This is a public thread for STEAP and the TPU (Steven Mark).
It has taken me a long time and a lot of money to find out how this works.
Most of this I have published before in a private thread, but this time I will not make you work for an end result, the missing links will be explained. What I post are SCHEMATICS and not always a working electronic diagram, what you get is the principle of function, the rest you build yourself.
The first thing to remember is C1 is made up of the solenoids wound over the loop CORE (ground plate of a capacitor). The solenoid coils form the other plate, there is no induction between the solenoids and the CORE COIL, it is a varying capacitance, a very special capacitance.
SM probably used all P-type MOSFETs, but I use N-type and MOSFET "B" is high side switching.
C2 is that rather expensive HV capacitor seen in his videos.
The switching sequence is such that "A" and "C" are never ever on at the same time as "B", timing is everything as SM said.
The D blocking diode is representative of two diodes at the positive end of the charge chokes.
The run cap is just that, you charge it to start the generator, you need an automatic safety switch to turn this OFF (temperature and over-voltage).
Please note the connection sequence of the solenoid coils, remember they go around in a toroidal shape.
The discharge curves are representative only, in the real unit running there are multiple HF resonances between charges, so many they overlap.
Regards
Mike 8)
Awesome work Mike O0 Thanks for sharing.
This does need a battery to kick start it?
Quote from: e2matrix on 2021.11.11, 17:02:43
Awesome work Mike O0 Thanks for sharing.
This does need a battery to kick start it?
A charged capacitor
Regards
Mike 8)
This is probably the last post until next week as I will be away.
What you have to remember is there are 3 solenoid coils that have a center tapping and are wound on top of one another. Each of these coils has a different inductance and due to the distance of each to the ground loop (the other plate) will have different capacitance. These coils should be wound with as much accuracy as possible so as the ratio of capacitance and inductance with one another is as uniform as possible, e.g. the inductance difference of a to c should be the same as from c to b. The capacitance of the ground loop to "a" coil will be higher than "c" coil to the ground loop, the lowest capacitance to the ground loop will be "b", the highest frequency, the 3rd harmonic.
What does this do to the resonant frequencies! Well they will be near harmonics to one another, similar to the drive frequencies, but up in the MHz, but it will not matter what frequencies, the important part is the recurring beat frequency between the "A" and "C" drives at the 1st and 2nd harmonic level, they are synchronised, "A" and "C" start together but "C" has an extra pulse slightly faster than the second harmonic of "A", the difference is the beat frequency (well known at audio levels in music). This beat is around 7,83Hz the first harmonic of the Schumann resonance, this is our reaction frequency.
Regards
Mike 8)
Here is an experimental setup . with 3 isolated supplies .
It may need only 2 and eventually none .
I have used a different approach with a 4011 and a 3 channel dds ..the 4011 Nand gates ensure that the conditional logic is in compliance before the fet drivers (3120)regardless of the 3 dds inputs state.
If compliance is not obeyed mosfets fry quickly .
I'm using the dds fy8300 which is made ground independent .
The silicone wire is a little pricey but now is a good time to stock up on it because supplies will run out .
Aliexpress have some black sheathed 4 core silicone which is the cheapest source at this time.
Topology is variable and I am of the opinion that a circle may not be important .
Remember "Nikola tesla the man who held lightning in his hands"
Nice work so far.
Did SM change his mind about the electronics have to be inside the torus? Perhaps that's the eventual plan.
Quote from: Jerry Volland on 2021.11.12, 19:54:03
Nice work so far.
Did SM change his mind about the electronics have to be inside the torus? Perhaps that's the eventual plan.
Welcome Jerry
Regards
Mike 8)
I think that there were three reasons for the electronics in the center
1. Space
2. Possible interference for the electronics
3. To make it more deceptive as to how it works
Nº2 I don't think so as the solenoids shield the plasma inside.
Regards
Mike 8)
If anyone has played with a SLINKY toy it will give you a little idea of how this works.
Regards
Mike 8)
Here is a link to how a class E amplifier works.
This is because the TPU works in a similar way, SM had combined the C1 into the inductor.
Not only that, he created a frequency mixer with a 1st and very near 2nd harmonic injection, giving a beat frequency output.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ayu4a_h69U
Regards
Mike 8)
Now to enlighten you a little more
Regards
Mike 8)
Synchronisation, see attached
regards
Mike 8)
Hi Centraflow!
Does your comment allude to a magnetic compression wave traveling the TPU ring?
I'm self-alluded here, but this concept haunts me that... the magnetic flux paths of a successful device will be closed, as open flux paths eat a lot of efficiency. The TPU is closed-path compliant.
And if slinky-like flux-density over time varies in the TPU then <-- per my amateur brain tortured by alien science --> an Aharonov-Bohm wave is the vehicle promoting the effects that violate Maxwellian equations of modern engineering.
An A-B effect needs imaginary numbers to explain how flux density with no polarity works (think flux ring with no outer poles, ororboro flux for this mind experiment). I'm not a scientist or engineer, just woodworker intuitions of a splintered mind.
Bucking magnetic coils are creating a magnetic flux-density (in abstract : more/less 'flux lines' per some unit area changing over time... a flux-line compression wave, a traffic wave, a bow wave, a shear tide)
The contents of flux-density-waves is more energy contained in denser flux 'lines.' It is an energy-content per-location oscillation, as words seem to link together to share.
Perhaps the TPU is using the magnetic envelop as the working tool for the outcome.
Slinkies make FM waves. Density waves chirp something if they encounter regularity. Tweak the chirp into full bloom. The chirp in principle on a ring must have density variations if the ring velocity is in the neighborhood of the cycles in the chirp. I.e., the chirp WILL have asymmetric nodes (logarithmic spacing like antenna elements). Oroboro-ish, chirp amplitude decay as the ring proceeds. Juggling density organizing chirps in a sideways resonance wrapped around the ring over time into a convolution of the driving signal.
Therefore, the chirp-activating coils will need adjustable spacing to manually tweak for the sweet spot, where the chirp becomes a power klaxon <-- if any intuitive design can be harvested. Have at. A design that is operating on a asymmetric reflection in the LC tank established on a quadrature design (non-step phased) <-- then the activating coils when symmetrically arranged would in the intuitive principle (thought experiment) to be activated at a chirped-sequence over time, i.e., asymmetry in the driver pulses, verses asymmetric design driven by pulses at a fixed rate in time.
Regards,
DonEM
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.11.15, 19:12:42
If anyone has played with a SLINKY toy it will give you a little idea of how this works.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: XenoEngineering on 2021.11.18, 11:17:46
Hi Centraflow!
Does your comment allude to a magnetic compression wave traveling the TPU ring?
I'm self-alluded here, but this concept haunts me that... the magnetic flux paths of a successful device will be closed, as open flux paths eat a lot of efficiency. The TPU is closed-path compliant.
And if slinky-like flux-density over time varies in the TPU then <-- per my amateur brain tortured by alien science --> an Aharonov-Bohm wave is the vehicle promoting the effects that violate Maxwellian equations of modern engineering.
An A-B effect needs imaginary numbers to explain how flux density with no polarity works (think flux ring with no outer poles, ororboro flux for this mind experiment). I'm not a scientist or engineer, just woodworker intuitions of a splintered mind.
Bucking magnetic coils are creating a magnetic flux-density (in abstract : more/less 'flux lines' per some unit area changing over time... a flux-line compression wave, a traffic wave, a bow wave, a shear tide)
The contents of flux-density-waves is more energy contained in denser flux 'lines.' It is an energy-content per-location oscillation, as words seem to link together to share.
Perhaps the TPU is using the magnetic envelop as the working tool for the outcome.
Slinkies make FM waves. Density waves chirp something if they encounter regularity. Tweak the chirp into full bloom. The chirp in principle on a ring must have density variations if the ring velocity is in the neighborhood of the cycles in the chirp. I.e., the chirp WILL have asymmetric nodes (logarithmic spacing like antenna elements). Oroboro-ish, chirp amplitude decay as the ring proceeds. Juggling density organizing chirps in a sideways resonance wrapped around the ring over time into a convolution of the driving signal.
Therefore, the chirp-activating coils will need adjustable spacing to manually tweak for the sweet spot, where the chirp becomes a power klaxon <-- if any intuitive design can be harvested. Have at. A design that is operating on a asymmetric reflection in the LC tank established on a quadrature design (non-step phased) <-- then the activating coils when symmetrically arranged would in the intuitive principle (thought experiment) to be activated at a chirped-sequence over time, i.e., asymmetry in the driver pulses, verses asymmetric design driven by pulses at a fixed rate in time.
Regards,
DonEM
Hi DonEM
First off, I am a strong believer that energy can not be formed from anything, only transformed from another form of energy, the STEAP TPU is such a beast. We use energy to extract from another form of energy and come out with more than we used.
The STEAP TPU which as far as I can see is not my invention, but many years at looking at how Steven Mark built it to extract ambient charge, that same charge that we all have felt when we have been shocked by a discharge from our body to a lower potential such as a metal gate (it does not have to be grounded).
We are swimming in this type of charge, the charge that is between the Ionosphere and our Earth, the charge that builds up so much it discharges as lightning from various potential differences such as cloud to cloud or cloud to ground, etc.
To extract this ENERGY we need to use the same form as this energy is stored. This charge is as in a capacitor, an AC capacitor as sometimes the lightning goes from the ground towards the "sky". The frequency of change within this capacitor is the well-known Schumman frequency (7.83Hz) which is caused by these discharges around the world.
To extract some of this charge we have to create a similar ambient for mixing these charges together and then extracting at a particular time. The ambient is for all intent and purpose a plasma, the plasma I use is a dielectric discharge plasma (DBD) which you can't even see with the naked eye at the level I am talking about here.
Follow the thread and if you want to, ask questions, as SM said, it is not rocket science.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.11.12, 02:32:24
Here is an experimental setup . with 3 isolated supplies .
It may need only 2 and eventually none .
I have used a different approach with a 4011 and a 3 channel dds ..the 4011 Nand gates ensure that the conditional logic is in compliance before the fet drivers (3120)regardless of the 3 dds inputs state.
If compliance is not obeyed mosfets fry quickly .
I'm using the dds fy8300 which is made ground independent .
The silicone wire is a little pricey but now is a good time to stock up on it because supplies will run out .
Aliexpress have some black sheathed 4 core silicone which is the cheapest source at this time.
Topology is variable and I am of the opinion that a circle may not be important .
Remember "Nikola tesla the man who held lightning in his hands"
The 4011 is probably a better way but you need the ability of the 4047's to be swiched in a gated and compliment gated way to get the sequence right , look at the "B" switching.
Not much time this end atm, so many family problems here.
Regards
Mike 8)
I will be drawing up a new drive circuit incorporating the NAND gates (CD4011) to replace the LMC660 over the next few days.
Lindsay, remember that the "C" clock must be DUTY corrected before "A" and "B" triggering. Duties are "C" = 16.66%, "A" = 8.33%, "B" = 25% +- X2 and X3 like the frequencies.
LOOK AT HOW THE ON TIMES FIT IN WITH THE OFF TIMES.
The second ON of "B" is collecting chargeback and going to C3 before C3 supplies power to the front end to continue the cycle.
I did say be careful what you are looking at on the ON-OFF pulse sync diagram, and why "A" and "C" can be ON or OFF with one another but "B" can NEVER be ON with either "A" or "C"
Forget about SM saying that it is running at around 5KHz, that really is very very misleading as I found out. If you ping an LCR circuit that has a resonant frequency of say 80KHz, with a square wave of 5KHz or even 1KHz, it will still resonate at 80KHZ. Everyone over these many years were looking at the wrong point about the frequencies, it really is all about timing, or in the audio business the BEAT.
Regards
Mike 8)
@ 3D Magnetics
Work in progress
Regards
Mike 8)
The attachment in post 11 has been replaced with a better description
Thank you Tony for this, it explains exactly what is happening. Tony is a builder on this forum. "Ainachara"
Regards
Mike 8)
Here are the new electronics using NAND gates (CD4011). Please note the red inscription at the bottom.
Attached is also the driver's schematic which has two supplies from batteries, atm I'm not sure of any other way of doing this drive as the "B" MOSFET takes a lot of hammering and a P MOSFET might not stand up to this.
The CMC, that is both charge chokes are in common mode (flux adding) is important, "why", so as the charge for both "A" and "C" are "equal", the only difference required is in the delay across "a" solenoid coil (inductive impedance).
If anyone sees any mistake, let me know, my eyes aren't as good as they used to be :(
Regards
Mike 8)
The last post came with the wrong schematic, it has now been corrected
Sorry about that
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.11.22, 12:09:47
Here are the new electronics using NAND gates (CD4011). Please note the red inscription at the bottom.
Attached is also the driver's schematic which has two supplies from batteries, atm I'm not sure of any other way of doing this drive as the "B" MOSFET takes a lot of hammering and a P MOSFET might not stand up to this.
The CMC, that is both charge chokes are in common mode (flux adding) is important, "why", so as the charge for both "A" and "C" are "equal", the only difference required is in the delay across "a" solenoid coil (inductive impedance).
If anyone sees any mistake, let me know, my eyes aren't as good as they used to be :(
Regards
Mike 8)
Comments on "Isolated drivers with High side switching for B Mosfet.png"
I prefer push-pull switching between drivers (VOD3120) because push-pull switching allows high driver currents. The resistor-diode network determines the switching times of the output stage (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gate-Treiber (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gate-Treiber)).
For the B-driver this is to be applied in exactly the same way. In my opinion, there is no need for a 1kΩ resistor to the source of the Mosfet B.
At the output of C3 you have drawn 2 diodes. This causes a halving of the current through one diode as a parallel circuit. I also thought about whether one diode should be connected to V+ of CMC A and the other to V+ of CMC C.
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.11.22, 13:57:22
Comments on "Isolated drivers with High side switching for B Mosfet.png"
I prefer push-pull switching between drivers (VOD3120) because push-pull switching allows high driver currents. The resistor-diode network determines the switching times of the output stage (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gate-Treiber (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gate-Treiber)).
For the B-driver this is to be applied in exactly the same way. In my opinion, there is no need for a 1kΩ resistor to the source of the Mosfet B.
At the output of C3 you have drawn 2 diodes. This causes a halving of the current through one diode as a parallel circuit. I also thought about whether one diode should be connected to V+ of CMC A and the other to V+ of CMC C.
Hi Toni
Yes but I found a problem with only one diode to a joint V+ chokes connection, the chokes current goes in the same direction but the voltage changes polarity. Starts + when charging and changes to - when discharging, the problem occurs when "C" switches on it's own and the "a" coil delay.
Driving the Mosfets is up to anyone what they want to do. I don't think SM used very sophisticated drives, the electronics were very compact, and I am sure he had a lot of problems with this and his continual tunning before demonstrations.
When looping, the voltage across the C1 is thousands of volts, it is then the plasma forms. C1 and C2 are in series when "B" is on, this becomes a voltage divider and how the voltage is controlled so as not to run away. The voltage on C3 will be in the region of 150-200v.
Great work on what you sent me O0
Regards
Mike 8)
PS. I'm the layman in electronics, your the qualified expert.
The TPU works with 3 frequencies, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd harmonics as square wave drive frequencies. Now SM let people think that the 1st frequency, the lowest, was the base for the other frequencies in a form of "A" X 2.1+- = "C" frequency, and "B" frequency was "A" X 3.2+-. That like a lot of things with SM was misleading, and I will tell you why.
Whatever frequency input into the LCR of the TPU, as long as it is a square wave considerably lower than the resonant frequency (low Khz), it will resonant at its natural resonant frequency. So why the 2.1 and 3.2+-, well he really was talking about "the duty cycles", which will be the pinging timing of the inputs. The frequencies are exact harmonics, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, but the ON and OFF times are the parts that have to be tuned.
The second harmonic is the control frequency "C", so the 1st harmonic is half this frequency "A", and "B" is the 3rd harmonic. An example is "A" at 2500Hz, "C" at 5000Hz, and "B" at 7500Hz. The "C" is the control frequency and as so it should be reasonably close to a very low sub-harmonic of the resonant frequency of the TPU, the closer it is the less inter-reaction that can take place, but this is quite tolerable with very low pinging frequencies in relation to the resonant frequencies, someplace between 1500Hz and 15000Hz or less.
The tuning thereafter is the ON and OFF timing for the Mosfets (duty), but it must be remembered that "A" and "C" can be ON together but "B" can never be ON with either "A" or "C", and I will keep on reminding everyone of this.
Steven Mark was very misleading, by accident or on purpose, the latter I believe.
Regards
Mike 8)
Great work Mike
Perhaps Pulse repetition rate and pulse width should be the terms used, at least in my head.
Where does the 7.8 hz come into play in this description?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.11.24, 03:16:22
Great work Mike
Perhaps Pulse repetition rate and pulse width should be the terms used, at least in my head.
Where does the 7.8 hz come into play in this description?
It's in the beat between the extreamly close resonances made by the coils and C1. The beat is the difference between one peak and the next, it was staring us in the face. If you apply two very close frequencies in a plasma within a glass tube you will see rings which are the beat. I have a video of that somewhere if I can find it.
Regards
Mike 8)
The question of creating a plasma trapped by a magnetic field is always subject to the mean free paths of the particles, and the ability of the field to contain even particles that would tend to escape the field, through multiple collisions. A charged particle goes in a circular motion around the magnetic flux lines, and its motion parallel to the lines is only affected by an increase in the value of the magnetic field since this would cause the magnetic flux lines to come closer. When this happens, the particle is reflected. This configuration happens in the magnetosphere, the plasma around the earth trapped inside Earth's magnetic field eg. ( The Van Allen Radiation Belt ).
At atmospheric pressure, the particles undergo collisions in their motion around the magnetic flux lines, and each collision makes them "jump" from one "circle" to another, causing them to diffuse perpendicular to the magnetic field, and perpendicular to the ground core of our solenoids, a thing that was impossible without collisions because of the constraining property of the magnetic field. The electrons are not completely confined, their density in the region of containment is still orders of magnitude higher than outside that region, but may have been of concern when Steven Mark had a visit from the Nuclear agency in the USA.
When particles are confined by a magnetic field, they circle in a characteristic radius equal to the gyroradius( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyroradius )of that couple magnetic field/particle. Unless you have tremendously high magnetic fields, or impossibly small speeds ( to ignite a plasma, electrons need speed, or they recombine fast), this gyroradius will be a lot more than microns. This means, finally, that your particles are not at all contained by the magnetic field, but rather by the speed of the decay of the plasma, they will usually recombine faster than they will escape the field.
In the TPU application of plasma, this fast recombination is not the case, the Atmospheric Dielectric Plasma, or DBD, which is bi-temperature, non-equilibrium plasma, is a cold gas plasma. This plasma consumes a lot less energy than the hot plasma and has proven plasma lifetimes high enough to observe "balls" of plasma, drifting together with the gas flow (simple mechanical flow) until a few tenths of centimeters. These "balls" of plasma are mostly rich in radicals, i.e. species, created by the plasma, that "should not exist" in the neutral gas because they have very short lifetimes. These radicals are used in plasma chemistry, material transformation, and why it is used to treat anything that can be "treated" by such radicals.
I have shown in the TPU that the core of the solenoids is a plate of a capacitor "C1", and that the inside surface of the solenoid coils is the other plate of "C1" (collector core is perpendicular to the solenoid coil, no induction, only capacitance). The way that the solenoid coils are connected to one another, a type of resonant delay line is created as the plasma on the surface of the dielectric passes through the solenoids. This delay creates movements of around a few Hz through the solenoids, this is the washboard effect that was talked about as movement felt within the TPU of Steven Mark.
See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetosphere_particle_motion
Regards
Mike 8)
Attached is a clarification of the 1st post schematic which was revision 2.8. I have had emails concerning the C1 plate connected to the "A" drain.
Well, that was a representation of the plate, the plate is all the coils perpendicular to the core and the other plate is the core. This is very important for anyone to understand how this works, there is an infinite variable capacitance between the core and the inside of the coils.
Regards
Mike 8)
Thanks Mike,
This seems to infer that the collector/ground is one "plate" ,the coils being the other .
Is the internal plate, collector and ground still a part of the topology?
One of them seems to have been deleted ...which makes more sense of the explanation.
It also fits with my burst of misunderstood success earlier.
What do think about using aluminum plate for the ground and would you suggest a closed ring or an open(cut) ring?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.11.26, 04:11:13
Thanks Mike,
This seems to infer that the collector/ground is one "plate" ,the coils being the other .
Is the internal plate, collector and ground still a part of the topology?
One of them seems to have been deleted ...which makes more sense of the explanation.
It also fits with my burst of misunderstood success earlier.
What do think about using aluminum plate for the ground and would you suggest a closed ring or an open(cut) ring?
The aluminum plate has been used, you only have seen SM's once, the speaker mounts, they get hot quickly.
You have to use the silicon insulated wire which will withstand 200c. The coils and core have to be this or it will not last long, the insulation will break down.
Wind your loop core and join the ends together, that is your TPU ground. The coils wound over the top are first a, then C, and last b.
The wire lengths get longer but the wound coil lengths are the same "they are ratios". The coils are center tapped if winding a large diameter Toroid, or the smaller diameter Toroid is a c b in one and a1 C1 b1 in the other and mounted on top of one another. Remember all coils are wound in the same direction, there are no bucking coils.
All coi connections must not be too close to the core connections or YOU WILL HAVE ARC Over.
The plasma forms between the inside of the coils and the outside of the core.
Typing on my phone as away this morning, back later
Regards
Mike 8)
Attached is the wire to be used, 14 awg
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.11.26, 08:05:07
The wire lengths get longer but the wound coil lengths are the same "they are ratios". The coils are center tapped if winding a large diameter Toroid, or the smaller diameter Toroid is a c b in one and a1 C1 b1 in the other and mounted on top of one another. Remember all coils are wound in the same direction, there are no bucking coils.
The naming of the order of the windings (a, c, b) is new information for me, Mike. Now I have another question (see picture: Start means the beginning of the winding.): How did you arrange the small toroids on top of each other? According to variation 1 or variation 2? Or does that not matter in your opinion?
Thx Toni
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.11.27, 13:11:20
The naming of the order of the windings (a, c, b) is new information for me, Mike. Now I have another question (see picture: Start means the beginning of the winding.): How did you arrange the small toroids on top of each other? According to variation 1 or variation 2? Or does that not matter in your opinion?
Thx Toni
Top, you have to think of a and a1 are continuations of the a coil.
The lowest frequency is the closest to the core, the fastest "B" is on the outside. It is one thing that SM stipulated as is the triggering of the Mosfets.
Regards
Mike 8)
While I'm at it, C2 capacitance on my unit is 22nF, C1 is 416pF, C1 voltage should be Around 11000v, source of "B" is around 200v. to ground.
Regards
Mike 8)
[bThe naming of the order of the windings (a, c, b) is new information for me, Mike][/b]
I don't think so, they are CCW around as shown by SM, see attached
Regards
Mike 8)
Let me explain the two different TPU sizes.
The 15" of SM has a continuous a a1 with a center tapping, the same with b b1 and c c1.
The smaller TPU which powered the TV etc has a c and b in the top toroid and a1 c1 and b1 in the bottom, but they are connected top to bottom as though they were center-tapped continuous coils, so the join is the center tap.
The only difference between the two is saving space, and the larger one was probably two TPUs, one on top of the other, and why there were two CMCs and not one as charge inductors.
Regards
Mike 8)
Hey Mike,
I've just cleaned up my lab after it being used as a safe haven storage during this separation from my ex girlfriend. Fired up my switching circuit and added some mods for easier tuning. I'm back. 8)
Thanks for being here.
Dave
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.11.27, 14:57:36
While I'm at it, C2 capacitance on my unit is 22nF, C1 is 416pF, C1 voltage should be Around 11000v, source of "B" is around 200v. to ground.
Regards
Mike 8)
I think I have this all right but with 11KV (c1) which will be sitting across the mosfets how can they survive?
Do you recommend any particular device here?
My project right now is using the Basic tpu with 2 frequencies .
waiting for yet more silicone wire and I dont want to unwind anything yet .
But 1 internal ground does concur with the paper drawings .
Thank you
It's not sitting across any mosfet, that's the point, the maximum in my case is around 200v. C1 when the "B" mosfet is On, is in series with C2, the center is a voltage divider, the voltage there is only 200v. If there was no C2 then yes you would fry your B mosfet.
The current at the mosfet is minimal, and the On voltage for A and C is 200v+_. The OFF voltage at the drain of A and C will be 400v supplying into the resonant circuit, now you can see where the HV across the C1 capacitor comes from.
The voltage will build up to this level in a couple of seconds, and why no load is connected on start up. If you don't build up the voltage you will not have the plasma level required for excess energy, now this is probably the Kick SM talked about, if you do not have it it will not work.
I hope you understand, C2 is critical to the working of this.
Welcome back Dave, you have some catching up to do.
Regards
Mike 8)
Yes makes sense , I was just confused by the 11kv as a measured value ...its not ever allowed to rise to that because its is being bled off by b mosfet at a slightly later time ,the end of the delay line .
I see that the only real current is charging the supply choke and of course the bleed off that is not ever directly from the supply but the voltage build up ...Genius !
This must be what SM called Catalyst, tiny little controlled lightning strikes.
This whole energy source thing seems easier for me to rationalize when you know that the work is to create an artificial environment for millions of tiny lightning strikes.
I think that most experimenters will use 2 x 9v batteries in series for the 2 switching supplies .
Then have to justify why the batteries are irrelevant to the layman.
Some good bench time ahead now .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.11.29, 09:25:53
Yes makes sense , I was just confused by the 11kv as a measured value ...its not ever allowed to rise to that because its is being bled off by b mosfet at a slightly later time ,the end of the delay line .
I see that the only real current is charging the supply choke and of course the bleed off that is not ever directly from the supply but the voltage build up ...Genius !
This must be what SM called Catalyst, tiny little controlled lightning strikes.
This whole energy source thing seems easier for me to rationalize when you know that the work is to create an artificial environment for millions of tiny lightning strikes.
I think that most experimenters will use 2 x 9v batteries in series for the 2 switching supplies .
Then have to justify why the batteries are irrelevant to the layman.
Some good bench time ahead now .
Lindsay
I did not measure the 11kv, I have nothing to measure that voltage :D but it is easy to calculate. C1 and C2 are "sort of" in series and the center voltage is around 200v. We know the capacitance of C1 and C2 so we can find the voltage within C1.
I use an online calculator, I'm lazy these days :)
One thing is though C1 is not a normal capacitor, so that 11kv might not be accurate, don't try to measure it. I started by using a fairly high value for C2, 8uF and the voltage was way down. By reducing the value the voltage started rising, until I reach the value I have now.
Feeding back 200v to charge the choke then gives you that 200v discharge plus the 200v from the C3 cap, giving a total of 400v+- input to the LRC. The problem with the calculations is they will not take into consideration the fact that the capacitance of C1 has infinite nodes along the length of the solenoid coils.
That just might be SM's little lightening discharges which you say, I did not know that, but it does make sense, though it is a barrier discharge. (DBD) not a break down such as an arc.
Lunch time here
Regards
Mike 8)
I am an RF person for many years, and I have talked about class E amplifiers because of their simplicity.
There is in audio the class D amplifier as well, they are similar but class E only uses one Mosfet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class-D_amplifier
I do not think SM specifically was inventing a power generator, he was in the audio business, and as so he probably stumbled on the "TPU"
If you look at how you can make an induction heater with two Mosfets, two charge chokes, a coil, and some capacitors, it will also give you an insight.
The unique thing about the TPU is the C1 capacitance.
On another point, for those using DDS signal generators, make sure that the rising edge of the two channels are in sync. Whatever I do with mine in the past, I could not get them to rise at exactly the same time, just using the sg. >:(
Regards
Mike 8)
Great points Mike,
My fy8300 has this bug also with phase ..cheap crap ok ,a lot for the money though.
If you go into the phase menu on any channel as if to try to adjust it ,it rights itself until you change any other value .
As long as you activate the phase setting without even adjusting the phase they sync up again.
Usable but highly annoying
the jds6600 is probably the same
if under pc control you just need to move phase slider any amount and the same fix occurs but as you would know there are many runtime errors with this interface.
Most annoying but saving the setting seems to keep it on reboot. but not from other memory locations.
This probably should not be in this thread but i know there are a few here with the 8300
A well shielded dedicated micro controller will be the go as experiments move forward.
Brian Collins the fake inventor revealed to me that the tv set unit was started in another room ( where the controller was)
once started it can be kept going with methods we are yet .to discover.
High Lindsay
I did not think of the computer interphase, when I have time I will try it, thanks for that. It can make a real mess of your testing.
Regards
Mike 8)
What is the approximate value of the charge choke.
The value surely affects resonance?
Quote from: itzon on 2021.11.30, 21:00:23
What is the approximate value of the charge choke.
The value surely affects resonance?
Mine is 1.25mH. If it was a class E modulated amplifier where you were driving the MOSFET at the frequency desired then you would have to take it into consideration, but here the only consideration is the charge time at the frequency used to reach saturation, in other words, DUTY. The natural resonant frequency of the "TPU" will take place whether you are driving the MOSFET with 1kHz or 10kHz with a square pulse, (a square pulse is made up of an infinite number of frequencies. What is ideal is to drive the MOSFET at near some low harmonic frequency of this resonance.
The TPU is made up of inductance and capacitance but in an unusual way, the resonance is a means of creating high voltage which is partly fed back to create an extremely high voltage across the C1 capacitance. This creates a "dielectric" plasma that is highly reactive, electrons are stripped and converted into ions and vice versa during relaxation time, this is where I think the extra energy is absorbed.
The length of the TPU (coils) is connected like a delay line, note the attached and the zero point crossing.
Regards
Mike 8)
If say your resonant frequency was 1MHz then a "good choice" would be 5kHz or 10kHz they are sub-harmonics.
Is there a strategy for starting up?
I have all the right things happening as far as timing goes .
If the supply voltage is above 50v Mosfet c fries itself .
Would it be correct to start with lower voltage and wait for a build up or is it full 200v on the charge cap?
I have some voltage pumping at 7.8 hz (a and c ) difference which follows the frequency right down to .05hz difference.
It seems that when the ringing begins to sound interesting there is a chattering followed by click sound and silence ..... a blown fet .
It was along day ,probably a fresh start with a clear head will help here but if you have any pointers for bringing this up slowly, let me know all of us will face this at some point.
Resonance of c1 a to ground is 1.12mhz .
If i use a large value 10mli h CMC it needs a much higher supply voltage .
2mh and the boost converter begins operating at a much lower voltage which seemed counter intuitive
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.01, 09:47:36
Is there a strategy for starting up?
I have all the right things happening as far as timing goes .
If the supply voltage is above 50v Mosfet c fries itself .
Would it be correct to start with lower voltage and wait for a build up or is it full 200v on the charge cap?
I have some voltage pumping at 7.8 hz (a and c ) difference which follows the frequency right down to .05hz difference.
It seems that when the ringing begins to sound interesting there is a chattering followed by click sound and silence ..... a blown fet .
It was along day ,probably a fresh start with a clear head will help here but if you have any pointers for bringing this up slowly, let me know all of us will face this at some point.
Resonance of c1 a to ground is 1.12mhz .
If i use a large value 10mli h CMC it needs a much higher supply voltage .
2mh and the boost converter begins operating at a much lower voltage which seemed counter intuitive
High Lindsay
Don't try feeding back until everything is known to be running correctly.
Start with a 12v feed and check the voltage at C3
Reduce the duty cycles of "A" and "C" at the same ratios, I take it you are using 8.3% for "A" and 16.6% for "C"!! they may be too high for the chokes and the frequencies you are using. start by using 2% for "A", 4% for "C" and make sure with your scope that "C" does not switch OFF late.
Sounds to me that one of the problems is "C" Mosfet for some reason is still ON when the "A" Mosfet is OFF, this is a RED EYE situation with all the discharge of "A" being shorted across the "C" Mosfet :D
The solution is to shorten the duty of "C" so that it is OFF a few nanoseconds before "A" turns OFF. There must be a delay somewhere in your circuit for "C" to turn OFF late. The rising edge is OK but the OFF timing is a duty problem, I hope you see what I'm getting at.
Take little steps, don't rush it now after all this time ;)
Regards
Mike 8)
@ Lindsay
What ringing? or was it a whistle? Once running correctly I can feel like a low-frequency bumping, and a very very slight hum, which could be vibration on my Formica bench, which I presume is the washboard effect that was coined.
Regards
Mike 8)
@ web000x
Dave, I know you are in an advanced stage of the build, take heed on what I have said to Lindsay over the duty of the Mosfets and especially the OFF timing of "C" in relation to "A", or RED EYE TIME.
Regards
Mike 8)
If you look at the duty and sequence diagram, you will see that "B" comes ON twice, the second time just before "C" switches ON for the second time, it is for a reason, and that reason is to extract the energy from the C1 capacitance as much as possible if it does not remove "most" of the energy then again there is a RED eye situation. "B" has to be synced correctly.
As I always say, TIMING IS EVERYTHING :)
Regards
Mike 8)
Thanks for the pointers Mike,
Hers is my gate drives after the 3120 driver.
The b drive is blocked by a and c at the led driver end and seems to be doing its job ok
these settings are as per info. assuming 1mhz resonance mine is 1.1
If i adjust the duty on b to be higher, the b pulses fatten up but they become uneven .
At no time is b on when a or or c are on .
No matter how far I zoom in the logic holds true..
I can scope this reliably with common earths a long as I dont apply main power source
early days I know.
Off to fly my ultralight to clear my head .
Lindsay
The B logic is wrong, when A and C switch OFF B switches On then again within its frequency time before A and or C are On again.
Regards
Mike 8)
Your problem is using the SG for "B", in the 4047s I use I am gating B with C, look closely.
Off shopping :-[
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.02, 06:28:43
Lindsay
The B logic is wrong, when A and C switch OFF B switches On then again within its frequency time before A and or C are On again.
Regards
Mike 8)
This is what my logic looks like. I've abandoned the function generator for now and am using 4047 IC's per Mike's schematic.
Dave
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.02, 06:57:35
Your problem is using the SG for "B", in the 4047s I use I am gating B with C, look closely.
Off shopping :-[
Regards
Mike 8)
Thank you ...
I have the other board almost done , I want so much to use the dds for future builds .
Is the accuracy of the 4047 lc a stability problem ?
Playing with the hetrodyning and the dds is very accurate .
.1 hz difference at 5000 and 2500 sees the c2 voltage pumping rate at .1hz so accurate!
If anyone can come up with a strategy that has the dds as reference source it will be better for learning than twiddling pots .
I will have one more go with some cowboy logic as see if i cant ruin the timing completely!
Another thought came to me at 6500ft regarding hendershot's method and it made me wonder if one could wire wrap a decent poly cap or a stripped down electrolytic as a core ?
Yes I was High !
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.02, 08:41:34
Thank you ...
I have the other board almost done , I want so much to use the dds for future builds .
Is the accuracy of the 4047 lc a stability problem ?
If you use good quality caps then it is very stable, I really do think SM used the same IC's, "why" because the frequencies would not have made sense when using the sync: (your CD4011), because "B" would follow the same frequency exactly as "C", it's that simple to see. So it is a question of gating "A" and "B" to use the different frequencies, apart from that you have to think about what "B" is really doing.Playing with the hetrodyning and the dds is very accurate .
.1 hz difference at 5000 and 2500 sees the c2 voltage pumping rate at .1hz so accurate!
If anyone can come up with a strategy that has the dds as reference source it will be better for learning than twiddling pots .
I will have one more go with some cowboy logic as see if i cant ruin the timing completely!
Another thought came to me at 6500ft regarding hendershot's method and it made me wonder if one could wire wrap a decent poly cap or a stripped down electrolytic as a core ?
Yes I was High !
[/quote]
It must be good stuff ;D
Regards
Mike 8)
This should help
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: web000x on 2021.12.02, 08:17:32
This is what my logic looks like. I've abandoned the function generator for now and am using 4047 IC's per Mike's schematic.
Dave
That is it O0
Regards
Mike
In post 32 as below:-
While I'm at it, C2 capacitance on my unit is 22nF, C1 is 416pF, C1 voltage should be Around 11000v, source of "B" is around 200v. to ground.
Regards
Mike 8)
« Last Edit: 2021-11-27, 17:16:05 by Centraflow »
Has been altered but not by me >:(
C2 should read 0.22uF and V out 20v NOT 200V. I use a KEMET axial cap rated at 3kvDC, 750vAC
Someone has hacked my post using my name at the time shown above, that is what happens I suppose on an open thread. Tomorrow I will go through the rest of my posts.
Regards
Mike 8)
Well explained I had the waveform like the drawing which was not to scale as far as duty cycle goes.
main pcb almost done ..
I know how hard it is to get all this across to many different builders .
One thing that was obvious was that the light output and heat on the mosfets seemed disproportionate to the tiny current draw100ma at 20v .
back to work .
Post 37 mentions the 200v .. is it the same context?
I hope we are not being victims of the sm security team .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.03, 03:03:05
Well explained I had the waveform like the drawing which was not to scale as far as duty cycle goes.
main pcb almost done ..
I know how hard it is to get all this across to many different builders .
One thing that was obvious was that the light output and heat on the mosfets seemed disproportionate to the tiny current draw100ma at 20v .
back to work .
Post 37 mentions the 200v .. is it the same context?
I hope we are not being victims of the sm security team .
Post 37 should read 20 and 40v, but that is at startup, that was a mistake of mine, one to many zeros :-[
Regards
Mike 8)
I just spent a long day fixing my errors and losing it ...all working sort of now.
Did you change the 4047 gating on the new 4011 diagram
the first and second 4047 are wired differently ..it had me going in circles ..I still dont know if its wrong or right as the earlier version they were gated the same .
brain dead now .. thanks for the clarification ,
I hope we can all see how errors are just so easy to make
even asking the right question is a challenge sometimes
Thank you
Here is another scope shot, it's inverted but again this is not a full running shot of the TPU powered up. It is without the charge chokes and the Mosfets, as in the previous scope shot I posted, just the direct input to the Drains of "A" and "C" at the lowest setting of my SG.
This shows quite well the resonant effects of all the coils and this special C1 capacitance, scoped at the "B" drain to TPU ground.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.03, 11:32:23
I just spent a long day fixing my errors and losing it ...all working sort of now.
Did you change the 4047 gating on the new 4011 diagram
the first and second 4047 are wired differently ..it had me going in circles ..I still dont know if its wrong or right as the earlier version they were gated the same .
brain dead now .. thanks for the clarification ,
I hope we can all see how errors are just so easy to make
even asking the right question is a challenge sometimes
Thank you
Must be the middle of the night for you :D
"A" is normal gating and "B" is complimented gating, "C" is just astable from the Q output but duty adjusted.
Regards
Mike 8)
Make sure you are using only the Q outputs of the 4047's as they are exactly 50% duty to start with but half the oscillator frequency, the oscillator is not an exact 50% for that reason.
Regards
Mike 8)
8pm here ,past my bedtime though.
I will have a clear head tomorrow .
All ducks are lined up . Ten years younger is my wish to santa claus .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.03, 12:06:45
8pm here ,past my bedtime though.
I will have a clear head tomorrow .
All ducks are lined up . Ten years younger is my wish to santa claus .
I'm wishing for 10 as well, and an electric mountain bike 8)
Regards
Mike 8)
Ok,
I have built the circuit ...2times now .
There is something not happening right ,could you give a rundown on what to expect from each output and the pots function ?
I have eliminated error on my part as the second nest build works the same as the suspect messy build.
perhaps some waveform and test points ...of course I could have made the same mistake twice .I have metered everything with no chips and it agrees .
Thanks
Hi Lindsay
Later today I will run through the electronics.
You have to be careful which inputs and outputs you are using of the 4047s.what ever you do do not use the oscillator output as it is not 50%duty. The output to use is the Q high output. The pot on the 4047 is just your frequency setting, the other 3 pots are your duty On with control, I hope you are not using a diode on those controls as I removed them some time back as they were only when using a sine wave input.
Later more detail.
Regards
Mike 8)
This will help to understand the 4047 and what I have done.
https://diyodemag.com/education/the_classroom_cd4047_astable_monostable_multivibrator
Note the explanation of True gating and Complimentary gating, which is what I have used as triggering from the "C" Q output via the "4011" sync chip.
Like most ICs they are sensitive on the input connections which are not used, they should be tied to the appropriate V+ or V- rails.
You must use the cap and resistor at the 4 and 5 gating inputs, this stops bounce.
Note that I have used the duty corrected signal from "C" to control the sync. into the 4011. "A" and "B" are duty corrected from the "Q" outputs.
Note I have run the "C" output through two inverting gates before going to the driver IC, this is to delay the timing because the "A" and "B" pulses have a little more plumbing, I did this only for that reason.
The 3 pots and capacitors used on the gates of the 40106 are just timing the ON pulse of the signals, they do not change the frequency, just the ON duty %.
Regards
Mike 8)
If anyone wants more clarification of anything, please ask, my brain does work in strange ways sometimes :D
On that point, a reminder that my schematics are not ALWAYS full working schematics, and or they can be improved over time.
Tuning is difficult because timing is everything, and I have been working on making it a little easier without using half-bridge drivers for the input signals. I have also taken heed of what Toni has said about using two diodes from C3 to the charge chokes, and this is what I have come up with which seems to make tuning easier.
Use only one diode supplying to the 2 charge chokes.
Use a diode from the drain of "A" and "C" before connecting to the TPU. This helps stop "C" from being fried in case of shorting the "A" discharge or HIGH pulse. "A" and "C" are only supplying a high pulse in the first place, the resonance is between the C1 and the coils, not through the Mosfets.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.06, 12:48:13
Use only one diode supplying to the 2 charge chokes.
Use a diode from the drain of "A" and "C" before connecting to the TPU. This helps stop "C" from being fried in case of shorting the "A" discharge or HIGH pulse. "A" and "C" are only supplying a high pulse in the first place, the resonance is between the C1 and the coils, not through the Mosfets.
Hi Mike,
is that what you are describing here? D3 and D4 in the attached schematic? Or please make a schematic sketch.
Tx Toni
Hi Toni
No, attached is revision 2.9
As the input from A and C charge chokes is a pulse and no return is required, unlike a half-bridge, the diodes let through this pulse but do not allow, in the case of "C" mosfet, a short of the "A" pulse through that mosfet if the timing is not right.
Regards
Mike 8)
I thought I would strip this down to just the bare elements, so here it is.
The voltage in C3 will rise, there is NO CONTROL in this schematic, so do not loop straight back until you have a control.
Even if you are not looping, you must control the input voltage to the output voltage at C3.
A minimum voltage is required at the input to create sufficient voltage across C1, an ionising voltage.
Always have a high wattage resistor across C3 as the means of stabilising its charge voltage, eg. 33K @ 10w. The voltage here needs to match what you are putting in at the front to the charge chokes, it will not be the output voltage, that will be at least twice this voltage.
Regards
Mike 8)
Thanks for that link ,I had located that already and as far as i can see all is good .
For the basics how about the cap values for the 3 4047's and the 40106's .
I cant recall where i got them from in the first place but they are not in this thread yet.
It may be that things are ok but i have a timing problem
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.06, 23:58:21
Thanks for that link ,I had located that already and as far as i can see all is good .
For the basics how about the cap values for the 3 4047's and the 40106's .
I cant recall where i got them from in the first place but they are not in this thread yet.
It may be that things are ok but i have a timing problem
Use this calculator for your RC frequency (remember you need twice the frequency because the Q outputs are halved.
Regards
Mike 8)
oops forgot the link
https://www.omnicalculator.com/physics/rc-circuit
:-[
For the duty, you can use 10K and 560pF, but it is just an RC timing, so use the RC timing app in the same place.
Regards
Mike 8)
Lindsay, make sure you have adjusted the duty of "C" before the 4011 sync IC.
See attached
Regards
Mike 8)
Perhaps a cro picture ? I have a ,c, and b on together most of the time
Astable c controls all outputs frequency and phase in sync.
Im not able to get b inhibited by c as it should right?
All pulse shaping works ok .
I could have fake 4047's ? highly unlikely
what values did you use for the 4047 rc?
Its the same on both boards which almost rules out operator problem
Dave ...did you have any issues ?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.08, 10:21:46
Perhaps a cro picture ? I have a ,c, and b on together most of the time
Astable c controls all outputs frequency and phase in sync.
Im not able to get b inhibited by c as it should right?
All pulse shaping works ok .
I could have fake 4047's ? highly unlikely
what values did you use for the 4047 rc?
Its the same on both boards which almost rules out operator problem
Dave ...did you have any issues ?
I used 0.001uF and100k pots, that will give you 1kHz - 100kHz/ 2 = 500Hz to 50kHz on your Q output.
But you can use many combinations.
C is your control frequency, it has to be duty corrected before triggering the "A" and "B" oscillators. Remember "B" is reverse, if you have "B" ON at the same time as the others it is maybe the 4011.
The duty cycles I have mentioned are REF: only, they are a point to start eg. 25%, 16.66%, and 8.8%, it is the ratios that must be the same.
@ ALL
The TPU is a parametric amplifier, remember the words of SM "it naturally runs with gain", that is not where the energy comes from because all amplifiers have gain, but are not OU. It is the means of extracting the ambient energy through the plasma, all along the solenoid coils with reference to the core there is an infinite capacitance change within the plasma. When it gets to "B", C2 is switched into the circuit, and from there on the parametric pumping continues within the continuing cycles.
There is no race here as to whom first replicates, but everyone must realise how this works, it is an analysis of the circuit, and the most complicated part is realising the coil core varying capacitance. You can see it in the scope shots I have posted.
Here are some others
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.08, 10:21:46
Perhaps a cro picture ? I have a ,c, and b on together most of the time
Astable c controls all outputs frequency and phase in sync.
Im not able to get b inhibited by c as it should right?
All pulse shaping works ok .
I could have fake 4047's ? highly unlikely
what values did you use for the 4047 rc?
Its the same on both boards which almost rules out operator problem
Dave ...did you have any issues ?
I think I see your problem, which is my problem.
As you are using the 4011 logic, the "B" 4047 should be wired gated astable as is "A" and not as complimented gating as I have drawn.
I have not tried this atm, mine is not using the 4011 logic, but it is an easy mode, let me know as I will have to change the schematic with the 4011, I just don't have time atm.
Regards
Mike 8)
I have altered the schematic, attached below, this should resolve the problem.
Pissing down with rain so no outside work, well it's getting dark now anyway ;)
Regards
Mike 8)
I have been building a new unit and I have been documenting it as I have gone along, here is the first part.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.08, 10:21:46
Perhaps a cro picture ? I have a ,c, and b on together most of the time
Astable c controls all outputs frequency and phase in sync.
Im not able to get b inhibited by c as it should right?
All pulse shaping works ok .
I could have fake 4047's ? highly unlikely
what values did you use for the 4047 rc?
Its the same on both boards which almost rules out operator problem
Dave ...did you have any issues ?
Let me know if Mike's revision doesn't solve your issue. I will make a video and go point by point with a scope for you so show you my signal propagation/logic levels.
I have not really had many issues with getting the oscillator circuit running. The biggest issue I had was getting the frequencies in sync. It is a little difficult if you are running the sequencer while trying to dial in the frequencies. I found that moving the astable inputs of A and B to V+ while tuning 4047 frequencies is much easier since your frequencies are free to run. Once you get your harmonic relations right, move the Astable inputs back to the output of the 4011 and just a few little pot tweaks will produce the waveform I posted earlier in this thread.
Dave
Thank you Gentlemen ..It was the gating wiring.
I was heading there ..I know and appreciate the issues with new circuits etc
the latest top view circuit from mike does work
Back to the Real work of getting the adjustments right ..
I think that having a set up sequence for the free running 4047 freqs and pulse width's/order will be helpful for others .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.02, 08:41:34
If anyone can come up with a strategy that has the dds as reference source it will be better for learning than twiddling pots .
I will have one more go with some cowboy logic as see if i cant ruin the timing completely!
Have you familiarized yourself with the arbitrary waveform generator for the FY8300? I am curious how accurately wave forms can be created. If I were to attempt to create an arbitrary waveform that mimics the shape of B output, I could lock it in with A and C outputs (DDS full control, no 4047's) and adjust via phase and frequency on the dds and get fairly decent control. The only real limitation would be adjusting the pulse widths of B output while remaining locked in with A and C frequency relations. If wave forms are easily and accurately created via software, maybe a few different wave forms that mimic B could be created with varying duty cycles. I've yet to install the software and have a look due to not having a decent PC at the moment. I will load it on an older computer tonight and see what I find out.
I'm sure Mike's circuit works just fine. It gets a little annoying to have to retune with each adjustment of the pots on the 40106 or 4047 oscillator circuit. I know you can lock in adjustable relations on the DDS to get all of the outputs to move at once.
Just thinking out loud.
Dave
there might be a limitation with the arbitrary function ..but with these things its best to try it and see..
Its possible that the right sync might be available by default ...lots to test there. the 3 channels do come from the same clock after all.
Im confident that a dds solution will be the future
there are some guys at eevblog writing code for the earlier units as the manufacturers released some machine control codes...might be worth a look there too.
Any way its good to be back on track with high confidence.
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.09, 08:40:21
there might be a limitation with the arbitrary function ..but with these things its best to try it and see..
Its possible that the right sync might be available by default ...lots to test there. the 3 channels do come from the same clock after all.
Im confident that a dds solution will be the future
there are some guys at eevblog writing code for the earlier units as the manufacturers released some machine control codes...might be worth a look there too.
Any way its good to be back on track with high confidence.
I saw a video of the software for these DDS's creating an arbitrary wave. You can input x,y coordinates so it would be doable. I might give it a try. It would at least allow for a frequency sweep of uniformity between the three outputs, duty would be locked unless I saved waveform triplets of varying duty cycles to toggle through. I like being able to frequency sweep easily....
Glad you're back on track. Measuring my toroid per Mike's recent pdf to compare and make similar calculations. Trying to get to the fruit.
I recently split up with a crazy woman that didn't care too much for this research. Glad to be back.
Dave
were you guys able to drive the 3210 from the 40106?
mine seems to have a current supply problem ..the 3210 led need more current .
a buffer stage needed?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.09, 10:05:18
were you guys able to drive the 3210 from the 40106?
mine seems to have a current supply problem ..the 3210 led need more current .
a buffer stage needed?
no, there are no problems. For the LED in the 3120, approx. 10mA current should flow. The supply voltage of the 40106 then results in a corresponding series resistor. For example, I used 820 Ohm for 12V. Now at 3V from the ESP32 https://www.espressif.com/en/products/socs/esp32 (https://www.espressif.com/en/products/socs/esp32) as a signal generator 270 Ohm.
Lindsay,
Do you have the software for the FY8300? I cannot find my disc anywhere. I have the JDS6600 software for my other unit but can't locate the FY8300..
Dave
Here it is...
You need to download the user guide and its all there ...not exactly clear, i had the same issue
Th serial protocol is there too ...im not a great coder but it looks very promising ....if it does what it seem to indicate.
heck, I cant even wire up a led properly on some days!
http://en.feelelec.com/index.php?case=archive&act=list&catid=6
Edit
Another point that might be useful is to fit a ground lift switch which switches the main bnc earths from mains ground to floating ...with all the cautions that go with it .
some use a high value resistor.
When it is hooked up to the computer via usb the ground is through the computer...unless it is a floating laptop.
The earth loop may otherwise pick up stray interference, which we generate .
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.09, 10:38:17
no, there are no problems. For the LED in the 3120, approx. 10mA current should flow. The supply voltage of the 40106 then results in a corresponding series resistor. For example, I used 820 Ohm for 12V. Now at 3V from the ESP32 https://www.espressif.com/en/products/socs/esp32 (https://www.espressif.com/en/products/socs/esp32) as a signal generator 270 Ohm.
Yes. My brain is worn out ,i must have a breadboard problem with the led wiring ...too many different supplies and grounds on one pcb..
Here is a little tip
The 40106 does not like 15 volts when driving leds 1.2k resistor ..fried them when tuning .
all logic and generators now at separate 5v and stable now .
Now who can tell what they see in this scope shot :D
Regards
Mike 8)
When looking at resonance what are you looking at? yes, the classic ring DOWN of the resonant frequency.
The question is can there be a ring UP? if so where is the energy coming from?
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.10, 09:05:13
Now who can tell what they see in this scope shot :D
Regards
Mike 8)
Ummm.... Positive energy coefficient. O0
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.06, 14:46:12
Hi Toni
No, attached is revision 2.9
As the input from A and C charge chokes is a pulse and no return is required, unlike a half-bridge, the diodes let through this pulse but do not allow, in the case of "C" mosfet, a short of the "A" pulse through that mosfet if the timing is not right.
Regards
Mike 8)
Mike,
Are you using this circuit? It seems C2 ceases to be resonant when the A & C drain diodes are present. I was trying to figure out why no current was flowing through my B transistor and then I got bit by the cap! :o It would seem difficult to find resonance before connecting a load..
Dave
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.10, 09:05:13
Now who can tell what they see in this scope shot :D
Regards
Mike 8)
Ok, Mike, what I see in this picture is:
1. a period of approx. 1.4 s, i.e. a frequency 0.74 Hz needle pulses of approx. 350 mVpp
2. in between 5 resonance points at a distance of 260 ms, i.e. a frequency of 3.846 Hz
3. and, this is interesting, the amplitudes of the 5 resonance points increase.
Now the question for you: with which circuit and at which point did you measure this?
And how do you use this principle on a larger scale so that it is useful?
Regards
Toni
Toni
I'm away from home in Valencia to collect my wife's grand daughter, will be back this afternoon. I was testing the new carefully built Toroid for posting pictures etc.
What nobody looks at is "sub harmonic resonance", and without taking a second look at resonance scope shots you can easily pass by a shot like that.
The frequency is close to the 2nd sub harmonic of 7.83.
Regards
Mike
@ Toni
OK the signal generator is set to square pulse at 1kHz 10v amplitude into a 10Mohm resistor.
The channel 1 probe is connected to the TPU side of the resistor.
The resistor is connected to the "a" coil where normally the drain of the "A" Mosfet is connected.
The loop (core) ground is connected to the "b" coil where normally the drain of the "B" Mosfet is connected, the scope ground is also connected here along with the signal generator ground.
I have redone the test now and all is the same, scope settings are in the photo posted before..
Below is another scope shot with the same connections but different scope settings.
I have also taken a 5sec video of this which shows the CCW movement. My TPU is connected that way looking from above the toroid.
Hope that helps
Regards
Mike 8)
I increased the sig gen frequency to 5kHz and the result is the same but higher definition, photo below
Regards
Mike 8)
Picture of new TPU
Regards
Mike 8)
This is that short video I mentioned, look at the direction of movement, there is only one signal input as mentioned.
Note the cursor frequency setting, freeze the video.
https://youtu.be/k2bxvLLRu0M
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: web000x on 2021.12.10, 09:21:32
Mike,
Are you using this circuit? It seems C2 ceases to be resonant when the A & C drain diodes are present. I was trying to figure out why no current was flowing through my B transistor and then I got bit by the cap! :o It would seem difficult to find resonance before connecting a load..
Dave
Dave, no without the diodes, that was for Lindsay to get things in sync.
But I have yet to try that, just be careful of the voltage.
Regards
Mike 8)
I have attached a video link to show how to look at the low Hz frequency within the STEAP TPU.
This again is on my new build and is something I have found when looking for the BEAT frequency, what I did not expect was a rising resonance wave.
Because the frequency is very low in relation to the normally resonant frequency, it is not normally seen unless you can take enough samples and expand it.
There is only one frequency input atm. further tests are to be done before powering this up with real power.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAx-xp1U3Cs
Regards
Mike 8)
Videos help enormously - thank you for sharing, Mike! O0
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2021.12.11, 19:03:30
Videos help enormously - thank you for sharing, Mike! O0
I really don't like doing videos, it really is not my platform. If I was to do a video of the STEAP TPU running I think I would get a lot of comments such a "false", it really insults my intelligence.
On youtube there are many things that are false, but also amongst us there are many people who are also false, they are there to create problems, either for personal gain or paid to create confusion so as not to believe in what you are told or see.
At our age, and I am older than yourself I believe, we do not have the same initiative such as money or fame, only for the better of our world, which is very important especially within the times we live atm.
I have solar panels which generate all the energy I need, but recently I changed my converter from 3600w to 5000 w with two inputs to take my STEAP input on the second, I deliver any excess to the grid. I had to legalize the first, the second I will connect, and that is it.
Thank you for your support, it is very much appreciated.
Best regards
Mike 8)
This morning I have repeated the 5kHz input tests without and with C2, attached are the results with C2 at 0.22uF
Fr without C2 = 4.762 Hz
Fr with C2 of 0.22uF = 6.250 Hz
Still with only one input at "A"
Regards
Mike 8)
Hello
I built the TPU years ago and will do tests again. How many turns are a,a1: b1,b and c1,c?
Greeting
Lota
Quote from: lota on 2021.12.12, 14:40:59
Hello
I built the TPU years ago and will do tests again. How many turns are a,a1: b1,b and c1,c?
Greeting
Lota
Welcome Lota
From which part of the world are you from, if you don't mind me asking?
To answer your question, I do not know :D
To explain my answer, it is all to do with ratios. If you take a length of insulated multi-stranded copper wire and wrap it back and to several times and join the ends together, then wrap another wire as a solenoid coil over the top from beginning to end, but with a center tapping, you have a solenoid with an insulated core (a, a1), the number of turns does not matter. You then take another length of insulated copper wire and wrap it over the top of the other from beginning to end with the same number of turns, again with a center tapping. You then do this a third time, and you end up with the core and the coils with the correct ratios of capacitance and inductance.
The shape is made circular for less space as one toroid or two (one with a, c, b and the other with a1, c1, b1).
The capacitance has a very high voltage when running, therefore ground "core" connections and coil connections have to be well spaced, or it will arc over.
Regards
Mike 8)
Hello
Thank you.
I designed the circuit with eagle for the cnc machine. But still has to test. Takes some time.
From East Germany. My English is not good.
Lota
If anyone is going to build this, please take heed of what I have said about heating up. I have posted the wire to use, it is good to 200c and is a Tinned multi-stranded copper wire (tin-coated because the plasma is highly reactive, as used in industry).
Regards
Mike 8)
Lindsay and other FY8300 users,
This image is a scope shot of me recreating the triple wave output with the FY8300S alone. There are limitations but it may be easier than using the other circuit with the touchy trimmer pots. One of the bummer limitations is that when you adjust all the frequencies at once, the phase lock of the three channels drifts and you get signal overlap. However, pressing the Phase Menu brings it back into phase 0 again so it is useful for dialing in very specific frequencies rather quickly. I may be about to abandon the 4047s. I can also use the 40106 pulse conditioning circuit for further on the fly pulse control.
Let me know if you'd like my notepad files with wave amplitude tables.
Dave
Hello
that doesn't look bad. Can you send me the creation or set it here?
Lota
Quote from: lota on 2021.12.13, 08:08:07
Hello
that doesn't look bad. Can you send me the creation or set it here?
Lota
This is the DDS that I have used to create the waves. I'm still working on dialing in the data tables to input for the arbitrary wave. I'll post them when I am happy with the phasing.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/174151334340?chn=ps&var=473053207660&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-213727-13078-0&mkcid=2&itemid=473053207660_174151334340&targetid=4580496732614413&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=&poi=&campaignid=418233788&mkgroupid=1230353745471221&rlsatarget=pla-4580496732614413&abcId=9300542&merchantid=51291&msclkid=3c6a3a6665cc1a5298115bd165e1e417
Here are the signal transitions I've been able to dial in on using the FY8300S. This starts one cycle and ends on the same scope shot of the next cycle while showing each signal transition at 20ns/div. I think this will work a little easier for me.
Dave
Looking good Dave!
I take it you are making a new arbitay for each new freq?
these are very capable if a bit buggy and fiddly
Changing the encoder knob to a propper knob is worth doing.
I did some live trimpot tuning today , no solid b build up yet .. need to get acquainted with the new beast
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.08, 19:24:16
I have been building a new unit and I have been documenting it as I have gone along, here is the first part.
Regards
Mike 8)
To compare Mikes' new set-up with mine, I took the same measurements and documented them in the attachment. I noticed that my TPU has slightly larger capacitances and lower inductances. I put this down to the fact that I have fewer turns in the coils, as I used the specified silicone wire (fine strands (150-400) of tinned copper wires) for this, which is thicker than the wires now used by Mike, which are not as fine, not tinned and thinner. This gives it more turns on coils a-a1, c-c1 and b-b1. Nevertheless, the resonance frequencies are again similar to those of Mike.
Regards
Toni
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.13, 14:06:48
To compare Mikes' new set-up with mine, I took the same measurements and documented them in the attachment. I noticed that my TPU has slightly larger capacitances and lower inductances. I put this down to the fact that I have fewer turns in the coils, as I used the specified silicone wire (fine strands (150-400) of tinned copper wires) for this, which is thicker than the wires now used by Mike, which are not as fine, not tinned and thinner. This gives it more turns on coils a-a1, c-c1 and b-b1. Nevertheless, the resonance frequencies are again similar to those of Mike.
Regards
Toni
High Toni
The core is the specified wire but the coils are not as I do not have any more silicon wire at the moment.
As I found out some time ago this is all to do with ratios which become really interesting as you dig deeper into what makes this tick.
With expanding a slow scan you will find all sorts of things, including your mains frequency which you have to discard as it starts to modulate what you are looking for, and impossible to avoid as the "toroid" seems to be quite an effective antenna for picking up signals.
In the next post I will show you how the frequencies relate, and for those that have not seen this before.
Good work
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.13, 10:55:34
Looking good Dave!
I take it you are making a new arbitay for each new freq?
these are very capable if a bit buggy and fiddly
Changing the encoder knob to a propper knob is worth doing.
I did some live trimpot tuning today , no solid b build up yet .. need to get acquainted with the new beast
The arbitrary waveforms do respond to frequency adjustments. However, adjusting the duty cycle of an arbitrary waveform is not possible. For this, I plan to make a few different templates of varying duty cycle so I can toggle between them with the simple selection of another arbitrary wave template.
I had to pull my knob off of the FY8300 and put a dab of hot glue in there so It would keep the knob from bottoming out against the faceplate rendering the push button part of the knob useless. I thought my DDS was garbage after 1 week out of the box because I no longer had the ability to make menu selections until I figured out the knob had slipped on the post.
Dave
P.S. Mike, I had a tool allowance that I had sitting idle at work that needed to be spent by the end of this year. I will have my Rigol 1054z soon. 8)
Replace the previous pdf with this one. Nothing will be lost, it is an ongoing continuation :)
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: web000x on 2021.12.13, 18:38:38
The arbitrary waveforms do respond to frequency adjustments. However, adjusting the duty cycle of an arbitrary waveform is not possible. For this, I plan to make a few different templates of varying duty cycle so I can toggle between them with the simple selection of another arbitrary wave template.
I had to pull my knob off of the FY8300 and put a dab of hot glue in there so It would keep the knob from bottoming out against the faceplate rendering the push button part of the knob useless. I thought my DDS was garbage after 1 week out of the box because I no longer had the ability to make menu selections until I figured out the knob had slipped on the post.
Dave
P.S. Mike, I had a tool allowance that I had sitting idle at work that needed to be spent by the end of this year. I will have my Rigol 1054z soon. 8)
;D ;D ;D ;D >:-) O0
Regards
Mike 8)
Here are my resonance measurements. Essentially I see a big difference to Mike's measurements (see at the end of the file)
Regards
Toni
15.12.2021: Attachment corrected
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.14, 05:32:00
Here are my resonance measurements. Essentially I see a big difference to Mike's measurements (see at the end of the file)
Regards
Toni
Thanks Toni,
I will eventually get some data posted regarding my unit. I have the same scope as Mike headed my way. I will run the same test when I get it so we can compare between the three of us that have a Rigol. At least we will possibly be able to rule out scope artifact or whatever it may be.
Dave
Quote from: lota on 2021.12.13, 08:08:07
Hello
that doesn't look bad. Can you send me the creation or set it here?
Lota
Hallo Lota, ich habe dir eine PM (persönliche Nachricht) geschrieben. Bitte schau mal nach.
Danke
Toni
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.14, 05:32:00
Here are my resonance measurements. Essentially I see a big difference to Mike's measurements (see at the end of the file)
Regards
Toni
Hi Toni
Yes, I have a cable problem from my channel 1 from the SG.
I have spent all afternoon to see what the problem is, it persisted until I changed the cable.
The cable tests as though it is ok, but it seems the cable is NOT 50ohms and causing a standing wave, I can't think of anything else.
The resonance is now as it should be and I will have to do some more tests.
I will remove the last pdf so as not to confuse, I did state at the time that it was a very unexpected result.
By the way on page 12 of your pdf you put 5kHz under the screen shot, it should be 5.000Hz, the rigol does put k if it is kHz and they use a decimal point and not a (,) commer as used in Europe, I get confused sometimes with living in Spain but being English.
Regards
Mike 8)
Hello
I once set up a circuit.
With two tc4017. Now I have to build the TPU. Frequency only for testing.
Lota
Quote from: lota on 2021.12.14, 18:41:32
Hello
I once set up a circuit.
With two tc4017. Now I have to build the TPU. Frequency only for testing.
Lota
You will have to be able to adjust your duty and frequency unless your Toroid build is perfect.
SM's 2.1 and 3.2 times base is for fine adjustment, it is the hardest part as I believe SM was always tuning before a demonstration.
It is all to do with timing and ratios.
Regards
Mike 8)
What is happening with the sg measurements ?
Did the faulty lead cause us a misdirection ?
Mine has a kind of flashing when put near mains interference sources ...surely unusual ..but this wind is unusual.
We need to get to the plasma point with no self run goal at this stage . There are so many variables and differences between builds, our early goal needs to be DBD Plasma.
I have gone back to the dds and I have B never on when a or c are on and while I dont expect self run I'm looking for the dbd condition .half second
At 10,000 hz and 10,000.5 I can get steady and obvious voltage rise and fall at .5 hz this is not possible with the 4047's. It proves that I have a working mixer but maybe not much else.
Can you suggest a simpler build that will ensure plasma if not much else?
We need to gain experience and familiarity with this state of matter .
On another thread here and a slightly different context is is suggested that the energy is in the dielectric .
I am tempted to revert to my 2 plates .
If so do you suggest closed rings or open ones (O shaped) or (C shaped)cut ?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.12.16, 11:16:35
What is happening with the sg measurements ?
Did the faulty lead cause us a misdirection ?
Mine has a kind of flashing when put near mains interference sources ...surely unusual ..but this wind is unusual.
We need to get to the plasma point with no self run goal at this stage . There are so many variables and differences between builds, our early goal needs to be DBD Plasma.
I have gone back to the dds and I have B never on when a or c are on and while I dont expect self run I'm looking for the dbd condition .half second
At 10,000 hz and 10,000.5 I can get steady and obvious voltage rise and fall at .5 hz this is not possible with the 4047's. It proves that I have a working mixer but maybe not much else.
Can you suggest a simpler build that will ensure plasma if not much else?
We need to gain experience and familiarity with this state of matter .
On another thread here and a slightly different context is is suggested that the energy is in the dielectric .
I am tempted to revert to my 2 plates .
If so do you suggest closed rings or open ones (O shaped) or (C shaped)cut ?
This has been an extraction, I was surprised at this result as I have stated, and it doesn't change anything, they were just exhaustive tests on my new build unit.
You can make the plasma by using an external HV pulsed source ( any transformer like an ignition coil) into a solenoid wound over a several turn loop core, the core being ground and the solenoid is positive (C1),
The problem is you have to extract the energy at the right time, it is all down to timing.
Regards
Mike 8)
PS Sent you an email.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.16, 08:12:08
SM's 2.1 and 3.2 times base is for fine adjustment, it is the hardest part as I believe SM was always tuning before a demonstration.
I am still having trouble figuring out how you are creating a beat when you are using the 4011 Sequencer. Since this sequencer restarts the oscillations from the A and B 4047's repeatedly, no beat is created because your pulses are in lock step. Can you elaborate on how you are
actually creating the 7.83Hz beat?
Also, Can you show us detailed scope shots of your gate signals running while your device is putting out COP > 1? No need to state anything about OU in a video or photos, just a tentative target for us to shoot for in pulse train tuning...
Thanks,
Dave
Hi Dave.
I think it is a problem of not seeing the trees, only the forest.
Let's take a-a1, at the beginning of a you input 5kHz so you will have 5000resonant bursts along a coil. At the beginning of a1 coil you input 10500Hz pulses which will give you as many resonant pulses. All these pulses are traveling in the same direction within the OFF time of A and C, this off time is a lot longer than the charge time, so the resonant peaks are a lot more but they are stepping because of the delay between one end of a and the other where C started. It is part of the delay line effect.
The input pulse is one to several million resonant pulses, it is not 1 to 1.
Busy few days with Christmas just around the corner, typing on my phone is not ideal.
Regards
Mike.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.17, 07:58:28
Hi Dave.
I think it is a problem of not seeing the trees, only the forest.
Let's take a-a1, at the beginning of a you input 5kHz so you will have 5000resonant bursts along a coil. At the beginning of a1 coil you input 10500Hz pulses which will give you as many resonant pulses. All these pulses are traveling in the same direction within the OFF time of A and C, this off time is a lot longer than the charge time, so the resonant peaks are a lot more but they are stepping because of the delay between one end of a and the other where C started. It is part of the delay line effect.
The input pulse is one to several million resonant pulses, it is not 1 to 1.
Busy few days with Christmas just around the corner, typing on my phone is not ideal.
Regards
Mike.
I get that there are waves interacting in the device and we must harness their interactions but I'm really just confused how you can say you are injecting 5KHz and 10.5KHz all while using the sequencer that dictates harmonic relations, eg 1:2 for our circuit. How are you adding the 500 extra pulses while running lock step?
Dave
Quote from: web000x on 2021.12.17, 08:35:21
I get that there are waves interacting in the device and we must harness their interactions but I'm really just confused how you can say you are injecting 5KHz and 10.5KHz all while using the sequencer that dictates harmonic relations, eg 1:2 for our circuit. How are you adding the 500 extra pulses while running lock step?
Dave
Dave it is not the input frequency, it is the discharge timing and the Toroid delay. The running frequency is the 2 resonant frequencies, with and without C2.
Later more explination.
Regards
Mike 8)
This should help you to understand, but it is not that easy to explain.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.18, 17:26:56
This should help you to understand, but it is not that easy to explain.
Regards
Mike 8)
Thanks Mike,
That is helpful in clearing up some confusion.
Dave
What happens if you switch off the power supply at the charging point? Can the TPU supply itself
or do the high voltage pulses break down?
These were questions I asked myself when I carried out the experimental set-up and series of measurements described in the appendix....
Have fun
Toni
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.19, 08:52:59
What happens if you switch off the power supply at the charging point? Can the TPU supply itself
or do the high voltage pulses break down?
These were questions I asked myself when I carried out the experimental set-up and series of measurements described in the appendix....
Have fun
Toni
Hi Toni
First Quote:
[bSo far, I have understood how to generate the high-voltage pulses with the possible lowest energy
input. This led me to completely abandon the duty of 8.33% suggested by Mike and instead use a
charging time (time needed to charge the CMC coils) that is not dependent on the frequency, but
since the duty is the expression of the charging time, it must be adapted to the frequency used.][/b]
The duty cycle is not suggested by me, IT WAS ONLY AN EXAMPLE (eg is what is used in English)
What is important as I have also said is the charge times depending on the choke used.
The C2 capacitor will depend on each build, I am sure it is not optimal by any means. The build I am doing atm shows a differential of 0.790MHz with 0.22uF which gives the lowest harmonic of 7.9Hz "pretty close to 7.83Hz but might not be good enough. I may need to bring the "with C2" frequency up.
What is your start voltage, and what is the voltage at C3, with and without a drain resistor across C3?
Regards
Mike 8)
Your doing some good work.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.19, 09:42:12
What is your start voltage, and what is the voltage at C3, with and without a drain resistor across C3?
Hi Mike,
in my document and the video, the voltage at C3 was 30V.
I have previously used different voltages from 10V - 30V to see how big the HV pulses are. In this appendix you can see that (except at 10V) the range is between 750V and 800V.
Atm. I have not connected a resistor across C3 (see schematic).
Thank you for your comments.
Toni
Quote from: ainachara on 2021.12.19, 10:24:24
Hi Mike,
in my document and the video, the voltage at C3 was 30V.
I have previously used different voltages from 10V - 30V to see how big the HV pulses are. In this appendix you can see that (except at 10V) the range is between 750V and 800V.
Atm. I have not connected a resistor across C3 (see schematic).
Thank you for your comments.
Toni
Sorry I had to read it again, yes 30v.
You need around twice that, there is a point where the voltage in C1 is sufficient to strip electrons (the plasma point), your C1 voltage is too low atm.
I have been told that all SMs demonstrations were started before in another room, which fits in with what I'm saying, C3 is charged up to around 70v beforehand, then the electronics are switched on in the demonstration (latching reed switch which also acts as the safety switch).
Regards
Mike 8)
I'm sure you are all aware that the Schumann resonance frequency of the earth is not a constant 7.83Hz. For example see-
https://www.disclosurenews.it/schumann-resonance-today-update/
Regards,
Pm
Quote from: partzman on 2021.12.19, 16:49:11
I'm sure you are all aware that the Schumann resonance frequency of the earth is not a constant 7.83Hz. For example see-
https://www.disclosurenews.it/schumann-resonance-today-update/
Regards,
Pm
Hi PM
Yes, and why I think SM was always, from what we are told, retuning before a demonstration. I follow the bot on Twitter, but the band in relation to the frequency seems acceptable. What is interesting are the harmonics at 6.5 spacing.
I'm not happy with the drive atm, it's not as I would like it, just not much time to spend on it.
Thanks for the interest
Regards
Mike 8)
Away on my phone.
Mike,
I'm compiling some data as we speak and I think you may be off somehow on your resonant frequency. . I am running tests similar to what you have but also have incorporated my Tektronics P6302 current probe and have found that I have series resonance around 4-6MHz for various tests. See attached scope shot of resonance on 'a' coil input and C1 GND. The yellow trace, SG voltage is at a min, and the magenta trace, the current, is at a max. Voltage and current are in phase.
I have measurements not that far from you:
1st coil (a,a1) to core is 0.462nF
2nd coil (c,c1) to core is 0.335nF
3rd coil (b,b1) to core is 0.277nF
L@A= 43uH
L@C= 38uH
In your recent PDF, you mention that you are looking for peak sine wave activity from the SG to determine resonance. Seems to me that would be the way for a parallel resonance circuit, but since we're driving a series resonant circuit, we're looking for minimum voltage, max current and phase 0 here as shown in my scope shot where I am just resonating at A and C1 GND. There is just too big of a discrepancy for the slight differences in our toriods.
Dave
Quote from: web000x on 2021.12.20, 04:30:14
Mike,
I'm compiling some data as we speak and I think you may be off somehow on your resonant frequency. . I am running tests similar to what you have but also have incorporated my Tektronics P6302 current probe and have found that I have series resonance around 4-6MHz for various tests. See attached scope shot of resonance on 'a' coil input and C1 GND. The yellow trace, SG voltage is at a min, and the magenta trace, the current, is at a max. Voltage and current are in phase.
I have measurements not that far from you:
1st coil (a,a1) to core is 0.462nF
2nd coil (c,c1) to core is 0.335nF
3rd coil (b,b1) to core is 0.277nF
L@A= 43uH
L@C= 38uH
In your recent PDF, you mention that you are looking for peak sine wave activity from the SG to determine resonance. Seems to me that would be the way for a parallel resonance circuit, but since we're driving a series resonant circuit, we're looking for minimum voltage, max current and phase 0 here as shown in my scope shot where I am just resonating at A and C1 GND. There is just too big of a discrepancy for the slight differences in our toriods.
Dave
Hi Dave
Will do it again, you are right on the parallel and series. I don't have a current pro e so will use a CSR.
Lately my head is in personal problems.
C2 is parallel to C1 though.
Regards
Mike 8)
Dave
Just got into my lab, and I have just thought that I am not going to be able to simultaneously do the current and voltage because of the grounding problem, unless I feed the input through a small toroid, after all it is only to see the max and min amplitudes and not a measurement of current.
Regards
Mike 8)
Dave, I'm having a lot of interruptions so not done all the frequencies atm.
Yellow is SG signal in
Green is the current in
Circuit is as yours.
At 0º phase +- because of either rise or fall, I'm measuring both (bottom right)
Frequencies as shown,
Difference is 7.94
So series or parallel depends on the frequency of resonance!!!! for this LC which is not a normal one.
More to do at lower frequencies
Regards
Mike 8)
If I run a sinusoidal signal through the frequency from 0 - 60MHz, I get the 1st resonance at A at 3.41MHz and the 2nd resonance at 9.17MHz. For C the 1st resonance is at 5.24MHz and the 2nd at 9.0MHz (see attachment).
After a lot of patience, here is the first resonant frequency at "a" to loop ground.
This is series resonance, though the solenoids to loop ground do have an anomaly.
The surprise is 5MHz. (5kHz will be the base frequency in this case) :D
Now to look at "C"
Regards
Mike 8)
Using this as a reference.
Regards
Mike 8)
Hey Mike,
Here are some of my measurement results for my toroid. I've done 4 separate resonance tests, two for A and C with NO C2 and two tests for A and C with C2 connected. I then take those isolated resonance frequencies and apply a single measured frequency to both A and C with two separate SG channels and measure the phase angles of signals and current. I only have one current probe worthy at those frequencies so I've had to take multiple measurements to show relations for current in A and C. The waveforms highlight some of the qualitative measuments of this toroid.
Dave
If anyone is going to build the toroid, please ask me questions before building. The way it is built will affect your final outcome.
If I find time today I will post a video of the waveforms when under test by inputting sine waves at the "A" and "C" inputs at the correct frequencies.
Regards
Mike 8)
Here is the short video, Tuning is not exact atm, input is 5v only, note the voltage on the pink trace.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4y8zBGH0zY
Regards
Mike 8)
Mike can you describe that video a bit?
Thanks
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.24, 16:38:06
Here is the short video, Tuning is not exact atm, input is 5v only, note the voltage on the pink trace.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4y8zBGH0zY
Regards
Mike 8)
this is how it looks on my TPU
25.12.2021 Video: https://youtu.be/Ro3vB1rKMi0
The beat, washboard effect at the resonant frequency of the toroid..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAg5HK_u0kI
"A" = resonant frequency
"C" = "A" X 2 + 7.83HZ That is the .1+- that SM talked about
"B" = "A" X 3 + 23.49Hz
The current going into C2 is near DC. Any resonant frequency change caused by C2 is very limited and is in the same ratio as if without. C2 and the "B" switching is the means of extracting the loop power.
Regards
Mike 8)
I want to talk about where does the TPU power comes from.
I have always said that you don't get anything for nothing, the excess power has to come from somewhere, as in wind turbines or solar panels, which are a good example.
A wind turbine has to overcome resistance caused by the Lenz law of equal and opposite magnetic fields, like all generators. It is this resistance to change that will never make an OU generator.
Solar panels do not have that problem as they convert energy directly from the sun without using electromagnetic fields, but they are not very efficient at doing that, some 22% at best.
The sun stores a huge amount of energy within our Ionospherer/Earth "capacitance", I have talked about this a lot. The capacitor is an AC capacitor that is running in the world circuit at 7.83Hz
The voltage is huge, millions of volts, but the current is low, so how can we obtain usable power out of this! Let me explain my solar panels, each panel produces 48v at 8.5amps DC, and they are connected in series which gives me 480v at 8.5amps DC. This goes into my converter to create 230v AC, 50Hz, the power, watts, comes from reducing the voltage to half and so doubling the current to 17amps (my resonant converter is 96% efficient). Converting high voltage lower current to lower voltage higher current is what part of the TPU does by using this extremely high voltage low current, from the Earth's capacitance.
Extracting this from the Earth's capacitance is done by using the same medium that the Earth stores this voltage. It is not magnetic, it is a plasma/static charge "ionic", so the TPU creates a similar medium, and the two mix and adds, such as magnetic fields in a transformer, but here they are not magnetic. A plasma conducts and has zero resistance, it is an ionic soup that can be converted back into electrons purely by switching it OFF and collecting the charge produced.
I hope that opens one's eyes to another dimension, a different mode or perspective.
Regards
Mike 8)
Post 164 should read + 23.49 and not 15.66, it has been corrected
Regards
Mike 8)
Post 164? this post is 157.
Mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2021.12.28, 04:36:54
Post 164? this post is 157.
Mags
Sorry 154, my bad eyes :'(
Still that is one frequency that needs a lot of fine tuning, it is the power catching
Regards
Mike 8)
The last few day's frequencies, and time of day.
Just for the interest of the bandwidth.
Regards
Mike 8)
And here is the intensity for the same period
Regards
Mike 8)
Hello Mike
want to ask if you got also the gyroscopic sensation or turbine effect as SM mentioned?
Norbert
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.12.26, 11:26:33
I want to talk about where does the TPU power comes from.
I have always said that you don't get anything for nothing, the excess power has to come from somewhere, as in wind turbines or solar panels, which are a good example.
A wind turbine has to overcome resistance caused by the Lenz law of equal and opposite magnetic fields, like all generators. It is this resistance to change that will never make an OU generator.
Solar panels do not have that problem as they convert energy directly from the sun without using electromagnetic fields, but they are not very efficient at doing that, some 22% at best.
The sun stores a huge amount of energy within our Ionospherer/Earth "capacitance", I have talked about this a lot. The capacitor is an AC capacitor that is running in the world circuit at 7.83Hz
The voltage is huge, millions of volts, but the current is low, so how can we obtain usable power out of this! Let me explain my solar panels, each panel produces 48v at 8.5amps DC, and they are connected in series which gives me 480v at 8.5amps DC. This goes into my converter to create 230v AC, 50Hz, the power, watts, comes from reducing the voltage to half and so doubling the current to 17amps (my resonant converter is 96% efficient). Converting high voltage lower current to lower voltage higher current is what part of the TPU does by using this extremely high voltage low current, from the Earth's capacitance.
Extracting this from the Earth's capacitance is done by using the same medium that the Earth stores this voltage. It is not magnetic, it is a plasma/static charge "ionic", so the TPU creates a similar medium, and the two mix and adds, such as magnetic fields in a transformer, but here they are not magnetic. A plasma conducts and has zero resistance, it is an ionic soup that can be converted back into electrons purely by switching it OFF and collecting the charge produced.
I hope that opens one's eyes to another dimension, a different mode or perspective.
Regards
Mike 8)
Extracting this from the Earth's capacitance is done by using the same medium that the Earth stores this voltage. It is not magnetic, it is a plasma/static charge "ionic", so the TPU creates a similar medium, and the two mix and adds, such as magnetic fields in a transformer, but here they are not magnetic. A plasma conducts and has zero resistance, it is an ionic soup that can be converted back into electrons purely by switching it OFF and collecting the charge produced.
Well prove that's how it work's So where does that energy come from in the first place ! your just guessing.
:o Sil
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2022.01.12, 16:20:28
Extracting this from the Earth's capacitance is done by using the same medium that the Earth stores this voltage. It is not magnetic, it is a plasma/static charge "ionic", so the TPU creates a similar medium, and the two mix and adds, such as magnetic fields in a transformer, but here they are not magnetic. A plasma conducts and has zero resistance, it is an ionic soup that can be converted back into electrons purely by switching it OFF and collecting the charge produced.
Well prove that's how it work's So where does that energy come from in the first place ! your just guessing.
:o Sil
The Ionosphere.
The Ionosphere is a series of regions in parts of the mesosphere and thermosphere where high-energy radiation from the Sun has knocked electrons loose from their parent atoms and molecules. The electrically charged atoms and molecules that are formed in this way are called ions, giving the ionosphere its name and endowing this region with some special properties.
So like for solar cells, the energy comes from the SUN, and it is distributed all around the Earth like a ball-shaped capacitor. When the charge gets too high in places, such as clouds with ice crystals, etc. you get a discharge, lightening. The Earth's magnetic field has an effect on this charge and can be seen in the polar regions as an Aurora (Northern lights). A capacitor stores charge in the same way.
Not guessing, but after many years of working this out before even starting, Steven Mark may be on his own or had help, but he found out how to do this, a capacitive transformer, and mixer using the same medium. So how do you create ions!! they are formed when electrons are extracted from a medium and form a plasma, a plasma is made up of ions, switch off the plasma and the ions revert back into electrons, the charge between the plates has increased and is extracted.
A simple DC to DC boost converter changes low voltage high current into a higher voltage but lower current, they also come as resonant converters, which are close to but not OU. If you had a source of energy in the form of charge, then you find a way to add a little of that charge into the system and push it to OU. Capacitance with an ionic medium is your mixing bowl.
Regards
Mike 8)
Any progress on this project?
In it's final stages of replication and understanding how this works.
Excited to read more about it!
Due to unforeseen circumstances, I am posting here all that you need to build the STEAP TPU.
I was little by little giving information to a few in a form of my experiences over the years of how I came to find how this works, it was a learning curve, each change in design was to bring you closer to the end product, but maybe it was not appreciated in that form. If this is so, I apologise, but I hope you have had some increased knowledge as I have had over the years, and you will have realised the complication of building this with little or no real information.
Attached is all you need to know, in the end, if you look at it closely before you decide to build, I am sure you will see and understand the mechanism by which it works, but not where the added energy actually comes from, I am not sure on that part, for me, there are 3 possibilities which I will leave up to you to work that out, anyway it is good for debate instead of war with a mad man.
SM was very careful on what he gave out, a lot was misleading and I needed to read between the lines, or disassociate from what he said because it was not the real truth. In the latter days, he started giving some real information, but it was so incomplete that it took a long time to fill in the missing pieces. In all, it has taken me three and a half years to complete this project, and I am now going to take a rest from it, it really is quite exhausting mentally.
I must also apologise to Lindsay for keeping him out of the loop, pun intended, as he just was too close to the SM contacts, and I started getting some very unnerving things happening which is driving my wife mad with me for continuing with this project.
I am not open to questions, all the information is here, once you realise how it runs you can easily build it.
Good luck
Regards
Mike
I was wondering how the coils kept swapping places and mosfets were N's on one drawing and P's on the next .
Thanks for all your work and the more rational explanation of its operation mode , which seems to be what many other configs used wether they knew it or not .
Has any body had replication success using the right info?
I'm not sure I want to start another wind in light of being out of the loop .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.03.26, 10:02:29
I was wondering how the coils kept swapping places and mosfets were N's on one drawing and P's on the next .
Thanks for all your work and the more rational explanation of its operation mode , which seems to be what many other configs used wether they knew it or not .
Has any body had replication success using the right info?
I'm not sure I want to start another wind in light of being out of the loop .
Hi Lindsay, I am in the UK atm at a family reunion. The mosfets was a problem of my computer application, they were always N type, but what ever I did they came as P types when using enhanced type.
Regards
Mike
From my phone
Someone speculate how long a pair of 9v in series would last as the mosfet drivers? If need, I have a bunch of Lion bats too with some up to 3A. Had issues with just how the torrids were wound so passed on this till now.
So to confirm, top torrid has a core of 3 to 6 shorted winds on the inside and the other half is 3 winds shorted between the two halfs of the torrid. That is the only thing left that I need to go. I see the 4047 circuit is missing the other two chips so not needed now.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.03.29, 15:09:02
Someone speculate how long a pair of 9v in series would last as the mosfet drivers? If need, I have a bunch of Lion bats too with some up to 3A. Had issues with just how the torrids were wound so passed on this till now.
So to confirm, top torrid has a core of 3 to 6 shorted winds on the inside and the other half is 3 winds shorted between the two halfs of the torrid. That is the only thing left that I need to go. I see the 4047 circuit is missing the other two chips so not needed now.
thay
Top and bottom are exact copies, you need at least 3 turns but 6 is better. They are shorted and top and bottom are joined together, they are just one plate of a capacitor, the other plate being the coils wound over the top.
Top and bottom Toroids are just a continuation of each other, it just makes it all compact, it could be just one bigger diameter Toroid.
SM's bigger Toroids were two as well but running as two parallel connected TPUs for more power.
Still on my journey home, should be back tonight
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.03.29, 15:09:02
Someone speculate how long a pair of 9v in series would last as the mosfet drivers? If need, I have a bunch of Lion bats too with some up to 3A. Had issues with just how the torrids were wound so passed on this till now.
So to confirm, top torrid has a core of 3 to 6 shorted winds on the inside and the other half is 3 winds shorted between the two halfs of the torrid. That is the only thing left that I need to go. I see the 4047 circuit is missing the other two chips so not needed now.
thay
OK back home.
The two 9v batteries will last a very long time, they do not power the TPU, only the electronics. To start the TPU you have to charge up the capacitors to at least 70v DC and the capacitors have to have a value to be able to get the plasma started and start receiving return power. I use two very big capacitors in parallel with the onboard capacitors ( 6800uF at 250v each), once started they can be disconnected, as the return will build up sufficient power to keep it going. "I believe" SM always started his TPUs before a demonstration and in another room, his moving of a magnet around the toroid was pure theatrics.
What I have shown here is a 300-500watt unit and it will depend on the quality of the build, it is also important to use the correct wire or it will fail very quickly from the modification to materials and heat build-up. (this plasma is used in industry for material modification).
Regards
Mike
Mike, if your TPU produces plasma as the source of energy, how it will turn off when flipped? Or you mean that was only BS what SM said about it?
Quote from: rensseak on 2022.03.31, 17:32:55
Mike, if your TPU produces plasma as the source of energy, how it will turn off when flipped? Or you mean that was only BS what SM said about it?
It's not the source of energy, did I say it was!
Regards
Mike
It would not work for you if there is no plasma, right? But that is not the point I want to know from you.
Quote from: rensseak on 2022.03.31, 18:20:35
It would not work for you if there is no plasma, right? But that is not the point I want to know from you.
No plasma and it will not work, you could say the plasma is the core material, and the plasma moves and has a high current. Think about it because there are several possibilities where the energy is extracted, I am not sure myself on that one, neither was SM.
Whatever it comes from the ambient, be it static or magnetic.
Regards
Mike
Going back to Stevens descriptions he mentioned creating "catalyst" and plasma does tick a few boxes for this.
There have been a few different description of the central loops and for some time they were described as loops going around an back on themselves.
Now it seems that they are coils joined in the centre .
It would be helpful to get this part defined as its very hard to change after the careful overwinds are done .
Are they back and forward winds or 3 turns joined at the ends? or 3 loops joined?
This was never clear ...but being out of the loop that may have been purposefully vague .
Else my comprehension is just poor .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.04.01, 04:19:20
Going back to Stevens descriptions he mentioned creating "catalyst" and plasma does tick a few boxes for this.
There have been a few different description of the central loops and for some time they were described as loops going around an back on themselves.
Now it seems that they are coils joined in the centre .
It would be helpful to get this part defined as its very hard to change after the careful overwinds are done .
Are they back and forward winds or 3 turns joined at the ends? or 3 loops joined?
This was never clear ...but being out of the loop that may have been purposefully vague .
Else my comprehension is just poor .
Hi Lindsay
The description of a twin wire going back on itself was my idea as a "ONE FOR ALL" core. It basically gave all the possibilities you can imagine, so you would not have to wind any other (which is what I did in the end as I was fed up with winding "many" toroids.
I really think it does not have to be a toroid shape, it could be straight ;) A toroid shape uses less space, but it has a space where the ends meet which allows for connections. You have to think hard over those connections and the possibility of arcing over with some which are "capacitive", seems SM had that problem where he opened up to repair the problem, so forwarned.
There is only one core wire in the end, one plate of the capacitor, the other plate is the coils, especially the "b" coils, but also there is capacitance with the rest of the coils even though the loop is connected to the "A" mosfet drain. The loop is not an inductive element with the coils, it is only capacitive (quite clever).
Splitting the coils (center tapping) into a top and bottom toroid is also a space-saving idea of SM. The big TPUs were TWO TPUs entirely and why two CMCs, give twice as much power. The smaller one I have described (powering the TV, etc) is half the big TPUs of SM, as simple as that, but deceptive.
Regards
Mike
Thanks for the drawing Trino. It really jumps off the page ! and encourages a smaller build. And welcome to the forum.
Mike , The collector plate,lets call it, could be made from a tube/circle of tinned copper tube ?
Wound carefully with looser tension as the winds become larger . Wound whilst straight and filled with sand to stabilize the later bending .
It is quite a challenge to keep them lined up and I thought of using thicker insulation to compensate.
A former like a flat spring, like a slinky, could be made to keep the layers seperated and in line with each other.
It could be later coaxed into a circle ..or not.
It could then be fed with synthetic (non conducting ) high pressure tubing with a tiny expansion valve (pin hole)and cooled with a non conducting refrigerant possibly just air.
This was acknowledged back in 2006 as a possible solution to cooling before WE knew it was a plate an NOT a coil as was the encouraged "belief" back when.
It would be extremely interesting to know if the power generated was enough to cool it with any left over .
I know that this was a real and unresolved problem at that time .
It would depend on where the actual center of the heat source was of course. What do you think?
If there is anything I am missing I would value some catch up and I acknowledge some of the bizarre stuff that sound crazy. I believe that any pressure is off now.
Hi Trino
Welcome to the forum.
I have that cad as well, but probably because of my dislexia I find Tiny cad good for me.
Lindsay, the "collector" works on the basis of surface area, more area the higher the power factor. This is why it is loads of small strands, and the Tin is non corrosive along with the air removed when insulated. All very important against breaking, if you read up about DBD for material transforming in industry it will give you a great insight as to what happens inside the coils.
As far as heat is concerned, with a fan top center of the Toroid blowing down from a sealed top and bottom, the air passes out between the top and bottom toroids. A good uniform build is very important, I used a piece of nylon "cable pull through" which is perfect as it will not be affected by the plasma, or it seems not to. The more uniform the better as then there are no hot spots,think about it, but the wire I used is important.
Regards
Mike
Trino
Look at the attached.
The pink trace is the result of the propagation delays built into the way the solenoids are connected.
The multi-trace is showing the two inputs and the result.
These are real traces taken from the TPU, but without constant current inputs, just the input pulses at 5v from the signal generator.
The TPU will always resonate at its natural resonant frequency as long as the frequency of the pulse is a lot less than the Fr (resonant frequency).
Regards
Mike
Hi Michael:
Many thanks for the return. I am off to the wire store today. Wish I had a source for the Teflon but have to use regular for now. 47's 11's and 106's on the way. See if I need the 106. Can you confirm that all six ends of the core short at the break of the two torrids?
Was looking into the GroWatt and see it is 48v so this is set up to run a 48v load? Will order a GWatt or two if I am successful in the build.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.04, 15:59:19
Hi Michael:
Many thanks for the return. I am off to the wire store today. Wish I had a source for the Teflon but have to use regular for now. 47's 11's and 106's on the way. See if I need the 106. Can you confirm that all six ends of the core short at the break of the two torrids?
Was looking into the GroWatt and see it is 48v so this is set up to run a 48v load? Will order a GWatt or two if I am successful in the build.
thay
Thay, it is silicon insulation, not Teflon, and all the wire used should be this with Tinned multi strands, see attached.
Yes the "loops join together, it is one plate of a capacitor which has a large surface area, the other plate is the over wound solenoid coils.
Regards
Mike
Even Amason have this wire, or they did!
Regards
Mike
Aliexpress are the cheapest source and buying 4 core with silicone wire and sheath is an advantage but is slow and descriptions are not always accurate.
these guys gave me a good price on 20 mtrs
Kapton High temp tape is also handy
Once you use this silicone wire you will not want to use
much else on everything, its so easy to use , and re-use.
Teflon may work and if so, aviation wreckers are the best source. as they have no use for it.
I suggest staying with what Mike has said worked.
A witness to the early demos stated to me that is was made from 23/0076 lamp cord (the cut up one ). He would/should have known .
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001456100940.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef18023IUkPQ
Interesting reading up on plasma the word "Catalyst" is used extensively in literature around it.
All.
You should buy what I have shown, remember this is a capacitor, dielectrics and distances matter, how much atm I really don't know enough.
The TPU is highly capacitive and works with ratios of capacitance between the loop core and the solenoids.
It is to do with the maximum number of waves of the same frequency which is possible, and a self modulation.
Regards
Mike
Hi mike
Sorry to bother you but on post #30 ainachara makes a statement on the label order of the windings. States the order as being Core A C B but on the final schematic you show them as Core A B C. This order has to be right or it will mess with the timings. Is B in the middle or is C?
Correct wire is here tomorrow so would like to have the right setup. All other info is ready.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.05, 21:15:57
Hi mike
Sorry to bother you but on post #30 ainachara makes a statement on the label order of the windings. States the order as being Core A C B but on the final schematic you show them as Core A B C. This order has to be right or it will mess with the timings. Is B in the middle or is C?
Correct wire is here tomorrow so would like to have the right setup. All other info is ready.
thay
B is in the middle but when you wind the coils it will not matter until you connect them. The winding of the toroid is totally universal, no need to wind it any other way, afterwards, it is how you connect it.
It was all a learning curve of what is really happening, that was my idea, the worst part of learning how this works was winding loads and loads of toroids, so I devised how to wind for all possibilities.
By the way, the Growatt converter has a 48v input and charger for batteries, lithium-ion, but the main input is from 150-580v DC from solar panels ( all panels are wired in series up to the max output of 580v). It is not a cheap unit, over 1000€, but as you see it is perfect for a TPU which might have a variable input from 150v up to 580vDC and is completely automatic. It has two inputs, the second is for STEAP, when there is no sun it switches automatically.
Regards
Mike
Ok I am going to explain where and how the plasma starts, I thought that it would be seen!
Look at loop C1 which I call a plate of C1, it is connected at the drain of mosfet"A", but where is the other plate! The other plate of C1 is the "b" coils, the center tap to the "B" mosfet drain is switched to the ground when the mosfet switches ON.
C2 and C3 and the "b" coils are resonant circuits on their own and are powered by the transformer action with "a" and "c" coils. The resonant frequency of the "B" circuit should be near the Fr of the toroid but does not have to be exact. The whole part which is important is the timing, the switching relations, the time when energy is extracted, and the times when it is fed back. The "B" mosfet can be compared to the starter for a fluorescent tube, except here there is a point when extraction takes place.
The C2 and C3 are in the low nF range which will give a Fr in the "B" circuit near the Fr in the main toroid, it does not have to be exact but within 1- 10KHZ. When SM talked about different toroids running at different frequencies, it was the difference, like 5KHz, this is where this came from.
Regards
Mike
What type of caps are c2 and c3? voltage / type...high I imagine but how high.
What Mosfet type did you find worked for you .
These variables could make or break it.
Thanks in advance
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.04.06, 18:27:35
The resonant frequency of the "B" circuit should be near the Fr of the toroid but does not have to be exact.
Dear Mike,
what exactly do you mean with toroid in the above sentence? Are you talking here about the resonant frequency of the complete toroidial designal of mutual induction coils ABC and the capacitor plates or are you talking here about the core material. I find it difficult do determine if there is a core material at all or are we talking here about air coils?
Thank you
Quote from: Frederik2k1 on 2022.04.07, 05:55:48
Dear Mike,
what exactly do you mean with toroid in the above sentence? Are you talking here about the resonant frequency of the complete toroidial designal of mutual induction coils ABC and the capacitor plates or are you talking here about the core material. I find it difficult do determine if there is a core material at all or are we talking here about air coils?
Thank you
Look at the photos and the schematic.
a,b,c is one toroid, a1, b1 c1 is the other toroid. Really it is all one toroid with center tappings, it is split into two to save space and stacked, but the connections are exactly the same.
The "A"s and the "C"s form the main toroid (they are not really toroids, there is a gap where they join for connections), and the primary of the generator, the secondary is the "B" coils. You have to understand that ALL coils are both coils and capacitors, especially the "B" coils, they are the other plate of the C1 capacitor centering with the "collector" loop core. The whole of the TPU is highly capacitive.
The real core of the TPU can't be seen (not in normal light) it is a plasma created by the discharge on the outside of the dielectric of the loop and coils (DBD). Needed is around 2kv, this all depends on the build materials. A DBD is basically a CAPACITOR, now you see why the TPU is very capacitive. A plasma is formed by the extraction of electrons which then form ions, it is superconductive, and when it moves it naturally forms a magnetic field through the center of the now seen solenoids. There are many facets to the TPU, it is all these together that makes it work, and to get all these things to work together requires TIMING and RATIOS.
Regards
Mike
Another photo.
These are photos of my testbed STEAP TPU which I use for finding possible component reduction.
The only difference is the center loop configuration (it is universal), but now found that 3-6 twisted turns are all that is needed, twisted gives an angular effect which seems to work better (it is possible that it has to do with Thomson scattering, hence the reference of SM to the exploding TV). When the coils are wound over the top, they naturally have an angle to the collector but not so much.
Regards
Mike
PS foregot the second photo
Hi Mike:
On page 7 steap tpu 2022 revealed.png which side of the windings is the start? Right or left as I am done winding them counter clock wise but need to know the start and finish ends. Ready to start connecting the ends to their homes but unsure of the orientation.
thanks thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.11, 02:25:20
Hi Mike:
On page 7 steap tpu 2022 revealed.png which side of the windings is the start? Right or left as I am done winding them counter clock wise but need to know the start and finish ends. Ready to start connecting the ends to their homes but unsure of the orientation.
thanks thay
Right, it runs CCW
Regards
Mike
Finally get to report something constructive. Torrids wound and ready. Got all but the fet drivers and have one of the 47's up and going. Need to play with the values for freq. As of now, I have 26k to 1mhz variance. Only have 50k pots at the moment. Still looking for the 100k and 1nf. Was fortunate to find all but the drivers in my box. Just have to order the chokes and the hv cap and run caps. Want new for all that. More later.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.12, 18:14:14
Finally get to report something constructive. Torrids wound and ready. Got all but the fet drivers and have one of the 47's up and going. Need to play with the values for freq. As of now, I have 26k to 1mhz variance. Only have 50k pots at the moment. Still looking for the 100k and 1nf. Was fortunate to find all but the drivers in my box. Just have to order the chokes and the hv cap and run caps. Want new for all that. More later.
thay
Hold on building the driver atm as it may have to be reverted to different duty cycles as it was to start with. The 50% and locking up might not work to get to plasma voltages, timing is what is very important, will know more in the next few days.
I will explain more when more is known about the timing relation of the "B" circuit and the "C" circuit. The toroids are not the problem, the sequencing is as the feedback is from the "B" circuit, and the "b" coils are the pickup and plasma starter, no plasma and it will not run.
Regards
Mike
In reading through solarlab's attachment here: https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4261.msg98508#msg98508
I found it a very interesting read and wonder if some of the information presented in that PDF may be related to how the TPU works.
Quote from: e2matrix on 2022.04.13, 19:51:37
In reading through solarlab's attachment here: https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4261.msg98508#msg98508
I found it a very interesting read and wonder if some of the information presented in that PDF may be related to how the TPU works.
I have just quickly read through the attachment, very interesting, and yes it could well be. The energy has to come from somewhere, and the only places I think it can be from our ambient in the form of charge, created by the SUN in the first place. Interreaction with the Earth's magnetic field might play a part, but I think it is too weak, but I could be wrong.
What I have based my design on is a huge investigation into Steven Marks TPU, and you may well know that the information from him was very limited. The main part of this is the core of a very strange "transformer" if you can call it such. The core is the extractor of this energy, plasma.
Regards
Mike
From the videos..
The frequencies "slap" (clapping hands) together
and from else where
Push pull is the way to go .
I cant tell if this is helpful or a distraction Just let me know and I will cease "helping".
Well, had the controller finished before I read your post so decided to go ahead and play a bit. Did notice that I could never get the 4011 section a/b to gate at all. Wired up a second 4011 on a board and watched the output when switching pin one. No change at all, always high. Did get all the 4047's to work properly and generate a good signal. Have a feeling that I want to put a schmitt trigger on the outputs to make them fast switching. Will consider that as I find out what you have in store with your update.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.14, 02:26:45
Well, had the controller finished before I read your post so decided to go ahead and play a bit. Did notice that I could never get the 4011 section a/b to gate at all. Wired up a second 4011 on a board and watched the output when switching pin one. No change at all, always high. Did get all the 4047's to work properly and generate a good signal. Have a feeling that I want to put a schmitt trigger on the outputs to make them fast switching. Will consider that as I find out what you have in store with your update.
thay
Post the circuit you are using please, as something is wrong, maybe with values.
Regards
Mike
PS I think I have solved the 50% duty cycle problem in reducing components.
Like this, but you also need the drivers for the mosfets, and remember B is high side switching.
regards
Mike
Note that in the frequency pulse relation the oscillators are running at 50% duty all the time, but the sequencer auto changes the duty of A and B but C has to be always at 50% as it is creating the exact half-wave in the "c" coils so as they change sign exactly at 50% duty.
"B" has to synchronise with "C" at the right timing, "A" will follow whatever "B" is set to.
Regards
Mike
I was wired up as per your sch middle of post 167 and the redraw of Trino on post 179. The sch I see now only uses half of the 4011 and I see all the 4047's are now astable and not gated. So this is a new setup and I will have to start over. Need to check one of the 47's anyhow. Output wave is not square and has a slope on the top and bottom. Oh well, that's show biz.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.14, 08:29:20
I was wired up as per your sch middle of post 167 and the redraw of Trino on post 179. The sch I see now only uses half of the 4011 and I see all the 4047's are now astable and not gated. So this is a new setup and I will have to start over. Need to check one of the 47's anyhow. Output wave is not square and has a slope on the top and bottom. Oh well, that's show biz.
thay
Thay, do not rush this. The other circuit does work as is drawn by me, but it is not switching the circuit as I require (timing).
My whole thing now is to reduce the components down to a minimum, SM did it and now I think from my testing, this is how he used just basic Schmitt triggers as oscillators at 50% and with the sequencer auto-adjusted the duties of "A" and "B". The"C" MOSFET has to run at 50%, that is quite obvious, "A" has to run in a special way, as can be seen, it is the one which is offset. Following the switching sequence, the original way I did it used a lot of components and was a big big problem to tune.
SM tuned using only "B" and "C", and if you look they now control what "A" is doing.
The schematic works but has to be tested with the toroids etc.
Regards
Mike
Thanks for the updates. I am in no hurry at all. I still have parts to get and so just have to take it a step at a time. O0
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.14, 10:17:53
Thanks for the updates. I am in no hurry at all. I still have parts to get and so just have to take it a step at a time. O0
thay
Choose your pots for the 4047s so that you can fine-tune the frequencies, they are a bit tricky to tune. Toni on this thread is using a microprocessor, it is the way to go in the future. If you have a 3 channel FG you could use that now I have reduced it to 3, 50% duty signals, you can see how the sequencer does the rest, I really do not know why I did not think of it before, but there you are I'm getting old :'( things don't add up the same.
Regards
Mike
I found that a 1k pot in series with the 47k pot on the 4047 enabled fine tuning to function .
Good on the 3ch sig gen, just ordered a y8300 be here the 17th it said (we will see) In the end, arduino's may well work great. Just have to use the 3-5v boosters per output for good switching.
I have attached a better pulse diagram.
An Extention of this will show the repeating sequence.
Regards
Mike
This goes with the pulse train.
Regards
Mike
Well, have the trigger up and switching. Not really sure if this is correct tho. As a base line I used 1meg , 2.1meg , and 3.2m as per your post. Pic is channel 1 trigger only on 3.2 channel 2 is A out channel 3 is B out and channel 4 is C out. Hoping this is at least close to what is needed. I do notice that as I progress in time, the there is a rotation effect.
Been a treat, bad 4011, bad scope probe, sig gen not really what I expected. May go back to the 4047's and add a 5k pot to the 50k for fine. Any how, usable or still not right.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.04.21, 09:35:03
Well, have the trigger up and switching. Not really sure if this is correct tho. As a base line I used 1meg , 2.1meg , and 3.2m as per your post. Pic is channel 1 trigger only on 3.2 channel 2 is A out channel 3 is B out and channel 4 is C out. Hoping this is at least close to what is needed. I do notice that as I progress in time, the there is a rotation effect.
Been a treat, bad 4011, bad scope probe, sig gen not really what I expected. May go back to the 4047's and add a 5k pot to the 50k for fine. Any how, usable or still not right.
The signals should be clean, not as you have it.
thay
Very noisy, you should trigger channel 1, yellow (C) output, channel 2 green (A), and channel 3 violet (B). Use 5kHz for A, 10.5kHz for C, and 16kHz for B. I'm not sure what frequency is good for the CD4011 but MHz is too much.
Regards
Mike
In post 213 the pulse is slightly wrong, I did not notice my drawing until now, I have corrected it and extended it so you can see how it pans out, they are in order if you want to piece the three together ;)
When wiring the CD4011 you should tie ALL unused "inputs" to the ground as it seems the IC can falsely trigger, other NAND gate ICs might be better.
Regards
Mike
On page 8, the posts 178-199 are missing, it seems they have been deleted :D NOT BY ME, I will ask admin.
Regards
Mike
Important, the CD4011 should be changed for a CD4093BE which has Schmitt trigger inputs, the CD4011 can't handle the noise.
Regards
Mike
Mike, I've been following along and saving everything. I've got Page 8 saved as a PDF and I'll send it to you if that may help with getting it reposted (assuming it was accidentally deleted). I could attach it here but just in case admin didn't want it up for some reason ?? I'll send it to you in PM. Oops, my lateness - looks like it's already been restored... :-[
Quote from: e2matrix on 2022.04.30, 17:19:20
Mike, I've been following along and saving everything. I've got Page 8 saved as a PDF and I'll send it to you if that may help with getting it reposted (assuming it was accidentally deleted). I could attach it here but just in case admin didn't want it up for some reason ?? I'll send it to you in PM. Oops, my lateness - looks like it's already been restored... :-[
Thanks, yes it has been restored, seems someone sent in a bot to do some damage.
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike:
4093 set up and working good. Nice switching for a change. Pic is current setup with trigg on C, A on chan 2, and B on ch 3. Using your freq of 5Kz, 10.5Kz, and 16Kz. Attached is a pic of the scope output. Hope this is getting closer to the mark (pun intended), one very touchy unit far as timing goes.
thay
I tried lining up the images but they need vertical lines as ..i think that b should never be on when both a and c are on .
That may have changed but Thay's cro shot has them all on as well.
There is also a switching delay in the 4093 that might need accounting for .
I have decided to abort the y8300 and go back to the 4047 design for signals. It may be a bit more work to adjust but it does have one good point. There is a "hardware reset" pin on it. Mike did say that all the signals need to start at the same time. I think using an old trick of the yesteryear computers, the power on reset to do that may work out. Since there will be three chips to reset at the same time, thinking of using one of the unused gates of the 93 to do this. That should sync the starting of the 47's all at once.
This simple circuit has like in the movie short circuit, given me the red ass. Something this easy should not be so hard to get going. So far, I have had a conflict with B and A/C which Mike said will blow the fets. So until I can tame this little beast, I will halt construction even if it is almost complete now. Timing is everything and so far, mine is off in left field.
thay
I am still looking into reducing down the components. Today I have ended up in emergencies at our hospital, I have been suffering for some weeks with various pains which have got lower and lower in my back and abdomen. They are doing tests and waiting results, but probably to do with my kidneys. A long day.
Regards
Mike
Health first, this can wait. I have to wait anyhow for more 47's to show. Had a bad one from the start and it finally smoked. Thanks for all you have gave. Be well
thay
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.05.04, 17:24:47
I am still looking into reducing down the components. Today I have ended up in emergencies at our hospital, I have been suffering for some weeks with various pains which have got lower and lower in my back and abdomen. They are doing tests and waiting results, but probably to do with my kidneys. A long day.
Regards
Mike
So sorry, Mike - hope you recover soon!
Hi all:
Mike, sure hope you are better. I went through a kid stone and it was hell. Be better soonest.
I need to verify something with the group that is currently building this. I read that C frequency is the driving trigger for both A and C. So with that in mind, if a way to clock A separately with C it will follow no matter what B is doing. And with that, If a way to clock B separately from A that should be ok as well. Tho, only if the signals C, A, and B start at the same time which is what Mike said has to happen. I have devised a way on paper so far for this to happen and a simple power on reset for the three 4047's so that the timing is held true.
I have to run this up on a plug board yet so not tested at all. As is, it seems to follow the current wave form chart that was posted lately. Sadly it will not be the 2 gate system shown. But I am happy with 3 chips and a couple of transistors to make it work. Propagation delays will be an issue so will have to pad some signals to put into proper alignment.
Now for the wire up. Will post if it works out.
thay
I'm away at our apartment taking it easy. Thank you all for your concerns. I still have low back pains but with the meds it is sufferable.
The wave sequence should auto regulate. There is just one thing to remember SM showed the sequence with the brown paper drawings using gates, though that is not a complete running circuit as is.
Remember that the frequencies are not exact harmonic switching, but there is a relation were the series repeats itself.
Will explain more when I am home in the next days
Regards
Mike.
Earlier in the piece I made a shunting arrangement which shunted the led on 3120 . It seemed to do the trick with the 8300 gen .
I did not have other info then
Any way, think about shunting logic as a sure means to switch the driver led off rather than gating which brings delays and noise .
I cant get precision frequencies with the 4047 , at least not enough to get reliable ,repeatable 8hz modulation .
One can also use fibre optic switching if local rf pickup becomes the problem.
Y8300 users:
My unit came with no disk or manual so have to get them. Sadly, software is for Windows only and I am a Linux user. Mine powers on with 10kzh 5v 3 phase output. Can that be re-programmed with what ever I want? And if so, does it start all three channels at the same point? Like others, I have issues with the 4047 being not so stable. Adjustment is tedious at best but can be set. I use 50K+1K trimmers and 1nf caps and can do the 5K, 10.5K and 16K easy.
thay
You might be stuck with yootuube videos .
It feels like a fiddly, cheap toy and is not perfect, but it is highly capable for what we need as far as I can see.
I had a and c, driving via diodes, a single shunt transistor across the B led input.
At that Time it was when the info had pulse width as the main game .
You can adjust many parameters , save to mem locations , etc etc .
The manual is just there, the interface software is klunky but a win computer ....any win computer will do the job
we cant export and share setups which is a bummer but screen shots do the job.
phase adjustments work well but in most cases a store and reboot synches them properly .
The S model has modulation inputs that may come in handy but the basic model is just as good ATM.
Tip... system /save will save current config to the boot up location.
and check and double check the leads that come with it .
Off to a good start. I have the 4047's running good. Power on reset works great. Power down and reapply, a short delay while all the power levels out and all gates ready then the signals start. Did away with the transistors and added some inverters. Timing will be radical due to the propagation delays involved. 50K+1K and 1nf timing allows for needed frequencies.
Need sleep now. Long night and day.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.05.11, 06:08:43
Off to a good start. I have the 4047's running good. Power on reset works great. Power down and reapply, a short delay while all the power levels out and all gates ready then the signals start. Did away with the transistors and added some inverters. Timing will be radical due to the propagation delays involved. 50K+1K and 1nf timing allows for needed frequencies.
Need sleep now. Long night and day.
thay
Very good.
Back home today but still in pain. I have reverted back to using the LMC660CN opamp IC in my attempt to reduce down components. I have designed 2 of the opamps as comparators in a different way, but need to test if it works as I need.
What I have done is I have fed in the oscillator outputs where the first comparator is comparing the C pulse with the B pulse, and then the B pulse with the A pulse. Note I have halved the B and A voltages so that there can't be any miss triggering due to the voltages of the ON pulses being near the same. The inputs are wired for inverting outputs.
This should give the right sequence and duties needed, at least on paper it does. As the outputs are near Vcc then, feeding LEDs in the Mosfet drivers no other components are needed.
Regards
Mike
Well, great news! My circuit does in fact switch correctly and keeps B off when A or C are on. Do have some propagation delay issues as I have not compensated for it yet. Looks to be around 52ns overlap so will pad with extra gates to get rid of it.
My 1nf caps do not seem to be up to the task so a bit jumpy on frequencies. Now that I have the switching good, I will order all the other parts and get to the task. Looking forward to see how the op-amp design goes. Mine has 4 chips and uses one gate of each except the inverter.
Since this is Mikes thread, I am hesitant to post the sch here as not to derail where he is going with his. Could send a pic private if you would like to see it. It will be as Mikes design is, open source and free to all in the world.
Now if I could just figure out the truth table for the opamp? ;)
thay
Thay, you can post whatever you want, I have no problem with it.
SM used his method of producing the drive and I am doing mine, the only thing we need is to have the same results.
Thanks for your work, regards
Mike
Will hold off for a bit longer. I still can not figure out how to rid the 53ns spike on the B out. This is 3X the response time of the mosfets I have. If I take B to 40% duty, it goes away. Will try the hex-inv circuit you showed earlier to see if it will work. As it stands, C still has no padding on it other than 4 invert gates. May try say 100ns on the C input to the C/B side to see if that works. Still have 3 nand gates available. Each at 100.
Other than that, I drew out the resultant wave forms and they match your latest plot.
I am at the start of my 12hr workdays so will be next week before I can resume. Till then.
Thanks for the great work you are sharing with us. This is a fun and frustrating project to make me want to work it.
thay
This is just a heads up regarding my switching path .
It may or may not seem useful depending on your state of need regarding isolated switching.
This guy has developed far more than just electrical isolation and I am certain it will hold interest to any body looking for a better switch .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pS1zAAD1nXI
Mike, if think this off topic please delete.
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.05.22, 03:13:32
This is just a heads up regarding my switching path .
It may or may not seem useful depending on your state of need regarding isolated switching.
This guy has developed far more than just electrical isolation and I am certain it will hold interest to any body looking for a better switch .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pS1zAAD1nXI
Mike, if think this off topic please delete.
That was an interesting video, thanks for that.
The timing for the TPU has a specific job. If you think of the child swing, start at a high on the left, and just at the high on the right the fulcrum point (top of the swing) moves X 2 the distance the swing has traveled linearly, instantly to the right. So the child is always moving to the right, never BACKWARDS (BEMF). The trick is where the energy has come from to move the fulcrum point so that it is OU.
When you charge a coil from a DC supply, the polarity of the positive end connection is in fact negative. When you disconnect a switch on the opposite end of the coil, the polarities of the coil ends change and the charge wants to discharge in the same direction as it was charging to start if there is somewhere for it to go (a capacitor for example). The only energy lost here is the switching loss, very small. If you have two of these linked together in a certain way (A and C), you now start to see how the child is always moving to the right as though he is a DC current.
In this case, there is no BEMF only FEMF (Foreward electromagnetic force). This is how a boost converter works to create a higher voltage from a lower DC voltage, but at the cost of current, but what if there was no cost of current, current is added from another source!!
Regards
Mike
QuoteIn this case, there is no BEMF only FEMF (Foreward electromagnetic force). This is how a boost converter works to create a higher voltage from a lower DC voltage, but at the cost of current, but what if there was no cost of current, current is added from another source!!
That is why I added the audio feedback component. A simple 9 vdc connection and speaker spacing promotes an increasing power oscillation to feed the charge pump. It keeps blowing the amp.
QuoteThis guy has developed far more than just electrical isolation and I am certain it will hold interest to any body looking for a better switch .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pS1zAAD1nXI
Thanks for the video, when I was younger I spent months designing and doing experiments on light based logic gates/computers as well as new forms of cryptography. So this video was right up my alley...
I thought it was neat how near the end of the video he talks about an optical lock even the "lock picking lawyer" could not open. I found this concept is also true of free energy devices and advanced technology. The only reason someone can pick a lock is by having some prior knowledge of how they work. If this knowledge is not present or the technology is not based on our prior knowledge then it's basically impossible to crack.
This also relates to my work in cryptography and the most secure methodology is not as simple as any given code or cipher. The most secure method is embedding the information in the last place anyone would ever think to look. I have found this is also true of advanced technology and the real process is always hidden beneath many other layers of processes. Which explains why so few can find what there looking for because there looking in all the wrong places.
So we should understand that most popular beliefs are often false beliefs based on normalcy. I mean, 99% of people think a lock can protect them then an expert locksmith walks through there locked front door as if it wasn't even there in under 10 seconds. Why even call it a lock if any real expert can open it in seconds?, it's an illusion, a joke.
Regards
AC
Quote from: giantkiller on 2022.05.24, 02:47:12
That is why I added the audio feedback component. A simple 9 vdc connection and speaker spacing promotes an increasing power oscillation to feed the charge pump. It keeps blowing the amp.
Take a look at this and tell me which you think is right! The output of this feeds the input, this is not just a voltage multiplier, the "b" coils, and MOSFET "B" is quite special. The "c" solenoids and the "b" solenoids are not just primary and secondary of a transformer. C1 is where the plasma forms, it IS a capacitor and it is made up of the loop core and the "b" coils, it is a resonant circuit that creates a very high voltage and causes the plasma, no plasma and this does not work.
The plasma is formed by the high voltage and the extraction of electrons. These electrons create ions, both positively and negatively charged ions, positive ions are attracted to the cathode and negative ions to the anode. This movement of charge is an electric current because current, in amperes, is simply the movement of charge.
I hope that has enlightened, this is why "B" switches ON only when "A" and "C" are OFF and discharging into the LC resonant circuit.
At resonance, there is a huge voltage across C1, and the silent plasma forms.
The Grd: symbols are ground reference points only as they change polarity (capacitor in a resonant circuit or a transformer secondary).
Regards
Mike
Well, think I finally have this figured. Attached is a scope shot of C B A and it used only two and gates and two inverters. What a fight. A lot of noise on the lines as had to fire up the old coin miner right next to me. Other one blew a power supply and fried it.
Will be adding this to my 47's and getting the rest of the circuits put in. Using the y8000 for testing here so not the output of the 47 board. I will be drawing up the circuit and posting it later.
So here is the circuit I made up. Hope it is usable or helpful in the journey.
Attached below. enjoy
thay
ps just tested the draw and it is 1.3 mA
Here is a primer i found ,note that its many years old with not so many views.
It is almost 100% of what my approach is .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV2CCIiPnVQ
Any way toslink connectors and fast fet drivers seem to be the go . more later.
I wonder why fets with fiber inputs ,or even fet drivers with fiber inputs don't seem to exist ..Please chime in if you know of such animals.
There is a lot to learn but I have found that the noise becomes uncontrollable using the common method with 3120 .
That could be for many reasons ,even incompetence on my part .
This enables just the ir receiver and fet + driver (active switch components) to be inside the circle.
Im not sure if the ir receiver diode will be swamped yet but there is the opportunity to shield the receiver module
Each unit is isolated each supply source is isolated.
This is not designed to be over-unity, just to be able to control the process.
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.06.04, 00:13:34
I wonder why fets with fiber inputs ,or even fet drivers with fiber inputs don't seem to exist ..Please chime in if you know of such animals.
I've found it's generally hard to find photodiodes that respond well at very high frequencies without at least a gain stage or two in-between. And even once you grab a few off Mouser it's still tricky. Generally you drive the diode in with a high-value resistor in series and detect the pulldown on a digital detector.
To get a good signal I'd either need lots of light, or have an unusable frequency.
Lensing was also tricky if you're using DIY fiber optics (maybe there are LED's+diodes with pre-fixed ST-ST connectors though?
The trick would be getting the diode balanced right on the knife-edge in front of your FET driver so it will trigger fast enough with the right amount of light. Or maybe using a comparator or op-amp in-between to help buffer the input.
The experiment was from a few years ago when attempting to use an optical interferometer to create an ultra-precise microgram balance scale to measure the effects of EMDrive and Quantitized Inertia on a bench-scale.
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.06.04, 01:07:17
I've found it's generally hard to find photodiodes that respond well at very high frequencies without at least a gain stage or two in-between. And even once you grab a few off Mouser it's still tricky. Generally you drive the diode in with a high-value resistor in series and detect the pulldown on a digital detector.
To get a good signal I'd either need lots of light, or have an unusable frequency.
Lensing was also tricky if you're using DIY fiber optics (maybe there are LED's+diodes with pre-fixed ST-ST connectors though?
The trick would be getting the diode balanced right on the knife-edge in front of your FET driver so it will trigger fast enough with the right amount of light. Or maybe using a comparator or op-amp in-between to help buffer the input.
The experiment was from a few years ago when attempting to use an optical interferometer to create an ultra-precise microgram balance scale to measure the effects of EMDrive and Quantitized Inertia on a bench-scale.
I'm not sure that you understand , I am using toslink connectors and fibre optic cable as in the video . I would not attempt to make it open although it could be done .
Toslink technology and the connectors are used in the audio industry as a digital connection that avoids earth loops and degradation.
It pretty old hat these days where bluetooth is the go to in just about everything where the delay doesnt matter as it streaming.
Fibre optics can take gigahertz with the right stuff, we just need clean 1mhz .
Strange things going on on this tread, but isn't a TPU Thr Steven Mark's generator ?
Have a look at this this on the net >
Many people have attempted to replicate Tariel's work, and a self-powered replication can be seen at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbkvXoDfk7g.
The Kapanadze coil analysed by William J. McFreey.
Hi if you bother to look at this hyperlink it clearly changes from Kapanadze to Steven Mark
It clearly gives you important information, if you wish i can delete it :'(
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.06.04, 05:57:10
Toslink technology and the connectors are used in the audio industry as a digital connection that avoids earth loops and degradation.
TIL, was not aware of that, thanks!! O0
When researching pre-existing techs to try and save myself some dev time, I did not think to check the audio-industry C.C
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2022.06.04, 09:20:28
Strange things going on on this tread, but isn't a TPU Thr Simon Mark generator ?
Have a look at this this on the net >
Many people have attempted to replicate Tariel's work, and a self-powered replication can be seen at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbkvXoDfk7g.
The Kapanadze coil analysed by William J. McFreey.
TPU stands for toroidal power unit, because of its shape, but that is very misleading, it does not have to be that shape, it is to reduce its foot print.
His name is Steven Mark and he never showed how exactly it was put together, and he was very misleading, unlike myself I have been showing STEAP through my years of investigation, but in a form that I have lived those years, that is you have to think and experiment as well.
This tech does not come with a free circuit diagram, plug in all the bits and switch On.
What I have shown is very close, you have to use your brain to unravel the puzzle, it is easier than you may think.
This is not a generator, it is an atmospheric ion extractor, the medium is plasma. All around us are ions which are formed by the extraction of electrons.
ATM I have not shown the Exact circuits on this forum or any other, there could be a health risk as it seems to give off X rays, well sufficient to activate photo X ray tabs use in hospital X ray areas.
This is all being looked into by professional people and time will tell where this goes in the end. It can not be a free for all when there are possible inherent risks.
This is not a generator, it is an extractor, the generator is the Sun.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.04, 16:29:50
TPU stands for toroidal power unit, because of its shape, but that is very misleading, it does not have to be that shape, it is to reduce its foot print.
His name is Steven Mark and he never showed how exactly it was put together, and he was very misleading, unlike myself I have been showing STEAP through my years of investigation, but in a form that I have lived those years, that is you have to think and experiment as well.
This tech does not come with a free circuit diagram, plug in all the bits and switch On.
What I have shown is very close, you have to use your brain to unravel the puzzle, it is easier than you may think.
This is not a generator, it is an atmospheric ion extractor, the medium is plasma. All around us are ions which are formed by the extraction of electrons.
ATM I have not shown the Exact circuits on this forum or any other, there could be a health risk as it seems to give off X rays, well sufficient to activate photo X ray tabs use in hospital X ray areas.
This is all being looked into by professional people and time will tell where this goes in the end. It can not be a free for all when there are possible inherent risks.
This is not a generator, it is an extractor, the generator is the Sun.
Regards
Mike
~Hmm well i'm not sure i would agree with you on some of your statements there is one video that explains some of it's inner workings or the guys name being real and in order to generate ions which is just an extra atom you need a spark generator not the sun and some kind of fuel source like aluminium or brass something rich in free electrons. One form of radiation it will produce is electro magnetic radiation impules, the same way ET gets here. Any way enough.
Sil
Quote from: AlienGrey on 2022.06.04, 22:49:00
~Hmm well i'm not sure i would agree with you on some of your statements there is one video that explains some of it's inner workings or the guys name being real and in order to generate ions which is just an extra atom you need a spark generator not the sun and some kind of fuel source like aluminium or brass something rich in free electrons. One form of radiation it will produce is electro magnetic radiation impules, the same way ET gets here. Any way enough.
Sil
Ions are generated from plasma, and plasma is formed when one or more electrons are extracted. Plasma is extreamly easy to make even at atmospheric pressure and without heat, it is called a DBD or cold plasma.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.05, 09:47:39
Ions are generated from plasma, and plasma is formed when one or more electrons are extracted. Plasma is extreamly easy to make even at atmospheric pressure and without heat, it is called a DBD or cold plasma.
Regards
Mike
The problem with ions and streamers is it produces ozone and it neutralises static electricity.
the high voltage pure spike is used to do something else here (I wont go into) all this is down to timing and
going through the Don smith vids can help with the learning process.
More on ions can be found here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_ioniser
My interest is purely educational (i don't build machines)
Sil
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.04, 16:29:50
This is not a generator, it is an atmospheric ion extractor, the medium is plasma. All around us are ions which are formed by the extraction of electrons.
Centraflow, is there possibly a simpler design/setup that would demonstrate a novel effect without necessarily producing significant power?
It seems you are working on jet engines while the rest of the world is still trying to master the first Wright Bros flight :P :P
I'm thinking of the simplest configuration that demonstrates a concept, like a model steam engine.
How simple do you have to get to be called simple? Take a look at this schematic and tell me where it is complicated.
Switching may have gave me a run, but it made me look at the whole picture. Three coils, three signals, some caps and
diodes. Consider that the grenade coil would generate hv. Just touch it in the wrong place and get an arc.
thay
Centraflow
QuoteIons are generated from plasma, and plasma is formed when one or more electrons are extracted. Plasma is extreamly easy to make even at atmospheric pressure and without heat, it is called a DBD or cold plasma.
If the plasma electric universe theory is correct there may be no such thing as a plasma as we know it. Everything is plasma in one form or another.
We could think of it this way, if we were immersed in a plasma but at the same potential we would never know it. We only perceive and measure differences in potential just like a fish can sense currents but has no comprehension of the concept of water. Thus the universe could be immersed in a high density high energy plasma, the proverbial Aether/Dark Energy-Matter, and we would never know it. As such there is no need for any spooky actions at a distance.
I mean, nobody actually believes everything was created from nothing and Energy/Primary Fields/EM waves can travel through nothing do they?. It's a direct contradiction to all logic and reason. We cannot claim a space is devoid of all substance and then claim countless disturbances are traveling through that same space as we speak. That's a direct contradiction in terms.
So if we assumed the entire universe was a plasma then what were seeing as natural phenomena is little more than a rarefaction/concentration of something already present. In essence, nothing is ever created or destroyed only transformed...
Regards
AC
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.06.07, 23:39:12
How simple do you have to get to be called simple? Take a look at this schematic and tell me where it is complicated.
Switching may have gave me a run, but it made me look at the whole picture. Three coils, three signals, some caps and
diodes. Consider that the grenade coil would generate hv. Just touch it in the wrong place and get an arc.
thay
The circuit is not the problem, but the core configuration is. I would love to replicate it because of its high promising operation, but the exact configuration of coils, seem like acting like inductors and capacitors at the same time is not obvious to me. A 3D cad model of the coil would be beneficial. I even would like to create a cad model of it or rather my understanding of it but I'm not trained in CAD tools.
For the circuit design: I would rather create an digital circuit based on FGPA. This avoids this messing around with digital logic gates and creates at sufficient clock speed very precise timing which the synthesis tool of FPGA can ensure.
So all in all, the circuit and timing is not the problem, the core is.
Quote from: Frederik2k1 on 2022.06.08, 07:19:54
A 3D cad model of the coil would be beneficial.
Maybe this picture will help...
Regards
Toni
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.06.07, 23:39:12
How simple do you have to get to be called simple? Take a look at this schematic and tell me where it is complicated.
Switching may have gave me a run, but it made me look at the whole picture. Three coils, three signals, some caps and
diodes. Consider that the grenade coil would generate hv. Just touch it in the wrong place and get an arc.
thay
It took me a dozen test coils for me to to get enough information to accurate calculate the properties of a
single air-gapped cylindrical inductor. Adding two more sets of coils and near-field dielectric interactions and multiple interlaced harmonics makes the device very complex indeed. :o
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.11.24, 11:51:35
The question of creating a plasma trapped by a magnetic field is always subject to the mean free paths of the particles, and the ability of the field to contain even particles that would tend to escape the field, through multiple collisions. A charged particle goes in a circular motion around the magnetic flux lines, and its motion parallel to the lines is only affected by an increase in the value of the magnetic field since this would cause the magnetic flux lines to come closer. When this happens, the particle is reflected. This configuration happens in the magnetosphere, the plasma around the earth trapped inside Earth's magnetic field eg. ( The Van Allen Radiation Belt ).
At atmospheric pressure, the particles undergo collisions in their motion around the magnetic flux lines, and each collision makes them "jump" from one "circle" to another, causing them to diffuse perpendicular to the magnetic field, and perpendicular to the ground core of our solenoids, a thing that was impossible without collisions because of the constraining property of the magnetic field. The electrons are not completely confined, their density in the region of containment is still orders of magnitude higher than outside that region, but may have been of concern when Steven Mark had a visit from the Nuclear agency in the USA.
When particles are confined by a magnetic field, they circle in a characteristic radius equal to the gyroradius( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyroradius )of that couple magnetic field/particle. Unless you have tremendously high magnetic fields, or impossibly small speeds ( to ignite a plasma, electrons need speed, or they recombine fast), this gyroradius will be a lot more than microns. This means, finally, that your particles are not at all contained by the magnetic field, but rather by the speed of the decay of the plasma, they will usually recombine faster than they will escape the field.
In the TPU application of plasma, this fast recombination is not the case, the Atmospheric Dielectric Plasma, or DBD, which is bi-temperature, non-equilibrium plasma, is a cold gas plasma. This plasma consumes a lot less energy than the hot plasma and has proven plasma lifetimes high enough to observe "balls" of plasma, drifting together with the gas flow (simple mechanical flow) until a few tenths of centimeters. These "balls" of plasma are mostly rich in radicals, i.e. species, created by the plasma, that "should not exist" in the neutral gas because they have very short lifetimes. These radicals are used in plasma chemistry, material transformation, and why it is used to treat anything that can be "treated" by such radicals.
I have shown in the TPU that the core of the solenoids is a plate of a capacitor "C1", and that the inside surface of the solenoid coils is the other plate of "C1" (collector core is perpendicular to the solenoid coil, no induction, only capacitance). The way that the solenoid coils are connected to one another, a type of resonant delay line is created as the plasma on the surface of the dielectric passes through the solenoids. This delay creates movements of around a few Hz through the solenoids, this is the washboard effect that was talked about as movement felt within the TPU of Steven Mark.
See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetosphere_particle_motion
Absolute gold for me, thanks Centraflow.
I guess my open-ended question is focused to finding the absolute simplest embodiment that demonstrates capture/acceleration/manipulation/detection of cold plasma without necessarily producing energy. Fewer parts makes the process easier to illustrate+understand as well as easier to model.
* High voltages (to liberate plasma from conductor)
* Magnetic field (to confine the liberated plasma)
* Complex/alternating waves/impulses (to accelerate the plasma?)
It might be possible to achieve all three of these within a pair of properly-wound coils, or perhaps even a single coil? ??? C.C
Put an L/C meter across a similar setup. Each coil will have an L value. Now read the C to the core. The large wire group of the core is as said, one plate of the C and the coils are the other. I have measured that on mine.
thay
Gentlemen.
I have been away but am now back home.
Regards
Mike
Here is how SM hid his explanation of the 3 frequencies and the X 2.1 and X 3.2.
The drive is very simple, it is why there was very little in the way of electronics. It is a master oscillator which is the running frequency, the other two are also running at that frequency but NOT THE DUTY, "B" is 180º out of phase with "C" and "A".
I hope you see what has been done.
Regards
Mike
I think i have it, but to put it another way ...all at the same master resonant frequency, but a and b are only duty cycle adjusted?
Thanks Mike
Quote from: ainachara on 2022.06.08, 09:16:17
Maybe this picture will help...
Regards
Toni
Who is this coming from? Is that generated by you? I am impressed!
Is it possible to make the individual coils successively transparent in the image or can you send me the CAD file somehow?
Thank you.
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.06.09, 23:24:44
I think i have it, but to put it another way ...all at the same master resonant frequency, but a and b are only duty cycle adjusted?
Thanks Mike
Attached is how this is done. The "C" frequency, resonant frequency, can be made by any means, SG, crystal oscillator or another CD 4047 as in the attached.
Setting up should be done with an oscilloscope to obtain the right rising and falling edges as highlighted in color on the pulse drawing, this is where the tunning is required. The adjusting of the timing of the "one-shots" changes the ON time duration, it's that simple.
The outputs go to the MOSFET drivers and that's it. SM did not use opto drivers so he used buffers with a pull-up resistor to sharpen the pulse from his one-shots formed by gates. The CD 4047 sinks current, as well as buffers, do.
There now only remains how exactly the internal power loop and input are made, I have given all the hints but not the "exact" way.
Remember that a HV is needed across C1 (the core), this is where the electrons are extracted and positive and negative ions are formed, added and added.
Regards
Mike
I understand the idea of what you're doing, but am still a bit confused on some of the specifics.
1 - The core principle guiding the frequency mixing/parametrics/inter-harmonics. It sounds like the interaction creates a net-motion in the ions liberated via the high voltage?
Would this then be a fitting analogy for the concept? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsd5bH0y8g4
2 - Cold plasma interaction/acceleration/pumping via EM (or just magnetic) waves. Thankfully this is much easier to experiment with and confirm on the bench.
It sounds like the 'capture' is relative to the field density, I wonder if the field has to be active/changing or if a static field from a simple magnet might suffice?
Also a question is whether the ion storage/acceleration process is occurring inside the dielectric of the silicone wire or in the space between conductors. If it is inside the dielectric, then uncoated magnet wire might be completely unsuitable for these types of experiments. That by itself narrows things down immensely. It would also give us a clear list of materials as everything besides PTFE+HDPE+silicone tends to have fairly poor loss characteristics overall.
Thanks for sharing everything you have Centraflow ;) I'm just trying to break the core concepts down into bite-sized morsels. :P
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.06.10, 14:17:31
I understand the idea of what you're doing, but am still a bit confused on some of the specifics.
1 - The core principle guiding the frequency mixing/parametrics/inter-harmonics. It sounds like the interaction creates a net-motion in the ions liberated via the high voltage?
Would this then be a fitting analogy for the concept? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsd5bH0y8g4
2 - Cold plasma interaction/acceleration/pumping via EM (or just magnetic) waves. Thankfully this is much easier to experiment with and confirm on the bench.
It sounds like the 'capture' is relative to the field density, I wonder if the field has to be active/changing or if a static field from a simple magnet might suffice?
Also a question is whether the ion storage/acceleration process is occurring inside the dielectric of the silicone wire or in the space between conductors. If it is inside the dielectric, then uncoated magnet wire might be completely unsuitable for these types of experiments. That by itself narrows things down immensely. It would also give us a clear list of materials as everything besides PTFE+HDPE+silicone tends to have fairly poor loss characteristics overall.
Thanks for sharing everything you have Centraflow ;) I'm just trying to break the core concepts down into bite-sized morsels. :P
Thank you for your interest.
If you think about a transformer, the medium of transfer is the core which is an alternating magnetic field within iron or ferrite. STEAP uses a core as well for its transfer, but it is in itself not only magnetic, it is also ionic because it is a plasma, it is only magnetic if it moves.
I'm getting bitten to death by mosquitos on a terrace atm, so I'm going to continue this probably tomorrow, it's the time of day when they get hungry at 7 pm.
This gets warm, most silicons have a breakdown voltage of around 600v, 200ºc, the plasma forms ON the dielectric, you also need TIN-coated multi-strand copper as the plasma will oxidise the copper, multi-strand for a larger surface area. Ordinary flex could be used but it will not last for long, that was SM's problem "heat".
Regards
Mike
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37Kw61271Cs
I think a good proof-of-concept would be to build a Kundt tube and feed it the same harmonic series used by a TPU prototype.
If free ions/electrons are being 'pumped' harmonically then we might expect to see a similar pumping action with styrofoam beads. :P
An even larger+simpler version would involve a long chamber of water and a variable servo at one end to modulate wave action.
Not sure I have posted this before, but this shows what is happening wave-wise.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4y8zBGH0zY
The frequency is not really a mix, it is all the same frequency, it is multiple phasing created by a clever delay line. There is an ultimate frequency though, it is very slow, and it is in the moving wave action. This is all underlaying DC pulses which are formed from the two sources "A" and "C" which add up to near a 100% duty (DC).
Both "A" and "C" individually without the "toroid" coils are boost converters. The CMCs are just constant current supplies. The coils and the way they are connected form delays in the output pulses through inductance changes. The loop core is connected to the drain of "A" MOSFET and it is one plate of the C1 capacitor, the other plate is the "b" coils ground-referenced through the "B" MOSFET at a switching frequency which is the same as "A" and "C" but 180º out of phase. Why is this!! because the interest is the DISCHARGE area of "A" and "C", and not the charge timing. C1 (very complicated) and the coils are the resonant circuit which has a Fr resonant frequency which can be changed by the value of an added capacitor, C2.
The "B" mosfet acts as a resonant transition gate. Input power is only taken when the resonance is isolated. When "B" is ON the circuit is at full resonance with C1 and C2 in series. When "B" is OFF the frequency of resonance goes sky high because there are only the coils and their self-capacitance of them. This transition is the pump. With "B" OFF the chokes charge, you could say the front and back ends of the circuit do not see one another.
Regards
Mike
To save a lot of work that has already been done, look at Naudins site here
http://jlnlabs.online.fr/plasma/html/s_gdp3.htm
Look through other parts as he delved into cold plasma quite a lot.
Regards
Mike
This is caused by the delay formed by the coils.
I have posted this before, but it is important to understand that the resonance, albeit the same frequency, is multiple.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.11, 10:27:35
you could say the front and back ends of the circuit do not see one another.
I would also consider how the impedance of the coil is changing with respect to time, as loading+unloading will change the characteristics of the system as a whole (intermittently turning a half-wave resonator into a quarter-wave resonator and vice-versa).
If this were the case, then it might be possible to precisely predict the COP by measuring the ratio between the 'high-water' impedance and the 'low-water' impedance.
I count 24 phase shifts within each long-wave period of your clip. So, if the phase is continually advancing with respect to time, then every 23 natural cycles we would end up with 24 cycles of induction (buy 23 get 1 free ;D). That would result in a smaller but directly-predictable formula.
And if the phase is also advancing physically with respect to time, it might also be acting as an 'ion accelerator' (as the Kundt tube analogy above). That would better explain the need for HV in this configuration, but unfortunately leaves a bigger computational hole to model+predict the exact output in such a system. At the least we would expect it to be proportional to the standing DC high voltage at the center of the coil.
I appreciate all the 'kickstarters' you post, it is such a breath of fresh air to see theory+practice at the same time ;D (so many posts are either 100% theory with no experiments, or clear schematics with no operating principle/theory). O0
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.06.11, 15:19:54
I would also consider how the impedance of the coil is changing with respect to time, as loading+unloading will change the characteristics of the system as a whole (intermittently turning a half-wave resonator into a quarter-wave resonator and vice-versa).
If this were the case, then it might be possible to precisely predict the COP by measuring the ratio between the 'high-water' impedance and the 'low-water' impedance.
I count 24 phase shifts within each long-wave period of your clip. So, if the phase is continually advancing with respect to time, then every 23 natural cycles we would end up with 24 cycles of induction (buy 23 get 1 free ;D). That would result in a smaller but directly-predictable formula.
And if the phase is also advancing physically with respect to time, it might also be acting as an 'ion accelerator' (as the Kundt tube analogy above). That would better explain the need for HV in this configuration, but unfortunately leaves a bigger computational hole to model+predict the exact output in such a system. At the least we would expect it to be proportional to the standing DC high voltage at the center of the coil.
I appreciate all the 'kickstarters' you post, it is such a breath of fresh air to see theory+practice at the same time ;D (so many posts are either 100% theory with no experiments, or clear schematics with no operating principle/theory). O0
You are welcome. It is a very deep rabbit hole, but there is light at the end of the tunnel if you keep at it.
HV is a must to create the DBD, no plasma no ionic interreaction.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.11, 15:56:08
HV is a must to create the DBD, no plasma no ionic interreaction.
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Schematic-of-a-DBD-plasma-actuator_fig1_310632302
After cursory research, I think exploration of the properties of Dielectric Barrier Discharge plasma easily warrants its own thread and more detailed study.
Initial experiments would likely be geared toward static and applied magnetic fields to see if such cold plasmas can be accelerated, suppressed, or bent akin to what happens in a CRT.
Seeing that schematic of a DBD plasma actuator reminds me of my time working with missile radomes where one source of noise in the radar was charge flowing across the outer surface of the radome. This was called streaking. Raindrop impact on the surface caused the charge in the form of electrons to be deposited there by the tribo-electric effect. When sufficient charge was deposited there would be a discharge path across the surface to the missile metal skin. I was also involved with detection of explosives using ion mass spectrometry that used something like a cathode ray gun but unlike cathode ray electrons that travel in vacuum the ions travel in gas so the behavior is quite different. Don't fall into the trap of believing the plasma will behave like cathode rays.
Smudge
Quote from: Smudge on 2022.06.14, 14:31:15
Seeing that schematic of a DBD plasma actuator reminds me of my time working with missile radomes where one source of noise in the radar was charge flowing across the outer surface of the radome. This was called streaking. Raindrop impact on the surface caused the charge in the form of electrons to be deposited there by the tribo-electric effect. When sufficient charge was deposited there would be a discharge path across the surface to the missile metal skin. I was also involved with detection of explosives using ion mass spectrometry that used something like a cathode ray gun but unlike cathode ray electrons that travel in vacuum the ions travel in gas so the behavior is quite different. Don't fall into the trap of believing the plasma will behave like cathode rays.
Smudge
You are quite right, it is not like inside a cathode ray tube. DBD is even more special because the plasma forms between two plates of a capacitor, to be exact, on the dielectric. It is here that there is a huge charge buildup.
STEAP uses this to gain charge from the ion's within the atmosphere, that charge that always exists which was created by the Sun and resulting in the Ionesphere which safe guards extream radiation from the Sun, but still there is charge always.
The plasma is the vehicle to extract and add some of this charge, 24/7, not only during light hours. This is using the unique high ionic charge created within the capacitance and on the dielectric surface.
Recycling part of this charge in a particular way, keeps this system going. If a unit, for example, produced an output of 1kwhr but to start it 250w, 750w in 24 hrs would give you sufficient to run an average house when used with batteries for high consumption peaks.
This is the goal, and is in the hands of professionals at this very minute.
Regards
Mike
Another way to describe the challenge IMO:
"How do you charge/discharge a capacitor when you only have access to one plate?"
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.06.17, 14:13:15
Another way to describe the challenge IMO:
"How do you charge/discharge a capacitor when you only have access to one plate?"
You have access to both, the "b" coils are not really coils at all, they are the other plate shaped like a coil. ;)
I have not published the final schematic atm, I am waiting to see if I'm going to be impeded in doing so, or any other possibilities.
You are all open to working it out, the information has been given, but not all together.
Regards
Mike
Quote"How do you charge/discharge a capacitor when you only have access to one plate?"
Was referring to the really big charged capacitor the energy is to be extracted from. :P
;D
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.06.17, 14:37:22
Was referring to the really big charged capacitor the energy is to be extracted from. :P
;D ;D ;D
There are always ionized particles all around us that have gotten through the Earth's protection shield from the Sun.
You create your own and mix them, like an audio mixer with coils on a ferrite core for example. That is just an example ok.
You have to have the correct medium like a transformer has an iron core.
Regards
Mike
Great news Mike ,
Im sure that you have considered ultra caps . Other than their higher charge absorption,
are there any reasons why batteries would be a better solution ?
It seems that much of our current tech (pun intended) has great application to this .
Im looking forward to NOT blowing so many mosfets and thank you for all your work in solving most of this puzzle that has had so many of us running in circles for decades.
When it comes down to it there are a lot of variables which are challenging but the learning is the most important thing ...after all.
It is hard to forget normal induction for the many with a little knowledge .
Remember SM stated "catalyst release" ..that's plasma.
Be careful with dc ...shocks are far,far more dangerous than with ac.
Hi Lindsay
Yes to caps rather than batteries, this has already been mentioned by an energy expert I have been with. Even at 1kw if the storage is 5kw you would have 6kw for the peak, at night the 1kw would recharge the 5kw easily.
From my experience a 2kw unit would supply also into the grid, with others doing the same less power is needed from the central generator, I think this is where this will go, the same as with solar but 24/7.
Regards
Mike
So is the sch in post 263 now the main driver circuit?
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.06.19, 12:49:14
So is the sch in post 263 now the main driver circuit?
thay
Yes.
Believe it or not, it is very similar to before, but without the interruptions which were making it unstable.
This has now reduced the component count right down and removed the instability, this also leaves it open to very accurate control of the frequency (Fr).
Remember the (Fr) resonant frequency of the toroid is always the same whatever frequency you input, what is different is the delay.
The last part of all this is how this is looped to keep the system running, and is a very important part of how this works.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.06.20, 11:35:46
Remember the (Fr) resonant frequency of the toroid is always the same whatever frequency you input, what is different is the delay.
What kind of natural frequencies do you generally get in your coils?
I was considering running an Arduino Teensy as primary driver but it would really start to lose granularity with switching freqs above ~500kc.
Since the 4047 has a hard reset and can have all three start at the same time plus use to gate the signals at the right times, hands down a winner. I am using it now. Tried to use an external 3 channel gen and it was modest at best. Go simple, less things to worry about.
As for the frequencies, my coils are nearly a carbon copy of his and they are about 1.2mhz. As Mike said, it will run at the natural frequency no matter what you trigger at. 5K, 10.5k and 16K are the stated starting area. Be a good idea to read from post 1 and take notes, by the time you reach here, you should see the directions.
Not sure if I can help you but will be open to try.
thay
SM hides everything in plain sight, I would think he is good at playing cards. ;D
Now I have been trying to make you all think for yourselves. My first breakthrough as to what was happening was when I fed the coils with ONE frequency but in a follow-on sequence. I tuned the frequency but the sequence stayed the same (more or less). This created harmonics which I picked up on my spectrum analyser. As I was tuning the frequency, all of a sudden the harmonics came together and kicked into larger more powerful harmonics. I have shown a video of this some time ago.
Now SM talked of 3 frequencies, but it was not until much later I realised they could not be as 3 frequencies as in 5,10 and 15kHz, but one frequency and 3 duty cycles, crafty SM.
What he did was use one clock frequency into a sequencer with different output duties. I have done this with the minimum component count using CD4047s, this is how it is done.
He stated that the 3 frequencies are 1st, then the 2nd is the 1st X 2.1 and the 3rd the 1st X 3.2 +-. In reality, it is the ON timing of the single frequency, the ON duty for the 3 MOSFET switches.
Remember that "B" can't be ON when "A" or "C" is ON, why? because "B" is ON when resonance is happening and not when the A and C constant current chokes are charging. That means the area of interest is the discharge timing of the chokes.
Look at the attached, they do not "quite" add up to 100%
Regards
Mike
This is the simple circuit, the clock can be any square wave generator that you want, and the inputs to the IC's are short pulses.
Regards
Mike
Great explanation Mike,
It makes me wonder if the effect could be achieved with 3 different turns ratios or something along those lines.
I always remember when he said the it was all in the way the coils interact with each other . I believe he was being honest at the time as who would have thought that the tech would be constrained the way it obviously has been . Just as well the domestic world is mostly rigged for dc supplies from solar systems.
Some corporate s here are creating green mines from massive solar farms and electric dump trucks ...which were always diesel/electric anyway .
Interesting times for sure .
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2022.07.04, 02:00:36
Great explanation Mike,
It makes me wonder if the effect could be achieved with 3 different turns ratios or something along those lines.
I always remember when he said the it was all in the way the coils interact with each other . I believe he was being honest at the time as who would have thought that the tech would be constrained the way it obviously has been . Just as well the domestic world is mostly rigged for dc supplies from solar systems.
Some corporate s here are creating green mines from massive solar farms and electric dump trucks ...which were always diesel/electric anyway .
Interesting times for sure .
They are inductance and capacitance ratios, same number of turns but they have longer wire and get fatter each over winding. They end up as ratios.
The resonance is both voltage and current aiding, all due to how the coils are wound, he is right.
Regards
Mike
Please note that in post 286 the clock and pulse sequence is wrong and has been replaced. I have had to take this from a backup as it seems to have been altered.
Thanks to Toni for pointing this out.
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike,
Thank you for sharing your TPU design!
It looks the closest explanation and replication to Steven Mark's TPU that I have seen in the last 25 years!
Do you also notice any "gyroscopic motion" when you hold your coils similar to SM design?
Any heat noticed when powering a load?
What is your output so far in voltage and current?
Still learning how to build your design and parts needed.
Thank you O0
Explaining the infinite waves within STEAP, THE DELAY LINES.
Regards
Mike
Love the new design of the gen. Will this be the goal post I can use to try and kick a winner? Just got the last circuit up and running but with issues, then the post took a forward jump. :)
At the moment I am using all low side drivers to test out the switching but will opt out for the isolated drivers for the final. My coils are near the same values as your set so can run with the set values for the time being.
Do want to ask how to determine the values for the CMC's as I am not really a designer in this.
Thanks Mike for all.
thay
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.07.16, 23:46:11
Love the new design of the gen. Will this be the goal post I can use to try and kick a winner? Just got the last circuit up and running but with issues, then the post took a forward jump. :)
At the moment I am using all low side drivers to test out the switching but will opt out for the isolated drivers for the final. My coils are near the same values as your set so can run with the set values for the time being.
Do want to ask how to determine the values for the CMC's as I am not really a designer in this.
Thanks Mike for all.
thay
In keeping of how I am explaining STEAP of how I came about finding the way it works, that last post is very important.
SM explained in his form of speed with reference to firing a gun, also of a short piece of wire and passing a magnet very fast, or a very long piece of wire and passing a magnet slower.
STEAP has an infinite number of waves in a small area. The output is taken across this small coil "a", think how that can be! It is like a secondary of a transformer but the output is DC, how can that be!
Who is going to give me the right answer!!
Regards
Mike
Output is turned on when opposing waves are 180 degrees due to delay line characteristics, maybe?
Quote from: itzon on 2022.07.17, 17:02:54
Output is turned on when opposing waves are 180 degrees due to delay line characteristics, maybe?
No. What do you have at either end of the "a" coil? Remember that coil "a" is part of both parallel and series resonance.
Regards
Mike
So, what is the output of the STEAP TPU currently?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.17, 19:19:25
So, what is the output of the STEAP TPU currently?
Just over 700w, 178v independent testing and stopped working just under 3hrs due to a sudden surge in heat.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.07.18, 07:14:39
Just over 700w, 178v independent testing and stopped working just under 3hrs due to a sudden surge in heat.
Regards
Mike
sudden surge in heat?
Edit: what is the ring diameter?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.18, 14:00:44
sudden surge in heat?
Edit: what is the ring diameter?
I was not there when this happened, I have never run this longer than 30mins. The insulation was good to 200c, it has been suggested that a small arc through a pin prick hole caused by over insulation voltage, it could very well be.
Now I am asked to build a new one with different material, that is used in nuclear plants.
This I have not yet done as the material has not yet been released and delivered.
I expect they are trying to workout how it was wound before it melted🔥
Really if you know how it works then you can work it out how to wind and wire it.
It gives off X rays so it is working in that frequency range, but the switching input is a few KHz.
Regards
Mike
PS I make No money out of this, it has cost me quite a bit, at least I have my travel and hotel paid for. Leaving next Sunday yet again to wind a new unit.
In my long research I found polyethylene had the best dielectric loss tangent overall, an order-of-magnitude better than silicone and at least twice as good as PTFE/Teflon. Not a lot of places that sell PE covered wire though so you'd almost have to cast it somehow?
You could buy thick PE tape used for sealing greenhouses that is 1-6in diameter and at least several mils thick.
I'm not sure if it's viable, but dunking the whole thing in silicone oil or beeswax might present a cooling option as well. Both have good thermal mass and flow, and decent loss tangents, but I have no idea if it would hinder dielectric barrier discharge.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.07.18, 17:16:09
I was not there when this happened, I have never run this longer than 30mins. The insulation was good to 200c, it has been suggested that a small arc through a pin prick hole caused by over insulation voltage, it could very well be.
Now I am asked to build a new one with different material, that is used in nuclear plants.
This I have not yet done as the material has not yet been released and delivered.
I expect they are trying to workout how it was wound before it melted🔥
Really if you know how it works then you can work it out how to wind and wire it.
It gives off X rays so it is working in that frequency range, but the switching input is a few KHz.
Regards
Mike
PS I make No money out of this, it has cost me quite a bit, at least I have my travel and hotel paid for. Leaving next Sunday yet again to wind a new unit.
Can't you tell them how it was wound before it melted?
X-rays sound unpleasant.
Just a little nitpick. In that table sent by Hakasays the volume resistivity says ohm/cm whereas it should say ohm-cm.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.18, 18:21:54
Can't you tell them how it was wound before it melted?
X-rays sound unpleasant.
The answer No, I want it to be for mankind. The uk nuclear plants are in fact 85%owned by the French nuclear company, I'm being very careful.
I ran a 30min demo and I had a radiation tag for that time, when developed I had passed nearly 7 X rays.
Regards
Mike
Sure glad you posted that. I will have to take measures here in my apt. I expect that is just the torrid area and not all of it, aka where the plasma is.
700 was a shock to me for output.
thay
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.07.18, 19:41:56
The answer No, I want it to be for mankind. The uk nuclear plants are in fact 85%owned by the French nuclear company, I'm being very careful.
I ran a 30min demo and I had a radiation tag for that time, when developed I had passed nearly 7 X rays.
Regards
Mike
Oh, I thought you were sharing with them, not that they are trying to reverse your work. Perhaps they did something to it and don't want to tell you.
Does your device produce any "cold current"? Lamps will have a white light that lights a room very well, as an indication.
Keep up the good work! Humanity needs all the help they can get right now.
I hope to share my device soon.
Best Regards,
Mike
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.18, 21:06:05
Oh, I thought you were sharing with them, not that they are trying to reverse your work. Perhaps they did something to it and don't want to tell you.
Does your device produce any "cold current"? Lamps will have a white light that lights a room very well, as an indication.
Keep up the good work! Humanity needs all the help they can get right now.
I hope to share my device soon.
Best Regards,
Mike
Well, I might. It is not easy to take this apart to find out how it works, when you reassemble it may not work again.
I'm a once bitten twice shy sort of person. At my age I'm not in it for the money, though if someone wants to pay for some good restaurants I will not stop them ;)
This link maybe old hat for some, but read it, it is all part of SM and the so called TPU. SM was a sound man. With this link in mind, think what would happen if you created billions of waves of near the same frequency but nano seconds of difference and they ended up across two ends of the same coil (like a transformer one end is positive when the other end is negative, a sine wave).
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/Sound/interf.html#c3
The number of waves is in the X-ray band, that is what I am assuming.
Regards
Mike
Here is a bonus
https://dosits.org/galleries/technology-gallery/basic-technology/projector-array/
Regards
Mike
Here is the answer to the DC output question,
Regards
Mike
Is the DC output positive and negative with ground (zero volts) in the middle (like a square wave), or DC that is offset above ground (like a battery)?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.20, 17:31:34
Is the DC output positive and negative with ground (zero volts) in the middle (like a square wave), or DC that is offset above ground (like a battery)?
Like I have shown, low impedance at one end and high impedance at the other end of the "a" coil.
Resonance is both parallel and series, the loop core capacitor plate is common to both capacitance. Where they cross on the positive and negative are the reference for the output voltage, the more phase waves the less spikes over and under the DC zero line, it is a differencial output.
This was a surprise I expect for SM.
The output has to be resistive or the frequency will vary depending on the load.
Not so easy until you rectify.
Regards
Mike
Sounds complicated to build.
There is a rotating field in the device, correct?
No it is not complicated, but you have to wind it as accurately as possible so as the ratios are the same between the a, b, c coils (inductance and capacitance).
There is a rotation caused by the slight difference in the parallel and series resonance caused by the capacitance difference with "c" and "b" coils, this is what I think causes the beat or wash board effect.
Regards
Mike
STEAP does not have to be a Toroid shape, I have added to the previous hand drawn sketch, it can be elongated, the only reason for a Toroid shape IS SPACE.
Silicon rubber insulated, Tin coated multistrand wire should be used, and good quality. Mine was from China, the new one will not be, it is coming from France.
The principle of heating is not fully understood atm.
It takes a few seconds to gain full output, that is because the waves are being multiplied up to near infinity or I should say near DC without stopping the resonance, it seems to auto control that point which stabilizes the output at a fixed voltage.
The kick is when the B mosfet is off, the diode supplies power from the stored up energy from the capacitor into the circuit, which it collected when the mosfet was ON and the A and C mosfets OFF.
Regards
Mike
How hot does it get?
Soft wire insulation will heat up when vibrated. It gets very warm, but doesn't melt.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.07.21, 18:29:53
How hot does it get?
Soft wire insulation will heat up when vibrated. It gets very warm, but doesn't melt.
For the longest run I have done I'd say around 40c (30min). Can't say for 3rd party tests as I was not there, I will no doubt find out next week in detail.
Regards
Mike
So if one was to want to build a container to shield xray, what would be the best material other than lead. A lot of red tape to get sheets of it.
thay
The CME we received from the Sun
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Thaelin on 2022.07.22, 14:37:32
So if one was to want to build a container to shield xray, what would be the best material other than lead. A lot of red tape to get sheets of it.
thay
Graphene possibly, this is why I'm leaving this for the experts in this field.
Regards
Mike
If you wish to shield against X-rays, I recommend boxes of pennies (US) - cheap and very effective.
We used boxes of pennies as shielding for our "cold fusion" experiments at BYU, which experiments began in 1986
-- long before we heard of Pons and Fleischmann.
A lot of industrial metal supply shops will sell lead ingots, lead shot, and sometimes lead sheet on big rolls.
Lead melts at a very low temp so you could even cast your own plates using an old cookie sheet.
But the waves generated by these systems might not be X-rays as we think of them, so different shielding techniques might be needed. Epoxy mixed with iron powder and cast/painted onto a surface can be a great RF shield, it might be effective against exotic waves as well.
Edit: Looks like Amazon has sheet lead as well: https://www.amazon.com/KRT-Lead-Sheeting-Sheet-Rolls/dp/B01I289NH2
...
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.07.26, 14:02:58
A lot of industrial metal supply shops will sell lead ingots, lead shot, and sometimes lead sheet on big rolls.
Lead melts at a very low temp so you could even cast your own plates using an old cookie sheet.
But the waves generated by these systems might not be X-rays as we think of them, so different shielding techniques might be needed. Epoxy mixed with iron powder and cast/painted onto a surface can be a great RF shield, it might be effective against exotic waves as well.
Edit: Looks like Amazon has sheet lead as well: https://www.amazon.com/KRT-Lead-Sheeting-Sheet-Rolls/dp/B01I289NH2
Waiting to be told exactly what radiation is given off, my experience was using lab radiation tabs worn in areas of radiation in Hospitals.
Regards
Mike
Will be back home for the weekend.
It's not X rays as such, it is right at the top end of the uv band.
The infinite number of waves overlap giving peaks with spacing between 9-10nm band. The información extracted was huge and a lot went over my head, but I got the basics.
Typing from my phone in France where I left my wife and her grand daughter with my father in law.
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike, Thanks for all the info so far. May I ask you what your plan is with the results you have gotten and likely will be getting? Do you intend to make an all in one information package for others to also obtain results with? Too often I have seen people getting good results and nothing ever came from it. They just never really did anything with it nor released the 'full picture' info. So others still could not replicate the tech and became forgotten again. But all it takes is one good pdf with all the info like windings, schematics and explanations and whole scene could change in an instance. Do you have plans along these lines? If you are getting the results you say you are getting and I have no real reason to doubt it. It would mean you have something important going on.
Kind regards, Steven
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.08.02, 15:11:05
Will be back home for the weekend.
It's not X rays as such, it is right at the top end of the uv band.
The infinite number of waves overlap giving peaks with spacing between 9-10nm band. The información extracted was huge and a lot went over my head, but I got the basics.
Typing from my phone in France where I left my wife and her grand daughter with my father in law.
Regards
Mike
Rushed into hospital this morning just as we were loading the car for the journey home. Might be a few days more before I get home.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: nali2001 on 2022.08.03, 08:40:42
Hi Mike, Thanks for all the info so far. May I ask you what your plan is with the results you have gotten and likely will be getting? Do you intend to make an all in one information package for others to also obtain results with? Too often I have seen people getting good results and nothing ever came from it. They just never really did anything with it nor released the 'full picture' info. So others still could not replicate the tech and became forgotten again. But all it takes is one good pdf with all the info like windings, schematics and explanations and whole scene could change in an instance. Do you have plans along these lines? If you are getting the results you say you are getting and I have no real reason to doubt it. It would mean you have something important going on.
Kind regards, Steven
You will have to wait for me to obtain further information on completing a new unit. I have a good working relationship with 2 nuclear investigation scientists and I want to keep it that way, we have formalized an agreement which is more than fair for both sides and posible future energy.
Regards
Mike
From my hospital bed😭
Mike
Yikes ... a lot on your plate and then this !!
Hope it's nothing too serious !
Thanks for all you do !
Chet
2022 is proving to be interesting...
You take care Mike.
Take your time and get will soon.
My post was just a plea to not let your results fade into obscurity. It happens about 99% of the time on these o.u related forums.
Kind regards,
Steven
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.08.03, 16:22:07
You will have to wait for me to obtain further information on completing a new unit. I have a good working relationship with 2 nuclear investigation scientists and I want to keep it that way, we have formalized an agreement which is more than fair for both sides and posible future energy.
Regards
Mike
From my hospital bed😭
Back home after a long drive from Langres hospital, 14.5hrs.
Lost our hotel booking and there were no more rooms on our journey south, bad time of the year without a booking.
Seems a pill I take caused me problems, or that is what the doctors believe.
Regards
Mike
Response to Frédéric from the other thread. STEAP works on the basis that there is a charge and discharge on the surface of a dielectric. You could say the dielectric is the catalist to making this work, and it is very possible that not all dielectrics will work, I have not yet delved into that possibility.
The loop coil core does not have to be insulated, but the coils will have to be. The "b" coils are the other "main plate of the capacitance. SM's garage Toroid used an un insulated, albeit painted, speaker frame made of aluminum. That one over heats very quickly due to high eddy currents within the aluminio.
Regards
Mike
So if I understand correctly, the dielectric barrier discharge (DBD) is the critical factor of operation, and the complex pulse/phase arrangement is effectively a means-to-an-end?
IE: So there may be other coil/capacitor arrangements and frequency patterns that could conceivably get the same result,
but without the >400v to create the DBD the process would never appear?
Quote from: Hakasays on 2022.08.09, 14:56:19
So if I understand correctly, the dielectric barrier discharge (DBD) is the critical factor of operation, and the complex pulse/phase arrangement is effectively a means-to-an-end?
IE: So there may be other coil/capacitor arrangements and frequency patterns that could conceivably get the same result,
but without the >400v to create the DBD the process would never appear?
The jury is still out on exactly the modus operandi. Let me put it another way, to extract ambient energy sufficient to keep the system running we have to use the same "currency" as the environment uses to store energy, it is ionic.
We are basicly using electrons converting into positive and negative ions and adding environmental ions.
I am typi g this on my phone so I will continue when I have time
On my computer.
Regards
Mike
The heating of the core in the unit is due, IMO, to eddy-type currents, let's face it we have metal inside a moving magnetic field, the solenoids. The metal must not be iron or any other magnetic metal or it would destroy itself in no time at all, paramagnetic is ok.
I believe SM used what he had in the speaker business. I think he used tin-coated copper wire with ordinary PVC insulation, this is why he was monitoring the temperature all the time, more than half an hour and the PVC would be so soft it would start the break down.
Going back to the multiple phase shifting or delay. When returning the resonance back into the "front end", the chokes come into play. In the big TPU of SM all the wires of the chokes go too and from the coils of the TPU and not one goes to the driver!!!! when you know how the "b" coils are connected (SM left those out as well as the others of the "c" coils, you will understand how he "looped" the TPU to keep it going) ;) Think of the child on the swing oscillating and every so many oscillations you give it a kick, the famous kick, it is all revolved around the coils "b" and the "B" mosfet with it's separate ground reference because the source of "B" is + except when "B" is ON and oscillating, when OFF the accumulated charge in the capacitors feed the kick through the internal and external Mosfet diode and into the center tapping of the "b" coils to charge the chokes.
You see I have done a lot of homework on this, I needed to get inside the head of SM, these things are not easy to explain as he said many times.
Regards
Mike
I wish you good health and welcome back. Thanks for the info and hope you give us.
I have the feeling if the TPU is ever going to mean anything to the world and the o.u community it is in your hands.
So much work and research have been poured into the tpu over the past 10 years with forum threads in the high hundreds of pages and nothing ever came out of it as far as I know.
You have a very good chance to change this, is how I see it.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.08.10, 10:14:11
The heating of the core in the unit is due, IMO, to eddy-type currents, let's face it we have metal inside a moving magnetic field, the solenoids. The metal must not be iron or any other magnetic metal or it would destroy itself in no time at all, paramagnetic is ok.
I believe SM used what he had in the speaker business. I think he used tin-coated copper wire with ordinary PVC insulation, this is why he was monitoring the temperature all the time, more than half an hour and the PVC would be so soft it would start the break down.
Going back to the multiple phase shifting or delay. When returning the resonance back into the "front end", the chokes come into play. In the big TPU of SM all the wires of the chokes go too and from the coils of the TPU and not one goes to the driver!!!! when you know how the "b" coils are connected (SM left those out as well as the others of the "c" coils, you will understand how he "looped" the TPU to keep it going) ;) Think of the child on the swing oscillating and every so many oscillations you give it a kick, the famous kick, it is all revolved around the coils "b" and the "B" mosfet with it's separate ground reference because the source of "B" is + except when "B" is ON and oscillating, when OFF the accumulated charge in the capacitors feed the kick through the internal and external Mosfet diode and into the center tapping of the "b" coils to charge the chokes.
You see I have done a lot of homework on this, I needed to get inside the head of SM, these things are not easy to explain as he said many times.
Regards
Mike
So the center torroid is "isolation" for the B circuit "kickback" ?
We know that ferrite torroids can work at gigahertz and beyond.
This seems very much like a voltage doubler,trippler , quadripler ..etc. Boost converter of course . The extra centre ground in the photos may then come into play.
This may also imply that the active drive in the big tpu drive is very low current and from a storage cap . Which is still "NO BATTERIES"
Its really fun ,if a bit dangerous nutting this out with your valuable help.
ALL ..... one hand working is safe , anything else is NOT.
Great work Mike!
This is how it is but with the correct timing the capacitors feed through the diodes to give the push to the resonance (the kick) ;)
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike,
My first post here.
I have read your whole STEAP thread and find it fascinating.
Perhaps if you have time you could summarize how you came upon this design and the influences, was the SM TPU the instigator or did this begin as a separate experiment.
I believe you mentioned that the shape was more for space saving than that of necessity. In your unit does the static field rotate and if so, do you think this is of importance and which direction does it spin CCW?
Have you experienced any of the seriously dangerous avalanche events, if so can you mention this experience.
I am happy that you are feeling better,
Mick
Quote from: mkjekyll on 2022.08.15, 23:41:52
Hi Mike,
My first post here.
I have read your whole STEAP thread and find it fascinating.
Perhaps if you have time you could summarize how you came upon this design and the influences, was the SM TPU the instigator or did this begin as a separate experiment.
I believe you mentioned that the shape was more for space saving than that of necessity. In your unit does the static field rotate and if so, do you think this is of importance and which direction does it spin CCW?
Have you experienced any of the seriously dangerous avalanche events, if so can you mention this experience.
I am happy that you are feeling better,
Mick
Welcome to probably the best forum.
Soon I will give some new information in a different thread, only for members of this forum and not to be repeated outside this forum, please, if built and working it "could" be a health hazard, not completely known yet.
This all started many years ago with Ron Stiffler in private, parametric resonance, the name STEAP IS MINE, he used another name. When Steven Mark appeared on the scene there was some similarity and I investigated the SM TPU on my own. What I have shown is my investigation over time "years" and is extracts from my lab book, and so you have my experience from start to finish without giving a set of plans and instructions. I is made to make you experiment and find the right direction like I have had to do.
Even if you have all the unit set up and wired correctly, it is not easy to start, even though now I can do it quite easily.
Regards
Mike
X-rays from Peeling Tape: (charge separation)
https://wiki.physics.wisc.edu/garage/X-rays%20from%20peeling%20tape
Quote from: Grumpy on 2022.08.17, 15:54:31
X-rays from Peeling Tape: (charge separation)
https://wiki.physics.wisc.edu/garage/X-rays%20from%20peeling%20tape
Thank's Grumpy for posting that O0
Yes it is charge separation it seems, and the collection is capacitive, but at atmospheric pressure. It has something for sure to do with being within a magnetic field.
I am a believer that charge is being added from the atmosphere and has to be ionic positive and negative ions.
I strongly believe you can not get something for nothing, the energy always comes from something that will be depleted of that energy supplied, i.e. the SUN.
STEAP only needs sufficient energy to keep it running, which is minimal in relation to the charge it receives, but it has to run within a high charge to start with and so makes it difficult to start.
By design it has to run in this sea of ions.
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike,
Thank you for your answer, I suppose you are tabling the question vis a vis rotation until the new thread.
I was watching Dr Stifflers website for a bit while it was available, found the limited information very interesting. Maybe there was a subscription service he offered with more info I don't quite recall.
I think along with gaining information we have lost quite a bit. Notice the lack of spheres or cones in modern RF. Aside from Tesla coils and flying saucer direction biasing I can't think of any spherical resonators or radiators.
I will be happy to comply with anything you prefer not to mention beyond this site, it is after all your years of work that proffered the data. A scientist should have control over his or her data.
Mick
Quote from: Centraflow on 2022.05.22, 17:01:07
The timing for the TPU has a specific job. If you think of the child swing, start at a high on the left, and just at the high on the right the fulcrum point (top of the swing) moves X 2 the distance the swing has traveled linearly, instantly to the right.
So the child is always moving to the right, never BACKWARDS (BEMF). The trick is where the energy has come from to move the fulcrum point so that it is OU.
When you charge a coil from a DC supply, the polarity of the positive end connection is in fact negative. When you disconnect a switch on the opposite end of the coil, the polarities of the coil ends change and the charge wants to discharge in the same direction as it was charging to start if there is somewhere for it to go (a capacitor for example). The only energy lost here is the switching loss, very small. If you have two of these linked together in a certain way (A and C), you now start to see how the child is always moving to the right as though he is a DC current.
In this case, there is no BEMF only FEMF (Foreward electromagnetic force). This is how a boost converter works to create a higher voltage from a lower DC voltage, but at the cost of current, but what if there was no cost of current, current is added from another source!!
Regards
Mike
Hi Mike,
This is mighty interesting to me. I would love to hear you explain this into more detail.
I understand when a coil is switched off it generates a back emf spike, depending on which side of the coil is opened up.
positive spike switching the negative supply and vice versa.
I would like to know where this spike is created? at the A C or B Mosfet? or several Mosfets?
Does it use both polarity spikes or just a single polarity!
Thanks for giving us guidance :)
edit: I added a scope shot of you, which shows the positive and negative spike, So that is what start the rising amplitude?
Cenrtaflow
QuoteYes it is charge separation it seems, and the collection is capacitive, but at atmospheric pressure. It has something for sure to do with being within a magnetic field.
I am a believer that charge is being added from the atmosphere and has to be ionic positive and negative ions.
I strongly believe you can not get something for nothing, the energy always comes from something that will be depleted of that energy supplied, i.e. the SUN.
All the most credible FE inventors of the past followed a similar pattern. At first they believed the source of energy was the Earth/telluric, then atmospheric and finally cosmic/radiant energy. As you imply, no credible FE inventor honestly believed the energy came from nothing and they knew better.
However there's a catch which took me years to figure out. When they spoke of "cosmic energy" they meant radiant energy from external sources like stars which imparted said energy to matter. The energy is cosmic ie. from stars however the energy the device transforms is from the matter/material of the device itself. We call this energy nuclear/atomic, relating to the motion of particles/fields and atoms in materials.
To make a long story short, I did a series of experiments which could properly segregate all the energy flows in a circuit and found there is much more energy present than we utilize. So the limit of 100% efficiency in an electromagnet device is true but only in the context of utilizing only the electromagnetism we normally do and nothing else.
In effect, the "kick" SM referred to is the extra process which liberates the extra energy from the circuit.
Regards
AC
If energy cannot be "created" nothing would exist.
The collector of energy is the core. One plate is connected to the "high" positive potential, the other is neutral and the third is the "b" coils.
Regards
Mike
From my phone.
This is the first post in quite some time, I have not been well, and still nowhere near 100%.
Because I left my group hanging in mid-air, I have decided to go directly to the end and post the attached. This will effectively remove any obligations that were in place, I thank you for your patience.
What is attached is a prior art declaration which was made back in 2021 and filed. The form of it is a patent application, and there is a good reason for this which I will not go into here.
Anybody can use this, but nobody can patent or claim it as theirs. You will see that it is "a new component" that is claimed, STEAP capacitor.
This is the component that is needed to extract and add atmospheric charge. It is simple but complicated in its workings, but basically, it uses charge displacement and balancing to extract charge and then deliver this charge within a cycle, it is both frequency and duty sensitive.
I will give no more explanation, I will leave this up to you to find this for yourself. The included typical circuit is correct, but you will have to make your own method of control of the C3 voltage, the resistor is an example of control. A resistor would work for fixed output, but you would probably blow a lot of Mosfets before you found the right value, you are forwarned.
I am moving on to a new project as and when I am fit enough.
Regards
Mike N.
:)
:)
I do like the simplicity of these figures compared to the full schematic. Feels more intuitive.
Here is some extra help to get a working unit.
Remember all coils are wound in the same direction, that includes b,b1. As the feed is in the center of the "b" coils, you have to realise the current flow goes out to the ends. When a coil charges and discharges the polarity changes, but be careful with the "b" coils, after all it is a capacitor plate that has an electric field and a changing magnetic field all at the same time.
Those that have built the "toroids" can give help to others.
The attached document will give some new information that those in the group should have found themselves. If you look hard at the coil schematics you will see that there are two halves, one in parallel and one in series, and a "a" coil (the output coil) which is the only coil that gives the frequency split. Your instruments can not show you these frequencies because of multi-phase interference. The LC Fr has to be calculated from your inductance and capacitance, then you will realise what you are looking at. In my case 25KHz and 15KHz on either side of the "a" coil.
Good luck gentlemen
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Hakasays on 2023.01.14, 19:07:32
I do like the simplicity of these figures compared to the full schematic. Feels more intuitive.
Seen in this way, I see with surprise common points with the type of capacitor on which I work in the thread on "New generator from a spatial gradient of the vector potential and current".
Here it is the capacitances between cores and between cores and windings while in my thread it is flat strips. The common point is the open ends. If we consider only the capacitive question (not inductive), an open end makes that we have no current at this end, and a stronger and stronger current when we go to the other side. The current is therefore not constant along the conductor, there is a gradient, and this current gradient can indeed have new effects, this is what I am testing with a spatial gradient of the potential vector.
I am in discussion on another forum with some electromagnetism and relativity experts to try to theorize and mathematize the question of the gradient of A. I think if I get an answer, it might be useful here, likewise the idea of the coil capacitors seen here might help me make a proof of concept about ∇A.
Note that there is an inconsistency. In the left view the ground is on the same side as "In", while in the right diagram it is the opposite. Connecting on one side or the other might matter.
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4201.0;attach=46900;image)
Quote from: F6FLT on 2023.01.15, 17:25:45
Seen in this way, I see with surprise common points with the type of capacitor on which I work in the thread on "New generator from a spatial gradient of the vector potential and current".
Here it is the capacitances between cores and between cores and windings while in my thread it is flat strips. The common point is the open ends. If we consider only the capacitive question (not inductive), an open end makes that we have no current at this end, and a stronger and stronger current when we go to the other side. The current is therefore not constant along the conductor, there is a gradient, and this current gradient can indeed have new effects, this is what I am testing with a spatial gradient of the potential vector.
I am in discussion on another forum with some electromagnetism and relativity experts to try to theorize and mathematize the question of the gradient of A. I think if I get an answer, it might be useful here, likewise the idea of the coil capacitors seen here might help me make a proof of concept about ∇A.
Note that there is an inconsistency. In the left view the ground is on the same side as "In", while in the right diagram it is the opposite. Connecting on one side or the other might matter.
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4201.0;attach=46900;image)
F6, the A and B "core" is made into a loop of 3 turns and like ends joined, effectively reducing inductance. Each turn is twisted 180º before making the next turn as the AB is a twin flex. This ensures maximum capacitance within A and B, and also equal inductance A to b,b1 and B to b,b1. when b,b1 is wound over the core.
Regards
Mike
Thank you Mike for the clarification. It is not easy to analyze. The possibilities of magnetic and electrical coupling are so numerous and drastically depend on the materials and the actual practical realization that it makes it difficult to reproduce a truly identical to the original one, and we cannot work at random. I don't intend to try to reproduce anything if I don't have a guiding idea on the concept, I'm thinking about it, because that of "extracting ambient energy in the form of charge" is an admission of ignorance of the exact origin of energy.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2023.01.15, 11:26:46
Here is some extra help to get a working unit.
Remember all coils are wound in the same direction, that includes b,b1. As the feed is in the center of the "b" coils, you have to realise the current flow goes out to the ends. When a coil charges and discharges the polarity changes, but be careful with the "b" coils, after all it is a capacitor plate that has an electric field and a changing magnetic field all at the same time.
Those that have built the "toroids" can give help to others.
The attached document will give some new information that those in the group should have found themselves. If you look hard at the coil schematics you will see that there are two halves, one in parallel and one in series, and a "a" coil (the output coil) which is the only coil that gives the frequency split. Your instruments can not show you these frequencies because of multi-phase interference. The LC Fr has to be calculated from your inductance and capacitance, then you will realise what you are looking at. In my case 25KHz and 15KHz on either side of the "a" coil.
Good luck gentlemen
Regards
Mike
Mike - thank you!
"The LC Fr has to be calculated from your inductance and capacitance, then you will realise what you are looking at. In my case 25KHz and 15KHz on either side of the "a" coil."
I would say that the LC Freq is surprisingly low (25 and 15 kHz).
It might help to think of it as an echo chamber of sorts .
Around the 5khz is where we want to be but it is much much lower than the resonance frequency. Its many "echoes" build up to and way beyond the resonant freq which will be mhz .
We keep the echoes going by tapping it gently at exactly the right time and place untill it is full and taps its self .
We know that lightning has polarity properties both vertical and horizontal around this frequency and this is a receiver of that energy or linked to it .
Radio receivers work in a similar fashion except we are not interested in demodulating anything , just the carrier in this case. More of a regenerative receiver
Its very hard and can be misleading to use some common terminology .
This is a marathon more than a sprint .
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2023.01.17, 08:22:36
Mike - thank you!
"The LC Fr has to be calculated from your inductance and capacitance, then you will realise what you are looking at. In my case 25KHz and 15KHz on either side of the "a" coil."
I would say that the LC Freq is surprisingly low (25 and 15 kHz).
Steven,
The resonance is not where you think it is.
The clever part of winding all these coils is their relation to one another.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2023.01.16, 10:00:51
F6, the A and B "core" is made into a loop of 3 turns and like ends joined, effectively reducing inductance. Each turn is twisted 180º before making the next turn as the AB is a twin flex. This ensures maximum capacitance within A and B, and also equal inductance A to b,b1 and B to b,b1. when b,b1 is wound over the core.
Regards
Mike
Hello,
What is the over all size of this device? is it just a small 3 inch section of wires, or is it a full circle and would be like 9 inches of wire then is ties into a full circle? This image is very helpful but a little confusing.
Thank you,
Jody
Mine are roughly 8" dia
I was pointing my 80w cnc laser diode at some low clouds trying to focus a narrow beam last night and wondered why it felt weird when the dot was visible ...so I googled and .....
serendipity!
https://www.science.org/content/article/laser-beams-make-lightning-tunnels
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/jan/16/scientists-steer-lightning-bolts-with-lasers-for-the-first-time
many others on searching perhaps if you find the BEST one
Put it here
This possibly explains the STEAP capacitor better on how it works. It seems that understanding the way it works within a circuit that is looped, is difficult to understand for most.
Before anyone asks where the extra energy has come from to make this work! it comes from the natural ionic charge that is all around us, as the charges naturally want to balance in this capacitor, the ambient charge is pulled in, in the final form of current when discharged as a supply source.
regards
Mike
Quote from: F6FLT on 2023.01.16, 12:11:34
Thank you Mike for the clarification. It is not easy to analyze. The possibilities of magnetic and electrical coupling are so numerous and drastically depend on the materials and the actual practical realization that it makes it difficult to reproduce a truly identical to the original one, and we cannot work at random. I don't intend to try to reproduce anything if I don't have a guiding idea on the concept, I'm thinking about it, because that of "extracting ambient energy in the form of charge" is an admission of ignorance of the exact origin of energy.
F6 sorry for the delayed answer, I have not been well since I had covid before Christmas, I have been up and down with problems and still, I'm not 100%, but I need to keep my brain working.
I am a believer that energy has to come from somewhere, and ambient charge fits in the case of STEAP. May I ask you a question? do you believe Maxwell's Demon could be realised?
Once you have answered I will show how you create the door between the two rooms and open and close it at the right time.
Regards
Mike
So as to understand what the coils do in the STEAP unit, here is how they function.
Regards
Mike
I will leave you with a non-looped power generator, yes it needs an input, unlike the full STEAP unit which will run "after starting" with no input.
This only uses 2 mosfets, A and C because the input is always available until it runs out.
Note the switching sequence and most important the gap between A and C ON pulses, here is the kick of the high current from one side of the C1 STEAP capacitor and the other. If you do not have this it will not work. Maxwell's Demon? maybe, if not atmospheric charge pulled in!
You need to understand the multi-phase delay line formed by all the coils and the way they are wound.
Regards
Mike
This is a reply to Peter's post on Tao and Jaños Re OU.com.
I have had this document since it was posted on OU. yes, it is the possible way the STEAP and SM's TPU work.
It is one frequency but different phases, millions of phases across one coil in 2 phase blocks (either end of a coil ).
I have a video of the waves at low voltage input, I will have to load it onto my youtube channel later today as it is too big a file for here.
Regards
Mike
Here is the video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4y8zBGH0zY
Regards
Mike
I think I'm getting old. Trying to get my head wrapped around the physical coil layout. The coils wind back on themselves? I took the sm diagram and tried to reconcile with the info mike posted. Still trying to work it out or is it just a b c being continuous coils all the way around over a couple loops?
Is this how it's wound roughly?
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.16, 09:38:17
I think I'm getting old. Trying to get my head wrapped around the physical coil layout. The coils wind back on themselves? I took the sm diagram and tried to reconcile with the info mike posted. Still trying to work it out or is it just a b c being continuous coils all the way around over a couple loops?
The schematic has changed
many times so you'll first want to confirm if the version you have is correct or not.
Quote from: Hakasays on 2024.04.16, 14:19:55
The schematic has changed many times so you'll first want to confirm if the version you have is correct or not.
It took me awhile to catch up. I'm coming up with a PLL for the three frequencies so I don't have to mess with finding the right ratio with a pot. Just have a PLL do it.
Something was mentioned about duty cycles for the B channel, that it needs tuning but not enough information to figure that out yet.
I think this is right for pulses? I don't want to just copy without understanding so this is my best first attempt, attached circuit.
Whoops. Corrected pulses circuit.
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.16, 14:32:04
I think this is right for pulses? I don't want to just copy without understanding so this is my best first attempt, attached circuit.
Our side-group could never get a solid answer from CF on circuit design or on pulse/timing protocols. Every time we tried to build/test a certain variation the schematic would change somewhere, forcing everyone to start again from scratch. Perhaps 6-7 revisions later and the group eventually fizzled. I couldn't justify spending any more time after carefully replicating designs that were known for a fact not to work.
There may indeed be something novel in CF's constructions, but due to the lost credibility the secrets may die with him. :-\
Personally I would suggest trying to decipher the core principle(s) involved and then testing that principle on the bench and/or in sims before trying to build something as complex as fully functional looped STEAP.
It's like trying to build a modern sportscar when we still haven't figured out the process of internal combustion. :P
Quote from: Hakasays on 2024.04.16, 15:17:36
Our side-group could never get a solid answer from CF on circuit design or on pulse/timing protocols. Every time we tried to build/test a certain variation the schematic would change somewhere, forcing everyone to start again from scratch. Perhaps 6-7 revisions later and the group eventually fizzled. I couldn't justify spending any more time after carefully replicating designs that were known for a fact not to work.
There may indeed be something novel in CF's constructions, but due to the lost credibility the secrets may die with him. :-\
Personally I would suggest trying to decipher the core principle(s) involved and then testing that principle on the bench and/or in sims before trying to build something as complex as fully functional looped STEAP.
It's like trying to build a modern sportscar when we still haven't figured out the process of internal combustion. :P
That is unfortunate. I've been reading the thread and noticing the schematic changes, hard to get it straight. I've got the equipment to replicate, but it looks like I'll have to do a bunch of tests first. It seems very "simple" circuit wise but very complicated operationally.
Edit: Also, thank you for compiling all of that information, future avenues for research.
Quote from: Hakasays on 2024.04.16, 15:17:36
Our side-group could never get a solid answer from CF on circuit design or on pulse/timing protocols. Every time we tried to build/test a certain variation the schematic would change somewhere, forcing everyone to start again from scratch. Perhaps 6-7 revisions later and the group eventually fizzled. I couldn't justify spending any more time after carefully replicating designs that were known for a fact not to work.
There may indeed be something novel in CF's constructions, but due to the lost credibility the secrets may die with him. :-\
Personally I would suggest trying to decipher the core principle(s) involved and then testing that principle on the bench and/or in sims before trying to build something as complex as fully functional looped STEAP.
It's like trying to build a modern sportscar when we still haven't figured out the process of internal combustion. :P
Perhaps it was fake from the beginning.
I'm tired and sad about always the same Story.
I agree with Haka on exploring some fundamental areas rather than a full-blown build.
Peter got the compressed pulse with the bifilar many years ago, and this is what SM supposedly started with:
This compressed pulse and a magnet
I did some work on pulse generation <a href="https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=272.msg101836#msg101836">here</a> that may be of interest. A few posts down I show a transmission line generating a pulse which should be applicable to the TPU.
Pm
Quote from: partzman on 2024.04.16, 19:00:38
I did some work on pulse generation <a href="https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=272.msg101836#msg101836">here</a> that may be of interest. A few posts down I show a transmission line generating a pulse which should be applicable to the TPU.
Pm
Going back to the roots, good idea. ;)
If I get the time I may try running a VNA analysis on such a setup (twinlead coil, series iron wire delay through one lead). If there is a novel interaction it should show up clearly here, and it may tell us something about what kind of interaction is happening between the two signals.
You think a single twisted 20+ft pair of Cat3/5 wire pair would work/be adequate?
If the brown paper is truly from SM it's a good lead but does not match up with what Spherics said. Either spherics had a different effect and attributed the same operation to SM or that drawing is not by SM, or the drawing is meant to distract.
SM is his letters mentioned mixing two frequencies to make a beat then tuning another coil to resonate with the beat. Also, a rotational component is needed. Now sure how he got rotation with all of the windings on top of each other as shown in the diagram.
Something just doesn't add up.
Quote from: Hakasays on 2024.04.17, 01:54:29
Going back to the roots, good idea. ;)
If I get the time I may try running a VNA analysis on such a setup (twinlead coil, series iron wire delay through one lead). If there is a novel interaction it should show up clearly here, and it may tell us something about what kind of interaction is happening between the two signals.
You think a single twisted 20+ft pair of Cat3/5 wire pair would work/be adequate?
I don't see why not! One advantage to this type of pulse generation is the relatively low power required to produce HV pulses. I have never seen the advantage of having these pulses in a TPU configuration so I'm sure I'm missing something!!
Pm
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.17, 05:04:07
If the brown paper is truly from SM it's a good lead but does not match up with what Spherics said. Either spherics had a different effect and attributed the same operation to SM or that drawing is not by SM, or the drawing is meant to distract.
SM is his letters mentioned mixing two frequencies to make a beat then tuning another coil to resonate with the beat. Also, a rotational component is needed. Now sure how he got rotation with all of the windings on top of each other as shown in the diagram.
Something just doesn't add up.
That brown paper drawing is what Mike (CF) reverse engineered to build his devices.
Note that this does not agree with the TPU winding and operating explanations that SM and Spherics provided.
Also note that SM built several devices that operated differently but utilized the same principles.
The Spherics devices are supposedly based on the fundamental operating principles rather than the effect that SM used.
Grumpy and others.
To start with STEAP and the SM TPU are one of the same.
To realise before anything you need to understand how this works. A full blown working diagram so as you just copy it is not my idea of 9 years of investigation. What I am going to do is tell you how it works, and what it is in it's parts.
First off the circuit on the brown paper drawing of the coils IS CORRECT, what you need to realise is he was drawing a top and bottom set of coils.
These coils DO not buck as it would appear because the centre taps come back on themselves in the drawing. This was for ease of drawing so as the connections can be seen. So you are looking at a top and a bottom toroid, but it could have been drawn with all the coils going in one direction.
The loops in the centre (2) are through all coils together, and were drawn like that so as they can be seen as seperate coils to the over wound coils. These loops are in fact a bifilar coil with their ends shorted so as to form a capacitance with next to no inductance. This acts like a SOLID ring, or core, inside the external coils. The centre of the TPU is JUST A NON METALIC FORMER (cork or the likes).
The TPU heats up OVER TIME, why? because the coils over the top pass multiple positive pulses in one direction through two coils (a and c coils).
The a, b, and c coils are wound as a trifilar coil, all in the same "direction", very important. Why is this important! well these pulses have varying amplitudes, like a sine wave but ALL positive. What happens if you have a MOVING magnetic field across that core! YOU WILL INDUCE A CURRENT INTO THAT CORE, eddy currents, over time it will heat up, not instantly like in iron, because it is copper, BUT it will heat up.
When you induce the current into the "core" it will produce an equal magnetic field going OUTWARDS towards the external solenoids. This is like an induction heater, but here is used a moving magnetic field (DC), and not an alternating magnetic field. The fields are perpendicular to one another, SM did not say exactly, only that "they" are perpendicular. The "b" coils wound as part of the trifilar, are not part of the moving field inducing into the core, but the collectors of the perpendicular field from the core, which was created by the huge circulating current in the core. So SM's collectors are not the core, but the "b" coils. IT IS A DC LINEAR GENERATOR, the trick is how it becomes OU and how it is fed back into the "front end" if you can call it that. The output is from either side of the "a" mosfet as shown on the drawings, the CMC is a separation of the DC generator and the multiple pulses of different amplitude (a filter).
The core is important, and is where the gain (to use SM terms) comes from, NO KICK and it will not work. There are only two input frequencies, not three, B is a switching GROUND from the collector to the A and C mosfet drains, B switches either with A or with C, A and C are never ON together.
Other words of SM:- When you cut the supply, the electrons have enough momentum to hit their target!
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.17, 17:37:05
Grumpy and others.
To start with STEAP and the SM TPU are one of the same.
To realise before anything you need to understand how this works. A full blown working diagram so as you just copy it is not my idea of 9 years of investigation. What I am going to do is tell you how it works, and what it is in it's parts.
First off the circuit on the brown paper drawing of the coils IS CORRECT, what you need to realise is he was drawing a top and bottom set of coils.
These coils DO not buck as it would appear because the centre taps come back on themselves in the drawing. This was for ease of drawing so as the connections can be seen. So you are looking at a top and a bottom toroid, but it could have been drawn with all the coils going in one direction.
The loops in the centre (2) are through all coils together, and were drawn like that so as they can be seen as seperate coils to the over wound coils. These loops are in fact a bifilar coil with their ends shorted so as to form a capacitance with next to no inductance. This acts like a SOLID ring, or core, inside the external coils. The centre of the TPU is JUST A NON METALIC FORMER (cork or the likes).
The TPU heats up OVER TIME, why? because the coils over the top pass multiple positive pulses in one direction through two coils (a and c coils).
The a, b, and c coils are wound as a trifilar coil, all in the same "direction", very important. Why is this important! well these pulses have varying amplitudes, like a sine wave but ALL positive. What happens if you have a MOVING magnetic field across that core! YOU WILL INDUCE A CURRENT INTO THAT CORE, eddy currents, over time it will heat up, not instantly like in iron, because it is copper, BUT it will heat up.
When you induce the current into the "core" it will produce an equal magnetic field going OUTWARDS towards the external solenoids. This is like an induction heater, but here is used a moving magnetic field (DC), and not an alternating magnetic field. The fields are perpendicular to one another, SM did not say exactly, only that "they" are perpendicular. The "b" coils wound as part of the trifilar, are not part of the moving field inducing into the core, but the collectors of the perpendicular field from the core, which was created by the huge circulating current in the core. So SM's collectors are not the core, but the "b" coils. IT IS A DC LINEAR GENERATOR, the trick is how it becomes OU and how it is fed back into the "front end" if you can call it that. The output is from either side of the "a" mosfet as shown on the drawings, the CMC is a separation of the DC generator and the multiple pulses of different amplitude (a filter).
The core is important, and is where the gain (to use SM terms) comes from, NO KICK and it will not work. There are only two input frequencies, not three, B is a switching GROUND from the collector to the A and C mosfet drains, B switches either with A or with C, A and C are never ON together.
Other words of SM:- When you cut the supply, the electrons have enough momentum to hit their target!
Regards
Mike
I will attempt to build it. I need to get the tinned copper wire.
SO the coil itself is wound as layers, let me know if I get this wrong:
TOP TOROID:
A - top
C - middle
B - bottom winding
CORE (A couple turns, shorted ends, connected to BOTTOM TOROID)
Bottom Toiroid:
A1 - top
C1 - middle
B1 - bottom winding
CORE
All windings CCW, right hand rule.
Every winding has the SAME number of turns. The windings that are on top of the other windings (like C or A), will have different inductance and capacitance to the CORE. What is acceptable ratio?
My goal is to carefully build a very precise coil. Measure the inductance, capacitance, find the resonant frequencies of each set of coils. However, I don't know what the target ratios are, I need to study the circuit more, it is very complex in action.
Please have patience with me, I am trying to absorb all the knowledge.
Just trying to get my head around this, Mike says it is a trifilar wound coil, but he also says the coils are wound on top of each other, this is not a trifilar wind.
In bifilar and trifilar winding the wires are all wound together at the same time this keeps each winding the same length of wire and the same impedance, if the coils are wound on top of each other they will be of unequal lengths and each coil will have it's own length and impedance and inductance. I think this is what is needed in this device so are the directions wrong or did CF miss speak with the trifilar winding?
Thank you
Room3327
Quote from: Room3327 on 2024.04.17, 19:20:27
Just trying to get my head around this, Mike says it is a trifilar wound coil, but he also says the coils are wound on top of each other, this is not a trifilar wind.
In bifilar and trifilar winding the wires are all wound together at the same time this keeps each winding the same length of wire and the same impedance, if the coils are wound on top of each other they will be of unequal lengths and each coil will have it's own length and impedance and inductance. I think this is what is needed in this device so are the directions wrong or did CF miss speak with the trifilar winding?
Thank you
Room3327
All the coils are the same length, they are in two halves, a a1 etc. You can either make two toroids and place one on top of the other, or one. If one then the centre will have the end of one and the start of the other. When bent around as a toroid you can see how one on top of the other is wired.
The cut open of SM's TPU was all one, the centre was a cork former to take the heat, and just coils wound on top. The current and so the fields all go in the same direction (DC dual amplitude pulses, SM's machine gun effect). That effect is made using the delay between the two lines and their capacitance to the B core which is a neutral ground (used as a passive sound effect room expander).
With that I am not aloud to tell you more, except remember SM is an audio expert, where he replicated triodes with N channel mosfets, so mosfets in a Triode linear mode. My electronics is on a board of 8 X 6cm including the mosfets but not the large buffer capacitor. One 9v battery can run the whole system, or start with a battery and then self run from one generator output coil (b), but not the large capacitor and (b) coil.
Lots of buffers as SM said.
Good luck gentlemen
Regards
Mike
Is momentary current applied to AB (the core) required to start the device?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.18, 01:21:35
Is momentary current applied to AB (the core) required to start the device?
No
So as those that still do not see what is going on, see attached.
Possibly my last post.
Regards
Mike
I think your "DC linear generator" explanation is the best so far. That makes sense.
The complex interactions of your coils and the frequencies required are what I don't understand.
Is it possible to see a video somewhere of the amplification effect described as the SM method? OU ?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.18, 14:25:42
I think your "DC linear generator" explanation is the best so far. That makes sense.
The complex interactions of your coils and the frequencies required are what I don't understand.
Look up about audio room expanders.
The way the coils are connected forms two LC delay lines, one has 50% less inductance of the other. The C is the capacitance to the B core (-). These delay lines come together into one end of the "a" half of the "a" coils, and forming multiple differential amplitude pulses (SMs machine gun effect).
Regards
Mike
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.18, 15:48:53
Is it possible to see a video somewhere of the amplification effect described as the SM method? OU ?
The OU is not from that.
If you take a DC to DC converter, you increase voltage at the cost of current = no OU.
If you convert DC to DC and increase voltage AND near infinite current = OU.
You can use 12v @ say 1amp and induce current into a metal ring, and have infinite circulating current in that ring, near 0v though, it is a short of very low resistance. (the principles of an induction heater)
But you should never use IRON in this unit ^-^
Regards
Mike
Question. Is it two solid cores or one? Ie are the coils top and bottom connected or is it two capacitor plates
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.17, 17:37:05
Grumpy and others.
To start with STEAP and the SM TPU are one of the same.
To realise before anything you need to understand how this works. A full blown working diagram so as you just copy it is not my idea of 9 years of investigation. What I am going to do is tell you how it works, and what it is in it's parts.
First off the circuit on the brown paper drawing of the coils IS CORRECT, what you need to realise is he was drawing a top and bottom set of coils.
These coils DO not buck as it would appear because the centre taps come back on themselves in the drawing. This was for ease of drawing so as the connections can be seen. So you are looking at a top and a bottom toroid, but it could have been drawn with all the coils going in one direction.
The loops in the centre (2) are through all coils together, and were drawn like that so as they can be seen as seperate coils to the over wound coils. These loops are in fact a bifilar coil with their ends shorted so as to form a capacitance with next to no inductance. This acts like a SOLID ring, or core, inside the external coils. The centre of the TPU is JUST A NON METALIC FORMER (cork or the likes).
The TPU heats up OVER TIME, why? because the coils over the top pass multiple positive pulses in one direction through two coils (a and c coils).
The a, b, and c coils are wound as a trifilar coil, all in the same "direction", very important. Why is this important! well these pulses have varying amplitudes, like a sine wave but ALL positive. What happens if you have a MOVING magnetic field across that core! YOU WILL INDUCE A CURRENT INTO THAT CORE, eddy currents, over time it will heat up, not instantly like in iron, because it is copper, BUT it will heat up.
When you induce the current into the "core" it will produce an equal magnetic field going OUTWARDS towards the external solenoids. This is like an induction heater, but here is used a moving magnetic field (DC), and not an alternating magnetic field. The fields are perpendicular to one another, SM did not say exactly, only that "they" are perpendicular. The "b" coils wound as part of the trifilar, are not part of the moving field inducing into the core, but the collectors of the perpendicular field from the core, which was created by the huge circulating current in the core. So SM's collectors are not the core, but the "b" coils. IT IS A DC LINEAR GENERATOR, the trick is how it becomes OU and how it is fed back into the "front end" if you can call it that. The output is from either side of the "a" mosfet as shown on the drawings, the CMC is a separation of the DC generator and the multiple pulses of different amplitude (a filter).
The core is important, and is where the gain (to use SM terms) comes from, NO KICK and it will not work. There are only two input frequencies, not three, B is a switching GROUND from the collector to the A and C mosfet drains, B switches either with A or with C, A and C are never ON together.
Other words of SM:- When you cut the supply, the electrons have enough momentum to hit their target!
Regards
Mike
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.19, 09:07:33
Question. Is it two solid cores or one? Ie are the coils top and bottom connected or is it two capacitor plates
Bifilar coil with each coil shorted to itself = a capacitor with next to no inductance, like a straight wire.
It is a bifilar, AB, with a trifilar on top, abc. The length of the two is the same.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.18, 01:21:35
Is momentary current applied to AB (the core) required to start the device?
Why did SM swipe a magnet around the top of the toroid! Will tell you how he started it.
Mike
What did SM discover by moving a magnet around a toroid that we don't know?
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.21, 08:33:09
What did SM discover by moving a magnet around a toroid that we don't know?
If you move a magnet across a wire what happens?? come on even my grand children know that.
Mike
If I told you that the only thing need as far a power is concerned (no batteries) is a charged capacitor, nothing more, you are going to say it is imposible, well it is not imposible.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.21, 05:34:17
Why did SM swipe a magnet around the top of the toroid! Will tell you how he started it.
Mike
Do you have a video link?
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.19, 10:53:18
Bifilar coil with each coil shorted to itself = a capacitor with next to no inductance, like a straight wire.
It is a bifilar, AB, with a trifilar on top, abc. The length of the two is the same.
Regards
Mike
And there are two sets of these coils right?
On top:
Bifilar, AB, shorted, with trifilar, abc.
On bottom:
Bifilar, AB, shorted, with trifilar, a1b1c1
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.21, 10:13:29
If I told you that the only thing need as far a power is concerned (no batteries) is a charged capacitor, nothing more, you are going to say it is imposible, well it is not imposible.
Mike
I would say that's super impressive and just what is needed to prove it really works. No batteries, just some caps.
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.21, 10:52:58
I would say that's super impressive and just what is needed to prove it really works. No batteries, just some caps.
Well you charge the caps beforehand so as the electronics are running, of course.
Mike
Quote:-
To realise before anything you need to understand how this works. A full blown working diagram so as you just copy it is not my idea of 9 years of investigation. What I am going to do is tell you how it works, and what it is in it's parts.
End quote.
Above is what I posted before.
SM is a Audio engineer, started his career using Tubes (valves), he was always making references to them and using Mosfets. That is the most fundamental part of my investigation into the TPU.
The brown paper drawings are the basic idea of how to build the TPU, but not a working drawing. I don't have time atm, but the idea on paper was not workable, but the "doodle" tells everything, and his words and videos told the rest.
This is a RESEARCH forum, do not pick ideas from out of the sky, and it is not a patent office where you can download the complete design.
He built amplifiers, WHICH HAD SOUND put into them, just think about that before commenting. He was not into resonance unless it was an unwanted feedback, and it is not NMR or any atomic type system, it is a simple system with a touch of a complicated result (it surprised him that it was DC.
Mike
...The brown paper drawings are the basic idea of how to build the TPU,...
what is this about?
QuoteThe brown paper drawings are the basic idea of how to build the TPU, but not a working drawing. I don't have time atm, but the idea on paper was not workable, but the "doodle" tells everything, and his words and videos told the rest.
Does anyone have a link to the "brown paper drawings"?. I would be interested to see SM's conceptual thoughts on the tech. In my opinion concepts are what matters, principals, and from that we can find our own way forward.
AC
Did Tony ever complete his STEAP build?
a few videos for your reminder ;)
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPj8bspVZUxZbAc_1-ImWskcQUPGhoDEi&si=QB2wKIyMP6MNsOei
Here are the brown paper drawings.
(https://i.ibb.co/ZhNyXZT/composite-brown-paper.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JzCXthk)
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.21, 19:17:34
Did Tony ever complete his STEAP build?
He is still working on it, he does not think in terms of audio electronics. This is not a square wave run system, there is no resonance as we know it, it is audio waves, in which case sine waves as two frequency inputs, a pentode mosfet configuration working in linear mode, the coils are a passive room expander system.
Mike
Quote from: lfarrand on 2024.04.22, 05:01:21
Here are the brown paper drawings.
Thanks,
Who is the author of these diagrams? SM 100% ? I haven't seen them before. Where do they come from?
The drawings show the symbol of a triangular wave.
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.22, 07:16:09
Thanks,
Who is the author of these diagrams? SM 100% ? I haven't seen them before. Where do they come from?
The drawings show the symbol of a triangular wave.
The brown paper drawings are SM. This all works in linear mode as in audio amplifiers, therefore the input has to be a sine or at least a triangle wave.
The mosfets switch between the area of 0v towards their full ON area, and not like a switch with square waves. Think audio or you will never get a unit to work.
Mike
This is what it looks like with 2 frequencies pacing through the coils.
This was a mockup just to show, but the toroid was real.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.22, 08:39:38
The brown paper drawings are SM. This all works in linear mode as in audio amplifiers, therefore the input has to be a sine or at least a triangle wave.
The mosfets switch between the area of 0v towards their full ON area, and not like a switch with square waves. Think audio or you will never get a unit to work.
Mike
So by feeding in some waves, slightly out of phase into a particular coil config we should see a kick if we get it right. At this point I was to make one kick and just get basics down. Looks like he was cutting off power at just the right time. To send electrons into a target
His coil configs look like 3 or so turns. Wrapped with three coils all the way around. Put two together stacked, center tap. Perhaps pulse a coil and allow the coil to generate the sine in its own resonant frequency. Phase two coils so their resonant frequency is slightly different.
But what do with the beat
This is where I am with my own understanding. Can't just take centraflows developed design. I have to understand the why.
I was interested in S M a long time ago until I found information that he was dead and that he had embezzled a lot of money from the people he got it from. Nobody knows how his device worked. He himself once said that if you have a radio station outside your window, his device works well.
You know that if you have 10kW EPR outside your window, it is not difficult to have 50W at home. Once upon a time, entire villages were powered this way, probably in Rumia. A piece of wire a few meters away was enough.
I know that S M showed that his device works in different locations.
How to explain the gyroscopic effect? Did it produce core vibrations? What do you think ?
...
I see a phase shift here.
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.22, 09:31:24
I was interested in S M a long time ago until I found information that he was dead and that he had embezzled a lot of money from the people he got it from. Nobody knows how his device worked. He himself once said that if you have a radio station outside your window, his device works well.
You know that if you have 10kW EPR outside your window, it is not difficult to have 50W at home. Once upon a time, entire villages were powered this way, probably in Rumia. A piece of wire a few meters away was enough.
I know that S M showed that his device works in different locations.
How to explain the gyroscopic effect? Did it produce core vibrations? What do you think ?
...
I see a phase shift here.
Apart from the phrase at the end, the rest us not true afaik. The last I heard he was in a wheel chair, and the only contact was via German lawyers, but I certainly do not have contact.
I estimate that he is about my age, getting a bit long in the tooth as we say in the UK
Quote from: lfarrand on 2024.04.22, 05:01:21
Here are the brown paper drawings.
(https://i.ibb.co/ZhNyXZT/composite-brown-paper.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JzCXthk)
Does anyone know what the file names are for the individual pictures of the so-called brown paper drawings? I am pretty sure I have them archived, but I don't recall which folder. I have 4.2GB and 4800 files in my "Steven Mark" folder.
Quote from: poynt99 on 2024.04.22, 15:31:44
Does anyone know what the file names are for the individual pictures of the so-called brown paper drawings? I am pretty sure I have them archived, but I don't recall which folder. I have 4.2GB and 4800 files in my "Steven Mark" folder.
I've never seen them before. If you have better quality, I'd love to see it :D
I don't have the individual brown paper images. I downloaded that composite picture from one of the threads here or on overunity.com.
Something I've found helpful is if you switch your file manager view to icon/picture mode then you can quickly scan for images with a particular colour scheme.
Maxmalone
QuoteI was interested in S M a long time ago until I found information that he was dead and that he had embezzled a lot of money from the people he got it from. Nobody knows how his device worked. He himself once said that if you have a radio station outside your window, his device works well.
You know that if you have 10kW EPR outside your window, it is not difficult to have 50W at home. Once upon a time, entire villages were powered this way, probably in Rumia. A piece of wire a few meters away was enough.
Perspective is everything.
Some might consider taking a fair wage not tax evading stock options and pouring money into side research embezzling. I know many people who know how this tech works so SM was definitely not alone. On power lines, in fact most FE inventors claimed they could not run there devices near or during a thunderstorm. Which gives us some indication of the possible source of energy.
Here's a clue, some inventors like Moray claimed there devices were extremely sensitive to external disturbances. One device could detect people talking 10 miles away. Another passive field detection device could detect cars and airplanes moving over 30 miles away. Other devices could detect thunderstorms hundreds of miles away. To my knowledge very few if any people today have any understanding how this was done.
In my opinion SM, like most FE inventors, was probably involved in a "catch and kill" operation popular in the news recently. In effect, they "catch" the person by manipulating them into signing contracts/NDA's. Then "kill" them literally or by blackmail, stopping all research and gagging them for life. As such Centraflows explanation " The last I heard he was in a wheel chair, and the only contact was via German lawyers, but I certainly do not have contact" is the much more reasonable one. SM was probably paid out, gagged and only allowed to speak through lawyers which is typical.
AC
See this: https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/steven-mark/anaheim-california/steven-mark-steven-mark-steven-daniel-mark-steven-mark-fraud-scam-artist-con-man-anahe-1386197
I do not share the opinion that there are many people who have a working real device. Hundreds, perhaps thousands, of people tried to replicate the device. It's not important without finding a solution for OU. I tried to find these kicks and yes, there is a moment when the initial current bends the wave, but it is not something miraculous that gives power. still comes from the source. Of course, this may not be the case.
The longer I deal with FreeEnergy, the more I come to the conclusion that no one has such a miracle device. Most do not want to admit defeat and try to show something that will save their honor and deceive themselves and others. The current times will favor fraudsters. Just look at YT. How many scams are shown. This is called entertainment.
---
so let's not give up...
Steven modeled the Kenatron rectifier diode.
SM writes: I came up with the idea while looking at 5U4 GB or 5AR4 vacuum rectifiers.
I feel that there are some very interesting clues in this exerpt, which SM is alleged to have written.
QuoteYou should hear my new amplifier I have made.
I am using 6BQ7-A tubes for the input and phase inverter because they are VHF amplifier triodes designed to operate in Color TV at very high frequencies and so you can imagine how crystal clear my high frequencies are in my stereo amplifier. Yes, I know that they are hard to find so I have found that I can use any triode designed for color TV VHF use. That gives me many tube types to choose from. In fact I wouldn't recommend them because they are operated on a six point three volt heater so you could use another tube designed to use a 12.6 volt heater instead.
I prefer using triodes because they generate less distortion.
Any deviation from the original signal or addition to , Harmonic and intermodulation is not good for stereo enjoyment, you know...
Stereo? I have a three channel system I listen to. Sometimes the three channels combine together to create the most magnificent sound you could imagine. A whole new sound stage opens up and suddenly you are transformed to someplace else.
Gosh, the reason I just hate transistors is because they are so slow and generate so much distortion!!! I think that transistors are basically useless for listening to really good high fidelity.
all those harmonics somehow get through to the music output and just ruin the music...
I am sure that you know what I am referring to. Did you know that electron transit times in some tubes approach the speed of light? They are mini particle accelerators. Did you know that the best electron transit times of transistors is about like turning on a mechanical switch for a lamp? That is probably why they use so much negative feedback in transistor amps, to keep the output signal close to what the input signal was. But, if you need all that negative feedback to lower distortion doesn't that SLOW down the amplifier even more? Gee, why not just build a tube amp to begin with. Less distortion and little need for feedback overdose. Much faster all around. You know, it would be especially suited for high frequency reproduction. Why don't you tell all of the transistor devotees what the differences are.
I have designed some amps using MOSFET , etc. which sound very much like tube amps.
However when I want to design a new amp I always start with tubes and when I get them perfected I move on the MOSFETS...
I made an amp and had a really difficult time with a 35K resonance. I had so much trouble with it that I finally left the resonance there. I last measured it at 35.705K at a really high level.
It is a good thing that I can't hear that high. But it does prove that my output transformer is capable of going up to 245K HZ. Which I measured. HEY, did you know that the frequency is proportional to the speaker's circumference? it appears that the frequency should change with the circumference of the speaker. That makes sense to you does it? No one I have talked to realizes that yet. I use 15" speakers myself. They are 15" from the dead center of the outside flange to the other sides flange.
You know transistors just don't do well at those high frequencies. They try hard but they just make all sorts of harmonics all over the place. dirty things transistors. MOSFETS are bettern you know if you wanted to make an amplifier that behaved as though it was a tube amp but in a smaller size.
Well as soon as I get my amp finished I will let you know if I have any more problems with it. But I like the sound and the power of it already.
I think he was talking about coherence when he said 'crystal clear'.
Anyone working on a device, related in any way to SM's TPU's, accepts that they were not fakes.
I think Mannix is the only one who used tubes.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.23, 00:43:51
Anyone working on a device, related in any way to SM's TPU's, accepts that they were not fakes.
I think Mannix is the only one who used tubes.
Did Mannix build a real device? Probably not.
Centraflow:
SM: Personaly I don't care where the energy comes from, be it powerlines, be it welding machines at a nerby construction site, be it a radio tower nearby, I just tune my devices and receive as much energy as I need.
I found this PDF (https://www.n5dux.com/ham/files/pdf/Analog%20Delay%20Lines.pdf) which explains analog delay lines to be very enlightening. It mentions 'The delay-line MOSFET's have a tetrode structure'.
Quote from: lfarrand on 2024.04.23, 09:17:08
I found this PDF (https://www.n5dux.com/ham/files/pdf/Analog%20Delay%20Lines.pdf) which explains analog delay lines to be very enlightening. It mentions 'The delay-line MOSFET's have a tetrode structure'.
If you look at Fig13, Room Expander, it will give you an idea of the "system".
Mike
Working designs aside, can you explain the method of induction within the STEAP?
As simple as moving a magnet through a coil.
So, far I can't understand most of the analogies and explanations.
Quote from: lfarrand on 2024.04.22, 19:40:44
I feel that there are some very interesting clues in this exerpt, which SM is alleged to have written.
I think he was talking about coherence when he said 'crystal clear'.
There are so many reverse nuggets in that SM quote above it unbelievable.
I have to agree. My current driver is a CFL which operates at 35.7khz.
SM needed speed to create EMPs.
Whats interesting is Don Smith used EMPs also and never mentioned the need for speed because the cfl power supply and the neon took care of that.
The rest of the circuit captured that activity and stored it.
The tanks and series LC ckts then produce a fidelic environment.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.23, 21:50:39
Working designs aside, can you explain the method of induction within the STEAP?
As simple as moving a magnet through a coil.
So, far I can't understand most of the analogies and explanations.
If you take a solenoid coil and you pass a current through it you will create an electro magnet, N one end and S at the other. If you pass AC you can induce currents into metals, not only iron, but into copper or aluminum, this is AC induction. The laws of induction use the term, moving magnetic field, not an alternating field, but both induce current into a metal, AC or DC. STEAP produces DC induction, a moving magnetic field, a DC linear generator.
Mike
To create the moving magnetic field you need two DC EM solenoids wound like a bifilar coil. You pass two different currents at different pulsed timings through the two coils. The result is a moving magnetic field in one direction which is a sudo, all positive, wave.
The core, copper, is induced with a current, it is a loop shorted, the currents circulate, very high currents. These currents induce an equal field back at where the inducing field came from, but WITH GAIN, as SM said, it runs with gain.
The pick up coils are wound with the inducing coils, therefore the solenoid coils are trifilar. You now have a linear DC generator "basicly speaking".
Mike
The DC-induced magnetic field does not move! it just skips. Does the film frame move? Only we see it that way. It's the same with the DC coil. A magnetic field is created at the coil. It arises and disappears. If there is a different magnetic field, it connects and then we can say that it connects and moves. It could be a sine wave then. Smooth displacement of the magnetic field, not DC jumps.
Yes, the current flowing in the short-circuited wire is large, but there is no excess energy. There is as much as there is a magnetic field. Show me an example when it's different.
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.24, 08:03:55
The DC-induced magnetic field does not move! it just skips. Does the film frame move? Only we see it that way. It's the same with the DC coil. A magnetic field is created at the coil. It arises and disappears. If there is a different magnetic field, it connects and then we can say that it connects and moves. It could be a sine wave then. Smooth displacement of the magnetic field, not DC jumps.
Yes, the current flowing in the short-circuited wire is large, but there is no excess energy. There is as much as there is a magnetic field. Show me an example when it's different.
Did I say jump! Each wave has a different amplitude, and it DOES move, it travels, as in an electron accelerator, pull push pull push, using magnetic fields.
By the way, I do not have to prove anything to you, sorry but atm I am not in any mood for arguing over something I know and you don't.
Look up accelerators. If you can accelerate "electron" current.
The whole unit is like an op amp, it runs with gain, the configuration is a current amplifier as well as voltage.
The output is a differential positive pulse.
Mike
PS Eastern Europe?
Centraflow:
I'm not arguing with you, I'm just describing what I know. It's hard to describe correctly if I'm not an English speaker. Maybe I misunderstood you. I would like to see with my own eyes what SM or you are writing about. Maybe I still don't know anything, but I'm trying to research it.
I also once came to the conclusion that it might be on Betatron! especially since the description fits. After years, I came to the conclusion that other devices also fit. Do not get me wrong.
According to what you write and what SM writes, the method should be noticed by many of us. Why isn't this the case?
If this is not a problem, show me when the current in the fault loop will be added to the input current and OU will be formed. Please.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.24, 06:21:43
To create the moving magnetic field you need two DC EM solenoids wound like a bifilar coil. You pass two different currents at different pulsed timings through the two coils. The result is a moving magnetic field in one direction which is a sudo, all positive, wave.
The core, copper, is induced with a current, it is a loop shorted, the currents circulate, very high currents. These currents induce an equal field back at where the inducing field came from, but WITH GAIN, as SM said, it runs with gain.
The pick up coils are wound with the inducing coils, therefore the solenoid coils are trifilar. You now have a linear DC generator "basicly speaking".
Mike
The core is parallel to the coils.
In a normal solenoid, the magnetic field is perpendicular to the coil windings.
So, is this some different form of induction, or I am missing the picture?
SM says it's a skin effect.
High voltage DC pulses become electrostatic. Then additional capacitive effects also occur. Outside the magnetic field we have coupling as in a capacitor. This makes measurements difficult and introduces a lot of noise. Maybe SM referred to it as HASH.
SM talks about a little kick. Once he says it's two waves when they meet. Other times it's a feedback effect from the coil. The return on price, i.e. bemf, is usually a high-voltage current.
Who will show the actual kick SM is talking about :) ?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.24, 13:19:48
The core is parallel to the coils.
In a normal solenoid, the magnetic field is perpendicular to the coil windings.
So, is this some different form of induction, or I am missing the picture?
If you short the two ends of a solenoid what do you have? NEAR no inductance, it behaves NEARLY like a solid piece of metal, the returning field is NEARLY perpendicular to the solenoids wound around it. How does a transformer perform if the secondary is SHORTED. You need to look hard at what happens. b/A/B/external ground plane, the latter not shown, is a capacitor which charges, A as you know is connected to one terminal of the output (SM drawing).
If you drop a imaginary MONO pole magnet down inside a copper tube, what happens? STEAP is in reverse, you can not drop a copper tube down inside a magnet, but it is the same.
Mike
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.24, 10:00:53
Centraflow:
I'm not arguing with you, I'm just describing what I know. It's hard to describe correctly if I'm not an English speaker. Maybe I misunderstood you. I would like to see with my own eyes what SM or you are writing about. Maybe I still don't know anything, but I'm trying to research it.
I also once came to the conclusion that it might be on Betatron! especially since the description fits. After years, I came to the conclusion that other devices also fit. Do not get me wrong.
According to what you write and what SM writes, the method should be noticed by many of us. Why isn't this the case?
If this is not a problem, show me when the current in the fault loop will be added to the input current and OU will be formed. Please.
Because it is clever The way to move a "field" is as the Room expander model. There is NO resonance, there is reverberation which is part of the way a room expander works.
It took me from 2013 until 2021 to work this out, not in plain site. You HAVE TO THINK LIKE A SOUND ENGINEER, the old ones like me ;D I am not a sound engineer, I am an industrial engineer, and my electronics started when I became a radio Ham, G6GVA in my days at Marconi, that is my UK call sign, but I have an equivalent class A here in Spain where I live.
Look at the SM drawings.
As SM said, you would not believe how simple this is.
Mike
" SM said it was a skin effect"
It is a skin effect, where are the charges on a capacitor? Where does high frequency run in a wire?
Mike
Electromagnetic waves, do they travel?
What did SM say? "the waves are traveling at near the seed of light"
https://www.ck12.org/flexi/physical-science/electromagnet/how-quickly-do-electromagnetic-waves-travel/#:~:text=All%20electromagnetic%20waves%20travel%20at,108%20m%2Fs).
A magnet through a copper tube travels at the speed gravity is pulling the magnet until the opposite induced field slows it down.
What if you had a remote control ON OFF ON OFF for the magnet as it went through the tube?
Mike
The STEAP uses moving electric fields to induce a current in the core.
Correct?
If the STEAP is not radiating, then the moving electric fields are uniform, and therefore there is an associated magnetic field, also moving.
Then there should be other ways to apply this effect, even if only a proof of concept to verify these details.
Will a long version of your abc coil diagram show this inductive effect on the core wire?
As a footnote to the audio room expander concept, here is Steven's patent.
I had a scan of a beat up "Spherics Audio Laboratories" business card sent to me by one of the many players in Steven's circle at one time or another, but I can't seem to find that either. >:( I will keep looking....
David Doleshal may have been one of Steven's closest associates, but sadly he is not technical in the electronics realm and although he witnessed the devices in operation, he was not able to shed any real light on how the units worked. He is supposedly a doctor of something, maybe Lindsay knows. Maybe he was Steven's lawyer, and hence the reason his name appears on the patent.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.23, 21:50:39
Working designs aside, can you explain the method of induction within the STEAP?
As simple as moving a magnet through a coil.
So, far I can't understand most of the analogies and explanations.
The way I see, we have conventional transformer induction and motional EMF induction. Both formulas are inherently balanced meaning by-themselves there is no obvious gain mechanism.
The two potential symmetry-breaking mechanisms IMO would be:
- Parametric variation of permittivity (or: electrostriction)
- Parametric variation of permeability (or: magnetostriction)
Either is conceivable since they both occur on the atomic level, with
the electrical or magnetic induction being a secondary reaction which is not necessarily symmetric to the energy required to induce the parameter change.
(For example the joules required to increase a ferrous material past its curie temperature is in no way related to the # of webers of magnetic charge present in the material. And the joules used to add heat are theoretically recoverable.)
The existence of a shorted loop coil implies that standing currents exist that are then modulated by altering one or both of these parameters, causing this secondary reaction which might be either conventional or motional EMF that would act on/modulate the existing charge(or both). That would either increase or decrease the total energy present depending on the arrangement. Since CF uses a lot of silicone-coated wire and no ferrous material I would lean toward electrostriction/permittivity modulation in his setup, while experimenters like GK are more likely to be using the permeability modulation route.
The experimental question then becomes what would be the simplest way to demonstrate an asymmetry or gain mechanism using this mechanic??
(doesn't matter if it's OU or self-powered as long as it demonstrates a new mechanism!)
Something like a constant-current flowing through a coil, applying HV impulses at various stages in linear sequence (akin to an 3-phase motor), then looking for an anomalous DC component between both ends of the constant-current wire? The result would be a DC component that changes with pulse-train-frequency, and inverts when the pulse train direction is reversed, and scales linearly to current running through the constant-current coil, and doesn't invert when the constant-current source is reversed.
Anyway that's just my take, and full-disclosure almost entirely credited to Eric Dollard's work on parametrics. :P
Both Centraflow and SM had at least one working device that had a wire core, so to speak, and the current was induced in this wire core as if dragging the electrons along the length of the wire.
SM had other versions but he described one with a 3-coil core, stacked, not interleaved.
This dragging direction is also the direction of the field motion.
Thinking more on the references to a solid core, is that the same as a closed solenoid?
Let's say it is, perhaps inside-out.
Somehow, the high velocity electric field is dragging the electrons as if a very strong magnetic field is moving. around the wire (based on field directions).
some way to apply several repeated electric fields along the length of the core wire should show some induced current.
SM suggested the transformer experiment.
If you do not understand how a room expander works, the basics, you will never get this to work.
SM said, if you do not get the kick you will never get it to work, that should give you a clue, what is causing the KICK?
I have shown you how to turn a mosfet into a triode, and 3 mosfets into a pentode, so what can the pentode do?
2 frequencies, one power supply.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.25, 06:37:39
SM suggested the transformer experiment.
If you do not understand how a room expander works, the basics, you will never get this to work.
SM said, if you do not get the kick you will never get it to work, that should give you a clue, what is causing the KICK?
I have shown you how to turn a mosfet into a triode, and 3 mosfets into a pentode, so what can the pentode do?
2 frequencies, one power supply.
Mike
Hmm does this pentode have the electron acceleration properties?
So the frequencies make a moving magnetic field, electrons can move because there is no circuit, no back pressure like turning off magnet in tube. Then once they are really traveling quick you turn on b and then boom there is your kick combined with the AB cap shorted ring if large current.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.25, 03:29:17
Somehow, the high velocity electric field is dragging the electrons as if a very strong magnetic field is moving. around the wire (based on field directions).
some way to apply several repeated electric fields along the length of the core wire should show some induced current.
So something like a string of Half-H-bridge drivers rated as high a potential as is practical?
And then if it were purely an electrostatic action then solid plates would conceivably work for the electrodes around the constant-current test coil.
Of course simpler circuits could be devised but not until it was confirmed if rise/fall times were critical factors to operation.
...If you do not understand how a room expander works...
sorry, what is this ? room expander
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.25, 13:38:50
...If you do not understand how a room expander works...
sorry, what is this ? room expander
It's a reverb circuit. Delayed signals.
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.25, 14:18:07
It's a reverb circuit. Delayed signals.
Thanks O0
So this fits as a delay line;
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.25, 14:23:18
Thanks O0
So this fits as a delay line;
I cant read the part number
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.25, 15:33:03
I cant read the part number
I can not too. I don't have a better resolution.
Quote from: Hakasays on 2024.04.25, 12:56:33
So something like a string of Half-H-bridge drivers rated as high a potential as is practical?
And then if it were purely an electrostatic action then solid plates would conceivably work for the electrodes around the constant-current test coil.
Of course simpler circuits could be devised but not until it was confirmed if rise/fall times were critical factors to operation.
The attached are the mosfets switching, note in their linear area, as audio switching is done. Class A amplifiers etc.
Do not take any notice of the frequencies, the yellow is just triggering my scope.
Mike
Edit: reduce size of pic
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.04.25, 14:23:18
Thanks O0
So this fits as a delay line;
That was just an IDEA. The real electronics fit on a 6cm X 8cm pcb, including the mosfets and frequency generators, one of which is a clock (as in watch) crystal.
At least your thinking of what SM gave. A lot was given in his mails, you just have to think like him.
The delay is in the coils inductance and capacitance to ground (LC).
Mike
Now all this business of looping back from the output to the input to create an OU machine will never ever work in ANY OU divice, it would brake the laws of conservation of energy. Apart from that, would it not run away with itself!
STEAP and the TPU run with gain, as in an op-amp, but unlike an op-amp, the gain is both voltage and current.
It is the linear generator part that runs the unit, the generator, it is NOT THE OUTPUT, so get that clear to start with when I said it is a linear generator.
I just thought I should mention that as it probably was misleading. I have been under the weather the last two weeks with an ulcerated colon, very painful, last of 10 days on two antibiotics today, I am without energy and bad tempered. My wife tells me I am a s*n of a b**ch to live with atm.
Mike
Thanks for sharing all you have Mike. I hope you feel better soon. Being under the weather and feeling bad tempered go hand in hand in my experience. I'm pretty grouchy when ill, which seems to be most of the time these past few months.
I've been thinking about it and it looks like the reverberatir function makes a really really fast rotating field in a really clever way
I wonder how it would change if you put a solenoid around it and apply dc current
So there is one frequency phase shifted. This produces a rumble that can be called an echo or delay. When is KICK created?
Is that the rumbling sound? So another frequency.
example:
1 f = 100kHz
2 f = 101kHz
phase shift 1kHz this is rumble.
Centraflow: I am sorry that you are having health problems and I wish you to recover quickly.
Trying to think like Mark. I read the letters to Durban and to Lindsay. It talks about many things.
There is a dynatron effect in vacuum tubes and according to some it has signs of OU. However, Mark describes the moment when the lamp is turned on and then a small pulse occurs. Everything is correct, except that this impulse is the result of the current of the first switch-on.
You can set the mosfet for this short ms time, but it is not OU.
I didn't find anything here while taking measurements hmmm..
Yeah it's a mixer makes a beat frequency and has a complicated interaction with the core plus other coils
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.26, 10:26:18
Yeah it's a mixer makes a beat frequency and has a complicated interaction with the core plus other coils
It's supposed to be that simple ;D
Just guessing, sorry if offtopic.
When I read these comments about phase shifting - can be involved something like phase shifting with oposite coils?
For example phase #1 on #1 CW coil and phase #2 shifted by 90 degrees on #2 CCW coil, both coils winded on same core, and #3 pickup coil between them?
When #1 coil fires, creates induction in #3 coil and #3 coil creates Lenz in 90 phase shift and in this time #2 coil fires (because it is shifted also by 90 deg) and by this #2 coil Lenz is strengthened and greater power is generated?
And the phase shift is created by op-amp circuit?
It came to my mind because I read Fernandez Egg of Columbus pdf published on OU forum long time ago.
It happened before somewhere,remind me. Chris?
It is very possible that the TPU construction is a representation of a vacuum tube.
Such a vacuum tube can be controlled by MOSFETs.
4x collector coils on frame with ? aluminum ?
Does this really generate OU already?
What are these protruding legs?
Could there be a vacuum tube there? Of course.
Vacuum tubes come in various sizes and even as small as a match.
I think that the frequency or even two frequencies alone do not give the intended result without an additional mechanism of excess current. The vacuum tube is the closest to what Mark used.
He talked about it many times. This is basically the basis that gives you a KICK.
Chief
??
Quote from: chief kolbacict on 2024.04.26, 17:10:33
It happened before somewhere,remind me. Chris?
Here the experimenters to ask about that claim
https://www.beyondunity.org/?p=2
Quote from: Chet K on 2024.04.26, 19:13:30
Here the experimenters to ask about that claim
https://www.beyondunity.org/?p=2
It's just that what was above reminded me of the design of partner coils. :)
https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4201.0;attach=51071 (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4201.0;attach=51071)
If you really really study those drawings of SM, and relate them to his TPUs, especially the one that was cut open along with the comments, you should realise how they are wound and connected.
Here I have done the work for you.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.04.27, 10:58:20
If you really really study those drawings of SM, and relate them to his TPUs, especially the one that was cut open along with the comments, you should realise how they are wound and connected.
Here I have done the work for you.
Mike
Do you have a picture or video of the one cut open?
Thank you for your work. If you managed to repeat the excess energy, congratulations. I never received more than a few mW more.
Let's talk about KICK.
Mark says the output of the device is approximately 5kHz HASH. This means noise. This fits the term KICK which in large quantities can be called KICK. If we collect it in a capacitor we have one bigger KICK, so to speak. A suddenly discharged capacitor will give us "KICK", but this is wrong thinking because the output is 5kHz. For this to be possible, each KICK is 5kHz, right?
If KICK is to give anything, it must give more than 100V for a 100V bulb. We know that the measured voltage is even around 900V. Now you need to understand that each 5kHz KICK must have the appropriate pulse width power. Normally we have 50%, but when the lama is 100V and the voltage at the output is 900V, it can be easily assumed that the pulse width may be several percent. Probably <5%.
Of course, only if there is no rectifier at the output.
The coils themselves, even wound into a toroid, will not do anything in my opinion. No frequency will change anything if it is not next to the transmitting station. The bad news is that Mark writes that his device works like a radio and that he doesn't care where the transmitter is from. I understand that this may just be a description. He just doesn't know where this energy comes from. If a blind man had never seen, for example, the sun, he would also write the same.
Okay... so where can this energy come from? since Mark wrote about vacuum tubes, I still think this is the beginning and the end.
Coils can act as chokes.
The gyroscopic effect of TPU is interesting, but vibrations of 3 coils at several Hz or even Khz can vibrate cyclically and give such a gyroscopic effect.
This is interesting, but we don't know if it has a direct impact on OU. Rather, the vacuum tube gives us this KICK and the rest controls a tube or several.
This is how I see it for now.
Lithium batteries for watches began to be widely used in the 1980s. According to my calculations, a 15" toroid could hold over 550 CR2032 batteries. This gives a 100V 60W light bulb for approximately 15-25 minutes.
Is it possible that the TPU were batteries? we know that the device worked for about 15-30 minutes and overheated. This matches the battery power perfectly unfortunately.
Unfortunately, this is not a completely good explanation, but it is quite possible.
TPU from a suitcase - can be powered from a meter.
TPU 2x bulbs, large base holds a lot of batteries.
another thick black TPU means > 500 batteries.
and the next biggest one that works with TV... 5000> batteries?
Unfortunately, this is a possible scenario.
Please understand that after so many years, such an explanation may be close to the truth.
Personally, I would prefer it to be a bad explanation, but has anyone verified it this way?
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.05.07, 19:20:33
Lithium batteries for watches began to be widely used in the 1980s. According to my calculations, a 15" toroid could hold over 550 CR2032 batteries. This gives a 100V 60W light bulb for approximately 15-25 minutes.
Is it possible that the TPU were batteries? we know that the device worked for about 15-30 minutes and overheated. This matches the battery power perfectly unfortunately.
Unfortunately, this is not a completely good explanation, but it is quite possible.
TPU from a suitcase - can be powered from a meter.
TPU 2x bulbs, large base holds a lot of batteries.
another thick black TPU means > 500 batteries.
and the next biggest one that works with TV... 5000> batteries?
Unfortunately, this is a possible scenario.
Please understand that after so many years, such an explanation may be close to the truth.
Personally, I would prefer it to be a bad explanation, but has anyone verified it this way?
No batteries, it is not possible.
It uses capacitors, an audio amplifier, a delay line, and a DC to DC boost converter, all configured in a clever way which creates a linear DC generater which keeps it all going with considerable excess "power".
Regsrds
Mike
This is the moment when the SM short-circuits:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phs-guFpdrU
you can see the flame.
Now let's compare it with another video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXLbEf_HLPg
SM says it's 900V! How is it possible that 900V will give such a long flame!?
Even the sound is similar. (you can hear it in another video)
If there is 40kV or more then the frequency must be > 30Khz or more between 60-200Khz or more.
If there is at least 1kW there, doing it without protection was very stupid. There was definitely a skin effect. Of course it would be an HF/HV burn
Centraflow: it doesn't look like DC but AC/HF/HV
I know that you have great knowledge and I agree that it may be so. frequency doubler. Of course, frequency multiplication by resonance.
So we have a basic value, e.g. 10khz, and at the end we get 100khz. We know that higher frequency means greater power.
Would it be that simple? and possible? :D
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.05.09, 16:36:32
This is the moment when the SM short-circuits:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phs-guFpdrU
you can see the flame.
Now let's compare it with another video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXLbEf_HLPg
SM says it's 900V! How is it possible that 900V will give such a long flame!?
Even the sound is similar. (you can hear it in another video)
If there is 40kV or more then the frequency must be > 30Khz or more between 60-200Khz or more.
If there is at least 1kW there, doing it without protection was very stupid. There was definitely a skin effect. Of course it would be an HF/HV burn
Centraflow: it doesn't look like DC but AC/HF/HV
I know that you have great knowledge and I agree that it may be so. frequency doubler. Of course, frequency multiplication by resonance.
So we have a basic value, e.g. 10khz, and at the end we get 100khz. We know that higher frequency means greater power.
Would it be that simple? and possible? :D
It is more simple than you can imagine.
You should look at this thread https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4659.msg112039#msg112039 it will enlighten you to the type of induction, and why the TPU warms up, it is part of the effect.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.05.09, 17:29:39
It is more simple than you can imagine.
You should look at this thread https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4659.msg112039#msg112039 it will enlighten you to the type of induction, and why the TPU warms up, it is part of the effect.
Mike
You yourself wrote that there is no iron there. The thread you mention talks about iron and its production method and, i.e. carburizing.
I built something like this once. Each coil was switched separately. There was a magnetic field inside that was moving. The magnet was spinning.
I did a simple experiment with the rotation of a magnetic field:
https://youtu.be/MxS0dq6aW1c
If the power is increased to 20Vpp, the frequency can be increased to 15Hz
If the compass is spinning, it means that the frequency in the SM TPU magnetic field is 7-20Hz max. when the compass can rotate. Later he stands still according to witnesses' accounts. This means that the frequency is > 20Hz and we don't know how much. However, in order for it to stand still, the frequency must be higher. Basically any > 20...30Hz. maybe 100Mhz and more. It doesn't matter anymore then.
Is there a video when SM shows the compass spinning?
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.05.10, 08:23:30
I did a simple experiment with the rotation of a magnetic field:
https://youtu.be/MxS0dq6aW1c
What is the orientation of the windings in this coil ?
If they are in the classical axial orientation then the compass is incorrectly oriented inside the coil to rotate optimally.
P.S.
Do you know that your Rigol signal generator can be upgraded to 200MHz for free ?
Quote from: verpies on 2024.05.11, 07:36:09
What is the orientation of the windings in this coil ?
If they are in the classical axial orientation then the compass is incorrectly oriented inside the coil to rotate optimally.
P.S.
Do you know that your Rigol signal generator can be upgraded to 200MHz for free ?
Yes, I know you can have 200MHz, but it is still under warranty.
The compass test is not exactly the same but it shows a rotation relationship at 7Hz which is interesting. However, this is not proof that SM did it this way. My coil has coils 2x1300 turns. I only use one winding.
I will change the compass orientation as you suggest.
Quote from: maxmalone on 2024.05.11, 07:52:02
Yes, I know you can have 200MHz, but it is still under warranty.
You will need it if you drive an inductive load with a square wave without a buffer or a clamp.
P.S.
The firmware change is reversible and undetectable.
New test vertical comapss: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y45znznGh2E
Quote from: Centraflow on 2024.05.29, 18:24:53
That is the way to go O0, but I needed a person who would understand how it works, so they have a learning curve to go through. That is about to change very soon.
Mike
Mike, here's a proposal.
1 you open a GoFundMe site, maybe "buy me a coffee" and/or a PayPal account. Or perhaps all and more.
2 Publicly ask for a 100-dollar contribution for every successful TPU replication.
3 You show us how to build it as if you were a teacher in a school. and we were the students.
Most of us will think it's well worth it.
If it goes global then we can shame Elon Musk and others who will undoubtedly benefit: to pay you.
Most probably won't pay, but a high percentage will.
This is using Kapanadze's law to everyone's advantage.
Everyone wins including the inventor...
Think about it, Mike.
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2024.05.29, 23:48:12
Mike, here's a proposal.
1 you open a GoFundMe site, maybe "buy me a coffee" and/or a PayPal account. Or perhaps all and more.
2 Publicly ask for a 100-dollar contribution for every successful TPU replication.
3 You show us how to build it as if you were a teacher in a school. and we were the students.
Most of us will think it's well worth it.
If it goes global then we can shame Elon Musk and others who will undoubtedly benefit: to pay you.
Most probably won't pay, but a high percentage will.
This is using Kapanadze's law to everyone's advantage.
Everyone wins including the inventor...
Think about it, Mike.
This is a forum of "research" I am not selling anything, though my 5 children and 9 grand children may not agree with years of work for nothing!!
I have one person I have been leading through the whole system by placing the ideas in front of him, without drawing an exact schematic and writing pages of instructions.
This system of "energy generation", because in principle it is a linear generator, was found by accident, SM and his audio room expansion system.
These are the things to research:-
Audio effects and how they are produced, especially echo and reverberation.
Audio amplifiers, A, AB, C, D etc
Passive effects and not electronic
Passive delay lines
DC to DC boost converters
Induction heaters
Carriers and modulation there of. This last one is extreamly important.
Eddy currents, induction and effects there of
Closed loop infinite currents
Regards
Mike
This video by Peter Lindemann covers electric motor secrets and touches upon DC-to-DC converters.
Also, those of you who had the schoolgirl motor running for months without additional power will have a trip down memory lane.
The video has only just been put up on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZYwU4coxT4
Hey Mike
I have a question about the wire diameter and type of wire your using for the toroid coils.
Is it large twisted multi strand or solid core?. If my working theory for this kind of device is correct solid core should not work or not nearly as well.
Thanks
AC
14awg
AC, Toni is correct, but it can be also 16awg, all depends on the current you are going to put through it.
Steap has near infinite current, all depends on the load impedance. If you induce a current into a shorted coil the current will be infinite, it will also refect back into any other coils inductively connected ;)
If you take the upper mid range audio frequency(6th octave) you will have 5.12kHz, X 3.2 will give you 16.384kHz, divide this by 2.1 it will give you 7.8kHz, 1000 times the earths resonant frequency!!! 16.384kHz is half the clock frequency of 32.768kHz, STEAP needs 2 frequencies of 16.384kHz 180º out of phase, and a modulation frequency of 5.12kHz (audio test frequencies 4-6kHz enhanced room sound range).
As SM said, "so many stories to tell".
The range of human hearing is divided into eleven octave bands, each band having double the frequency span of the previous band. These are called the 1/1 octave bands. The human ear can hear a maximum of 10 octaves: 20-40Hz, 40-80 Hz, 80-160 Hz, 160-320 Hz, 320-640 Hz, 640 Hz to 1.28 KHz, 1.28-2.56 KHz, 2.56-5.12 KHz, 5.12-10.24 KHz, and 10.24 KHz up to the upper edge of the human ability to hear. The next octave would start at 20.48 KHz, which is barely above the high threshold of human hearing.
Years of investigation and experimenting.
Regards
Mike
Centraflow
QuoteSteap has near infinite current, all depends on the load impedance. If you induce a current into a shorted coil the current will be infinite, it will also reflect back into any other coils inductively connected
A shorted coil, sneaky and it makes sense in the context were talking about. In fact it's kind of brilliant and electrical isolation is always an issue with these kinds of systems. Thanks, that's a really good idea.
I was wrong about the wire and forgot your using two stacked toroid elements where I was thinking about one.
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2024.06.03, 19:57:57
Centraflow
A shorted coil, sneaky and it makes sense in the context were talking about. In fact it's kind of brilliant and electrical isolation is always an issue with these kinds of systems. Thanks, that's a really good idea.
I was wrong about the wire and forgot your using two stacked toroid elements where I was thinking about one.
AC
Can be one, only stacked to make a smaller footprint. The big one of SM with 2 cmcs was two units stacked to give more power.
The TV unit was a single unit in two halfs and stacked.
As long as the coils are connected correctly, both work.
Regards
Mike