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Author Topic: Akula0083 30 watt self running generator.  (Read 816934 times)

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When starting the circuit up with the 9 Volt Battery
the LEDs seem quite bright.  As soon as the 9 Volt
Battery is disconnected it seems that the LEDs drop
somewhat in their intensity.

That could be a symptom of capacitor charging and
discharge.  Is the 9 Volt Battery used to charge
capacitors and also provide Gate Charge to a switching
MOSFET which controls discharge of the capacitors to
the LEDs?

Once the circuit is activated how long will it continue to
run before it eventually dies out?

After close examination of the video at very slow speed
it appears that the LEDs are DC operated.

Supercapacitors could be the secret.


« Last Edit: 2014-04-22, 06:47:39 by Dumped »


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Can anyone work out the value of this cap which appears to marked 5V and is close to where the 9V battery is connected to the circuit. 1000 can be seen, so is this a 25V cap or a 2.5V / 5V cap at a higher capacitance?

The LED light level is very low and illuminated for very short periods of time, so I plump for a capacitor fed supply rail feeding a carefully tuned fly-back oscillator with series connected LED load. Note that a third 2,200uF capacitor and an additional TO220 device appears on the circuit board in part 3 when the device is demonstrated working disconnected from the SMPS. The switch has also been transferred to the board. Notice the difficulty he has latching / holding the LED's illuminated, suggesting to me current starvation to the oscillator.

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Looks like a 100uF 25V cap to me, it's not unusual for part of the voltage to be missing as the sleeving is place on the cap during manufacture from a long printed tube and is spliced and heat shrunk onto the aluminium body of the cap.

Thanks for saving the videos Tutorial_FE  O0

Dumped those led's are low Hz pumped if you look at Tutorial's first video above at 4:51 you can see the iris of the camera trying to react to the pulsed light, to see that look at the white background.

It is not good he keeps playing with the pot and making it stop, if i were showing OU i would set it up and let it run, OK you can show the pot adjustment is critical but why again and again and again, get's a bit annoying, watching the video I'm thinking no dont adjust it again LOL
   
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Looks like a 1000uF 25V cap to me, it's not unusual for part of the voltage to be missing as the sleeving is place on the cap during manufacture from a long printed tube and is spliced and heat shrunk onto the aluminium body of the cap.

Unfortunately, I cannot get a clear clip on the top fold-over of the cap label to confirm the voltage rating.
   
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Dumped those led's are low Hz pumped if you look at Tutorial's first video above at 4:51 you can see the iris of the camera trying to react to the pulsed light, to see that look at the white background.

It is not good he keeps playing with the pot and making it stop, if i were showing OU i would set it up and let it run, OK you can show the pot adjustment is critical but why again and again and again, get's a bit annoying, watching the video I'm thinking no dont adjust it again LOL

Ultra suspicious! Anyone care to design an ultra low current / low frequency LED driver working from a cap supply rail and capable of a few seconds operation after each application of a 9V battery.
   

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Don't get me wrong, i still think it's impressive, but please show it running for at least 1 minuet  :)
Maybe he did in another video, i have been in and out the last couple of days, and the video vanish faster than they appear  :-\

Bearing in mind i can light 13 LED's using no battery's at all and for ever  :-*
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=202.msg2130#msg2130

   
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While Akula No3 seems to be the best of the videos, superbright LEDs are not a good proof of anything unless as others have said it is allowed to run for a very long time.

Notice (Akula No3) the core gapping circular pieces of something...looks like copper to me.

I believe in the video he uses stock untampered electrolytic capacitors.

I cannot stress enough the need for precise gapping of the core for efficient operation of a flyback converter. The gap allows quick dissipation of the remnant stored magnetism, allowing the core to "reset" for the next pulse of energy. Without a gap, the core will quickly go into saturation and your FET will draw excessive current unless you employ cycle by cycle real time current limiting.

If you can measure the FET current you will see a sudden spike or rise in current at the end of the current ramp.

Other factors such as frequency too low for the given inductance can cause the same spike.

Properly designed, you should not be drawing high currents, the Watts in and Watts out should be very close.

If you are drawing 10 amps from your battery at 12 volts, you are supplying 120 Watts to a 30 watt circuit. This is indicative of the above mentioned problem.

There are other factors that can cause excess dissipation e.g. slew rate too low in the gate drive to the FET or operating frequency too high or both.

You want to strike a happy medium with all these factors for most efficient operation.

Where extremely compact lightweight design is not needed my preference is low frequency operation , high inductance in the core and of course for a flyback converter, precise gapping.
« Last Edit: 2014-04-22, 20:23:09 by ION »


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@ Wottsup, I got straight onto your suggested coil wind but have not noticed any real change from my previous L1 - 15 turn primary and L2 -  28 turn secondary. It would be wise for you to build the circuit using the PCB (if anyone has any leftover spare), so we can compare results using the same coil config and circuit build - apples to apples.  Happy

@Happy

Sorry for delay in responding. Had some family stuff all Monday but managed to order my cores.
That is good since now you know you can get the same result with fewer turns. That is because when you reduce the number of primary you increase the pri/sec ratio at the same time. But what wind method are you using again?

What type of diodes are you using as D5 and D6?

@all

I am attaching a pdf on the D5 and D6 diode model 15SQ045 that was in the parts list. Is this the most appropriate diode you guys can find for this app? The question is, is it close to the specs of Akulas diode model. The 045 designation putts this in the VRRM 45 volts range which could be either to high or to low depending on when you would expect L2 to bleed into the load. Don't know enough about specs. Above my pay grade. hahahahahahahaha But this is another variable point.

The thing is I cannot see a second big diode on Akulas photo so is it possible that the D6 diode is a smaller type since D6 should not require the same "through-put" as D5 but may require a higher (or lower) VRRM? I know Akula put down the same model on his diagram but the photo says otherwise. The D5 and D6 diodes in the original diagram are marked as being MBR3545. Is this a Russian model number and who then indicated that the 15SQ045 should be used?

@Grumage

Man oh man, everything is coming together slowly but surely.

Remember when I had posted a mapping of the Akula 30 Ecore showing how it fits inside the former and explained how the former diameter that Akula must have had makes it impossible for the L1 side to have three layers of L1 (seen as thicker wire) plus two layers of L2.

Look at Akulas last Cap Gutting Video, the core has gaps but both coils run across so there is a balance and he only uses one layer per side across the gap. Do you see his primary has a second layer of a few more turns. Akula probably does not know it but that is because all pulsed coils suffer from what I call Half Coil Syndrome where you have 75% of the energy dissipation occurs in the first half of the coil, he puts extra turns on a second layer to push that 75% across more of the 1st layer wind length. He must have used his scope to wind and tune at the same time to then stop at that specific second layer turn count. hehehe

That is a big difference then the T1000. That is such great news as a wind confirmation of basic rule, if you pulse one side of gap, you pick up on the other side. Otherwise, if you pulse across the gap, you pick up across another gap, otherwise there are timing issues that the circuit will not wait around and needs immediate reaction, like Akula just showed.

Otherwise with the T1000 and one center gap, you may as well look at a tick-tack-toe game to figure out the flux paths. I am sure your L2 does not like it and does not know how to output it. You were getting a deep negative if I remember @verpies mentioning it. Or was it @Itsu.

The second best news about the last Akula video is exactly what I was talking about. He is using 4 pots, and we are using two pots, the two extra pots that would be good to use are at either R3 or R2 or R5. R3 (vary the return), R2 (vary the L2 bleed) and R5 (if varying R5 can vary the total load consumption), this will provide the level of flexibility required to tune the circuit to many coil types and available energy levels. That is a big big clue to tuning the circuit with pots or by replacing some resistors.

On a side issue, I am curious. If you scope across L1 with probe and ground, one way, then the other way, then only with the probe (no probe ground) one end then the other end, are the waveforms different? Is it the same on the L2 side? If the single probe waveforms are different, those eight waveforms (4xL1 and 4xL2) are the ones I would want to analyze and compare when knowing exactly where the probe and ground were placed. Like P-R1-L1 means the probe is between R1 and L1, G-L1-D5 means the ground is between L1 and D5. Hehehe

@verpies

I need to ask you a simple question about scopes, not because I don't know but because I need someone with some authority in the matter to explain how a scope probe and ground signal is calculating to map the waveform we see on our screen. If this is supposed to be a learning experience then this should be part of it otherwise I fear it will make my job explaining things a lot harder once I get my E-cores.

So here is a simple scenario. You scope across a coil where you already know the probe end is at +80 and the ground clip end it at -40. So how does the scope treat this information and where will the waveform be at that one specific instance in time?

wattsup



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I would like to make some suggestions for future builds.

1) breadboard stage: this can be a PCB or vector board design, but parts should be spread out on the board physically as they are seen in the schematic as nearly as possible. This makes for very easy location of parts when you are probing, and if everyone can conform to this, youtube video's will be easier to interpret, as all breadboards will look more or less the same. I have often used this technique and it makes for fast troubleshooting against the schematic. I use pin sockets or solder posts for components that might be changed often. I raise the parts off the board a bit to make it easier to hook a probe to a leg. Also, I can snip out a part and solder a new one to the old leads or easily shunt or series a value. Add test points throughout the board at key points.

2) prototype PCB: this is post breadboard and is used to make sure the design has no issues with trace coupling, interlayer capacitance, parts fit etc. It is made compact for efficiency of material use.

3) production PCB: after all bugs are worked out of the prototype PCB the V1.0 production board is released.

I any any case, parts designators should agree with the schematic across all boards, 1,2,3.


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Akula lantern 3 translated by Stivep1 - Wesley

итог фонарь №3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BNgo09N0yM

« Last Edit: 2014-04-22, 16:58:20 by TutorialFE »
   

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@verpies
I need to ask you a simple question about scopes, not because I don't know but because I need someone with some authority in the matter to explain how a scope probe and ground signal is calculating to map the waveform we see on our screen.

Ideally like this:


Non-ideally there are stray parallel capacitances, series cable capacitances, inductances, propagation delays, etc...
In some cheap scopes the inverting input of the front end differential amplifier is connected to the chassey of the scope which makes up a huge plate of a stray capacitor.

So here is a simple scenario. You scope across a coil where you already know the probe end is at +80 and the ground clip end it at -40. So how does the scope treat this information
It takes the difference between the inverting and non-inverting input of the front end amplifier/attenuator and applies it to S/H + ADC.
   
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I would like to make some suggestions for future builds.

1) breadboard stage: this can be a PCB or vector board design, but parts should be spread out on the board physically as they are seen in the schematic as nearly as possible. This makes for very easy location of parts when you are probing, and if everyone can conform to this, youtube video's will be easier to interpret, as all breadboards will look more or less the same. I have often used this technique and it makes for fast troubleshooting against the schematic. I use pin sockets or solder posts for components that might be changed often. I raise the parts off the board a bit to make it easier to hook a probe to a leg. Also, I can snip out a part and solder a new one to the old leads or easily shunt or series a value. Add test points throughout the board at key points.

2) prototype PCB: this is post breadboard and is used to make sure the design has no issues with trace coupling, interlayer capacitance, parts fit etc. It is made compact for efficiency of material use.

3) production PCB: after all bugs are worked out of the prototype PCB the V1.0 production board is released.

I any any case, parts designators should agree with the schematic across all boards, 1,2,3.

Yes, this is good advice IMO. I'm happy with strip board but less experienced builders would benefit by using breadboard.

Hoppy
   
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@Happy

Sorry for delay in responding. Had some family stuff all Monday but managed to order my cores.
That is good since now you know you can get the same result with fewer turns. That is because when you reduce the number of primary you increase the pri/sec ratio at the same time. But what wind method are you using again?

What type of diodes are you using as D5 and D6?


wattsup



@ Wottsup,

I'm using the wind method you suggested in your previous post.

Diodes are exactly as specified by Akula (MBR3545), as this is exercise is to replicate his device as accurately as possible. I do not wish to alter the diodes, just try different coil winding configs as this was the only detail not given to us. The mosfet driver chip mod is IMO valid as there is a push-pull version of his circuit published, so the driver chip is not a significant deviation from this. I have built all three versions.

Happy  :)



« Last Edit: 2014-04-22, 18:08:06 by Hoppy »
   

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Dear All.

Well, another fruitless day !! I have rewound a transformer with 6 turns primary and 18 turns secondary. I have physically gapped the two halves with relation to Dr Andrey Melnichenko's suggestions. Creating two separate halves. Primary on one "triblet" secondary on the other.

At the moment we have a PWM with a fixed duty cycle. As far as I can see the "Duty" pot fitted to the boards we have is primarily a "high voltage cut off" ??  Correct??  So a simple question. can we reduce the pulse width ?? ATM I am pushing over 2 A @ 12V this can't be right ?? Ok, yes, that is only 24 Watts. But I think the LED's could be lit by a fraction of that by having a narrower pulse width !!

I am getting to the point of finding a suitable wall to bang my head against !!  :D

Cheers Grum.


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Evening Grum,

Before any attempt is made to change the design in order to reduce the duty cycle, I feel that we must decide on why the 'STOP' switch is fitted. My experiments do not show any real purpose for this switch. Yes, it does turn off the LED's (when closed) at lower supply voltage settings but always at the expense of higher current draw. The duty pot certainly sets the high voltage cut-off point which effectively cuts the PWM output. My hunch is that this circuit was an unsuccessful attempt by Akula to achieve desired self-running operation. The latest videos from him, suggest a more successful attempt, assuming of course they are not faked. A few more replications from others may shed some light on these issues.

Hoppy
   
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From Grumage:

Quote
ATM I am pushing over 2 A @ 12V this can't be right ?? Ok, yes, that is only 24 Watts. But I think the LED's could be lit by a fraction of that by having a narrower pulse width !!

You are right, however this is the problem with using high brightness LED strings....it is very difficult to know how much power is being used unless you compare the brightness using a light meter that is accurate at the frequency of the light output and comparing against a calibrated DC drive from your power supply and generating a multipoint look up table.

I would prefer a small incandescent lamps, as they don't play as many tricks on your eyes as pulsed LED's.

Save your head for now, there will be plenty of time for that later





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At the moment we have a PWM with a fixed duty cycle. As far as I can see the "Duty" pot fitted to the boards we have is primarily a "high voltage cut off" ??  Correct??  
Only 17% correct.
The "high voltage cutoff' is just 1/3 of the feedback loop's function.  The others are described in this message.  The DTY pot controls the sensitivity of the feedback loop.

So a simple question. can we reduce the pulse width ??
Yes, but you have to realize that a reaction to the event described in pt.1 is very quick.  Scope how the voltage across C6 varies.  The feedback loop has to react to these small changes in voltage on pulse-by-pulse basis, but it can't because you are overriding these changes by applying a steady external voltage source to C6 and destroying this feedback.

Because your circuit is under unity at this time, you must help it with the external power supply.  Let's say that the circuit is only 70% efficient.  This means that you have to supply 30% of the power from an external power supply...but you are supplying 100% *.
Thus the feedback loop has nothing to do.  If you delivered only 31% of the power then the feedback loop would start to react to variations across C6.

So put a high power ~100Ω rheostat/variable resistor in series with the supply line between your PS and the whole contraption, so the PS is not so stiff and acts more as a current source than a voltage source - only then the feedback loop will get a chance to regulate the pulse width.
Set the PS to 15V and tweak the DTY pot together with the rheostat.  If you don't have a rheostat then stretch out a nichrome wire from some household heating element and clamp a crocodile clip on it in various places or try out a lot of different incandescent light bulbs in series (12V and/or 230V ones).

* When two voltage sources (PS and L2 in this circuit) are in parallel, then the source that provides more voltage supplies all of the current.
  The lower voltage source normally sinks all of the current if there is no diode in series between these sources to stop it or current sharing resistors to distribute it evenly.
« Last Edit: 2014-04-22, 22:22:38 by verpies »
   
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Because your circuit is under unity at this time, you must help it with the external power supply.  Let's say that the circuit is only 70% efficient.  This means that you have to supply 30% of the power from an external power supply...but you are supplying 100% *.
Thus the feedback loop has nothing to do.  If you delivered only 31% of the power then the feedback loop would start to react to variations across C6.

So put a high power ~100Ω rheostat/variable resistor in series with the supply line between your PS and the whole contraption, so the PS is not so stiff and acts more as a current source than a voltage source - only then the feedback loop will get a chance to regulate the pulse width.
Set the PS to 15V and tweak the DTY pot together with the rheostat.  If you don't have a rheostat then stretch out a nichrome wire from some household heating element and clamp a crocodile clip on it in various places or try out a lot of different incandescent light bulbs in series (12V and/or 230V ones).

* When two voltage sources (PS and L2 in this circuit) are in parallel, then the source that provides more voltage supplies all of the current.
  The lower voltage source normally sinks all of the current if there is no diode in series between these sources to stop it or current sharing resistors to distribute it evenly.

Good Day All:

That is an excellent idea, (Verpies , above)... I was thinking about this exact problem the other day. The incandescent light bulb is excellent because you can use it to regulate (measure) the amperage the circuit is consuming in real time.  If the bulb is the automobile type dc, then the bulb will light up when it's current rating is reached.

@Verpies
Whats your take on using a SMPS to do the same thing, ie: variable pulsing the output of the SMPS to mimic the action of just momentarily touching a battery to the Vc & Neg. on the circuit board?  Kind of like Akula using a 9volt battery to  jump start his latest circuit. The circuit under question could be pulsed and then tuned between the pulses for best results.

Any suggestions for such an application?

take care, peace
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Grum:

To calculate the power dissipation in the LED string measure the voltage across R5 the 1.0 Ohm (which represents the current through it and the LED string) and multiply by the voltage across the LED string. This should give you the power in Watts the LED string is drawing.

There should only be a small amount of HF ripple on C3 that would not adversely affect the measurement.


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@ Wottsup,
I'm using the wind method you suggested in your previous post.
Diodes are exactly as specified by Akula (MBR3545), as this is exercise is to replicate his device as accurately as possible. I do not wish to alter the diodes, just try different coil winding configs as this was the only detail not given to us. The mosfet driver chip mod is IMO valid as there is a push-pull version of his circuit published, so the driver chip is not a significant deviation from this. I have built all three versions.Happy  :)

@Happy

I don't understand why when I look up MBR3545 all I find in terms of specs is stud diodes. All of brands I could find are stud diodes. How is that possible that there is no specs on standard fat diode with this model? I am attaching a pdf of the MBR3545 stud type and see there are differences in the specs between that and the one listed on our parts list. But why is the MBR a stud type when in the Akula30 photo, there is no stud diode? So many inconsistencies.

@verpies

Thanks for your reply and I will post more on that later. I would have liked for you to put down the number the scope would have shown in my question, please.

I think guys should switch to a battery feed, not more. The system has to run with quick gain to achieve a total output. The time required to fill C11 and C3 caps and it should just cruise along. It should not require much to start, not more then a 12v battery an off switch and maybe a fuse.

@all

I made a synopsis of the Akula effort up till now that may help clarify things or help put them in perspective. I know you can get discouraged but things are not so bleak.

After this post I will post something about scoping that may help some of you. @Grumage, I asked you about your waveforms in my previous post and it would have been good if you could answer because your answer is tied in with what I am going to discuss with @verpies later on. You don't need to put up the scope shots, just let meknow if with the probe only the waveform is the same as with a ground.

I would say we are in very good shape. With his last Cap Massacre video, it's as if Akula is talking to us and trying to tell us some things. When he had trouble restarting it around 5:56 onward, how many of you thought, "Hey, you have to readjust the pot you just deregulated man" then he readjusts the pot to make it work again. I am sure he did that on purpose to show us the importance. Спасибо

Akula just hatched his last build and video in what, a few days. He did not spend months working his coils. On his last system, he could have removed those 4 nice fat pots if he really wanted to and replaced them with fixed value resistors after he found the best values with his pots and we would never have known it. Akula Methodology 101.

Akulas videos and builds are telling me "Hey man, the coils have to be 1 pri thicker then the 1 sec, don't overdo it on the winds, either both winds over or both off the gap, the general circuit is this, the looping logic is this (great logic indeed), the diodes can be one big fat guy or three smaller more responsive guys in parallel (like in his last video) and lastly, get control over your R variables. Adjust the Rs to set the loop. Once the effect is found, measure the pot resistance values and replace the pots with a good resistor nearest to those values." That's what he did to make the Akula 30. Instead of matching the coil to the circuit, he is matching the circuit to the coil. As long as the base principle is sound and you realize you need to find the R values, the effect he is showing is replicable in a million ways. hehehe

BUT DOES IT WORK???????
Stay tuned folks when Jed says to Eli-may "Eli-may, we'll get that varmint and loop it on home". hahahah

The 4 pot methodology would cut through the chase of getting coil winds perfected to fit a pre-set circuit. Instead of trying 100 coils, try one but with more variables to tune. Otherwise you could be winding coils for the next year. That's what he is trying to tell us.

Sooooooooooooooo, next move should be replace R1, R2, R3 and R5 with 4 comparable pots then find the best finer values. Some here will know more about choosing the right pots. That will give you guys a new way to play but more importantly it will bring us closer to matching the Akula Effect. What can I say any more then that would be redundant.

I am preparing some tests with a flyback ccore (while my ecores arrive) just like in his last video because the core, ecore, ccore should not make that much difference if you employ the base principle. The ecore will just move more flux around but in essence, his last video with the primary pulsing out from both ends for the secondary to catch right away from its ends, tells us the impress is at the first reflection. So that also tells me that in the ecore, each coil has to be on its side of the gap, exactly like in the photo and the ecore mapping I had shown.

I don't know about you guys but this is getting so interesting.

Can't wait to play around with this starting tonight. Can't wait to see one of you guys with the first loop.

wattsup

« Last Edit: 2014-04-23, 13:53:22 by wattsup »


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@Happy

So many inconsistencies.


wattsup



@ Wottsup,

Yes, and the biggest one being how in his latest videos, he can hardly get a few small LED's to light and yet in his 30W version, he gets a powerful LED floodlight to shine brightly in self-running mode!!  ???  C.C

Not so Happy  :(

   
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@Happy

Come on man, don't lose heart so soon. You are not getting the point here. He did not make that last video to show a Guinness Record for most output. He did it to show us the finer points in getting it to work and he even cuts up the caps to show us there are no batteries inside the circuit, then he takes apart the coil to show how they were wound and to show how the flux in the core/gap relation are simpler then we thought. He shows us three diodes in parallel for D5 and I am sure there is much more but I have not spent too much time on them to trace the circuit, etc., in order to confirm other similarities between this last device and the Akula 30.

Man oh man, if SM made a video like this instead of the Crapville we have to visit each time, we would already have OU.

wattsup



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@ Wottsup,

I sense that he's won you over already.

A further inconsistency: why are there two pots on the circuit board but only one shown on the schematic?

Could the supply rail be 3V - get my train of thought??

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@ Wottsup, I sense that he's won you over already.
A further inconsistency: why are there two pots on the circuit board but only one shown on the schematic?
Could the supply rail be 3V - get my train of thought?? Hoppy

@Happy

The schematic shows two pots R11 and R15. But those are punny things for the frequency side.

He has not won me over because I still am very conscious that he could have hidden button batteries in a few of those pots, but man oh man, there has to be a limit to the level of paranoia we can handle. Seems like we will never be 100% assured of anything until it is accomplished and repeated as a self-runner. All in good time my friend, just hang in there.

When this project was started, there was no guarantees, no set time table and no special expectations but our ability to sort out what and how we can to make it work. All we can do is our honest to goodness best efforts and have some level of trust that Akula is not taking us down the Yellow Brick Road only to find out the Wizard is a feeble old man. hahaha

wattsup


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Hi,

One thing is missing in all these circuits - the Automatic Frequency Control for automatic tuning into resonant frequency.
If you guys will be able design simple and economic feedback based resonant frequency auto tuning circuit, you can replace frequency control with that circuit and have instant resonance in any core/coils configuration.

Please see book attached about that stuff - http://www.tubebooks.org/Books/afcs.pdf

Cheers!
   
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