So, you need NRG to compress it. OK? In compensation, it gives you back his NRG, minus some losses. OK? In the "Bucking Coil" configuration (2 springs that are kinda canceling themselves), it seems that you only need few NRG to "compress" them but, in return, these "springs" will give you back the NRG (minus some losses) that would had been necessary to compress them should they were not canceling themselves. Hence, some kinda "OU" behavio(u)r? Or watts? -------------- Now, please, have a look at this picture: It is not exactly the same thing that the (already quoted) JLN's "Bifilar Coils VS Bucking Coils" but, for my part, I can perceive some similarities. ------------------------ A very bad quote from a person that I do not remember whom: "You only need to understand the motive to write the symphony"... Meilleures Salutations, Jean

4Tesla	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #403 on: 2014-03-31, 01:43:17 »
Group: Guest	Quote from: EMdevices on 2014-03-30, 23:24:48 Hi Guys, I've been quite busy and haven't had much time to check the forums. I notice this topic is receiving a lot of attention, so is it worth my time to persue, or is it another joule thief (time thief)? EM Like JT, but high wattage and self-running for a few days (as told by the those on the Russian forums). There aren't too many with circuits built, but I'm sure there will be quite a few in the coming weeks.

From Other Planet	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #404 on: 2014-04-01, 11:00:05 »
Group: Guest	Im pretty sure this thing is not a Joule Thief, at least not an ordinary one. The caps not have enough capacity to supply alone the 494 and Mosfet driver for 1-2 days or more. Maybe the thing gets "out of tune" with time. I believe there is a reason why akula implemented this super complicated automatic tuning system in his big device: http://s6.uploads.ru/2DLk4.jpg

wattsup	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #405 on: 2014-04-01, 13:34:24 »
Hero Member Posts: 520	@ALL GEEZ. I made a mistake and posted before my post was ready. I will post it soon. Sorry. wattsup @all While the circuit boards are in transit maybe I have some side question that will help explain the circuit much better then what we think right now because I was mentally analyzing in a micro second step by step of what is happening in the circuit in order to predict the waveform that one should see when putting a scope probe at certain points in the circuit. This way when the circuit is eventually operational, the waveforms will confirm or cancel what I think is happening. This enables me to grade my own predictions before the effects are on the table, a game I like to play to sharpen my mental equity to work out problems in the mind before doing them on the bench, but either way, questions like WHY will be abundant. Something like, I predict the scope at the L2 will show two sharp rises and one big dip in the first 1/2 cycle of the waveform. If we see this, I know my theory is consistent. hehehe But while doing this, I realized something that just does not click. More often then not, it is when you consider side-examples that may help explain what is happening or what is not known. So, a small mental exercise...... if you take two transformers each on their own core, put the primaries in series, then add a dc bulb (not an LED) in series to the second primary (forget the secondaries) your are left with two open ends. With a battery you put the positive to the open end of the first primary and the negative to other end of the dc bulb. Now looking at this very rudimentary scene, we already know that to light up the bulb, it has to have a positive and a negative signal reaching both of its respective connection points otherwise no light. Right or wrong. Has to be right. Right? So the question is this. We know the bulb is getting the negative side because it is connected directly to it. But on the other side, we also know the positive has to pass the two primary coils to reach the bulb for it to light up. Does this mean both coils are fully immersed in the positive side of the energy source? hehehe Yes we already know the bulb will not be as bright going through both primaries because of the internal resistance of the windings but regardless of that lower output, is the positive signal in all the primaries is the question? What test or measurement process can be done to show this answer without fuzzing up the logic that will irrevocably prove if the coils are fully positive or not? Do you see the quandary. Yes very elementary indeed but it is still a very real problem to consider. Are our instruments so limited that we could never prove this or disprove this. I think this is the grey area we see being capitalized in the Akula circuit where if when the battery is first connected, the positive passes through the L1 while going to the load. But then, if there is positive after L1 to reach the load, how can the mosfet switch, where I figure the mosfet is an NPN? Should it not be a PNP instead? If the out of the L1 is positive, then the mosfet is creating a straight short between the L1 output and the load. If that short on the L1 out is positive hitting the ground via the mosfet, then this has to be Tesla Ozone based, and the inductance of L1 will load the polarized C3 after the diode clips off any negative spikes resulting from the short. This means the L1 primary is fully positive biased, whereas if the coil was connected directly to the battery, half the coil would be positive biased and the other half negative biased. It has to be. But how can that be that an NPN mosfet is passing a positive signal to ground? Or is it that when the mosfet is closed, the negative signal is reversing through the mosfet diode and entering to take up its half of the L1 coil. If that is the case then this shows that both the positive and negative signals have a forward momentum (I'm using this term for simplicity because spin conveyance explains this so well but it is not yet in the discussion books - hehehe). It seems to me that there is something missing in how we see energy transferring in the most fundamental effect that has cloaked our eyes to the real effects. It's hard to explain but the Akula circuit is playing with these effects and if we have no vocabulary or insight to explain it, we may be stuck in the present limbo we find ourselves in with standard EE logic. So for me to understand this device will require some new brain cells being activated with a new type of logic. Hmmmm. Imagine that I have not even integrated the effect to the L2 yet and already there are hard questions to answer. Everything is based on how the positive and negative signal will interplay in the circuit and how this shifts the north/south polarities of the fields inside the coils and over the core. Am I ready for the asylum because I am the only one that sees this or does this make any sense to you guys? I'll be in the office all day so keep on truck'in. wattsup « Last Edit: 2014-04-01, 15:14:19 by wattsup » --------------------------- http://etherimpress.com

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #406 on: 2014-04-01, 16:47:26 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	OMG Wattsup. What you wrote is sooooo confusing. Can you rewrite it so every time you write about electric potentials you specify two points between which these potentials are measured? e.g. when you write that something is "positive", please also write the reference that this something is positive to, because the same point that is positive in respect to one reference can also be negative to another reference, at the same time. P.S. When fully turned on, MOSFETs conduct in both directions between source and drain, regardless whether they are P-Channel or N-Channel devices.

NerzhDishual	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #407 on: 2014-04-01, 19:31:45 »
Group: Guest	Hi From Other Planet, Thanks for your picture commented in Russian. http://s6.uploads.ru/2DLk4.jpg According to Google: "С учетам моментов времени в процессе работы которых создается ЯМР! means: Taking into account the time points in the process which creates NMR! NMR?? Nuclear Magnetic resonance and "Испытания проводились в лаборатории при институте по изучению ядерной энергетики" means: Tests were conducted in the laboratory at the Institute for the Study of Nuclear Energy. and: "по адресу касахстан г курчатов парк ядерных технологий" means: At (=care of) kasahstan g Kurchatov nuclear park technology According to google, too: http://cryptome.org/eyeball/kurchatov/kurchatov.htm Kurchatov, Kazakhstan Nuclear Research Facilities ------------- Yeah, if wee need some "Nuclear Research Facilities" we are not out of the woods. R we? ------- Anyway, a little sim: The code is in the attached file. Bien le bonjour, Jean ------------------------ One-Small-Sim.txt (1.28 kB - downloaded 241 times.)

Grumage	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #408 on: 2014-04-01, 20:49:09 »
Group: Moderator Hero Member Posts: 2741	Dear Verpies. Please find attached scope shot of current from L2 using an unknown output non calibrated CT on Ch1. Voltage spikes on Ch2 (5 v/cm X 100 ) Ch3 (0.5 v/cm X 100 ) Signal as seen on L1 with respect to ground Cheers Grum. ------------------------ Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. ss1.JPG (1654.99 kB, 2592x1936 - viewed 1944 times.) --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #409 on: 2014-04-01, 21:17:28 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 19:31:45 Yeah, if wee need some "Nuclear Research Facilities" we are not out of the woods. R we? We don't need a big institute. NMR can be had on a table top. "Nuclear" is just a scare word in the context of this circuit. Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 19:31:45 Anyway, a little sim: That sim has several qualitative differences from the Akula circuit. The largest one being that the LED can be lit directly from the power supply, but in the Akula circuit the load LEDs cannot be lit directly from the power supply (C11). The next difference is the ground connection to L2, that completely bypasses the load. Why did you create the abridged and inaccurate sim if a more complete one was already posted in this thread here ? « Last Edit: 2014-04-01, 22:14:32 by verpies »

Peterae	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #410 on: 2014-04-01, 21:22:50 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3867	Quote "С учетам моментов времени в процессе работы которых создается ЯМР! means: Taking into account the time points in the process which creates NMR! I knew it was only time

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #411 on: 2014-04-01, 21:30:54 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: Grumage on 2014-04-01, 20:49:09 Please find attached scope shot of current from L2 If I had a scopeshot like that from a working device, I would be able to replicate it in one day with the same core ;(

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #412 on: 2014-04-01, 21:41:47 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: Peterae on 2014-04-01, 21:22:50 I knew it was only time The two conditions of TL494's negative feedback loop ( dv/dt<x && v<0 ) are consistent with beta current pulses, since the physics of such pulses makes their edges very steep and their polarity negative relative to the stimulating/confining pulses. Also, the copper shield would come in handy in collecting the deccelerated fast-electrons, which would otherwise cause heavy negative charge buildup and associated HV insulation breakdown. The usual electronic operational principles prevent the Akula's circuit and transformer from exceeding unity O/I power ratio, unless something unconventional happens in that transformer. The conventional behavior of the transformer in this circuit is pretty accurately illustrated by the simulations posted in this thread. « Last Edit: 2014-04-01, 22:23:13 by verpies »

Peterae	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #413 on: 2014-04-01, 21:48:16 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3867	Copper or Aluminium ? you realize a MnZn fettire core has a real deep skin depth.

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #414 on: 2014-04-01, 21:54:44 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: Peterae on 2014-04-01, 21:48:16 Copper or Aluminium ? For the shield? Quote from: Peterae on 2014-04-01, 21:48:16 you realize a MnZn fettire core has a real deep skin depth. Fuzzily. Was MnZn the ferrite in reference to which you (or someone else) had corrected me about its resistivity?

Peterae	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #415 on: 2014-04-01, 22:00:54 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3867	Quote For the shield? Yes Shield Thats right better memory than me

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #416 on: 2014-04-01, 22:17:30 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	If MnZn is the ferrite with higher resistivity, then its skin depth must be deeper as a consequence. Quote from: Peterae on 2014-04-01, 22:00:54 Yes, shield I think copper foil is more convenient as an electric shield.

NerzhDishual	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #417 on: 2014-04-01, 22:22:40 »
Group: Guest	My dear Verpies, Quote from: verpies on 2014-04-01, 21:17:28 .................. That sim has several qualitative differences from the Akula circuit. ....................... The largest one being that the LED can be lit directly from the power supply, but in the Akula circuit the load LEDs cannot be lit directly from the power supply (C11). The next one is the ground connection to L2, that completely bypasses the load ? ......... Why did you create the abridged and inaccurate sim if a more complete one was already posted in this thread. ........ Answers: It is not the Akula CCT. I just titled it "One-Small-Sim". No? Why? Just because: 1) My abridged and inaccurate sim, indeed, lits the LEDS via the power supply, but can show some "self sustaining" behavior during about one minute (new version). 2) The more complete sim also lits the the LEDS via the power supply and can show no "self sustaining" behavior (not even one second). Did you test it? Now, if you believe that "I Am One Too Many Here", please just ban me if you can or get me excluded... Basta! and Va revr gant al laboused bihan... Le bonjour chez vous, Jean

Peterae	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #418 on: 2014-04-01, 22:27:41 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3867	Quote If MnZn is the ferrite with higher resistivity I thought MnZn was low resistance, OK i will try to check. Quote I think copper foil is more convenient as an electric shield. How about Beta Shield, Copper or Aluminium.?

Grumage	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #419 on: 2014-04-01, 22:32:58 »
Group: Moderator Hero Member Posts: 2741	Quote from: verpies on 2014-04-01, 22:17:30 If MnZn is the ferrite with higher resistivity, then its skin depth must be deeper as a consequence. Dear Verpies. I have just checked my core material resistance at approx. 10K ohms. Any help ?? Magnetic Characteristics: uiac = 2100 AL Value = 4100 (+ 30% / -20%) Cheers Grum. --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

Peterae	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #420 on: 2014-04-01, 22:35:44 »
Group: Administrator Hero Member Posts: 3867	NerzhDishual We like you being here, you dont want out do you? PS NiZn ferrites exhibit higher resistivity than MnZn

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #421 on: 2014-04-01, 22:37:10 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 22:22:40 It is not the Akula CCT. I just titled it "One-Small-Sim". No? If your circuit is not relevant to Akula's circuit then my comparison with it was meaningless Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 22:22:40 2) The more complete sim also lits the the LEDS via the power supply Only for half a second during the ON transient, due to L1 and C3 forming a series LCR circuit with R5, R1 and D1. When the VT1 switch is not operating, the LEDs will not be lit after 500ms. ...in your circuit they will be lit even if the switch is not operating. Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 22:22:40 ...and can show no "self sustaining" behavior (not even one second). Did you test it? Yes, the conventional operation of these circuits is not self-sustaining and its O/I energy ratio is under unity. I already wrote this explicitly. Powering LEDs with capacitors does not count. Quote from: NerzhDishual on 2014-04-01, 22:22:40 Now, if you believe that "I Am One Too Many Here", please just ban me if you can or get me excluded... You will not be banned by opposing my arguments or disagreeing with me. I think only Ad Hominem remarks, profanity or selling Viagra would ban you from here.

Grumage	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #422 on: 2014-04-01, 22:45:26 »
Group: Moderator Hero Member Posts: 2741	Here is the full specification for the cores I am using. Cheers Grum. ------------------------ CF139.pdf (236.49 kB - downloaded 489 times.) --------------------------- Nanny state ? Left at the gate !!

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #423 on: 2014-04-01, 22:49:32 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: Grumage on 2014-04-01, 22:32:58 I have just checked my core material resistance at approx. 10K ohms. Any help ?? AL Value = 4100 It's the best you can do without a spectrometer. The resistivity is normally measured across a 1cm³ cube with 1cm² wet electrodes (the electrode area matters very much in this measurement). Peterae seems to be looking at ferrite material characteristics now and he can probably identify its composition with these values.

verpies	Re: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator. « Reply #424 on: 2014-04-01, 22:53:25 »
Group: Professor Hero Member Posts: 3376	Quote from: Grumage on 2014-04-01, 22:45:26 Here is the full specification for the cores I am using. So it is a ~½T MnZn ferrite with 2100μ_r r.permeability and 8Ωm resistivity (800Ω/cm) « Last Edit: 2014-04-02, 01:15:48 by verpies »

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