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Author Topic: What is Known about the TPU  (Read 356114 times)
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Hi gridbias,

In the past I used to do several circuit simulations by very expensive circuit simulator softwares I had had access at my work but I did not have any success in finding a circuit that would produce any extra output beyond the input.  Ali wrote at overunity.com that NI's Multisim or Orcad shows extra output but LTSpice for instance does not.

My opinion is that circuit simulators are very good tools for somebody wishing to "perfect" a certain circuit setup, to check many "what if" questions etc but I do not believe in simulations showing more output over the input because I have not managed to achieve any extra output over the input with any such fancy simulated circuit, not to mention looping in practice.  What is even more important, I have not seen anyone building a electrical circuit in practice that measurably gave higher output vs input.  Possibly there are some such circuits like Steven Marks TPU or that of Kapanadze but until a third or fourth party replicates and confirms the COP > 1 we are in the believe state...

I do hope Ali is going to show a video on his practical circuit which is already built from off the shelf components and not built from software modelled ones in his computer.  Hopefully his practical results will reflect back to his simulations in the output / input power ratio too...   

Ali's circuit simulation is probably an off topic in this thread, hopefully Grumpy forgives us for mentioning this here, though my news link on getting electricity from the Earth's magnetic field may not be off topic,  lol.

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The sims cannot show junction surface or batch impurities. When 2 or more devices are connected together the junction variables can perform disfunctions.
I.E. Are conduction or field harmonics in the sims?


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1. download multisim 11 , it is  free for a period long enought to try this , other wise torrent it
2. load sim
3. switch on and you wont believe what you see
4. alter values at will ,  even a single  irf 540 shows self run phenomenon
5. scratch head
6. conclude that it is a sim error ( and it realistically should be)
7. decide that ali was lying about building it in practice and having his globe run for many days

My initial conclusion is that when the mosfets are ideally switched ( rise time ) the phenomenon simulates well ... something worthy of  investigation by the members here  in any case


300 uh is a value used by all expensive pi metal detectors
   

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It's not as complicated as it may seem...
I'll try playing with the FG rise time again and see if I can get sustained oscillation. Right now, only for about 20ms, then it falls off with 100 Ohm load.

The first, and possibly most important "problem" with Ali's simulation, is he is NOT using any resistance in series with the inductor! This is a MUST if you are to expect realistic results. Even as little as 0.01 Ohm could mean the difference between something that appears to be OU and something that clearly is not OU.

I would suggest you try inserting some resistance in there Lindsay.

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yes ..resistance there does indeed make it reasonable ... thanks ..still fiddling though

edit .1 ohm and it still runs
   

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It's not as complicated as it may seem...
Ok.

Out of curiosity, see what power the 4700uF capacitor is delivering. Are you getting 800W in the load resistor?


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Darren,

The origional sim already  has this part  covered .



Have you looked at this in multisim? If not, please do so. Your experience is valuable. 

I am so surprised that this could even be simulated so well even if it only when  collection of errors make it so.

Many people will be convinced by this impressive error congregation.

That would mean that the origionator was lying about it ..that would be a sad conclusion, but if so then the sooner we know the better.

Building might be the quickest  way to be almost sure.
   
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The sims cannot show junction surface or batch impurities. When 2 or more devices are connected together the junction variables can perform disfunctions.
I.E. Are conduction or field harmonics in the sims?

Hi GK,

I have not used Multisim Ali uses but it is surely a conventional Spice based circuit simulator so the answer to your questions is surely no.

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Hi GK,

I have not used Multisim Ali uses but it is surely a conventional Spice based circuit simulator so the answer to your questions is surely no.

Gyula

Exactly...
The very, I mean very!, high speed switching that takes place hits the coil. It's like the pumping action of a Tesla coil secondary. It looks like a bias field to the spark gapped strike of the primary.
Is there a simulator that will actually take into account the mobius connected coils with the field effects other than normal transformer coupling?
I will make an attempt to use the sim file in multisim. Maybe Ali was alluding to the sim shows the start of the process but the rest of the work has to happen in real time in a circuit.


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something to play with that is more like a build ..play with the switches ..there is a "turbine effect"

Something to shoot for on the bench regardless of the non reported effor in simulation .

Trouble is,  if this simple circuit can be made to work anything like the sim then  we are all idiots
   

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something to play with that is more like a build ..play with the switches ..there is a "turbine effect"

Something to shoot for on the bench regardless of the non reported effor in simulation.

Trouble is,  if this simple circuit can be made to work anything like the sim then  we are all idiots

Quote
idiots. We are...

The companion wave generation is the specific timing for this switching / non conduction process in which everyone seeks.

The actual key is linking the compwave generation to a configuration which enables resonance.

It produces traveling waves at a very high frequency. This level is at the production of where coils operate differently. I have had the trumpet wave form many times until finally it filled the scope screen solidly. I did not tap it. That test consumed current. I want to see if I can get something to tap of off using the compwave instead of pure magnetic flux. Mag flux is easily derived by using current. If one were to be adverse to current then raise the voltage.
These are the minimal parameters I have collapsed this down to.
My thinking lately has been the secondary or trinary coils with high inductance, like small video transformers. When verticle they would look like the open TPU legs. When horizontal they would fit neatly into a slim box.

I don't think the sims would clearly encompass the switching effects that the multi-connected conduction devices exhibit in reality or real time. This process / effect is non standard. So how could it be in a simulator? Since when would an inexpensive electronics simulator include traveling wave theory? Even if the program designer knew of this advanced effect / process?

Earl had given us circuits where the design was reliant on the switching of two cmos devices in parallel. I even posted a schematic from SM that showed this same type switching battle of timing with 3 stages of cmos into voice coil drivers facing each other headon into a coil. This model is partially current and high speed switching.

In other words... You hit a coil faster that it can conduct. Something that I believe Grumpy touched on many, many times using other examples and terms.

In any new process individuals go through the process of [wrapping their minds around it] to claim territory by applying their knowledge and experience. This leads to alot of rabbit holes or dark corners. Surely no one knows it all. So instead of trying to trick an older process to [perform] based on the [wrapping] why not cross the barrier of individuality and accept a tried and true step to advance this beast with what each and everyone knows through their experience?

This compwave process always shows specifically and repeatedly the anamolies you all are chasing in a myriad of long paths, dark alleys, and very excellent experiments.

I should add this also. This compwave pulsing scheme only works on very low inductance.  Meaning 4 turns of wire is just great. I have tried this on inductive windings, like regular coils we are used to and the process does not happen. So I am striking a wire very fast and shutting off before conduction occurs. I believe this was stated by SM using jumper cables. This also looks like [Cancelling the flux].
« Last Edit: 2012-02-05, 05:10:53 by giantkiller »


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The magnets utilized in TPUs need to be present, unlike what SM said that they learned how to start the device with a flick of the magnet.  A "flick" of a magnet induces a quick voltage spike, but having the magnet present is different, I think of it as needing a magnet in order for a audio speaker to function, if you remove the magnet you no longer have a functioning loudspeaker. 

So why would SM mislead us by the "flick" comment?

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Why think it is misleading?

Isn't it just as possible the flick of a magnet is needed to start the process and the others are needed to maintain it?


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Could this be the single most important statement made by SM regarding the operation of the TPU and in relation to the collector.
The hotter it gets the more fuel it gives itself to burn.
   

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Could this be the single most important statement made by SM regarding the operation of the TPU and in relation to the collector.
The hotter it gets the more fuel it gives itself to burn.

Is that a quote?

I still haven't located it.



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"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." - Einstein

"What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning." - Werner Heisenberg
   

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Why think it is misleading?

Isn't it just as possible the flick of a magnet is needed to start the process and the others are needed to maintain it?
[the others] create a bias field which constitutes a static mode.
[The flick] rings the bell.


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http://www.thewaterengine.com/pdf/stevenmarktpu.pdf
Page 2

Quote
OK let us compare this story of the common radio.
Think of the power unit as a device similar to a radio receiver.
No I do not want to hear feed back informing me that I am trying to convince the world my unit works on radio waves!!!.
But it behaves very much like a simple radio receiver except for the fact that radio waves need to be amplified before they can be of any use to us.
My units behave as though they are variable tuning devices, and we are tuning them to a frequency just like a radio.
The closer you get to the center frequency the more power you permit the collector to dissipate into a load.
the important difference here is that in the case of the radio, you tune into the frequency and amplify it for use.
In the case of my power unit, you create several frequencies within a space of the collector coil's circumference.
The frequencies are directly related to the circumference of the collector coil.
You can begin to collect the current and dissipate it with no need for amplification because the signal source also becomes the feed for the power source and has the natural tendency to run with gain.
It is important that you note that you can never tune too closely to the exact frequencies of power conversion because the power received by the collector will instantly destroy it.
We instead must deliberately tune off the frequencies of conversion in order to make the thing properly work.
Remember that it is like a furnace which feeds itself.
The hotter it gets the more fuel it gives itself to burn.
That is why the control units are so very important.
Without the control unit constantly monitoring the frequencies of operation and making the necessary changes to keep the whole thing off exact conversion frequency, then the unit would very quickly destroy it's self.

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The destructive heating caused by the eddy currents become the problem we face when we make a really large powerful coil.
« Last Edit: 2012-04-15, 08:12:35 by Peterae »
   

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The reason i highlighted the heating element is that he got the original idea from the valve rectifier, he tells us that the heater phase of the rectifier valve against the phase of the HT transformer creates the kicks,the power in these kicks will increase in relation to the heater voltage of the rectifier valve, the heater electron stream is only the catalyst to allow the harmonics to be generated not the source of energy used to create them, he is in effect creating the environment to which the kick can be produced, once he understood exactly what the kick was then he must have found another way of creating them.

I will try to reproduce this experiment, anyone ever heard of a rectifier tube going into scream mode ^-^ does a tube that's screaming get hotter or to put it another way is there a possibility for a tube to suffer runaway.
   

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Peterae,

If I remember correctly, screaming tubes were caused by plate potential starvation, metal bases or poor tube manufacturing processes.

There is a way to obtain amplification in a tube, even a diode tube, without applying cathode/plate current. This does require the use of an open heater filament used as the cathode (5U4-GB) or a directly heated cathode (5AR4). On first realization of this possibility, one would think, if this was true, that adding feedback could be a fire-feeds-furnace scenario. It hasn't worked that way for me  :(


---------------------------
"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." - Einstein

"What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning." - Werner Heisenberg
   
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Hi all:
   Been kind of lax lately but have been working a lot. I have run into a situation
that needs clarified. If a dc cap has a diode across it properly oriented so as to
feed the cap with the correct polarity, this would be considered as half-wave
rectification...right? One diode would only let half the wave through. I know this
is right but this is just to set it straight.
   Then in the large TPU, the caps there would be with a diode and be performing
half wave rectification. That is if that is in fact a diode. Still up in the air there.  Whats
the call?
 
thay
   

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Hi all:
   Been kind of lax lately but have been working a lot. I have run into a situation
that needs clarified. If a dc cap has a diode across it properly oriented so as to
feed the cap with the correct polarity, this would be considered as half-wave
rectification...right? One diode would only let half the wave through. I know this
is right but this is just to set it straight.
   Then in the large TPU, the caps there would be with a diode and be performing
half wave rectification. That is if that is in fact a diode. Still up in the air there.  Whats
the call?
 
thay


As far as I'm concerned, it is a diode. There is a slight chance that it is an inductor but there is absolutely no way it is a resistor or molded cap.

"If a dc cap has a diode across it "?

The diode isn't across the cap but I get your idea. The component electrically 'across' the cap (in parallel with) is an Epcos voltage suppressor, or similar.


Yes, you would think one diode means half-wave rectification. It could also mean the diode is used as a detector. The color banding layout would reflect that the diode is of the type capable of radio 'type' detection.
 


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"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." - Einstein

"What we observe is not nature itself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning." - Werner Heisenberg
   

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The reason i highlighted the heating element is that he got the original idea from the valve rectifier, he tells us that the heater phase of the rectifier valve against the phase of the HT transformer creates the kicks,the power in these kicks will increase in relation to the heater voltage of the rectifier valve, the heater electron stream is only the catalyst to allow the harmonics to be generated not the source of energy used to create them, he is in effect creating the environment to which the kick can be produced, once he understood exactly what the kick was then he must have found another way of creating them.

I will try to reproduce this experiment, anyone ever heard of a rectifier tube going into scream mode ^-^ does a tube that's screaming get hotter or to put it another way is there a possibility for a tube to suffer runaway.

I thought SM said that in the initial turn-on of a valve, the current interacts with the earth's magnetic field and you get a kick.  This is the same as saying that the initial turn-on of a circuit will interact with a static magnetic field.  Simple enough for anyone to test.   O0
   

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Hi G
The 2 are related, the Valve power ON tug appears a mechanical tug i have seen this myself.

I think the whole idea of the valve rectifier is to allow us to find the frequencies needed to create them, he says that all sorts of hash and noise will be seen and occasionally they will meet and produce one large kick, we know he used expensive equipment to study this, from some of my previous experiments i have been able to hear and feel the mechanical tug which has been the result of what i believe to be mixing of certain harmonics creating a large tug.
I have tried to establish how to isolate whatever the circumstances are to create this tug/kick/em energy burst.
You see when i used 2 white noise generators i would occasionally produce one big kick they were not necessarily that frequent in some cases, but every now and then the conditions were right and it is these conditions that when we know what they are will enable us to produce the large kicks not only when we want but also as many and as frequent as we require.

He also went on to ponder the magnetic field from a nuclear explosion, this all points to the valve tug,combined small kicks meeting to produce one large kick, as being pulses of EM and my view is that EMP is radiant in nature, from EM rules on PCB ground planes, you have a copper plate that allows EM to dissipate across the ground planes surface and therefore the ground plane must attain a charge from the dispersion of the em in the smaller tracks, the fact the ground plane receives and disperses em noise due to capacitive coupling, sounds very similar to the metallic shields used by Tesla as he walked around the room to detect the blast of radiant energy, and the metallic shields acquired a charge.

We can all produce EM noise but there's more to creating the correct conditions to get a strong tug.

If EM noise is required to create a tug then why does the valve filament tug at power up, i believe the reason for this is at power up you have had to switch current on, it is the switch that momentarily causes the conditions for the tug, this can be proven by constantly switching the valve on and off, i bet every now and then the valve filament will tug even though the filament is still hot,same goes for Tesla's power lines again it's the switch on that causes the deaths, keep switching on and off fast, i bet more deaths would occur not just switch ON from cold.Think of the harmonics that are produced in an arc, as SM stated most engineers placed caps across the relevant points to stop the switching noise, i even understand Tesla introduced similar devices across the HV DC power lines to suppress the switching noise and stop the deaths and arcing over, which is quiet interesting because i also believe that with Tesla's power lines there was more power once the switching transients had dispersed down the length of the power lines than there was at the switch creation point.
I am guessing that the current down the entire length of wire is the same but the voltage climbs due to capacity of the sourounding air hence the blinding killer arcs which were obviously much higher in voltage than at the switch on point, in rush current would be the same down the entire length would it not? with asymmetric capacitors ION movement gets the blame for the small extra thrust produced so i will also blame ION dispersion results in increased power production C.C
   

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Man.  I don't know what to say.

When you switch the circuit "on", the current, or what we call current, flows outside the conductor.  The electrons do not start to drift until they have aligned to the potential, which takes a few ns, and even then not all of them drift instantly. 

So, is the energy transfered by the electrons or are the electrons pulled along by the energy? 

If "by the energy", then what is the nature of this "energy"?

An asymetric capacitor creates a radial current and this is one of only two ways to make "the effect" evident, the other is a unidirectional HV pulse - per Vlaenderen, Tesla, and Steinmetz.

It is very spooky to use a dual switch pulser and reflect this energy back to an ungrounded power supply.  The space around the supply changes and it becomes highly charged, but the supply works the same or appears to. When you touch it, you will get pin-prick shocks.  If you are grounded, a strong wave of energy will flow across you to ground, and this may blow the regulating transistor in the supply.  (It will short when this happens.)  Very easy to verify this yourself.
   

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The test SM suggests with the rectifier valve and out of phase heater must have been tried by some? Mannix must have tried this
It's the main thing to confirm the kick surely.

Quote
If the plate voltage is not rectified then it is AC with a potential 60 Hz frequency.
That combines with the 5 volt 60 Hz in the coil of the htr transformer and generally amounts to nothing. In fact the power of the 5 volt transformer amounts to nothing.
It is an insignificant power supply except when the two transformers get slightly out of phase with each other, or when they are connected in reverse of one another.
Then you can measure all kinds of things going on.
You can generate all kinds of hash and multiple frequencies, and I do mean all kinds.

I wonder if this simulates in spice
   
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