Advocates of (pseudo) free-energy fight free speech: danger from ou.com

[exnihiloest]

After being banned from overunity.com, even my comments about youtube videos from user overunitydotcom are now blocked.

Overunity.com is becoming the great place to spread disinformation and lies and to support scams, forbidding any critical opinions even these supported by solid facts and scientific arguments.

This site is a real danger for the free energy research, discrediting our domain.
It is becoming a commercial site with more advertisements and fallacious claims than real research about free energy. It promotes obscurantism and swindles, and fights open minds who are not gullible enough to accept them.

Here is my "verboten" comment about Travis forgery at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkxrLzcp0Z8:

The concrete makes the air of the bucket to redistribute around, lowering the air/water interface, therefore increasing the air pressure and the Archimede's thrust. This means that the left and right bucket buoyancies can't be compared because their volumes are not of same shape.
Do we gain energy? Obviously not. Work is force by displacement. To move one or the other bucket from height h, we need to inject an air volume h*S at a pressure P where S is the inside section of the bucket and P the water pressure at the air/water interface.
The concrete doesn't change anything, because this air volume occupies all the space above the concrete when the bucket goes up, i.e. the same space as without concrete.
Therefore the presentation is fallacious, obviously we face a scam.

[Peterae]

Don't waist you time ex trying to fight this battle, i know you are trying to protect people from being scammed, well that what MH's aim was too, it does not work, we are living in the real world, scams are everywhere not just OU, ultimately it's down to each individual to do their own research, and if they cannot spot a scam then they need to wise up before being caught out.
We all pay way too much tax, many feel tax is a scam    and look at the mess the banking system is in.

Honestly if you try to fight scampers you will make yourself ill, just stick to doing good quality research which disproves a scam and you will be better off in the long run.

[muDped]

...
Overunity.com is becoming the great place to spread disinformation and
lies and to support scams, forbidding any critical opinions even these
supported by solid facts and scientific arguments.

This site is a real danger for the free energy research, discrediting our
domain.  It is becoming a commercial site with more advertisements and
fallacious claims than real research about free energy. It promotes
obscurantism and swindles, and fights open minds who are not gullible
enough to accept them.
...

Aye, many of the "forums" exist for those purposes.  Exploitation of
gullibility and ignorance can be profitable.  At least for a time.

Peterae's advice above is good.  We do all learn from our mistakes
and our "investments" in scams.  In due time.

While the gullible are caught up in those fantasies their minds are not
receptive to reason and criticism - they filter out all which does not
support their beliefs.  Until at long last their eyes are finally opened.

For most it means suffering the pain of disappointment after
disappointment or financial loss before they become sufficiently
motivated to acquire wisdom.

In truth, there is scant little that can be done to deter this pattern
of "learning."  We can be incredibly stubborn in our support of
deception while under its spell.

Thankfully, most of us do "see the light" and hit the books sooner
or later...

[NickZ]

   Dumped:
   Let's hope that some of us do see the light . Although at times it sure doesn't look like it.

  I've just been confronted for my views at Energetic Forums, Earth Light thread, for trying to explain that what are being called "non galvanic cells" are working by the same principals as that of the well known and studied galvanic chemical reaction cells, that we've both discussed previously.  As some guys now think that you can make a non-galvanic cell simply by making a cell in the same old way as a two different metals (copper/Mg ribbon), by using an Epsom salt soaked paper separator.  And that by just simply letting the paper separator dry out overnight, that now it becomes a "non galvanic cell" that is not working by the same old galvanic chemical reaction, and will not break down, or corrode.  Well, I told them that I don't buy it, and to put the cell on a load and to make a long term test, to prove their views.
  When I tried to convince them that they are not correct,  some of them just about threw me out of there.
  Well, maybe it's just as well.  "Time will tell",   my favorite saying,  I still take shelter under.
     You might want to check it out, good for a laugh, or two, if nothing else.
                                         
                     NickZ

[muDped]

Aye, I'm following that discussion.  You're doing well.

Such is life for those who have little understanding of
chemistry; polar liquids which may replace water in
certain reactions (with attenuated activity); and a good
grasp on what the galvanic cell is.  They're likely to fall
for anything or misinterpret what they "see" with their
own eyes.

Once we've "made our minds up" on any given issue
we may cling to what we believe no matter what.  For many
to admit error is a fate worse than death itself.

For most time will indeed tell.  The most stubborn, however,
will not give in even then...  At least not to reason and proofs
provided by an "antagonist."  Ego is a formidable barrier at
times. 

[exnihiloest]

@all
Thanks for your feedbacks. I'm very pleased to hear the voice of Reason .

Note that mistakes or eccentric ideas are very acceptable in research. I'm not at all opposed. They are even necessary steps. The problem appears only when people spread them as being the truth, hid the obvious flaws and reject the right for critical minds to express objections.

I'm worried about that because it is the tip of the iceberg. It is included in a much wider, disturbing and growing problem: the confiscation of the world by people who take their innate knowledge and their felt as the truth, which is the way to arbitrary. Just a small sign: there is a new minister in the French government, an ecologist. Last year he placed Japan, third economical power on earth, in the south hemisphere while learnedly explaining that the winds of the south hemisphere staying in the south hemisphere, they couldn't carry Fukushima radioactivity to Europe !  . The "elites" become now the emanation of ignorance satisfied of itself. This problem is new. We hadn't it during the 50's to the 70's but we have had it many times in the History, and it has been the source of end of civilizations.

Professors of public school, and family, who taught me when I was young had a great care to not falsify the reality and to transmit pedagogically real knowledge and methods of thinking, coming from respectable and various philosophers, thinkers, scientists... This is education, a base to go further according to a process named "progress" and related to the human ability to improve and to transmit his knowledge from generation to generation, contrarily to animals.
I'm afraid that an increasing part of the today youth is very influenced by pretentious ignorants or falsifiers, at least on Internet, and is beginning to fight skilled people, specially those having titles and diploma, and to reject culture, science and knowledge.

So what, when the new generation will get the political power?
We search for free energy. But why and for what future?
If we get free energy and it is collected by a generation who bases its acts on fool beliefs and visceral reactions instead of reason, isn't it as giving the atomic bomb to fascists?

[giantkiller]

Zardoz...

[NickZ]

  I really do appreciate your comments, also.  Face, and all.
  Though only looking for that allusive "free energy" myself,  that we are already surrounded by at all times. All I'm trying to do is stay with the truth, and to accept it when I see it, and discard it when I don't. Any help with this is always fully well received. I'm the first one to admit when I'm wrong, as I'm not partial to anything, but the truth.
                                       NickZ

[giantkiller]

Try these:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=aaily+olson+alchemical+manual&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CF0QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.scribd.com%2Fdoc%2F87878403%2FAlchemical-Manual-for-This-Millennium-Vol-1&ei=9hnRT-WqAYjO2wWFzKimDw&usg=AFQjCNEka5rmudRgrUs8C7o5W7bUJQAGTw

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=aaily+olson+alchemical+manual&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CFwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.scribd.com%2Fdoc%2F9177409%2FAlchemical-Manual-for-This-Millennium-Vol2-by-Aaity-Olson&ei=9hnRT-WqAYjO2wWFzKimDw&usg=AFQjCNGtsQVRo6fv5xXL1DBWKiqzFDxkog

[exnihiloest]

@NickZ
Your attitude is very respectable. I try to do the same.

@gk
There are full of such books in shelves of bookstores where decades ago, there were scientific books.
The human kind prefers often to believe instead of knowing, it's intellectually much easier and not challenging its illusions. A little place for the bullshits of gurus and gullible nuts is at most acceptable. The problem comes when their speech becomes the norm for the societies.

[Farrah Day]

Yep, there's no such thing as free speech on some forums - say the wrong thing and you're made very unwelcome by the gulible devoted, and sadly misguided, masses.

Mystic Murakami's Energetic Forum is exactly the same, that is: if you disagree or proffer conflicting information or ideas, then you're quickly booted out the door. And of course it's strictly forbidden to speak out against any one of his 'science fantasy' books.

And, as has rightly been said, when you block or ban all the voices of common sense and reason, all you are left with is threads upon threads of misinformation and flawed science. How very sad. 

The likes of Erich Von Daniken would have been in his element on either of these forums with his 'Chariot of the Gods' series of books. 

[exnihiloest]

...
And, as has rightly been said, when you block or ban all the voices of common sense and reason, all you are left with is threads upon threads of misinformation and flawed science. How very sad.  
...

The scientists can publish papers about speed of neutrinos exceeding the speed of light (CERN's paper), about perpetual motions of type 2 (maxwell's demon from Xinyong Fu) or about antigravity to lift tens kg (Fran De Aquino on arXiv). Almost every day there are papers from academics challenging the conventional knowledge, including relativity or Maxwell's electrodynamics.

We see that there is much more free speech in the scientific communauty to express amazing subjects than in the free energy to express academic views when needed. It's a shame whose the consequence that one can guess will be a total fail of alternative research . The research and discovery process requires a full liberty of ideas and liberty of confrontation of ideas.

[Peterae]

You are only allowed to have free speech if the other party allows it, if you start saying someone is full of BS and cannot prove that they talk BS then you are in effect slandering a person and by law this is illegal, in the UK it is taken very serious and can be a prisonable offence.

So if you start questioning a device be very carefull to have 100% proof it's a fake, i would imagine this would be as hard to prove just as much as to prove it works, in other words be prepared to be sued, this nearly happened to MH on here, the process is very simple, you slander someone or their devices without prove they are a con, the person in question then kindly asks for the forum to provide the ip address of the person slandering, if the forum does not respond, it would be easy enough to get a court order to get the IP addresses.

There's a big case in the UK right now about a women on Facebook, she was called a vampire, i believe she has already been granted the ip addresses to start slanderous actions via the police, the incredible thing these days is that most countries are now signed up to the transportation of people in foreign countries, so it no longer matters where the slanderer lives.

There is no free speech and there never was, its just in the old days you needed money to get someone, this is now mostly free.

It is a forum's admins duty to remove any slanderous comments, so remember this, anyone consistently slandering and threatening the existence of the forum will be banned, ultimately it is the forum that pays the price for slanderous posts, it is our responsibility to remove them, especially if by request.

If you have been kicked off another forum for arguing about a device being a fraud chances are the admin had no choice and you did not provide enough physical proof to show it was a fake, that in a slanderous action and expect to be banned because of it, specially if you keep doing it over and over again.

I suggest you all take equal shares in a new forum studying fake claims and air your views on that forum, but be prepared to be shut down as that is very likely to happen.

[PhysicsProf]

You are only allowed to have free speech if the other party allows it, if you start saying someone is full of BS and cannot prove that they talk BS then you are in effect slandering a person and by law this is illegal, in the UK it is taken very serious and can be a prisonable offence.

So if you start questioning a device be very carefull to have 100% proof it's a fake, i would imagine this would be as hard to prove just as much as to prove it works, in other words be prepared to be sued, this nearly happened to MH on here, the process is very simple, you slander someone or their devices without prove they are a con, the person in question then kindly asks for the forum to provide the ip address of the person slandering, if the forum does not respond, it would be easy enough to get a court order to get the IP addresses.

There's a big case in the UK right now about a women on Facebook, she was called a vampire, i believe she has already been granted the ip addresses to start slanderous actions via the police, the incredible thing these days is that most countries are now signed up to the transportation of people in foreign countries, so it no longer matters where the slanderer lives.

There is no free speech and there never was, its just in the old days you needed money to get someone, this is now mostly free.

It is a forum's admins duty to remove any slanderous comments, so remember this, anyone consistently slandering and threatening the existence of the forum will be banned, ultimately it is the forum that pays the price for slanderous posts, it is our responsibility to remove them, especially if by request.

If you have been kicked off another forum for arguing about a device being a fraud chances are the admin had no choice and you did not provide enough physical proof to show it was a fake, that in a slanderous action and expect to be banned because of it, specially if you keep doing it over and over again.

I suggest you all take equal shares in a new forum studying fake claims and air your views on that forum, but be prepared to be shut down as that is very likely to happen.

Wow -- clearly stated, Peterae.

So if you start questioning a device be very carefull to have 100% proof it's a fake, i would imagine this would be as hard to prove just as much as to prove it works, in other words be prepared to be sued, this nearly happened to MH on here,

Is this why we don't hear (IIRC) from MH lately here? 

[giantkiller]

We throw handfulls of mud back into the creek because no one takes time to sift through for the nuggets. We place our focus on the who and not the slivers of wisdom or knowledge that some men spend theirs live crying out to others about. A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing? No. I little bit of ignorance is the most vile of power.

The Fibonacci model, Shauberger model, and Russel model that jumps out of the Millenium docs is astounding. For those that live in a thimble i guess the Earth is still flat.

Erich Von Daniken spoke of things outside of the [Taught] window. I have been to Chizen Itzen and have seen below the ground that the tourists glibbly walk around on. We can't explain where these towers came from let alone explain what is evident below ground level. Or the really big question is [Where did the 200 feet of mud and 6" to 8" round stones come from that makes up the ground that the tourists walk on that covers the rest of these buildings?] Riddle me this [O big thunkers(I am adressing mankind in general here)]?

Or how about this:
If you go through the planet from these south american sights there are huge asian temples on the other side.

Or how about this:
Go to google Earth and look at the volcano chain of the Hawaiin islands. Towards the west there is an abrupt turn in the linkage. What the hell happened there and why are we not taught that in school? Is it outside our concept?

Or explain me this:
How does the grain in crop circle events get it's dna and basic compound model altered beyond our capabilities? And these changes have been in our food chain for thousands of years. Check out Cheerios. The organic compound make up is the same compound listed for Ezekial bread in the the book of Ezekial from the Bible.

Or Explain me this:
How come no Temple of Academia has seriously investigate Coral Castle? The propery has gone the way of Jellystone family campgrounds.

Or explain me this:
If one starts at Old faithful geyser and goes west at the same angle to the same distance as the Hawaiin chain, at the turn in the chain distance there is a Volcanoe in the gulf of Alaska.  Lituya Bay is the site of the largest recorded tsunami in history.

Or explain me this:
The Easter Island effagies all look towards South America.

Oh, I apologize deeply. Never smack an idiot. They don't know what they don't know and vehemently guard their ignorance.

Better yet is there any objectivity anywhere? Hows this for free speech?
Kill the messenger. That will solve everything.

And do you know what I think?
Coronal mass ejections are the alarm of the clock going off. This cleans out the waring riffraff and starts the planet (French for small plan) over again. If we used at least 10% more of our minds or loved our neighbor as ourselves we would be in space by now living in peace with the rest of the universal family. Instead we live by the sword and die by the sword. Godlike justice, no?

Self inflicted mass extinction. Hows that for evolutionary thinking? Aren't we just the biggest, bestest thing that has happend to ourselves?

[NickZ]

   Gk:
  "Kill the messenger, that will solve everything... 
 
   So good to hear from you, old friend, I see that you are advancing in your views, more each day. I hope that it is in the best direction, and not back to the "cave". 
  I used to know what I wanted and how to go about it,  but now,  things have changed.
                                                                                                                         NickZ

[muDped]

...

It is a forum's admins duty to remove any slanderous comments, so remember this, anyone consistently slandering and threatening the existence of the forum will be banned, ultimately it is the forum that pays the price for slanderous posts, it is our responsibility to remove them, especially if by request.

If you have been kicked off another forum for arguing about a device being a fraud chances are the admin had no choice and you did not provide enough physical proof to show it was a fake, that in a slanderous action and expect to be banned because of it, specially if you keep doing it over and over again.
...

Aye, it is sad but true.  Today the power of "fear" dominates
the social/scientific environment.

It doesn't take much to be "banned" from certain forums.
In the case of both my own and Farrah's experiences at the
infamous "EF" it was the result of questioning the integrity
and honesty of the forum co-founders and certain principal
participants in forum activities/discussions/ploys.

Some of us are not able to stand idly by while certain
parties engage in deceptive exploitations of the gullible
and uneducated for financial gain;  we must speak out to
raise questions and/or criticisms.  Naturally, we attempt to
do so with maturity and without rancor but with the full
expectation that some sort of retaliatory action will be taken
by the "forum" to preserve its "interests."

Taking a vocal stand for Truth is more important in certain
situations than remaining silent for fear that our "voice"
will be silenced.

It may be difficult to prove than any particular device is
indeed a "fake" or a "fraud" but it should be possible to
raise doubts in the name of truth without entering in to
the realm of "slander."

How is this done?  By avoiding judgmental and/or accusatory
conclusions; by "letting the facts (truths) speak for themselves."
By refusing to become emotionally entangled in personal
differences of opinion or personal attack.

It is possible to call a spade a spade with well formulated
words which remain clear of "slander" territory. 




 

[muDped]

...

... If we used at least 10% more of our minds or loved our neighbor as ourselves we would be in space by now living in peace with the rest of the universal family. Instead we live by the sword and die by the sword. Godlike justice, no?
...

You raise a whole slew of poignant questions in your
posting!  There is so much that we do not know
about the history of Man on Planet Earth and the
involvement of Supernatural Beings in times past.
Evidence remains, as you've illustrated, of some truly
remarkable technical abilities some many thousands
of years ago.

Your statement quoted above zeros in on the plain truth
about what our world has become in opposition to what
the vast majority of the common people would prefer.

Our planet has been hijacked by the "bad boys" for the
time being but their tenure is nearing its end.  They do
not plan to give up their power and control over all
things political without a struggle so world events are
destined to become even bloodier and more warlike
as the psychopaths "do their thing" for their own pleasure.

Good Times are coming but they're yet a ways off...

[giantkiller]

Well I see a plan in place...

Call it the devil, evil, bad guys, nasty aliens or whatever. But the fact remains the the human race predominantly thinks with prejudice. Obviously what abuse performed on a child human that causes them to seek power to re-perform those same abuses on others, i don't know. But the test is we have squandered our existance on this planet and now it is too late to avoid the on coming Coronal mass ejection. A microwave of sorts that will reap chaos on mankind. And the winners are? Why would evil want to stop a planet's inhabitants from exerting a leap of intellect on the vertical axis to the stars and live a leap of strength on the horizontal level in war. The stronghold of ignorance has people actually believing to just be docile till hell breaks loose. Guess our laziness has been exploited to the max.

[muDped]

Aye, some have referred to planet earth as the "Prison Planet."

We're all here for a purpose and there are many things that we
must experience with endurance.  Learning the powers of Love
and Forgiveness in a place which is rampant with badness, hatred
and corruption.

What begins with innocence and goodness is easily perverted.

We have all experienced it to some extent.

Then, we at some point in our experiences begin to yearn for
goodness, integrity, honesty, truth and love.  Real love.

We're stuck here on this planet until we learn the better way.

The prophecies of old do tell us that what is to come is unlike
anything that has ever happened to planet earth at anytime
in the past.  We are all to be "refined" as the precious metals
are; by "fire."  It may be symbolic but it will feel like fire.

[NickZ]

  Dumped:
  I have no words, you always just blow me away.  What could i possibly say, after that.  Thanks again for being who you are.
                   NZ

[NickZ]

 
Along the lines of free speech: CAMELS FOR OBAMA'S HEAD, AND CHICHENS FOR HILARYS. 
 
Not exactly meant to liven this thread, but it may be of interest, as well. I'll refrain from any comments.

  http://news.yahoo.com/al-qaeda-offshoot-offers-camels-obamas-head-hens-165924543--abc-news-topstories.html