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Author Topic: Free energy is easy, ask an intelligent question...  (Read 16495 times)

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If we taught ourselves to solve problems in the dynamic magnetic domain circuit, where core reluctance is like electric resistance, flux is like electric current, mmf is like electric voltage etc., life would be quite simple.  A coil loaded with a resistor appears in the magnetic circuit as a magnetic inductance Lm obeying mmf=-Lm*dPhi/dt.  The solution for the two coupled coils A and B is easily derived.

Smudge
   
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Wrong! The current will indeed be DC during the ramp time T (I am not talking about transients in coil B, I am talking about a steady state when di/dt=k in A, which corresponds to the period T on the diagram.
The proof is straightforward:
let M be the mutual induction coefficient.
Voltage induced in B: eb = -M.dia/dt = -k.M = constant
Current : since B is connected to a resistor, ib=eb/R=-k.M/R will also be constant, we can also find this using the current equation.

The only thing I said that is wrong is ‘No reaction.’
The question is why. The trap is to see only the DC current in coil B. A clue: is the flux in B constant?

Well, let's take a closer look at your equations!

Number 1, "Voltage induced in B: eb = -M.dia/dt = -k.M = constant".  First, the sign on M and k is incorrect.  Take A and B wound on a common core using the standard dot convention with the dot being the start of each winding.  If the dot on A receives a positive pulse, the dot on B will be more positive than the unmarked finish.  Therefore, this equation should be "Voltage induced in B: eb = M.dia/dt = k.M = constant".  Under the same conditions only with current in the windings, ia=-ib.

So, let's apply some real world conditions.  La=Lb=5mh with a coupling factor K=.9.  Therefore using M=K*(La*Lb)1/2=4.5mh.  Our voltage supply Vs=50v, dt =10us, and using dia=ea*dt/La, dia=100ma.   Substituting in the corrected equation we have eb=.0045*.1/10e-6=45v.  This can be confirmed due to the fact that also eb=K*ea=.9*50=45.  You define k=di/dt or k=.1/10e-6=10e3.  So, k*M=10e3*.0045=45. 

Then you state  "ib=eb/R=-k.M/R will also be constant".  This is incorrect because you have not included dt in your ib=eb/R equation.  In doing so it is clear there would dib in the B coil.  What am I missing here?

Pm
« Last Edit: 2026-02-17, 16:03:56 by partzman »
   
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I applied the standard equations, they are correct. Before saying that it is wrong, think about it. For example, the sign - in eb = -M.dia/dt comes from the fact that eb=-dΦ/dt, it is a convention. Or when I say that ib is constant, it is only proportional to dia/dt=k, and there is no generator in circuit B. It's basic.
On the other hand, the generator is a current generator, not a voltage generator. Why do you absolutely want a voltage generator?! It doesn't matter, it only complicates things and could lead to errors. What matters is di/dt=k.

I just added the little power calculation to show that A supplies the energy, but it's irrelevant to the point.
What is interesting is the principle, the action of the charges in circuit B on those in circuit A, and the problem of applying Maxwell-Faraday's law in this context. That's the question I was asking. The rest is just details.
« Last Edit: 2026-02-16, 18:39:01 by F6FLT »


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I applied the standard equations, they are correct. Before saying that it is wrong, think about it. For example, the sign - in eb = -M.dia/dt comes from the fact that eb=-dΦ/dt, it is a convention. Or when I say that ib is constant, it is only proportional to dia/dt=k, and there is no generator in circuit B. It's basic.
On the other hand, the generator is a current generator, not a voltage generator. Why do you absolutely want a voltage generator?! It doesn't matter, it only complicates things and could lead to errors. What matters is di/dt=k.

I just added the little power calculation to show that A supplies the energy, but it's irrelevant to the point.
What is interesting is the principle, the action of the charges in circuit B on those in circuit A, and the problem of applying Maxwell-Faraday's law in this context. That's the question I was asking. The rest is just details.

OK my bad and I corrected my previous post.   After some research, I see when You used eb=-dΦ/dt which defines a single turn.  For multiple turns flux linkage (λ=NΦ) should be used instead of flux.  This then allows us to generate eL​=−L*di/dt which when accounting for the current reversal in Lb, the voltage polarity across Lb is correct.

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However, a DC current in one coil cannot induce a current in another, so there is no ‘counter-current’ in A due to B.


Can a direct current component exist in such a nonlinear inductance?
If it will be coil B.  ;)
« Last Edit: 2026-02-26, 12:52:13 by chief kolbacict »
   

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Is it possible to make a magnetic diode?
Something that allows magnetic flux to pass in one direction but not the other.
   

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that is a magnet biased inductor.

mostly meant for buck and boost power supplies.   the idea is that you pulse the winding in the polarity that the magnetic field of the coil produces is in repulsion to the biasing magnet. as the winding builds the field in the core, opposing the magnets field, the winding pushes the magnets field out of the core and then driving the core even further with opposing flux to the magnet.

this allows the use of a smaller core but emulates a larger inductance.  generally to reduce the physical size for fitment in smaller equipment.   If you pulse the coil in the opposite direction, the core is already mostly saturated by the magnet, so self inductance would be to a minimum.   so in a way, yes. if the proper ac freq is used, it will have rectifying effect.  not on/ off, but a big difference in the amount of currents in one direction or the other.

I believe Tyco and a few other brands produce them.


Mags
   
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Is it possible to make a magnetic diode?
Something that allows magnetic flux to pass in one direction but not the other.

It is possible but impractical because it requires a mechanical device and has no miraculous effect on energy conservation. However, the driving effect of magnetism is interesting : https://physics.aps.org/articles/v11/s134


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It is possible but impractical because it requires a mechanical device and has no miraculous effect on energy conservation. However, the driving effect of magnetism is interesting : https://physics.aps.org/articles/v11/s134

what mechanical device?  possibly if done right, magnet biased inductor could act as a non voltage drop rectification.  id see it similar to teslas 1 way valve.

mags
   
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It's weird that nobody seems to know what to do or where to start. Everyone seems to want to make everything so complicated when the premise is easy.
My first FE project was easy and anyone could build it. It was a solenoid engine like this, https://hackaday.com/2019/09/25/build-your-own-solenoid-engine/

The iron plunger and crankshaft mean little and the real variables are the switching and coil winding/geometry. The premise is very simple.
1)We use a small capacitor to send a slug of energy into the solenoid coil. The input is set to say 24v at 680uF and cannot change.
2)The only thing which can change is the amount of force applied to the plunger and how long the force lasts.
3)The total force applied to the plunger determines how long the crankshaft will rotate with a single impulse input into the coil.
4)This reduces all the complexity down to one problem which is how to produce the maximum force from the solenoid coil with a set input.

I can give you a clue and the problem relates to something called a permanent electromagnet. This concept is found in many places in the art and patents dating back to the early 1900's. the concept is easy to understand and if we input X energy into a properly wound and configured coil it produces a magnetic field which does not reduce with time. In effect it acts just like a permanent magnet which can be turned on and off.

It's obvious why it works, if we input X energy into a normal coil and the magnetic field lasts 1 second then if the magnetic field lasted 3 seconds it could do much more work. Thus the whole ball of wax comes down to one goal which is to make the magnetic field last as long as possible to do the most work on the plunger as possible.


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It's weird that nobody seems to know what to do or where to start. Everyone seems to want to make everything so complicated when the premise is easy.
...
It's obvious why it works, if we input X energy into a normal coil and the magnetic field lasts 1 second then if the magnetic field lasted 3 seconds it could do much more work.
...

A childish truism. This simplicity is only the projection of a simplistic view onto complex matters. To accomplish work, a variation of flux is required, and therefore energy must be supplied to maintain the flux, compensating for what the work consumes. This is precisely what we discussed here: https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4792.msg118458#msg118458

Everything is simple to those who don't understand the issue. The less competent we are, the more we believe we have solutions. But obviously, these solutions don't work for anyone; they're just hot air. Their only reality is the cognitive dysfunction of a brain that doesn't understand its limitations and attributes them to others, especially scientists. In physics “everyone seems to want to complicate everything”, but only in the eyes of those who do not understand a subject whose complication is beyond them.


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so in the solenoid example AC has shown in the link, is there an advantage to having the whole crank shaft, etc., vs rotor with stators, etc.?


mags
   
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so in the solenoid example AC has shown in the link, is there an advantage to having the whole crank shaft, etc., vs rotor with stators, etc.?

mags

There is no advantage other than simplicity and many inventors used a simple spring to measure the solenoid coil output force vs time. The point is to remove all distractions from the process so we can concentrate on what's important. The only thing that matters here is energy conversion and efficiency.

Suppose we had an iron slug resting below a solenoid coil and when the solenoid coil is energized by a small measured impulse of electrical energy the iron slug is pulled upward and held in place by the solenoid coils magnetic field. The greater our knowledge and understanding the longer the iron slug will be held in place before it falls back to it's resting position. We can pretend to know all we want, spout laws and equations, point fingers and blame others all day long but it means little if nothing. The only proof of how much we actually understand is how long that iron slug is held against the force of gravity within the solenoid coil before it falls.

Maybe we need a friendly competition to demonstrate who actually understands what they are talking about?. Something anyone can afford unlike the pulse motor fiasco. Let's keep it super simple and we can work out the details here. I'm thinking...
1)a 1/2" x 3" soft iron slug cut from a standard 1/2" dia mild steel bolt.
2)The solenoid coil can be any dimension or number of turns and the only limitation is that the iron slug is free to move within the coil former.
3)The most important variable is the input energy and it must be a standard electrolytic capacitor not a battery. One capacitor of a known capacitance, let's say 10,000 uF at 35v which are very common so there is no question about how much energy is input into the system. The input energy is set and anything which happens after the fact is open.













« Last Edit: 2026-03-08, 14:41:14 by Allcanadian »


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Comprehend and Copy Nature... Viktor Schauberger

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool.”― Richard P. Feynman
   
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I am collecting bits of this and that for your experimental challenge.

Hope to learn alongside the “kids”
Will mention this to ( invite) whomever I can think of …
Respectfully
Chet K
Edit to explain “the Kids”
Teaching the younger persons in my life ( kids /grandkids etc)
« Last Edit: 2026-03-08, 17:48:59 by Chet K »
   

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The only proof of how much we actually understand is how long that iron slug is held against the force of gravity within the solenoid coil before it falls.
Minimize the resistance of the winding. In a shorted winding the current persists indefinitely at zero R, ...and so does the magnetic flux generated by it.
The time the slug is up is not a matter of knowledge - it is a matter of money because niobium wire and LH are expensive.
   
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A short-circuited coil maintains its current if it is superconducting. A coil is charged with current in the same way that a capacitor is charged with voltage.

Our capacitors are almost ideal components because leakage currents are extremely low and losses in the dielectrics can be negligible.
Conversely, our coils are very poor components, mainly because of their resistance, which causes a coil charged with current to lose it very quickly.

But even if we had coils as ideal as our capacitors, which would maintain a current for as long as a capacitor maintains a voltage, this would not produce any more free energy than we get with capacitors.
A permanent magnet is ultimately just a set of superconducting nano-coils, which are electron spins, and no one has ever succeeded in using permanent magnets to produce a cycle that would generate work. And for good reason: magnetic work requires a variation in magnetic potential energy. If we don't have it, that's the cause of the effect we're making disappear. We can have it on part of a cycle, for example a magnet attracting a ferromagnetic piece. But to return that piece to its starting point, we would have to expend just as much energy.

Some will say that with a current in a coil, we could cut the current on the second part of the cycle and return the ferromagnetic piece to its starting point at zero cost. Wrong! This overlooks the fact that the work done in the first part of the cycle was at the expense of potential magnetic energy, meaning that the energy in the final magnetic field that will be recovered will be less than that initially applied, and the difference will represent the work that has been done.

The idea that a current maintained in a coil could be used to produce free energy is a remake of SMOT. It is equally inept. I understand that people had fun with it at one point, I was no exception, but after 20 to 30 years of failure in this area, it is time to understand the basic principles and realise that changing the DIY parts with coils instead of magnets does not invalidate a principle.

Simpletons see new fields of ‘research’ easy because they have replaced the red insulation on a conductor with green insulation, so clearly, it's not the same thing at all :) (I'm hardly exaggerating).  They see simplicity everywhere because they do not understand the relationships between the pieces of the physics puzzle, which are beyond them. Moreover, if in two centuries of electromagnetism everyone has failed to produce free energy, assuming that it is possible, it is because producing free energy is surely a subtle matter. They don't even grasp this simple idea; their contempt for scientists and their pretentiousness blind them.
Only the physics principles are (relatively) simple. But for free energy, new principles or new energy sources need to be found. We cannot count on those who see this as easy and go round in circle. If they could work a little, achieve something or think before they speak and utter childish naiveties with the assurance of an omniscient person, we could breathe a sigh of relief.

« Last Edit: 2026-03-08, 22:02:18 by F6FLT »


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Some will say that with a current in a coil, we could cut the current on the second part of the cycle and return the ferromagnetic piece to its starting point at zero cost. Wrong! This overlooks the fact that the work done in the first part of the cycle was at the expense of potential magnetic energy, meaning that the energy in the final magnetic field that will be recovered will be less than that initially applied, and the difference will represent the work that has been done.
I once analyzed a similar scenario here.

   

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Simpletons see new fields of ‘research’ easy because they have replaced the red insulation on a conductor with green insulation, so clearly, it's not the same thing at all :) (I'm hardly exaggerating). 
Sadly, I have observed this too  :(.

For example, recently a newbie that I was talking with, could not see the analogy between two arrangements of these nine cored coils besides their number, circularity and the central one:

  Arrangement #1.

  Arrangement #2.

On the other hand, another member who considers himself electromagnetically inept, noticed the analogy without even seeing both pictures next to each other ...and before I did.
   

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........
A permanent magnet is ultimately just a set of superconducting nano-coils, which are electron spins, and no one has ever succeeded in using permanent magnets to produce a cycle that would generate work.
.........
That word "permanent" gives rise to the math that tells you why "no one has ever succeeded in using permanent magnets to produce a cycle that would generate work".  But that magnetism is not permanent, it decays over time.  There is a belief among most experts in magnetism that the Curie temperature causes an abrupt phase change in the material where it loses its "permanent" magnetism.  That is incorrect. It is not an abrupt phase change.  As you approach the Curie temperature the decay time constant reduces from tens of years to fractions of a seecond.  You turn off the current and use the natural decay of the remanent (so-called "permanent") magnetism for the slug to fall.  Do this for different temperatures near the Curie point.  I think that type of experiment could offer interesting results that develop new math perhaps extracting energy from the thermal agitations that cause the "permanent magnetism" decay.

Smudge
   
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...For example, recently a newbie that I was talking with, could not see the analogy between two arrangements of these nine cored coils besides their number, circularity and the central one:
...
:)
The thing is, free energy comes from the magic of appearances. And to convince people of this truth, all you need is a YouTube video where you walk around the setup like a Harry Potter master wizard, point your finger accusingly and say, ‘The idea is simple, but scientists don't understand anything. I do,’ and then explain your genius and how it works with a barrage of empty phrases, hocus-pocus and mumbo-jumbo. And the sleight of hand works on the less educated, who then repeat the gospel: ‘Free energy is easy’.


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@Smudge

I am open to all hypotheses, provided that they are logically consistent, compatible with what we already know, and refutable.

Whether through phase change or otherwise, the energy gained in one system is lost in another. We have never seen a closed system where the final situation is identical to the initial situation, with energy produced for the outside in between. Phase changes to date, regardless of their field, have not been able to provide free energy, so if this type of effect allows for free energy, it is as an intermediate means, which can certainly be interesting and useful, but not as a principle.

When it comes to free energy, I would add that the hypothesis must be testable, especially when we do not know what is depleted because the energy source is unknown. The experimental evidence must be commensurate with the extraordinary nature of the claim. But to prompt an experimental verification as proof of concept, which is very costly in terms of both working time and reflection, especially if it is not one's own idea, and given the systematic failures in the past, the concept must be perfectly clear, detailed and convincing.

« Last Edit: 2026-03-09, 09:43:59 by F6FLT »


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@Smudge

I am open to all hypotheses, provided that they are logically consistent, compatible with what we already know, and refutable.
Here we have two separate sequences, (a) magnetization by electric means during which we supply a quantity of energy and (b) loss of magnetization by internal thermal agitation during which we extract a quantity of electrical energy.  This has already been the subject of comment in another thread of this forum quoting CoE that says you will not get more out than you put in.  Why can't these two separate effects act like a refridgerator or a heat pump with COP>1?  But unlike those, the output here is electrical energy and not heat energy?  Surely there is a market for such a system?     

Quote
Whether through phase change or otherwise, the energy gained in one system is lost in another. We have never seen a closed system where the final situation is identical to the initial situation, with energy produced for the outside in between.
But this is not a closed system.

Quote
Phase changes to date, regardless of their field, have not been able to provide free energy
Really, what about Heat Pumps??
Quote
so if this type of effect allows for free energy, it is as an intermediate means, which can certainly be interesting and useful, but not as a principle.

When it comes to free energy, I would add that the hypothesis must be testable, especially when we do not know what is depleted because the energy source is unknown. The experimental evidence must be commensurate with the extraordinary nature of the claim. But to prompt an experimental verification as proof of concept, which is very costly in terms of both working time and reflection, especially if it is not one's own idea, and given the systematic failures in the past, the concept must be perfectly clear, detailed and convincing.
Well that Korean Company have produced notarial certificated data of exactly this even though they don't really know how their system works.

Smudge
   
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I think the solenoid coil hold test is a good one because it's cheap, easy and shows how primitive our technology is.

When we use a battery and measure the voltage and current it can be deceiving. However when we use a set amount of energy from something like a capacitor we can see how quickly the energy dissipates. I mean we close the circuit, the iron slug moves a little and the majority of the energy we put into the system is completely wasted.

It reminds me of the magnetic bearing I invented. Give a normal 1/2hp induction motor a little spin by hand and it lasts maybe 1 second. Where I could give the same rotor the same spin on my magnetic bearings and it would keep turning for days. It's not magic, it just shows how something most consider normal can be grossly inefficient in reality. The goal is not to do the impossible only to do better than normal. In effect, once we start learning how to solve problems and the thought process required to learn everything gets easier.

Which brings us full circle back to the beginning of this post. Normally the majority of the energy we put into the system is completely wasted. The goal here is not to build a FE device more so do some basic experiments showing how to extend the run time of a circuit which holds the iron core of a solenoid in place. Keep It Simple Stupid applies here and we want to start with something cheap and simple so everyone can get involved.

I started a new thread here, https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4922.msg118533;topicseen#msg118533


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Comprehend and Copy Nature... Viktor Schauberger

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Sadly, I have observed this too  :(.

For example, recently a newbie that I was talking with, could not see the analogy between two arrangements of these nine cored coils besides their number, circularity and the central one:

  Arrangement #1.

  Arrangement #2.

On the other hand, another member who considers himself electromagnetically inept, noticed the analogy without even seeing both pictures next to each other ...and before I did.

Careful you don't let the truth get in the way of a good story. Your design didn't lend itself to the requirements of this device ... that's why I said it was not analogous to the Hubbard. Also as I explained, I hadn't seen a single faithful replication attempted to uncover what Hubbard was doing (and neither had you), and yet I have been able to put forward a working theory that I am now very actively building... newbie is a pretty dismissive way to describe me, I've been at this for a while now.
   

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newbie is a pretty dismissive way to describe me, I've been at this for a while now.
I thought you were "not big on semantics".  Anyway, it was better than the word F6FLT had used.  ...and notice that I have not identified you by name - you have done this yourself.

The word "newbie" does not refer only to the time spent but also to the knowledge and experience. Would you prefer a "rookie" ?
You are clearly manifesting the lack of basic knowledge and experience when you put bulk solid steel inside a high frequency winding  ...unless you are making an inductive furnace.
...and that's only the most egregious manifestation.

  That gray material, in the device you are building, is galvanized steel tube, isn't it ?

There is nothing wrong with being inexperienced but considering your knowledge and experience to be so complete that you don't accept good advice from others is a different story (study this and this)  ...and habitually skipping answers to direct questions is downright rude.

Careful you don't let the truth get in the way of a good story. Your design didn't lend itself to the requirements of this device
Do you know what the requirements of this device are? If "yes" - what are they ?
Don't conflate requirements with the expected output parameters when you answer...
If you come up with real requirements, make an effort to analyze how they "don't lend themselves" rather than making unsupported assertions.

... that's why I said it was not analogous to the Hubbard.
Yes, you stated that and this is one of the ways you have demonstrated your lack of knowledge and experience.

I hadn't seen a single faithful replication attempted to uncover what Hubbard was doing (and neither had you),
Yes but that is irrelevant to the analysis of this device on the basis of the body of knowledge and experiments made to date.

...and yet I have been able to put forward a working theory that I am now very actively building...
Can the members of this forum learn details about this working theory from you or is it your secret ?



   
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