I thought I would post this as some observations on the TPU mystery based on the videos, and Dr. Schinzingers reports. If you can think of anything that should be added, let me know (PM) and I will add it to the list.
1. Devices were extremely lightweight considering their power density, and could not have contained known battery technology. (See report of Michael Fennell and Dr. Schinzinger)
2. Devices were observed by various engineer types and Dr. Schinzinger who would have had the good sense to look for hidden wires, batteries, RF fields etc.
3. Devices were carried about while lighting lamps and moved around on the table again eliminating hidden wires or RF induction or heavy batteries.
4. Devices would illuminate large banks of series connected lamps for lengthy periods of time without faltering.
5. Devices would overheat, could be shut down and restarted after cooling.
6. Devices could be cut into pieces after operation showing no hidden batteries and exposing circumferential and toroidal wires.
7. Some units had excellent load regulation, others had poor regulation.
8. Devices would output DC with some 5 kHz and hash (high frequency noise) riding on top of the DC
9. Devices would take some time to wind up to full output.
10. Devices would exhibit a stiction or washboard effect when moved through the air.
11. Some devices would exhibit a slight gyroscopic effect when moved about.
12. Some devices would "wind down" when turned upside down.
13. No time varying magnetic fields were observed in the vicinity that could account for the power output (See Schinzinger report#1)
On This Page I will present Dr. Roland Schinzinger's Life work and Credentials
RESUME ROLAND SCHINZINGER
Dept. of Electrical and Computer Engineering (UCI)
Professor Emeritus of Electrical Engineering (UCI)
PhD, Univ. California, Berkeley 1966
MS, ? 1954
BS, ? 1953
Westinghouse Design School / U. of Pittsburgh 1955
Apprenticeship (Technikum), Bosch Co. 1947
High School (Doitsu Gakuin, Tokyo, Abitur) 1945
Academic Appointments:
(UCI) Associate Dean 1979-83, 1985-86
(UCB)Teaching Fellow 1963-65
Robert College Istanbul Turkey:
Associate Professor 1962-63
Associate Professor 1958-62
University of California, energ. & Mgt. (Grad Program) 1991-92
California State Polytechnic University 1978-80
University of Santa Maria, Brazil 1993
University of Kariruhe, Germany-
Power and High Voltage Institute 1986
University of Manchester Inst. Of Science and Tech.-
And Imperial College, London: 1972-73
Honors:
Fellow, Institute of Electrical and Electronics Eng.,(IEEE)
Fellow, Institute for the Advancement of Engineering
Award for Contributions to Professionalism (IEEE)
1983 Centennial Medal (IEEE)
Science Faculty Fellow (Natl. Sc. Foundation) 1964-65
Sangamo Prize Fellowship (Sangamo Electric) 1953
Honor Societies HKN, TBN, Sigma xi
Listed in ?Who?s Who, Am. Men & Women in Science and Engineering
Publications:
Over 70 technical papers, plus numerous reports and commentaries.
Also four books: Ethics in Engineering McGraw-Hill
Conformal Mapping P.A.Laura
Emergencies in Water Delivery Davis Pub.
Electrical Laboratory SIMA Ltd.
IN MEMORIAM
Roland Schinzinger
Professor of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science, Emeritus
Irvine
1926—2004
Roland Schinzinger, professor emeritus of electrical engineering and computer science, passed away at his home in Irvine on January 25, 2004 as the result of a heart attack. It was a tremendous loss to the University, where he was one of the founding faculty, a distinguished scholar, a dedicated and universally-liked teacher, and a diligent writer.
Professor Schinzinger was born on November 22, 1926 in Osaka, Japan three years after his German parents moved to Japan. After World War II, Roland decided to come to the United States. Upon his arrival in San Diego, he worked as a taxi driver and a ditch digger to support himself. He was soon awarded a scholarship to study at the University of California, Berkeley, where he earned his B.S. in 1953 and M.S. in 1954, both in electrical engineering. Upon his graduation, Roland worked with Westinghouse in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and taught at Robert College in Istanbul, Turkey. He then returned to UC Berkeley to continue his studies toward a Ph.D. degree in electrical engineering under the guidance of Professor Robert Saunders. In 1965, Roland followed his advisor Professor Saunders to the newly opened UC Irvine campus where he completed his Ph.D. research in 1966. The same year, he joined UCI as an assistant professor. Throughout the years, Professor Schinzinger served the School of Engineering as associate dean for undergraduate student affairs, associate dean for graduate affairs, and on occasion as acting dean. He also held a long-term joint appointment in the Graduate School of Management, where he was instrumental in developing a program in operations research. Roland became a professor emeritus on January 1, 1993, but remained active in teaching classes and mentoring students. He was the academic director of the Energy Scholars Program and a mentor to the students who participated in independent studies of the electric vehicle. During his career at UCI, he authored many articles and books in a broad spectrum of research areas covering engineering ethics, power systems, operations research, and education.
Professor Schinzinger was not only a great citizen of UCI, but also of Irvine, Orange County, and the world. Due to his experience in World War II Japan, the peace movement was a passion and a drive throughout his life. He participated in many peace rallies during his undergraduate years at Berkeley. He worked as a counselor at the Santa Ana Peace Center during the Vietnam War . Even recently, he would often stay up late writing and working on e-mails sent all over the world related to issues of peace. His influence reached far and near. Our neighborhoods were the immediate beneficiary. He and his family were members of the Society of Friends, the Quaker congregation in Costa Mesa. He served on the Irvine Planning Commission, as a member of the energy committees for the city and the county, and was the founder of the bicycle trails located throughout Irvine today.
Roland lived a virtuous and influential professional and political life, which he balanced with a strong caring for and focus on his wonderful family. He married Jane Harris in 1952, and together they had one son, Stefan, and two daughters, Annelise and Barbara. Roland was a loving father and husband, and together they traveled the world and left profound imprints on those they met. In 1993, Jane died of cancer. Later, Roland married Shirley Price and together they enjoyed life to the fullest. Their union brought their families even closer together and their joy touched all whom they knew. The world is a better place for Roland's presence, and all who met him, worked with him, and loved him gained at least a thought, a viewpoint, or a gesture that made a difference in their lives.
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Roland Schinzinger (deceased) was active in engineering ethics for over two decades, participating in the National Project on Philosophy and Engineering Ethics (1978-1980) and coauthoring four editions of Ethics in Engineering (McGraw-Hill, 1983, 1989, 1996, and 2005). In addition, he was author of Conformal Mapping: Methods and Applications (1991, 2003), Emergencies in Water Delivery (1979), and Experiments in Electricity and Magnetism (1961).
Schinzinger was a founding faculty member at the University of California at Irvine, where he also served as associate dean for undergraduate student affairs, associate dean for graduate affairs, and on occasion acting dean. He retired as professor emeritus of electrical engineering in 1993. Earlier, his industrial experience included work at Bosch-Japan, Tsurumi Shipyard of Nippon Steel Tube Co., Far Eastern Equipment Co., and Westinghouse Electric Corp. He was a registered professional engineer.
His many professional honors include the IEEE Centennial and Third Millennium medals, Fellow of IEEE, and Fellow of AAAS. In 1992 he received from IEEE's United States Activities Board the Award for Distinguished Literary Contributions Furthering Engineering Professionalism.
Schinzinger was active in his local community at Irvine, California. As a member of the city's planning commission, he helped establish bicycle trails and plan energy efficient housing. He volunteered extensively in peace activities, and worked extensively for the Friends Committee on Legislation, a lobbying group advocating just and compassionate laws in California.
Here are Dr. Schinzinger's reports
This first report was shortly after his visit to Steve's home, and he brought with him some instrumentation. He can be identifies at several points in one of the longer video's
============================================================
Report #1 Posted by Lindsay Mannix, February 07, 2006
ROLAND SCHINZINGER PhD.
Report on Test of Energy Device
At the request of Mr. Richard Mincherton I was present on October 28th at a test demonstration of a device that its inventor claims will produce electric power without measurable energy input except as derived from the earth'' magnetic and gravitational fields. The test was conducted at the inventor's home. I was allowed to bring and use measuring instruments, but because the inventor had to leave after
1 ½ hours, I was not able to conduct independent tests on my own.
Based on my observations, I can attest to the fact that the three models of the device displayed and tested on that day did indeed light up one, two and six light bulbs (each rated at 100 watt and 120 volt) respectively. This was less then the figures quoted to me before the test, but still adequate to demonstrate that the devices function in some fashion. The smallest unit produced 140 to 150 volts unloaded and 60 to 90 volts when lighting one 100-watt bulb.
The mid-sized unit produced 250 volts unloaded, and was observed producing 142 Volts at 0.5 Ampere after 30 minutes of lighting two bulbs.
The largest unit produced 798 Volts unloaded. With a six-bulb load the voltage dropped to 420 Volts.
It was difficult to determine how many hours the devices may be able to operate because the inventor ended the demonstration after 1 ½ hours.
I could not detect any time-varying magnetic field that might have provided an external energy input.
After the test the inventor cut the toroidally shaped device into segments (though not the controller box located at the center of the device). These samples consisted of an array of circumferentially arranged coils and wires grouped around a core made of a cork like substance.
October 29, 1995 Roland Schinzinger
===========================================================
Here is the letter of Dr. Schinzinger inviting Steven to bring the devices to his lab at UCI for further testing.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roland Schinzinger
PhD.
29 Gilman St. Irvine, CA 92715-2703, Phone & FAX: (714) 786-7691
December 1, 1995
Dear Steven,
Thank you for dinner the other night. I truly enjoyed the experience and the ride home together. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
When you get to be my age Stephen you have learned how not to ruffle feathers. If I were in your shoes I would do exactly what we discussed.
I have talked to my associate about the problems as you see it involving the heat created by your unit when generating power. He is willing to assist us in finding a solution and he does not feel it is an insurmountable problem.
The current involved no matter how slight must be a contributing factor, regardless. We must first consider all the working principles and decide how to go about solving the problem.
I look forward to seeing you and your unit at my laboratory around eight thirty on Saturday morning.
I will have only one observer and we will be otherwise alone.
I promise you that we will give an honest evaluation of everything we observe and will attest to what we find.
If you need to talk to me first you may leave a message for me at my office at the University of California Irvine.
Sincerely,
Roland
===========================================================
Here is the Lab report after Steven brings his devices to Dr. Schinzinger's lab at UCI
Sent to LM by SM :Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 22:35:31 EDT
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roland Schinzinger, PhD.
29 Gilman St. Irvine, CA 92715-2703
Phone & FAX: (714) 786-7691
Second report on Energy Device
At the request of Steven Mark I agreed to thoroughly test his invention of an energy device" toroid" at my laboratory at the UCI campus.
With me was John Sanchez who will act as an observer and Mr. Mark who will operate his device for the tests.
The device is reported to develop measurable amounts of electric power beyond any known battery or storage device.
In fact the inventor claims that his device will create electric power indefinitely as long as it is permitted to cool at intervals.
Mr. Mark arrived promptly at 8:30 AM and wasted no time in permitting my examination of two units.
The first unit was roughly shaped like a large donut. It measured approximately 4.72" across with an inside diameter hole of 3" making a core width approximately 1" thick.
The unit was exactly 2" tall, resembling a "Toroid". I did not measure the weight however the unit was extremely light when held in the hand.
Mr. Mark connected the unit directly to a 100 watt 120 volt incandescent light bulb and caused the unit to operate.
It did in fact illuminate the incandescent bulb quite brightly. I measured the voltage at 137 volts D.C. exactly, (ObS). See note*
I then measured the current flowing through the wires to the bulb at a steady one-ampere, (ObS).
We noted the time at 9:06 AM.,(ObS).
We next measured the light output from the bulb with a luminescence meter and noted that it read 2.5, (ObS).
Next we measured a similar incandescent bulb placed in a socket powered from the main 120 volt (as measured) AC power provided to the laboratory.
It measured 2.4 on the luminescence meter. This can probably be accounted for because the voltage as measured from the Toroid device is 137 volts and therefore 12 volts greater, generating a slight increase in light output over the incandescent light powered by the laboratory main power supply system.
The toroid device did indeed provide the standard voltage and current necessary to provide electric lighting for a 120-volt circuit.
The inventor then asked us for another bulb, which we provided him and he set about connecting the second bulb along with the first.
The second bulb was connected in parallel to the first and did indeed light just as brightly as the first.
I measured 137 volts now across the output just as before although the load had doubled and the impedance halved (ObS).
I measured the current flowing to the two bulbs at just less then 2-amperes, (ObS).
The inventor stated that the unit would provide the two amperes at 137 volts for several hours, if not indefinitely.
We were cautioned that the unit while in operation would generate heat leading to self-destruction if not shut down and permitted to cool.
He claimed that after cooling the unit could be restarted and used again over and over.
We permitted the first unit to remain in operation and provide power for the two incandescent bulbs while we turned our attention to the second larger unit the inventor brought with him for testing.
The second unit was again toroid shaped with a large hole in the center. It was approximately 15" at the outside and 13" inside with a core thickness of approximately 1". The unit was 4" tall. The unit was not measured in weight but could be easily lifted with one hand, (ObS).
The inventor started the second larger unit in operation and cautioned myself and Mr. Sanchez not to touch the output leads from the device as they were at lethal potential. The time was 9:39 AM.
The inventor measured the output leads and told us there was 600 volts potential at several amperes.
He connected the unit to five 120 volt 100 watt incandescent light bulbs as provided by myself.
The larger second unit did indeed brightly light the five incandescent bulbs brightly. These bulbs were wired in series.
I measured the current through the wire connected to the 5-bulbs at 1.1 ampere, (ObS). I measured the voltage at 614 volts D.C., (ObS).
The inventor then connected another five 120 volt light bulbs along with the first five making a total of ten 120 volt, 100 watt incandescent light bulbs lighting at equal intensity.
I measured the light output with a luminescence meter at 2.43 each light bulb, (ObS). I did not measure the current but calculated it to be 2 amperes at 614 volts.
I asked the inventor if this was the limit of the unit and he replied, "no way."
He provided a quick blow fuse rated at 50 amperes.
With two large electrical clamps and wiring, he shorted the fuse across the output terminals of the toroid and destroyed the fuse, (ObS).
There was only a slight flickering of the ten incandescent bulbs as observed although there was a tremendous discharge of sparks from the output terminals of the toroid unit.
The inventor then gave me the fuse for examination. It was warm to the touch and smelled acrid, (ObS).
It was a large 240 volt AC air conditioner disconnect fuse and designed for severe service duty, (OsS).
The inventor's claim that the large toroid output terminals were at lethal potential was no longer in question.
The time was 11:20 AM when the inventor removed the small toroid unit from operation because of heat build up.
I examined the small toroid unit and it was indeed quite hot to the touch.
The unit had been in steady operation for exactly two hours and fourteen minutes. Noted: 2-hours and 14 minutes, (ObS).
The load of 2- amperes at 137-volts did not change through the test period.
I can personally state that I do not know of any battery or storage device of this size or weight with this capability.
The time was 12:47 when the inventor removed the large toroid device from operation.
It had been in constant operation for three hours and eight minutes
.
Noted: 3-hours and 8 minutes, (ObS).
The load of 10-amperes and the voltage of 614 volts did not change throughout the test with the exception that the voltage did began to fluctuate at 12:03 and began a slight decline to 598 volts by the end of the test.
This could be due to heating of the unit while in operation.
I can personally state that I do not know of any battery or storage device of this size or weight with this capability.
I cannot determine how many hours the toriod units could potentially operate because of our limited time available for testing.
I can however state with relative certainty I believe the tests show great potential for this Toroid technology.
December 12, 1995 Roland Schinzinger
*note: (ObS) "also observed by John Sanchez".
For reference, a report by Michael Fennell who was asked to do an energy evaluation on the TPU. This is commonly known as the "Engineer's Report".
=============================================================
29 September 1997
Michael Fennell (Consulting Engineer)
8348 Menkar Road
San Diego, CA. 92126
To whom it may concern:
I have been hired by Mr. Green to evaluate the performance of the Toroidal Power Unit or TPU as has been described to me as a proprietary invention of Steven Mark who was until 1995 President and Chief engineer of Spheric Laboratories, a public corporation. I have been instructed to compare the performance of the TPU with that of any known batteries and other storage systems.
As understood the device is universally observed to have the following characteristics:
Outside Diameter: 6"
Inside Diameter: 5"
Height: 1 - 3/4"
Weight: 12 ounces
Output Power: 250 Watts
Output Voltage: 160 Volts
Voltage Frequency: 5000 Hz.
Duration of Performance: 30 Minutes
To compare the TPU with commercially available and developed batteries I described its performance in terms of -Specific Energy-.
The power delivered by a battery or motor is the amount of energy delivered per unit time. A 250 Watt device delivers 250 Joules per second. The total energy delivered is the power times the amount of time that the device is on. A 250 Watt power supply that is on for 1 second delivers 250 Joules. Since the TPU was on for a half an hour, it delivered (250W) x (0.5 Hours) = 125 Watt Hour of energy. In Joules that is (250 W) x (1800 s) = 450,000 J.
A convenient way of comparing two energy sources is to compare their specific energies. The specific energy of a battery is the total power it delivers divided by its weight. For the TPU that would be 125 W-Hour / 0.34 Kg or 367 W-Hour / Kg.
Specific energy is a useful number for comparing power supplies for vehicles and portable electronics, because a battery may deliver a large amount of power, but weigh too much to be useful. If the batteries constitute a large fraction of the vehicle mass, much of the power they supply is used just to move their own mass.
I have included a table comparing the specific energy of the TPU with that of other batteries. Generally, batteries are defined as self-contained electrochemical cells: they burn no fuel and require no outside chemicals.
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BATTERY SPECIFIC ENERGY COMPANY W-Hr / Kg REFERENCE
TPU 367 As Observed
Lithium-iron Disulfide 130 (2)
Lithium 125 Battery Engineer(3)
Sodium Sulfur 100 (2)
Nickel-metal Hydride 75 Energy Conversion Devices.(3)
Zink-Bromide 70 Electro Energy(1)
Nickel Cadmium 56 (2)
Lead-Acid(Experimental) 50 (1)
Lead-Acid(Conventional) 35 (1)
----------------------------------------------------
(1) "Electric-Vehicle Batteries," H. Oman and Gross Feb. 1995
(2) "Solar Dome," Robert Q. Riley
(3) Phone conversation. See text.
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For electric vehicle applications, the most promising near term successor to conventional lead acid batteries are Nickel-Metal-Hydride (NiMH) batteries. These are currently used in laptop computers.
Energy Conversion Devices (ECD) has a large number of patents on NiMH technology, and has licensed the technology to GM in the U.S. and other manufacturers in Europe and South East Asia. To obtain more information on these batteries contact Greg Fritz at ECD (248-363-1750) or John Dunbar at Gold Peak (619-674-5620). Gold Peak Inc. Makes NiMH batteries and is a licensee of ECD. Greg Fritz says that ECD may be able to produce batteries with a specific energy of up to 150 W-Hour / Kg within several years.
Lithium polymer batteries are another promising battery technology. Battery Engineering is bringing out a 125 W-Hour / Kg battery this summer, according to Sal Piazza (619-830-5820), a battery engineer and spokesman.
Capacitors can also be used as energy storage devices. Maxwell Technologies produces a line of ultracapacitors that can achieve extremely high energy storage densities. Their ultracapacitors are used in electric vehicles to capture energy from regenerative brakes and store it for subsequent accelerations. However, according to Ed Blank at Maxwell (619-279-5100) their capacitors can not possibly match the performance characteristics of the TPU. He said that if their capacitors could match the TPU then he would not be at work; he'd be at the beach.
A small Maxwell capacitive energy storage device system is about 18'x18"x6". It can deliver about 42 W-Hr. The unit described by Ed Blank is designed to deliver 5000 W For 30 seconds at 56 volts. I do not have the weight of the device, but the specific energy should be much lower because the box has 108 times the volume of the TPU.
Two characteristics differentiate the performance of the TPU from batteries. First, it has a 5000Hz AC output. Batteries are strictly DC devices. Second, its output voltage is very high compared to typical batteries. Batteries are constructed from electrochemical cells with a small fixed voltage; a typical value is 1.5 volts. Higher voltages are achieved by stacking these small cells together in series. Typically the largest stacks are 12 volts. These higher voltages can not be made arbitrarily large.
Battery cells have internal resistance; if a large number of cells are stacked in a series, each cell in the series will pass all the current delivered by the stack. Consider the concept of the weakest link in a chain.
For example, if ten 1.5 volt cells rated at 1 amp each are stacked together, the stack can only be operated at 1 amp at 15 volts. Drawing higher current would result in each cell in the stack passing more then its rated 1 amp. This would cause internal changes in the cells which can lead to a cessation of the electrochemical energy producing activity or a buildup of gas with possible explosion.
To use many batteries to create the current and high voltage associated with the TPU would be out of the question.
AC voltages can be obtained from battery based power supplies using converters or actually inverters. However, inverters are built using capacitors and inductors that tend to be bulky. This means that it would be extremely difficult if not impossible to build a 160 volt 5000 Hz power source by linking together a large number of low voltage batteries and the additional inverter electronics in a package with the small size and mass of the TPU.
In Summary:
No known form of battery or capacitor comes close to the performance specifications of the TPU as described. Even the best available lithium batteries would require almost triple the weight to deliver an equivalent amount of energy. Whatever this device is, it does not seem to be a battery in the conventional sense of a self contained electrochemical cell that burns no fuel and requires no outside chemicals.
Another point to consider is; from what I understand 30 minutes may not be the limit of this device's performance. If that is the case, it will be proportionally better in performance. For example, if the device is capable of operating at the same power for 60 minutes, this would equate to about six times its weight in the best available lithium batteries that would be required to deliver the equivalent amount of energy.
Sincerely,
Michael Fennell
B.A. Physics, Swarthmore College1983
M.S. Applied Physics, UCSD, 1988
I have worked on projects for NASA.
I have been a project engineer for ENERGY SCIENCE LABORATORIES, a senior technical associate with AT&T BELL LABORATORIES and have been a technical Writer for the HARVARD UNIVERSITY COMMITTEE ON PATENTS AND COPYRIGHTS.
Quote from: Michael Fennell on 2010.11.04, 13:54:00
Another point to consider is; from what I understand 30 minutes may not be the limit of this device's performance. If that is the case, it will be proportionally better in performance. For example, if the device is capable of operating at the same power for 60 minutes, this would equate to about six times its weight in the best available lithium batteries that would be required to deliver the equivalent amount of energy.
The overheating and "flipping over shut off" effects were only present on early units.
In the video "stevennew.mp4" with U.E.C at the top of the screen, SM states that these devices utilize a different method of induction which causes electron flow to produce useful electricity. One of the device runs for about 20 minutes and the voltage is checked at the start (about 170 volts) and at 20 minutes (about 169 volts). He states that this device makes batteries obsolete, can power cars and other devices, and that no other energy source offers the same energy density. (See report by Michael Fennell.)
SM states that the devices are not recievers, and that the electricity is produced within the device.
Even if you abhore conspiracy theories, and such, you can see that if SM's claims are true, then we have a slight problem with the TPU. It is a viable replacement for "oil" as an energy source. Oil is still required for many other purposes and used in many many products. The TPU does not replace oil entirely, it augments it. It allows us to go beyond the level of energy that oil can supply to us. There is no ground connection required. There are no connections to anything but the load.
The TPU allows us to utilize an energy source anywhere in the universe, at any time, for any purpose - indefinitely! This device and devices that use these same principles can usher in a new era for mankind!
Unfortunately, very few believe, and only a meer handful are willing to put in the bench time to achieve success.
Instead, we fight over the rights to the planets energy supply. We surpress devices that are "too efficient". We complain and argue. We spend our time on projects that have less documentation than the TPU, and a miniscule amount of success.
Some have argued that the TPU must not bne "real" since so many people have been working on it and it's variations for so many years and nothing has come of it. This is an incorrect assumption. A frined of mine came forward on the Eergy Builders Forum and discussed his version that did produce useful power in excess of the power applied for operation. (I don't recall exactly but I think he put 100w in and got 170w out.) This device was a collector loop of several turns with four coils wrapepd over it, forming a toroid. The coils were switched sequentially at around 28mHz. It was not impessive until he looped the output back to the input. After brief operation it overheated, cooked, fireballs on the bench, etc. Two other people witnessed this event on Skype.
Everyone also seems to forget that GK's GK4 device produced some interesting results and was referenced by Spherics.
Before you say "nothing has come of all the work", take a good look at the work that was actually performed. You will see that most of it is inapplicable, and unrelated, say 70% of it. 20% was wasted do to misunderstanding the information presented. That leaves a paltry 10% of the useful, which amounts to a few weeks. So, not much work has actually been performed towards a working TPU.
By the way, G, that quote was not from me, from the Fennell report.
I started this thread hoping it could light up an otherwise very dimly lit bulb.
BTW, I attached the torrent tracker to the "SM Videos Torrent Download" thread and checked the health of the torrent which is very good.
I also have to laugh at those that shoot from the hip. Talking about using boost converters and hidden batteries.
I tried all that with high energy lithium batteries and custom made high efficiency boost converters (remember I'm a switchmode design engineer) and could not come close to the power density required.
so much for quick draw McGraw.
I Think the 367 W-Hr / Kg REFERENCE says more than a million words, but how much can we actually trust this documents authenticity.
Unfortunately to my knowledge the good Dr ROLAND SCHINZINGER has not authenticated the others report personally either, and it will be hard for him to do so based on the fact he's no longer in this world.
Luckily the videos showing the run times and bulb loads should be enough to give the TPU a good chance of being real, coupled with other known facts and observations, also the shear fact that it has not been announced a fraud(with technical details) i think gives it credit.
We have had people say SM was not a clever chap(Jack Durban) in my book the guy is defiantly a genius.
Let hope he writes his memoir's before he departs this world.
I have Michael's phone number. I lack the courage to call him.
He is exactly who his report says he is. Else I would not have found him.
SM's IQ is over 150.
Quote from: Michael Fennell on 2010.11.04, 13:54:00
Another point to consider is; from what I understand 30 minutes may not be the limit of this device's performance. If that is the case, it will be proportionally better in performance. For example, if the device is capable of operating at the same power for 60 minutes, this would equate to about six times its weight in the best available lithium batteries that would be required to deliver the equivalent amount of energy.
The overheating and "flipping over shut off" effects were only present on early units.
In the video "stevennew.mp4" with U.E.C at the top of the screen, SM states that these devices utilize a different method of induction which causes electron flow to produce useful electricity. One of the device runs for about 20 minutes and the voltage is checked at the start (about 170 volts) and at 20 minutes (about 169 volts). He states that this device makes batteries obsolete, can power cars and other devices, and that no other energy source offers the same energy density. (See report by Michael Fennell.)
SM states that the devices are not recievers, and that the electricity is produced within the device.
Even if you abhore conspiracy theories, and such, you can see that if SM's claims are true, then we have a slight problem with the TPU. It is a viable replacement for "oil" as an energy source. Oil is still required for many other purposes and used in many many products. The TPU does not replace oil entirely, it augments it. It allows us to go beyond the level of energy that oil can supply to us. There is no ground connection required. There are no connections to anything but the load.
The TPU allows us to utilize an energy source anywhere in the universe, at any time, for any purpose - indefinitely! This device and devices that use these same principles can usher in a new era for mankind!
Unfortunately, very few believe, and only a meer handful are willing to put in the bench time to achieve success.
Instead, we fight over the rights to the planets energy supply. We surpress devices that are "too efficient". We complain and argue. We spend our time on projects that have less documentation than the TPU, and a miniscule amount of success.
Some have argued that the TPU must not bne "real" since so many people have been working on it and it's variations for so many years and nothing has come of it. This is an incorrect assumption. A frined of mine came forward on the Eergy Builders Forum and discussed his version that did produce useful power in excess of the power applied for operation. (I don't recall exactly but I think he put 100w in and got 170w out.) This device was a collector loop of several turns with four coils wrapepd over it, forming a toroid. The coils were switched sequentially at around 28mHz. It was not impessive until he looped the output back to the input. After brief operation it overheated, cooked, fireballs on the bench, etc. Two other people witnessed this event on Skype.
Everyone also seems to forget that GK's GK4 device produced some interesting results and was referenced by Spherics.
Before you say "nothing has come of all the work", take a good look at the work that was actually performed. You will see that most of it is inapplicable, and unrelated, say 70% of it. 20% was wasted do to misunderstanding the information presented. That leaves a paltry 10% of the useful, which amounts to a few weeks. So, not much work has actually been performed towards a working TPU.
It maybe easier if we had an email address for him ;D
It would be a real bonus to get the report actually verified though
Quote from: Peterae on 2010.11.04, 15:22:07
It maybe easier if we had an email address for him ;D
It would be a real bonus to get the report actually verified though
I have asked Lindsay repeatedly for more info on those reports, but it was never forthcoming.
I can tell you that I have a pretty good nose for this sort of thing and the reports read "true" to me, no red flags.
I emailed Michael Fennell.
way to go G ;D, let's hope he reply's, this could be very interesting indeed.
Hope so ION but you cannot beat direct proof, which so far i have only seen the videos.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.11.04, 16:02:28
I emailed Michael Fennell.
I doubt that you will get an honest reply, though I could be wrong.
Look at what happened to Sanchez.
(in the letters)
Isn't Sanchez still there at Berkeley?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.11.04, 17:11:02
Isn't Sanchez still there at Berkeley?
Don't know if he's still there, just seems he won't talk about the TPU.
Hats off to you G for having the courage to contact Fennell.
The main problem with the TPU is the amount of information available , there only speculation on how it work . Even the toroidal shape mean nothing , its maybe just a convenient way to present the device and nothing related at all with what we think .Its like trying to reverse engineer a aircraft reactor just the looking at the outside, some fuel input, some wire , and 1 million speculation on how its should work from a unverifiable source.
If Grumpy get some information from Fennell that will be the only one that ill personally trust because it come from a reliable source and not from some funky conversation with a nowhere.
I still believe the device is real and i really hope that we will get some crucial information on how it really work from that email or at least a guide line.
Best Regards,
IceStorm
I found Sanchez.
no TPU was not real
best to look at other inventions.
Found Campbell too.
Quote from: Microcontroller on 2010.11.04, 21:34:50
no TPU was not real
best to look at other inventions.
such as?
Quote from: Microcontroller on 2010.11.04, 21:34:50
no TPU was not real
best to look at other inventions.
I would be interested how you came to this conclusion. Did you research it carefully, track down every lead, develop timelines? What was the extent of your research, what key factors led you to believe this.
Why would Dr. Schinzinger express great interest in the device? Have you carefully read the test reports?
MH or ION
Regaurding the TPU and fellows experimenting nowadays,have you a cause for this??
From Bruce TPU at OU today http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2300.msg262956#new
Quote:
Harmonics are dangerous. A friend experimented with harmonics and a coil (completely different type set up than this) and disinigrated his wire coil and put a hole in his garage ceiling. My "ah ha!" moment came when I finally realized that I needed to be looking at the magnetic field associated with harmonics and NOT the e-field.
Chet
PS
These are the kinds of statements From exemplary People, that lead me to the conclusion that this is no BS.
Quote from: ramset on 2010.11.04, 22:57:51
MH or ION
Regaurding the TPU and fellows experimenting nowadays,have you a cause for this??
From Bruce TPU at OU today http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=2300.msg262956#new
Quote:
Harmonics are dangerous. A friend experimented with harmonics and a coil (completely different type set up than this) and disinigrated his wire coil and put a hole in his garage ceiling. My "ah ha!" moment came when I finally realized that I needed to be looking at the magnetic field associated with harmonics and NOT the e-field.
Chet
PS
These are the kinds of statements From exemplary People, that lead me to the conclusion that this is no BS.
Was he able to replicate the experiment with controls in place so that this would not occur a second time? Where is the complete documentation to get this effect. Reputable experimenters keep detailed documentation so that others may duplicate their experiments. This is scientific method, not heresay ( friend of a friend etc.).
When Faraday first documented his induction experiments a whole new industry was born building generators, small ones at first then giant ones. His discoveries were replicated all over the world and ushered in the age of electricity. It changed everything.
I don't see anything like this happening in the FE or OU community. Seems no one has made that
crucial first experiment that represents a
fundamental new discovery of energy production, is documented, and is replicable .
When it happens, you will know it. It will change everything
All in due time.
It is a misconception that this new power source will free us from oil. Rather it will serve to propel us forward faster than ever. It will take energy to build devices and perform research. It will take oil to make semiconductors and insulators and other materials. Oil production will purr along at its own unrelenting pace.
It is not the replacement of oil or income or power that they fear. It is the accelerated growth that a new energy source brings. They know they can not keep pace.
As my brother once put it: Screw 'em if they can't keep up.
100kW is the figure that Harold Aspden calculated - From a device the size of a beer can.
When gasoline is $10 US per gallon in a couple of years, what are you going to be doing? Waiting in line for fuel? Eating Raman Noodles to save your money for gas? Burning your furniture for heat?
We are better than that.
The answers are right in front of you. They have been disclosed to the best ability of the discloser. If you do not "believe", you have only yourselves to blame. Remember, the disclosers never asked you for anything. Not a single thing.
Now. Get to work!
Hi all,heres a question,why would SM want you to know how to build a tpu.
According to Jack Durban He lies even when he doesn't need to,he had a constant flow of people investing large amounts of money,he lived a lavish style that indicates vast greed to me,gave the investors nothing.He sold the tpu rights for a large sum,so why would he want you to know how to build a tpu,its not in hes interests that anyone ever make a working tpu.
If he doesn't want you to know how to build a tpu then he set up a vast amount of lies,false information to make sure you go in circles.If the tpu is real and the military is aware of it why is SM walking around,why isn't he dead or locked up.Who released the original videos ,without that release no one would know SM from adam.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.06, 06:23:31
Hi all,heres a question,why would SM want you to know how to build a tpu.
According to Jack Durban He lies even when he doesn't need to,he had a constant flow of people investing large amounts of money,he lived a lavish style that indicates vast greed to me,gave the investors nothing.He sold the tpu rights for a large sum,so why would he want you to know how to build a tpu,its not in hes interests that anyone ever make a working tpu.
If he doesn't want you to know how to build a tpu then he set up a vast amount of lies,false information to make sure you go in circles.If the tpu is real and the military is aware of it why is SM walking around,why isn't he dead or locked up.Who released the original videos ,without that release no one would know SM from adam.
I have seriously considered everything you have said and wrote much about it in the past. One possible scenario is that all of the SM / Lindsay Mannix emails are disinfo on someone's part, either SM or someone that may have been impersonating SM.
That's why a serious replicator might only want to work from the video's as a basis or starting point. The rest is conjecture and cannot be verified easily.
Supposedly someone named Jeremy Gaul released the original video's to Youtube in early 2006, nearly ten years after their creation. I don't think anyone has found the reason why. A good starting point for some detective work...any takers?
My guess is that original videos were locked up as part of SM's NDA. Whoever was the videographer may have kept a copy for himself that eventually wound up in a garage sale when VHS fell out of favor.
I guess no one will really know the truth of the TPU. One thing I can tell you after thousands of hours of research is this: The large TPU known as SM17 was very difficult to fake.
Those who only scratch the surface and come to quick conclusions about fakery on this unit have not done their homework.
All SM's other units could be easily explained as trickery, but I'm not saying that they were faked.
I am available for further discussion.
Edit: powerunlimited1 on youtube has a series of videos that show faked TPU replications
To Ion
I suspect Jack Durban,SM's
boyfriend or someone involved in the theft of one of the big tpu's at the mansion
were involved in the release of the video's to the internet,motive revenge.The release of the video's
brought SM to overunity.com to do damage control,I believe he uses a few personas to misdirect
people.I have done a reverse speech on the video's,reverse speech does work,on one forward he says
something about dc,reverse "extremely easy to make",he believes it works.I have done this reverse speech
on another device that another inventor claimed worked,in one part of the video,in reverse
he says its "bull shit".Reverse speech is not fool proof but has its uses.All of the devices can be faked
including the big tpu for a video however you can not continue the fraud in front of people.My theory is
only 3 of the devices are real,the rest are fake,the 6 inch tpu, real,the one in the lab setting, real,the big tpu, real.
The reason for faking them is to show that the device can be scaled,it can't because SM doesn't know how it works.
The video where the tpu powers the drill,vacuum cleaner and tv is a fake,the 6 inch tpu is real but it doesn't power the
the tv,drill or vacuum cleaner.This was done to show the investor that you could produce 120 ac from hv dc,
a trick for the big pay off.The problem with the tpu not handling inductive loads was never solved.I believe the tests at the university were done because the investor
didn't trust SM and wanted more proof.Then heres another question what happened to the tpu,and the company that
bought the rights?A big mystery here you have a device that could destroy all coal,oil and gas industries
destroy all alternate energy sources,bring oil producing countries to there knees over night yet the inventor walks around
with no problem.I have no theory on this or any clue why the military doesn't simply off SM,"dead men tell no tails"
or at best lock him up forever.I'm aware of the faked tpu videos on youtube.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 00:20:51
Then heres another question what happened to the tpu,and the company that
bought the rights?A big mystery here you have a device that could destroy all coal,oil and gas industries
destroy all alternate energy sources,bring oil producing countries to there knees over night yet the inventor walks around
with no problem.I have no theory on this or any clue why the military doesn't simply off SM,"dead men tell no tails"
or at best lock him up forever.I'm aware of the faked tpu videos on youtube.
Are you referring to U.A.E.? If yes, then they "own" the technology, but were told not to develop it, is how I see things. (Look what happened to Xogen, same thing).
Why you would say that some of SM's devices were fakes and some real is beyond me. I don't agree. Why would someone make a bunch of fakes and mix them in with the real devices, when they already have the real thing? Sounds ridiculous.
In fact, how did you come up with
all that nonsense above?
.99
Just when you thought you had heard everything...LOL!
To poynt99
you assume that that SM would not fake video's since the devices
are real,if some are real then they all are real,he would never fake things.
Wrong conclusion,unless you have lived with someone(my exwife) that lies and lies
and sounds very truthful,fools everybody you will never understand, I don't think you understand trickery,no offence intended.Wattsup did a very good job of showing
that the tpu in the garage was a fake,powerunlimited 1 did the illusion so
it can be done and could have done.Wattsup made the wrong conclusion that all tpu's are fake
3 are not,the tripplite inverter trick was done to show to the investor that you can
take hv dc and convert it into 120 ac so the investor would think he was cornering
the energy market,your a smart guy look at the inverter he used figure out how you take an 150 to 180 volt dc voltage and convert it to 120 ac,when the unit is designed to run on 12vdc,prove me wrong,the problem with the tpu not handling an inductive load was never solved.SM's logic is
since it was proven by the tests at the university on the 6 inch tpu and the 17 inch tpu that they worked then
if he faked the rest of the tpu's you would not believe he faked them.The reason is simple
he never solved the inductive load problem,he can't scale the units down,he doesn't know how they work ,
this was told to Jack Durban in 2008 by SM
"I don't know how it works only that it does".Also note that on the tripplite inverter video he says
he was being pressured by the investor to run ac devices.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 02:08:44
To poynt99
your a smart guy look at the inverter he used figure out how you take an 150 to 180 volt dc voltage and convert it to 120 ac,when the unit is designed to run on 12vdc,prove me wrong...
OK. Something from SM:
QuoteOur problem is that we have a very high voltage of direct current with a variable impedance. I paid an Engineering company to design and make the special inverter you see in the videos.
It was designed to convert the high voltage DC into 120 volt 60 cycle AC that is used by the television set, the drill and the vacuum cleaner as seen in the demonstration videos. Note also that the output of the power unit was very slightly affected by the switch-on of the various electrical appliances in the video.
In the video I have a voltage meter connected directly to the DC output of the power unit and it measures a voltage of about 160 VDC. I then turn on the various 120 volt AC appliances through the inverter and the measured output of the power unit is hardly affected at all. However if you suddenly pull the wire from the power unit leading to the inverter notice that the 160 volt dc output from the power unit jumps up to 300 - 450 volts DC! This is an instability problem that I have never been able to fix.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 02:08:44
Also note that on the tripplite inverter video he says he was being pressured by the investor to run ac devices.
Of course they pressured him, and that makes perfect sense. SM got the inverter developed and they had their AC power.
Anything else?
.99
This "TPU is fake" stuff is getting ridiculous. Next, CP2012 will go into a spiel about how SM was greedy and just wanted more and more money, or that he stole the technology from the US Navy, or Army, or CIA.
Some of the other angles are that the device is unsafe and a hazard to the planet.
Fact of the matter is that most technology is not safe, so keep it away from children. Aternative energy device will not replace oil, but will augment it as an energy source. Billions will still be made from oil. People will live and die. There will still be famine and fighting.
Look at all the plastics around you, the semiconductors in your computer, the clothes you wear. Oil was involved to make and deliver everything. These devices will not replace chemistry or biology. They will not negate the need to eat, or to breath.
Why would someone want us to stop working on the TPU?
To poynt99
This is why you guys go in circles,SM said,SM never lies,As I said before you don't understand trickery.
An ac inverter of this type uses a transformer,with stepup windings 24 volts center tapped at 12 volts to 120 volts,
with transistors for switching driven by a circuit to get true sine wave 60hz output.Explain how you get 150 vdc in and
change it to 120 ac and still use the same circuitry.They must have done it is not an answer or SM said they did it.I've been around awhile in
newsgroups and I know your a smart guy,how did they do it?like poker show your cards.Why is a relay used, probably from radio shack,ha ha,
I know exactly why, but I want hear your answer.
CP2012: You'll have to do better than that...
Notice the issue related to backtorque in a homopolar generator? Take the load off and it ramps up. I doubt this is coincidental. This little issue is caused by the orientation of the fields and the inherent spin of the medium. If you rotate two direction at the same time, this issue goes away.
Little late to try and say it was faked.
QuoteDear Lindsay,
Please do not be disheartened by my last letter to you.
By the way to answer the question about what a potential is? It has to do with the way you use the electron flow. For example: You must have a way for the electrons to flow from a point A to a point B or both depending on your mode of circuit. the potential is the reason the electrons are attracted to point A or B.
Electrons flow through wires all the time but they do not establish any work force.
You must be able to couple the electron flow safely to provide work force. Generally we use alternating current to transmit power great distances. Then we use step down transformers to couple the high current high voltage to provide a useable work force at the end of distribution.
Our problem is that we have a very high voltage of direct current with a variable impendence. I paid an Engineering company to design and make the special inverter you see in the videos.
it was designed to convert the high voltage DC into 120 volt 60 cycle AC that is used by the television set, the drill and the vacuum cleaner as seen in the demonstration videos. Note also that the output of the power unit was very slightly affected by the switch on of the various electrical appliances in the video.
In the video I have a voltage meter connected directly to the DC output of the power unit and it measures a voltage of about 160 VDC. I then turn on the various 120 volt AC appliances through the inverter and the measured output of the power unit is hardly affected at all. However if you suddenly pull the wire from the power unit leading to the inverter notice that the 160 volt dc output from the power unit jumps up to 300 - 450 volts DC! this is an instability problem that I have never been able to fix. In one of the videos you can see one of the 120 volt 100 watt light bulbs explode during a test. The light bulb was connected directly to the DC output of the power unit not to the inverter. Notice also that the voltage rise lasts for many (5) seconds not just a split second as would be the case if a secondary coil was excited and then collapsed. I hope that you can see the correlation between this bit of information and your comment about the similarity of a jet engine turbine. EXACTLY, I call it the inertia factor. Basically for lack of another term, however you see what I am getting at here.
Sincerely,
SM
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 04:01:21
To poynt99
This is why you guys go in circles,SM said,SM never lies,As I said before you don't understand trickery.
An ac inverter of this type uses a transformer,with stepup windings 24 volts center tapped at 12 volts to 120 volts,
with transistors for switching driven by a circuit to get true sine wave 60hz output.Explain how you get 150 vdc in and
change it to 120 ac and still use the same circuitry.They must have done it is not an answer or SM said they did it.I've been around awhile in
newsgroups and I know your a smart guy,how did they do it?like poker show your cards.Why is a relay used, probably from radio shack,ha ha,
I know exactly why, but I want hear your answer.
Don't generalize, If you read this thread carefully I stated that a lot of SM / Lindsay communications may not be real, so I take it all as just information, some of which goes in the disinfo folder.
Also, I and others have considered many angles on how the TPU's could be faked, including the inverter issue, and the use of the relay and it's purpose.
One possibility is that the relay was used as a pilot device to turn on a bank of batteries hidden in the inverter. It utilized a small command signal from the TPU. Same for the big lamps, which could have had batteries in their bases and a relay for activation from a smaller pilot signal.
All of the devices shown in the UEC video would work on DC as well as AC including the TV. Brush motors are used in drills and vacuum cleaners and are AC / DC. In this regard, the inverter may have been a ruse, not necessary at all, and the large transformer hollowed out for batteries
I have also done battery Joule analysis and yes, some of the TPU's could be faked using internal batteries and a boost converter.
Unless the SM17 had a lot of high capacity batteries hidden in it's core, it would be difficult but not impossible to fake.
Remember that the SM15 was actually working before it was cut into pieces for handout. Of course one might claim the batteries were hidden in the small box in the center.
There is much trickery in the world, however there are a few pieces of this puzzle that don't have satisfactory explanations.
e.g. read Dr. Schinzinger's reports and his letters carefully. These are written by a person of high professional caliber, the wording, the phrasing is not SM or Lindsay who often misspelled and were definitely not professional writers.
I might add that Dr. Schinzinger was a mentor to the electric vehicle club at UCI. He knew a lot about battery energy densities, and he can be identified in the videos.
Don't think for a minute we are all a bunch of dummies that have not done our due diligence on this issue.
If you'd care to be more civil and less condescending, maybe we can work together to solve the remaining mysteries.
So I've raised you and called you, put up and show your cards.
To Ion
I'm very aware of the Dr. Schinzinger's reports I believe that was done because
the investor didn't trust SM and wanted a serious evaluation.
I have worked on SM stuff since Jack Durban was on overunity.com
the thing that worked for me was what,Jack Durban said of SM,"he lies even when he doesn't need to".
I concluded that everything SM said is a half truth, flat out lie or a depiction of something that he discovered,but twisted.
SM has been and is on these news groups,to confuse and misdirect,I believe it has something to do with the deal
with the company he sold the rights to(now this my theory)anyone figures out how it works and bulids it
he loses hes income or possibly gets killed,its unknown what deal he did or if the military is involved.
I don't trust our US government,your right the videos are the key to making this device,however SM threw
in things to confuse the engineers that the investors brought in.On the inverter video,think simple,in the inverter video
the simplest way is hollow out the big transformer,use a 12 volt sealed lead acid battery,use a small inverter(was sold at radio shack at that time,225 watts continuous,over 300 watts,5 min)
pop out the on/off switch of the inverter,use a dpdt ac relay from (radio shack]wire the switch to the relay,check which connections turn on the inverter.
Now wire the coil connections to the triplitt inverter input connections then your set to go,I would wire the battery to some hidden wires to recharge the battery.
When you apply a hv dc voltage to the relay, the relay will turn on the inverter the inverter will power up the drill,vacuum and
tv The illusion is the tpu powered the tv,vacuum,drill.The 6 inch tpu used is real,it powering the appliances is not.
There was a constant flow of investors ,with engineers
they would bring in there own light bulbs, meters,and looked at all angles of fraud.An investor will not give you a penny
there greedy bastards if it didn't work, this fact is absolute proof that the 17 inch tpu worked in my book,the investors were big players.
Heres something for you,you know in the video with the
17 inch tpu when he measures
the current and everybody says he didn't measure the current correctly,hes not measuring
a dc current but a pulsing dc magnetic field across the back part of the tpu,across the opening,The meter can detect a
10hz to 10khz pulsing dc magnetic field,I made a coil in a circle with an opening the coil is driven by a signal generator
fed to a power amp of 400 watts,I measured with an iron core and without an iron core.With an iron core i
got readings from the meter the same amount as on the video,without a core nothing or very little.I went from 10hz to 10khz on the frequency,
I set the meter exactly as the tpu video,the meter at this dc setting does not react to ac magnetic fields,tried that know for sure.
Theres a good chance that the tpu has a iron or ferrite core,the vibration reported is most likely in the range of 10hz to 400hz.
As you pass 400hz the vibration slowly disappears.The tpu is very hard to figure out so every small clue helps.
Hi CP2012
I am, for the most part in agreement with you, the TPU is simpler than everyone makes it out to be and SM or whoever was impersonating SM has a job and was getting paid to keep it complicated and obfuscated.
Sorry if I came on a little harsh, it is part of a vetting process, I haven't got time to waste with people that haven't done their homework (the Quick Draw McGraw's). But you apparently seem to have thought this out.
We may not be in complete agreement on all issues, but I would like to keep the conversation going, see what we could uncover.
I want you to consider something, the transformer used in the inverter. That looks to me like a Topaz or Xentek isolation transformer, notice the plug on the side. This is not common in Tripp Lite inverters (to my knowledge) plus it is way too tall, the lid would never fit on. Add to that, their is no noticeable mounting for a transformer that size, which is quite a bit larger than the standard transformer, which has angled mounting brackets. Consider also the rather large long core, typical of isolation transformers.
So if you took a off the shelf isolation transformer that had dual primaries for 120 / 240 connection and replaced the standard open frame transformer normally found in these inverters, the voltage transformation ratio would make sense. The lid was off the inverter for several reasons, but mostly because it wouldn't fit with the new larger transformer.
I could add some details about the modification to the inverter SM spoke of because modifications would be necessary, but I'll save that for later.
I'm still researching this and have found a couple of Tripp Lite inverters of similar vintage, I will be popping the covers to check it out when I get them.
Most inverters that I have worked on use open frame transformers, no need for the nice painted white end shells, let alone the plug and outlet on the inside of the unit on the end shell., this just adds cost, and these devices are in a very competitive market, cost is paramount.
The form factor and style of the open frame transformer (attached) is more typical of what you find in inverters.
BTW. the illusion you described first occurred to me back in 2006 after first seeing the video's and considering various scenarios. One thing I can say for sure, it is not RF from a hidden transmitter, trust me on that one.
Attached are some snaps of the inverter.
So, all BS and disinfo aside, we seem to agree that SM had working devices, even if not all of them were presented factually.
Any tricks or subterfuge just serves to detract us from the working units.
How did the working devices work?
Sorry to interject here but one question.
In the UEC video when he shows the 6" tpu, he says "this is a new device just built". I am curious as to why he kept making new 6" devices. Are they throw away devices? Make one , use it up then discard it?
If the 6" TPU was produce 186 vdc at 5000hz, is there not a way to transfer that to AC via a H-bridge. Those ribs on the right hand of the inverter transformer could be heat sinks for some mosfets.
Maybe one major thing about Doc. S. From his letter to SM where he mentions another person in his faculty and himself think that they can work out the heat problems, this implies that the Doc was more vested in this then we would think. I would not be surprised that SM played the "put the carrot in front of the rabbit trick" to make the Doc feel sort of implicated in any future advancement. I think SM played him good and because of that, I cannot consider this report as truly objective. The Doc was sold on the idea even before his last report.
In the report where the guy equates the TPU to batteries required to do the same thing, there is no mention of the 5000hz. Why?
Here are some other questions.
1) The dimensions of the 6TPU-A (the -A is because it is the second unit of this type SM showed.) permits 22 x 9vdc batteries to be fitted inside of it would give 198vdc. I don't have a small weight scale to measure the weight of one 9vdc battery to see if 12 ounces fits.
2) If you take 22 of such batteries, put them is series, then put it through a mosfet that pulses this into a bulb load at 5000hz, how long will the batteries last?
3) If you take 22 of such batteries, put them in 2 groups of 11 batteries is series, then both in parallel to increase amperage, then put it through a mosfet that pulses this into a bulb load at 5000hz, what will the voltage output show and how long will the batteries last?
4) He measured 186 vdc without load and once the inverter was connected and the TV running he measured 171 vdc off the 6TPU-A. In Doc S's first report he talks about starting voltages unloaded and loaded that where lower and that had spreads much higher then this TPU. Why? Maybe because the batteries were not used up as much in the video?
Anyways, whatever, we will never really know so what is the point. Guys are still better off working on new devices with new ideas and not try to wean this any further because in all logical perspective, it is a dead end.
I am putting some images below that are better quality.
How would this work with a working TPU cut apart with a saw? I didn't see any batteries inside it. I suppose it could be a trick too.
Don't fall into the trap. There will always be people that want us to believe that the TPU was faked.
Wattsup
You have done a lot of research on the TPU, which I respect. I hold differing opinions in some areas. We can agree to disagree and remain gentlemen.
I will try to answer some of these questions, and I'm sure others will have differing answers.
QuoteIn the UEC video when he shows the 6" tpu, he says "this is a new device just built". I am curious as to why he kept making new 6" devices. Are they throw away devices? Make one , use it up then discard it?
[/b]
We have no way of telling the time sequence of any of the videos as the time stamp may be in error or perhaps SM had made a more perfect model that would have better load regulation. I don't think he threw anything away, just ongoing search for perfection.
QuoteIf the 6" TPU was produce 186 vdc at 5000hz, is there not a way to transfer that to AC via a H-bridge. Those ribs on the right hand of the inverter transformer could be heat sinks for some mosfets.
[/b]
If there was some kind of boost converter running at 5 kHz with a little filtering it would be as SM said mostly DC with some 5kHz hash riding on top of the DC. for the most part the noise component is not usable for and not the appreciable part of the power delivered. Many are confused on this AC /DC issue. Yes those ribs are the heatsink for some mosfets used in Tripp Lite"s inverter circuit. I have one of those assemblies.
QuoteMaybe one major thing about Doc. S. From his letter to SM where he mentions another person in his faculty and himself think that they can work out the heat problems, this implies that the Doc was more vested in this then we would think. I would not be surprised that SM played the "put the carrot in front of the rabbit trick" to make the Doc feel sort of implicated in any future advancement. I think SM played him good and because of that, I cannot consider this report as truly objective. The Doc was sold on the idea even before his last report.
[/b]
I don't think the good Dr. could have been played by SM. He was much older and considering his background, he was well traveled, well written and an extremely educated and probably very wise man. Give him some credit. When you get to be 80 a man in his position has seen an awful lot. I read his reports and letters and see his wisdom shining in these so I respectfully disagree on this issue. What would you consider truly objective?
QuoteIn the report where the guy equates the TPU to batteries required to do the same thing, there is no mention of the 5000hz. Why?
[/b]
Next time you get a chance, hook up your scope to the output of your computer power supply. You will notice some hash riding on top of the DC. If you zoom in you will find that it is switching noise from the mosfets and inductors. It is as SM said, inconsequential as far as energy content, even though a lot of it was smoothed before your scope. This 5000Hz thing has to be put in perspective. It is not the major output of the TPU, just some noise squeaking through on top of the DC.
Thank you for the research you have done regarding the 9 volt batteries, although I seriously doubt he used those, as their internal impedance is too high and their load regulation would have been far worse than what is seen in the video. To support this kind of loading would require more robust cells and a boost converter.
I will do some additional research regarding questions 1-4 and report back. I will say for now. that different chemistry 9 volt batteries have differing weights and power densities. Are we talking Zinc-Carbon, Alkaline or rechargeable NiCd? Internal impedance of each type differs and will affect regulation or sag under load.
QuoteAnyways, whatever, we will never really know so what is the point. Guys are still better off working on new devices with new ideas and not try to wean this any further because in all logical perspective, it is a dead end.
What is the point of anything? I for one enjoy a good detective story, in this case, I put on my best detective hat and have a fun go at it. The story is intriguing to me, and I like to investigate in between more serious work as a relaxation. It may be a dead end for you, but I enjoy peeling the layers of this mystery. As POYNT said if it is not your cup of tea, don't read this thread.
I also enjoy watching the balance scales tip one way or the other as more evidence unfolds. How will it turn out?...."It is a Mystery", but new evidence alters the course one might take in their "builds".
BTW, an old B&W movie entitled "12 angry men" teaches us not to solidify our opinions too quickly.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.11.08, 19:36:04
Don't fall into the trap. There will always be people that want us to believe that the TPU was faked.
I try to keep a middle of the road "still under investigation" attitude.
I had prepared a rebuttal but again what's the point. Better to just say I am sorry to have wasted all your time and move on too other things.
I always saw the TPU as a ring configured output stage of the stun gun type circuit. Having put one together with many rings and driving with a stun gun I saw where the invertor could be a fourth stage for interfacing to the standard power connection. So the ring configuration is a tesla coil and the stun gun is the primary spark gap. The ring is a multi stage or tiered Tesla coil. We fire the outer winding while reading the inner winding. The outer winding is fed back into the core/collector which creates a resonant or high speed magnetic core. This is what Otto's configuration of the GK4 showed me. It is mobiusly wound.
So we stungun the outer 16awg winding which it's other connection end is connected to the core. That core is connected to the secondary 30awg winding.
The three layers are configured as 3 squat Tesla coils all feeding the other while on a horizontal plane within each layer the segments are configured as sequentially driven Tesla coils. Think about this. Tesla coils driving Tesla coils with feedback Tesla coils. The GK4 is 4 per layer of 3 layers which is 12. But with Otto's configuration this number is greater as even the whole configuration is mobius'd.
This is my view and anybody that understands the mobius Tesla coils has never given argument. Even anybody that newly comes on board or is shown this device is amazed that there would be any thinking along the lines of taking one of Tesla's patent, building it ,3 times over, then another person comes along and says connect all the layers up in a bucking fashoin as the same a each layer itself as done in the patent.
The most bizarre thing I realized the other day is that the 4 segments in each layer are connected with a swastika type diagram and Otto comes from the Germanic tribe. All I did was to take a single Tesla patent, copy it 3 times by SMs description, then wire per Otto. Now I have this Rubik's ball of Tesla coils in a handheld unit. Any TPU coil wound is a multiple Tesla coil configuration. One hellava transformer.
I am still in awe of all the minds coming together at one point on a build...
I still think about hooking the GK4 up again. But not in the house. I know what this device is per Tesla, SM and Otto. But the final process is much more than that.
You should see the strange looks from other people that know transformers and the wonderous looks from people that know electronics ad Tesla coils.
In the bucking configuration this thing is a an EMP ball.
Hope this helps.
It's an enigma, that's for sure.
You gents can believe whatever you want. There are answers that are not found on the internet or forums. Some explanations for things are not correct even though they sound good. Instinct and gut feel can be deceiving. It comes down to "you" the individual and what "you" want.
I'll add that if you take the time to compare all "real" purported OU devices, every hint SM gave, and everything Spherics provided, all the info on the Hendershot Generator, cross-reference and look everything up, you will come to one conclusion:
Ether vortices are real and allow you to connect to the wheelwork of nature. By this I mean that the perpetual spin of the ether particles can be used to create useful electricity to power devices to do work in excess of the work required to harness this spin property of ether.
Whether or not the TPU is "real" is no longer relevant.
Here's a little something to munch on, based on Wattsup's estimate that 22 x 9 volt batteries would fit in the 6" TPU. Notice that the weight of the batteries alone would be 2.2 lbs, not including wire, housing and tape. (the device was estimated at 8 to 12 oz.)
Also 37.4 Watts would be dissipated by the batteries internal resistance alone or roughly 23% of what might have been delivered to the load is wasted power. The tape would have melted off the unit in short order.
Zinc carbon cells while a bit lighter, could never deliver 1 amp to a load as their internal resistance is substantially higher.
NiCd 9 Volt rechargeables are quite a bit heavier otherwise would be a good fit.
I used a loop current of one amp which is probably very close to the draw of the lamp since at 120 volts the current for a 100 Watt lamp is 0.83 amps..
I've been following the TPU saga for a long time. Did the TPU lamp load actually draw the full 0.83A?? I have tested mains lamps at various voltages and its surprising at how low the voltage and current can fall before the lumen level drops noticeably. Add to this that camera shots of illuminated lamps, can give a very misleading idea of power being consumed and we are left IMO with a distinct possibility that a ring of 9V NICAD batteries could have been used to illuminate the lamp at considerably less current. Given that the voltage on load was 171V running the TV. Could he have used a 240V, 100W lamp drawing 0.41A max and even less at 170V? ECW wire wound around and silicon compounded to the battery cases, could double as an oscillator coil and heatsink to keep the temperature from melting the tape for at least the duration of the demo.
Hoppy
Quote from: ION on 2010.11.09, 05:09:17
Here's a little something to munch on, based on Wattsup's estimate that 22 x 9 volt batteries would fir in the 6" TPU. Notice that the weight of the batteries alone would be 2.2 lbs, not including wire, housing and tape.
Also 37.4 Watts would be dissipated by the batteries internal resistance alone or roughly 23% of what might have been delivered to the load is wasted power. The tape would have melted off the unit in short order.
Zinc carbon cells while a bit lighter, could never deliver 1 amp to a load as their internal resistance is substantially higher.
NiCd 9 Volt rechargeables are quite a bit heavier otherwise would be a good fit.
I used a loop current of one amp which is probably very close to the draw of the lamp since at 120 volts the current for a 100 Watt lamp is 0.83 amps..
To ION
Good analysing of the tripplite inverter,never thought
about why the cover was off,thought that might be a gimmick
to fool the investors or that it might not be the original transformer.
With dual windings it is possible to build a an inverter of 180 v dc to 120 vac
however it would require massive changes to the circuits in the tripplite inverter however its possible.
To me the simplest answer is the correct answer bigger transformer
bigger area to hide an inverter and sealed acid battery,
When jack durban left working for SM he stated that SM had not solved a problem that
the tpu had with an inductive load.I disagree with you on the tripplite inverter being a working modified unit
to change hv vdc to 120 ac,but I want to hear your idea.It would be far easier to modify a
standard ac inverter,an 800 watt unit was sold at radio shack at the time.
Then theres the issue of the relay what purpose does the relay have?
The modifications could have been hard wired no need at all for a relay.
Good points on the 6 inch tpu not being a set of batteries,however its possible
wattsup is right on the real small tpu.
Energy capacity says it all
Typical NiMh PP3 150mAh x 22 =3.3AH
P=IxV = 3.3 x 9 = 29.7 Wh ;D
Quote from: Hoppy on 2010.11.09, 10:40:49
I've been following the TPU saga for a long time. Did the TPU lamp load actually draw the full 0.83A?? I have tested mains lamps at various voltages and its surprising at how low the voltage and current can fall before the lumen level drops noticeably. Add to this that camera shots of illuminated lamps, can give a very misleading idea of power being consumed and we are left IMO with a distinct possibility that a ring of 9V NICAD batteries could have been used to illuminate the lamp at considerably less current. Given that the voltage on load was 171V running the TV. Could he have used a 240V, 100W lamp drawing 0.41A max and even less at 170V? ECW wire wound around and silicon compounded to the battery cases, could double as an oscillator coil and heatsink to keep the temperature from melting the tape for at least the duration of the demo.
Hoppy
I agree Hoppy, there is much we do not know about the luminous intensity and it is possible to create many scenario's around these devices.
My opinion is that I'm on the fence, as this could go either way depending on the evidence one relies on.
For example, using the video's alone, a hidden battery scenario can be believable. Add the Schinzinger lab report , then the hidden battery theory has very low probability.
If there is truth in the Schinzinger lab report a different scenario emerges as Dr. Schinzinger was intelligent enough to measure luminosity.
Additionally, in one report, Dr. Schinzinger was very smart to double the load and measure the voltage, as this speaks volumes about the impedance of the voltage source , and would have been a dead giveaway if batteries alone were used.
With batteries and a boost converter having feedback regulation, another quite different yet believable scenario emerges.
It would be interesting to calculate the required inductance for a boost or push pull converter running at 5 kHz with an approximately one amp load.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.09, 11:00:47
To ION
Good analysing of the tripplite inverter,never thought
about why the cover was off,thought that might be a gimmick
to fool the investors or that it might not be the original transformer.
With dual windings it is possible to build a an inverter of 180 v dc to 120 vac
however it would require massive changes to the circuits in the tripplite inverter however its possible.
To me the simplest answer is the correct answer bigger transformer
bigger area to hide an inverter and sealed acid battery,
When jack durban left working for SM he stated that SM had not solved a problem that
the tpu had with an inductive load.I disagree with you on the tripplite inverter being a working modified unit
to change hv vdc to 120 ac,but I want to hear your idea.It would be far easier to modify a
standard ac inverter,an 800 watt unit was sold at radio shack at the time.
Then theres the issue of the relay what purpose does the relay have?
The modifications could have been hard wired no need at all for a relay.
Good points on the 6 inch tpu not being a set of batteries,however its possible
wattsup is right on the real small tpu.
Thanks for taking a look at what I have posted.
Bear in mind that I do not subscribe to one theory alone, but several, each having a different probability so when you say:
Quote"I disagree with you on the tripplite inverter being a working modified unit
to change hv vdc to 120 ac"
You are believing that my ideas on this are cast in stone, which they are not. It is not proper scientific method to discard all possibilities, one should entertain all possibilities and assign probabilities to each scenario.
Yes, I agree, it would require large changes to modify a Tripp Lite for 170 VDC. I would like to get a schematic of the inverter we see in the videos and take a crack at converting it myself. Anybody have one?
The inductive load driving and the overheating problems are red herrings and in way a distraction and detract from this discovery, providing the discovery itself is real. I'm sure I could solve both those problems in short order. Getting people focusing on this aspect takes them off the main road, but should be kept as information to be tagged.
I believe Jack Durban is always telling the truth as much as I believe the same for SM.....in other words, I don't. I listened to Jack Durban's interview with an ear to careful analysis, I'm sorry it doesn't impress me.
Especially laughable is phone message from SM to Jack Durban. I played it for many people without biasing them beforehand, and they all said "contrived"
But I try to keep an open mind on all this, just collecting information.
I would like to understand why you believe modifying the Radio Shack inverter would be any easier than the Tripp-Lite.
Has anyone done voice stress analysis on SM in the videos?
Thanks for taking interest.
Quote from: Peterae on 2010.11.09, 11:11:20
Energy capacity says it all
Typical NiMh PP3 150mAh x 22 =3.3AH
P=IxV = 3.3 x 9 = 29.7 Wh ;D
That's right Peterae, 29.7 Watts for one hour
or 59.4 Watts for 30 minutes
or 118.8 Watts for 15 minutes.
Another factor is to take a look at the voltage fall off for various battery chemistry types vs. loads. The figures are published.
To ION
Heres some pictures of a 75 watt inverter changed to use a hv dc input.
The only thing you have to worry about is supplying 12 vdc to the input.
The switching power supply portion is disabled,I cut the trace from the 12 v supply,you
have to provide a 12 vdc supply,you can
do that in a whole bunch of ways i just throw this together.The 12 vdc controls
the over voltage /under voltage,this disables the output ac as long as the input
is close to 12 vdc your good to go.The hv dc voltage comes from an isolation transformer
hooked to a variable transformer,going thru a bridge rectifier,filtered by a few capacitors.
It should be possible to do the same to much bigger inverters 400 watts and higher,have not
not done it but it should be possible,might have to play with it for awhile.
The real issue is this,is there a problem with the tpu not being able to handle an
inductive load or not
,I agree that the tpu doesn't have a heat problem ,I disagree that it doesn't have
a problem with inductive loads.
There are no videos of it driving an inductive load,with out the triplite inverter.
The doctor at the university never tried an inductive load
why is that, only resistive loads,light bulbs.If it doesn't have a problem with
inductive loads then the modified triplite inverter is real,if it has a problem its a fake.
I think the output is a pulsing dc voltage not a dc voltage with a hash at 5khz but a pulsing dc at 100 hz to 400 hz,note
that there are no readings involving an oscilloscope so its a hard question to get a true answer.Jack Durban had hes own agenda
so its not certain what he said was totally truthfull.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.10, 10:57:09
To ION
Heres some pictures of a 75 watt inverter changed to use a hv dc input.
The only thing you have to worry about is supplying 12 vdc to the input.
The switching power supply portion is disabled,I cut the trace from the 12 v supply,you
have to provide a 12 vdc supply,you can
do that in a whole bunch of ways i just throw this together.The 12 vdc controls
the over voltage /under voltage,this disables the output ac as long as the input
is close to 12 vdc your good to go.The hv dc voltage comes from an isolation transformer
hooked to a variable transformer,going thru a bridge rectifier,filtered by a few capacitors.
It should be possible to do the same to much bigger inverters 400 watts and higher,have not
not done it but it should be possible,might have to play with it for awhile.
The real issue is this,is there a problem with the tpu not being able to handle an
inductive load or not
,I agree that the tpu doesn't have a heat problem ,I disagree that it doesn't have
a problem with inductive loads.
There are no videos of it driving an inductive load,with out the triplite inverter.
The doctor at the university never tried an inductive load
why is that, only resistive loads,light bulbs.If it doesn't have a problem with
inductive loads then the modified triplite inverter is real,if it has a problem its a fake.
I think the output is a pulsing dc voltage not a dc voltage with a hash at 5khz but a pulsing dc at 100 hz to 400 hz,note
that there are no readings involving an oscilloscope so its a hard question to get a true answer.Jack Durban had hes own agenda
so its not certain what he said was totally truthfull.
Good job on the inverter modification. Remember SM said there were some resistors as part of the inverter modification. These were probably a dropping resistor divider, soaking up a bit of the headroom of the 170 Volts before going into a three terminal 78_12 series regulator to power the control circuit in the inverter. This is common industry practice for regulators of this type that must be operated above their maximum voltage rating.
As for the inductive load "problem", where is the problem? There are many facets to this. I specialized in circuits to drive inductive loads as part of my livelihood. Most "purely" inductive loads driven from an AC source are reactive and can't absorb energy.
Inductive loads driven from a DC source is another issue...why would you want to do it? Of course you can't drive a transformer or induction motor from a DC source unless it is chopped. There are synchronous drives and inverters for those applications.
I'd be quite happy with a unit that drives only resistive loads. I can handle the rest.
QuoteThe doctor at the university never tried an inductive load
why is that, only resistive loads,light bulbs.
That's because it would be quite foolish to do so. The inductive load (iron core) would probably saturate on a DC source and tell you nothing about power unless you hooked up a scope, a current probe, and were able to carefully record the "current ramp up to saturation time". You would also need to record the applied voltage and take all of this into account to compute power.
With a light bulb "What you see is what you get"...... very simple, and that is the proof of the pudding, especially when time is a constraint. The doc had the good sense to take comparative light meter readings, not relying on his own subjective eye measurement. In this case the light meter is the "seeing" and can be related directly to power by doing a "control", which he did. Also doubling the load and recording voltage drop tells a lot about output impedance, so that it could be compared to a batteries impedance.
QuoteIf it doesn't have a problem with
inductive loads then the modified triplite inverter is real,if it has a problem its a fake.
This statement does not make sense. When you drive a transformer that has a resistive load on it's secondary, the primary does not any longer appear inductive. It reflects the resistive load to the primary thus the primary impedance is predominately resistive, less any leakage inductance, which can be minimal in a well designed transformer. This holds true even if the transformer is part of an inverter circuit.
Talk of an "inductive load driving problem" is probably diversionary and only important if it can tell you something useful about building the device itself.
I agree with you on this point, Jack Durban had his own agenda, we can surmise what that was.
Keep it coming
TO ION
If the output of the tpu is clean or can be filtered it is possible to use an
inverter to change it from hv dc to 120 ac.The fact he changed the transformer in the triplite
inverter says really nothing it could be to use higher voltage windings or to be able to
hide a battery and a small inverter,its a draw.In a letter the doctor mentions something
that the tpu stops working near a transformer,heres that letter.What is the purpose in your opinion,
of the relay in the modified triplite inverter.
Have you seen this alleged letter sent to SM from the doctor:
This is a copy of a letter I received from Dr. Schinzinger during our
period of correspondence. It is probably around 1995 or so.
Roland Schinzinger
Ph.D.
29 Gilman St. Irvine, CA 92715-2703, Phone & FAX: (714) 786-7691
Dear Steven,
Thank you for your kind words of sympathy regarding my loss. We both share similar feelings.
In your letter you asked my opinion: I think it is a miracle that your device works.
Exactly how it converts energy is elusive to both of us at this time. That does not
mean we shouldn't apply ourselves to know for sure. My offer to work with you still
stands. I understand your difficulties with the gentlemen you work for and I will not
take your decision personally. I will be glad to talk to you and help you all I can.
My offer to work on the project was made with the greatest respect and not as some
kind of justification to the Foremost Corporation. I told them that from what I could
see of your units they did supply substantial amounts of both voltage and current. I
told them I could not give any indication of the value of the discovery without
knowing more about it. I did recommend that they invest necessary funds to continue
working on the discovery and that I was interested in working with you. That is about
all I said to them on the subject. Anything you may have heard to the contrary is not true.
To further our discussion, the reason you can not use small transformers within or at
close proximity to your unit is because of the leakage fields of magnetic flux. They
induce currents into nearby circuitry and most likely cause frequency changes in the
operating point of the control unit. Remember when you inject even a small frequency
component into sensitive frequency dependant equipment you can have a disaster. That
is exactly what I believe is occurring when you try to use a transformer close to your
units. There will be all kinds of harmonics present within this field extending past
the radio frequency range. If I were to compare the two I would say that toroidal
transformers would be more susceptible. This may be contrary to common thought.
Toroidal transformers have all their flux aligned with the grain of the steel used
in them. This is the reason for their reduced size as compared with E I cores. When
operated at higher flux density you can permit a smaller core. Toroids will always
saturate quickly, however, E I transformers ramp up to saturation levels slowly. If
anything, I would suggest you work with E I rather then Toroids. In either case I
believe you will find that you will have to place the inverter well outside the collector
coils.
You may also leave a message for me at my office at the University of California Irvine.
Sincerely,
Roland
==============================================
cheapower2012:
I'll try to answer your questions and statements in the order posted.
QuoteIf the output of the tpu is clean or can be filtered it is possible to use an
inverter to change it from hv dc to 120 ac.
We agree here. It is my belief that the DC output was fairly clean with just a little hash and ripple on the output.
If there was appreciable noise, it would have caused the inverter to malfunction, as inverters are not that well filtered and generally rely on the clean output of a sealed lead acid battery (SLA). Of course he may have included extra filtering in the modification.
QuoteThe fact he changed the transformer in the triplite
inverter says really nothing it could be to use higher voltage windings or to be able to
hide a battery and a small inverter, its a draw.
Agreed again, this could go either way. It's just information to put in the flowchart.
QuoteWhat is the purpose in your opinion, of the relay in the modified triplite inverter.
Don't get too hung up on the relay, just about all of the older high power inverters have one or more high current relays. In some cases the relay is activated from the microcomputer control board. A light duty power-on switch on the front panel initiates the start-up and allows high current power to flow to the inverter section only after a fault diagnostic check says OK.
Haven't counted lately but I've got a large section of my basement filled with inverters of all kinds from a few hundred watts to 5 kilowatts. They all have high current relays that are activated by the power on switch of the device.
Hoping when I get the TPU (or equivalent) working I can use these to build power packs of all sizes with a clean AC output. Some of my inverters are resonant types with clean low distortion sine wave output.
Regarding Dr. Schinzingers letter:
QuoteTo further our discussion, the reason you can not use small transformers within or at
close proximity to your unit is because of the leakage fields of magnetic flux. They
induce currents into nearby circuitry and most likely cause frequency changes in the
operating point of the control unit.
This teaches us that there was no ferrite or tapewound core inside the TPU or all of the B field would have been entrained into the metal core, and the unit would not be sensitive to external ferromagnetic materials as an air core would. This is a large clue, yet people are still discussing the possibility of a ferromagnetic core???
Think about a metal locater: it is an air core search coil and is sensitive to external ferromagnetic objects which change the frequency of the oscillator tuned circuit, of which the coil is the main component. The search oscillator is heterodyned against another shielded oscillator BFO to produce a close to zero beat frequency. any nearby metallic object detunes the search coil, lowering it's frequency and producing an audible beat note.
QuoteThere will be all kinds of harmonics present within this field extending past
the radio frequency range.
A Theramin also works on high frequency, a few hundred kilohertz. With heterodyning, beat notes are produced in the audible range and this device, while mainly relying on capacitive detuning, would also be affected by ferromagnetic objects in it's vicinity.
QuoteIf I were to compare the two I would say that toroidal
transformers would be more susceptible. This may be contrary to common thought.
Toroidal transformers have all their flux aligned with the grain of the steel used
in them. This is the reason for their reduced size as compared with E I cores.
The first statement is counter intuitive to me. I would think ferromagnetic cored toroidal transformers would be less, not more susceptible to radiated fields.Not too clear what the doc is trying to say here. For a given power rating, reduced size means less magnetic fringing, a magnetically tight structure, no leaks.
QuoteToroids will always saturate quickly, however, E I transformers ramp up to saturation levels slowly. If
anything, I would suggest you work with E I rather then Toroids. In either case I
believe you will find that you will have to place the inverter well outside the collector
coils.
What the doc says here is generally correct, but there are many exception based on selection of core materials etc e.g. it is possible to cast a ferromagnetic toroidal core with materials that allow slower saturation.
Note also that there are several types of E-I construction, e.g. non-interleaved, interleaved, gapped middle leg, non-linear gapped middle leg, adjustable gap and combinations of all this and there are more variations. Each has a specific application.
Of course if SM places ferromagnetic materials inside the collector coils, it will cause a certain amount of detuning and SM would have to go through a retuning process. It is also possible that the ferromagnetic material would distort the fields and make the unit inoperable or only partially operable.
Just wondering what inverter he was referring to in this sentence?.
Attached is a photo of a Stancor isolation transformer, a little larger capacity than the one in SM's inverter.
Replying to my own post...is this thread dead already?
OK, I've watched the UEC branded videos again, where SM is only with the cameraman, no other persons seen. These are available in three parts on youtube, though I could only find parts one and two.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MYVmtF4JYg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_jJExZ1mBE&feature=related
I've checked out the Dirt Devil vacuum cleaner that he plugs into the inverter. Several models were made with 2, 3, 4, and 5 amp current draw.
I measured a Model #500 at 204 Watts power draw. 1.7 amps, which looks exactly like the one in the video.
I have a drill like the one shown in the video's which unloaded is 178 Watts at 1.48 amps, although the label says 3 amps, probably loaded.
So although SM is exaggerating just a bit here, I believe his presentation is generally truthful and reflects the attitude of someone who just wants to document his discovery. Maybe I'm naive, but the audio, video, and body language contain a lot of positive cues.
On another note:
Look closely at the voltage drop on the device....171 volts initially to 169.2 volts after 20 minutes operation. This is more an indication of copper's positive TCR (temperature coefficient of resistance) from heating than battery drain, as I cannot find batteries that would fit in that unit and produce such small drop after 20 minutes with a load of approximately one amp, let alone meet the 12 0z. weight requirement.
Of course there are many ways to debunk this....a rigged meter....no real load on the device, just used as a pilot turn-on for hidden batteries etc......but I don't need to go there as I can entertain "fakery" as a guest forever if I choose.
Nice work ION.
Is there anything more that can be said to convince the doubters I wonder? Do they need convincing?
Just a thought, but perhaps one could apply the same reasoning behind foregoing the effort in pointing out erroneous claims, to foregoing the effort in convincing the doubters? Is our time better spent pursuing some thoughts and experiments towards our goals maybe?
Not trying to kill this thread, just offering something to think about.
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.11.20, 15:34:30
Nice work ION.
Is there anything more that can be said to convince the doubters I wonder? Do they need convincing?
Just a thought, but perhaps one could apply the same reasoning behind foregoing the effort in pointing out erroneous claims, to foregoing the effort in convincing the doubters? Is our time better spent pursuing some thoughts and experiments towards our goals maybe?
Not trying to kill this thread, just offering something to think about.
.99
I agree, and am working multiple paths. The point of this thread was to reinforce my own beliefs with rigorous analysis in the hope that others see this and join in.
My last post here should help reinforce the belief that it is genuine. From there we can get the best minds here to get on board, pull our heads together and make forward progress.
That is evolving as it is supposed to in other threads.
I will thoughtfully consider your input on this.
There is a method to my seeming madness! LOL
The first time I saw the TPU videos 3 years ago I wondered what the linear piece inside what I considered the control toroids could be.
My first though was that the purpose was to insulate the two coils, one on each half of the toroid. But that I quickly discarded.
The mystery has then been at rest for me since.
Some weeks ago I participated in the Kapanadze tread at overunity.com.
LtBolo mentioned a paper which we both misunderstood at that time. We thought that applying a radial electric field to the MnZn ferrite changed the magnetic permeability. None could confirm this by experimentation.
I also took a look at the paper and recognized we had misunderstood the paper, but still it was unclear to me how it worked, until yesterday.
Today I checked it again and did a very simple experiment.
I took a MnZn toroid T30 material with some 20 windings on one half of the core. I connected my LC meter and read the inductance.
By applying pressure to make the toroid "oval" without breaking (crushing) it, the inductance decreased.
So the "linear piece" in the control toroids are probably a piezo electric material. By applying a voltage to the side of the piezo crystal, it gets longer, the core gets oval and the inductance decreases.
When the coil are part of a tank circuit, the frequency increases. A passive voltage to frequency converter.
I see this as a very clever way to control the frequencies to the TPU, as the piezo crystal consumes next to no energy to control the frequency. It also makes the control circuits much more simple,
Please take a look at the attached document, what do you think ?
Eric
Eric,
See Magnetostriction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetostriction)
.99
To All
Heres a set of experiments this relates to what the meter in the tpu video is reading,I labelled the pictures 1 thru 7 just look at them in sequence.This is for general information.I have been very busy lately,holidays.I will post another part on pulsing magnetic fields and ac fields as soon as i have a chance.Note: the gap on my experiments is not exactly the same as the tpu,it was done so you can get the point more clearly,this has been done with coils with gaps like the video,same results,with static magnetic fields same results.The meter in the video is not reading a current but a magnetic field
produced by a current,there is a limitation with this meter as too how far you can figure out the nature of the magnetic field(ac,pulsing dc,static) and the vibration rate.
.
Good detective work CP2012!
Couple of questions...black tape on your meter seems to be masking the mfr. model.#...??
Do you know exactly what model was used in the video's?
Sure looks the same, but I can't make out the model # in the video's.
To ION
The meter is a very expensive high end meter,basically worthless except for the fact that SM used it
The meter I'm using is the exact model SM used in the videos,thats been checked.The meter has limitations when I post the next set of experiments you will see that however it will open a lot of directions that were not thought of.You can't make out the number on the video is why no one has figured out what meter it is,I had the same problem.A lot of people have spend thousands of $$$ buying things to make a tpu with utter failure, save your money.I remember one guy spent $10,000 boy was he mad!
His TPU looked fantastic but didn't work. The TPU is real only it doesn't work the way people think it does, its not a free energy device, its an energy converter converting an unknown energy source into electron motion. It is not Tesla's work or any such garbage, has never existed before, its an accidental discovery by SM. Here is one for you Ion, how could a TV repairman/stereo tech, tube changer come up with something that the best minds in the world couldn't, its insane but true.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.21, 06:30:49
To ION
The meter has limitations when I post the next set of experiments you will see that however it will open a lot of directions that were not thought of.You can't make out the number on the video is why no one has figured out what meter it is,
How did you figure out the meter model number?
QuoteThe meter is a very expensive high end meter,basically worthless except for the fact that SM used it The meter I'm using is the exact model SM used in the videos,thats been checked.
Why do you need to keep the model number a secret at this time?
QuoteHeres one for you Ion,how could a tv repairman/stereo tech,tube changer come up with something that the best minds in the world couldn't,its insane but true.
Ok sounds like you have figured out something or know how it works. I believe it was an accidental discovery from his work with dual voice coil speakers, trying to get a spatial effect from a single speaker.
But I could be totally wrong and am very interested in your take on this.
I have no proof, just a hunch. I believe he came up with it by being keenly aware of some anomaly he noticed and exploring it rather than trying to filter or otherwise eliminate it.
Whatever it is, it is very simple, therefore I can't understand why people are assigning such complexity to it. As SM said it is the coils and how they interact.
Here's a question for you: were some of the clues SM gave to Lindsay real while others were to throw everyone off? And which ones are real?
QuoteThe tpu is real only it doesn't work the way people think it does, It's not a free energy device,its an energy converter converting an unknown energy source into electron motion,its not teslas work or any such garbage,has never existed before,its an accidental discovery by SM.
This has been the subject of our latest thread "Induction: Methods and Madness" started by Grumpy. Join us there to discuss it further.
I and others would be interested in how you came to discover this, and what your theory of operation is.
Looking forward to your next post. Thank you for your excellent detective work.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.21, 03:53:38
To All
Heres a set of experiments this relates to what the meter in the tpu video is reading,I labelled the pictures 1 thru 7 just look at them in sequence.This is for general information.I have been very busy lately,holidays.I will post another part on pulsing magnetic fields and ac fields as soon as i have a chance.Note: the gap on my experiments is not exactly the same as the tpu,it was done so you can get the point more clearly,this has been done with coils with gaps like the video,same results,with static magnetic fields same results.The meter in the video is not reading a current but a magnetic field
produced by a current,there is a limitation with this meter as too how far you can figure out the nature of the magnetic field(ac,pulsing dc,static) and the vibration rate.
.
I agree with your conclusions. If this is a static magnetic field that is required for operation then it may be fed by the output and without limitation, the output will feed the input until something gives.
It occured to me that since a coil pulsed with HV attracts metal, that there shoud be some sort of actual attraction between the control coils and the collector coil in the TPU.
Thus we have a possible means of determining if we have a rotating electric field by observing how a small peice of wire is moved by the rotating field. When the field is not rotating, a small wire is attracted to and oriented perpendicular to the pulsed coil. If there is a change in this orientation to one that is not perpendicular to the pulsed coil and somewhat toward the direction of rotation, then rotation may be occuring.
If the attractive force between the pulsed control coil and collector is more than that of a static DC-Powered control coil and collector, then we might suspect that the permittivity or permeability (see the Coulomb Constant) of space has been altered, else the charge produced by a pulse is more than that of a static supply, or the SOL changed. (Or it's just wrong.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coulomb's_law
Hi All heres a few more things tpu related
More stuff for everybody,I included the operating manual for anyone that wants the specifics of the meter SM used,it has the web address if you want to buy one,about $204.Theres a picture of my meter its exactly like SMs the meter is made by another company but hasn't changed since 1997,for uei.
dc varying magnetic field
like a moving magnet that changes location but not direction
OK
Can you also say that this moving magnetic field is not homogeneous in relation to the entire collector, else current generation could not occur? A toroidal collectorm, magnetic ball inside.
I have a problem with that video. He states that if that TPU runs for more than 15 minutes it will get so hot that it'll melt the tape. Then he shows that after 20 minutes it's barely cool. Then. The fact that it loses any voltage at all implies that it's not solid state. There has to be some chemical process to lose charge. If it were solid state it would absolutely not lose any mass or any voltage. And then the big question. If it loses charge how does one recharge it? Can it be recharged is the question? I understand this technology is now a decade or so old? If it's not recahargeable then it's considerably more costly than your average battery which makes its value moot. So. My question would be - is there a patent? And if not then why? If it was meant to be exploited then its technology would be open. Or is this another technology that was bought - and then buried by the MIB?
Quote from: aetherevarising on 2010.11.28, 02:00:17
I have a problem with that video. He states that if that TPU runs for more than 15 minutes it will get so hot that it'll melt the tape. Then he shows that after 20 minutes it's barely cool. Then. The fact that it loses any voltage at all implies that it's not solid state. There has to be some chemical process to lose charge. If it were solid state it would absolutely not lose any mass or any voltage. And then the big question. If it loses charge how does one recharge it? Can it be recharged is the question? I understand this technology is now a decade or so old? If it's not recahargeable then it's considerably more costly than your average battery which makes its value moot. So. My question would be - is there a patent? And if not then why? If it was meant to be exploited then its technology would be open. Or is this another technology that was bought - and then buried by the MIB?
QuoteHe states that if that TPU runs for more than 15 minutes it will get so hot that it'll melt the tape. Then he shows that after 20 minutes it's barely cool.
Did you mean "barely warm". We have no idea what the actual temperature rise over ambient was, as this was not measured.
SM said the unit in question was rated at around 8 amps, he was drawing much less. He may have been referring to a full load condition.
QuoteThe fact that it loses any voltage at all implies that it's not solid state.
QuoteIf it were solid state it would absolutely not lose any mass or any voltage.
I don't know how you arrive at this, and don't know the context in which you are using this term.
Solid state has many definitions, please be more accurate in your statement. If you mean "solid state" in the context that it contained semiconductors devices as part of it's operation, it is no guarantee that it would have excellent regulation unless this was a factor in the design. e.g. It could have been a boost converter with or without without feedback regulation.
A small drop in voltage under load can partially and possibly wholly accounted for by the positive temperature coefficient of copper wire, as I stated earlier. Depends on the gauge and length of the wire used and the temperature rise over ambient.
Hidden batteries could not have have exhibited such a small drop in voltage over the time shown in the video. Based on their load line curves, the drop would have been much greater.
If a boost converter was used, and the boost converter had some feedback regulation we could expect to see the voltage change witnessed in the video, around 1%.
QuoteAnd then the big question. If it loses charge how does one recharge it? Can it be recharged is the question? I understand this technology is now a decade or so old? If it's not recahargeable then it's considerably more costly than your average battery which makes its value moot.
Please exercise due diligence and go back and read the Schinzinger lab reports. Apparently you have a misinterpretation of the device.
QuoteMy question would be - is there a patent? And if not then why? If it was meant to be exploited then its technology would be open. Or is this another technology that was bought - and then buried by the MIB?
These things remain a mystery on top of other mysteries surrounding the device. The deeper you dig, the deeper the rabbit hole.
Food for thought:
How many free electrons would have to be rotating in a loop of wire 6" in diameter and 16 gauge to produce a slight gyroscopic effect.
What would the required speed of rotation be if all of the free electrons were in rotation.
How many amps and what velocity would satisfy a slight but noticeable gyroscopic effect.
Mass of an electron is 9.109 x 10^-34 grams
1 Coulomb=1A=6.2422 x 10^18 electrons passing a given point per second.
Good point ION,the weight of the units, the small ones were about a pound.
Electrons are too light to effect the weight of an object,it would take a lot of electrons moving,its impossible for that to be caused by electron motion.Elimiinate that which is possible,what your left with althu impossible, is the correct answer.
I noticed you didn't get involved with the bedini motor discussion,very funny stuff.
God point, Ion.
So, if it can't be electrons rotating, what else could it be?
QuoteIt was found that inertia is not a fundamental property of matter, nor, indeed, an irreducible magnitude, but a property of energy. If an amount of energy E be given to a body, the inertial mass of the body increases by an amount E/c2, where c is the velocity of light in vacuo. On the other hand, a body of mass m is to be regarded as a store of energy of magnitude mc2.
Would pulsing a coil with HV increase it's inertial mass?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.01, 02:10:26
God point, Ion.
So, if it can't be electrons rotating, what else could it be?
Would pulsing a coil with HV increase it's inertial mass?
An effect on gravity?
Before anyone poopoo's this idea, just remember, if we knew exactly how gravity works, we could most probably alter or control it.
Itzon
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.01, 01:37:13
I noticed you didn't get involved with the bedini motor discussion,very funny stuff.
The few times I have made intelligent (to me) posts that would put the Bedini issue to bed once and for all were quickly ignored.
e.g running two Bedini motors in inverse parallel with two small batteries would quickly settle whether there was any OU taking place.
Or using much smaller batteries so the testing could occur over a few hours rather than days. Or automated battery swapping with a single machine.
All these posts were ignored with no comment by MH or others.
If the idea is to engage in rigorous analysis, that is fine if one believes there is something worthy of analysis. I prefer much simpler "proof of the pudding" tests before I deem it worthy spending a lot of time with rigorous analysis. And I know how to do both, having spent 30+ years in the power control industry.
If I had to engage in rigorous analysis for all the junk and bogus science out there, I would get seriously bogged down timewise.
So it is my guess the discussion is continued in the attempts to teach electronics 101, a worthy and noble enterprise. If one enjoys that, so be it.
When one becomes invisible on a thread, one should withdraw from that sandbox.
Ion:
I actually appreciated your comments but didn't comment because I had nothing to add because I agreed with them. They all made good sense.
Sorry if you felt ignored because you weren't on my part, I just couldn't add anything. I think the thread is getting stale and will switch over to mostly reactive mode. Whenever some news of note happens then I'll comment. Even if there are only a handful of silent readers entrenched in the Bedini camp that are lurking, that's cool! lol
MileHigh
To MH
very funny stuff, good job.
To ION
I don't involved for the same reason,if it can't be looped its a fake,if it can be looped but can't continue in a loop with a load its a fake ,has any big storage batteries(lead/ acid or other) its a fake every time.Has storage batteries big ones, its not a fake its a fraud,Hi Tech Snake Oil.
So, if it can't be electrons rotating, what else could it be?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.01, 14:52:44
So, if it can't be electrons rotating, what else could it be?
The jury is not out on electrons. I never said it could not be electrons, that was a conclusion of others. My question was how many electrons at what velocity for a slight effect.
So how much faster than drift velocity would all of the free electrons in a 16 gauge 6" loop of copper wire need to be accelerated to for a slight gyroscopic effect?
Ion, I have always gone on the assumption that the "Electrons" rotating could not have been responsible for the "Gyro" effect. I mean "Directly" from just their mass. The current would have to be pretty high, and the speed very great. As I have never done the math, I admit this is a wild guess, but unless there is more info, I use "Feel" on a lot of things.
I am left with two possibilities, assuming the effect exists. One, there is another "Thing" rotating, which attaches to the gravitational bias of the planet. (Backed up by Asplundh, if I spelled that right, great...) The needed math and proofs of that are much too much to get into here. Two, and this is less likely, but possible, the magnetic field is really rotating, and actually causing the wires / mass of the unit to contract or expand or alter position, causing an inertia-like effect. I highly doubt this, but cannot eliminate it as I have not seen or tested an operating unit for myself.
Seeing that I cannot prove that it was real or not, the above may or
For a rigid body rotating around an axis of symmetry (e.g. the fins of a ceiling fan), the angular momentum can be expressed as the product of the body's moment of inertia I (a measure of an object's resistance to changes in its rotation rate) and its angular velocity ω.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angular_momentum
So, a whole lot of electrons rotating very very fast. More electrons than are in the collector of the TPU, and spinning so fast that the material would come apart. If the drift velocity was that fast the material would vaporize from the heat, or be one hell of a super conductor.
Note that the output of the TPU does not suffice as a source of the gyroscopic effect.
The jury can come back in now.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.01, 00:17:21
Food for thought:
How many free electrons would have to be rotating in a loop of wire 6" in diameter and 16 gauge to produce a slight gyroscopic effect.
What would the required speed of rotation be if all of the free electrons were in rotation.
How many amps and what velocity would satisfy a slight but noticeable gyroscopic effect.
Mass of an electron is 9.109 x 10^-34 grams
1 Coulomb=1A=6.2422 x 10^18 electrons passing a given point per second.
Einstein-de Haas effect?
http://demonstrations.wolfram.com/EinsteinDeHaasEffect/
http://wapedia.mobi/en/Einstein-de_Haas_effect
"A mechanical effect accompanying magnetization"
http://www.deepdyve.com/lp/american-physical-society-aps/a-mechanical-effect-accompanying-magnetization-Dacd3CePOe
http://ultra.bu.edu/papers/Mohanty_NN_2008.pdf
To Cheappower2012
I'm curious how you have drawn the conclusion that it is a static magnetic field in the TPU (SM17). I am unable to determine the UEI meter setting from the video's so don't know if it is on AC or DC setting. Are you able to see a polarity indicator in the video?
Dr. Schinzinger says this:
QuoteI could not detect any time-varying magnetic field that might have provided an external energy input.
Yet in your post, (8c conclusions) you say he was able to get a reading.
The picture you posted, reproduced here, shows Dr. Schinzinger holding what looks like an air core sensing coil connected to some kind of meter. If there was a high frequency AC field around the TPU, it is doubtful he would have been able to detect it with this method, as the meter may have had a low pass filter. Lacking info on the meter and coil used, I will have to take his statement at face value.
If there was a static magnetic field, he may not have been unable to detect it with an air core sensing coil, unless he was rapidly moving the coil.
This leaves us with a few conclusions, which we can cover later.
To ION
On a dc amp setting, on the left side,center of
the display screen theres a bar that comes up as he moves the
meter it comes and goes, very hard to see.I used frame per frame
and enhanced the frames very hard to see,if the reading was on ac amps
a small ac would appear on the left side of the screen right below the center.
The ac would not disappear when he moved the meter around if you set the meter
to read dc amps.The meter will display a a small bar on the left side of the display,
in the center that will come and go as you move the meter around.I reviewed the video SM
puts the meter on dc amps,then puts the meter into hold mode so it doesn't react
then presses hold to unlock it after hes passed the rim of the tpu.
The meter has limitations remember its beening used outside of its normal
operation,the meter can not tell if the field
is a static magnetic field or a pulsing magnetic field or at what frequency its pulsing at.If we knew the type of meter
the dr was using,we could figure out the settings he has it at.In the video he says hes reading 1.7 millivolts,the field is confined
around the ring.The Dr's coil looks like it has a lot of windings,notice hes very far from the tpu,in taking hes readings.The field is pulsing
but not at a high rate,the field must be very strong,it appears to be an air core coil
not a iron or other core,it takes hundreds of amps to produce a strong magnetic field,and at these levels the coil will vibrate.I believe the coil(in tpu)is pulsing at a low frequency and carrying hundreds of amps,only a small portion of the coils power is transfered to the capacitors,remember in the Dr's report SM poped a fuse of 50 amps by shorting it across the ouput while at the same time it had the lights hooked up.
Also remember Sm shorted the output terminals and produced a gigantic arc in a video.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.05, 22:36:14
The field is pulsing but not at a high rate,the field must be very strong,it appears to be an air core coil
not a iron or other core,it takes hundreds of amps to produce a strong magnetic field,and at these levels the coil will vibrate.I believe the coil(in tpu) is pulsing at a low frequency and carrying hundreds of amps,only a small portion of the coils power is transfered to the capacitors,remember in the Dr's report SM poped a fuse of 50 amps by shorting it across the ouput while at the same time it had the lights hooked up.
Also remember Sm shorted the output terminals and produced a gigantic arc in a video.
Hundreds of amps in those 12 AWG-looking wires? Or some exotic energy field that has the equivalent of hundreds of amps?
CP2012
Thanks for clearing that up.....I was not able to see what was going on with the meter as I have low res video's.
I did some current testing of an open tpu mock-up with zipcord and found that I had to pass about 10 amps through the wire to get it physically too hot to touch. (as seen by SM gingerly touching the device in those videos on top of the speaker box) I'll see if I can find the test data and post it here.
If there were 100 amps or so in the large tpu, then many wires had to be paralleled or as G says it may have been "some exotic energy field that has the equivalent of hundreds of amps?"
all good information....still the mystery persists
I have a device i made to test high current effects on wires it puts out 200 to 500 amps on a wire,the duty cycle is the important thing ,the on time is very short.I think its hundreds of amps for the tpu but for a very short time there maybe heat but not much remember the meter doesn't care as regards the magnetic field.The tpu may adjust the duty cycle as you draw more power the duty cycle results in more heat at a certain point the tpu must go up in flames the wire can't handle the amps.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.06, 00:12:00
I have a device i made to test high current effects on wires it puts out 200 to 500 amps on a wire,the duty cycle is the important thing ,the on time is very short.I think its hundreds of amps for the tpu but for a very short time there maybe heat but not much remember the meter doesn't care as regards the magnetic field.The tpu may adjust the duty cycle as you draw more power the duty cycle results in more heat at a certain point the tpu must go up in flames the wire can't handle the amps.
That's a good way to test, another is SCR capacitor discharge method. A third is a large transformer with a single turn secondary fed from a Variac, can develop hundreds to thousands of amps at very low voltage depending on the turns ratio.
So we can only guess at how such large currents were sustained in the TPU's. Pulse mode is one thing, sustained current flow is real continuous power.
I will have to run a test to see if a 50 amp SSD fuse can be blown from the peak current discharge of a 800 Volt 400 uF capacitor. Got to locate the peak current curves for such a fuse.
BTW, the flamelike discharge was due to a resistor in series with the leads (from SM).
Now, where do we go from here?
The coil transfers power to the caps the caps put out the power
there low loss electrolytic capacitors.Sm used radio shack for many parts,
you have to identify the structures
in the 17" tpu. The tpu is low
tech,people jump in and use hi tech parts
it won't work.The tpu is mostlikely very easy build ,so easy to build that you
couldn't sell it,so think low tech.
So, how is this huge current created in the TPU?
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.06, 01:26:13
The coil transfers power to the caps the caps put out the power
there low loss electrolytic capacitors.Sm used radio shack for many parts,
you have to identify the structures
in the 17" tpu. The tpu is low
tech,people jump in and use hi tech parts
it won't work.The tpu is mostlikely very easy build ,so easy to build that you
couldn't sell it,so think low tech.
I agree, it is low tech in the component usage, but I would say it is high tech in the configuration of the components. That is the part we need to understand. That it is most likely very easy to build, I also agree, but only after the configuration to produce the effect is known.
e.g who could have had any idea how a laser or a vacuum tube would work before they were created.....same with the TPU....it appears to be magic, but once we understand it, we will all be saying "why is it no one thought of this configuration before?"
What we need are a series of simple experiments aimed at increasing current flow in a loop that already has some current flowing in it. My guess is it will not use inductive transformer type effects, as these tend to produce a back emf which works against the forward EMF drive, effectively nulling it. Transformer action is nearly always a zero sum game as far as DC is concerned.
Another method of enticing current flow to increase is needed.
spin a hv plate cap on the end of a Dremel tool, vertical orientation, ends open, see if it charges
by the way, the dielectric is not the seat of effect as I once thought, the electric field is. Roentgen rotated the electric field "with" the dielectric!
I have been spinng certain things at high speed in the past.
Like neon bulbs, led's and wires attached to my portable drill.
The idea was that the end of the wire was moving at the highest speed making the whistling sound and my goal was to make it spin faster then sound can travel or 340 meters per second.
And yes i did measure a voltage when one lead of the meter was attached to the water pipe the other to the drill head.
it was very clear but i remember it was too small to be of any intrest so i quit those experiments.
:)
To make it more interesting, you'd have to spin it faster or increase the perpendicular field (field of force parallel to the axis of rotation). If it is a background field, you can't change it, but you could replace it with your own field and feed some of the output to power this field to make it stronger.
When you connect a load, it will pull the voltage down, probably about 1/3 (back torque) or more.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explosively_pumped_flux_compression_generator
An EPFCG package that could be easily carried by a person can produce pulses in the millions of amperes and tens of terawatts, exceeding the power of a lightning strike by orders of magnitude.
Now how to replace the explosives :-\
probably not, but I can cause electrokinetic induction
The TPU: Was It Real ?
Hell yes! It was real!
To ION
On the video look at the left toroid's bottom,you will see a spark
that concides with the position of the switch,left switch.The switch bottom contacts are closed at the
top,off when the switch is either center or bottom.A transformer when current is flowing in the primary,goes
from this to an open circuit a large spark will be generated on the secondary.Note the tpu is in an off state
when both switches are at bottom position.Theres a crude picture of the tpu with a picture
labeling the functions of the switches from the 17" tpu.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.08, 05:08:01
To ION
On the video look at the left toroid's bottom,you will see a spark
that coincides with the position of the switch,left switch.The switch bottom contacts are closed at the
top,off when the switch is either center or bottom. A transformer when current is flowing in the primary,goes
from this to an open circuit a large spark will be generated on the secondary.Note the tpu is in an off state
when both switches are at bottom position.There's a crude picture of the tpu with a picture
labeling the functions of the switches from the 17" tpu.
Yes I see the brief spark as the left switch is toggled. Good catch. Very easy to miss, I stepped through the frames of the video you posted. Wonder how much current would have to be flowing through the toroid to produce that arc over when interrupted?
From Grumpy:
QuoteThe TPU: Was It Real ?
Hell yes! It was real!
The evidence seems to indicate this.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.08, 16:26:15
Wonder how much current would have to be flowing through the toroid to produce that arc over when interrupted?
less than those caps will deliver
I wonder if Stefan Hartman believes the TPU is real, because he has removed the old TPU topics from his Overunity website. :o
Did anybody archive what was posted there?
They're all still there ;)
.99
Hi,here is a video showing an air core coil ,with a short duration high current pulse applied.
the hammering noise is the contraction and relaxation of the coil due to the strong magnetic field.The flashing red light is a magnetic pulse detector,like a logic probe,only for magnetic fields.The pictures are the coil and the detector,I believe the vibration in the tpu is caused by a short duration high current pulse.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.11, 12:58:55
Hi,here is a video showing an air core coil ,with a short duration high current pulse applied.
the hammering noise is the contraction and relaxation of the coil due to the strong magnetic field.The flashing red light is a magnetic pulse detector,like a logic probe,only for magnetic fields.The pictures are the coil and the detector, I believe the vibration in the tpu is caused by a short duration high current pulse.
Well done CP2012....I have done some similar testing looking to recreate vibration.
The next step would be to try the same test with a non-inductive winding instead of a solenoid winding. Also a
tall thin structure would allow more
free play of the
vertical wires than a tightly wound solenoid.
Looking at the cross section cutaway of the SM17, It looks to me that SM is using a
loopback winding for low inductance....hence all the glue and outer ring at the base where a few tie wraps would have sufficed to hold the whole thing to the base. Look closely at the cutaway, the windings do not appear to turn the square corners of the lower block.
In his early designs, SM used lamp cord in a bifilar fashion for low inductance. Why lampcord? If you twist two ends together and pulse the opposite two ends, you have a nice uniform non-inductive path. Parallel currents flowing in opposite directions
always cause repulsion between the wires, regardless of the polarity of the energizing current.
In a loopback winding you go down one side and back up the same side, repeating this on the inside and outside of the TPU, never making complete solenoid style turns around the TPU.
This creates a non-inductive wind, but you get repulsion effects between the loops. This is a very different construction technique than bifilar out of phase windings.
A non-inductive wind will make better use of the risetime of a sharp pulse,
peak current limited only by the DC resistance of the wire as the inductance is minimal. This is my next area of research.
current pulse as in the discharge of a cap?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.11, 14:47:16
current pulse as in the discharge of a cap?
Yes, that is the best method. Use a small electrostatic corona wire power supply from a scrapped laser printer, this can be powered up with a small 9 volt battery. Charge a "pulse rated capacitor", dump it with an avalanche device or high voltage transistor. A tiny spark gap can also be used. Makes a compact, portable high current pulse generator. The drawback is the PRR (pulse repetition rate) will be limited by the available recharge current.
Question CP2012: Can you describe your pulse circuit?
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.11, 15:26:25
Yes, that is the best method. Use a small electrostatic corona wire power supply from a scrapped laser printer, this can be powered up with a small 9 volt battery. Charge a "pulse rated capacitor", dump it with an avalanche device or high voltage transistor. A tiny spark gap can also be used. Makes a compact, portable high current pulse generator. The drawback is the PRR (pulse repetition rate) will be limited by the available recharge current.
Question CP2012: Can you describe your pulse circuit?
I use a cap bank to keep the voltage up and switch after this.
Some may recall that SM mentioned transformers and out of phase signals (maybe transients too - can't recall)
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.11, 15:51:19
I use a cap bank to keep the voltage up and switch after this.
Some may recall that SM mentioned transformers and out of phase signals (maybe transients too - can't recall)
There are lots of ways to create high current discharges on the bench. I am referring to a small portable means as might be packed into a TPU.
Any non-inductively wound device satisfies SM's reference to out of phase signals. Though we can't know exactly what he was referring to, I believe this statement was in reference to the 5U4 circuit.
To ION
I just did a coil both tightly wound and lose using bifilar
windings the magnetic field totally cancels out you get no vibration.
Does prove the magnetic field is the cause of the pounding noise.
You have to be careful of SM he laid out a lot of traps in the tpu
to fool the engineers,as soon as I have more time ill get into that aspect.The pulsing device
comes from
looking at a guys web site that likes to build magnetically driven ball bearing
guns,this is based on hes old stuff,I modified
a few things from hes stuff added a few other things reduced it to a very small
number of parts make it so its portable ,has a fixed pulse rate,the flashing light in the video is the pulsing rate.I made another one
that has a variable rate 1 to 12 pulses a second,because its designed on that guys circuit
it can discharge a cap at 20,000 mfd at 200v,however I only use 1000 mfd at 180 v on this one.
There are a lot of very smart people on the web sometimes they make something that has dual uses like this
all thats needed is a few changes,no need to start from scratch,he had all the bugs worked out.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.11, 16:16:56
There are lots of ways to create high current discharges on the bench. I am referring to a small portable means as might be packed into a TPU.
Any non-inductively wound device satisfies SM's reference to out of phase signals. Though we can't know exactly what he was referring to, I believe this statement was in reference to the 5U4 circuit.
My powersupply of 4kv and cap bank will fit in a cigarette pack and runs on 12vdc at about 500mA, or less if less voltage is required.
If SM worked with Quad DSL speakers and voice coils when he found the effect, perhaps it is HV more than HC.
At this point though, I don't think he stumbled across the effect, but rather noticed that modern electrodynamics has "glossed over a few things". He may have come the same logical crossroad, where we now stand. From the things he said about magnets and the earth and getting usable power from these things, he was probably searching like we are. The bifilar approach where one signal is applied o two parallel wires and one is delayed can produce the necessary moving electric field. You need enough voltage that the resultant moving superimposed wave is strong enough to create an effect on the collector.
HI ALL,here is more information so you avoid one of SM's traps,SM is a master at fooling you into concluding one thing or moving you in a direction thats false.He fooled many engineers,and very smart people,there are more of these traps in hes units.The concept that SM lies and that he may not want you to build a tpu is a hard concept for some people.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.12, 13:03:17
HI ALL,here is more information so you avoid one of SM's traps,SM is a master at fooling you into concluding one thing or moving you in a direction thats false.He fooled many engineers,and very smart people,there are more of these traps in hes units.The concept that SM lies and that he may not want you to build a tpu is a hard concept for some people.
Then SM never should have said that the TPU's used a differnt form of "induction", of "causing electrons to flow".
Everytime I meet someone on these forums that might be SM, I ask about those toroids. The answer is never that they are fake or part of a tuned tank, rather it is that they are part of a regulator or for filtering, isolation, or whatever, but never anything that pertains to the production of the inductive effect. So, I am inclined to think that they are not important. Also, I don't recall that SM ever mentioned them in his letters. Knowing that some switching methods cause a reflection, I'm inclined to think they are for isolation.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.12, 15:52:56
Then SM never should have said that the TPU's used a differnt form of "induction", of "causing electrons to flow".
Everytime I meet someone on these forums that might be SM, I ask about those toroids. The answer is never that they are fake or part of a tuned tank, rather it is that they are part of a regulator or for filtering, isolation, or whatever, but never anything that pertains to the production of the inductive effect. So, I am inclined to think that they are not important. Also, I don't recall that SM ever mentioned them in his letters. Knowing that some switching methods cause a reflection, I'm inclined to think they are for isolation.
SM may have been unable to restrain his underlying enthusiasm for the technology and would occasionally blurt out something real amidst some obfuscation.
Regarding the small toroidal transformers in the center of some devices, I have a different point of view which I have expressed in other threads. There are plenty of opinions around for years of research.
But that is not so important when we consider the 6" and 3" units, which did not posses such a large toroid, and no small visible toroidal shaped bumps under the tape.
I take it all as information, whether some is true or false will be revealed eventually, the real question is how could these smaller devices have worked and what would be a good starting point for replication.
In the last four years, thousands of man-hours have been spent mixing frequencies and driving pulses into traditionally wound toroidal structures, to my knowledge, and to no avail, except for heresay.
There are lots of impressive sounding documents that would leave you to believe this or that method works e.g. "Working TPU Replication". The old SM threads at OU are full of them. Not to mention youtube videos.
We are all still thinking way inside the box, which SM ventured out of. We need a fresh start in new directions of R&D effort to crack this.
Exploring means to create the vibration and gyro effects might be an effective method to reverse engineer the device, so CP2012 might be on the right track, although I have not fully agreed with all his findings, I commend him for taking this approach.
ION,
Good post.
I'll add my thoughts.
Don't let your experiences limit what you can see. There are cases of individuals making great attempts to produce drawings, connection diagrams and analysis of photos.
A few of those decided there own work became scripture and got a little huffy when people went there own way.
No one is right until it is working that way on the bench.
Example:
I am flabbergasted when someone familiar with common mode chokes or common toroidal cores claims them to be a filter choke.
The smaller TPUs didn't have a small toroid inside because the TPU functions the same way as the small toroid.
TPUs with a single small toroid or the function of a single small toroid quit when they were flipped over.
CP2012,
As my grandfather was fond of saying " We?...... Who is we?..... Do you have a turd in your pocket? " ;D
to Wavewatcher
,There was a man that played the lottery every week he prayed to
god, please let me win the lottery,every week he lost.after months of this
he said god I have been a good person,gone to church and have prayed to you every night why wont
you let me win the lottery.suddenly the the sky opened up and a loud voice said,"Meet me half way and buy a ticket".
God has no money so he makes the man pay for it?
Or -
Once led by the blind you are forever blind?
Sorry.
I've been awake about 22 hours.
HI All,heres something to think about,in the video SM plays with a speaker magnet using it first on the left toroid
which does nothing,then the right that does something.All the time the switch positions are in an up position
that is an ,"on" position.The tpu is already in an on position ,is he playing games or trying to jump start the tpu.
I'll post more stuff as soon as I get over this nasty cold.
Hi all,
This post will be to look at MR WATTSUP's theory
that all of the tpu's are fake he originally started
with the garage tpu and 4 inch tpu being fake,and showed that it was possible.
I think he has a point on the two being fake,however
I don't agree that all the others are fake.
No one can prove that the 4 inch tpu and garage tpu are fake but it can be shown that
they could very well be fake and should not be considered in any theory
to explain construction and operation.The video is made to look fake for a reason
I can deplicate the original garage tpu and produce a close copy but that would serve no purpose.
In a few days, maybe sooner, I will post more details on how the SM garage tpu is fake.
CP2012
Good work on the TPU fakery stuff! You have certainly done your homework.
I have written a lot about this and done a few experiments that proved to me that the first TPU and the garage TPU could easily have been faked. Others could also have been faked if you are clever enough. I will see if I can dig them up and post them here.
We concur that there are many ways to fake the various TPU's.
But that does not mean they were. They may have served their intended purpose, as you say, to appear to be fakes.
I look forward to your next post. Thank you for your work and sharing with us.
HI ALL
This posting is how the illusion is done it applies to the garage tpu,I will post that maybe tomorrow.
Another thing in 1996 there were a lot of sealed lead acid batteries you could get from radio shack,all sizes and shapes ,different amp ratings.The battery I'm using is a fairly large one but a much smaller one will work,it only has to light the light for a very short time,sealed lead acid batteries can do this with no problem.
What about the TPU's that you consider to be "real"?
CP2012
Good work as usual.
I had previously considered the shorted outlet scenario, but also thought a small electromechanical or solid state relay could be used in the lamp bases as a pilot control device.
This way if he was asked to plug it into a normal outlet it would still appear as if the power was coming from the outlet.
Only a few mA at 80 to 120 VAC or DC would be required to activate the relay. A small boost converter in the TPU would supply the command signal to the relay.
For this device, a real test by SM would have been a light bulb directly connected to the TPU and left on for a good length of time that would preclude the use of batteries.
Better than light bulbs would be a red hot heating element, such as toaster wire or screw in ceramic infra red heater element.
to GRUMPY
Only the 15 inch,17 inch all 6 inch tpu's,the one in
the office are real.The garage tpu is fake the 4 inch tpu is fake.
To sell a product to greedy people you must make them think
that they will corner the market
TO ION
You can go the relay way,however this was a one shot deal,record it once,and thats it.The purpose was to get the investors excited,watch the video on the garage tpu ,in one part SM is asked by the cameraman is there batteries,I think he knew there were. Theres an interesting thing in the garage tpu video that was missed i will post that too.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.27, 17:11:49
to GRUMPY
Only the 15 inch,17 inch all 6 inch tpu's,the one in
the office are real.The garage tpu is fake the 4 inch tpu is fake.
To sell a product to greedy people you must make them think
that they will corner the market
TO ION
You can go the relay way,however this was a one shot deal,record it once,and thats it.The purpose was to get the investors excited,watch the video on the garage tpu ,in one part SM is asked by the cameraman is there batteries,I think he knew there were. Theres an interesting thing in the garage tpu video that was missed i will post that too.
OK, taking the "hard right" over the "easy left": all working TPU's have a rather "tall" cross section. The open ones clearly have two circular wire arrangements of some sort, spaced apart a few inches, which coincides with the tall cross-section of the larger ones, but the larger TPU's have these circular arrangements covered by a toroidal winding or vertical wires.
The open TPU, which do not have the outer winding/wires, will turn off when flipped over. The most obvious vertical-oriented force that does not flip when you flip your TPU is "gravity". Perhaps the need for this force was satisfied in the larger units by another force, such as a magnetic field.
Our two stacked/spaced circular arrangements could be series or parallel individual induction sections. The outer winding/wires of the larger units would then apply to all collectors inside.
Wow! This is looking easier than I thought. I hate winding toroids, but if it gets it to rotate, so be it.
CP2012 showed that the magnetic field at the gap of SM17 is DC. So, when SM said that a compass rotated when in the middle of the TPU, which TPU was he talking about? and did it rotate because of a magnetic field or an electric field?
Hi All
Here are a few things that shows that the garage tpu can
not be used
as a reference for the construction of a tpu.On the video
SM tested the garage tpu without the outlet box,he forgot to turn off a lamp.
Something that looks like an arc will be seen in the small square below
where he tests the voltage output.I think it has to do with the inverter drawing more power
at start up,with the light on.Could it be a reflection?Another thing that signals that its fake is
the voltage output 91.3 only drops to 91.2 with a load of 120 watts,yet the 6 inch unit had
a big voltage drop with a 100 watt load.
Its almost like the voltage monitored is not hooked up to the output that's what I think is happening.
Remember sealed lead acid batteries were easy to get in 1996 in all sizes and will fit in the lamps with no trouble.The inverter from radio shack will also fit in the lamps with no trouble.
The next post will be on the 4 inch tpu.
It is fascinationg how much quality effort people go to to make their case for the contrary.
And how no effort is put towards experimenting with the actual light speed electron devices that the inventor"alegedly" said to use to begin with.
Hi,
The megawatt or so running through a heavy cable causing it to 'jump' when power is initially switched through it.
Just one example.
Have you heard any reasonable explanation for this? There's lots of speculation though, including the possibility SM's devices utilised this.
Steve.
Quote from: gridbias on 2010.12.28, 13:16:02
It is fascinationg how much quality effort people go to to make their case for the contrary.
And how no effort is put towards experimenting with the actual light speed electron devices that the inventor"alegedly" said to use to begin with.
Regarding the first statement, this is part of the "due diligence" that everyone should consider. I commend CP2012 for putting the time and effort into this.
As for the second part, how do you know what is being done that is not yet reported here? Your "no effort" statement holds "no water", it is an assumption. There some are people here that are old hands working with vacuum tubes, have a lot of experience and are just not reporting any anomalies yet.
Your statement carries with it the implication that you know something through a direct experience of the effects SM mentioned. This posture seems familiar to me somehow. Do we know you under a different name?
We welcome your "light speed electron research" here.
Quote from: szaxx on 2010.12.28, 13:30:18
Hi,
The megawatt or so running through a heavy cable causing it to 'jump' when power is initially switched through it.
Just one example.
Have you heard any reasonable explanation for this? There's lots of speculation though, including the possibility SM's devices utilised this.
Steve.
There are strong repulsive or attractive forces between conductors depending on the direction of current flow. I have experimented with this.
If you are referring to a different force, not based on mutual attraction, repulsion, or interaction with earths low level magnetic field, please elaborate further.
Quote from: gridbias on 2010.12.28, 13:16:02
It is fascinationg how much quality effort people go to to make their case for the contrary.
And how no effort is put towards experimenting with the actual light speed electron devices that the inventor"alegedly" said to use to begin with.
Sounds like a "Mannix Comment". "Light speed electron devices" sounds like a reference to tubes rather than a different means of induction as SM stated at the end of the UEC video. I don't see you experimenting towards that.
Quote from: szaxx on 2010.12.28, 13:30:18
Hi,
The megawatt or so running through a heavy cable causing it to 'jump' when power is initially switched through it.
Just one example.
Have you heard any reasonable explanation for this? There's lots of speculation though, including the possibility SM's devices utilised this.
Steve.
When a circuit is first turned on, two electric fields, one positive and one negative, propagate from the power source through the circuit. Nipher and Jefimenko researched this and both photographed the electric fields. (Nipher with photographic plates and Jefimenko with grass seeds. The electric field does not go away with DC circuits as most assume it does.
CP2012,
You should know that there is no leg in the front of the OTPU, but your "hiddenbatteries" photo indicates otherwise. This is the right quadrant of the device.
Please don't argue with this, as I have stared at that device longer than I care to admit. In fact, what IS there exactly where one would expect a leg to be, appears to be a common shiny-boxed line filter, in a horizontal position. Interestingly, this is where the power output to the bulbs is. Something very similar to this:
(http://www.sphere.bc.ca/test/inductors/schaffner-fn323-6-01-filter-tiny.jpg)
(http://4sale.sbszoo.com/filter/dit-0242.jpg)
Also, there is no leg in the top quadrant. The "leg support" for this quadrant is provided by a circuit board.
The left side has a wood leg, but it has a coil or transformer taped (green) to it. The bottom has a wood leg in plain sight.
.99
I notice, as have others, that the bifilar coil (zip cord?) appears to have the ends soldered and there also appears to be another connection next to it.
Also, the winding is not exactly radial, it has a slight angle to it.
Also, the four zip cord windings appear equally spaced and rather "flat". Did the open tpu turn off when flipped? (I'm going through the video now.) In later TPU's the cross-section is taller, not flat and wide. I wonder is SM has several "collectors" in the wide space inside the zip cord coils...
It is amazing how often the 'battery in the leg', micro-switches & false wall outlet idea reoccurs.
I know. I did the same thing about 4 years ago.
CP2012,
I commend you on your due diligence but that should also include reading the first few posts on this thread. As is now, when those TPU demonstrations took place there was no battery combination capable of delivering the power for the length of time, as witnessed and reported by individuals with excellent credentials.
IMO: The open TPU was certainly no more a fake than any other TPU. I very seriously doubt there are batteries in any TPU except possibly the one labeled the FTPU and the small one around 4 inches in diameter.
Grumpy,
Attached is a detail I drew some years ago showing the likelihood that what you call 'zip cord' is actually common 300 Ohm twin transmission line, also just as available at R.S.
CP2012,
The one issue that I will concede may lend some credence to your notion of the OTPU being a "fake", and that goes against the general coil arrangement concept of SM's devices, is that in the OTPU, there does not appear to be two coil windings orthogonal to one another.
However, the green taped coil/transformer and the highly-obscured top quadrant of the device, may provide for the apparently-required orthogonal windings relative to the obvious toroidal winding.
.99
Gentlemen:
I think everyone's input is valuable and we should consider and save it all as "information". While CP2012 is saying "here is how these particular devices could be faked", he is not saying all or any were indeed faked.
Back in the gn0sis forum days we covered many of these scenario's quite extensively. It is good to see a member actually carrying out with real experiment the things we mused about.
CP2012 has done a fine job of demonstrating how a couple of devices "could" be faked.
We all agree that Roland Schinzinger was no slouch when it comes to Electrical Engineering and if his reports are real, that is good enough for me to believe at least two or three of these devices worked as claimed.
Whether some of the devices were a ruse to throw off a few people is also possible.
G:
We see the soldered ends of zipcord in at least one other TPU, as pointed out in the beginning of the "reverse engineering" thread.
To ION
You can not prove anything only show its possible give whats in 1996 that could be used to fake a tpu.If its shown that it could be done, then using that tpu as a reference is not a good idea.
I have made 6 inch fake tpu's you will see one soon, as soon as I finish the 4 inch tpu post.You can light a 25 watt bulb using 1996 technology,very hard to do a 100 watt bulb,I can do that too and have.You can't run the 100 watt bulb for long even then so the 6 inch tpu has to be real.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.28, 19:19:18
Gentlemen:
While CP2012 is saying "here is how these particular devices could be faked", he is not saying all or any were indeed faked.
CP2012 has done a fine job of demonstrating how a couple of devices "could" be faked.
I would have to disagree about what CP2012 has indeed said. Below are 3 instances where he says all
were faked
except 3 units.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 00:20:51
My theory is only 3 of the devices are real, the rest are fake, the 6 inch tpu, real, the one in the lab setting, real, the big tpu, real.
The reason for faking them is to show that the device can be scaled,it can't because SM doesn't know how it works.
The video where the tpu powers the drill, vacuum cleaner and tv is a fake, the 6 inch tpu is real but it doesn't power the
the tv,drill or vacuum cleaner.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.27, 17:11:49
to GRUMPY
Only the 15 inch, 17 inch all 6 inch tpu's , the one in the office are real. The garage tpu is fake the 4 inch tpu is fake.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.11.07, 02:08:44
Wattsup made the wrong conclusion that all tpu's are fake 3 are not...
What is to be gained by devising ways some of SM's devices
could be faked, when indeed there is belief that at least 3
are not faked? For goodness sake, focus on those 3 then and quit wasting time and effort on the others.
.99
QuoteWhat is to be gained by devising ways a device could be faked, when indeed there is belief that at least 3 are not faked? For goodness sake, focus on those 3 then and quit wasting time and effort on the others.
.99
I would agree with .99 ...
And I would really like to know if there is a working prototype anywhere for the TPU, or workable designs, or if Steven Mark "sold out" to a big company or what...
Anyone?
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.12.28, 19:43:41
I would have to disagree about what CP2012 has indeed said. Below are 3 instances where he says all were faked except 3 units.
What is to be gained by devising ways some of SM's devices could be faked, when indeed there is belief that at least 3 are not faked? For goodness sake, focus on those 3 then and quit wasting time and effort on the others.
.99
I stand corrected and properly chastised.......I thought I remember him saying early on "this is how they could have been faked", then it was later changed to "were faked". mea culpa
I personally have discounted the validity of the first unit and the garage unit to some degree. But these are not what Schinzinger tested
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.28, 20:38:22
I stand corrected and properly chastised.......I thought I remember him saying this is how they could have been faked, then it was later changed to "were faked".
:D
Don't worry, I hurt myself making that post ;)
.99
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2010.12.28, 20:26:01
I would agree with .99 ...
And I would really like to know if there is a working prototype anywhere for the TPU, or workable designs, or if Steven Mark "sold out" to a big company or what...
Anyone?
Prof,
Perhaps the attached may answer some of your questions. I was once username "z_p_e".
.99
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.28, 19:36:47
To ION
You can not prove anything only show its possible give whats in 1996 that could be used to fake a tpu.If its shown that it could be done, then using that tpu as a reference is not a good idea.
I have made 6 inch fake tpu's you will see one soon, as soon as I finish the 4 inch tpu post.You can light a 25 watt bulb using 1996 technology,very hard to do a 100 watt bulb,I can do that too and have.You can't run the 100 watt bulb for long even then so the 6 inch tpu has to be real.
(When this thread first started, I thought it was a wast of time, but it has become quite interesting.)
As for SM not know how it worked, I think the new the basic premise for this form of induction as he called it in the UEC video, but he apparently did not understand the interaction of other fields that were involved in the operation. The early TPU's lost there output when they were flipped over, and did not have outer windings (toroidal). SM corrected this issue in the version with the outer windings - he may not have known exactly why this worked. Like I said before, I believe that the early units had assistance from gravity, and the later units used a static magnetic field from the outer winding.
Does anyone have a good view of the section of the cut-apart TPU?
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.12.28, 20:41:07
Prof,
Perhaps the attached may answer some of your questions. I was once username "z_p_e".
.99
POYNT:
Excellent summary, I found it valuable back when you wrote it and equally valuable today.
I would add one caveat to the researcher new to TPU information: Beware of the many TPU related claims and misleading titles on Youtube and Google concerning working replications.
Also there have been many urban legends concerning the TPU that have become fact and cast into a body of religious beliefs. Beware lest you be led down many a blind alley.
G:
QuoteDoes anyone have a good view of the section of the cut-apart TPU?
At least I don't, and have never seen a clear shot. This is why I have called for a few good men that are savvy with frame merging and clarification techniques. Anyone who can help with this will advance the project by a good leap.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.28, 20:50:56
POYNT:
Excellent summary, I found it valuable back when you wrote it and equally valuable today.
I would add one caveat to the researcher new to TPU information: Beware of the many TPU related claims and misleading titles on Youtube and Google concerning working replications.
Also there have been many urban legends concerning the TPU that have become fact and cast into a body of religious beliefs. Beware lest you be led down many a blind alley.
G:
At least I don't, and have never seen a clear shot. This is why I have called for a few good men that are savvy with frame merging and clarification techniques. Anyone who can help with this will advance the project by a good leap.
Agreed, Ion -- .99 has provided an insightful summary. This stood out:
Quote5) As of this document's release date, there have been no known successful
replications of the TPU.
[/b]
I take it from the discussion that this still holds...
BTW, a very useful feature of the OUR award (besides providing encouragement) -- is this: When the OUR award is awarded, we can be assured that the community has made REAL progress! O0
CP2012,
From your train of thoughts as depicted in your diagram regarding the OTPU, I assume you are implying that there is no appreciable current in the clear/red speaker wire on the device (only voltage), and that all the current supplied to the bulbs is via wiring internal to the light fixture? You do mention a wire loop of some sort, but no mention of location was made.
Consider then that it is very odd for SM to be weary of touching the device for fear of being burned from the heat generated in that speaker wiring.
.99
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2010.12.28, 20:58:13
Agreed, Ion -- .99 has provided an insightful summary. This stood out:
Quote5) As of this document's release date, there have been no known successful
replications of the TPU.
I take it from the discussion that this still holds...
BTW, a very useful feature of the OUR award (besides providing encouragement) -- is this: When the OUR award is awarded, we can be assured that the community has made REAL progress! O0
People claim OU and working TPU's (as well as other devices) all the time. None have been substantiated.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.28, 21:54:09
I take it from the discussion that this still holds...
BTW, a very useful feature of the OUR award (besides providing encouragement) -- is this: When the OUR award is awarded, we can be assured that the community has made REAL progress! O0
People claim OU and working TPU's (as well as other devices) all the time. None have been substantiated.
Wow... that needs to be changed!
Quote from: PhysicsProf on 2010.12.28, 22:25:32
Wow... that needs to be changed!
one day these claims may be true O0
In the one Steven Mark TPU video, with the U.E.C. logo on the screen, Steven says that his devices utilize a "different form of induction", "another way to make electrons flow (current).
Personally, I think they use a form of electrostatic induction.
At what time mark was that about?
.99
Quote from: poynt99 on 2010.12.29, 01:26:50
At what time mark was that about?
.99
the last few minutes when the 6-inch PU has been running for about 20 minutes.
What does he say when he says the word "induction"?
You guys are funny,its ,"my belief", that only the 15 inch,the 17 inch
the 6 inch unit,and the office tpu are real."Its my belief"
you believe that SM won't try to trick you and wants you to know how to make a tpu.
Nothing can be proven, but you can show reasons why something is correct or not.
Why show this,well theres a tendency on the part of a lot of people here and
very much on overunity.com to constantly refer to every tpu to argue stupid points.You guys want
a quick answer,there are no quick answers this is a very hard problem
the tpu is a very low tech device,using principles that are part known and part unknown,combined with tricks to fool anyone trying to reverse engineer this,I don't have all the answers
but twisting what I say is not the answer.
If your waiting for SM to give you the secret of how to make a tpu good luck.
SMis a good actor,maybe I should make a video where theres no chance of getting
shocked or burned and act like there is,
are you children or raised in effluence,that you can't understand trickery.
There is no loop you simply solder a wire across to short the output,the loop concept was presented for clarity,its simply a short.Oh lets see why would SM do that,
why would a ring master(bedini) make a Ferris wheel and invite a bunch of clowns to witness a miracle,to sucker them for money,what a concept.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2010.12.29, 03:39:44
You guys are funny,its ,"my belief", that only the 15 inch,the 17 inch
the 6 inch unit,and the office tpu are real."Its my belief"
you believe that SM won't try to trick you and wants you to know how to make a tpu.
Nothing can be proven, but you can show reasons why something is correct or not.
Why show this,well theres a tendency on the part of a lot of people here and
very much on overunity.com to constantly refer to every tpu to argue stupid points.You guys want
a quick answer,there are no quick answers this is a very hard problem
the tpu is a very low tech device,using principles that are part known and part unknown,combined with tricks to fool anyone trying to reverse engineer this,I don't have all the answers
but twisting what I say is not the answer.
If your waiting for SM to give you the secret of how to make a tpu good luck.
SMis a good actor,maybe I should make a video where theres no chance of getting
shocked or burned and act like there is,
are you children or raised in effluence,that you can't understand trickery.
There is no loop you simply solder a wire across to short the output,the loop concept was presented for clarity,its simply a short.Oh lets see why would SM do that,
why would a ring master(bedini) make a Ferris wheel and invite a bunch of clowns to witness a miracle,to sucker them for money,what a concept.
With the right support, I think we can prove alot.
I need to combine Peter's delayed bifilar driver that shows the higher pulse when they combine with WW's triggerable HV pulser. If we can get rotation of this pulse around a toroidal coil with this method, the rest is easy, I promise.
(19:41:56) Grumpy: WW - correct, that doesn;t rotate, but two pulses with one delayed will rotate, and no one used it, and no one has the smoking gun
(19:42:48) poynt99: chet: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=413.0
(19:42:51) Grumpy: can someone get with PEter, like maybe WW and get an HV bifilar coil pulsing and rotating (toroidal coil)
(19:50:07) Grumpy: WW, can you delay a trigger by about 220ns and do the bifilar combo pulse yourself? If so, can you roll with this in the next week or two?
(19:50:11) Grumpy: :warning:
(19:50:18) Grumpy: :important:
(19:50:28) Grumpy: WW: see above
(22:14:10) WaveWatcher: reading
(22:16:38) WaveWatcher: Hmmm...
(22:17:53) WaveWatcher: Shoot me a schematic of coils and switching with details on coils. I'll see if I have what it takes.
(22:18:18) WaveWatcher: No need for details on electronics - just needed parameters
(22:19:03) WaveWatcher: You do know there must be two axis of rotation to make a compass follow?
(22:19:41) WaveWatcher: One orbital and the other axial
(20:22:19) Grumpy: OK - Pter found that two pulses into a bifilar coil (as in two wires) with one signal delayed aout 220ns cause the two pulses to combine into one large sharp pulse when they supperpositioned (coincided)
(20:23:28) Grumpy: screw the bias for now - get rotation - ok - since the hv only exists when the two pulses are combined and one pulse is faster than the other, then the position of the hv pulse with "rotate" around the circle
Just a quick chat dump for the sake of my memory and a comment...
(22:27:04) WaveWatcher: Hope Peter can carry that torch. The tight control on delays are a problem for me until this PS is finished.
(22:27:34) WaveWatcher: (not a conventional power supply)
(22:29:46) Grumpy: no delas here either..hmm
(22:31:33) Grumpy: we can have a working TPU in a few weeks - no bs - we were told but did not imediately understand the clues
(22:32:10) Grumpy: no one ever thought of using an accelerator...LOL!
(22:32:24) WaveWatcher: Yes someone did.
(22:32:43) WaveWatcher: Have you looked at my avatar?
(22:33:02) Grumpy: but you need the perp field and someone tried to erase that from the face of the earth
(22:33:35) Grumpy: I can;t quite read it
(22:34:02) Grumpy: this will work and was a great problem in early telegraph days
(22:34:32) WaveWatcher: The poloidal windings I suggested prvide the perp(radial) magnetic
(22:34:50) Grumpy: that be it
(22:35:17) WaveWatcher: I am convinced the acceleration must be of the actual electrons, not charges.
(22:35:31) Grumpy: yes, they are pullsed by the ES field
(22:35:37) Grumpy: pulled
(22:36:09) WaveWatcher: the highest speed attainable is in the Sonic range, but who cares..
(22:36:56) Grumpy: anything faster than normal drift will have much higher voltage
(22:37:03) WaveWatcher: Sonic also means a 'pulse' can be at a single location on the winding at a point in time
(22:37:41) Grumpy: yes that is what you want - localized force
(22:37:47) Grumpy: moving
(22:38:20) Grumpy: roudn and round - the inductive effect is cumulative and builds up so more and more electrons are dragged along
(22:38:42) WaveWatcher: If it is a single point - not the whole winding - it can be moved
(22:39:08) Grumpy: it has to rotate for everything else to come into play
(22:39:55) Grumpy: that is why pulsing a coil will never work, but several coils indiually or this bilar-delay method will work
(22:40:04) WaveWatcher: then you make a second one to follow but relative reverse polarity and you are rotating one of .99's electric dipole in orbit around the center of the TPU
(22:40:23) Grumpy: that compass rotated electrostatically
(22:40:48) Grumpy: I stay away from rottaing electric dipole in center
(22:40:52) Grumpy: brb
(22:41:29) WaveWatcher: it would see an electric dipole as ES. The dipole(s) would be running around the circumference.
I don't have SS control of things like delays. I use coil position and configuration to cover that need, currently.
What folks call a 'collector' I call one axis of control. The all covering over-wrap coil is the collector. Under that are three horizontal controls, each having three set of segmented coils over them.
Firing in quadrature only creates motor-like rotation. You can't cause axial rotation of a 'charge point' unless it is a plasma. Dipoles are needed. Two dipoles, each spanning the diameter of the system and 90 deg, or less, from each other, create overall rotation around the system center.
Take it for what it is worth. I've only seen about 1 volt of DC so my way isn't right either.
Good night :)
the collector is the coil that you are inducing current into
Get the rotating ES field, add the perpendicular force field which increases current substantially, and we make front page of NSA Daily. Rotating field must be ES not EM or you will have to run it very very fast (Marinov) and you still need the other field.
2kw doesn't scratch the surface. 20kw is very reasonable. Totally scalable.
Just need some techies on-board. AVEC is easier in some respects, but Peter had used delay chips, so that makes it easy to get the delay.
I have some 900v mosfets if someone wants to ride.
I believe i have pretty well proved the large pulse is a result of altered coil characteristics, when you pulse then wait and pulse again the coil undergoes a change in it's parameters, thus allowing the 2ND pulse to rise and fall much easier, in other words it's a new way of sharpening a pulse much like Spheric suggested using saturable inductors, this also explains why i could get crackling in my coils by using certain delay settings, the 2ND pulse can be extremely fast and is not impeded by the normal impedance of the coil.
900 volt FET's wont survive and are also too slow anyway, if you remember all the trouble i had with blowing fet's, the reason being that anything over 50 volts can reach kv in a matter of nS and the fet will burn before you know it, this problem is 2 fold because the EM pulse it's self triggers the fet into conduction causing the fet to become unstable and switch on a lot more than it should which again causes a fast demise.
To try and get round this i used a white noise generator to drive each bifilar coil, this worked because the timing was random for each fet and once in a while the timing would be correct to produce the fast sharp pulse causing the crackling, because the white noise was random you would not be in a position to have a constant sharp pulse forming and therefore to a degree the fet was saved from a heated death, but even then i had failures and this was down to voltage breakdown within the fet.
When the setup with the white noise was safely producing the crackling noises, they were along the full length of the wire, i could hold a magnet in any place along the length of crackling wire and feel the jolts with the magnet, this does raise an interesting point, if the sharpened pulses that create the crackle are so fast and sharp how can the magnet register a jolt, is the build and collapse of the magnetic field during a crackle a lot longer than a few nS, and why is the crackling along the entire length of the wire, using the white noise generator to trigger the crackling, it should have only produced one localized crackle somewhere along the length of wire(Does one crackle produce reverberation)
Peter,
Ever heard of SEB?
Anyone using n-Channel MOSFets, IGBT's, Bi-Polars and almost any other solid-state device for switching above 28V should consider reading up on SEB and related issues.
http://powerelectronics.com/power_semiconductors/power_mosfets/circuit-zapping-cosmic-radiation-0907/
Avalanche transistors work well, but they burn real fast if you go into Zener mode. If I can work out the delay, then two av stacks should work.
Another option might be to use two frequencies and/or run the pulses in opposite directions. Delay seems simple enough though.
No doubts that you have to get the pulse field to rotate, by any means necessary.
Quote from: Peterae on 2010.12.29, 07:45:13
I believe i have pretty well proved the large pulse is a result of altered coil characteristics, when you pulse then wait and pulse again the coil undergoes a change in it's parameters, thus allowing the 2ND pulse to rise and fall much easier, in other words it's a new way of sharpening a pulse much like Spheric suggested using saturable inductors, this also explains why i could get crackling in my coils by using certain delay settings, the 2ND pulse can be extremely fast and is not impeded by the normal impedance of the coil.
900 volt FET's wont survive and are also too slow anyway, if you remember all the trouble i had with blowing fet's, the reason being that anything over 50 volts can reach kv in a matter of nS and the fet will burn before you know it, this problem is 2 fold because the EM pulse it's self triggers the fet into conduction causing the fet to become unstable and switch on a lot more than it should which again causes a fast demise.
To try and get round this i used a white noise generator to drive each bifilar coil, this worked because the timing was random for each fet and once in a while the timing would be correct to produce the fast sharp pulse causing the crackling, because the white noise was random you would not be in a position to have a constant sharp pulse forming and therefore to a degree the fet was saved from a heated death, but even then i had failures and this was down to voltage breakdown within the fet.
When the setup with the white noise was safely producing the crackling noises, they were along the full length of the wire, i could hold a magnet in any place along the length of crackling wire and feel the jolts with the magnet, this does raise an interesting point, if the sharpened pulses that create the crackle are so fast and sharp how can the magnet register a jolt, is the build and collapse of the magnetic field during a crackle a lot longer than a few nS, and why is the crackling along the entire length of the wire, using the white noise generator to trigger the crackling, it should have only produced one localized crackle somewhere along the length of wire(Does one crackle produce reverberation)
OK on the FETs.
I got the same jolts in a magnet held near a CCU coil. I think the pule field (electric) interacted with the atoms of the magnet and altered their velocity, causing little surges of increased magnetism. This varies somewhat with orientation.
Anyone have an avalanche pulser?
I may have confused the issue by misquoting SM so I took some time this morning to make a transcript of the last few minutes of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_jJExZ1mBE&playnext=1&list=PLB1B2087E4EC1AB40&index=51
Quote34:11:26
This technology basically makes batteries obsolete
There would be no reason to have a battery to power an automobile or anything like that
If you used these devices
34:23:11
We have made larger devices which put out an average of 20 amps of current at 1000 volts
34:30:21
These devices could easily power large industry in third world nations
34:36:06
They could even power uh aircraft uh without the use of fossil fuel or whatever that might have to be and um
34:42:16
The uh basic point to all this is that this is a new technology, an entirely new way of doing things, it is not a battery, it is not collecting energy from outer space
34:56:03
In fact the technology utilized in this is very si (blanked out) receiving (blanked out) new (blank out) find old (blank out) verse engineering philosophy
35:12:19
This is not magic, this is not technology which is basically the equivalent of perpetual motion, it is not that at all.
35:20:22
The power comes from a very viable source that we use everyday, electromagnetic fields
uses elecromagnetism or uses a magnetic field to create electron flow in a wire,its its been around for hundreds of years, its what we use everyday. and basically that's what we are doing here, we are creating electron flow in wire uh
35:41:23
This device has uh the ability to uh to produce power uh probably for uh every uh application that we have now today that utilizes batteries.
35:56:26
This would replace, I would think, almost everything.
35:59:04
uh It is possible to utilize uh uh several of these units to create probably uh thousands of amps of current if necessary.
36:11:22
You will notice that the device has been in operation for twenty solid minutes now uhm there basically uh uh is no heat uh
I may have left out a few um's. We really need to find a copy without the blanked out section (34:56:03).
Note: I used the on screen elapsed time counter.
Grumpy,
I think it was you who made a comment about caps going bad, in short time, when near high voltage pulsing experiments, even when they were not in that circuit?
Wouldn't it bite if we found out a TPU focuses cosmic radiation as an energy source?
I've seen MOV's, CMOS, all forms of transistors and electrolytics go bad (with their leads shorted) while stored on my bench. I moved my parts bins to an opposite wall because of SEB. The problem went away. Anything using metal-oxide layers is a problem.
I have suspected for a long time that this puncturing of a substrate only happens when exposed to the radial field generated by two bucking magnetic fields and the subsequent angular displacement of any local charge field.
Sounds 'Whack', I know. It also sounds like a good reason to use tubes or switch to SS using deep space designs and materials for circuits AND place that SS in the center of the TPU.
Even with all of that I am still convinced high voltage is not a requirement but only a result. The HV pulses possible from my custom PS are from a very fast IGBT driving a pulse/step-up transformer. That transformer feeds a coaxial pulse forming line. B+(Vc for you SS fans) does not go through my coils.
So, my best path is to continue what I have going.
Peter,
My current power supply and shop work have the target of supplying you with the sub-resonance methods I offered. I must make sure you can reproduce the effect.
The results of my 'pinching/delay/resonance' experiments are much the same as yours. Yes, I am sure you are correct about the parameters of the coil (and surrounding space) change immediately after each pulse. I still slide/trim coils to adjust delay.
Have you ever placed the switch (MOSFet, etc) in the center of the pancake coil? You may need a different coil design to allow that. (centered and same plain as the winding turns).
I just have to inject here, a couple years ago in the Tesla patent 282382(?)and all related things(?) in the Tesla section of OU.com I shared with everyone the anomally I found testing a TPU device using phased AC rotation. A poloidal coil used as core with toroidal windings rotating a magnetic field around this core produced a very high voltage that could not be accounted for with any normal methode of analysis. Using only a 9 volt RMS signal (2 Phases) I got over 30 volts out, there is no way with normal induction that that voltage could have possibly developed (out of the poloidal winding). This voltage increased and decreased with the speed of rotation and seemed more like a static charge but for this to show up it need a very small bias current in the poloidal winding. I used a secondary toroidal coil to supply the bias current for the core the turns ratio was 10:1 so the secondary voltage was about .9 volts. This was rectified and fed to the poloidal winding for the bias current and the output was DC. So once again I am sharing this information with the world because I think we are on the right track here.
Room
Added: Actually I used series resonance with the 9 volt input signal and at the resonant point the secondary output was 2.7 volts that got rectified and used as bias, just for better clarity.
Quote from: Room3327 on 2010.12.29, 17:30:29
I just have to inject here, a couple years ago in the Tesla patent 282382(?)and all related things(?) in the Tesla section of OU.com I shared with everyone the anomally I found testing a TPU device using phased AC rotation. A poloidal coil used as core with toroidal windings rotating a magnetic field around this core produced a very high voltage that could not be accounted for with any normal methode of analysis. Using only a 9 volt RMS signal (2 Phases) I got over 30 volts out, there is no way with normal induction that that voltage could have possibly developed (out of the poloidal winding). This voltage increased and decreased with the speed of rotation and seemed more like a static charge but for this to show up it need a very small bias current in the poloidal winding. I used a secondary toroidal coil to supply the bias current for the core the turns ratio was 10:1 so the secondary voltage was about .9 volts. This was rectified and fed to the poloidal winding for the bias current and the output was DC. So once again I am sharing this information with the world because I think we are on the right track here.
Room
Added: Actually I used series resonance with the 9 volt input signal and at the resonant point the secondary output was 2.7 volts that got rectified and used as bias, just for better clarity.
Best to repost this on your bench as everything is getting lost at OU. Also a back of the napkin sketch with a few driving details would be handy for replication.
ION, It's all right there in my LSR thread I haven't been hiding it. The only difference is I added a second rotating field to it in the LSR thread.
:)
I should add that when I posted this information, I was hit with denial of service and had my computer lock up every time I went to OU.com and had hundreds of viruses loaded onto my computer, I had nothing but trouble with them after that and that is why I left there.
Quote from: Room3327 on 2010.12.29, 17:58:54
I should add that when I posted this information, I was hit with denial of service and had my computer lock up every time I went to OU.com and had hundreds of viruses loaded onto my computer, I had nothing but trouble with them after that and that is why I left there.
Room3327,
I wouldn't attribute those computer issues with what is posted. The cause is the site you visited. OU.com blasts your machine with almost every hook in the book. Some of those turned out to be trojans for me. I am no newbee to computers and networking. It is more due to the methods always evolving.
I would like to see some detail on the rotation you mentioned. In my experience, if the output requires rectification to produce DC then the rotation is conventional and motor-like not an elliptical wave or precession. I gave up on motor-like rotation a while ago for TPU research.
I'll look for that thread you mentioned. Thanks.
WW,
I was rectifing the toroidal secondary winding that was running on AC the output from the poloidal winding is unidirectional or DC as the field is rotating in one specific direction (CW or CCW). I know it was hard for me to believe too.
::)
Added: I didn't have any computer problem with OU.com until I started posting.
I just looked at your info.
No, it isn't hard to believe O0
It is easier (for me, anyway) to obtain precession with a sine and an exact copy of that sine only delayed.
Nice looking work and planning :)
Did you ever try loading that unrectified DC output?
WW,
Yes, I loaded the output and that is why I say it appeared to be a static charge, It definately was not overunity but I don't know how correct my parameters were either. It's very possible to improve on what I tested as I have with my last coil (pictures in the LSR thread). The testing was done with a toroid I had wound and then had to take apart as the windings were connected wrong for rotation I used part of that coil and added a poloidal winding to the outside of that. I'm sure you know that most of the magnetic field in a toroid is contained in the core so what I was seeing, was due to the little field on the outside of the toroid. I am very sure moving the poloidal winding to the inside of the toroid will improve things significantly, which I did with my last transformer (photos) I just have not tested it yet because as I said I lost interest when it seemed no one else had any interest in it. You can lead horses to water but you can't make them drink.
;D
Quote from: Room3327 on 2010.12.29, 17:52:11
ION, It's all right there in my LSR thread I haven't been hiding it. The only difference is I added a second rotating field to it in the LSR thread.
:)
Sorry I hadn't seen the LSR mentioned in that post, thought you were talking about something different. Yes I've been to your bench and looked it over in the past.
There is another issue besides SEB, that I have found to be quite a pain in the neck and head. When you use HV, short (few ns) pulses, into a high impedance coil, you create a very strong, rapidly changing elecyric field. Go have a quick look at 9th grade physics text and they show that electrons and other charges move in an isolated object as well as objects connected to ground. Add that the inducing effect is made much stronger by the rapid change and you suddenly get large currents in conductors regardless of how they are protected. If you place your mosfets in a metal box of foil bag, the transient electric pulse induces a current in the box or bag and in the mosfets. It took me a while to hack through the pseudoscience BS surrounding "radiant electricity" and determined how it can go through objects.
The attached image is from page 153 of "Electrical Transients in Power Systems", by Allan Greenwood.
Even the third object is entirely between the other two, the ES field of the first object still affects objects 2 and 3. Even if you ground the middle object, the electric field pulse with induce the grounded cage and the object inside.
The random Hutchison effect explained with resonant control.
http://wbabin.net/ntham/davis.pdf
Resonance in a ring.
I agree with the double pulse in a ring config. I have posted that before also. Currently working on digitally controlled sine generator with Jason. The board had some flaws that I am working out. Submitted these to Jason already. He has a hit list to re-engineer.
Quote from: ION on 2010.12.29, 15:33:06
I may have confused the issue by misquoting SM so I took some time this morning to make a transcript of the last few minutes of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_jJExZ1mBE&playnext=1&list=PLB1B2087E4EC1AB40&index=51
Quote
34:42:16 The uh basic point to all this is that this is a new technology, an entirely new way of doing things, it is not a battery, it is not collecting energy from outer space
34:56:03 In fact the technology utilized in this is very si (blanked out) receiving (blanked out) new (blank out) find old (blank out) verse engineering philosophy
35:12:19 This is not magic, this is not technology which is basically the equivalent of perpetual motion, it is not that at all.
35:20:22 The power comes from a very viable source that we use everyday, electromagnetic fields
uses electromagnetism or uses a magnetic field to create electron flow in a wire,its its been around for hundreds of years, its what we use everyday, and basically that's what we are doing here, we are creating electron flow in wire uh
I may have left out a few um's. We really need to find a copy without the blanked out section (34:56:03).
Note: I used the on screen elapsed time counter.
Looking at what SM says that is not deleted, he claims to have found a new way to cause electrons to flow in a wire.
The deleted parts are hard to guess at, but someone deleted them for a reason, as they appear to be deliberate rather than random audio that was arbitrarily lost. He mention "verse engineer philosophy". Possibly "reverse engineering philosophy", as in he may have determined what makes electrons drift and become a current at a fundamental level.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.29, 23:53:45
I may have left out a few um's. We really need to find a copy without the blanked out section (34:56:03).
Note: I used the on screen elapsed time counter.
Looking at what SM says that is not deleted, he claims to have found a new way to cause electrons to flow in a wire.
The deleted parts are hard to guess at, but someone deleted them for a reason, as they appear to be deliberate rather than random audio that was arbitrarily lost. He mention "verse engineer philosophy". Possibly "reverse engineering philosophy", as in he may have determined what makes electrons drift and become a current at a fundamental level.
Yes I had capsulized what you have underlined in the chat the other day, which led to some confusion, as if it were a direct statement. Chat box was not allowing me to send anything over a few words, so I was shortening phrases. Most of what I wanted to say never got through to explain this.
I tried snipping out the blank parts and normalizing the audio portion of the blank areas back up to zero db, hoping there may have been some residual audio, but to no avail.
There is a possibility of artifacts of the audio embedded in the video, but I don't know how to extract this. I'm not sure if we are listening to the HiFi audio or standard audio.
There may be a copy out there somewhere that does not have blanked audio, a pre UEC version. Jack Durban probably has a copy. None of the Durban videos have UEC branding.
My guess is the UEC branded videos came well after the fact....may have been a Brian Collins scam behind SM's back or SM may have been complicit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X26_8LW-S2o
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=167210479374903373
4GB
http://www.samsonium.org/sites/default/files/SM_TPU_DVD.torrent
interview with Jack (nothing nice to say...):
http://pesn.com/Radio/Free_Energy_Now/recordings/2008/080319_JackDurban_MarksToroid.mp3
First, I would respectfully request that speculations about the TPU, real or fake be kept in the appropriate thread: "The TPU Was IT Real"
Second, I would like to respond to MH and some of his "quick draw" analysis of the TPU.
I believe it is ok to have an opinion that it is fake, for it may very well have been a scam, but it is necessary to arrive at this viewpoint after having done the appropriate "due diligence", which includes at least a few hundred hours of research into the knowns and unknowns.
I suggest starting at the beginning of this thread and read as much as you can.
While I respect MH's ability to sniff out the bogus devices such as Ainslie, Bedini, Steorn, Romero and others and am completely in agreement his position on these devices, in the case of the larger TPU devices, to arrive so quickly at an opinion that it was done with hidden batteries using a small "joule thief" converter demonstrates a lack of prowess in the field of power engineering. Converters of this class (flyback) are rarely used for more than 100 watts output. Take some classes at Power Integrations to understand why. The larger SM17 supposedly demonstrated 800 watts output and was extremely lightweight for it's power density.
Regarding the Jack Durban interview by Sterling Allen, it is the most ridiculous interview I ever heard anyone conduct, as none of the real questions were asked, and JD demonstrated a superficial knowledge of the art and science of electronics. Even the questions posed by Hartmann and other callers lacked substance. It seemed to be another prop in the Sterling Allen free energy circus.
As for the recorded telephone message from SM to JD, clearly a contrived bit of theatrics, so one must ask why JD walked away from a device he claims to have believed was real so many years ago, a device that would have dwarfed anything on his website, only to surface later to trash SM's reputation. Of course later we learn that JD and SM have kissed and made up after the screaming episode.
I would recommend one stay away from the soap opera stuff and focus on the early reports and Dr. Schinzinger's involvement and letters to SM.
When you read this thread from the beginning you will see that Dr. Schinzinger had impeccable credentials and knew power engineering, was not easily fooled and knew how to conduct the appropriate test to determine whether the device had hidden batteries etc. He was a mentor to the electric vehicle club at UCI.
By doubling the load and noting voltage drop, he could calculate the output impedance of the device. Read his lab report at the beginning of this thread. Note that it occurred Dec 12, 1995, before most of the videos were shot.
Those who have not done their homework could easily "shoot from the hip" with a quick assesment, but like the characters in the movie "Twelve Angry Men" they might have to reconsider their quick opinion when asked to reflect on the evidence.
I have spent a lifetime in the field of power engineering, also did my share of bit banging in the 6502 days, with many successful and profitable microcomputer designs. Now we use PICs.
"not just a bit jockey"
Ion:
Great posting and "Twelve Angry Men" is a movie that everyone should see. It's a truly awesome move. Indeed, I am shooting from the hip and will confess (again) that the whole TPU business is not my cup of tea. And I am also not very knowledgeable with respect to power electronics. But I do know the basics about how transformers work.
I am only left with the hard-ball question; "It's 15 years since 1996 and the SM TPU seemingly only exists in the imaginations of the forum enthusiasts. Where the f*ck is it if it is supposed to be real?"
I guess that's a rhetorical question! lol
MileHigh
The pattern of OU'ers ends in fustration and/or dissillusionment. They then turn into lurkers or rip chords.
Quote(20:28:39) giantkiller: a trigger coil can be used on the base of a transistor to fluxuate a coil.
(20:29:18) giantkiller: I am working on the SM17 model for some time now. Life gets in the way.
(20:30:29) giantkiller: the chatbox gets lossy.
(20:31:02) giantkiller: I have 3 18" loops that I want to use as ZPE readers.
(20:31:47) giantkiller: I also had resonated iron core in a couple of my tests and want to get back to that.
(20:33:05) giantkiller: My suspicion is that the large loops face the earth and the ionosphere and can read this activity.
(20:33:37) giantkiller: So if an iron core can be resonated then the field of the earth can be also.
(20:34:24) giantkiller: The strange effects that some see are probably related to this activity.
(20:35:22) giantkiller: This is related to 'jacking the field' or the electron motion that itseung8 stated.
(20:35:58) giantkiller: it happens in a core and in space through resonance.
I had posted that center toroid thingy is a voice coil driver.
I have a model that injects noise into the driver that drives the coils. I used buffer chips instead of true drivers so that stage has to be replaced.
This was a hot summer and the bench was cookin'. Winter is here and I am headin' back in.
If anybody is in a hurry then do it yourself. I always post steps of progress or tests. I want what all you guys want. The extensive blaring has to be weeded through for any nuggets if any more are needed.
You want to know my theory?
The TPU is a recruitment program. Somebody should have figured it out by now. Too many involved with no results. What happens to the prairie dogs?
Question:
When a LC circuit or pole pig goes into hyper resonance because of unwarranted feedback, how does it self destruct without blowing the relays up channel feeding it?
Is this post all over the place? Not really. These things are related to the TPU.
The ZPF/ZPE information piqued my sight and is added to the que. I feel it is related. What else could it be? That is if the TPU is not sequential stun guns in a loop.
These 2 snippets are all that I feel are left in addition to resonance and self destructive feedback.
Any other ideas? We got audio, power, component, process, electrical, digital, physics, chemistry minds here... And all these have expended many hours and delivered facts to no avail...
'I am not finished' equals 'Haunted'.
Quotethe whole TPU business is not my cup of tea. And I am also not very knowledgeable with respect to power electronics. But I do know the basics about how transformers work.
I am only left with the hard-ball question; "It's 15 years since 1996 and the SM TPU seemingly only exists in the imaginations of the forum enthusiasts. Where the f*ck is it if it is supposed to be real?"
MileHigh
Nothing new. Only fuel. The frustrated are left to die on the vine. Sorry, that is the game. So what does one get when they smack a coil real hard in resonance? I am tired of losing equipment to EMP blasts. I am pro at this. I could end up in jail as a 'Lone, crazed gunman' with the damage I can do. For what end? There has got to be a fine line in all of this...
I'm not sure if MH is aware of this, but it's worth repeating that Steven Mark, the inventor, tells us the TPUs are not overunity devices, but simply energy conversion devices or a type of radio receiver, that are tuned to a frequency (around 5000 Hz or so) and operate on magnetic fields. I believe him. As such, I can say that there are lots of TPUs around, under the disguise of magnetic wireless power. MIT guys are working on it, and Intel, and a few companies already have products for sale. However, all these products are different in design than the TPUs. They are basically tuned LC circuits, and they couple through the magnetic field, but the TPUs, while making use of the magnetic field, uses a different approach at extracting energy from the fields. It's such a unique and powerful technique that the DOE wants to keep it under wraps, so we are told.
Check out these videos for example, all resonant magnetic coupling.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtZx_qI8BlM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OlOexol5NI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYqxH8lGznA&feature=related
EM:
I am so tired of hearing the old "energy conversion" line. I view that as the "get out of jail free" card that so many people play from both sides. For most cases, they are normally not talking about the electromagnetic spectrum or sound energy or radioactive particles, etc. Science has a pretty good handle of all of the different forms of energy out there. The "other source of energy" is not definable and not measurable but it's there. Right.
If people are so convinced that there is unknown energy out there that various devices "convert" then why not try to build an "unknown energy detector" for starters? Just a lousy detector, not a working device.
I made the comment where I said that people that allege over unity from their motors should scope the signals and show exactly where in the timing of the device the excess energy is manifesting itself in the real world. At least show that if you can't explain what's going on, at least you have to be able to make some empirical observations that show the presence of the excess electrical energy. Lo and behold, it appears that no one can do that.
For the SM device, from your background, can't you definitively state that there is no electromagnetic energy or alternating magnetic fields at around 5000 Hz that are pervasive everywhere? That's a kind of electromagnetic "Manna from Heaven" argument. It's just not real and I don't buy Steven Mark's "energy conversion device" argument.
The near-field magnetic resonant wireless power stuff is separate and distinct from Steven Mark's pitch. For those systems, you plug your plug into a wall socket to generate the alternating magnetic field.
Some of you can believe that Steven Mark has figured out a "unique and powerful" system for tapping into an alternating magnetic field - but there is a problem here - I suppose that we are dealing with a magnetic field that "comes from somewhere but we can't explain it and we can't measure it."
I will try to watch the videos later. I am not trying to give you a hard time either, I know that you are just giving me generic information about Steven Mark. I suppose that I can end by saying (again) where is a device? Also, I don't want to see it lighting a light bulb, I want to hear how it works explained to me and backed up with clear and unambiguous scope and multimeter measurements. I am willing to bet that most of you reading this would bet that if there were new Steven Mark video clips released you would all expect that you will never see real measurements made with scientific instruments. The best that you can hope for is to see a light bulb of unknown wattage being lit up with an unknown waveform and recorded by a camera with an unknown light sensitivity and unknown lens aperture setting. So you will never know if you are looking at a 20-watt light bulb or a 150 watt light bulb.
You know it just occurred to me that there is almost a type of Stockholm Syndrome with respect to the forum participants that believe in free energy. Whenever something promising comes along it's basically a forgone conclusion that you will see demos with huge obvious holes in the data and you will have to speculate endlessly. If the holes are so obvious, why doesn't the person making the clip plug those holes and show the measurements that the people want to see? Then you can expect the inventor to go underground and the device to be withdrawn from view or disappear, or, be taken apart. There is so much conditioning of the "prisoners" that this is the normal state of affairs.
Okay, sorry for the rant but Steven Mark and the grainy black and white video is a classic example of the syndrome. Steven is a dungeon master.
MileHigh
MH
Thank you for not taking offense at my post although it could have been offensive.
My stance is this: I don't have the desire to spoon feed anyone about the TPU. The amount of information that was shared on at least three other forums, and one underground group was enormous. A lot of bright, savvy engineers and techs covered every angle you could imagine and spent nearly five years in the process.
We tried every imaginable way to debunk the information and videos, frame by frame analysis, video restoration, scrutinizing all of the available information with a fine tooth comb. Hidden battery theories and analysis etc.
There are many ways some of the devices could have been faked. Some, however were way more difficult to fake, but not impossible.
I would like to give up on the TPU but of all the devices ever presented, it has haunting incongruities that do not sit well with an outright rejection. I have tried to get away from it but cannot reconcile a few things.
Excuse me if I get a bit edgy when a newcomer has an instant analysis. I can only suggest one start with the first few pages of this thread. That is the tip of a giant iceberg, but there is so much more. You will not find it on the internet anymore, it has been buried.
Possibly some of us have it archived and can share it, but you have to have the taste for it, a few hundred hours to spend, and an open mind (but not so open that your brains have rattled out).
If it was a scam, it certainly did not seem to start that way, and some quirk of SM's personality veered him from his original work, the work which which seemed to greatly interest Dr. Schinzinger
I discount many here, GK included, that talk with apparent knowledge and authority of what made the TPU tick. Many talk in circles or just like to hear themselves espouse their latest theory. They know little and have not delivered the repeatable definitive experimental proof of concept. Just talk talk talk. Empty, practically undecipherable rhetoric with all the buzzwords and cryptic inuendo.
edit: sorry for the shot GK, but you need to improve your communication skills.
This is not the language of engineering or how engineers communicate information. They do it with clearly drawn schematics and text that clearly defines every working aspect of the schematic including timing diagrams and data.
Successful projects, even where there are great unknowns, like the Manhatten Project, have project leaders and designers that pool the best minds into groups where their unique talents are harnessed to the goals accomplishment. Forums are more like a Keystone Kops fire drill.
I am pretty much fed up with the talkers, but I guess that's what forums are for, where the biggest ego's can shine like those lightbulbs they try to light.
To All,
How might the TPU work if it is real?
Hi G
To properly study this we would need to propose maybe five theories in separate threads, and set our minds to studying each possibility.
We could select a panel of arbitors to appraise and grade the merits of each theory. I would choose you, exnihiloest, MH, AC, POYNT and Peterae and a few others.
We would have to be focused and not derail each thread. Those wishing to may submit a theory to be added, provided it is well researched. Then by process of elimination we might arrive at the goal of a working theory.
Otherwise it's Keystone Kops Fire Drill time again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZBdxvego1E
I give you this:
The tpus thump and discharge huge sparks without arcing to the person holding on.
These two items are the starting point of any and all analysis.
One should start here to accept or deny the validity of the TPU. No?
With the experience and skills here this should be just a stun gun on a large transformer.
Lighting light bulbs is not a true test. We all know this. But SM runs a converter to a tv and drill.
If a fake is to be found then this is the place.
Discussing parameters of components and standard processes has not accomplished jack shit in 15 years. Shame on all of us since our ivory towers of knowledge are merely placards for the hopeless.
I do not hoard the dirt from piles of failed attempts but am merely sifting for the nuggets that i see apply to the two items at the beginning of this post.
I hope this level of eloqution is understandable and acceptable.
Maybe, just maybe lighting a lightbulb was SMs way of shedding a little light on a larger process.
I have no problem with the use of standard incandescent lamps as a load provided the wattage is known and the lamps are pretested for power usage.
I am reasonably certain that there were no trick bulbs used in SM's tests. There were a lot of smart cookies present that would know the difference between a trick bulb, a 15 Watt bulb and a 100 Watt bulb, both in temperature and light output.
I find no problem with Dr. Schinzingers use of incandescent lamps in the lab report. I would have done the same thing in his shoes and having a limited amount of time for the testing. Metering instruments can be easily fooled by peaky waveshapes, the lamps integrate all this into a true RMS power output.
Those that have worked around power could easily tell you approximately how much is being dissipated by a red hot wire of a certain length, diameter, and material type.
So lamps are a valid test method.
Incandescants can be lit by 2 methods. Two wire current or one wire electrostatic. SMs light bulbs were hot when running. This makes the tpu even more interesting.
But this is a minor after effect. Produce the thumping and the huge sparkage then the engine is started.
I do not see anybody addressing this and these are relevant effects or outputs since we dont have scope shots.
I would agree with this and add a few more points, like the "stiction" washboard effect when clearly elevated on the pair of wooden table leaves. This may be either an interaction with the gravitational field or the magnetic field of the earth.
It was witnessed by many and a key clue, but we have no further trail to follow.
By thumping, I presume you mean the vibrational effects.
As for the sparking or arcing, there are two ways I have seen this type of effect:
1) extremely large inductance charged with sufficient DC current
2) high frequency RF type discharge
This is for Grumpy. ;) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9fdHWs_xGM
Thanks Moby,
Hard to see a youtube video on dial-up. I can download at work if it is a file.
Tried to download and post it for ya Budd, its too big, Its Dan Davidson speaking on shape power, i remember us looking for his book of the same name some years ago, and i thought you may enjoy the viewing of it. he also has a full seminar on the subject on TY these days.
And i guess since i kinda hyjacked the thread i should at least try to stay on topic, "Is the TPU real?" yes IMHO it is but (we) lack the proper material to make it work properly. as a math-a l33t, and this is my own opinion based on calculations derived years ago using the SWAG method, we would need to cause the summation of magnetic resonance somewhere handy the median spectrum of visible light, umm yeah,, around 430-480,THz, good luck with that in a copper and iron aircore coil as suggested by SM. and if ya can find a FET or any other switch that fast id love to read the data sheet.
with that said its not hard to build a big ass fuji blocking JT type circuit and alot of us did build these, some of those old farts are here on the forum ( You know who ya are! :-X lol ) the problem is/was heat. you get about 1 amp@100 V for 10 minutes then it burns up. the DC is garbage and hardly usable for anything but burning rosin off of magnet wire. far far far from OU. but they do make neat high output lights if ya can stand being around the RF they throw at ya. thats probably all the SM device really was any way, hell take a real close look at it with the fuji mod Joule Thief in mind. thats my financed .02. and sorry to hyjack the thread. :-X
QuoteFor the SM device, from your background, can't you definitively state that there is no electromagnetic energy or alternating magnetic fields at around 5000 Hz that are pervasive everywhere? That's a kind of electromagnetic "Manna from Heaven" argument. It's just not real and I don't buy Steven Mark's "energy conversion device" argument.
QuoteSome of you can believe that Steven Mark has figured out a "unique and powerful" system for tapping into an alternating magnetic field - but there is a problem here - I suppose that we are dealing with a magnetic field that "comes from somewhere but we can't explain it and we can't measure it."
MH,
you probably didn't see what I posted in the past on this TPU stuff, but I answered those questions as they were burning questions for me as well. It's the TPU that attracted me to these forums back in 2005. A fellow engineer sent me the links to one of Steven Mark's videos and I got hooked. I just had to find out how he was doing it!
Let me give you a quick summery.
After 4 years or so, my search culminated in a very unpopular viewpoint with the TPU crowds, and some of the guys here don't like to hear this again. I hope you welcome this view because it's the only one that is scientific and highly likely, especially if you watch the videos and Steven himself affirms this view. When I discovered the location of where Steven tested and filmed his videos in the 1990's, at the so called "MANSION" in Anaheim California, I went to this location personally and saw the High Voltage power lines right behind his house, a mere 20 meters away. I also brought with me a magnetic field meter that I built and measured the MAGNETIC fields and they are HUGE! I made a few videos and posted spectrum graphs of this energy. The spectrum is basically full of 60 hz harmonic frequencies extending up to almost 6 or 8 kHz. These are called in the industry, Power Line Harmonics (PLH) and they are due to all the switching equipment and nonlinear transformers on the power grid. Steven's TPUs are basically just tuned and resonant receivers to these frequencies, the power comes from the grid, and there is no doubt about that in my mind.
So when I say the TPUs are no different in operating principles to the magnetic wireless power I mean it, but the construction is obviously different since Steven has a very low frequency resonator in his hand. The Intel and MIT guys work in the MHz range, so naturally the tank circuits are different and simpler. But at 5 KHz an LC tank circuit would be huge and of very low Q. Steven has something very special in that he has a very low frequency high Q receiver. To all indications, it is a type of acoustic vibrator integrated with a receiving loop of wire and somehow activated by a magnet, much like a speaker needs a magnet to work. He also talks about rotating magnetic fields and vibration, so it's something quite exotic he designed, and has lot's of merit for further study even though I for one am convinced this is NOT OVERUNITY, if we understand where the power comes from. I get the feeling sometimes that people DO NOT WANT TO KNOW WHERE THE POWER COMES FROM, so they can FEEL GOOD AND SAY THEY HAVE AN OVERUNITY DEVICE.
Anyway, I don't want to bore you with too much detail, but that's my view point: the TPU power we observe comes from the electromagnetic pollution around power lines, period! It's not even pollution if you think about it, it's how power lines work, by necessity the electric and magnetic fields exist around the transmission line and he is tapping into it. On a side note, we discussed if this is ethical and if he is STEALING power, and I would say NO. He is not tuned into 60 Hz, but into the harmonics that are labeled EM pollution by the industry itself, and as such he is entitled to harvest what somebody else throws away!
Just so you know, Steven Mark tested and filmed ALL HIS VIDEOS at his mansion, a mere 20 meters away from the power lines. But we are told that he took the devices down to UC Irvine so the professor could test it, and it worked there as well. OK, this is not big deal to this theory. Some want to point to this fact and say that invalidates this theory, but what they don't know is that the energy from power lines extends for miles, and I would expect there to be power lines around UC Irvine. Steven also tested the TPUs at high altitude in an airplane and it worked, fine, and I have no problem with that either. Power line generated magnetic and electric fields are everywhere pretty much, at least around highly populated places like southern California where Steven Mark lives.
Anyway, you're open to make up your own mind, but I thought I give you my perspective because I have a feeling you will adopt it as it explains the mechanism and the source of energy. The others don't know the source and don't care, they just go with what they were told by Lindsay and experiment away, and that's ok too. I still experiment on the TPUs when I can because there are so many open questions still remaining.
Sorry guys, don't hate me! :D ;D 8)
EM
PS. After posting my theories on the Power Lines as the source, some experimenters thought I was saying the TPUs are FAKE? That's not my definition of FAKE. The TPUs are exactly what you see in the videos: toroids that output power. Fakery would imply Steven was trying to deceive us somehow, and I don't get that feeling from the videos. The TPUs are definitley REAL in my book!
@EM,
Did you not show a wireless demo of a TPU like device on the floor of your house?
(for those that missed it).
And no it is not free. The lines that take the energy past us are owned and operated by companies who expended the cost of construction.
The problem the power companies have is its called noise but can not be elliminated. He, he, he...
So give it a 'Dirty' name and maybe people will fear it. Ha HaHahaHAh. The sheep are lead easily no?
Ooh. Bad radiation! It needs to be avoided for health reasons! Look at those polluters! If everybody could walk around with a tpu for power extraction they wouldnt mind the noise. But alas they pay attention to the 'Man' noise.
Or...
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...
This would truly make it a conversion device.
Imagine the possibilities: Every city can be a power HOT SPOT!
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.06, 19:51:31
As for the sparking or arcing, there are two ways I have seen this type of effect:
1) extremely large inductance charged with sufficient DC current
If we consider that the "energy" in a circuit is not from the movement of electrons, after all, they move so slow as if they are a boat in a river and not the river itself. Then the energy is separate from the particles.
Another thing to consider is that electric and magnetic fields polarize a medium, be it "space", the Direc Sea, or an aether, the properties of this medium are changed. The medium can store energy in the form of these polarizations.
The fields that we can generate seem like byproducts, secondary effects, afterthoughts compared to the ever-spinning particles.
I have tried in vain to explain the TPU with magnetic induction or with particle sources. If anyone can prove me wrong on this fact, I welcome the data.
There was a time that I thought i had discovered another form of induction, but it wasn't. Induction could not explain everything. I can only describe it as an energy build-up where it shouldn't be. It shorts transistors quite readily. It is easily achievable with a dual spark gap or pulse circuit and a gap should anyone want to explore it. Keep your supply ungrounded, then touch it. You will actually feel it, and there will be no doubt about "energy" after that.
The only way the TPU can work, in my humble opinion, is by manipulation of the medium where fields reside. That is, to form electric and magnetic fields without a material source.
I think that the way to do this is by diverging the particles of the medium (stretching by electric impulse) and then curling them around on themselves (rotation induced by a magnetic field), something like that.
It is Soooooo Sooooooo SAD that some individuals keep claiming that SM's TPUs were faked by SM tuning into "juice"
from a power line 20 meters from his mansion.
If that is true, WHY did his TPUs work at the World Famous & Very Prestigous University of Calif (Irvine) Engineering Lab? Claiming SM "fooled"
PROFESSIONAL PROFESSORS with PHD Doctorates in Electrical Engineering Degrees is extremely LUDICROUS! Let's Get Real Here!
Let's Wise Up Now folks. If these ridiculous theories is the best we can do, then we might as well Hang Up Our Jocks, because we
DON'T have a chance in Hell of ever making a TPU.
.
ION,
It looks like you have three theories already.
EM,
If you can help MIT get beyond three feet of wireless transmission without intermediate devices and less than 45% power loss I think they would throw you a party ;)
The dill-wods claimed to invent the method but can't make it work beyond one lab room. What is up with that?
Hey Guys,
I appreciate all of your input and many of the comments have been thought provoking. I also acknowledge that I don't know all of the details about the investigations and everything that people have been working on.
One final thought that may have already been covered. At least for the demos in the mansion, couldn't he have taken a few of the big audio power amplifiers that he apparently had in quantity, and turned a substantial amount of the floor area into an area with an alternating magnetic field to do the job?
Nobody has to answer I assume that has been covered exhaustively.
I will now exit from the thread!
MileHigh
Quote from: AllPhase on 2011.09.07, 01:04:02
It is Soooooo Sooooooo SAD that a certain individual keeps claiming that SM's TPU was faked by SM tuning into "juice" from a power line 20 meters from his mansion.
If that is true, WHY did his TPUs work at the prestigous Cal Tech Engineering Lab? Claiming SM "fooled" Cal Tech PHD Doctorate Electrical Engineers is extremely LUDICROUS!!!
MileHigh,
Do you see the post from Allphase? This is exactly what I was talking about. People get confused and think I am saying the devices are "FAKE", and I am not saying that at all. His TPUs are REAL, as real as it gets. This is energy harvesting at it's best! People talk about free energy and here's free energy in our back yards, why not take it?
You're making a good move exiting this thread, it can take over your life if you let it. LOL ;D
By the way, Steven walks outside with a TPU, about 150 ft away from the house to show there is no coupling to magnetic fields from the house, but at those low frequencies he is still well within a fraction of a wavelength of the power lines.
@AllPhase,
He went to UC Irvine, not Cal Tech. Get your facts straight!
EM
I'd like to hear everyone's ridiculous theories.
You cannot couple 800+ volts at 10 amps from power lines at that distance. If this were how it worked, why the suppression? Why would UEC even bother to buy the device and why would SM still not be permitted to talk about the device?
I've felt it EM, I touched the dragon's tail, and it sure as hell woke me up!
OK....
Lets split this game into 2 battlefields:
The EM device and the Grumpy generator.
In the EM device group the people who find the TPU impossible, build and solicit the EM device for cottage reproduction level.
In the Grumpy generator group the people who are hooked on that model work that effort.
This way both camps are satisfied, egos are assuaged. And we can flank the reality of this planet from both sides and become Gods! Muhwahahaha!
No seriously, it is a good plan.
But one cannot run the EM device from within their home. The load will be seen by the meter. So the device is put on an aluminum back plate to shield the home field from entering the coil. The coils are mounted on the sides of your houses facing your neighbors. We rob Peter to pay Paul. I like this part. >:-)
We will call ourselves Robbing Hood! The plan grows more diabolical by the very moment it lives!
Why these EM devices can be mounted on the sides of electric cars for charging. Every stop light will become a charging station. :o
Seriously: a two pronged approach.
@Grumpy,
My spider senses still nudge me down the ZPE read and amplified feedback setup. I can not see this any other way. The static between AM stations can be read and amplified. It is pervasive and all around us. So we make more of it, read it, amplify it and feed it back. We charge a coil and turn it into a magnetic antenna.
I know what your NDA says. You can not say the terms or process conclusively but you can agree with what some else states.
I was under one for a spell with my patent.
@all,
The SM17 is 3 stacked antennas in the effective aperture mode. Each one is like 4 to 6 turns. Charging these would not power anything.
It also has a vertical winding of antenna wire all the way around. This gives a huge number of 90 degree coupling points/nodes onto the horizontals. If pulsed electrostaticly these nodes all couple and the beast sings. What I find odd is the lights are bright white(electrostatic?) but get hot. And there are huge sparks in that one demo of SM holding the ends. I cant even get near my tests without feeling that warm glow inside.
@MH,
You must not leave. With your transformer knowledge you should be able to resonate 2 transformers with feedback into self destruction. It creates a charge pump.
I'm going to exit this thread for now, but I'll be back!
Keep the experiments and the theories going, nothing is set in stone unless proved on the bench.
here is a little look at what i been working forward in the tpu..
see if you guys are interested..
roobie
The only "NDA" that I have is my own lack of knowledge. Seems that just about everyone signed that one! LOL!
Seriously, all conventional explanations fall short.
Someone posted a list of the sizes and weights vs outputs for all of the TPU's a while back. The later versions had very interesting size vs output ratios.
The 800volts at 10amps is what has kept ahold of me. It think wattsup did the weights.
Here are the weights and outputs someone posted, I have not checked them for correctness:
TPU Weights
12 Ounce Open Unit in the 38 Min Film.
OD = 6 inches.
Height = 2 inches.
Thickness = 1 inch.
Output = 186V @ 5 Amps. 7 Amps with a Heat Sink.
============================================
Small 1 Pounder, Open Coil. Took Magnet from his pocket.
OD = 4 inches.
Height = 1 3/4 inches.
Output = 100V @ 1 Amp. 7.3 Hz & 5 KHz.
=================================
5 Inch Unit evaluated at U of C, by Dr Schinzinger
Date: 12-12-95
OD = 4 ¾". ID = 3 "
Thickness = 7/8 "
Height = 2"
Weight = He said Very Light.
Output = 137 V at 1 Amp through a 100 W Bulb.
Luminescence Meter Measured = 2.5
==================================
17 Inch Unit evaluated at U of C, by Dr Schinzinger
Date: 12-12-95
OD = 17". ID = 15 "
Thickness = 1 "
Height = 4"
Weight = He said about 6 pounds.
Output = 614 V
==================================
Small Open Coil, 1 1/2 Pounder:
OD = 6 inches.
Height = 2 inches.
Thickness = 3/4 inches.
Output = 120V @ 5 Amps. 7.3 Hz & 5 KHz.
=================================
Large 17" Open Coil TPU in video.
OD = 17 inches.
Height = 4 inches.
Thickness =
Weight = 6 Pounds.
Output = 830V @ 1.0 Amps.
===============================================================
MH
Another quick shot with the big audio amps......but he didn't bring those amps to UCI at the prof's lab. We been down this road before.
EM
You are entitled to your opinion about stealing waste power from the power lines. It is a theory to be developed and either accepted or discarded. Respectfully though, other than lighting a few milliwatt LED's how much power can you extract from the power lines ?
I've always considered you one of the brighter guys on the forum, but there may be a time to take a close look at this theory and either develop it to the max or discard it. How much progress has really been made in this area by anyone? I would include it as one of five possible theories, but personally would not hold much hope for it. I consider it a somewhat myopic viewpoint considering the square law for radiation and directionality, and considering all the evidence which points away from this theory which you have conveniently swept away in your desire to promote it. There is a lot of evidence that negates this theory.
Despite my lack of belief in power line harmonic capture, I encourage you to continue working on this theory, and let us know when you've lit those big incandescent lamps.
Kooler:
Showing voltage on a meter is not an indication of power, that's why I don't include SM's first unit as a serious unit to study. It is a curiosity item only. Had SM lit the 25 Watt bulb (the claimed power output), I could take it more seriously. Why he did not do this is strange to me. He should have hooked a real load to the FTPU.
To me a clearly annotated schematic tells a lot more than a video. Where is the schematic, and where is the load? Posting a video such as this tells us little about power in / power output. Exactly what is the point of the demonstration?
QuoteTo me a clearly annotated schematic tells a lot more than a video. Where is the schematic, and where is the load? Posting a video such as this tells us little about power in / power output. Exactly what is the point of the demonstration?
I always saw this as a teaser alluding to bigger things. It also showed stand alone lighting possibilities. I have also come away with this as there will be no spoon feeding from the source. In all these years, people, regardless of knowledge and experience have not reverse engineered the tpu process? What gives? Nobody?
Interesting frequency mapping. Closely ties into Walter Russell.
Quote from: giantkiller on 2011.09.07, 14:20:23
I always saw this as a teaser alluding to bigger things. It also showed stand alone lighting possibilities. I have also come away with this as there will be no spoon feeding from the source. In all these years, people, regardless of knowledge and experience have not reverse engineered the tpu process? What gives? Nobody?
You misunderstood what I was saying, this was specifically addressed to Kooler about his video, not the FTPU.
SM was certainly not about to give away a schematic.
Agreed, though SM's video documenting of the FTPU was brief, hasty, and haphazard. He fumbles with a meter he should have known how to work. He shows no load connected to the device and terminates the video stating he wants to show us another unit. Then proceeds to the garage and the OTPU demo.
The FTPU may very well have been a teaser.
Quote from: EMdevices on 2011.09.07, 03:08:14
I'm going to exit this thread for now, but I'll be back!
Keep the experiments and the theories going, nothing is set in stone unless proved on the bench.
This is the right attitude, as you say, nothing is set in stone unless proved on the bench. That's why I get a little frayed when you matter of fact state you are 100% sure of the power line harmonic capture but cannot demonstrate that level of power capture on the bench.
On another note I should have added a third method to produce the large arcs seen in the video by SM. Charge some large electrolytics to 800 volts and draw the arc through an appropriate value resistor.
SM told us he used a resistor in series with the leads that produced the arc. I propose that the large electrolytics seen in the video were a series stack with bleeder resistors for voltage equalization, a common practice when you need to filter in excess of 450 volts, which is the limit for most commonly available electrolytics.
Had he not used the resistor we would have heard a loud crack when he shorted the output.
SM was an old tube TV guy. He knew this practice of stacking electrolytics from his experience with the boosted B+ common to early tube sets. In those sets a damper diode (tube) is used to catch the flyback pulse and add it to the B+ thus exceeding the rating of the normal 400 volt electrolytics in those sets, hence the need for stacked electrolytics.
The Boosted B+ was used to provide sufficient potential for the plate of the horizontal output tube (flyback driver).
Peterae: you are a TV repair guy from way back, correct me if I'm wrong, I was servicing sets with my dad from about age 10. I'm one of those old farts someone talked about earlier.
Another thing I forgot to mention, a prime clue, is the slight gyroscopic effect present in the TPU. Food for much thought.
I admit SM's first TPU would have been better accepted if he would have connected a 25 W bulb as a load.
HOWEVER, it did work because:
1. He said on camera that it quit working when it was flipped upside down. This PROVES it had a rotating magnetic field that didn't like rotating backwards when flipped over.
2. He said on camera that it had a gyroscopic "feel" to it when the TPU was moved sideways. This proves a rotating magnetic field.
Quote from: AllPhase on 2011.09.07, 16:33:45
I admit SM's first TPU would have been better accepted if he would have connected a 25 W bulb as a load.
HOWEVER, it did work because:
1. He said on camera that it quit working when it was flipped upside down. This PROVES it had a rotating magnetic field that didn't like rotating backwards when flipped over.
2. He said on camera that it had a gyroscopic "feel" to it when the TPU was moved sideways. This proves a rotating magnetic field.
ALLPHASE: you cannot make that leap of judgement to a rotating magnetic field. There are other possible answers such as a rotating acoustic field. Acoustic Ring Resonators also present a gyroscopic effect. What about the washboard stiction effect? You cannot get that simply with a rotating magnetic field. Try rotating a small powerful magnet axially on the end of a motor. You will have the rotating magnetic field but no washboard "stiction" effect.
You may retort that it will have the gyro effect, but it would have that even if you rotated a non-magnetic mass.
Just gather the clues, be careful in making hasty judgements about what it is, we have been down many blind alleys that way.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.07, 16:54:26
ALLPHASE: you cannot make that leap of judgement to a rotating magnetic field. There are other possible answers such as a rotating acoustic field. Acoustic Ring Resonators also present a gyroscopic effect. What about the washboard stiction effect? You cannot get that simply with a rotating magnetic field. Try rotating a small powerful magnet axially on the end of a motor. You will have the rotating magnetic field but no washboard "stiction" effect.
You may retort that it will have the gyro effect, but it would have that even if you rotated a non-magnetic mass.
Just gather the clues, be careful in making hasty judgements about what it is, we have been down many blind alleys that way.
What was said in the videos about the stiction/washboard effect?
Also,
The unit on the glass table did work hanging down by sms side.
Before that he handed it to the other man who stated 'vibrations'.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2011.09.07, 17:11:35
What was said in the videos about the stiction/washboard effect?
In one of the videos the 17"device was placed on top of two table leaves . Onlookers are invited to push the device to and fro to feel the ripple effect.
I used the words stiction / washboard, but would have to review the video to see what was actually said.
From WIKI:
QuoteStiction is an informal portmanteau of the term "static friction" (μs), perhaps also influenced by the verb "stick", coined by Ben Cazzolato. Its existence is questionable.
Two solid objects pressing against each other (but not sliding) will require some threshold of force parallel to the surface of contact in order to overcome static cohesion. Stiction is a threshold, not a continuous force.
I used this (stiction) term to represent a sliding and catching effect although it is probably not a perfect term and I may have misapplied it in this case. "Washboard" or "ripple effect" is probably more accurate.
EMDevices, As much as I respect what you did in tracking down SM and doing the EMF tests one cannot possibly believe all the power SM demonstrated was coming from power lines even at 20 meters. The inverse square law alone would make that impossible. And especially the demos in an airplane and elsewhere makes your theory ridiiculous unless you are just saying the ambient grid EMF is a trigger that got things going in the TPU. That I could almost accept but there is no way you are getting all that power at the distances he had his TPU's unless the grid EMF is just triggering energy from ZPE or some such source.
May I suggest that your continued inability to let go of this nonsensical theory supports blocking your feelings of guilt for not having the balls to go knock on SM's door once you had tracked him down, asked him for a demo and then grabbed his TPU running away like a madman which would have resulted in saving GK thousands of hours of work and would have saved the world by now from it's self destructive course of energy consumption. No guilt trip intended C.C
;D
Ok, another "quick" post for ION! ;)
@ION
QuoteThis is the right attitude, as you say, nothing is set in stone unless proved on the bench. That's why I get a little frayed when you matter of fact state you are 100% sure of the power line harmonic capture but cannot demonstrate that level of power capture on the bench.
That was a rhetorical statement ION, I proved my theory on the bench and you guys have to prove your theory(s). I am 100% convinced of where the power comes from, but you or everybody else doesn't have to share my conviction, and I don't expect you to. I'm not here to convince anybody of anything and I don't believe I can do it either, except perhaps with a demo very similar to SM's, nothing short of that will suffice. I never had the time or the patience to build something like that because what matters to me is that I have proved the concept to myself and now I am at peace. I now have answers and it no longer bothers me that I don't know how he did it. I learned a lot in the process and I'm truly grateful for undertaking this journey. But, like I said, there are still open questions. I don't claim to know all the details of his device just the part about the source of energy.
For people that say SM had 800 volts and 10 amps, can you do that? This is what I have to say:
If I show you a circuit that produces 80 volts and 1 amp, so 10 times less, from an artificial power line, or transmitter, and this transmitter operates at 10 times LOWER voltage than a normal power line, would you be convinced that I have something similar? If you are not than you don't trust circuit analysis and Ohms law. Everything scales up very nicely. I in fact have achieved something very similar that convinced me that IF I SCALE IT UP IT WILL WORK like SMs TPUs. To have this kind of faith requires training and experience, and I don't expect people on this forum to understand and take me at my word. I just don't have the time these days to build something just so I can convince the skeptics, what would I get from this waste of energy? More ridicule? more skepticism? cries of, "you faked it"? No thank you.
Here's what I built to prove to myself and to an engineer coworker, that LOW FREQUENCY RESONANT MAGNETIC COUPLING IS THE MECHANISM USED BY STEVEN MARK: I built a loop 1 m by 1 m, held it vertical about 6 feet off the ground on a camera tripod, and fed it about 200 V AC (not 60 Hz, it gets very hot, don't do this at home, other safety components were used) Than I built a simple LC tuned loop about 10" diameter with a Q of about 100, and received about 3 volts at ..... get this .... 12 meters away ! Can you picture the proportions? OK, let's stop right here and see what this means. Some of you will say, ah that's nothing, 3 volts at 12 meters, that's worthless! Well, for those trained with experience, they know what the important factors are in scaling up this scenario, here they are:
1 ) Loop Area of the Transmitter Coil
2 ) Loop Area of Receiver Coil
3 ) Separation Distance between the loops normalized to the transmitter diameter.
4 ) The Q of the receiver loop
5 ) OrientationGiven these parameters, I was able to transmit significant power, in my opinion, at a distance of at least 10 times the diameter of the loop just by RESONANT MAGNETIC FIELD COUPLING! Those that have not played with this technology do not have an appreciation for this number. We can obviously achieve much farther power transfer with other technologies like directive power transmission utilizing for example radar beams (Sandia has shown they can transmit Kilowatts of power at distances measured in miles at efficiencies of 85% or better. )
Now, how does this relate to Steven Mark and the Power grid?
Well, if we look at a power grid in southern California from space, or normal to the surface of the earth, i.e. a top view, we see MILLIONS OF LOOPS of wire formed by the grid and carrying AC current with high voltages and low frequencies. Keep proportions in mind for this discussion. If we have a high Q receiver and walk around anywhere in southern California we will always be in the near fields of these loops of wire. If we compare the TPU sizes with these large loops across southern California, we have a ratio of loop diameter to receiver diameter that is very large, so naturally I carried out experiments of this type on the bench utilizing large transmission loops and small, or rather miniature receiver loops, something like 20 inches to 1 inch diameter ratio. To my amazement it worked just fine, and being closer to the transmitter loop relative speaking, I was able to transfer much more power than at larger distances with a much larger receiver loop. The mini loops worked beautifully even up to 30 inches away from the TX loop, which would be analogous to Steven Mark taking his TPU up in the air in an airplane above southern California and receiving power from the huge loops formed by the grid on the ground.
So once again, it's all about proportions, everything scales up or down to within reasonable limits dictated by conductivity, skin effects, etc.
The only thing that I did not test extensively and I regret not having done it, is DC2DC conversion of the received power output. I did the analysis and I became convinced that I can scale the received voltage for any of the scenarios I described above, and better match the impedance and extract even more power than with a simple LED or resistor connected across the coil, which will disturb the Q of the coil. Impedance matching is very important. In the case of the 3 volts at 12 meters away, if I remember correctly, I could pull about 100 mA, so about 300 mW of power. I estimated that if I design a proper impedance matching circuit I could extract about 3 watts.
Another area I did not explore to my satisfaction is REGENERATION, where I can now drive the receiver in phase to extract even more power, but all this does is translate in a higher Q receiver. My methods of improving Q were low ESR capacitors and proper design of the coil, with lots of strands. But regeneration is something quite important to be explored.
In conclusion, I proved TO MYSELF with math, with circuits, with tests and with experiments I witnessed with my own eyes, that this technology works and how it works and how it scales up. The key words:
TO MYSELF I invite everybody to test their own theories and see if they are valid. I for one have no desire to scale things up at this time. I might do it later and might surprise you guys with a nice video but don't hold your breath. I would much rather spend the time investigating the DC creation mechanism of the TPUs and the high Q acoustic vibrations and how magnetostriction plays a part in the TPUs. Like I said, there are lots of open questions still remaining about the design, not source of power. By the way, the lowest frequency I managed was 20 KHz, and SM was down at 5 kHz. I have a lot of respect for Steven Mark as an engineer and for his TPU designs, he achieved something quite impressive! A wonderful energy harvesting technology! So I defend the guy and say his TPUs are very REAL and something that can transform our society and usher in what Tesla has been dreaming of: GLOBAL WIRELESS POWER !
EM
@e2matrix
lol ;D
ION
As a TV engineer i worked with an Older guy he was an expert on the early TVs and always worked on the valve sets, although i did work on Valve sets my knowledge was limited and can remember very little, i was mostly working on the early hybrids and solid state sets from early 80's up until above 7 years ago, i had a few years out of it here and there, working for xxxxxx and the film industry :)
God it seems like a life ago that i was setting up the convergence coils/pots on the early Thorn\TCE 3500 series and others, very few would appreciate the skill in setting up purity and convergence 8)
EM
I have no argument with the fact that power can be transmitted over short distances with a high power transmitter and tuned high Q receiver. This is common sense, it is standard radio engineering theory, plus it was demonstrated by Tesla, Marconi, Hertz and others over one hundred years ago.
Most HAMS played around with doing this stuff for kicks,lighting lamps at a distance, and when people like MIT make it out to be something new and big and wonderful, those skilled in radio art sit back and have a good belly laugh.
This is not the argument and you do yourself a disservice by your insistence that it is.
Your experiments are well and good, but can you achieve results with the broadband noise of a power line as a source? Doing it at a single frequency with high Q transmitter tank and high Q receiver loop is easy stuff.
As a scientist I would ask how much radiated power and in what frequencies bands or spectra is available and at what distance from the power lines around SM's home?
When you can answer that question with real data, I will take your theory more seriously.
Meanwhile, anyone can set up a couple of high Q tank circuits and transmit power over short distances. This is a no brainer.
Considering the inverse square law, a spherical radiation pattern (not beamed power) how much loss do you calculate from a setup like that over say 20 meters? How much power is required in the transmitter loop to supply a kilowatt 20 meters distant?
The noise from power lines is broadband, very low in power, is damped by all the resistive loads, and cannot possibly deliver a kilowatt at 20 meters or we would all be fried like chicken from it.
So I repeat, give me the power and frequency spectra of the SM powerlines at a distance of 20 meters.
Then maybe I can change my mind.
Where I live we have high power lines from the Limerick Nuclear plant passing right over a local park. There are bleachers for the ballfield nearly directly under the power lines. The bleachers are grounded because of a slight static charge that builds on them from the powerlines. No one is fried when they watch a game. I have been there with equipment and have not measured anything beyond millivolts AC or DC.
We agree to disagree as gentlemen I hope.
Ok,
Can we get back on track to the real meat?
Instead of looking at large devices to small power output, rotate that picture.
Like Grumpy posted about the 800v @ 10amps. Feast your minds on the SM17. The power output to device mass is phenominal!
The link in my signature to Purco ftp has alot of TPU items.
So what would such a light set of windings perform as we have seen in the vids?
I have a TPU related observation. There may be different opinions of the importance and relevance but here it is:
On all 'current' demonstrations of incandescent bulbs being lit by the 'new' wireless power transmission (of those I've seen) one thing is common. The bulb lights very slowly in the beginning but changes brightness rather quickly when the demonstrations show distances and angles from the transmitter.
I believe the initial slow increase in brightness is due to the bulb resistance being an important part of the tuning of the overall receiver circuit.
I don't recall that action on the TPU videos.
If this is true then a TPU is not so dependent upon the load for operation or 'tuning'.
Comments?
P.S.
ION isn't kidding about Hams being old-hat at the so-called new wireless power transmission. I've used a 15W 120v bulb on a wire loop hanging on the fence about a hundred feet away as a field strength indicator.
Yes, that was primarily the magnetic side of the signal.
@ ION
QuoteWe agree to disagree as gentlemen I hope.
Oh yes, absolutely, I wouldn't have it any other way.
QuoteAs a scientist I would ask how much radiated power and in what frequencies bands or spectra is available and at what distance from the power lines around SM's home? When you can answer that question with real data, I will take your theory more seriously.
I assumed you saw my postings and calculations I posted a few times in the past? I guess not, but no problem, I can do it again.
QuoteConsidering the inverse square law, a spherical radiation pattern (not beamed power) how much loss do you calculate from a setup like that over say 20 meters? How much power is required in the transmitter loop to supply a kilowatt 20 meters distant?
First of all, I'm not concerned with losses in the "transmitter" when the transmitter is the power lines, I don't have any control over that as an energy harvester. I'm just concerned with the fields I sense at my location, regardless of where they come from. But I know where they come from and that's what seems to be the problem here. Second of all, we are not dealing with RADIATION and the INVERSE SQUARE LAW, that only applies in the FAR FIELD, that's RF stuff. What we are dealing with is near field coupling via the magnetic fields, as opposed to electric fields like Tesla wanted.
QuoteThe noise from power lines is broadband, very low in power, is damped by all the resistive loads, and cannot possibly deliver a kilowatt at 20 meters or we would all be fried like chicken from it.
First of all: I agree, the Magnetic fields we experience without a RESONATOR present are weak fields. When we bring a RESONATOR into the field, THAN the fields build up to high levels. The build up in the reactive fields is what ENABLES a LARGER POWER TRANSFER AND COUPLING TO THE SOURCE. This is what I was trying to explain to ltesung888, about his sound resonator experiments, it's very similar.
Second of all: The reason we are not fried like chicken, is because we are utilizing the MAGNETIC FIELD. It is however possible to resonate and receive the electric field like Tesla wanted. But that's a no no, very dangerous. Magnetic fields are better because at low frequencies they are not easily shielded by conductors because the skin depth is larger with lower frequency, but ferromagnetic shields will do the trick.
QuoteSo I repeat, give me the power and frequency spectra of the SM power lines at a distance of 20 meters. Then maybe I can change my mind.
I provided the spectra and the field strengths and calculations but you must have missed it but I can do it again.
QuoteWhere I live we have high power lines from the Limerick Nuclear plant passing right over a local park. There are bleachers for the ball field nearly directly under the power lines. The bleachers are grounded because of a slight static charge that builds on them from the power lines. No one is fried when they watch a game. I have been there with equipment and have not measured anything beyond millivolts AC or DC.
Yes, the levels are small, but when amplified with a high Q receiver, those levels can build up to high levels like I show below. That's what I'm trying to tell you guys. That's the beauty of high Q resonators, if there is a field present from whatever source, we can couple to it and receive it's energy. But the energy source at 5 kHz or 6 kHz is not from some unknown place, AS I FOUND OUT. It's coming from the power lines like I showed you guys in the past. It's the power line harmonics from switching equipment, or maybe something that coupled to the power lines and flows on them, but the reality is that it's there and SM is tapping into it. This point is really not debatable, if he is telling the truth when he said 5 or 6 kHz and I can see that frequency on the spectrum taken at the mansion from the power lines, its obvious and I know and draw the conclusion that it is due to the power lines. I'm not sure what other conclusion I can draw? What are your suggestions? Steven even says he's TPU is a receiver and is tuned to a magnetic frequency and "converting" it's energy, are we not going to believe him? Just think about it and let it sink in, that's all I can say.
Ok, just for you ION: Let me do this again, I want to show you some sample calculations to build up your confidence. I will first calculate the magnetic field density at a distance from a current carrying wire or power line, than deal with the Receiver and assume a certain Q that I suspect is being used by SM.
TRANSMITERAssume a current on an infinite wire as an approximation, since we assume we are relatively close to a long power line. Than, the magnetic field density B, at a distance R, is given by:
B = (4 pi 1e-7) I / (2 pi R)
Assuming the current, I = 100 amps (which is conservative for a power line), at 20 meters away we get close to 10 micro Teslas. Sounds very small right? But hold on there is more, let's look at the receiver now.
RECEIVER If the frequency is 5.5 kHz let's say, we can calculate how much voltage is induced into an OPEN CIRCUIT loop. After we calculate this, we will than assume we can tune the loop with a capacitor and make it resonant, and we'll assume a Q = 100, for starters. However, I suspect the TPUs are using acoustic vibration as the resonator mechanism and as such these have Q factors in the 10 000 range.
Here we go: This is the equation we'll use to calculate the induced voltage due to a change in the magnetic flux phi = B x Area of loop. For simplicity we'll assume Area =1 m^2 , and the number of turns in the loop N=10.
V = -N dphi/dt = - 10 * d B/dt,
If we are only interested in one particular frequency, or sinusoid, that we'll tune into, than the magnetic field density as a function of time is described by B = B_amp x sin(2pi f t). Differentiating we obtain:
dB/dt = B_amp x 2pi f x cos(2pi f t),
we're only concerned with the amplitude from now on, so we'll drop the cosine. Also note that upon differentiating, the frequency now plays a role. Some of you might quickly realize that it's beneficial to do this type of wireless power transfer at higher frequencies, and that is correct, but there are implications I won't go into. Let's proceed by substituting B_amp = 10 miro T, and f = 5500 Hz
Vpeak_oc = 10 * (1e-5 x 2 pi 5500) = 3.5 volts
Remember, this is the OPEN CIRCUIT voltage, no resonance implemented yet!
If we implement resonance, and let's say we have a tank circuit with a Q = 100, the magnification factor, which is very easy to accomplish just with LC circuits alone, we obtain:
Vpeak = Vpeak_oc * Q = 3.5 x 100 = 350 volts !
But we know that volts without current means nothing, so how much current can I draw? As few of you know, if I load the coil I change the Q, and I lose what I'm after, but there are techniques to minimize this and obtain an optimal results, by impedance matching. From my experiments, I observed that I can lower the Q by a half, and manage to draw significant power, so OK, let's say under load the voltage drops to 150 volts, with a source impedance of 10 ohms, and I can draw 1 amp. The power received is than:
P_avg = (V x I) / 2 = 1 amp x 150 volts /2 = 75 watts (were dealing with peak amplitudes, not RMS, that's why we divide by 2)
But if I load the receiver with a 10 ohm load, equal to the source impedance for maximum power transfer, I can extract:
P_avg = V^2/2R = 150^2/20 = 1125 watts!So, as amazing as this is, imagine that SM has a resonator (TPU) of a Q = 10 000, that's 100 times greater than what we calculated above. He can than realize an open circuit voltage of perhaps 35 000 volts or 35 kV! This is distructively high! That's why SM said that the devices have to be tuned
SLIGHTLY OFF FREQUENCY, or else they destroy themselves,
NO KIDDING!
There you have it ION, math for your eyes! If you don't believe the math than I can't realy do much else for you short of a demo. Thanks for the questions, I love to teach! or rather preach! LOL ;D :D 8)
EM
If the inventor told you what devices to use that are essential to have a chance of success.....would you use them ?
gridbias,
give it up man, that's not what a TPU is, there are NO VACUM TUBES! He was simply telling you how he started noticing the resonance effects.
People still don't know what the KICK was all about. It is PHYSICAL VIBRATION of the filament, and that's what the TPUs use as the resonance MECHANISM, MECHANICAL VIBRATION, THAT'S WHY THEY ARE SUCH HIGH Q DEVICES. I don't know how else to say this. He even told you how the speaker diameter plays a part and has a resonance at 35 khz or so, hello?
It's the mechanical vibrations of the TPU structure that provide the high Q resonance mechanism necessary for efficient and practical power harvesting at those low frequencies!
And, there are no tubes and no mass electronics!
EM
EM
If the TPU collects energy from ambiant fields, this will not explain the additional effect associated with the device.
SM's early device stopped when flipped, and you also had this effect, but later SM device did not stop when flipped and was wound differently.
Then there is the washboard effect, the gyroscopic effect, the rotating compass SM spoke of - that then suddenly stops when the device has "wound up to full speed".
The was an undescribed effect when placing the TPU in a tub of water. Why would a passive reciever exhibit some "interesting" effect when in water?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2011.09.07, 23:04:44
EM
If the TPU collects energy from ambiant fields, this will not explain the additional effect associated with the device.
SM's early device stopped when flipped, and you also had this effect, but later SM device did not stop when flipped and was wound differently.
That's correct, in the UTC video he holds the 6" TPU horizontaly and also verticaly, while talking about it, and it works just fine in both orientations. It's the way they are wound. I don't have the energy right now to explain all this stuff.
QuoteThen there is the washboard effect, the gyroscopic effect, the rotating compass SM spoke of - that then suddenly stops when the device has "wound up to full speed".
That's why I say this device is unique, the interaction of the resonant high intensity reactive magnetic fields, around the TPU, with the acoustic or mechnical vibrations of the device can have interesting implications. Sligh frequency shifts can create beat frequencies etc.
By the way, did you know that a vibrating bar exibits the same GYROSCOPIC effect as a spinning GYRO? Read up on Gyro IC's and how they are implemented, just a vibrating micro lever, that's all. So the TPU's vibration is key, and that's why I keep harping on the fact that the resonance mechanism at 5 kHz has to be acoustic resonance inside the structure itself, and not from an LC tank circuit, because the frequency is simply too low for LC resonance!
QuoteThere was an undescribed effect when placing the TPU in a tub of water. Why would a passive reciever exihibit some "interesting" effect when in water?
The interesting effect was that
IT STOPPED WORKING! :)
Loading and suppresing the acoustic vibrations of the structure RUINED THE Q, and so good bye High Q Receiver.
EM
PS, I'll throw out one more analogy for those that still don't get it. An EMPTY wine glass is resonated by acoustic energy that can shatter it, why? because it has a very high Q and can build up vibrations that are significant and that can destroy it. In other words, the Q of the wine glass does not diminish much with AMPLITUDE, and so there is no self protection mechanism. If you fill the wine glass with water or a liquid, than it can no longer vibrate freely because the liquid is preventing and loading it down, too much power disipation.
The TPU is something very similar, at the core it is an acoustic vibrator, but how can acoustics and magnetics mix? They mix with the aid of coils, as in a loop, that is driven by the magnetic fields he is tapping, and with the proper transducer mechansim that drives the acoustic resonator from the large currents developed in the loop. Magnetostriction is one such phenomena, and I went off on that tangent as you all know. Than there is the simple way of creating a force with a coil and magnet, like in a speaker. In the Open TPU (OTPU) he places two magnets in it and they stay there. This is very close to a speaker and loop type of integrated resonator. The "speaker" is the rings (they resonate acoustically) and the wire is the loop that interacts with the magnetic fields. That's how I explain it to myself, but this area of speculation is not yet fully developed. Like I said, there are still open questions remaining about the particulars of his TPU designs, and they varry, but generaly I know what is happening.
However, keep this in mind, vibration is critical, this is another concept I'm pretty confident about!Ok, if there are no other questions, I will now go back to investigating the permanent magnet dynamos. I am not realy interested in energy harvesting anymore, perhaps I should be but it just doesn't have the same mystery and spell over me it once had. Extracting energy from magnets is more exciting to me right now, because it can be a power source that can be taken anywhere.
EM
A long time ago on another forum (as Vortex) I posted what I called the "Acoustic Resonator Theory"
Glad to see you are thinking along these lines.
We are in agreement here. The acoustic vibrations may be an important clue.
Thanks for bringing it up. If anyone is interested I can repost it here.
EM,
When you have a chance and the free energy ;) I would like to know your source for the idea the TPU just quit working when placed in a tub of water.
Oh!
There are differences between vibrator gyroscopes and rotating ones. Vibrators tend to maintain their orientation to the plain of their motion. Gyroscopes tend to maintain their orientation to the center of the Earth.
Gyros also suffer to a drift phenomenon and recover their orientation after lateral movement has stopped. These are a couple of reasons why the vibrators are better suited than gyroscopes for terrestrially bound applications.
I'll dare say you won't find the vibrating variety used in aerospace without an accelerometer added and certainly won't find them in anything requiring measurement of relative position and orientation. There, you will see Sagnac based devices or the real spinning variety.
In short.... there would be no wash-board like effect without rotation (rotation in the common sense or rotation of a second entrained energy while revolving around a loop of material). At least, not that I can imagine.
Don't get me wrong. I find the magnetostriction ideas more plausible than others, especially when magnets were used in some devices to run or to start.
I also agree with the ideas of acoustic resonance. This is most likely, even though there are ways to make a loop of wire resonant at very low frequencies (this involves oscillatory magnetostriction of nonferrous conductors). This almost always results in demands of demonstrations.
I have complied on more than one occasion with bad results. The replication was good... the jerk tried to patent it (Uncle Sam didn't appreciate that :( )
(Removed unrelated drivel)
BTW....
I heard from a non internet related source that even though the tub was not metallic it emptied the tub with a nasty fury. I have some doubts about the source C.C
probably ionization followed by detonated
@EMdevices
Do you believe that some of the devices are fake and some are real
or do you believe there all real.Did you get the pdf file of the clamp amp meter
SM used in the video of the 17"" tpu.The meter operation manual may help you with your theory,if you don't have the file I will post it.
@ Cheappower2012, I have everything on Steven Mark and more. Thank you though. All his devices are REAL!
Quote from: EMdevices on 2011.09.08, 05:40:33
...So with high Q resonators you not only receive more power but the reactive fields are so huge and of high intensity that the resonator can repel off of them much like a propeller pushes against the air to create thrust!
...
This gives interesting possibilities, already used in conventional technology, but which one could be logically related to facts in favor of free energy?
In a resonator, the energy accumulates from period to period. This energy is stored in magnetic or electric fields, or pressure fields for mechanical systems. The field of the resonator and that of the source superpose, creating an interference pattern in space. This may lead to a "channel" between the source and the receiver, optimizing the power transfer.
A typical example is the ferrite antenna of a radio, tuned to the frequency of the AM station to receive. The effective cross-section of the antenna is much more than its material cross-section. The antenna captures more energy than this that would cross the coil if it was not resonant but it does it at the price of a redistribution of the field around the antenna, forcing it to pass through the ferrite at the expense of the field outside, and finally it doesn't recover more energy than that available is the space around, which was provided by the transmitter.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2011.09.08, 03:09:39
probably ionization followed by detonated
No, not so dramatic. For what it is worth that source said the water was thrown out of the bathtub in all directions and made the engineers very wet but laughing.
That source isn't any more reliable than the proof provided by the videos. I just thought the story was funny.
EM
You are probably aware that Bill Beaty has mused on energy sucking antenna's here:
http://www.amasci.com/tesla/tesceive.html
I have no problem with your calculations, they look correct. The problem I see is that "Q" gets squashed pretty rapidly when you try to extract power from a resonant receiver loop.
You have stated that it is possible to overcome this with impedance matching. I have not found this to be the case. Could you expand on this with a simple schematic?
If this is so, you have created a device which can feed itself without destroying "Q", so you have no need for a transmitter loop, a portion of the output can be fed back to the input to keep the resonant loop oscillating.
I have not been able to make such a system work, it seems to violate basic principles.
I believe Tesla tried to make a passive regenerative system, don't know if it was successful.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.08, 10:59:54
I believe Tesla tried to make a passive regenerative system, don't know if it was successful.
I believe he was....
This is a short introduction with references to papers of much more detail.... http://www.teslasociety.com/teslarec.pdf
OK, so you have a solid object on a table and you want to know why it is vibrating.
Seems to me the only way to say the object is vibrating on its own, is if it loses some weight and gains weight and loses weight and so on. That would be the only way an inanimate object could move enough to create a vibration on its own without any other moving parts. Moving left and right for me is not an option. Up and down by losing and gaining weight is the only way I can think of. That would entail an anti gravity effect.
But the TPU is not an inanimate object. It has coils and they pulse and there is a magnet placed inside.
Why did SM not place his big fat magnet on the LTPU? Because the magnet and the vibration effect that it produces was just SM's only way to always know the device was working otherwise he would risk looking like a fool during a demo and God forbid such a thing should happen to SM especially during a money seeking demo. If he put a magnet on the OTPU and it did not vibrate, only he would know it so he could stall saying something has to be readjusted. When he sweeped the magnet on one LTPU toroid then the other, the magnet vibrated in his hand confirming to hm that the two stages work so he could keep on with the demo. If there is no vibration, just stop and say you forgot to adjust something and fix the problem before the demo continues. The magnet/vibration was SMs go ahead to continue a demo. You would never have known it until you realize why only the LTPU was not magnet mounted. How many days did we spend on passing a magnet next to a toroid? I remember those days only too well. lol
If the inanimate object is to vibrate, it either has to have a electromagnetostriction like a speaker coil or a small motor turning an off centered weight. The energy required to make a coil to coil relationship vibrate would be tremendous without a core.
So for me, either the TPU is losing and gaining actual weight or there is a vibro mechanism somewhere. Guys seen to forget that SM was in major paranoia mode and one of his main efforts had to be to continuously outwit everyone with distractions, both for his requirements of remaining on top on the pile and also most likely at the insistence of his investors who obviously would have told him, "can we show enough of device without showing any of the workings or maybe even include some distractions so we have no chance of divulging anything to prospective investors and their specialists". Saying his device has a slight gyro vibration is a perfect way to make you look away from the real effects.
Take any magnet and coil. Mount them on any plate surface. Pulse them and see how it will vibrate when in your hand. You have just made the effect. Now pulse near 800 hertz, uh, the effect is gone because the human hand cannot sense vibrations above a certain frequency. According to my own tests, the maximum was about 800 hertz. So anything that creates a vibration or gyro would have had to be equal to or less than 800 hertz. Try it yourself.
Oh, one other thing about the LTPU at 800 volts yes, but not 10 amps, only 1.??? amps.
wattsup
PS: About the 5000 hertz. If you had one pulse entering 10 coils in parallel but the coils were 36 degrees out of phase with the next coil and so on, would that equal 5000 hertz applied with only 500 hertz initiated? What we are forgetting is multiples. Nothing was single. All TPUs showed a multiple design. Not one in and one out. The main issue for SM was to design in a way to augment amperage and that is usually only accomplished by paralleling multiple mA outputs.
Anyways, It is so good to have guys discuss this stuff again and maybe through this some major headway could be reached regardless if it is for an SM style TPU or any other style.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2011.09.08, 12:41:50
I believe he was....
This is a short introduction with references to papers of much more detail.... http://www.teslasociety.com/teslarec.pdf
Thanks for the paper WW, it showed the circuit I remember seeing elsewhere. Will have to follow the references.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.08, 00:53:22
EM
A long time ago on another forum (as Vortex) I posted what I called the "Acoustic Resonator Theory"
Glad to see you are thinking along these lines.
We are in agreement here. The acoustic vibrations may be an important clue.
Thanks for bringing it up. If anyone is interested I can repost it here.
I would interested in a repost.
Also,
I have placed a neodyn in the iron core GK4. The magnet reports vibrations in a large range of frequencies less than 100khz.
I was also building a test piece that is made of a 1 foot long 1/4" wooden dowel with a small neodyn at each end. One end is placed in or by the coil. At the other is placed a am radio earplug with the nipple cutoff. The vibrations are pickuped via the audio plug. The contraption is laided on the bench on top of foam pieces.
Quote from: giantkiller on 2011.09.08, 18:25:18
I would interested in a repost.
It has been posted here:
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=1092.msg16745;topicseen#msg16745
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.08, 16:27:55
Thanks for the paper WW, it showed the circuit I remember seeing elsewhere. Will have to follow the references.
You're welcome.
This paper clarified the origin of the name 'detector' for the device that rectifies and filters RF energy, also thought of as demodulation.
(Yes, the filter after the diode was considered part of the detector at one time.)
I have found these original meanings interesting as it shows how our concepts of past discoveries become muddled. Tesla was building a device to detect the presence of RF energy. There would have been no point in demodulating the signal.
Another project called for 'magnet wire' in the patent. 'Magnet wire', as we know it today, wasn't invented for three decades after the patent was issued.
This detective work can be interesting.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2011.09.07, 22:06:09
I have a TPU related observation. There may be different opinions of the importance and relevance but here it is:
On all 'current' demonstrations of incandescent bulbs being lit by the 'new' wireless power transmission (of those I've seen) one thing is common. The bulb lights very slowly in the beginning but changes brightness rather quickly when the demonstrations show distances and angles from the transmitter.
I believe the initial slow increase in brightness is due to the bulb resistance being an important part of the tuning of the overall receiver circuit.
I don't recall that action on the TPU videos.
If this is true then a TPU is not so dependent upon the load for operation or 'tuning'.
Comments?
P.S.
ION isn't kidding about Hams being old-hat at the so-called new wireless power transmission. I've used a 15W 120v bulb on a wire loop hanging on the fence about a hundred feet away as a field strength indicator.
Yes, that was primarily the magnetic side of the signal.
You are spot on regarding the slow rise to brightness. When fed from a voltage source, lamps light right up, but fed from a current source they come to life slowly because of the non-linear property of tungsten (temp vs. resistance).
Also the SM devices never showed any change in lamp brightness vs. angular changes, eliminating the idea of a hidden transmitter or directional outboard source. EM should put this as a red flag into his theory.
SM was able to demonstrate blowing a 50 amp severe service air conditioning fuse when placed directly across the output. Apparently, it may have been a Class RK5 fuse which is a time delay type with a 500% rating for 10 seconds. So to blow it, there was either 250 Amp source current available for 10 seconds or a much higher peak current for a shorter time. I will try to find the curves for this class of fuse.
I'll have to check and see if those stacked lytics have the required stored Joules to blow such a fuse so I can get that one out of the way. If they were 400 or 450 volt lytics, can anyone guess what the uF rating was from the pictures?
Has anyone been able to see with clearer video's what the ratings of the lytics were on the LTPU?
Good points Ion. I looked up the wording on that & I found the following:
==========================================================================================
I asked the inventor if this was the limit of the unit and he replied, "no way." He provided a quick blow fuse rated at 50 amperes.
With two large electrical clamps and wiring, he shorted the fuse across the output terminals of the toroid and destroyed the fuse, (ObS). There was only a slight
flickering of the ten incandescent bulbs as observed although there was a tremendous discharge of sparks from the output terminals of the toroid unit.
The inventor then gave me the fuse for examination. It was warm to the touch and smelled acrid, (ObS). It was a large 240 volt AC air conditioner disconnect fuse and designed for severe service duty, (OsS).
The inventor's claim that the large toroid output terminals were at lethal potential was no longer in question.
.
Here is the video where he demonstrates the "washboard" effect to three others from 4:55 to 6:35.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aDViLnziT8
I was wrong about the soft cloth, he must have had some felt feet under the device as it slides smoothly without a hint of screeching or scratching. I don't think he'd want to scratch the table leaves.
I can barely hear what they are saying in the video. Somebody chimes in "magnetic lines".
Can anyone with better ears make a transcript of that section?
Allphase:
All of that text is in the lab report at the beginning of the thread.
You posted a picture of the small chokes. This is not what DR. Schinzinger is referring to at the end of the lab report.
He tested two different sized units. Read the report from the beginning for the sizes.
=============================================================
On another note, are we left with having to succumb to a "cargo cult" mentality, making an exact physical replica of the LTPU?
No one has actually done this in the years I've been here. Some are close but no cigar.
We have a partial schematic thanks to Wattsup and myself.
In leiu of a working theory and demonstrable effect, we may be forced into that corner.
I shudder at the thought of that much more detective work.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.08, 22:52:32
You are spot on regarding the slow rise to brightness. When fed from a voltage source, lamps light right up, but fed from a current source they come to life slowly because of the non-linear property of tungsten (temp vs. resistance).
Don't forget the change in resistance effecting the tuning point of the circuit - should it be a tuned circuit.
Yes, the shocking revelation should be that the TPU is a voltage source. That pretty much eliminates Faraday induction and conventional transformer theories.
Quote
SM was able to demonstrate blowing a 50 amp severe service air conditioning fuse when placed directly across the output. Apparently, it may have been a Class RK5 fuse which is a time delay type with a 500% rating for 10 seconds. So to blow it, there was either 250 Amp source current available for 10 seconds or a much higher peak current for a shorter time. I will try to find the curves for this class of fuse.
At a minimum the fuse was a Class R dual element time delay. This is odd as a 50A version rated for 600V is about 6 inches long. The I
2t curves are not so revealing as the short circuit and fuse blowing would have been extremely fast when applied to a voltage source. This may mean that TPU was capable of delivering at least 25kAIC for less than the time for 6 cycles @ 60Hz.
The fuse didn't explode in his hand so I will assume it was rated for 600VAC (safely functional to around 900VDC) and the TPU wasn't capable of delivering over 250kAIC :D
Quote
I'll have to check and see if those stacked lytics have the required stored Joules to blow such a fuse so I can get that one out of the way. If they were 400 or 450 volt lytics, can anyone guess what the uF rating was from the pictures?
I will humor you here because I can't imagine those caps in series or used to filter the output.
Since there isn't indication these were anything special (not even low ESR) I can say from the relative dimensions they weren't 400 + volt types for that time frame - unless he had access to types used by the military, aerospace and big computer companies. I would never connect 900V worth of caps to an 800V supply anyway.
For the moment lets say they were special and rated 400 + volts. That would put them a maximum of 100 mmfd @ 450WVDC. 400V rating was then a non-US rating so I would say 450.
As far as I can tell they were probably 470 mmfd @ 50WVDC or 1000 mmfd @ 25WVDC.
In any case, there wouldn't be enough stored energy in those caps to flash blow a dual element time delay fuse rated @ 50A. The report also classed the fuses as fast-blow? ? ? There is some contradiction and probably
stems from the reporter. I'll take that back and say the good Dr knew what he was talking about so the fuse must have been one of the new Euro Gould/ITE-like fiberglass body types used in industrial equipment then. The 'quick-blows' were actually time delay types with a much shorter curve and not what we call 'fast-blow'.
Good work WW, always great to hear a person that "knows his stuff" in power engineering.
I also agree about the slow rise effect in lamps of Hi Q systems. A tank circuit acts more like a current source with voltage rising very high when unloaded.
This is not typical of the TPU, and why I discount the tuned tank circuit, stolen power theory.
As for the lytics it is hard for me to believe they were part of some resonant system. Pulse discharge, I will believe, but lytics, even low esr types don't fare well in resonant tank circuits.
Also unless the lytics were non-polar types he would need reverse protection diodes on them if they were series connected to form a high value AC cap. SM would have known better and used a large dry film cap or oil filled type.
Why I lean to them being brute force filter caps.....but I'm open to other ideas.
I wouldn't think they were part of a tank either. No tank caps are needed on a high Q acoustic system.
My opinion is they are brute force filter and energy storage caps but not for the output. Instead, as the supply for the device in the middle. One cap/detector/over-voltage protection set for each half of that circuit in the middle.
What most identify as resistors are clearly not, in my view. They were metal can rectifiers. You should remember them. They were about 3/16" diameter with one end filled with an epoxy bead. The color banding indicates possible milspec types or types common to hybrid TV sets of the era but they are probably only germanium or Schottky. If I was color-blind I would say they were of the 1N9x series, going by the markings.
I reviewed the video's again and the video freeenergyStevenMark(5).mp4 shows the washboard effect and also SM holding a speaker magnet near the small later version coil and the toroids in the center of the large coil. I cannot make out the audio during this time.
The washboard effect may be the device coupling and decoupling to different force lines or spin regions as it is moved.
The flaming arc is interest and SM states some about "normal arc" but I cannot tell if he says it is like a normal arc or unlike a normal arc. I have seen the flaming arc with high freq hv of low current from a Tesla-type disruptive discharge coil. In my opinion, it does not look like an arc when welding. The large ring has an output of 850v, and this may attribute to the arc's appearance. In the back of my mind, I remember that current is proportional to particle velocity.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.09, 00:37:05
Here is the video where he demonstrates the "washboard" effect to three others from 4:55 to 6:35.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aDViLnziT8
...
I can barely hear what they are saying in the video. Somebody chimes in "magnetic lines".
Can anyone with better ears make a transcript of that section?
Audio Transcript[3:41 SM] At this point I ask you to be extremely extremely careful, someone was very seriously injured.
You main want to remove your wrist watches, please, if you have any on.
It's for your own safety, because if you are to accidentaly make contact with the ring it will burn you very badly.
[Australian] It's safe but that aspect ...
[guy in suit] I understand...
[SM] We're demonstrating extremely high amounts of voltage and current, there can be ...
[SM measures voltage, etc..]
[5:08 SM talking to first guy in a suit experiencing the washboard effect]
hold it only on the black tape, slide it, don't push it down, just slide it back and forth very slowly, you feel ...
[The guy in suit is sliding the TPU on the two raised panels..]
[5:27 Australian ] Feel that well? (or Walt)?
[Guy in suit] I can feel it, I'm just trying to determine the difference between friction here [he points to side of TPU] and ... So what is it that I'm [feeling]?
[Australian] you're draging the magnetic lines of force as you're pushing across!
[guy in suit] will I be able to feel the same when moving that small one [he points across the table to small TPU powering TV]
[voice repeats in the background] no ... no ... no
[SM] ... but they alter it's resonaces but its dificult to feel ...
[Australian] it depends on the [great??] coupling ...
[SM] you may go ahead and use this as well [talking to second guy wanting to experience the washboard effect]
Anyone ever used a degauss coil on a TV, sometimes at power up you can get a jolt/alignment, and you can feel a coupling 3-4 feet away from the shadow mask of the TV.
I am pretty sure the Valve filament movement is due to an intense alignment against the earths magnetic field, it sure would be nice to determine this, i wonder if a ratiometric sensor could tell, probably not fast enough.
Also i really want to use that ratiometric on my explosion setup as well at some point.
Can anyone make out the audio in freeenergyStevenMark(5).mp4 when SM is talking with the old gentleman about the output of the small ring varying and then holds a magnet near it? Then places the magnet near each toroid inside the large ring.
It sounds like SM might be saying that the magnet near he device affects the voltage but not the current as the light stays the same. Just can't make out the words to be sure.
Grumpy,
Remember that Jack Durban said that SM's use of a magnet was a RUSE to try to conceal & confuse how TPUs really work.
.
@ION
QuoteI have no problem with your calculations, they look correct. The problem I see is that "Q" gets squashed pretty rapidly when you try to extract power from a resonant receiver loop.
Yes it does, that's why even with impedance matching we can't load it down too much, that's just the way it works. (see charts below for an arbitrary set of parameters I chose)
QuoteYou have stated that it is possible to overcome this with impedance matching. I have not found this to be the case. Could you expand on this with a simple schematic?
With impedance matching we can improve the power we can extract for a given Q value. I have tried various impedance transformations, primarily inductive (one pickup loop next to the resonator), and capacitive voltage division. I've done lot's and lot's of calculations and simulations I don't have time to dig up.
QuoteIf this is so, you have created a device which can feed itself without destroying "Q", so you have no need for a transmitter loop, a portion of the output can be fed back to the input to keep the resonant loop oscillating.
That's not the implication at all. I don't want anybody to get confused here. This is not free energy or perpetual motion at all. It is just a high quality resonator that couples to the source of energy well (due to it's high Q) and power can than flow wirelessly in more abundance to my receiver. The power is accounted for, no extra power shows up.
Comments on the Charts Below:
The loops I use for this example, have some inductance and series resitance, so for this case I chose L=1e-4 H, Rs=0.1 ohms, than I calculated C for resonance at 6 khz. Than I applied a load resistance across the capacitor to show what happens to the Q and the detuning that occurs. The detuning chart plots the difference between wL and imag(Z), where Z is the termination impedance of the loop, i.e. the Capacitor and load Resistor in parallel. Notice that optimum power transfer occurs with a load between 100 and 200 ohms, for this example only. The power calculation assumes a 1 volt untuned induced voltage, so I square the Q and divide by the load resitance. By the way, those Q values go up into the hundreds if I up the frequency to 100 kHz. So like I was saying before, the higher the frequency the easier it is to implement wireless power transfer via magnetic field coupling, but if there is no high frequency to harvest, than tough luck. But there is low frequency magnetic and electric polution from the power lines, which explains why so few people have been able to tap into it, because it's low frequency and it's very hard to do! Steven Mark succeeded however, and I admire that achivement very much!
EM
EM
Thank you for taking the time to clarify your work, it is appreciated. I hope that you continue with this work and as I said before, supply the frequency spectra and power available from the power lines.
EM said:
QuoteBut there is low frequency magnetic and electric polution from the power lines, which explains why so few people have been able to tap into it, because it's low frequency and it's very hard to do! Steven Mark succeeded however, and I admire that achivement very much!
One question, what is the fundamental frequency, and voltage of the power lines over SM's house.
Second, when you made measurements there were you able to get a reading of frequency spectra and radiated power for each of these frequencies or broadband power radiation.
Third: What is the range of frequencies of the "low frequency magnetic and electric pollution". What is the power radiated in these bands?
To embark on tapping this energy, it would be important to know if it is a worthwhile endeavor. This data would be required as a first step.
Thanks again.
Quote from: AllPhase on 2011.09.09, 15:29:43
Grumpy,
Remember that Jack Durban said that SM's use of a magnet was a RUSE to try to conceal & confuse how TPUs really work.
.
Regardless of whether that is true or not, Jack Durban had a different agenda than what he appeared to have.
I take all that he said with a huge grain of salt.
I'm not an expert but please consider what I will try to say. I think it is easier to tap EM background radiation from far radio stations in Mhz range then even closest power lines. In fact I'm trying to build pure sinewave inverter for low power to test some ideas (mostly around TPU and VTA ) and seems that when I by mistake got primary or secondary wires close in length to 1/4 or 1/2 or any even part of length of some radiowave I got a nice noise.
Second - here for tapping radio waves seems core is a big help - I'm not expert and even electronic just an ordinary guy interested in free energy so for me it's a big question why, anyway , ferrite is black and TPU cut was black inside , right ???
Third : I'm using not ordinary , poor guy method to get pure sinewave inverter, don't know if it works anyway but have no other idea : I use audio generator with amplifier .
I spent a monstrous hours (sorry, I'm bad in electronics) trying to get audio generator circuit (custom made Wien bridge) to work ! The issue was from powering it from +15 - 0 and -15V (symmetrical power supply). I tried to make it work from single battery and with capacitors working as dividers but it is very hard even using big capacitors.
I ended using small transformer and two voltage stabilisers.
Anyway - maybe those two big capacitors were part of power supply for audio signal generator producing pure sinewave , for example 60 Hz ???
Quote from: forest on 2011.09.10, 18:47:52
I'm not an expert but please consider what I will try to say. I think it is easier to tap EM background radiation from far radio stations in Mhz range then even closest power lines. In fact I'm trying to build pure sinewave inverter for low power to test some ideas (mostly around TPU and VTA ) and seems that when I by mistake got primary or secondary wires close in length to 1/4 or 1/2 or any even part of length of some radiowave I got a nice noise.
Second - here for tapping radio waves seems core is a big help - I'm not expert and even electronic just an ordinary guy interested in free energy so for me it's a big question why, anyway , ferrite is black and TPU cut was black inside , right ???
Third : I'm using not ordinary , poor guy method to get pure sinewave inverter, don't know if it works anyway but have no other idea : I use audio generator with amplifier .
I spent a monstrous hours (sorry, I'm bad in electronics) trying to get audio generator circuit (custom made Wien bridge) to work ! The issue was from powering it from +15 - 0 and -15V (symmetrical power supply). I tried to make it work from single battery and with capacitors working as dividers but it is very hard even using big capacitors.
I ended using small transformer and two voltage stabilisers.
Anyway - maybe those two big capacitors were part of power supply for audio signal generator producing pure sinewave , for example 60 Hz ???
Last question first, split supplies are usually done with a full wave bridge rectifier and center tapped power supply transformer. You can then use three terminal regulators, 78 and 79 series for regulation and DC purity. Otherwise use two equal batteries in series if you must use batteries.
If the material in the TPU were a black ferrite, it would have weighed a lot more than reported in the lab report.
Signal generator and audio amplifier are ok but will start to distort badly over 20 kHz unless amp is super high quality $$$$$$.
If we stop or apprehend the 2 jumper cables we will contain more energy in the electromagnetic spectrum.
This creates a virtual stun gun also opposite of a speaker by holding the cone stable.
The torsion is held in a compressed state thereby disabling the degradation into lower forms of expansion(emp).
The washboard or thumping tells us the energy wants to dissipate.
EMDevices, Thank you for the audio transcript.
.
Quote from: AllPhase on 2011.09.11, 14:05:10
EMDevices, Thank you for the audio transcript.
.
I second that note of thanks. Do you have more transcripts, EM?
Nice to see you guys talking again about Steven Mark devices! O0
In the research to find out the causes of several things which I couldn't understand in my experiments with the spinning spiral arc discharge, because of my limited knowledge, I found one more article, where they mention the famous "kick" word, associated with electric current. Relative new article, but I think it is interesting he refer to this "torque" momentum at this example as a kick. (source: http://books.google.com/books?id=yKXNvaGItAYC&pg=PA10 (http://books.google.com/books?id=yKXNvaGItAYC&pg=PA10) )
@All
As a side note and for what it"s worth, I had been communicating with @JD by e-mail off and on. Back in August of 2010, I sent him an e-mail just mentioning that I had some pretty good ideas on how SM may have done his videos and I had a few questions for him if he would not mind discussing this further.
He sent me an e-mail a few days later and I do not think he will mind me posting it here. It's only a few lines......
QUOTE
August 13th, 2010
Hi Leon,
Been very busy for the last few months. I did locate the better tpu video and the quality is not significantly better.
The quest to find out how the videos were made is going to be a waste of time as they are real. I worked with the Extreme tech CEO, a very credible guy and he saw a demo on the hood of a car in store parking lot.
There is no doubt that the videos are real.
All the best,
Jack
UNQUOTE
wattsup
Quote from: Chef on 2011.09.12, 23:10:17
Nice to see you guys talking again about Steven Mark devices! O0
In the research to find out the causes of several things which I couldn't understand in my experiments with the spinning spiral arc discharge, because of my limited knowledge, I found one more article, where they mention the famous "kick" word, associated with electric current. Relative new article, but I think it is interesting he refer to this "torque" momentum at this example as a kick. (source: http://books.google.com/books?id=yKXNvaGItAYC&pg=PA10 (http://books.google.com/books?id=yKXNvaGItAYC&pg=PA10) )
Heinsten De Haas effect - i.e. spin current, can explain also wire vibration
see the analogy with Otto 50 TURNS-ON-TWO-FINGER EXPERIMENT
http://inamori-frontier.kyushu-u.ac.jp/electronics/common/img/spin_current_en.jpg
WattsUp,
Thank you very much for sharing what Jack said.
Every bit of information helps sir.
.
Wattup:
QuoteJack said: I did locate the better tpu video and the quality is not significantly better.
Nevertheless, it would be very nice to have a complete unedited video. Is there a possibility this can be had?
Thanks
Direct from the documents:
QuoteThe second point of criticism is that the "TPU" is a fake and doesn't really work. I have received the input of a variety of engineers and technical people. Most relevant is the feedback from two highly qualified individuals. The first of these is Chris Campbell, an experienced Radio Engineer from California, and the second is Roland Shinzinger, a well known authority on power systems, and a Professor Emeritus of Engineering, (UCI). Mr. Campbell was selected by myself because of his well known expertise in radio and microwave transmission devises. Mr. Campbell was asked to be as skeptical and critical as possible regarding potential ways that these effects might be faked. Dr. Schinzinger was hired by
an outside firm and presumably given similar instructions to examine the device for possible fraud or trickery.
Mr. Campbell made it very clear that it was virtually impossible to transmit the necessary energy via radio or electromagnetic means of a magnitude necessary to light all the light bulbs seen lit in the demonstrations. This is especially true because of the inventor's willingness to drive around town and perform the demonstration anyplace desired.
QuoteDearest Lindsay,
I have read some of the response at the web site. It is a bit more encouraging then I was expecting. I have one comment about what KOSH said in regard to the clamp meter. The meter measures anything powerful in regard to electron flow based on the strength of magnetic field. So the meter displays that there is OBVIOUSLY a LARGE magnetic field inside the coil!!!!! If the meter says five amps just from a contact high, that means there is one helava lot of power spinning around inside there!
It amazes me how elementary that example is and yet the geniuses on line say, Whats the meter for?.....It aint clamped on anything... One engineer from a large American power company told me that the meter says more then anything else about the demonstration. You cant fool the meter, it must have a strong field to react and show a current. So, it aint batteries and it ant radio waves, but it is electron flow of a high order creating a large magnetic field. Or vice versa? Ha,
Ha!!!
Sincerely,
SM
So we sit inside this huge magnetic field of the planet. The tpu simply creates a resonant magnetic sphere that interfaces with the bigger sphere and rings it. Just another form of nuclear magnetic resonance.
QuoteHe went on to discuss my technology in detail and reminded me of the destructive capability when the devices reach harmonic perfection
'nuf sed...
...but it is electron flow of a high order creating a large magnetic field. Or vice versa? Ha, Ha!!!
;)
I don't know if anyone has thought of this....
That type of ammeter will NOT show a reading with the jaws closed unless current is passing in one direction through the center and the other direction on the outside. In other words, IF you could have current flowing like a river and you stuck that closed set of jaws in the river flow of current..... there would be very little reading.
The reason.... the greater amount of flow over the outside (larger diameter) would offset the lesser amount of flow through the inside (smaller diameter).
Just for shts & grins let us say there was a flow of current through the space surrounding the TPU. The actual current flow would be the reading times the ratio of the inner diameter compared to the outer diameter.
(at a minimum. Things wouldn't be that simple)
So, if the meter reads 1 Amp and the OD is twice the ID the actual current flow through the center would be twice the meter reading.
If you have such a meter just try to show a reading without passing a conductor through the middle of those closed jaws.
Yes, the meter on the video was very telling.
...or if the current is induced by something that is in rotation in the local space of the probe.
I.E. any conductor within the space occupied by the rotating "something" would have current induced into it as one side will always be a different direction than the other. Can't beat Lenz, even on the fringe.
I think that the orientation will determine how much is induced and therefore how many electrons are caused to drift. (Orientation varies the coupling.) Movement of the something along the conductor would be like a "current without the carrier", so not detectable by inductive means, or even electrostatic means as the conductor is also charged and may have current, but may be indicative of additional "energy" transferred through the conductor. I.E. less heat from measured current and resistance. I think it would affect a magnet held near the conductor, but this is just a yes or no indication and may not be useful for measurement.
The question of "How did Tesla get it to rotate?" is still open for debate. His Magnifier was initially vertical and this may be a clue but later versions in his notes were not in the same orientation to negate inductive coupling to the primary/secondary. Of course they may have had bias from the gap not quenching completely or an orientation that wasn't mentioned or a tuning point with the coil.
You guys speculate too much,here is the amp meter SM used again,it was made
in 1998 has not changed according to the manufacturer.The meter on the dc amp setting
reacts to a magnetic field,it will not react to any ac magnetic field,but will react to
a pulsing
magnetic field.I have tried 120 hz pulsing magnetic fields it will react to this,mostlikely
it will react to a pulsing field at 6,000 hz.In the video he lays the meter accross the
opening of the
coil,its a coil because other experiments indicates that the meter reacts to a north-south or
south- north,in one direction it will make a minus sign come up.Hes measuring a magnetic field it
may not be from the current going to the light bulbs,
its ether a stationary or pulsing dc magnetic field,if the coil is an air core,mostlikely its this
,it means a very large current is flowing.
On con men,this guy reminds me of SM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdozRv0XOjU&feature=related
Quote from: EMdevices on 2011.09.14, 21:33:35
...but it is electron flow of a high order creating a large magnetic field. Or vice versa? Ha, Ha!!!
;)
Look at the delay between the two events. The first one is the cause, the second the effect.
In continuous conditions, look at the phase shift.
Quote from: cheappower2012 on 2011.09.15, 04:28:29
You guys speculate too much,here is the amp meter SM used again,it was made
in 1998 has not changed according to the manufacturer.The meter on the dc amp setting
reacts to a magnetic field,it will not react to any ac magnetic field,but will react to
a pulsing
magnetic field.I have tried 120 hz pulsing magnetic fields it will react to this,mostlikely
it will react to a pulsing field at 6,000 hz.In the video he lays the meter accross the
opening of the
coil,its a coil because other experiments indicates that the meter reacts to a north-south or
south- north,in one direction it will make a minus sign come up.Hes measuring a magnetic field it
may not be from the current going to the light bulbs,
its ether a stationary or pulsing dc magnetic field,if the coil is an air core,mostlikely its this
,it means a very large current is flowing.
On con men,this guy reminds me of SM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdozRv0XOjU&feature=related
We speculate too much?
Quote
That type of ammeter will NOT show a reading with the jaws closed unless current is passing in one direction through the center and the other direction on the outside.
That wasn't speculation.
The ampmeter showed 2 things:
1: The dynamic field inside the unit.
2: The feedback loop or the symbiosys between the outter rings and the center toroids.
The comment 'This is very telling' about the ampmeter is the comment that leads to the fields and not the electronics.
On the OU site I posted numerous field graphics representing the dynamics that a schematic cannot show. I also showed the fields in the Deyo coil.
Funny... if you show a working unit or a schematic you draw attention with 'Proof'. I chose to show the fields. Why not alot of others who profess great knowledge? Just my curiosity, thats all.
@EM,
You are are correct about the power line interaction. Absolutely correct. The ampmeter in the SM17 shows this interaction between the outter ring and the center toroids. It is near field excitation. It is the feedback everybody is looking for.
Look at the fields and not the mechanical nor electronics and you 'WILL' see the process. With that there is no grey area of argumentation.
Can somebody post that Stven Mark tip when he said about field like big ball ?
With such questions as the ammeter readings we just turn in circles.
Technically speaking those toroids, if standard and if driven in a standard way should not have shown such high or even no amperage readings in the way he took them because toroids keep the field inwards. This is why recently I postulated that the field is not coming from the toroid but from the center of the toroid that harbors some other type of coiling or mechanism.
We know that SM never did anything for nothing. We know that there is a toroid in the FTPU and we cannot see under the toroid. We know there is a toroid on the OTPU and we never were able to see behind it (it was placed vertically). We know there is a toroid in the MTPU and again we never saw under it and we know there are two toroids in the LTPU and again there is a nice but small black box under them.
So we know SM never does anything for nothing, so there has to be a reason for everything in his videos, so there has to be a reason why we never see under the toroids. A while ago, I had put up a diagrams of a mechanism that could be under the toroids and also this same mechanism could exhibit the gyro shaking effect.
Take a speaker and connect it to your pulse generator and then hold the speaker in your hands and see if it does a gyro effect and see up to what frequency you can feel the effect. This will give you at least some parameters.
So imagine that if in the LTPU was dishing out 800 something volts at 1 amp, the only evident control circuitry would be in that black box and this is what we all tend to think. All the other TPUs did not have that much circuitry either. Maybe the OTPU since we can see the circuit board but there are not that many components on it. But again look at the LTPU with such a small box for controls and compare that to the mountain of control circuits in the latest Kapanadze device that is producing less then half of the LTPU output.
There has to be some control. SM says there is no mass circuitry because it is the knowledge of the coils and that wire is very important. But it is always the knowledge of the coils and it is always that wire is important so that statement does not mean anything more then if I was a hang man and said "knowledge of the knots and rope choice is very important". Then you have to interpret what "no mass circuitry" means. So, when does circuitry become mass circuitry? Don't know.
To think that the LTPU is working and producing that much juice and there is not one place to put enough circuitry to control such an event is just dumbfounding. So how did he generate his feed power, his switching system of 5000 hertz and some 800 watts, and how did he re-combine the outputs to produce so much juice.
When SM gave the working 6TPU to the other guy, the other said "slight noise and vibration" and SM practically pulled the unit out of the guys hands as if to say "Enough already, you shmuck, why are you mentioning NOISE". So what noise did that guy hear loud enough to mention before he mentioned vibration?
Anyways, we can go on and on and on and it will never end and one day, even if one of us does make a working TPU, we will never know if it follows SMs TPU design or if it leaves SMs technology in the dust. Well we never know. We just got a new look at a Tariels Kapanadze device and it may give more clues, so maybe a new SM video is out there somewhere that may resurface and do the same.
wattsup
PS: Maybe one last thing that has been pulling at me for several days now. Go back to all that you have learned of OU, from the first things you saw till today, which system in your eyes seems to be the most promising and would be easy to work out. Well we know SM's devices are not easy, or Kapanadze or Romero or there are so many other. But in my eyes, the one that exemplified the best the rotating magnetic field effect is the one and only ........................................... Rodin Coil. I am always amazed at such a simple device that is wound on a donut shape that can keep a magnet turning and turning at high speed with the simplest of pulsing schemes. So what I am thinking these days is why wind a Rodin on a dumb plastic donut shape. Why not try to take an alternator stator coil which is like a donut, and, wind a Rodin Coil over it and pulse it to see what happens. Seems to me all the stator wants to see is a rotating field and that is just what you get with a Rodin Coil. No duals, no quads, no 3-phasing required. Then, what if the STPU and 6TPU used this same idea and the outer winds follow in a way the Rodin method of continuous turns of the same wire. Or even wind a pick-up coil over the Rodin Coil. Has anyone tried that? Don't think so because all the videos I have seen just show the Rodin Coil and how nifty it is turning a ball magnet.
Looking down from the top we can see a toroid bifilar winding of an air core.
I see the field of the first one exciting the second one. The rotation comes from the flux circling in the center of the ring.
So here we can see 2 virtual spheres of magnetic activity.
@ wattsup and everyone else, i think you've got some really good ideas. don't know about the 60hz theory, but then again who does know other than steven. i think these units can run as a closed loop system with feedback once they are started by some means, be it a small battery or charged capacitors or even yes, possibably white noise. i think you should try the 45dgre winding with a vertical secondary. that would be a different winding from agent gates device which i believe has a horizontal secondary coil. as far as rotating magnetic fields go, has anyone tried a quad stator coil configeration, like in a motor, maybe useing AC instead of DC pulses for the field windings by pulsing the small toroid primary winding and producing AC on the secondary winding. could this produce a rotating magnetic field? like the egg of columbus. wouldn't the vertical secondary coil or coils be induced if the oscillator were runing at the correct resonant frequency. i read an artical about car altenators, the field winding only requires 2 to 4 amps to produce up to 70 amps of output current and supplies its own feedback current once its started. very interesting isn't it. just food for thought, i will leave you with one more idea. what if the small toriod choking type coils were being used for high self induction as Tesla used them in some of his high frequency high voltage converters; patent # 568,176, bedini also makes use of such tesla type circuitry in his radiant energy devices. maybe a high selfinduction choking coil could be used to charge the bigger capacitors of a primary circuit as in a air core tesla coil. if the tpu was laid out like the tesla magnifier the extra coil could be put inside the vertical or secondary coil and this would not be in magnetic coupling but would be of high self induction as tesla designed his. i know it's hard to figure out that DC thing, but i heard steven himself say on one of his videos that the tpu was putting out high frequency AC but would not read as ac on the meter. just more food for thought. O0 also, i believe it was real and eventually we'll figure it out or somthing like it; would that be so bad?
dag57 said:
Quotei read an artical about car altenators, the field winding only requires 2 to 4 amps to produce up to 70 amps of output current and supplies its own feedback current once its started. very interesting isn't it. just food for thought,
The initial excitation current for the rotating field comes from the battery. The actual power output is a function of the mechanical input from the engine, it is not a free lunch. Yes, once started the mechanical input provides the field current and the battery is now in charge mode.
A clear understanding of how an alternator works is a good thing, but there is nothing free here. You could replace the field windings with permanent magnets and two things would happen:
1) you would have a power output based on RPM's of the engine and so would have to do the control on the stator side since you would no longer be able to modulate the strength of the PM field.
2) you have lost the fine ability to have zero field if you had no electrical load, and the ability to lessen the drag on the engine.
Car alternators have been neatly engineered to provide a simple yet robust system of DC power for the car and charging control of the battery. But there is no free energy there, it is all supplied by shaft horsepower input.
:o with new information
The secret was probably SHORTED COIL.
SHORTED COIL is a waveguide and a place where electrons can be accelerated, closed loop.
This alone explain many Steven Mark tips.
Now, closed coil if specially made shape is efficient RCL circuit WITHOUT A GAP IN CIRCUIT (like inside ordinary capacitor).
Do you see the importance of this ? At resonance , there is no resistance , like in superconductor.
Simple but powerful. TPU.Case (almost) closed. Now we need to understand how electrons are accelerated and that's why I asked about "field like a big ball" SM tip.
hi ion, and thanks for your responce. i was pondering replacing voltage on the field winding with AC instead of the DC 12 volt battery current; and then no actual rotation of the shaft would be nessesary. the amount of output is going to be based on the speed of the rotation between fields and of course field strength. if we could rotate an alternator at 5000 hz instead of say 3500 rpms, (that would be 300,000rpms) what kind of output would that produce. this type of setup would be like combining motor field coils with generator stator windings all in one package. may only produce a transformer effect. just one more idea guys! :) have a great day, Don
Are there any recorded instances of the
device ever working apart from Steven?
Was it necessary that Steven be in close
proximity of the device in order for it to
generate any power?
@ all, somthing wattsup said made me think of another idea posted by grumpy a while back i believe. wattsup mentioned in his post about how a speaker coil will push away from the magnet when pulsed in the right direction. this reminded me of a post about bucking coils. when to like fields are placed together they do not cancel each other out but rather push against each others fields to create a so called scalar field @ 90 degrees. this type of magnetic field is what bedini is suppose to be using in his famous motor/radiant energy generator device... and what i'm about to say next may be similar to something tpu-bruce was thinking but maybe not. what if there were a horizontal coil wound with a bifilar bucking arangment (like the battery cables steven mentioned) spreading this scalar magnetic field @ 90 degrees straight through both sides of a vertical collector coil (which could be wound also in a bifilar configeration as tesla stated in his patent #512,340) and has the ability to store an enormous amount of electrical potential internally; and we've all read that the only way to convert radiant energy is with a capacitor or a battery. wouldn't this produce high voltage radiant discharges (dc in nature) ? ;) Don
Quote from: dag57 on 2011.09.16, 16:37:17
hi ion, and thanks for your responce. i was pondering replacing voltage on the field winding with AC instead of the DC 12 volt battery current; and then no actual rotation of the shaft would be nessesary. the amount of output is going to be based on the speed of the rotation between fields and of course field strength. if we could rotate an alternator at 5000 hz instead of say 3500 rpms, (that would be 300,000rpms) what kind of output would that produce. this type of setup would be like combining motor field coils with generator stator windings all in one package. may only produce a transformer effect. just one more idea guys! :) have a great day, Don
Then you would have the equivalent of a standard AC transformer with a phase adjustment by the shaft.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.17, 12:46:06
Then you would have the equivalent of a standard AC transformer with a phase adjustment by the shaft.
thanks ION ; in a generator the magnet or magnet windings are 90 degrees (or perpendicular) to the output windings; but in a AC transformer the primary and secondary has parallel windings (or one over the other). does anyone think a 90 degree type of winding setup would make any difference as far as the transformer effect? my mind keeps wanting to replace those rotating 90 degree magnetic (North and South) pole projections with stationary 90 degree AC (North and South) pole projections. might make a good weekend project anyway. ;) getting back to the TPU and was it real, i believe it was; but how did he do it? is there a general consensus of how the TPU is functioning or generating power. have we ruled out a conversion from magnetic to electric? have we ruled out regauging or as tesla put it, high self induction? i read over the 1875 NY news paper article about thomas edisons discovery of aether energies and its charging effects even on grounded pipes!. by the way everyone should read that article! should the reasearch move in that direction? gerry vassilatos discusses this charging effect in one of his books. good read but don't know how accurate he is. soo many questions. :D Don
Don
To my knowledge no one has a workable theory with experimental proof. Everyone has an opinion or pet theory.
The proof is in the simple repeatable experiment. I have been chasing the TPU for 6 years, and it remains an enigma.
Unfortunately, the waters have gotten very murky with lots of claimed replications or half baked youtube presentations. Lots of hoaxsters and tricksters have gotten into the act, some showing how it might be done with batteries for a few minutes.
But no one has been able to duplicate what we see in the videos of the larger units, nor have they been able to replicate the long run time in Dr. Schinzingers lab report.
So much misinfo and disinfo has crept in since the beginning of it's exposure on the web in 2006, it would be extremely difficult for a newcomer to sort the wheat from the chaff.
There are a few experienced persons on this forum that have been there from the beginning, and are well read on the real stuff.
Believe some of what you see and some of what you hear, be careful of wrong turns and dead ends. Normal transformer action will not get you there.
Quote from: ION on 2011.09.18, 15:57:53
...
But no one has been able to duplicate what we see in the videos of the larger units, nor have they been able to replicate the long run time in Dr. Schinzingers lab report.
So much misinfo and disinfo has crept in since the beginning of it's exposure on the web in 2006, it would be extremely difficult for a newcomer to sort the wheat from the chaff.
There are a few experienced persons on this forum that have been there from the beginning, and are well read on the real stuff.
Believe some of what you see and some of what you hear, be careful of wrong turns and dead ends. Normal transformer action will not get you there.
Many will understandably have difficulty with
accepting that the energy output of the device
does not originate in the device itself.
Some few "individuals" seem to have the ability
to "channel" the energy flow from an unseen
source which is not accessible to most.
Something in the supernatural realm.
If that is indeed the case then the device will
not "work" except in the presence or control
of the channeler.
Yes, it is mysterious and "other-worldly." It
is also the subject of several "black project"
endeavors within the vast underground military
complex where the impossible is dealt with on
a daily basis.
Seeing is believing but far removed from comprehending.
I just heard some interesting info from an old TV repairman Friend of mine.
He says he recalls one of the many design problems that almost ended RCA just as color TVs were becoming a hot item.
RCA made the core of TV sets for almost all of the manufacturers. He recalls only having to use one set of manuals and schematics for most console sets.
The problem that had to be changed was the power supply. It was a ferroresonant supply using permanent magnets for bias and temperature stability. I asked if he meant 'ferroresonant transformer' ? The answer was 'the whole supply was regulated magnetically. Line voltage went into an inverter that output 16kHz to this magnetically regulated supply. This high frequency transformer with magnets looked like a large toroid but was more hollow than normal. He said he never took them apart. They just went back to the manufacturer so he would be paid for warranty work.
All device voltages were fed by this HF transformer, including 30kV for the CRT. The inverter section used a common big dual rectifier tube. The HF side rectified outputs with Top-Hat silicon rectifiers by RCA.
He isn't aware of my thoughts about TPUs and I doubt he knows what they are. I was just asking him about early color sets. The above was volunteered.
I had heard that there was a toroidal power supply transformer used in early sets. They even had coils called 'control coils'. I haven't found documentation on this.
Anyone have any info on this weird arrangement?
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2011.09.20, 01:52:53
I just heard some interesting info from an old TV repairman Friend of mine.
He says he recalls one of the many design problems that almost ended RCA just as color TVs were becoming a hot item.
RCA made the core of TV sets for almost all of the manufacturers. He recalls only having to use one set of manuals and schematics for most console sets.
The problem that had to be changed was the power supply. It was a ferroresonant supply using permanent magnets for bias and temperature stability. I asked if he meant 'ferroresonant transformer' ? The answer was 'the whole supply was regulated magnetically. Line voltage went into an inverter that output 16kHz to this magnetically regulated supply. This high frequency transformer with magnets looked like a large toroid but was more hollow than normal. He said he never took them apart. They just went back to the manufacturer so he would be paid for warranty work.
All device voltages were fed by this HF transformer, including 30kV for the CRT. The inverter section used a common big dual rectifier tube. The HF side rectified outputs with Top-Hat silicon rectifiers by RCA.
He isn't aware of my thoughts about TPUs and I doubt he knows what they are. I was just asking him about early color sets. The above was volunteered.
I had heard that there was a toroidal power supply transformer used in early sets. They even had coils called 'control coils'. I haven't found documentation on this.
Anyone have any info on this weird arrangement?
Schematics and layouts are available for those old sets if your friend can supply a few chassis numbers.
I personally don't ever remember seeing anything like this, though I repaired and scrapped for parts a lot of RCA sets back then.
The time-line doesn't fit but I just located this....
The references cited go back to 1929.
wattsup
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2011.09.20, 03:01:45
The time-line doesn't fit but I just located this....
Oh good, I'm glad were talking about this again. I remember reading this particular patent a few years ago, if I'm not mistaken. Thanks for the story from your friend. SM did say that he learned a lot from RCA.
EM
PS Here's a link to read more about ferroresonant transformers:
http://www.generaltransformer.com/transformer/ferroresonant-transformers.htm
The vacuum tube color tv set was a monstrosity - to compensate
for the aging of the tubes there were a multitude of adjustments
for the cathode ray tube display.
The Horizontal Output circuit provided the horizontal sweep,
B+ Boost and CRT High Voltage as a result of flyback. The
high voltage was regulated to prevent X-ray generation from
the picture.
The horizontal output transformer was a rectangular ferrite "toroid"
with the various windings to provide various outputs and it did
resonate at nearly (slightly less than) the synchronized horizontal
sweep frequency.
Servicing to perform Cathode Ray Tube drive adjustments
and color convergence was a couple of hours proposition
if things went well. Once all the interactions were "memorized"
through experience then it could be done in an hour or so.
With a mirror.
Thank God for transistors!
Some pretty weird stuff in our history....
Thorn 3500 convergence panel and also look at that big chroma delay line on the bottom left LOL not been able to find the circuit yet.
And at the back bottom right are those coils with the magnets on top that WW mentioned by the looks of it
Anyone remember the Radioshack color TV kit?
A rich neighbor wanted it but didn't know plus from minus. He paid me a hundred bucks to build it for him.
It took 3 days to build it and 5 days to make adjustments. What a beast!
The use of the horizontal output transformer to supply all regulated voltage in the TV was introduced approximately when solid state became the norm, although there were some hybrid tube sets that may have employed this.
The bulky 60 Hz power transformer was dropped in favor of the lighter weight high frequency operation of the ferrite flyback transformer.
The patent shows a unique twist, using the variable strength of a special permanent magnet bias to temperature compensate the output voltage of the ferroresonant (as opposed to flyback) approach. That is probably the main claim of the patent.
The 3500 was one of the first TVs to use a switched power supply in the UK, this allowed any power consuming circuits to be driven from the switched transformer. Most of the rails that come from the flyback are relatively low power or higher voltage, these are frame timebase and RGB tube driver supplies (200V)
Early TVs before my time to generate the EHT they would cascade conventional power transformers to produce the EHT for the tube anode, the guy i served apprentice to once told me, these were lethal to work on and had heard of several engineers killed mainly due to lack of earthing and insulation breakdown.
Most early flybacks would drive triplers to attain the EHT for the tube, later split diode flybacks would replace triplers and have the built in A1 variable tube supply along with the focus control.
An interesting power supply design was the Ferguson TX6/7 this used a large chunky choke, the choke was variable width pulsed and the resulting energy stored was released regulated, i have posted the circuit for this somewhere on OUR because this choke was used in the kap device.
There were a few sets that combined power supply and flyback but cannot specifically remember models, one Grundig chassis comes to mind.
Quote from: WaveWatcher on 2011.09.20, 11:51:42
Anyone remember the Radioshack color TV kit?
A rich neighbor wanted it but didn't know plus from minus. He paid me a hundred bucks to build it for him.
It took 3 days to build it and 5 days to make adjustments. What a beast!
Aye, the Heathkit Color Television kit was very
popular. Many ships in the U.S. Navy acquired
them and the onboard Electronics Technicians
built and maintained them as the main shipboard
tv set located in the crew's mess.
Those were indeed the days!
yep, those were some fun times back then. in 1975 my dad was just retiring from a life long endeavor of radio and tv. i on the other hand was graduating highschool. he was a repairman who started learning radio back in the early 1940's. i remember him telling me that a neighbor of theres built him a regenerative 1 tube shortwave set when he was about 8 or so years old; and that's what sparked his career in and love of radio. my father passed away in 1996, i can only imagine the exspression he would have on his face if he could see these 60" led flat panels today. i myself recently retired from a automobile manufacturing company; i do have a sincere interest in the study of alternative energy, especially those types dealing with converting or generating electrical energy. about the TPU; any new ideas? :) Don
SM mentioned comp wave. Am I the only one pursuing this? It exists. It is producible. Everything else is covered ad nauseum. But nobody touches this. Why? I have reproduced it and I have produced it. There are a few others but they have gone quiet. If mine is not the only answer then I wonder why. Scared or in awe? Grumpy pushes it all the time but everybody shys away like it is a quack theory. Too bad too. I am looking at it as we speak. My new builds have continuously forged ahead into the control of it. It is like a laser beam and emp mixed.
Why did SM mention stranded speaker wire and short lengths(jumper cables)? Like Grumpy has posted "Stop the current just short of conduction". I wonder what that does? What if we don't let the wires jump and there is a reader wire or cage next to it? What gets transferred? What happens in the middle of a ring that snaps the center like a stungun? When the pressure is released wouldn't we get a vortex? Same as above as below. Wind and water do it and they follow the rules of a greater command. The stars and galaxies do it. I wonder if universes too? Can we spiral a mass of electrons when we release the pressure? My how grand this level of thought is, no?
Get a length of bifilar stranded speaker wire. Just enough to wrap a paper towel tube end to end. Tie one set of ends together to +12v. Pulse the other ends with fets. The timing is 5 - 50 ns long and up to 100ms apart max. And look at the return on the scope. It is greater than the input. So we have no conduction but bemp. I have found that low inductance is the key. Two wires pulsed together just a bit off. Sm mentions iron wire delay. It was then stated to put that in a ring. So I wrapped a styrofoam ring with low inductance and wham! GFIs are clicking all over the house. 'Nice weapon of minor destruction' I sez. Need I make it bigger and better? Nope. I built and tested what I thought would happen.
Remember the SM17 with the bifilar antenna wire wrapped all around. And what about the low inductive horizontals. Probably should go back and read SM papers again. We don't need light to see how bright this thing is....
The compiled TPU stuff is in the link of my signature.
I had fired a stungun into the GK4 and got Radiant energy shooting out of the sides instead of the white sparks that usually accompany a stungun. It had not heat and did not sting.
As I moved my finger around the sides I could control the charge connection point. Kinda like God pointing at earth and lightning bolts fly down. The charge path distance was 1/4 inch. My suspicion is that less iron in the core the farther the distance could be until a certain point where the energy would change frequency to white from purple. What led me to this was SM showed a huge discharge that was a stungun type display. I then surmised that the TPU was in some way a horizontal ringed Tesla coil. Others who have produced powerful coils reported lightning discharges from above. Hmmm... I sez. Me thinks me can do it too.
So what SM found was a way to reproduce the Tesla coil firing but without the high current primary. Pure genius, my man, pure genius...
Giantkiller:
QuoteGet a length of bifilar stranded speaker wire. Just enough to wrap a paper towel tube end to end. Tie one set of ends together to +12v. Pulse the other ends with fets. The timing is 5 - 50 ns long and up to 100ms apart max. And look at the return on the scope. It is greater the the input. So we have no conduction but bemp. I have found that low inductance is the key. Two wires pulsed together just a bit off. Sm mentions iron wire delay.
You have a great imagination.
Let me ask you seriously, and this goes out to all experimenters:
For inductors:
v = L di/dt
i = 1/L integral v dt
For capacitors:
v = 1/C integral i dt
i = C dv/dt
Do those equations have meaning to you experimenters out there?
If not, a thread should be started to go over those equations and what they mean. Because the answers to the vast majority of the questions can be found in the understanding of those equations. The understanding of what's going on can be found by applying the knowledge gained from those equations.
QuoteAnd look at the return on the scope. It is greater the the input.
But there is something missing here in your description. What happens when the FET switches off? You observe a high voltage spike on your scope and perhaps you are interpreting that as a greater return. But is it really?
Why do you see a high voltage spike? The answer to that question lies in the equations listed above.
Why are you saying that the return is greater? Aren't you missing a fundamental here? The scope only shows you the voltage. What about the current? Everybody knows that voltage without current means nothing, or current without voltage means nothing, when you are trying to gauge the return.
Anyway, any experimenters that are playing with coils on the bench that don't understand the four equations above are severely handicapped. This will never go away, it's another one of those things that's carved in stone.
MileHigh
@MH,
I realized we have the equations and they might fit the TPU. What could possibly be the answer if all the textbook reporters can not reproduce the TPU in such an amount of time that has gone on?
If we can not understand the process of the TPU then not only I but the rest of you are following a pipe dream. And you have all the equations.
QuoteWe can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Quote"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited..."
...Einstein.
Thanks for the compliment...
QuoteFlatlanders don't have up
...Sagan.
Giantkiller:
I have a thought for you. Let's assume that there is something unknown, special, and unique about the SM TPU. Let's assume that the equations don't work with the SM TPU.
However, from what I understand, nobody can figure out what makes the SM TPU different and nobody knows exactly how it was built.
Then doesn't it follow that if you attempt to build your own TPU that you most likely have missed the mark and your replication is conventional? Assuming that's the case then the equations apply.
So in that sense, if you understand the equations, then you should be able to correlate your observations on the bench with the equations. So you play with your setup and lo and behold you note that the equations are perfectly modeling what you see. That's still a win, don't you think?
When you switch on the FET in your setup this equation is in play: i = 1/L integral v dt.
When you switch off the FET then this equation is in play: v = L di/dt.
Quote"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited..."
That's an interesting quote. But you can't forget that it also takes some imagination to understand the equations and as a result gain knowledge. Then at least you can say that you got to the "first plateau." Perhaps indeed you can then take it higher. One step at a time.
To come back down to Earth, I am pretty sure that your observations with your TPU setups are directly explainable by the equations.
MileHigh
@MH,
OK.
I pose this from Grumpy,
http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=79.msg17064#msg17064 (http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=79.msg17064#msg17064)
Now my curiosity has been how does this fit into the equations?
I have read Valone and Laviolette. They seem to have this identified but it is still considered fringe.
But again since this action they speak of is in a different frequency range than what we are used to then maybe it will fit into the equations.
Others have mentioned this activity also. But it is not mainstream yet.
Honestly I think the "one step at a time" approach is best here. I'm just talking about inductors and capacitors in circuits that you can work with on your bench.
QuoteWhat happens in the middle of a ring that snaps the center like a stungun? When the pressure is released wouldn't we get a vortex?
This clip was recently linked to. TinselKoala is hosting it:
So cool eh!?
It would tend to confirm or reenforce the idea of the "magnetic vortex."
It's a nice clip and I love the presentation except for one thing. What the presenter claims is an indication of a magnetic vortex is actually not a vortex. I interpret "vortex" as a swirling magnetic field, like something that would make a compass needle spin. In fact the magnetic field emanating from the magnet is just your basic vanilla magnetic field. It is essentially a static and unchanging thing. The plasma represents a current flow, and so naturally the plasma will curl as it cuts across the magnetic field. With the magnet in the vertical orientation you can create a "plasma motor." So it's the plasma that is spinning around, and not the magnetic field.
The only way to create a "magnetic vortex" would be with "brute force." You could have two coils at right angles to one another. If you excite one coil with a sine wave and the other coil with a cosine wave, then the magnetic field in the immediate vicinity of the two coils would spin around like a vortex.
MileHigh
thanks for posting that clip MH, I saw it before but it's nice to see it again. I love his little toy there, I wanted to buy one from the store a while ago. Plasma dynamics are quite interesting, and what would be nice to do is to film the spinning vortex at high frames per second to see what it looks like. I might just download this video and step it frame by frame to see if I can calculate the speed.
now that I said nice things, its time to be a bit critical. Even though I like the presentation, the guy jumps to conclusions about the spin of the magnetic field as a fundamental property, which is incorrect. I can tell that he is not thinking too deep because he does not even mention the Lorentz forces that the ionized gas particles feel in the presence of the magnetic field of the magnet while they carry the RF currents, etc..., but it makes for a nice demonstration.
@GK and all
Here is an observation on the TPUs.
Look at the STPU. Think of it as having a 1.5 pound core of iron bailing wire. See how thick and stubby it is. All that thick iron mass can get hot for sure if it is producing output.
Take the same mass of iron wire core and make a 6TPU. The walls are thinner and higher but this time you have more room for the over coils. So you are transferring more juice and the 6TPU will still get hot because the winds are still close enough together.
Now take the MTPU that is a bigger version of the 6TPU with the same mass of iron wire spread out more and again you can have even more over coils. This one used one center toroid. The output of the secondary overcoil goes to one side of the center toroid and the other side of the center toroid goes back to the feed side to the primary. That's why the amperage reading was highest off the toroids.
Now think of the LTPU as having two 6TPUs. The same mass of iron wire in a top ring and another same mass in the bottom ring. Now the winds are wider and the wires can be separated more and this was one of SMs goals to minimize heat concentration. And now you have even more over coils. This is two layers (NOT THREE) (That is why you never see any vertical wire showing in the LTPU outer center side wall, but funny you do see some wires coming out the center inner sidewall). That is why you have two center toroids and they are in parallel between half of each.
Yes but how would it work? If you have two coils wound over an insulated iron wire core and if those two coils are one primary and one secondary or what we call an isolation transformer, then you have one push coil, received from the other coil and that coil sends it back to the push coil. But that is not possible because of losses. Well........... what if the iron wire core has output as well. Now you just loop the over coils and draw juice off the core coil. Shit. Can it be that simple.
So one over coil is pulsed at the second overcoils' resonant frequency. The second over coil is wound the same as the first but with one or two winds less or more. That way when the primary is pulsed at the secondaries resonant frequency, it is not the same frequency as the primary that is supposed to be identical, (but slightly off). Running at the resonant frequency is supposed to produce the effect that the primary is consuming almost nothing to keep the secondary resonant, so the return from the secondary is even more closer to OU. But if the iron wire core can now add to the mix, then this is how he did it. I was very close to this with my FTPU tests but now know more on how to test more. All the above would equal the statement "Knowledge of the coils", and not knowledge of anything that much more complicated. Also, "wire is very important". Copper is copper. Not much difference with one from the other. But iron wire is very uncommon in such builds and therein may be the importance. I think this is the way to go forward.
wattsup
Jason and I discussed this at length.
We surmised the process was a bifilar dual pulse protocol (like the two wire test) and a length of the iron wire in parallel. The iron wire would consume any radiation at any angle then we use the iron wire as a conductor. You only need a small length as an antenna.
That small TPU we see above is a ferrite toroid wound with some coils and activated by a small magnet placed on the inside rim. This device is very simple and I can't imagine any electronic components used. It most likely is composed of wire and maybe a capacitor the most. We know it makes sounds which we analyzed and determined to be power line harmonics, so it appears to be a high Q resonant receiver much like a wine glass that responds to acoustic vibrations, except this thing responds to AC magnetic fields which would be audible if we had magnetic ears. (the human ear can easily hear a 5 kHz audio tone)
Besides the high Q mechanical aspect, the TPUs are also high Q because they use REGENERATION. This is the process of providing positive feedback with sufficient gain to almost self oscillate, but not quite. This allows nulling out the resistive part of a tuned tank circuit to further increase the Q over that of a passively tuned tank circuit. Steven Mark has said that the TPUs are like a "furnace that feeds itself."
Keeping these principles in mind can guide one to understand the TPU devices by just looking at them. They are all different which is a fortunate thing for us, because we can compare and contract and determine what's the common denominator. I have been trying to understand the coil arrangements of some of the TPUs, and how the voltage is induced and with what polarity and how positive FEEDBACK can occur to "feed the furnace" and further amplify the reactive fields so that they can induce more energy to be received from the external AC magnetic fields.
So, looking at the common mode choke in the center of the TPU, and how it's wound, made me realize that the "turbine effect" or rotating magnetic field occurs inside the torroid. The torroid is a critical item of the TPUs. It is a two pole single phase AC motor (induction motor) without the rotor, and it needs a phase imbalance to start to spin the field, which the magnet induces I believe, and perhaps this spinning field also interacts with the physical deformation of the ferrite itself as it resonates acoustically. By tracing the coils I was able to determine that I can create regeneration back to the main antenna loop with the correct phase to feed itself. The impedance mismatch prevents the voltage from driving current backwards against the regenerative voltage, so the buildup of energy is at the correct phase with the external magnetic fields and couples with them and extracts their energy. The more I study Steven Mark's TPUs, the more I realize he really understood his TPUs because he mentions these key aspects.
1) Turbine effect
2) Tuning to magnetic fields
3) Vibrations and Noise
4) High currents
5) Heat
6) Up-side Down shut off
7) Magnet start up.
EM
PS, The magnetic vector rotates inside the ferrite torroid, and the wires that come out of the center, or the leads, are playing a critical role unsuspected by any of us. The rotating magnetic field induces a peak voltage when the field is rotated 90 deg to what is shown, and the phasing is exactly what is needed to build up the reactive fields because the other phase delay is due to the inductance of the loop where the current is lagging by 90 so together we get 180 degrees of phase difference and, with the correct polarity connection that can be 0 or 360 deg of phase change or possitive feedback. I did extensive calculations of impedances and reactances and induced voltage and current magnitudes, and it looks pretty good.
Read about single phase induction motors and why they can't start: http://openbookproject.net/electricCircuits/AC/AC_13.html#xtocid1540137
This is similar to how the TPU functions without the magnet, it can't start spinning the field, and if the field is not spinning inside, it does not provide positive feedback to improve the Q, so the received energy is very low, mili volts!, but once it gets going due to the effect of the permanent magnet biasing the core, things begin to build up and the furnace feeds itself and the fire grows hot!
Some good thoughts here guys, now all we need is a definitive proof of principle experiment.
Regarding EM's comments about rotating the field in a ferrite, I have explored this without success yet.
I often thought the magnet bias acted like the shading pole of a two pole AC motor so that there could be a preferred direction of rotation, but have not been able to get this effect on the bench with a ferrite circular core.
The core could also be wired with a capacitor to provide a leading angle on one of the windings in order to provide preferential direction of rotation, such as in small reversible AC motors.
If you could get the "B" field inside the core to rotate, would the "A" field outside the core also rotate?
Is there a way to intercept the "A" field or would it move electrons in an outside conductor or winding such as we see in the TPU?
"I expect that the ferrite will saturate before you reach the power levels demonstrated by SM.
Unless there is a change in the rotating magnetic field, there is no indication that it is rotating or not. A rotating homogeneous magnetic and static homogeneous magnetic field have the same appearance.
@EM
I am not sure about the rotating magnetic field (RMF).
Seems to me the RMF would work against a device that is trying to catch the HV line emmision. SM did say "what are the ramifications of two fields turning in opposite directions". In order to notice two fields turning, you would also require one non-turning position against which both fields could turn. Otherwise two RMFs would be pointless. That would indicate the use of some type of coupling coefficient.
What I am trying to say here is two fold.
1) You create a self-feeding loop (or an almost self-feeding loop) between two coils working at a high rate of coupling co-efficiency which is more then possible when they are at resonance.
2) You draw off a third source which also happens to be your coupling coefficient object for the first two. This has not been done before where the laminate (for lack of a better word) is also your output.
I really appreciated you redoing your last post plus the adder.
Such discussions are not easy to put forth without creating some misunderstandings. In your drawing of the center toroid, you only show two wires, but there are four. In any advancement of an operational theory, one should try to include all the factors with the explanation pointing specifically to each component or group of components. That is how I have always tried to put forth ideas that point right to what is also seen in the devices.
I do agree that the STPU would not have 1.5 pounds of iron bailing wire and I will explain to you something I have realized since yesterday.
The question is the center toroid. Up till today we would consider the center toroid present in the TPU as follows;
FTPU - Top center
OTPU - behind the circuit board placed vertically on its side.
STPU - Not known - maybe until today.
6TPU - Placed on the side wall of the TPU. (Hard to see but there is the same size protrusion on one of the side walls.
MTPU - One in center
LTPU - Two in center
Well in the STPU one would think there is no toroid and this has created a major blockage in the advancement of these ideas because the idea should fit all TPUs. So let's look closer. OK look again at the image above of the STPU. Now think of the FTPU with the top and bottom outer loops and overcoils. Now take those loops and wind them the same diameter as the center toroid. Put one on top of the center toroid and one under the center toroid. So you have a three level STPU cake with top loop, middle toroid and bottom loop. SM just took the FTPU and condensed the loops and made a triple decker STPU cake (with nice icing on top - lol). So look again at the STPU image. Look at the dimensions and the center hole fit very well the center toroid as well as the outer diameter. The toroid diameter is slightly less then the top and bottom rings and this is why we see the top edge coming outwards very slightly.
So.......... ALL THE TPUs HAD A CENTER TOROID and now if you take my theory of operation,from one device to the other, the toroid stays the same or is doubled. What changes is the top and bottom rings and windings. The toroid is being used as a dual coil. One that pulses, the other that loads and sends back to pulse but all this happens through the outer rings.
Here is a better explanation.
1) Top and bottom rings are bailing wire output.
2) On each ring you have two over coils (control coils) or call them whatever. They are wound identical but one has a few less turns so the resonance frequency cannot be reached on both at the same time.
3) The center toroid has two coils that are not in bucking mode as a continuous straight coil of two winds. They are two distinct winds wound as bucking mode but wired as two separate coils.
4) Put a pulse on one overcoil at resonance to the other overcoil.
5) The resonant over coil will produce a reactive output that goes to one side of the center toroid as a feed pulse.
6) The other coil of the center toroid is the output that goes back to the feed of the pulse at No. 4.
This is self feeding, produces two fields (1-fields of the loops, 2-fields of the toroid).
Way back I had made a wiring diagram shown below. I had done some tests on FTPU mock-up (shown below) but the loop wire was copper. I think that was the mistake and will make a new one with bailing wire that will make it self-feeding.
The only odd ball device is the OTPU because the rings seem to be plastic. Now maybe the plastic has the same attribute as the bailing wire when coils are pulsed at resonance and producing reactive power. I don't know yet. It would be simpler to say the OTPU rings were light grade iron or some other metal that was actually has a slit cut on one side (at the back end where there is tape over the ring) to make it a finite (non-looped) coupling method and output method. The OTPU is harder to explain but the main facts fit is perfectly.
I am taking the perspective that the TPU was ether driven and did not rely on any HV lines. For me, every time a coil is energized, the coil draws in ether from the ambient presence. To use it, one would have to trick the ether into doing what it always does but now in a self-feeding loop.
In the FTPU he produced 60 volts but never loaded it because he is not so stupid to do so if the device could not handle enough of a load to do a good show video. So the FTPU showed voltage and he left it at that. What I can gather from this since the center toroid is the same as in all the other TPUs, it is his outer winds that did not have enough transfer ability to produce some good amperage to take on a load. So as the TPUs progress from STPU (more bailing wire and control coils) to the 6TPU (even more bailing wire and controls coils) up to the LTPU.
I'll stop here because my brain is going to fast. But this gives me some more direction for experimenting. I have a nice sized toroid core and will make the triple decker STPU and do some tests.
wattsup
QuoteSM did say "what are the ramifications of two fields turning in opposite directions"
wattsup, its so amazing he said that, because that's exactly how a pulsing magnetic field is understood in a single phase induction motor before it starts rotating, and only pulses. It's understood as two counter rotating fields that superimpose and create the appearance of a pulsing magnetic field in a certain direction. Imagine if one of the phasors is slowed down relative to the other one, than the two phasors meet up again slightly displaced from their original spot and so the pulsing magnetic field seems to rotate. If we suppress one of the fields completely, than we have full and honest rotation.
[edit: my picture is extracted from another drawing, the important concept is the rotating magnetic field iniside the toroid, but yes there are 4 leads]
Ion, do you remember Mark Snoswells work with this concept? I think he managed to get a rotating field if I remember correctly. Anyway, this whole concept led to the 3 phase research and rotating magnetic fields, Bob Boyce, etc.., but obtaining a rotating magnetic field is only a partial answer to energy generation, not the end result.
Basicaly, what I'm saying is a rotating magnetic field provides a means for us to obtain any desired phase shift, like 90 deg lagging or leading to mimic capacitors and inductors, which may not be practical or possible with these discrete components at low frequencies. However, it appers SM has implemented capacitors in some of the TPUs. Also, this concept is not exclusive, it only addresses some of the TPUs, i.e. the simpler ones, but the more complex ones with circuitry and control are obviously different. He obviously evolved his design and the final product is controled with electronics and does not require physical tuning, it's all done with frequency control. But I personaly like the simpler concepts, the no "mass electronics" versions, even though its enjoyable to play with electronics components.
EM
Here is a basic question:
Current in a conductor is a flow of electrons, which is extremely slow, and there have been several attempts to show that the energy transfered by flowing electrons cannot sum to the energy transfered in the circuit.
Is this current a cause of circuit effect or an effect itself?
If it is the cause, then our hope are in vain. If it is an effect, then we have to look for the true cause.
Does anybody know if there are any kind of recivers that use any type of hetrodyning that dont require very low noise oscillators?
Would it be possible to tune into anything using squarewaves or noise of any kind?
Would semiconductor noise prevent any kind of usefull feedback from being effective?
If we couls not avoid noise wouldnt even harmonic be the only kind of noise that mighyt not de tune our circuit?
If it were a very low frequency that we were looking for miight the noise factor be so critical that purity of oscillator would be of prime importance?
Oh that right, it's all fake!
Quote from: gridbias on 2011.10.06, 23:45:50
Does anybody know if there are any kind of recivers that use any type of hetrodyning that dont require very low noise oscillators?
Would it be possible to tune into anything using squarewaves or noise of any kind?
Would semiconductor noise prevent any kind of usefull feedback from being effective?
If we couls not avoid noise wouldnt even harmonic be the only kind of noise that mighyt not de tune our circuit?
If it were a very low frequency that we were looking for miight the noise factor be so critical that purity of oscillator would be of prime importance?
Oh that right, it's all fake!
Gridbias:
Are those honest questions or are you trying to teach something? Your post is not clear and the ending line seems to carry some "attitude".
We like rigor without the rancor, so if you have something to teach, or questions to ask, please present in a manner befit a scientific mind.
Your post seems cryptic. We know semi's are noisy, so are tubes. Have you had success in getting any of your TPU attempts to work. What is the status of your TPU work these days, can you share that?
How is Steven these days?
Ion,
The answer to these questions are important but that is just an opinion. And yes I am sharing an attitude ...despair
None of you have even the slightest chance of building a controllable device without using the recommended method ..again, just an opinion.
Im sorry if any body feels mislead and saddened that hardly nobody really took the path offfered.
tpu's wont fix our issues anyway
It is a 3 dimensional chord you are looking for ..good luck
Quote from: gridbias on 2011.10.07, 08:20:28
Ion,
The answer to these questions are important but that is just an opinion. And yes I am sharing an attitude ...despair
None of you have even the slightest chance of building a controllable device without using the recommended method ..again, just an opinion.
Im sorry if any body feels mislead and saddened that hardly nobody really took the path offfered.
tpu's wont fix our issues anyway
It is a 3 dimensional chord you are looking for ..good luck
We all feel a bit of despair or maybe confused disillusionment. And opinions are fine we, are all entitled to them.
You (and SM) have often pointed the way and some of us did take it, building very fine oscillators and amplifiers, tubes of course, with no luck.
I would hope we could all be brothers here and share our level of failure (or success) in this project. It is no one's fault that we have not cracked the code.
If you have cracked the code and have a working device or proof of principle, please do share, it will be uplifting to some of your brothers here to know that it can be done.
If you are as lost and dismayed as some of us, it is helpful to share that to, so we know we are all in the same boat and can try to find a shore.
I can tell you that I have been at this since 2006 with no success and of late just a few ideas on the bench to be tested.
Still believe what I see in the videos and the Prof. Lab report. As for all of SM's direction, I'm not sure although I have meticulously studied every word he left us with.
TPU's will not fix society's moral decay and materialistic bent, that is true, free energy will be wasted as energy is wasted now in the oil economy.
Have you taken the path that was offered......was it met with success?
Do not worry my T-bros! (aka TPU bros) :P
There is no reason to be disillusioned either, it's a journey of discovery and the process is quite captivating and fulfilling. I wouldn't have it any other way!
In a few months I will embark on another intensive research effort of the TPU technology, and it promises to be 10 times more exciting then what was done in the last 5 years, because I have collected so much information and expanded so much brain energy that now I have a very clear understanding of what it is and how it functions, and most importantly how the energy arrives to it. >:-)
EM
Let us trim the fat and boil the meat down:
We have two parallel wires that shake when hit. I say hit because pulses are slow. Grumpy said current is slow. With the comp wave generation from the two wires we get a shock wave. It has to be because the jumper cables jump, right?
So keep that in mind...
We roll the parallel pair into a cylinder. It is not a coil at this point. Might look like it but we have a different approach to driving this configuration. A different type of induction.
When the wires are hit and they repel the energy that exited from the wires it is a 360 degree wave. This shock wave goes outward and inward of the cylinder. The field follows after this event. Have we not heard this before? I think so. In fact I am positive. Ever seen a nuclear explosion? We get the light then the magnetic field then the blast wind. As above same below.
At the center of this cylinder the shock wave runs into itself. Now we're talkin' TPU.
With the previous examples of the TPUs we can definately fit the twin wire test into them. As Wattsup has shown in other threads.
So what do we do with the magnitude of the eclipsing shockwave in the center? Why, yes... We can put circuitry there.
Attached is a depiction of the windings with the eclipsing activity in the center only. In reality this device is a spherics of energy.
Quote from: EMdevices on 2011.10.08, 17:11:15
Do not worry my T-bros! (aka TPU bros) :P
There is no reason to be disillusioned either, it's a journey of discovery and the process is quite captivating and fulfilling. I wouldn't have it any other way!
In a few months I will embark on another intensive research effort of the TPU technology, and it promises to be 10 times more exciting then what was done in the last 5 years, because I have collected so much information and expanded so much brain energy that now I have a very clear understanding of what it is and how it functions, and most importantly how the energy arrives to it. >:-)
EM
T Bros or TPU Brothers, either way I like it.
Would that we could get a few more good minds on board.
I would hope that in the future, those who would present a theory do so by prefacing their comments with "this is my theory or WAG"
So many times folks present their WAG as if it were a fact. If this is so then they should show us their working device.
This would cause some restraint, but clear the air of so many WAGs presented as the "the method to success".
After several years, we are still on different paths with no indication of altering our chosen routes.
Trying some insulated bailing wire rings.
Just experimenting for now.
Trying to see if there is something lightbulbable. lol
These rings are 8 turns each.
The frequencies this device would operate at are in the 1-8Mhz range and maybe more.
wattsup
PS: To save space on the forum I put higher res images as shown below and will add others there in time;
http://purco.qc.ca/ftp/Wattsups%27%20stuff/tpu-stuff/ftpu-2011/
A little bit more work with that bailing wire and we'll get to the bottom of it all. We should be spinning in no time! :D
Direct current voltage induced by microwave signal in a ferromagnetic wire
Abstract
Experimental results of rectification of a constant wave radio frequency (RF) current flowing in a single-layered ferromagnetic wire are presented. We show that a detailed external magnetic field dependence of the RF current induced a direct-current voltage spectrum. The mechanism of the rectification is discussed in a term of the spin transfer torque, and the rectification is closely related to resonant spin wave excitation with the assistant of the spin-polarized RF current. The micromagnetic simulation taking into account the spin transfer torque provides strong evidence which supports the generation of spin wave excitation by the RF current.
EM,
Microwaves aren't required. I haven't found the journal address but there was amplitude modulated DC current produced on aluminum wire loops fractions of a meter in diameter. I'm pretty sure the wire was from a spool of MIG wire for welding aluminum/magnesium castings. The AC signaling used was from 100Hz to some few mHz. Static magnetic fields were required. It was from the same university in Mexico that confirmed work relating to frame dragging and rotating magnetic fields.
I found that article several years before I heard of a TPU. It would be nice to find it again. I'll keep it in mind as it would apply to the TPU saga.
WW,
I hope you find that article. Personally, I see the DC phenomena as a byproduct and perhaps related to the gain mechanism that pulls in more energy from the external fields and causes the regeneration action without transistor amplifiers. Certainly we don't need microwaves, that article is just to show that there's special action going on in a ferromagnetic wire under AC influence, and explains the DC voltage that results. The 5000 kHz frequency in the TPU gets rectified in the bailing wire and DC develops, but what does the DC current do in turn? Anything? My theory is that the DC current with superimposed AC current received is the mechanism that brings in more energy. It's really quite simple, let's do the math:
Assume we have direct current Idc and a sinusoidal small signal current Iac sin(wt) superimposed on each other, and let's calculate the instantaneous power flow into a load resistor R.
P_inst = I^2 R = ( Idc + Iac sin(wt) )^2 R = Idc^2 R + Iac^2 sin(wt)^2 R + 2 Idc Iac sin(wt) R
Notice that we have 3 terms, one for DC power, one for AC power, and another AC term which is a product of the two currents.
Now, if we integrate over one period to find the average power delivered to the load, we are left with:
P_avg = Idc^2 R + 1/2 Iac^2 R
which is what we expect. This is because the last term integrated over one period is equal to zero, so it's a type of reactive power that is given to the load and taken back the next half cycle, which is weird because we are dealing with a resistor here, not a capacitor or inductor. What I believe we need to do is capture this instantaneous power and rectify it somehow or simply let it resonate our tank circuit with even more energy, this is a way to amplify reception of weak signals with DC. O0
EM
I just took a look at the TPU, starting with the synthesis on Rexresearch.
- there is a point on the explosion (implosion?) of a 1960s CRT, the presumed cause of which would be an effect similar to that of a TPU, which occurred by misfortune and killed a child. But there was no TV explosion since the glass of more modern CRT is made much thicker, while the deflection circuits of cathode ray tubes are still manufactured on the same models.
- the magnetic field of a nuclear explosion is presented as if it could share a mysterious common principle with the TPU, a principle that would be unknown. That's not true, the principle is known: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_electromagnetic_pulse
As with the mention of the CRT explosion, and also of old Edison DC generators that would have killed workers, this confirms the need to regulate the system that generates this immeasurable power, without which the risks would be enormous, we risk dying in agony. :o
- it is said: "It is common scientific knowledge that if you have a piece of wire and first run electricity through it you will have a small kick when first energized. The kick is universally attributed to the earth's magnetic field."
A piece of wire that is not yet connected to a voltage source does not have the same potential. In addition, like any conductor, it is a capacity. Once connected, a current flows to charge this capacitive conductor until its potential is equal to that of the source. This kick has never been "universally" attributed to the Earth's field.
Since the different frequencies are supposed to provide this kick, and this kick has nothing to do with an unexplainable anomaly, either it cannot be a specific effect of the TPU, or Steven Mark didn't at all understand what he faced.
I obviously cannot try to make a technical analysis, since nothing is presented methodically, there is no science on youtube, only popularization. So I analyzed (I admit it quickly) with a method called "zététique" in French, not common in English nevertheless I found that: zeteticism (https://wiki.tfes.org/Zeteticism). ). It can be applied not only to the scientific questions as indicated at the link, but also to the non-scientific ones (people credibility, psychology and so on).
I don't see any Steven Mark technical description documents, only vague explanations and videos. I may conclude that Steven Mark is not trying to inform us but, in view of the above, to impress and condition us to think in a certain way, whether he really found something or nothing. Dr. Schinzinger, who certified the experiments, is surely respectable and credible, but he could very well have been manipulated. Scientists are not the best at detecting fraud, they have little experience in this field. According to the zeteticism, the best for this task are the "magicians", it is their job.
However, not everything is negative. The idea of rotating fields thanks to superpositions linked to different frequencies is surely a path to explore, because fields can be "moved" at the phase velocity, which has no limit.
It reminded me of that experiment of H Ardavan:
"Experimental demonstration of a new radiation mechanism: emission by an oscillating, accelerated, superluminal polarization current (https://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0405062)"
Capacities instead of coils are sequentially powered, generating a polarization current in a dielectric, which can have a much faster velocity than an ordinary current. This generates a wave that at a given location, can come from different emission moments that will therefore accumulate (a "kick"?). This idea gave rise to the US2017323697A1 patent (https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/description?CC=US&NR=2017323697A1&KC=A1&FT=D&ND=3&date=20171109&DB=&locale=en_EP).
The full works are attached
Regards
Mike 8)
Steven Mark did state that the TPU has a rotating field and that it was a requirement for the device's operation. He did not state what type of rotating field this is.
He also said there is a video that shows a compass rotating when placed in the ring of the TPU, but I have never seen this video.
The entire time that Steven Mark was conversing with experimenters, he stated that he could not give details of the device's operation and could only speak through "analogies".
The TV story was an analogy for a magnetic vortex, so strong that it pulled the screws out of the walls. IT doesn't matter if it true, he was trying to tell us to look at a vortex or rotating field.
All the analogies of initial circuit connection, when electrons first start to flow, when DC generators are first turned on are references to pulses. If you look at the work that Peter did with the bifilar wires and pulses, a compressed pulse is the product when one wire was delayed about 220ns. Poynt99 was able to reproduce this effect in a Spice simulation.
Dear F6FLT
Thank you for your interest.
You said:
QuoteDr. Schinzinger, who certified the experiments, is surely respectable and credible, but he could very well have been manipulated. Scientists are not the best at detecting fraud, they have little experience in this field. According to the zeteticism, the best for this task are the "magicians", it is their job.
This whole story of the TPU gets more interesting the deeper you go.
Quote
Roland Schinzinger 1926-2004
Roland Schinzinger
1926-2004
Roland Schinzinger, Professor Emeritus of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science, passed away on January 25, 2004.
Professor Schinzinger joined UCI in 1966 as an assistant professor, one of the first three faculty members of the school and a founding faculty of the new campus. His area of expertise was power systems engineering and energy engineering. During his career, he served the school in the capacities of associate dean for undergraduate student affairs, associate dean for graduate affairs and on occasion as acting dean. He also held a long-term joint appointment in the graduate school and was instrumental in developing a program in operations research. He was a compassionate and considerate faculty, a father-figure to his students. He was the academic director of the energy scholars program and a mentor to the students who participated in independent studies of the electric vehicle. He was dedicated to teaching ethics and was co- author of the book, "Ethics in Engineering." He wrote, "Technology should be viewed as an experiment on a societal scale. Its practitioners should be viewed as experimenters. Such a perspective can reveal much about the responsibilities inherent in engineering and the need for serious attention to professional ethics." Although he retired in December 1992, he remained active on the campus and was recalled many quarters to continue his teaching.
Professor Schinzinger and his family were among the first residents of the City of Irvine and he has lived in University Park for many years. He served on the Irvine Planning Commission, as a member of the energy committees for the city and the county and was the founder of the bicycle trails found throughout Irvine today.
Professor Schinzinger received his B.S. in 1953, M.S. 1954, and Ph.D. in 1966; all degrees were earned at U.C. Berkeley. Professor Robert Saunders, the founding dean of the UCI School of Engineering, was his graduate advisor.
Professor Schinzinger's memorial, in the form of a Quaker meeting for worship, will be held in the University Club on Saturday, February 7, 2004, at 2:00 p.m. Testimonials from friends are welcome at the service. Additionally, a Web site has been established to accept testimonials www.schinzinger.com.
DR. Schinzinger would not have been easily fooled as he showed up at the one demonstration in SM's home with equipment to detect stray fields or hidden sources.
As a mentor to the electric vehicle club at UCI, he would certainly have understood power electronics and what is possible with batteries.
You may wish to read the Doleshall Letters on this site.
Read the letters from Dr. Schinzinger to SM. Also check out the published works, books and papers of RS including "Engineering Ethics"
As Grumpy stated, there is no direct literature only analogies and there are serious doubts SM really understood the device, as is evident when he demonstrates the first small unit. So the earth magnetic field stuff is to be taken with a large sprinkle of salt.
There is much more.
Regards
Grumpy and iron are right. O0
There is a lot more to this, each week that goes by I seem to understand it more and I think more than SM himself, I'm sure he is not the inventor.
I am sure that pulling in the static ambient charge is the name of the game, as so capacitors and not coils, pulling in like air into a water vortex.
Regards
Mike 8)
Note also the Rexresearch page is a mess of stuff put together by someone who has no idea what they were doing and is ripe with misinformation mingled with some correct stuff.
Jack Durban who gets it wrong is given top billing.
Half the time you can't tell who a particular quote is attributed to.
The Gunderson patent and ECD are thrown in to complete the confused mess.
Why the entire Gunderson (non working) patent is there is beyond me.
And what does Wesley/Akula have to do with this?.
Further only one of over a half dozen original TPU demo videos is linked
Beware, Rexresearch is not a good source for info, and will certainly confuse.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.01.31, 18:48:04
Grumpy and iron are right. O0
There is a lot more to this, each week that goes by I seem to understand it more and I think more than SM himself, I'm sure he is not the inventor.
I am sure that pulling in the static ambient charge is the name of the game, as so capacitors and not coils, pulling in like air into a water vortex.
Regards
Mike 8)
I give Steven the benefit of the doubt in regards to his discovery because I have NEVER been able to find the delayed bifilar pulse compression method in any literature source. How he went from that to a working energy device is a testament to his character even if someone told him how to do it.
The electrons in a conductor are already there, we just need a better way to make them move.
Quote from: ion on 2019.01.31, 19:07:26
Note also the Rexresearch page is a mess of stuff put together by someone who has no idea what they were doing and is ripe with misinformation mingled with some correct stuff.
Jack Durban who gets it wrong is given top billing.
Half the time you can't tell who a particular quote is attributed to.
The Gunderson patent and ECD are thrown in to complete the confused mess.
Why the entire Gunderson (non working) patent is there is beyond me.
And what does Wesley/Akula have to do with this?.
Further only one of over a half dozen original TPU demo videos is linked
Beware, Rexresearch is not a good source for info, and will certainly confuse.
On and off over the years,i have watch many video's about the TPU.
Most of which would be very easy to fake,but a few have me stumped.
There was one i watched that you posted ION on one of the many threads here that is one of the few that has me stumped. It was one of the smaller unit's,where SM powers up a few light bulbs,and also a small TV,but where the output of the device was sent into a converter of some sort,and then to the TV.
So far so good,it could have been faked at that point.
The kicker came when SM took the small unit,walked out of-and away from his house,and then powered up an incandescent bulb with the unit while out in the garden.
Is it safe to assume that back then there were no CFL or LED bulbs that could look like the incandescent bulbs of the day?
Also,how is it that SM(who was not that savvy in the art of EE,according to many) could build these devices-large or small,one after the other,and have them all work,and yet we have some of the brightest minds here-such as your self ION,poynt,verpies-etc ,that cant seem to work out how this very !apparently! simple device worked ?.
If we look at the video below,we can see that there is very little to this device.
I believe that this is the one that used plastic speaker backing plates?
Why-or how is this so hard to replicate ?.
Mind you,this is one of those times where it could easily be faked,where the batteries are hidden within the lamp bases them self.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxLpaydM4eg&list=PLGallUGGsDszooMoKrvXnT-Eq5fmGh0IP
If the TPU is real,and is this easy and simple to build,i just do not understand as to why anyone here is looking elsewhere,or why replication attempts have stopped.
Brad
Added-this was the video i was referring to
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MYVmtF4JYg&index=8&list=PLGallUGGsDszooMoKrvXnT-Eq5fmGh0IP
I have an electric bike from the early 2000s that has 30 NIMH D cells in series in the front hub. They are 10ah and can deliver 50A continuous and 100A peak. One could probably do some incredible fakes with just one of these batteries and a boost converter to light a 100w bulb. Yeah, the battery could get warm, even hot. ;)
Mags
There was an EE that did an analysis of the TPU to see if batteries at the time could have explained it's function and he determined in his report that it was impossible with batteries available at the time. His name was Michael Ferrel or Fennel, or something like that, as I recall. This is posted on this sight along with the Dr's report. I was able to determine that he was a real engineer and that he lived in California. We never contacted him though.
Everyone has not given up, there have just become quiet. A wise person would not show a working version without protecting themselves first, and protecting themselves very well.
There may be more to the operation of these devices than just generating electricity.
Brad, you said:
QuoteAlso,how is it that SM(who was not that savvy in the art of EE,according to many) could build these devices-large or small,one after the other,and have them all work,and yet we have some of the brightest minds here-such as your self ION,poynt,verpies-etc ,that cant seem to work out how this very !apparently! simple device worked ?.
In your post you have brought up many of the points we have thoroughly addressed in the Steven Mark thread. But to answer your question by example, who would have thought that a polished ruby rod and some high intensity pulsed light or RF source could have resulted in what we know as a LASER.
Some things are difficult until the operating principle or mechanism is discovered, then it is easy and even a child could do it.
I could give many more examples, but think about it, even the simple discoveries of Faraday were unknown until he did the work of discovery.
Giving birth to something truly new is difficult at first, especially when everyone is so steeped in pulsing coils and electromagnetics, most of which has been rather thoroughly investigated. This is a very well traveled path, or more like a rut most TPU researchers got stuck in for many years, hence no progress.
As I said before, sloshing charge or electrons back and forth is not the goal.
Quote from: ion on 2019.02.01, 03:34:22
Brad, you said:
In your post you have brought up many of the points we have thoroughly addressed in the Steven Mark thread. But to answer your question by example, who would have thought that a polished ruby rod and some high intensity pulsed light or RF source could have resulted in what we know as a LASER.
Some things are difficult until the operating principle or mechanism is discovered, then it is easy and even a child could do it.
I could give many more examples, but think about it, even the simple discoveries of Faraday were unknown until he did the work of discovery.
Giving birth to something truly new is difficult at first, especially when everyone is so steeped in pulsing coils and electromagnetics, most of which has been rather thoroughly investigated. This is a very well traveled path, or more like a rut most TPU researchers got stuck in for many years, hence no progress.
As I said before, sloshing charge or electrons back and forth is not the goal.
Ok,so sloshing charge/electrons back and forth is not the answer.
So what is the path forward?,so as this dose not die a horrible death.
Which is the best thread to continue on with this research and development toward a working TPU,as there is so many of them.
I recall you making a post in one of the many threads,where some one carried out an experiment where they spun a coil up to a high speed,then stopped it quickly,and was able to read a voltage across the coil once it stopped spinning. If this were true,would we not see the same by a rapid spin up of the coil?. Im guessing we are going on the assumption that the electrons mass will give the electrons inertia,and when the conductor stop's spinning,the electrons inertia will keep them flowing through the conductor for a brief time ?.
Dose this have relevance to the TPU's workings?
If it dose,i can carry out that experiment,and see if indeed a voltage appears across the coil once it is stopped quickly from spinning. If so,what dose this tell us?.
Brad.
Quote from: ion on 2019.01.31, 19:07:26
Note also the Rexresearch page is a mess of stuff put together by someone who has no idea what they were doing and is ripe with misinformation
...
I agree, and I saw that the patent at rexresearch does not correspond to the TPU. But they quote facts and comments, so just take them with caution.
When I look at an invention, I normally use what the inventor has published. The problem with the TPU is that we are obliged to use what others write about it because we have nothing from Steven Mark except comments.
My main doubt about the TPU does not come from a technical question but from what surrounds it. When you have such an invention, in my opinion you don't let it go. Either you have the skills and you try to understand, if not the principle, at least the conditions under which the effects occur, and if you do not have the skills, you surround yourselves with people who have them, such as Dr. Schinzinger.
Is SM dead? Has he gone mad? Why has this invention not been completed, with disclosure to the general public?
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.02.01, 09:12:34
Is SM dead? Has he gone mad? Why has this invention not been completed, with disclosure to the general public?
Indeed.
Where has it gone ?
Was it sold?
Did SM just walk away with a pocket full of cash,and burry the TPU ?
Something is just not right--this kind of machine just dose not disappear C.C
Brad
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.02.01, 04:43:22
Ok,so sloshing charge/electrons back and forth is not the answer.
So what is the path forward?,so as this dose not die a horrible death.
Which is the best thread to continue on with this research and development toward a working TPU,as there is so many of them.
I suggest starting a new one.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.02.01, 09:12:34
I agree, and I saw that the patent at rexresearch does not correspond to the TPU. But they quote facts and comments, so just take them with caution.
When I look at an invention, I normally use what the inventor has published. The problem with the TPU is that we are obliged to use what others write about it because we have nothing from Steven Mark except comments.
My main doubt about the TPU does not come from a technical question but from what surrounds it. When you have such an invention, in my opinion you don't let it go. Either you have the skills and you try to understand, if not the principle, at least the conditions under which the effects occur, and if you do not have the skills, you surround yourselves with people who have them, such as Dr. Schinzinger.
Is SM dead? Has he gone mad? Why has this invention not been completed, with disclosure to the general public?
Steven Mark claimed that the device was taken from him and he was told he could not tell anyone how it works. He said he was visited by the FBI and a man from the Atomic Energy Commission (as I recall, but I might have that wrong). He later made a comment that the US Navy has had a similar device since the 1950's, this was by email and not post on the site.
Once he started talking to Mannix in Australia, the told Steven to stop and that they would take away his income if he did not. Perhaps he was collecting social security and cold not afford to lose that income.
Once "spherics" shared his information about the TPU and how it works, several people pursued that line of research. Everyone says they failed, but none of them followed the rules that spherics gave us.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2019.02.01, 13:55:05
Steven Mark claimed that the device was taken from him and he was told he could not tell anyone how it works. He said he was visited by the FBI and a man from the Atomic Energy Commission...
Well, we get it, thank you.
After the miracle machine, the conspiracy theory, a classic as an escape, a last lie to disappear from the confusion and buzz that your lies have built, without having to account for it.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.02.01, 09:12:34
I agree, and I saw that the patent at rexresearch does not correspond to the TPU. But they quote facts and comments, so just take them with caution.
When I look at an invention, I normally use what the inventor has published. The problem with the TPU is that we are obliged to use what others write about it because we have nothing from Steven Mark except comments.
My main doubt about the TPU does not come from a technical question but from what surrounds it. When you have such an invention, in my opinion you don't let it go. Either you have the skills and you try to understand, if not the principle, at least the conditions under which the effects occur, and if you do not have the skills, you surround yourselves with people who have them, such as Dr. Schinzinger.
Is SM dead? Has he gone mad? Why has this invention not been completed, with disclosure to the general public?
I spent over a decade, close to 13 years studying diligently every crumb of information I could find on the TPU.
In order of reliability or merit, this info falls into several categories.
1) The videos are the prime source. These must be relied on for basic information with a few pieces of technical info in the audio portion. Note that on one video when SM begins to describe the operating principle, the audio has been blanked out.
2) The lab tests of Dr. Schinzinger read true, as do the emails between SM and RS. Also Dave Doleshal emails to Stephan Hartman
3) The exchanges between SM and Lindsay Mannix may have more info if it was not disinfo from someone posing as SM.
These email exchanges are numerous and contain some info, but I do not use it as a basis.
4) Jack Durban has some strong animosity towards SM going way back, which colors his info in his writings and audio interviews, This may have been resolved. He is technically savvy, having operated his own business as a consultant and design engineer at Vorelco.com. You can see the stuff he worked on here. http://www.vorelco.com/portfolio. Jack believes the device was real and describes the odd stiction effect when moved through the air.
My opinion about whether it was real or not: I have approached all the info from the position of both believer and skeptic, examining carefully each stance.
In the end and lacking any new info I must say that I remain highly intrigued while at the same time having some skepticism.
It is soooo very important to know the timeline of events. This is a small portion of the entire timeline:
After the first smackdown in 1997,
SM no longer promoted or talked about the TPU.
Nine years later, in 2006 a video surfaced on the internet due to a post of it by Jeremy Gaul. Lindsay Mannix in Australia also somehow at that time acquired a VHS tape of the device demonstration. Lindsay made a series of long posts on OU (Master of Magnetics thread) after he was able to find SM in California These were his his series of email queries, proceeding cautiously. SM was smacked down again, in 2006 for conversing with LM by email, having apparently violated the terms of his prior agreement with (?).
Someday I will put together and post the entire timeline, which is revealing.
p.s. LM is a member here under another name which I am not at liberty to disclose. When he chooses to come forward with additional info or reveal himself, I'm sure he will.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2019.02.01, 13:55:05
Steven Mark claimed that the device was taken from him and he was told he could not tell anyone how it works. He said he was visited by the FBI and a man from the Atomic Energy Commission (as I recall, but I might have that wrong). He later made a comment that the US Navy has had a similar device since the 1950's, this was by email and not post on the site.
Once he started talking to Mannix in Australia, the told Steven to stop and that they would take away his income if he did not. Perhaps he was collecting social security and cold not afford to lose that income.
Once "spherics" shared his information about the TPU and how it works, several people pursued that line of research. Everyone says they failed, but none of them followed the rules that spherics gave us.
Ok,can we find out where this Mannix guy live's?,as i live on one side of Australia,and Jim lives on the other side--so we got this country covered.
Im happy to do a couple days drive to chat to this Mannix fellow,that is if he can provide us with any useful information.
Also,where do i find this information spherics shared?
If he provided the information required to build the TPU--why have none here done so?.
Brad.
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.02.01, 14:57:20
Also,where do i find this information spherics shared?
If he provided the information required to build the TPU--why have none here done so?.
Spherics' board has all the links: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?board=93.0
The main reason people have not had success IMHO is because very few have reached the high voltages and switching speeds required.
Anyone that's tried knows it is a VERY delicate balancing act to switch hundreds of volts with nanosecond timing through highly inductive loads and NOT release the magic smoke.
Few are able to design boards that can handle this, and the only ready-made hardware is the kind of lab-grade equipment that you'd need a second mortgage to procure.
Quote from: Reiyuki on 2019.02.01, 15:31:59
Spherics' board has all the links: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?board=93.0
The main reason people have not had success IMHO is because very few have reached the high voltages and switching speeds required.
Anyone that's tried knows it is a VERY delicate balancing act to switch hundreds of volts with nanosecond timing through highly inductive loads and NOT release the magic smoke.
Few are able to design boards that can handle this, and the only ready-made hardware is the kind of lab-grade equipment that you'd need a second mortgage to procure.
Contrar:
To quote SM from the first video: "very very cheaply put together, there is no mass circuitry involved with any of this stuff, it's just the knowledge of the coils and how they interact with each other"I always come back to this quote when I veer off too far.
p.s my (important) post 354 may have been missed as others were typing past that.
Yes, high voltage pulses are not a strong point for most experimenters.
I have shorted long strings of avalanche transistors, shorted power supplies, and set power supplies on fire (that was pretty cool).
The dual series spark gap is very troublesome.
The only person that publicly completed the AVEC was Roberto Notte (spelling?), and he was limited to 1kv, as I recall.
Several others built units but a far as I know they never turned them on, or at least not with the voltage required. I do know of working private units, but I do not know how well they work. By working, I mean that the experimenter told me they got an output. I don't ask questions regarding these things. Sure I would love to know, but release of information is the role of the experimenter. I would rather they keep working than have problems.
As far as I know, I am the only one the tried avalanche transistors and everyone else used MOSFETs. Several people have asked me about using avalanche transistors but I don't know of they ever used them.
Triggering the avalanche stacks has proven to be a real pain and I have not gotten it to work reliably.
Quote from: ion on 2019.02.01, 14:26:05
I spent over a decade, close to 13 years studying diligently every crumb of information I could find on the TPU.
In order of reliability or merit, this info falls into several categories.
1) The videos are the prime source. These must be relied on for basic information with a few pieces of technical info in the audio portion. Note that on one video when SM begins to describe the operating principle, the audio has been blanked out.
2) The lab tests of Dr. Schinzinger read true, as do the emails between SM and RS. Also Dave Doleshal emails to Stephan Hartman
3) The exchanges between SM and Lindsay Mannix may have more info if it was not disinfo from someone posing as SM.
These email exchanges are numerous and contain some info, but I do not use it as a basis.
4) Jack Durban has some strong animosity towards SM going way back, which colors his info in his writings and audio interviews, This may have been resolved. He is technically savvy, having operated his own business as a consultant and design engineer at Vorelco.com. You can see the stuff he worked on here. http://www.vorelco.com/portfolio. Jack believes the device was real and describes the odd stiction effect when moved through the air.
My opinion about whether it was real or not: I have approached all the info from the position of both believer and skeptic, examining carefully each stance.
In the end and lacking any new info I must say that I remain highly intrigued while at the same time having some skepticism.
It is soooo very important to know the timeline of events. This is a small portion of the entire timeline:
After the first smackdown in 1997, SM no longer promoted or talked about the TPU. Nine years later, in 2006 a video surfaced on the internet due to a post of it by Jeremy Gaul. Lindsay Mannix in Australia also somehow at that time acquired a VHS tape of the device demonstration. Lindsay made a series of long posts on OU (Master of Magnetics thread) after he was able to find SM in California These were his his series of email queries, proceeding cautiously. SM was smacked down again, in 2006 for conversing with LM by email, having apparently violated the terms of his prior agreement with (?).
Someday I will put together and post the entire timeline, which is revealing.
p.s. LM is a member here under another name which I am not at liberty to disclose. When he chooses to come forward with additional info or reveal himself, I'm sure he will.
Dear Ion,
I understand that after being involved in a project like this for a long time, seeing that its purpose is discredited by others should not be pleasant. I knew you wouldn't like my previous post, but I have to say what I think and why.
I'm not questioning the four points you're making. If they are perfectly admissible in support of this machine. However, they are not proof of a real overunity.
For the conspiracy theory, I can't follow you or anyone else. Men in black stories are not reasonable. Not only is it impossible to prevent a leak, but it is easier from the beginning to convince by publishing a plan to have your machine duplicated by all the DIY enthusiasts on the planet, than to produce obscure videos. This is how Naudin was able to popularize the lifter.
When you make videos, it's because you want your discovery to be known. But if we want our discovery to be not only known but credible, it must be duplicated by independent people. I can't believe Steven Mark would ignore it. He chose the way to make his setup known without wanting to make it credible, and therefore it is not credible.
Well, I have just flipped through the AVEC doc. IMO what a load of complicated construction, I really do not think this is complicated like ion has said.
Let's just ask ourselves a question:- The output from any power device has to have a logical termination sourcewith a higher voltage than the input and a usable current, such as a transformer or switching mode circuit like a boost converter.
The former we know the TPU does not have, and the latter has a max efficiency of around 95%, not bad but not OU.
Now let's take the switch mode supply for a minute, if we can increase the current somehow on top of the increased voltage (boost not buck), then we would have OU. This is where I have been working for a few years now, and then in the last year started linking it to the SM TPU.
So I ask another question, how can one get high voltage and high current easily from a circuit which has only a small battery at the input? You charge a capacitor over time and discharge rapidly, your cap is the output. But this is not OU, but what if you could somehow create a vast ongoing charge in that cap, so fast that the output you are drawing keeps a relatively high voltage but with current as demanded by the load connected to it.
The answer is you find an unconventional way to put that charge between those plates from somewhere other than just the input. That way is to draw it in from the air "loose term" around you like the air sucked into the vortex of water going down your bath pug hole, but in your unusual capacitor, it is charge drawn in.
All it needs is a capacitor which has a charge spinning around inside which attracts a further charge, it's not coils, it's capacitor plates, and that is what I have found in the last couple of weeks, take it or leave it, does not worry me :P
So SM was right, I is very simple and not rocket science.
Regards
Mike 8)
The Greatest Trick the Devil Ever Pulled Was Convincing the World He Didn't Exist
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.02.01, 18:37:47
Dear Ion,
I understand that after being involved in a project like this for a long time, seeing that its purpose is discredited by others should not be pleasant. I knew you wouldn't like my previous post, but I have to say what I think and why.
I'm not questioning the four points you're making. If they are perfectly admissible in support of this machine. However, they are not proof of a real overunity.
For the conspiracy theory, I can't follow you or anyone else. Men in black stories are not reasonable. Not only is it impossible to prevent a leak, but it is easier from the beginning to convince by publishing a plan to have your machine duplicated by all the DIY enthusiasts on the planet, than to produce obscure videos. This is how Naudin was able to popularize the lifter.
When you make videos, it's because you want your discovery to be known. But if we want our discovery to be not only known but credible, it must be duplicated by independent people. I can't believe Steven Mark would ignore it. He chose the way to make his montage known without wanting to make it credible, and therefore it is not credible.
Dear F6FLT
I will answer your points (which are well taken) and try to refute or explain in sequence, to the best of my ability and knowledge.
1) I have no problem and am not displeased with, rather am very interested your thoughts on the TPU, your experiments and in all your work that you have generously shared with all of us at OUR. You will find that we are in strong agreement on most things. I am glad that you can be comfortable to express your thoughts, and encourage it.
2) I agree that the videos are not real proof of overunity that an engineer would require. I agree that there is a possibility for fakery, even in the videos. This is also true of any supporting data, it could all be contrived.
3) I also do not give credence to conspiracy theories, men in black etc. I also regard them as a last ditch attempt to divert from a non-working device. I am only reporting the documents as they were given. We must however be careful here, and be sure not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Certainly there are military secrets that people have died for, and that are kept secret to this day under severe penalty of imprisonment or death.
4) Regarding the videos, SM himself admits they were only very crude attempts to document events as they transpired. They were never meant to give away the operational mechanism nor to be promotional. SM wanted a lot of money to reveal the true operating mechanism, so he was holding out for some big fish investors. SM was not a scientist willing to share the mechanism with the world, rather he liked money and his lavish lifestyle.
As far as I know, only interested parties that SM could trust were allowed to witness the video demonstrations. SM closely guarded the operation of his devices. In one instance, however, when a device was not putting out full power, only about 2/3 power, he became disappointed and took a saber saw to the device cutting it up into many pieces, giving each person a portion of the cut up device. This he did after letting the witnesses fully disassemble and test with meters to look for hidden power sources. Dr. Schinzinger was present during this and can be positively recognized in the video. That they all could have been in on the scam is a possibility. Not probable though if you closely watch the entire video and listen to the dialogue.
So as usual everyone is perfectly entitled to continue research into these devices or walk away.
The worst that would happen for anyone to continue TPU research with the goal of discovery of new principles in mind, is they will have wasted time and maybe learned some physics, so for me it is just a goalpost that seems to have a use.
My own belief is that there may possibly be a combination of electrostatics and electromagnetics going on in the device that may not have been priorly explored . Other possibility is some acoustic/electric principle that may have been overlooked. Possibly combinations of both. The area for experimentation is wide.
This I do know: There are many new experimenters just now learning what is inside the box of electronic engineering and believing they have something new. As they get further up the path they will see that these areas have been well explored, and their device is not at all novel. It's a good idea to fully explore the inside of the box and know the terrain well before exclaiming Eureka! Then one has a better idea of what may exist over the edge of the box.
Best of luck to all in their research.
author=ion link=topic=403.msg71961#msg71961 date=1549051659]
QuoteThis I do know: There are many new experimenters just now learning what is inside the box of electronic engineering and believing they have something new. As they get further up the path they will see that these areas have been well explored, and their device is not at all novel. It's a good idea to fully explore the inside of the box and know the terrain well before exclaiming Eureka! Then one has a better idea of what may exist over the edge of the box.
Indeed.
This was/still is me.
But i keep trying.
Quotether possibility is some acoustic/electric principle that may have been overlooked.
This is the area we should be looking into.
I have something to show all soon.
It is nothing new,but it shows an extremely small vibration making a large disturbance ,and some form of disassociation/phase change.
QuoteBest of luck to all in their research.
I hope you have not given up on the TPU ION ?.
Brad
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.02.02, 00:20:02
author=ion link=topic=403.msg71961#msg71961 date=1549051659]
Indeed.
This was/still is me.
But i keep trying.
This is the area we should be looking into.
I have something to show all soon.
It is nothing new,but it shows an extremely small vibration making a large disturbance ,and some form of disassociation/phase change.
I hope you have not given up on the TPU ION ?.
Brad
Dear Brad
We are all still learning what is inside the box. Hopefully we will find the edges, then it's new rocks to look under.
I'm always very interested in your experiments and findings especially now when it comes to acoustics and vibration. Keep up the good search.
And I have not given up on the TPU, it is like a north star that keeps me thinking.
Regards from the old fool
Quote from: ion on 2019.02.02, 03:10:45
Dear Brad
We are all still learning what is inside the box. Hopefully we will find the edges, then it's new rocks to look under.
I'm always very interested in your experiments and findings especially now when it comes to acoustics and vibration. Keep up the good search.
And I have not given up on the TPU, it is like a north star that keeps me thinking.
Regards from the old fool
ION
I am in the process of uploading a couple of video's--> !!! you need to see this!!!--second video is most interesting.
At first i thought i was seeing the mains being rectified some how,as the frequency is close to 100Hz. So i hooked up my inverter,and ran the fogger unit off the inverter,and the outcome was the same,even though the transducer unit was completely isolated.
It may be a case of the two frequencies(mains-50Hz,and transducer's 149.6KHz) mixed together ?.
I will add that the transducer is plastic and ceramic,and dose not conduct any voltage or current from the transducer's circuit into the water.
I recall reading that the voltage output from the TPU was mostly DC,with a slight AC component-->is that correct?
If so,we !may! have been looking at the TPUs operation all wrong.
I will post the video's as soon as they have uploaded.
Will take some time,as i am uploading in HD,and our internet speed here is most slow C.C
Brad
Ok,here is the first video.
I know it is nothing new,but it is interesting how such a small vibration can cause a large displacement.'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBaf2p3gRys
Brad
Hi Ion,
You explain that SM wanted a lot of money and therefore had no interest in disclosing everything. We see after all these years that he will have had nothing, which goes against the frame of mind you attribute to him.
My point of view: he cannot recover money because his invention is simply not one, either he made a mistake himself (unlikely) or more likely he misled others. So he can't say any more because that would be his trick, and apparently he didn't say enough for investors to finance it, fortunately for them.
Then you see the testimonies from scientists as strong arguments in favour of the reality of the effects. But fooling scientists is not as difficult as you think. In the 1970s, we saw a guy, Uri Geller (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uri_Geller), who was capable of prowess in telepathy and telekinesis (fork folding). See how he skillfully misled scientists:
"Geller's performances of drawing duplication and cutlery bending usually take place under informal conditions such as television interviews. During his early career, he allowed some scientists to investigate his claims. A study was commissioned by the United States Defense Intelligence Agency as part of the Stargate Project and conducted during August 1973 at Stanford Research Institute (now known as SRI International) by parapsychologists Harold E. Puthoff and Russell Targ. Geller was isolated and asked to reproduce simple drawings prepared in another room. The experimenters concluded that Geller had "demonstrated his paranormal perceptual ability in a convincing and unambiguous manner".
If Uri Geller can fool scientists at the Stanford Research Institute, don't you think that SM can do it even more easily in an uncontrolled environment?
That is why we must be uncompromising with the requirement of proof, its solidity and indubitability having to match its extraordinary character.
You said "My own belief is that there may possibly be a combination of electrostatics and electromagnetics going on in the device that may not have been priorly explored". I think so too, so let's put SM aside (and his twin brother Kapanadze) and move on! :)
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.02.02, 09:39:58
Hi Ion,
You explain that SM wanted a lot of money and therefore had no interest in disclosing everything. We see after all these years that he will have had nothing, which goes against the frame of mind you attribute to him.
My point of view: he cannot recover money because his invention is simply not one, either he made a mistake himself (unlikely) or more likely he misled others. So he can't say any more because that would be his trick, and apparently he didn't say enough for investors to finance it, fortunately for them.
Then you see the testimonies from scientists as strong arguments in favour of the reality of the effects. But fooling scientists is not as difficult as you think. In the 1970s, we saw a guy, Uri Geller (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uri_Geller), who was capable of prowess in telepathy and telekinesis (fork folding). See how he skillfully misled scientists:
"Geller's performances of drawing duplication and cutlery bending usually take place under informal conditions such as television interviews. During his early career, he allowed some scientists to investigate his claims. A study was commissioned by the United States Defense Intelligence Agency as part of the Stargate Project and conducted during August 1973 at Stanford Research Institute (now known as SRI International) by parapsychologists Harold E. Puthoff and Russell Targ. Geller was isolated and asked to reproduce simple drawings prepared in another room. The experimenters concluded that Geller had "demonstrated his paranormal perceptual ability in a convincing and unambiguous manner".
If Uri Geller can fool scientists at the Stanford Research Institute, don't you think that SM can do it even more easily in an uncontrolled environment?
That is why we must be uncompromising with the requirement of proof, its solidity and indubitability having to match its extraordinary character.
You said "My own belief is that there may possibly be a combination of electrostatics and electromagnetics going on in the device that may not have been priorly explored". I think so too, so let's put SM aside (and his twin brother Kapanadze) and move on! :)
It will be hard to gain the proof you seek if we do as you say,and forget SM and move on.
Research and development on the TPU should not be winding down,it should be ramping up.
Brad
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.02.02, 09:33:51
Ok,here is the first video.
I know it is nothing new,but it is interesting how such a small vibration can cause a large displacement.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBaf2p3gRys
Brad
Dear Brad
I enjoyed your new video. I have a few of those ultrasonic misters, surplus new old stock from humidifiers.
I tried many methods of vibrating wire hoops in free air loosely suspended using repulsion forces, but it required too much power to get even a small level of vibration.
I talked about some of this in a rough paper here: http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=1092.0
Now my experiments will turn to using electrostatic charge on the wire hoops and modulating it, as you know the coulomb force is very strong and effective.
Spheric mentioned that SM got some of his ideas from electrostatic speakers and delay lines used in such speakers as Quad produced.
SM was (to a dunce like me), a very smart person regardless of what his detractors say about him. Perhaps not classically trained in Physics, but had a good sense of how to use electronic circuitry, was a master builder of vacuum tube amplifiers, and even built a hybrid electric vehicle back in the 70's.
The clues have all been given, it's just a matter of the proper perspective for their interpretation.
I am working steadily in the background but don't bother to post all my failed experiments.
Good work
p.s. for some reason when accessing that thread with chrome, I get a lot of gibberish, with firefox it is ok
The whole idea of the TPU is thoroughly poisoned at this point.
The only thing that will change that is a positive result that can be directly connected to the TPU.
This is difficult because the only testable working principles are the explanations from Spherics, who has not been heard from since he released the information.
Though he explained several necessary details, he never explained how the field rotation was created in the TPU. SM claimed that the early versions rotated CCW in the northern hemisphere and CW in the southern hemisphere, and turned off when flipped over. This sounds like the Coriolis Force. This would imply that rotation was not forced, but an interaction with the earth. Even if this is the case, I do not see how to reproduce it.
Then there is the fact that there are several versions of the TPU's and scant details.
With so little tangible info on TPU construction, we are left with the AVEC info from Spherics, and our own guess-work.
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.02.02, 13:36:29
It will be hard to gain the proof you seek if we do as you say,and forget SM and move on.
Research and development on the TPU should not be winding down,it should be ramping up.
Brad
Let's talk a little bit about method. The context is the question of refutability (or falsifiability (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability)) in Popper's sense.
1) If I say "elves exist because you can see their footprints in this path where they pass every day": it's refutable, just observe the path for a day.
2) If I say "elves exist, they come out of the ground at night but only when they know they are not being observed": no one can prove that this is false, this is irrefutable.
A thing presented is scientific if it gives the means to refute it (case 1 only). If it is not refutable, it is not scientific (case 2, TPU videos). We can discuss it, but it's like discussing the sex of angels, so we waste years in useless discussions like with SM or Kapanadze (except for personal training, but there are more effective methods for that).
So:
I've not to "
gain the proof", I have only to verify the proof that is presented (
Are these footprints really caused by Elves?).
Otherwise, the simplest way is to use this Euclid's principle:
"What is claimed without proof can be denied without proof."
In other words in our field: "there is no overunity by SM or anyone else until proven otherwise.".
But I do not prevent anyone from doing poetry or science fiction by talking about the sex of angels, which for the TPU can be references to the Earth's magnetic field, the Coriolis force, the deflection TV circuits of CRT from the 60s, the threats against the inventor, the military forces for the suppression of inventions, the shared frequencies with UFOs...
Most simply use SM and Spherics posts and videos as guidance for their own work, not as definitive proof.
Besides, with modern technology pretty much anything can be made into a hoax.
To speak in analogy, people interested in the possibility of heavier-than-air flight would have been diligently studying the grainy film and newspaper clippings from the first Wright-bros flight, working out the geometries and design requirements of such an aircraft. Scientists of the day calling it another hoax would have focused their efforts elsewhere.
The autisitic Daniel Pomerleau is able to manifest electrical
energy by thinking it into existence. He doesn't know how
it is possible yet it does manifest and it has been verified
by many in his infrequent demonstrations. Daniel uses simple
coils of wire to aid his manifestations.
There are certain practitioners in Asia who are also able
to manifest Electric Shocks and Sparks by thinking them
into existence. They too cannot explain how or why but
the effects have been witnessed by many and in a few
instances captured on video.
Apparently extra-dimensional sources are responsible for
those manifestations. Could the same be said of the TPU?
Manifestations which seem to defy Science as we know it?
Then too there are the little known Secret Space Programs
which rely upon similar manifestations to power their strange
spacecraft which enable speedy and silent transport to regions
of off-Earth space. Area 51 and other areas which exist to
study and duplicate very advanced mysterious craft with the
assistance of extra-terrestrial beings.
It is all Star Wars kind of strange stuff.
And, it is real.
A miracle! C.C
If we start taking urban legends for granted, we will not get very far. Let's be serious. Autism does not prevent Pommerleau from being another Uri Geller (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uri_Geller), who made his money by charging for his demonstrations, demonstrations in which it is impossible to verify anything seriously.
As for Spherics, his work is to be known as what not to do, since he failed to build a working TPU.
The interesting thing about science compared to other knowledge sectors is that what is claimed must be strictly verified by experiments before it can be part of it.
There are always people who talk about the works of others, claiming to reveal their secrets to us, when they themselves have been unable to reproduce the effects they are talking about. We also have Wesley, about Kapanadze.
As one humorist said about some journalists claiming to speak on behalf of obscure authorities: "When you know so little, you have the right to remain silent". If the same sentence were applied in our field, we would hear much less noise.
This does not mean that we should not make assumptions or talk about them, certainly we should. This means that as long as the wrong assumptions have not been dismissed and the right ones transformed into real operating principles proven by verifiable facts, as long as the conclusion is not drawn, this is still blah blah blah that cannot be trusted.
I think I can even say that the more a person claims to reveal secrets about a device that neither he nor anyone else has ever been able to duplicate, the less you can trust him.
To the subject of this thread, real is what SM gave us as information. An then there was a time only a few persons got more insights, like this pictures:
(https://i.postimg.cc/66k6xS9H/2009-12-22-17-11-29.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/23xN40Lv)
(https://i.postimg.cc/c1p3kXPW/2009-12-22-17-11-37.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Wt7th62Y)
(https://i.postimg.cc/CMXXKB67/2009-12-22-17-11-46.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8sdtK5Gf)
(https://i.postimg.cc/7PjzQwfb/2009-12-22-17-12-20.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/nMYMX8Kt)
(https://i.postimg.cc/3rzrHwj5/2009-12-22-17-11-51.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/rzC21MYQ)
Of course this is just a sample to get a glimpse of how it could have been made but probably already close to it. And I think Otto with his ECD was really near on it. Just to remind you again.
i have seen these pictures before and was intriged back then as i am now again.
How does it looks like underneath that black tape?
It can not be that the A, B and C wires are ALL 3 all the way wired around the orange / blank wires.
It would have been much thicker then, so it must be kind of jump over, like 15 turns red, then 10 turns yellow,
then x turns black, then again 15? turns red, 10? turns yellow etc. etc.
The inner orange wire (collector) seems to be 3 turns all inside the "wrapped around wires", while the blank (aluminium?)
wire is 2 turns, started opposite of the orange wire and with 1 turn outside the "wrapped around wires" and 1 turn inside them.
Looking at the wrapped around wires, the number of turns is confusing, like A1 (red) wire has 9 turns while A2 (red)
has 15 turns, same for the yellow wire (10 / 11), so probably it does not matter much.
Itsu
IMHO:
Except for a vague resemblance to the first tpu, those images bear no resemblance to later devices.
I mostly count them as having nothing to do with the actual devices, as their pedigree is unknown. I think they are someone's incomplete attempt at a build based on their own interpretations. There was a lot of this show and tell stuff posted back in the day of every variation of windings you could imagine. These just came along sometime later after a long pause in the first flurry so somehow they were given credence.
FWIW
Vague resemblance? It is up to your imagitation. If you look at the devices SM presented they all looks different. Of course he would not show exactly how it is made. But all what is shown in the picture is scaleable, you can stack two of this rings and so on. There are a lot of possibilitys for modification. On the other hand, did he not say "very cheap put together and just baling wire"?
Quote from: rensseak on 2019.02.04, 04:57:15
Vague resemblance? It is up to your imagitation. If you look at the devices SM presented they all looks different. Of course he would not show exactly how it is made. But all what is shown in the picture is scaleable, you can stack two of this rings and so on. There are a lot of possibilitys for modification. On the other hand, did he not say "very cheap put together and just baling wire"?
So this device you have pictured works?.
You did already many testings and did anything work of it? And was your testings anything in this fashion? Not that I know.
Quote from: rensseak on 2019.02.04, 07:31:04
You did already many testings and did anything work of it? And was your testings anything in this fashion? Not that I know.
I've done no testings--only just started looking into the TPU.
But you did not answer my question--> Dose the device in the pictures you posted work ?.
Brat, I think it would work. Unfortunately I have no equipment to do any testings.
Quote from: rensseak on 2019.02.04, 16:44:42
Brat, I think it would work. Unfortunately I have no equipment to do any testings.
Can i ask where you got this design?,or which TPU it was to resemble?
Thanks
Brad
Brad, you said this in the other thread, which I did not want to derail so am addressing it here.
QuoteAnd,as far as Mark's(TPU man) being a fraud,well it go's like this--
There are video's showing the device working as claimed.
There have been many witnesses to the device's working.
There have been independent tests carried out,and data supplied by reputable people.
There are video's showing the device's working that !as yet! have not been debunked,where the workings/energy source simply cannot be explained,E.G-power density to large for batteries,no RF that strong in the vicinity to deliver that much power-ETC.
Mark's simply cannot be put in the same boat as RF,and seen as a fraud simply because !we! have not yet cracked the secret's to the TPU's workings. So much presented toward the TPU,and nothing but unfounded claim's by RF,along with hours of video's that show or tell nothing.
The two are nothing alike.
You make good points, but there is more.
Most do not know the history or evolvement of the TPU so let me expand on it a bit with a few facts.
1) Steve Mark never posted any of his documenting videos on the internet. After 1997 he he seemed to disappear. The video posts were done later in 2006 by others that rebranded the videos and used them for their own purposes.
2) Steve Mark stopped all work and talk of the TPU around 1997. He never had a website promoting it nor sought money from the general public for his discovery but was very interested in making a deal with one or more large companies that would be allowed to thoroughly test the device. Whether he was part of a scam for money involving Brian Collins is yet to be determined. We know that Brian Collins in many cases was acting independently and bringing high profile investors to initially observe the device.
3) It is important to remember that very little would be known about the TPU if one had to rely on information given by SM, as he was never after 1997 promoting the devices in any way, and hardly actively promoting them before that. Mostly he was demonstrating them and documenting the demonstrations with videos.
4) Anyone who actually watches the original videos must agree that they are very crude attempts to document something interesting and
in no way are slick marketing tools. Steve was trying to explain an effect that he himself did not fully understand.
I have studied the videos very carefully, in some cases making transcripts of what was said, using equalization and noise reduction. Some of the dialogue is very interesting.
Considering the above, I find the devices of SM curious as these devices disappeared from the scene in 1997 and did not reappear again until 2006 when others posted the crude documenting videos on the web. This did not in any way benefit SM monetarily.
This is a very important point to keep in mind.So as Tinman said, these devices fall into a different class, not easy to compare to the scams of today, where the "inventors" are actively promoting the devices on the web, and in many cases living off the proceeds as away of life.
Granted the web was in it's infancy back then, maybe it would have been different if it happened instead in 2007.
You will not find a build diagram or set of instructions anywhere on the web, but some have carefully reverse engineered elementary schematics from the videos. It was not SM's intent to give away the operating principle, which he himself did not fully understand.
There is more but all for now. I understand that there is some investigative work being done by you and Jim, and I hope you will post your findings here when you feel the time is right.
I would urge those who only wish to do a surface level study of SM and his devices to find something else to do as the waters surrounding this issue have been muddied enough over the years from surface dwellers. If you have a lot of time and are curious enough to want to to dive deep into the subject there is ample information on this site as a starter.
Regards
Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.04.30, 06:05:00
I am now getting some results but not fully there yet as I have problems looping without blowing things.
No surprise there.
Could you guys move all the phone listening and internet problems stuff to a thread dedicated to that topic, as it is seriously of topic here.
Regards
Some TPU ramblings-
On OUdotcom there was a link to a new Ruslan video which has now been removed in which he discussed supposed "secrets" to OU. The video is still available at- https://transfer.sh/JBo6c/O_nabolewshim.mp4
but it appears that there is no way to auto translate as there was on Utube. It was after pondering on what he said that I decided to watch it again and it was gone!
If I understood correctly, he alluded to using lower frequencies to create a skin effect thus creating surface electrons and then with the correct timing, apply high frequency pulses or spark discharges(?) to pull in ambient energy (electrons?) to generate excess energy. He likened the action to an internal combustion engine with the proper timing.
One will notice that all the so called grenade coils use wire with heavy insulation. Surface electrons in the dielectric?
More comments can be seen at - https://overunity.com/12736/kapanadze-cousin-dally-free-energy/msg533970/#new
Regards,
Pm
PM
I think there is good info in what you are saying, from what I have seen from my experiments that there is something in the relation of frequency tuning and something happening in the dielectric (re my work STEAP).
Regards
Mike 8) 8)
I posted on OU forum such excerpt from Tesla interview:
"That was in 1891, prior to my going to England to lecture before the scientific societies there, the Royal Institution and the Institution of Electrical Engineers. I had a wire run out through the window, and placed on the roof all sorts of devices to constitute this capacity [shown in the diagrams as an elevated square]. The first step was to connect this alternator [shown in the diagrams as a circle] with one terminal to the water pipe system and the other end to the antenna. I had already proved in my lecture at Columbia College that I could transmit energy through one wire; therefore, I was prepared to find that a current of considerable strength could be passed through this wire here [connecting the alternator to the elevated capacitor], although it was insulated. My idea at that time was that I would disturb the electrical equilibrium in the nearby portions of the earth, and the equilibrium being disturbed, this could then be utilized to bring into operation in any way some instrument. That was what we would now call, simply, impressing forced vibrations of very high frequency on an antenna. We have introduced the term "antenna" since that time. . . ."
Evidently Tesla also thought that he could move electrons from ground up and back. It is so simple ! Most things are at ground potential even if they are quite high above ground. When we make something "above ground" we have overunity - exactly what Don Smith said.
Quote from: partzman on 2019.05.04, 13:30:30
Some TPU ramblings-
On OUdotcom there was a link to a new Ruslan video which has now been removed in which he discussed supposed "secrets" to OU. The video is still available at- https://transfer.sh/JBo6c/O_nabolewshim.mp4
but it appears that there is no way to auto translate as there was on Utube. It was after pondering on what he said that I decided to watch it again and it was gone!
If I understood correctly, he alluded to using lower frequencies to create a skin effect thus creating surface electrons and then with the correct timing, apply high frequency pulses or spark discharges(?) to pull in ambient energy (electrons?) to generate excess energy. He likened the action to an internal combustion engine with the proper timing.
One will notice that all the so called grenade coils use wire with heavy insulation. Surface electrons in the dielectric?
More comments can be seen at - https://overunity.com/12736/kapanadze-cousin-dally-free-energy/msg533970/#new
Regards,
Pm
pm;
Thank you for summarizing the video. I watched it with the download version, but since no translation was possible, no insights on my end.
Regards
Beware of the so-called "secrets" that some claim to reveal.
When I read this word, a symptom of esotericism, charlatanism and religious thought, I run away. I never see that in scientific and technical publications. People just say what they have to say, with enough justification.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.05.05, 11:41:26
Beware of the so-called "secrets" that some claim to reveal.
When I read this word, a symptom of esotericism, charlatanism and religious thought, I run away. I never see that in scientific and technical publications. People just say what they have to say, with enough justification.
All the great pioneers have arrows in their backs. Those that put them there were afraid to take the journey.
Put an ant in a box and shake it up. The ant doesn't realize the force behind the shaking but will apply limited reasoning to compensate for lack of understanding.
Let a blind person smell an orange and try to tell them what color it is.
What is interesting is the ability to lead people down a rabbit hole or primrose path by merely stating some contrived education or experience. Then the comments are made and the hierarchy battles ensue while losing all the pertinent nuggets of the posting. Exposure over expression.
Clamor for the ivory tower, the soapbox if you will.
Pathetic human endeavors, no?
A few proofs and everyone falls for the kumbaya nest or throws bullets in the campfire.
90 degree coupling was one such issue...
Quote from: giantkiller on 2019.05.05, 18:05:35
All the great pioneers have arrows in their backs. Those that put them there were afraid to take the journey.
Put an ant in a box and shake it up. The ant doesn't realize the force behind the shaking but will apply limited reasoning to compensate for lack of understanding.
Let a blind person smell an orange and try to tell them what color it is.
What is interesting is the ability to lead people down a rabbit hole or primrose path by merely stating some contrived education or experience. Then the comments are made and the hierarchy battles ensue while losing all the pertinent nuggets of the posting. Exposure over expression.
Clamor for the ivory tower, the soapbox if you will.
Pathetic human endeavors, no?
A few proofs and everyone falls for the kumbaya nest or throws bullets in the campfire.
90 degree coupling was one such issue...
90 or 180 whatever ...there is no secret from 1875 when Edison discovered "etheric force" . EM radio waves are interacting with Earth magnetosphere and attract ions and electrons. This is "outside ambient" while our radio transmitter is not loaded by this and if made correctly and use resonance it can use far less energy of power source then the "effect". I don't see how it is different then heat pumps.
1874...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ernst_Worrell_Keely (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ernst_Worrell_Keely)
Quote from: giantkiller on 2019.05.05, 18:05:35
All the great pioneers have arrows in their backs. Those that put them there were afraid to take the journey.
...
The fact that pioneers have sometimes had an arrow on their backs does not mean that most alleged or self-proclaimed pioneers are not in fact pretentious fools who reinvent hot water, or nothing at all, and for whom the arrows are perfectly justified.
As for the statement "Those that put them there were afraid to take the journey", it is a judgment of intention, you don't know anything about it, it's gratuitous statement about people.
If we do not have to learn what to think, however, to think right, the method must be learned. When I read as arguments such false reasoning as sophisms, paralogisms, pychological digressions, allegories, metaphors... I am not surprised that crackpots who claim COPs of 144 without proving anything, are believed.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.05.07, 10:13:00
The fact that pioneers have sometimes had an arrow on their backs does not mean that most alleged or self-proclaimed pioneers are not in fact pretentious fools who reinvent hot water, or nothing at all, and for whom the arrows are perfectly justified.
As for the statement "Those that put them there were afraid to take the journey", it is a judgment of intention, you don't know anything about it, it's gratuitous statement about people.
If we do not have to learn what to think, however, to think right, the method must be learned. When I read as arguments such false reasoning as sophisms, paralogisms, pychological digressions, allegories, metaphors... I am not surprised that crackpots who claim COPs of 144 without proving anything, are believed.
PISS OFF
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2019.05.13, 02:58:03
PISS OFF
The truth hurts. I'm glad I could be helpful to you. 8)
Quote from: F6FLT on 2019.05.13, 07:14:20
The truth hurts. I'm glad I could be helpful to you. 8)
Have some truth pain yourself.
1 hour 52 minutes in. Gabriel Krons negative resistor demonstrated. Circuits revealed.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCu1hNQsr9YnkIjFkMAc3Npw
Show me something you have built. Show ANYONE something you have built.
How about we keep this thread dedicated to the TPU, instead of posting more of RFs hours long dribble fests.
Brad
Yes I go along with that.
I will be uploading the full video of my SA and tuning of the TPU which I could not do because of my slow internet, now have 600Mb semetric (up and down) 8)
This shows what happens when we use 3 frequencies in a special way and gain power.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2019.05.14, 02:00:39
...
Show me something you have built. Show ANYONE something you have built.
I don't have to answer your comminatory injunctions. I have made hundreds of achievements in electronics, since my first radio at the age of 11, but no free energy or overunity device that works.
In this, I am like everyone else, except that I do not show any experiments that I know are conventional and for which I have been able to make serious measurements that do not indicate anything special. I am only interested in proof of concept that highlights new elementary phenomena or anomalous behaviors.
On the other hand, we see many pretentious incompetents who believe they see anomalies or overunity in setups they copy, which nothing indicates that they would not be conventional, of which they have not even had the idea themselves and of which they understand nothing, but in front of which they strut their stuff. Your video is an illustration of this.
As you were viscerally reacting to my words, may I ask you if you are Rick Friedrich, so that you feel personally targeted when I only speak in general?
A "differential" negative resistance is a common concept in conventional electronics but it only works dynamically, so over a range around a U/I polarization point that consumes energy.
On the other hand, a static negative resistance without other energy source would be a free electrical generator. It's an urban legend on Krons. If you're sure you have it, I don't see what you're doing here, the goal is reached, there's no more research to do, just engineering. Scale it up and disconnect your home from the grid.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2019.05.14, 07:59:43
Yes I go along with that.
I will be uploading the full video of my SA and tuning of the TPU which I could not do because of my slow internet, now have 600Mb semetric (up and down) 8)
QuoteThis shows what happens when we use 3 frequencies in a special way and gain power.
Regards
Mike
Now that would be something well worthy of this thread Mike.
It's not a matter of !if! we will ever have an energy gain system,but more so !when!
We only know what we have learned,and we have learned very little yet.
There is so much more to come--we simply have not gone as far as we can go yet.
Brad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrAwmxdu6Yg&feature=youtu.be
It was filmed in HD but the TPU was interfering with the autofocus at times. Please take note of the kicks at the point of hitting the right frequency for this particular TPU. Now I know what I am looking for, the newer TPU has been designed a lot simpler and hopefully, I will have overcome some of the problems of RF interference in certain parts.
As it seems to loop is going to be the only proof of OU then so let it be :)
Please note the power of the harmonic frequencies in the 60KHz bandwidth, they are all the same, it is not until you get up into the 300KHz+ bandwidth that you start to get the normal dropoff associated with harmonics.
Tuning was done with the clock frequency which automatically tunes the 3 harmonics at the same time, so when the 1st is 5KHz for example the 3rd is 15KHz and the 9th is 45KHZ and it will produce at the resonance of the TPU, harmonics of 10,20,30,40,50 etc but all at the same dbv (power level), this is when the output gives real usable power.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: TinMan on 2019.05.14, 07:49:39
How about we keep this thread dedicated to the TPU, instead of posting more of RFs hours long dribble fests.
Brad
I saved your obviously valuable time by giving you the actual time stamp.
Re the TPU: If you are prepared to listen to the guy he reveals the process of anti-gravity using coils - which is one of the features of the TPU. ie an anti gravity feel. ( But not necessarily in this vid.)
So there is a relevance.
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2019.05.14, 18:40:13
I saved your obviously valuable time by giving you the actual time stamp.
Re the TPU: If you are prepared to listen to the guy he reveals the process of anti-gravity using coils - which is one of the features of the TPU. ie an anti gravity feel. ( But not necessarily in this vid.)
So there is a relevance.
I do not recall anything being said about anti gravity associated with the TPU.
I do recall a washboard effect and a gyroscopic effect being mentioned,but that has nothing to do with antigravity.
Brad
The TPU reportedly had an inertial effect that was evident when held up in the hand.
The effect was evident in that the TPU offered a slight resistance to being moved.
This is likened to the same effect associated with gyroscopes, except the TPU had no moving parts.
Based on a theory, I surmised that there is an accelerating force present in the TPU, but it is oriented around the ring, hence you have inertia rather than gravity. Based on this feature, I think the force could be re-oriented to produce an accelerating field, axial to the ring, for propulsion.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2019.05.14, 23:25:24
The TPU reportedly had an inertial effect that was evident when held up in the hand.
The effect was evident in that the TPU offered a slight resistance to being moved.
This is likened to the same effect associated with gyroscopes, except the TPU had no moving parts.
Based on a theory, I surmised that there is an accelerating force present in the TPU, but it is oriented around the ring, hence you have inertia rather than gravity. Based on this feature, I think the force could be re-oriented to produce an accelerating field, axial to the ring, for propulsion.
Transcript of portions of the video entitled "Infinity Power Generator" posted two years ago by HYIQ:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hWI6LKmZ7w&t=199s
Note there were two cameras filming the same event and the video shows both camera angles sequentially.
49:27 Washboard effect again, and SM asks an interesting question, about creating a propelling force (motor force) with the washboard effect.
49:32 SM speaking of the washboard effect says: That is interesting, because if I'm wrong, and I probably am, doesn't that mean that you could potentially develop some kind of a motor force, no matter how small, um, it's a possibility?
and again, from the second camera:
1:15:02 SM is testing the amount of washboard effect to see if movement could increase low output. Shinzinger directly seated at table looking on the unit.
1:15:14 SM explains a strange effect of the unit to Schinzinger: "If you change the load on the device you change the rpm's" (motions with hands spin direction) saying also: "that is interesting", "now if I'm wrong, and I probably am, wouldn't you think that you could potentially develop some kind of motor force, no matter how small, um, it's a possibility?"
FWIW
Alcubierre...
Paul Hill's version:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwi69svBgJ7iAhXHna0KHZkIDyEQjRx6BAgBEAU&url=%2Furl%3Fsa%3Di%26rct%3Dj%26q%3D%26esrc%3Ds%26source%3Dimages%26cd%3D%26ved%3D%26url%3Dhttps%253A%252F%252Fwww.thecid.com%252Fufo%252Farticles%252Farticles%252Fhill.htm%26psig%3DAOvVaw3lKFUiBR7vIzj2BTiuby41%26ust%3D1558025670350117&psig=AOvVaw3lKFUiBR7vIzj2BTiuby41&ust=1558025670350117
Bump
The TPU was real but was it an overunity device?
Yes right now you can use a TPU looking device for remote power transmission/reception ( reportedly 96% efficient) so in that sense it was real.
Once I discovered that I got cold feet about further work on TPU unless someone tell's me SM was tapping in to
some other energy source.
In my fanciful imagination I was thinking that he was creating a magnetic vortex and this some how used the
Earths magnetic field to fortify a local field.
This is what I have found https://jwcn-eurasipjournals.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s13638-018-1148-8
There is also a paper from IEEE Rigorous modeling of mid-range wireless power transfer systems based on royer oscillators
I am not a member so could not download it.
I know many of you are experts but what ever you want to construct, first decide what it is you are going to make and how it will work.
Quote from: MasterBlaster on 2021.02.21, 11:36:22
...
There is also a paper from IEEE Rigorous modeling of mid-range wireless power transfer systems based on royer oscillators
...
Hi MasterBlaster,
Here you can have it: http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=67185327398477365161 (http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=67185327398477365161) To open the zip file, use this password: wpt1wpt
Gyula
There are forms of induction that mainstream science doesn't use.
Willie Johnson identified several induction equations using dimensional analysis when he was writing his gyroscopic force theory.
Based on everything we know about the TPU/'s and the Spherics information, I determined that these devices use another form of induction. Some of these forms of induction utilize separate external fields to induce current. This means they are an open system and that normal limits of magnetic induction do not apply. Vary any of the external fields and you vary the output. Feed the output back to an external field and you increase the output, which increases the external field, and so on, if unregulated.
Overunity? Not really. SM said that were energy converters, and that seems like a good basic description.
Where does the energy come from? Energy is everywhere.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.21, 15:55:06
Overunity? Not really. SM said that were energy converters, and that seems like a good basic description.
If it converts energy from an inaccessible source to an accessible one, who's complaining?
The following are real, as is the TPU of Steven Mark, (SM).
If two conducting bodies rigidly connected have a difference of electrical charge
there is a resultant unbalanced gravitational force which will produce motion.
An electromagnetic pump is a pump that moves any electrically conductive liquid
using magnetism, plasma is seen as such a liquid. A magnetic field is set at right
angles (perpendicular) to the direction the liquid moves in, and a current is passed
through it. This causes an electromagnetic force that moves the liquid.
https://www.science.gov/topicpages/c/cylindrical+asymmetrical+capacitors.html
As "supposedly" drawn by SM but with certain tactical parts missing, the basics of
the TPU and the basics of the electronics, (brown paper drawings), have to be read
correctly. There was a TPU stolen! and just maybe the drawing was a breakdown
from dismantling it, but I am told it is in the hand writing of SM!
The tactical parts I have replaced in all the possible forms to find which is the correct
form, in fact there are two that work but one is better than the other and hence the
evolution of SM's TPU's.
The first link above will give you some of the science behind how this works, and the
difficulty anyone will find in using or selling or what ever.
Plasma energy conversion systems for electric power generation already exist and are
very efficient, no moving parts.
So how does a TPU work!!!
Copy and paste from my book:-
The STEAP TPU is a "type of" magnetohydrodynamic
(MHD) generator, like a conventional generator, relies on
moving a conductor through a magnetic field to generate an
electric current. A MHD generator uses hot conductive
ionized gas (a plasma) as the moving conductor. The
mechanical dynamo, in contrast, uses the motion of
mechanical devices to accomplish this. Note I said "type
of", that's because the TPU is not only a generator but a
captor of positive ions, it generates X and captures X+Y =
Z.
The TPU does not rely on a very hot plasma, though it does
warm up, and the captor is an asymmetrical capacitor, it's
very clever, it generates the plasma in one instant, and in
the other it captures it as stored energy at a rate of between
5000 and 10,000 times a second.
I apologize for the small print, I typed it in word so as I could copy and paste, and it did not convert to the forum posting very well.
Regards
Mike 8)
Mike
Good post... another way to understand the effect can be seen in any magnetically quenched spark gap.
The moment plasma or a spark tries to jump the gap it's own current flow produces a turning force bending it away from the gap points. This is an easy way to prove an external field can produce a force and motion on a fluid conductor like a plasma.
It's simply a matter of taking this basic concept then expanding on it.
Regards
AC
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.21, 17:16:11
The STEAP TPU is a "type of" magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) generator...
Ion, myself and a few others considered MHD generators over a decade ago, but there was no mechanism for gain, no reason for them to runaway and produce too much power, and they don't fit all of the TPU properties. Also, a MHD does not explain the gyroscopic effect.
Then why did the early TPU's turn off when flipped over?
Why does a compass rotate when the large TPU is first started, but a gauss meter detects almost no magnetic field near the small TPU (6 inch) that SM demonstrated.
See this video a 5:19 for the gauss meter reading:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26QqUKoQpO4&ytbChannel=null
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.12.12, 15:52:56
Then SM never should have said that the TPU's used a different form of "induction", of "causing electrons to flow".
Everytime I meet someone on these forums that might be SM, I ask about those toroids. The answer is never that they are fake or part of a tuned tank, rather it is that they are part of a regulator or for filtering, isolation, or whatever, but never anything that pertains to the production of the inductive effect. So, I am inclined to think that they are not important. Also, I don't recall that SM ever mentioned them in his letters. Knowing that some switching methods cause a reflection, I'm inclined to think they are for isolation.
Unfortunately, I'm having trouble finding the old video that I referenced above. It was one of the videos where he showed the 6-inch device and a lot of what he was saying was deleted.
EDIT:
Does anyone have this file?:
stevennew.mp4
On the topic of rotating magnetic field, Please note the similarities:
https://youtu.be/n2RJ_kPEkt0?t=316
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.21, 19:00:24
Does anyone have this file?: stevennew.mp4
I have it. It is 127 Megs. Suggest I how can get it to you. Is it ok to post it here?
Posting here is ok with me if you can upload it.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.21, 20:03:44
Posting here is ok with me if you can upload it.
I tried but it did not work. I have PMed you.
Quote from: MasterBlaster on 2021.02.21, 19:53:23
I have it. It is 127 Megs. Suggest I how can get it to you. Is it ok to post it here?
Perhaps try to use https://gofile.io/welcome (https://gofile.io/welcome)
What I used in my Reply # 412 above for you has a max file size upload of 50 MB only.
Quote from: gyula on 2021.02.21, 20:48:40
Perhaps try to use https://gofile.io/welcome (https://gofile.io/welcome)
Thanks to gyula We can I seen the video together!
stevennew.mp4
https://gofile.io/d/cQhXEi
Quote from: MasterBlaster on 2021.02.21, 21:48:09
Thanks to gyula We can I seen the video together!
stevennew.mp4
https://gofile.io/d/cQhXEi
Thanks MB and gyula for posting this video.
Quotes from the video after 30 minutes:
"This technology basically makes batteries obsolete."
"Slight variances in output in the air" (in an aircraft)
"Could even power aircraft without the use of fossil fuel"
"this is a new technology, it's an entirely different way of doing things"
At 34:55 "it is not collecting energy from outer space""it not a technology that is equivalent to perpetual motion, it's not that at all"
at 35:38 "we are creating electron flow in wire" (this is what I interpreted to mean a different method of induction)
There is a lot of stuff that he says near the end that is deleted, presumably someone thought that what he said was relevant.
Grumpy
QuoteAt 34:55 "it is not collecting energy from outer space"
"it not a technology that is equivalent to perpetual motion, it's not that at all"
From my research on basically every know FE inventor I estimate less than 1% understood where the energy came from and why.
So it's no surprise SM didn't know and from his language I thought it was obvious. Well over 99% of people cannot even answer the question, what is energy and where does it come from?.
In my opinion Centraflow is literally light years ahead of everyone and most inventors because he's trying to seek real understanding and answer the hard questions. All energy does come from outer space directly or indirectly, it is perpetual and the Earth and everything on it is not a closed system.
People would do well to listen to what Mike is saying, he's asking all the right questions...
Regards
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.02.22, 00:08:33
All energy does come from outer space directly or indirectly, it is perpetual and the Earth and everything on it is not a closed system.
The theory of quantum foam seems a good place to start. It involves very high frequencies which might help to explain why it is difficult to deal with.
Grumps,
It is probably nothing, but the last idea I had a number of years ago but didn't investigate other than a visualization exercise, was that the "new induction" mechanism may be by way of a "pinched" magnetic field. The pinching might be achieved via the control windings if two opposing fields are simultaneously created in such a manner that the polarity is the same, but in opposite directions (similar to forcing two N-poles together).
The net pulsed magnetic field may or may not be detected externally, but the postulation is that the net field is "pinched" in such a way that it creates an orthogonal lobe* of flux which crosses the collector coils and induces the collector current.
If this worked, it could be eliminating the Lenz effect since the collector and control coils are orthogonal to each other.
* where the field squishes out 90º, possibly both towards the outside and inside of the toroid.
Quote from: AC
All energy does come from outer space directly or indirectly, it is perpetual and the Earth and everything on it is not a closed system.
A concise description of the "Meta-Physical" or "Extra-Dimensional" aspect of Energy.
It is Correct by the way.
Quote from: Poynt
The pinching might be achieved via the control windings if two opposing fields are simultaneously created in
such a manner that the polarity is the same, but in opposite directions (similar to forcing two N-poles together).
The net pulsed magnetic field may or may not be detected externally, but the postulation is that the net field is
"pinched" in such a way that it creates an orthogonal lobe* of flux which crosses the collector coils and induces
the collector current.
If this worked, it could be eliminating the Lenz effect since the collector and control coils are orthogonal to each other.
There may be something to this. Certainly worthy of investigation.
The Halbach Array exploits a similar concept.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.21, 18:41:01
Ion, myself and a few others considered MHD generators over a decade ago, but there was no mechanism for gain, no reason for them to runaway and produce too much power, and they don't fit all of the TPU properties. Also, a MHD does not explain the gyroscopic effect.
Then why did the early TPU's turn off when flipped over?
Why does a compass rotate when the large TPU is first started, but a gauss meter detects almost no magnetic field near the small TPU (6 inch) that SM demonstrated.
See this video a 5:19 for the gauss meter reading:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26QqUKoQpO4&ytbChannel=null
When you realise how the toroid is made the movement is obvious. You do realise they are not 360º complete end-to-end toroids!
Yes next to no external magnetic field.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 12:39:40
When you realise how the toroid is made the movement is obvious. You do realise they are not 360º complete end-to-end toroids!
Yes next to no external magnetic field.
Regards
Mike 8)
Then why did the early TPU's turn off when flipped over?
Can MHD explain this?
I know ho the TPU toroid is made, how is your device made?
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.22, 15:00:08
Then why did the early TPU's turn off when flipped over?
Can MHD explain this?
The way it is collected.
Eg. if you have say 3 series polarised capacitors or batteries, and you turn one in the middle around is how I saw this at first. only with the very first one which did not power anything, just produced 63v
SM probably used later a switch mechanism to turn it off and on when turning it upside down, a bit of showmanship.
When you look at where you can place the electronics there is not much space, can you explain that?
Regards
Mike 8)
PS
Erni (ION) was a good friend, we communicated off the forum right up to nearly to his demise RIP.
Quote:-
I know ho the TPU toroid is made, how is your device made?
End quote
Do you, then where is yours.
Nice try Grumpy, you will just have to pay for the book :P
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 15:31:32
The way it is collected.
Eg. if you have say 3 series polarised capacitors or batteries, and you turn one in the middle around is how I saw this at first. only with the very first one which did not power anything, just produced 63v
What do you mean by "turn one in the middle around"? Do you mean to flip it over or make it rotate?
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 15:31:32
SM probably used later a switch mechanism to turn it off and on when turning it upside down, a bit of showmanship.
When you look at where you can place the electronics there is not much space, can you explain that?
Regards
Mike 8)
PS
Erni (ION) was a good friend, we communicated off the forum right up to nearly to his demise RIP.
No switch, SM did not know why it turned off when flipped over and asked the entire forum if anyone knew why. At the time I did not.
SM explained that the center of the TPU is a "void " and safe place to locate the electronics.
I think your device is different from the TPU, based on what you have explained about it.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 15:36:29
Quote:-
I know ho the TPU toroid is made, how is your device made?
End quote
Do you, then where is yours.
Nice try Grumpy, you will just have to pay for the book :P
Regards
Mike 8)
SM told everyone how the later units were wound, he just couldn't tell us how they worked:
Tue, 21 Feb 2006 20:06:57 EST
About the collector:
It is three separate coils of multi strand copper wire laid one on top of the other, not interleaved. Three is important. You can do many things with three coils. You can run them in parallel, you can run two in series and one in parallel, or etc.
You can run a separate frequency into each coil for better control on large power units if need be.
The control wiring is vertically wound in several segments around each of the horizontal collector coils. Other control wires are wound around all of the horizontal collector coils together.
Through the different control wire and coil wire arrangements you can keep complete control of the unit most of the time. However, you must have an emergency KILL switch. A way of cutting off all the control frequencies simultaneity. This kill switch must be, manual and also connected through a heat sensor buried within the collector coil. it should automatically stop the function of the unit before it self destructs on it's own. This is important for obvious reasons. Also the kill switch should also be connected to cut off whenever it measures over voltage. If that should ever happen, you would never have enough time to hit the kill switch before the inevitable explosion occurred.
You know, it is very similar to the idea of a long garden hose. Picture a hose with water in it. If you pick up one end and move along the length of the hose you will move the water constantly along in the direction you are moving. You could also squeeze the hose in the direction to move the water along as well. And you could do both to control the movement of the water more precisely. You can think of the movement of water as the movement of electrons through the collector coils.
I hope the things I share with you give you ideas about how my unit works. As you know, I am a great believer in understanding, not copying.I never built the TPU based on this description from SM since we were given a design from Spherics that is easier to experiment with. My device is currently in pieces, in several boxes that were in storage but I pulled them out over the weekend. Still need a place to work on it...
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.22, 15:50:14
What do you mean by "turn one in the middle around"? Do you mean to flip it over or make it rotate?
No switch, SM did not know why it turned off when flipped over and asked the entire forum if anyone knew why. At the time I did not.
SM explained that the center of the TPU is a "void " and safe place to locate the electronics.
I think your device is different from the TPU, based on what you have explained about it.
Grumpy
You get nothing if there is no source, first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule.
With that said, where do YOU think the power comes from?
The first one made by SM stopped when turned over, the second one probably as well, the other small ones were built differently, the ionic field is pulled into the solenoids and it spins inside, back, and to.
The void would be natural the only place there would be something, in the small TPU's is where the two ends are close and the electronics are placed, there is nothing in the middle of those "only thin air".
What if I said the forst was totally passive!! Hmmmm that would put the cat amongst the pigeons :D
You may be right mine is different ??? but answer the question, where does the power come from? I know, I nearly always shock myself every day opening my front gate :o
Well that's me done. Attached may help you see things differently
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 17:29:02
Grumpy
You get nothing if there is no source, first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule.
With that said, where do YOU think the power comes from?
The first one made by SM stopped when turned over, the second one probably as well, the other small ones were built differently, the ionic field is pulled into the solenoids and it spins inside, back, and to.
The void would be natural the only place there would be something, in the small TPU's is where the two ends are close and the electronics are placed, there is nothing in the middle of those "only thin air".
What if I said the forst was totally passive!! Hmmmm that would put the cat amongst the pigeons :D
You may be right mine is different ??? but answer the question, where does the power come from? I know, I nearly always shock myself every day opening my front gate :o
Well that's me done. Attached may help you see things differently
Regards
Mike 8)
All of the TPU's are passive except for small batteries for oscillators. For later units he swiped a magnet along the side to start them.
Potential energy is everywhere, one just needs to convert it into kinetic energy.
Your drawing shows something completely different from a TPU, and looks to be a form of
differential accumulator. They are used in some space craft (not from earth) to collect massive amounts of energy from the upper atmosphere and also from the sun. This then powers their propulsion systems. Congratulations.
I shock myself on gates too.
Mike
QuoteYou get nothing if there is no source, first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule.
Well said, it took me less than a day to build my first working FE device. I had this wild theory, normally I can see what should happen and work through the process however in this case I had no idea what would happen. I thought something different should happen outside the context of induction and it should interact with it's environment however it was very ambiguous with countless unknowns.
It took no time to build and prove but six years to understand what in the hell it was actually doing and why.
So from my experience you are correct and the first step is identifying a source of energy. Next is finding ways to interact with or convert the energy, then finding the most practical way of doing it.
I did everything backwards which is often the case however that doesn't mean others have to repeat my mistakes. In retrospect you nailed it..."first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule".
Regards
AC
Ha ha
Gentlemen, I'm taking leave of the forum as of the end of this week, been fun at times and others not so, one or two undercover agents here if you know what I mean.
Reactivating this thread I hope has helped to bring some form of sense to the existence of this forum, as of late science is sorely missing.
For those that I work privately with me, they no the way to contact me as usual.
Wish the best to all
Regards
Mike 8)
Goodbye Mike, and see you next time you are on the forum.
EDIT:
(My name is also "Mike" by the way.)
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.02.22, 18:59:56
So from my experience you are correct and the first step is identifying a source of energy. Next is finding ways to interact with or convert the energy, then finding the most practical way of doing it.
I did everything backwards which is often the case however that doesn't mean others have to repeat my mistakes. In retrospect you nailed it..."first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule".
Everything in the universe is comprised of "energy" in one form or another.
Grumpy
QuoteEverything in the universe is comprised of "energy" in one form or another.
That's well enough however it's not very specific.
I see Mike posted a picture of his setup as a basic circuit diagram. I recognized it right away and it is known in the art however it's very obscure.
However it isn't identical to SM's tpu because his didn't require a ground lead. Normally the development follows a pattern of rotating devices, motionless devices with a ground lead, motionless devices with no external connections then in some rare cases anti-gravity. Note that the majority of new devices have completely bypassed the first step because more people have access to the internet and information.
I suspect that if Mike can open the door and popularize Free Energy it will open the flood gates for everyone else. So he's kind of like our canary in the coal mine and hopefully he can pull this off. Were all rooting for him...
Regards
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.02.23, 00:04:30
I see Mike posted a picture of his setup as a basic circuit diagram. I recognized it right away and it is known in the art however it's very obscure.
You are so full of yourself.
There are a few videos that I wish to leave with you, they are not mine but of an excellent scientific colleague who teaches very well.
Here is a link to the first, and very important video for understanding the TPU.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85obZfbKFB4
Will look for the others and post here
Enjoy
Regards
Mike 8)
Second video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o82mwcMgQPo
Regards
Mike 8)
Third video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5B58pEh8F3E&feature=emb_logo
Regards
Mike 8)
Fourth video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvQck6Y-_rE
Ivo works in the same field, pun intended
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.23, 01:59:28
You are so full of yourself.
might need new glasses, a problem with the 'I's :)
Quote from: JimBoot on 2021.02.23, 12:38:07
might need new glasses, a problem with the 'I's :)
Sorry Jim, I didn't know you and AC are related... :o
Quote from: Grumpy on 2021.02.23, 13:52:41
Sorry Jim, I didn't know you and AC are related... :o
lol it's what we say over here when someone keeps telling us how awesome they are. "I did this... I'm that... I can do... I know...," I, I ,I, I " people who bang on about themselves tend to need their 'l's checked.
Ere many generations pass, our machinery will be driven by a power obtainable at any point of the universe. This idea is not novel. Men have been led to it long ago by instinct or reason; it has been expressed in many ways, and in many places, in the history of old and new. We find it in the delightful myth of Antaeus, who derives power from the earth; we find it among the subtle speculations of one of your splendid mathematicians and in many hints and statements of thinkers of the present time. Throughout space there is energy. Is this energy static or kinetic! If static our hopes are in vain; if kinetic — and this we know it is, for certain — then it is a mere question of time when men will succeed in attaching their machinery to the very wheelwork of nature.
Nikola Tesla: "Experiments With Alternate Currents Of High Potential And High Frequency" (February 1892)
Grumpy
QuoteYou are so full of yourself.
Everyone is full of themselves otherwise we would be full of someone else, lol.
As well, when I said...
QuoteHowever it isn't identical to SM's tpu because his didn't require a ground lead. Normally the development follows a pattern of rotating devices, motionless devices with a ground lead, motionless devices with no external connections then in some rare cases anti-gravity. Note that the majority of new devices have completely bypassed the first step because more people have access to the internet and information.
This is simply a statement of fact and Mike isn't the first to crack this nor will he be the last. My bet is that his device doesn't stop when flipped because it's tied to ground nor will it produce inertial effects because the geometry and action has changed. I'm not saying it doesn't work, I think it does however it's not the same as SM's device.
Another interesting fact is that many inventors and possibly SM didn't using switching electronics. They used the geometry and spacing of certain elements or LC components to create a time delay. We could imagine this as part of the output in the primary of an open transformer. The secondary would be spaced a distance away with a parallel capacitor to create a time delay in the signal. I think this is what SM was doing with the two toroid's in the center of his device.
If the input A is added to the output B as A+B then we could filter out A and send it back to the input to create more B.
I was doing this last night with a three element version of the Hubbard device and getting some really crazy scope wave forms. Everything gets mixed together on the output and the signal can stop for a moment and later restart on it's own all from a single input impulse with no switching.
Regards
AC
This video goes with the four that Centraflow posted recently:
Radiant Power produced by solid state Tesla hairpin circuit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Flj1i0zQ-8&t=0s
Cantraflow, thanks for posting those videos.
Grumpy
QuoteRadiant Power produced by solid state Tesla hairpin circuit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Flj1i0zQ-8&t=0s
I like IVO and watched that video a while back.
In my mind the numbers didn't jive because the wavelength of 67.9kHz in his video is 4,415 m and his coil is only 9.25 m. While Tesla claimed a real hairpin circuit could produce peak alternate nodes down to a 6" spacing which works out to 1967 MHz. This is also shown in Tesla's diagrams for his medical patents. The correct frequency for his coil should be closer to 32 MHz in my opinion.
IVO does go into the medical patents a little here...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uaNpeYKO74
I like how IVO uses an inductive discharge to charge his capacitors which is pure Tesla, (large inductance, small capacitance, inductive discharge). One trick few people figured out is that a real plate capacitor as shown in the art, under the proper conditions can produce physical thus electrical oscillations within the LC oscillations. I even went so far as to dope or paint my plates with many materials like crushed quartz with interesting effects. When I look at a circuit I tend to think... how can I throw a monkey wrench into the works.
What could I do to change the attributes in some way to make it act differently than I expect?...then see what happens.
Regards
AC
Currently I am reading about "Charged Particles". Talk about teaching an old dog new tricks!
Anyway, I have come across this patent for a TPU and thought you may be interested.
I am trying to work out the paralles in this device and the SM variety.
Electric current generation apparatus
https://patents.google.com/patent/US5650681A/en
Masterblaster
QuoteAnyway, I have come across this patent for a TPU and thought you may be interested.
I am trying to work out the paralles in this device and the SM variety.
Electric current generation apparatus
https://patents.google.com/patent/US5650681A/en
A question, why would you bother with such a complicated and expensive patent when Centraflow basically spelled out how to build a supposedly working device?.
I mean Mike basically spelled out how to build a working tpu.
It's mind boggling that there is such a lack of interest in free energy here in a supposed free energy forum.
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.03.01, 06:05:09
It's mind boggling that there is such a lack of interest in free energy here in a supposed free energy forum.
Just because you can't see it,does not mean we are not trying.
Brad
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.03.01, 06:05:09
I mean Mike basically spelled out how to build a working tpu.
It's mind boggling that there is such a lack of interest in free energy here in a supposed free energy forum.
Many people say many things. I never saw a book or a demo by Mike and now he has departed.
I feel forced to just tread on the same grounds.
Do you remember the Otto and Roberto's book and attempt? What became of that?
Quote from: MasterBlaster on 2021.03.01, 10:45:33
Do you remember the Otto and Roberto's book and attempt? What became of that?
Otto had a very considerable presence on OU a long time ago. This might be point to start:
https://overunity.com/2235/ottos-replication-of-steven-marks-tpu/
There are a vast number of other threads, to be found with "Otto" in their search engine.
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2021.03.01, 06:05:09
Masterblaster
A question, why would you bother with such a complicated and expensive patent when Centraflow basically spelled out how to build a supposedly working device?.
I mean Mike basically spelled out how to build a working tpu.
It's mind boggling that there is such a lack of interest in free energy here in a supposed free energy forum.
Cool
Where is your's then ?
Brad
I'm still around.
Undercover is not so undercover these days, I was not born yesterday ;)
The book is finished and now will come with the second part attached, it just needs converting to Kindle format and any editing that may be needed by Amazon.
The price will be around 20€, it all depends on the tax in your country.
A second book is being planned right now, which is long overdue, on how to run an air aspiration motor on water. This book will give my history and Stan Meyer's, and how so simply it is done ;)
It will be in the same format as this one but with more story behind it, that will certainly put the cat amongst the pigeons :D
My decision for doing this now is my advancing age, and the rapidly changing World in the last year. Those that don't want these things known are rapidly losing their cards to play like I am losing my time to play my cards.
Here is a video that I came across some time ago, "it applies to both books", that is a clue :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLWIBrweSU8
Regards
Mike 8)
The questions may be
Is it the clouds rubbing together?
Or is the charge always present but needs the right conditions to manifest as a discharge ?
I like the bit before the bang the most
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.03.02, 11:49:39
The questions may be
Is it the clouds rubbing together?
Or is the charge always present but needs the right conditions to manifest as a discharge ?
I like the bit before the bang the most
very similar to what you see in a Tesla coil isn't it? Charged particles trying to find a path?
The charge comes from the Ionosphere.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.03.02, 09:36:14
The book is finished and now will come with the second part attached, it just needs converting to Kindle format and any editing that may be needed by Amazon.
We shall soon witness your books amongst these then. Perhaps just as instructive:
https://www.google.com/search?q=books+on+free+energy
Quote from: MasterBlaster on 2021.03.02, 16:05:29
We shall soon witness your books amongst these then. Perhaps just as instructive:
https://www.google.com/search?q=books+on+free+energy
Except Mike's book refers to 1 specific technique .
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.02.22, 17:29:02
Grumpy
You get nothing if there is no source, first you identify the source and then you look for the way to plug into it, that's the first rule.
With that said, where do YOU think the power comes from?
The first one made by SM stopped when turned over, the second one probably as well, the other small ones were built differently, the ionic field is pulled into the solenoids and it spins inside, back, and to.
The void would be natural the only place there would be something, in the small TPU's is where the two ends are close and the electronics are placed, there is nothing in the middle of those "only thin air".
What if I said the forst was totally passive!! Hmmmm that would put the cat amongst the pigeons :D
You may be right mine is different ??? but answer the question, where does the power come from? I know, I nearly always shock myself every day opening my front gate :o
Well that's me done. Attached may help you see things differently
Regards
Mike 8)
So it goes back and forth a more than round and round ?
This explains the SLAP where he describes his understanding of frequencies coming together in the videos
When SM said there were magnetic effects both near and far that was somewhat misleading as most of us "assumed" that it was a gyroscope of sorts.
There is no doubt that there was a gyroscopic action when held .
Looking foward to your book Mike !
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2021.03.04, 23:20:37
So it goes back and forth a more than round and round ?
This explains the SLAP where he describes his understanding of frequencies coming together in the videos
When SM said there were magnetic effects both near and far that was somewhat misleading as most of us "assumed" that it was a gyroscope of sorts.
There is no doubt that there was a gyroscopic action when held .
Looking foward to your book Mike !
Yes, when the frequencies come together at a rate of around 7-8 cycles a second, the exact harmonic peak, it is what gives the movement back and too within the magnetic field.
The "toroid" being near 360º it would "appear" to go around and around but in fact moving approx: 300º and going back on itself 8) and that gives it the gyroscopic effect or washboard effect.
Regards
Mike 8)
Book now being published with Google Play in pdf form which Amazon did not want to do, only in their format "kindle" which
I will post a link when it is all ready for sale.
Any proceeds will be going to pay for the updates to my lab and to pay for further lab work in the pipeline.
Regards
Mike 8)
Quote from: Centraflow on 2021.03.05, 11:38:16
Book now being published with Google Play in pdf form which Amazon did not want to do, only in their format "kindle" which
Do you have a traditional paper version?
Any news on Mikes book
Bump
Quote from: itzon on 2023.04.01, 15:29:24
Does your book have a title?
Forget the book, publication was blocked.
I have bumped this thread because of the information that was posted by ION, it had been lost in the depths of the forum and I want to post some things in the near future.
Regards
Mike
The devices of Egypt,
As well as those of Ed Leedskalnin
And Tesla
Give light to the magnetic self-induction necessary for this type of device.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2023.04.01, 16:42:58
Forget the book, publication was blocked.
I have bumped this thread because of the information that was posted by ION, it had been lost in the depths of the forum and I want to post some things in the near future.
Regards
Mike
Why/who blocked the publication of your book?
I always thought ION was Spherics. Very similar mannerisms.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2023.04.03, 14:03:21
Why/who blocked the publication of your book?
I always thought ION was Spherics. Very similar mannerisms.
Why not print up a modest number of books and sell them through this and similar sites and using social media?
I have heard a good report from these people:
https://www.ylolfa.com/en
Google books or amazon are both pretty easy to publish through,
Can set your own price, everythings done online, don't even have to talk to them.
This is going to help the group of people that are trying to build STEAP, my work of investigating and "replicating" the work of Steven Mark and other inventors in the past.
Does it open a can of worms!!!!!!!! for sure it will, Maxwell Demon? maybe!
STEAP stands for Space Time Energy Absorption Pump as most know, well the question is where does that energy come from?
I'm not around much now as I am very busy on the one hand, and the other trying to keep my head down and enjoy my retirement.
Regards
Mike
I am so surprised that nobody has said anything, I really am!!!!
Do you realise that it does not matter what high value the external capacitor is across the A/B plates, APART from the energy stored in A/B, with 4uF the energy is 2 joules, with 20uF it is 10 joules. This energy is put into there when there is a discharge into A plate and the switch is closed so the B plate goes to the ground.
The next discharge into A does not have the switch to ground, but there is via bb1 and C2. The question is what happens to that energy on A/B when the C1 capacitor has suddenly become 290pF.
Here is the charge for C2, this second discharge is short, controlling the C2 charge, until the first charge cycle starts again.
For those with the full correct circuit will now see how this all works.
Regards
Mike
Thanks Mike. This is truly an outstanding achievement. It will take a little bit of time to process, which I think is what most people with an interest in the STEAP are doing right now.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2023.05.04, 17:32:27
I am so surprised that nobody has said anything, I really am!!!!
Do you realise that it does not matter what high value the external capacitor is across the A/B plates, APART from the energy stored in A/B, with 4uF the energy is 2 joules, with 20uF it is 10 joules. This energy is put into there when there is a discharge into A plate and the switch is closed so the B plate goes to the ground.
The next discharge into A does not have the switch to ground, but there is via bb1 and C2. The question is what happens to that energy on A/B when the C1 capacitor has suddenly become 290pF.
Here is the charge for C2, this second discharge is short, controlling the C2 charge, until the first charge cycle starts again.
For those with the full correct circuit will now see how this all works.
Regards
Mike
For my part, I was hoping for more details as I came to the party rather late, and I guess I am still mad at Kapanadze - so it's a distraction, personally.
I am trying to process any similarities between the Kapanadze patents and your achievements.
Also when I look at Mark's original device, the coils seem rather small. ie just a few turns. I am still trying to process the process.
So silence is just a lack of sufficient knowledge on my part and I suspect many others. I am hoping for more clarity.
I got stuck with the c1 plate shape? .
Perhaps some arrows ?
A 3 plate capacitor and charge switched b4 the charge/dischare process can complete .
This would mean its a trick of switching rather than tapping a medium .
Sorry If i sound confused Covid demon is here .
Please keep explaining and more drawings as its very hard to pass this understanding on once you have it .
Bear with us as you can . and Thank you .
Centraflow: I would like to suggest a Zoom conference with all who are trying to replicate and those who may want to start a replication.
Zoom enables replicators to show their attempts on camera and also is a way to interact and clear up anything not clear.
I have a Zoom account and can organize this. It is very easy once you get into it.
If you wish to discuss this further please pm me.
Kind regards, H.
What if all is connected and TPU is working on the same principle as Tariel Kapanadze devices? It's so simple you would laugh because it's only the way coils interract with themselves. The method of run the process on is irrevelant, it maybe be even capacitor discharge throught tiny spark gap.
Quote from: forest on 2023.05.05, 14:37:29
What if all is connected and TPU is working on the same principle as Tariel Kapanadze devices? It's so simple you would laugh because it's only the way coils interract with themselves. The method of run the process on is irrevelant, it maybe be even capacitor discharge throught tiny spark gap.
The only coil interreaction is with the capacitance between coils and NOT inductance. The coils form LC delay lines, the inductance difference of one set with the other is minute. The only real inductance is in the CMC which is used as a charge choke and separation from the input voltage, it is like a DC-DC converter on steroids but the real trick to make it work is in the C1 capacitance set and the controlled switching of all the mosfets.
The STEAP TPU is highly capacitive and does not work like a transformer.
Maybe other systems work in a similar way, if they work!
Winding the unit is paramount to a working system, it can be made any size as long as the ratios are the same.
Regards
Mike
3Dmagnetics
QuoteI got stuck with the c1 plate shape? .
Perhaps some arrows ?
A 3 plate capacitor and charge switched b4 the charge/dischare process can complete .
This would mean its a trick of switching rather than tapping a medium .
Indeed, it's a common perceptual problem.
Imagine our capacitor plate as large as a city block. We both live on the same block two houses apart and we both have very large pancake coils of wire set up in our back yard. When the charge on the whole capacitor plate changes my coils extract some energy from the field change. However my coils cannot change without effecting your coils because were on the same block on the same plate. Not only do my coils effect the charge density on the plate but what I'm doing in my back yard does as well which effects you and your coils.
This is relates to infinite element analysis where we do not lump together or average everything. We recognize all the individual parts which make up the whole and how they can have an effect on each other. As such I tend not to only see a simple "capacitor plate" but also the countless parts which make up said plate and there individual charges.
As a computer nerd/programmer I equate charge density to resolution. Remember how terrible the resolution of the first video games was like the first Atari?. I was programming games similar to pac man on a commodore 64/apple 2E back in the 80's dreaming of the high resolution near photo realistic games I knew as a fact were coming today, I could see the evolution. Energy technology follows a similar trend and we need to look beyond the low resolution object based perspective many still hold. So while many are still stuck on pac man mode I enjoy fortnite and BF2042 even though I'm almost 60. Ergo... never grow old in spirit.
In effect we could think of it this way, from space any given city looks static and devoid of motion or energy. However if your down town in that city it is vibrant buzzing with energy and everything is in motion. Now imagine the city is a capacitor plate and the people are charges. The reality does not change nor the energy state present but our perspective does.
It's not that difficult, all the extra energy comes from all the extra stuff already in motion on a deeper level most chose to ignore...
AC
In post 481 there is a mistake in the drawing at the end of the document, I have also highlighted the second ground.
Regards
Mike
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_fRKxz_UNo
6minutes and 53 seconds in.
Mind blowing insight into Steven Mark's device
Quote from: Aking.21 on 2023.05.11, 02:32:44
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_fRKxz_UNo
6minutes and 53 seconds in.
Mind blowing insight into Steven Mark's device
I presume you are looking at the huge current, that is what happens in the tpu, it is a current generator. Voltage generators will never be OU, but infinite current at any positive voltage results in power.
I really do not know atm where this energy comes from, that is still very open to debate.
Regards
Mike
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2023.05.05, 21:19:03
Remember how terrible the resolution of the first video games was like the first Atari?.
I like this. Sometimes I play doom 2, like in the good old days, as if I had become 20 years younger. :)
Aking21
Quotehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_fRKxz_UNo
6minutes and 53 seconds in.
Mind blowing insight into Steven Mark's device
Indeed, the images below taken from the video are self-explanatory.
AC
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2023.05.12, 21:51:45
Aking21
Indeed, the images below taken from the video are self-explanatory.
AC
Well, I was hoping for more scientific responses.
There are a couple of giveaways.
1 We are witnessing FLAME PLASMA. PERIOD!
This is a huge giveaway.
2 How is this plasma field created?
It is certainly similar to this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuZTZvBOfBE
So a couple of Mark's secrets are now uncovered.
3 The kind of plasma we see is a "flame" type of plasma which is different from an ordinary spark gap.
4 Masses of free electrons are created, and they are certainly Nitrogen, Oxygen, Carbon Dioxide, Neon, and Hydrogen electrons, because they are the major components of air. These additional free electrons will magnetize neighboring electrons which are free to enter and energize the TPU.
5 We see no spark gap or plasma flame in the TPU, however, the electrical construction of such a phenomenon is an integral part of the TPU.
We now know this 100%. So we now know a major component of the circuit.
6 That disclosure is a huge blunder by the demonstrators and must have made Steven Mark cringe in horror.
7 I suggest we scour the internet to find a similar circuit. The TPU needs both electrodes (positive and negative) to be combined to create the flame plasma. Other videos do not need this double electrode, so the Marks circuit is slightly different.
8 Similar to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82gd7genfUE 2min 50 seconds in.
.
Aking21
QuoteWell, I was hoping for more scientific responses.
I wrote a longer response but some thought I may be a little long winded so I kept it short. I like your posts and your like a breath of fresh air in both forums, in my opinion.
I have seen these kinds of discharges in countless experiments and the fat arc, fuzzy edges, white color and lack of noise are all indicative of high voltage but more so very high frequency. The Tesla hair pin circuit easily produces such discharges so long as the spark gap is properly quenched and preferably chopped with undersized capacitors. As Tesla said, high inductance low capacitance which produces HV/HF discharges like the ones in the video.
The actual mechanism at play is really interesting and as we know single or low frequency HV discharges produce thin, blue, quite noisy streamers like an ignition coil. However as the frequency increases, which is actually a reduction in the time period ie. voltage rise/fall, something peculiar happens. A massive amount of harmonics are produced at frequencies well above the source frequency. In fact, some FE inventors supposedly tuned there devices based on how much RF interference a nearby radio produced, go figure...
Now imagine a gap with a discharge having a large time period, long wavelength where the electric field gradient across the gap appears static like DC.
For example the wavelength of a 60Hz AC signal is around 5000 km where Tesla was claiming to have produced wavelengths in the centimeter range much smaller and closer to 30,000 MHz with his hair pin circuit. Which is around 9 orders of magnitude difference or like saying a 60Hz wavelength is ten billion times larger than a one centimeter wavelength like Tesla was referring to but really who is counting?.
The technology is kind of weird in that way and just when a person thinks they have something figured out someone finds another completely different way of doing things. That's pretty cool.
AC
quote author=Aking.21 link=topic=403.msg104722#msg104722 date=1683942339]
Well, I was hoping for more scientific responses.
[/quote]
I think AC's first image is significant. Why is the plasma curved upwards, why isn't the flow in a straight line between the two discharge points? Below is another frame showing that upwards curvature. Could it be due to the earth's magnetic field? Some quick sums suggest this might be possible. Then if in the TPU there is a plasma type of electron flow along the surface of a conductor that is influenced by the earth's magnetic field could this be where the energy comes from?
Smudge
Quote from: Smudge on 2023.05.13, 10:33:51
quote author=Aking.21 link=topic=403.msg104722#msg104722 date=1683942339]
Well, I was hoping for more scientific responses.
I think AC's first image is significant. Why is the plasma curved upwards, why isn't the flow in a straight line between the two discharge points? Below is another frame showing that upwards curvature. Could it be due to the earth's magnetic field? Some quick sums suggest this might be possible. Then if in the TPU there is a plasma type of electron flow along the surface of a conductor that is influenced by the earth's magnetic field could this be where the energy comes from?
Smudge
I think the consensus of opinion veers towards high frequency, with modest high voltage.
The question is what constitutes high frequency? Maybe from 6 kHz to 100 kHz may be a good starting point.
Certainly looking at the plasma lighter circuitry, especially the flamey plasma one is a must.
If someone can get hold of a flamey plasma lighter circuit, that would be great.
It would also be useful to look at the difference between an ordinary plasma lighter circuit and a flamey plasma lighter circuit.
I am aware that Kapanaze also uses "High frequency".
Interestingly, the flamey lighter behaves exactly the same as the Mark device, as the plasma lighter flame also shows an upward curvature.
This is becoming an "overunity" detective hunt with the suspect in our sights.
We are slowly de-mistifying Steven Mark's device.
Here is a good example,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EztfUOa7jVw
High Frequency Tesla Coil HFSSTC Electronic Candle Plasma Flame Electronic candle
I really like the plasma channel as well,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyZuel2iaBk
Building a Wireless Power Plasma Candle ( Flame Discharge ft. Teslaundmehr)
Most High Frequency Tesla Coils HFSSTC run around 4MHz. Note the 4MHz limitation is only due to the efficiency of the mosfet switching and Nikola Tesla's devices ran at magnitudes higher frequencies and voltages. As we can see the qualities of the discharges in the video's above have a fat, fuzzy appearance and are super quiet very similar to the video of SM's discharges. Tesla described this effect as brush discharges which were extremely sensitive to any external forces like air currents and magnetic fields. Now consider that Tesla claimed to have produced wavelengths in the cm range which works out to 30,000 MHz in excess of 300kV. That's impressive...
AC
why an electric arc is called an arc:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_arc
Sir Humphry Davy discovered the short-pulse electrical arc in 1800.[2] In 1801, he described the phenomenon in a paper published in William Nicholson's Journal of Natural Philosophy, Chemistry and the Arts.[3] According to modern science, Davy's description was a spark rather than an arc.[4]
In the same year Davy publicly demonstrated the effect, before the Royal Society, by transmitting an electric current through two carbon rods that touched, and then pulling them a short distance apart. The demonstration produced a "feeble" arc, not readily distinguished from a sustained spark, between charcoal points.
The Society subscribed for a more powerful battery of 1,000 plates, and in 1808 he demonstrated the large-scale arc.[5] He is credited with naming the arc.[6] He called it an arc because it assumes the shape of an upward bow when the distance between the electrodes is not small.[7] This is due to the buoyant force on the hot gas.
One frequency, two pulses with different multi-pulse duties and sequence timing.
A and C timing gap dictates the output voltage, it is a differential output. Any ground used on the output is the second ground.
Regards
Mike
I know this is ancient but do you have a link to this post? Or do you remember how it was switched? My fets get hot at 6mhz.
Quote from: Grumpy on 2010.11.04, 14:20:26
The overheating and "flipping over shut off" effects were only present on early units.
In the video "stevennew.mp4" with U.E.C at the top of the screen, SM states that these devices utilize a different method of induction which causes electron flow to produce useful electricity. One of the device runs for about 20 minutes and the voltage is checked at the start (about 170 volts) and at 20 minutes (about 169 volts). He states that this device makes batteries obsolete, can power cars and other devices, and that no other energy source offers the same energy density. (See report by Michael Fennell.)
SM states that the devices are not recievers, and that the electricity is produced within the device.
Even if you abhore conspiracy theories, and such, you can see that if SM's claims are true, then we have a slight problem with the TPU. It is a viable replacement for "oil" as an energy source. Oil is still required for many other purposes and used in many many products. The TPU does not replace oil entirely, it augments it. It allows us to go beyond the level of energy that oil can supply to us. There is no ground connection required. There are no connections to anything but the load. The TPU allows us to utilize an energy source anywhere in the universe, at any time, for any purpose - indefinitely! This device and devices that use these same principles can usher in a new era for mankind!
Unfortunately, very few believe, and only a meer handful are willing to put in the bench time to achieve success.
Instead, we fight over the rights to the planets energy supply. We surpress devices that are "too efficient". We complain and argue. We spend our time on projects that have less documentation than the TPU, and a miniscule amount of success.
Some have argued that the TPU must not bne "real" since so many people have been working on it and it's variations for so many years and nothing has come of it. This is an incorrect assumption. A frined of mine came forward on the Eergy Builders Forum and discussed his version that did produce useful power in excess of the power applied for operation. (I don't recall exactly but I think he put 100w in and got 170w out.) This device was a collector loop of several turns with four coils wrapepd over it, forming a toroid. The coils were switched sequentially at around 28mHz. It was not impessive until he looped the output back to the input. After brief operation it overheated, cooked, fireballs on the bench, etc. Two other people witnessed this event on Skype.
Everyone also seems to forget that GK's GK4 device produced some interesting results and was referenced by Spherics.
Before you say "nothing has come of all the work", take a good look at the work that was actually performed. You will see that most of it is inapplicable, and unrelated, say 70% of it. 20% was wasted do to misunderstanding the information presented. That leaves a paltry 10% of the useful, which amounts to a few weeks. So, not much work has actually been performed towards a working TPU.
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.16, 07:38:54
I know this is ancient but do you have a link to this post? Or do you remember how it was switched? My fets get hot at 6mhz.
From what I can remember the only "schematic" from SM was the brown paper one that Mike (Centraflow) reverse engineered.
The schematics from Spherics were very basic high or low side switching of MOSFETS with a snubber. Shortly after the Spherics info was provided, Roberto in Italy built a unit, but he only used 1kv, which is below the minimum requirement. I think he said you have to drop 1kv across the CCU coils.
I tried HV MOSFETS, but they were slow and had an intrinsic effect that made them very noisy and hard to work with.
I worked diligently with HV BJT's for over a year, got burned out on it, and have not touched it for over a year. Next step is to rebuild my test board with heatsinks for the BJT's.
Busy with work and home now though...
Quote from: Grumpy on 2024.04.16, 14:20:21
From what I can remember the only "schematic" from SM was the brown paper one that Mike (Centraflow) reverse engineered.
The schematics from Spherics were very basic high or low side switching of MOSFETS with a snubber. Shortly after the Spherics info was provided, Roberto in Italy built a unit, but he only used 1kv, which is below the minimum requirement. I think he said you have to drop 1kv across the CCU coils.
I tried HV MOSFETS, but they were slow and had an intrinsic effect that made them very noisy and hard to work with.
I worked diligently with HV BJT's for over a year, got burned out on it, and have not touched it for over a year. Next step is to rebuild my test board with heatsinks for the BJT's.
Busy with work and home now though...
Understandable. All of my noise issues disappeared when I went to an isolated gate drive, but the chinese isolated driver boards need long pulse widths (>100ns) and I'm opting to build my own with faster FETs.
Quote from: bte on 2024.04.16, 14:34:29
Understandable. All of my noise issues disappeared when I went to an isolated gate drive, but the chinese isolated driver boards need long pulse widths (>100ns) and I'm opting to build my own with faster FETs.
If you really want to know there was only a clock source (crystal oscillator), a sequencer IC, and 3 mosfets.
As SM said "you would not believe how easy this is".
Mike
I'm sure, and it's a goal to work on a coil configuration like sm, but I need to start at the initial idea, the eureka moment, where the basis of the effect is first. I think sm mentioned two transformers out of sync gave him his revelations to start on the tpu.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.20, 18:41:35
If you really want to know there was only a clock source (crystal oscillator), a sequencer IC, and 3 mosfets.
As SM said "you would not believe how easy this is".
Mike
I'm glad you understand it, at least someone does. I'm not even sure how the windings are configured in his tpu. Like what is the most basic vanilla no nonsense version, has to be simple, those open units were simple to the extreme
What is the cause of the current of the ring accelerating electrode of the electron gun of the kinescope?
After all, electrons fly through the hole and are not discharged on the electrode.
And they are discharged only at the anode. It's just some stray electrons that end up hitting it.
Or is the electric field being spent on accelerating the beam ?
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.20, 18:41:35
If you really want to know there was only a clock source (crystal oscillator), a sequencer IC, and 3 mosfets.
As SM said "you would not believe how easy this is".
Mike
What was his sequencer ic? The brown paper is hard to read the parts. I can see cmos chips
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.20, 19:49:33
I'm glad you understand it, at least someone does. I'm not even sure how the windings are configured in his tpu. Like what is the most basic vanilla no nonsense version, has to be simple, those open units were simple to the extreme
The windings and how they are connected is one of the most important parts.
Those open units had a problem, you turn them over and they stopped working.
You take a weak magnetic field and you accelerate it. The faster it moves through a coil the more current is generated. You could take a strong field and move it through a coil SLOWLY to generate the same current.
What magnetic field comes for FREE but is weak? ;)
Mike
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.21, 12:47:30
What was his sequencer ic? The brown paper is hard to read the parts. I can see cmos chips
No idea what he used, I know what I use though.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.21, 16:38:46
The windings and how they are connected is one of the most important parts.
Those open units had a problem, you turn them over and they stopped working.
You take a weak magnetic field and you accelerate it. The faster it moves through a coil the more current is generated. You could take a strong field and move it through a coil SLOWLY to generate the same current.
What magnetic field comes for FREE but is weak? ;)
Mike
Earth's, but how to move it?
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.21, 17:14:09
Earth's, but how to move it?
You are moving it when you place a compass between North and South, the field goes through the compass magnet on it's way to South, or no!!
The word COMPASS, it PASSES through the susbended magnet, does it not!
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.21, 17:54:47
You are moving it when you place a compass between North and South, the field goes through the compass magnet on it's way to South, or no!!
The word COMPASS, it PASSES through the susbended magnet, does it not!
Mike
This makes less sense than before. Maybe I'm out of the loop.
I'm taking notes though.
STEAP and the TPU are black holes for the magnetic field, pull it in and spew it out.
There are 2 Norths and 2 souths, a 2 solenoids bent around but have a gap, N gap S
S gap N
The first TPUs were only one toroid N gap S, turn it over in the same plane and it stopped working, with two it does not stop.
Mike
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.21, 18:03:01
This makes less sense than before. Maybe I'm out of the loop.
I'm taking notes though.
bar magnets on the table NSNSNS with gaps between them
just so they do not pull to one another, where are the fields?
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.21, 17:54:47
You are moving it when you place a compass between North and South, the field goes through the compass magnet on it's way to South, or no!!
The word COMPASS, it PASSES through the susbended magnet, does it not!
Mike
And so a brave new world begins: According to Grok3
Recommended IC: CD4017 (Decade Counter)
Why It Works: The CD4017 is a dirt-cheap (~$0.30-$0.50) sequencer with 10 outputs, but you can easily use just the first 3 (Q0, Q1, Q2) and ignore the rest. It steps through outputs one at a time with each clock pulse, perfect for sequencing.
Setup:
Clock Input: Feed it a clock signal (e.g., from a 555 timer or even a manual pushbutton) to advance the sequence.
Outputs: Connect Q0, Q1, and Q2 (pins 3, 2, and 4) to the gates of 3 MOSFETs.
Reset: Tie Q3 (pin 7) to the reset pin (pin 15) through a resistor. This makes it cycle back to Q0 after Q2, giving you a repeating 3-step sequence: Q0 → Q1 → Q2 → Q0.
MOSFETs: Use N-channel MOSFETs like the IRF540 or IRLB8721 (cheap, ~$0.50 each). Each MOSFET's gate connects to an output (via a 100-1kΩ resistor for safety), source to ground, and drain to your circuit's load (e.g., motor, lamp, etc.). The MOSFETs can switch high currents (10A+) or voltages (up to 100V or more), depending on your needs.
How It Switches 3 Circuits
Step 1: Clock pulse 1 → Q0 goes high (5V or whatever Vcc is), MOSFET 1 turns on, circuit 1 activates.
Step 2: Clock pulse 2 → Q1 goes high, MOSFET 2 turns on, circuit 2 activates (Q0 goes low, shutting off circuit 1).
Step 3: Clock pulse 3 → Q2 goes high, MOSFET 3 turns on, circuit 3 activates (Q1 off).
Step 4: Clock pulse 4 → Q3 triggers reset, Q0 goes high again, restarting the cycle.
Specs
Outputs Used: 3 (out of 10 available).
Switching Capacity: The CD4017 outputs ~10-20 mA per pin, plenty to drive a MOSFET gate. The MOSFETs then handle the real load—could be 12V LEDs, 24V motors, or whatever your circuits are.
Cost: ~$0.50 for the IC + ~$1.50 for 3 MOSFETs + a few cents for resistors = under $3 total.
Alternatives
74HC4017: Similar to CD4017 but operates at lower voltages (2-6V) and slightly faster. Same 3-output trick applies.
Custom 3-Stage Shift Register: A 74HC164 (8-bit shift register) could work, but it's overkill and trickier to limit to 3 outputs without extra logic.
Minimalist Option: A 555 timer with a 4013 dual flip-flop could rig a 3-state sequence, but it's more parts and effort than the 4017 setup.
Why CD4017 Wins
It's dirt cheap, widely available (think Amazon, DigiKey, or any electronics bin), and needs minimal tweaking to lock at 3 steps. Pair it with MOSFETs, and you've got a robust, flexible 3-circuit sequencer. No need for a fancier IC unless you're cramming it into a tiny space or need microsecond precision.
My only criticism is that Grok3 didn't turn each circuit off first. But then I didn't ask it to. Grok3 resets the sequence after all three (coils) are activated. Anyway, Mike, thanks for making it clear.
It is like a black hole for magnetic fields. The field inside the unit spins like a cork screw, a very tight cork screw, it creates a field which has a very fast angular velocity in the middle of the solenoids. It is like watching the water go down a plug hole in your sink. The closest solenoid to the core is a generating coil.
From all that you should be able to make your own,"sometime" in the future after the oil and gas industry of the USA and Russia, has colapsed.
Drill baby drill ;D The s**t is coming out of two holes.
I'm gone.
Mike
A black hole for magnetic fields ???
I need calculations and a build plan. Something I hope to do with my project to avoid replication fizzling out.
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.21, 19:20:00
A black hole for magnetic fields ???
I need calculations and a build plan. Something I hope to do with my project to avoid replication fizzling out.
You do not replicate, you investigate after weighing up how it might work. It took me 8yrs, from 2013 to 2021.
No free lunches,and I am not looking for making money, but I have given enough short cuts to a working model, and where the energy comes from.
Mike
Yes, but the investigation of the primary effect is still lost on me.
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.22, 14:44:40
Yes, but the investigation of the primary effect is still lost on me.
Magnetic thrust.
Mike
So you've got two plates of a capacitor (which are coils B & C1) with a solenoid wound such that a magnetic field can be created inbetween the plates. A changing magnetic field has a changing electric field perpendicular to the magnetic field.
It is known that when you charge or discharge a capacitor a magnetic field is created. If you invert this, then it stands to reason that creating a magnetic field inbetween the plates of a capacitor will charge the capacitor.
Quote from: lfarrand on 2025.02.24, 10:12:10
...
It is known that when you charge or discharge a capacitor a magnetic field is created. If you invert this, then it stands to reason that creating a magnetic field inbetween the plates of a capacitor will charge the capacitor.
Your second situation is not symmetrical to the first.
When you charge a capacitor, its circuit is looped back. Under the effect of an electric field, charges can move and charge the capacitor. The movement of the charges is accompanied by the magnetic field.
If you use a magnetic field and the capacitor is in a closed circuit, the capacitor will charge (but also discharge with each alternation). This is the symmetrical case of the previous one.
But if the capacitor's circuit is open, obviously the number of charges on each plate can't change, so the capacitor won't charge. There's no reason for it to charge.
Quote from: lfarrand on 2025.02.24, 10:12:10
So you've got two plates of a capacitor (which are coils B & C1) with a solenoid wound such that a magnetic field can be created inbetween the plates. A changing magnetic field has a changing electric field perpendicular to the magnetic field.
It is known that when you charge or discharge a capacitor a magnetic field is created. If you invert this, then it stands to reason that creating a magnetic field inbetween the plates of a capacitor will charge the capacitor.
Only when charging, not discharging, a magnetic field is created.
You charge it slowly and then short it.
Mike
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.24, 17:08:39
Your second situation is not symmetrical to the first.
When you charge a capacitor, its circuit is looped back. Under the effect of an electric field, charges can move and charge the capacitor. The movement of the charges is accompanied by the magnetic field.
If you use a magnetic field and the capacitor is in a closed circuit, the capacitor will charge (but also discharge with each alternation). This is the symmetrical case of the previous one.
But if the capacitor's circuit is open, obviously the number of charges on each plate can't change, so the capacitor won't charge. There's no reason for it to charge.
The electric field between the plates when the capacitor is charging, can be seen as a straight wire with current going through it, but only when charging. So you charge slowly and short it (discharge rapidly). All this is done through cycling in time.
The field will extend between the plates and revolve around the length of the coiled capacitor, like a cork screw. The coil is no longer a coil, it has next to no inductance, it is a bifilar plate capacitor.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.24, 18:16:54
The electric field between the plates when the capacitor is charging, can be seen as a straight wire with current going through it, but only when charging. So you charge slowly and short it (discharge rapidly). All this is done through cycling in time.
Charges follow the electric field only in a conductor. If the circuit is looped, they move.
If the circuit is open, you have two conductors: the two "plates".
Charge displacement under the electric field is a short rearrangement of charges in
each "plate". The displacement is cancelled by the attraction of electrons to the positive zones created by their absence where they came from. The electric field is cancelled by the new configuration. No electrons have been removed from one plate or added to the other. The charges Q+ and Q- on each plate remain equal, only the electronic distribution in each plate has changed. We have therefore no potential difference between the two. The capacitor is not charged.
A capacitor can only be charged by removing charges from one plate and putting them on the other, so a circuit is needed from one to the other to move them.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.25, 15:27:12
Charges follow the electric field only in a conductor. If the circuit is looped, they move.
If the circuit is open, you have two conductors: the two "plates".
Charge displacement under the electric field is a short rearrangement of charges in each "plate". The displacement is cancelled by the attraction of electrons to the positive zones created by their absence where they came from. The electric field is cancelled by the new configuration. No electrons have been removed from one plate or added to the other. The charges Q+ and Q- on each plate remain equal, only the electronic distribution in each plate has changed. We have therefore no potential difference between the two. The capacitor is not charged.
A capacitor can only be charged by removing charges from one plate and putting them on the other, so a circuit is needed from one to the other to move them.
hey f6
so you dont believe electrons are being depleted from the pos plate and extra electrons pumped in to the neg plate when charging?
mags
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.25, 15:27:12
Charges follow the electric field only in a conductor. If the circuit is looped, they move.
If the circuit is open, you have two conductors: the two "plates".
Charge displacement under the electric field is a short rearrangement of charges in each "plate". The displacement is cancelled by the attraction of electrons to the positive zones created by their absence where they came from. The electric field is cancelled by the new configuration. No electrons have been removed from one plate or added to the other. The charges Q+ and Q- on each plate remain equal, only the electronic distribution in each plate has changed. We have therefore no potential difference between the two. The capacitor is not charged.
A capacitor can only be charged by removing charges from one plate and putting them on the other, so a circuit is needed from one to the other to move them.
Of course you need a circuit, how on earth do you think I am charging the capacitor!
The point is that as the capacitor charges, the electric field between the plates can be thought of as a straight wire and the right hand rule applies for the magnetic field created.
I have high lighted post 526
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.02.25, 16:59:57
so you dont believe electrons are being depleted from the pos plate and extra electrons pumped in to the neg plate when charging?
Through the space between the plates or through the circuit external to the capacitor ?
Quote from: verpies on 2025.02.25, 22:51:14
Through the space between the plates or through the circuit external to the capacitor ?
hey verp
external circuit
i wrote something today that may be nothing, but maybe not...
might interest you.
https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4757.msg114906#msg114906
mags
A charging capacitor has a time varying electric field between the two plates, it is here that a curling magnetic field is created.
This is the back bone of electromagnetic waves in radio.
Knowone has thought of using this in a spiral capacitor formed by 2 plates wound like a bifilar coil "bifilar capacitor". To maintain the field you charge slowly and abruptly discharge in a continual cycle.
This will create a cork screw magnetic field, and if this is placed inside a solenoid coil magnetic field, the result will be a thrust field in the direction of the solenoids magnetic field.
If you could look at the ends it would look like a turbine or water going down you sink waste.
Mike
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.25, 15:27:12
Charges follow the electric field only in a conductor. If the circuit is looped, they move.
If the circuit is open, you have two conductors: the two "plates".
Charge displacement under the electric field is a short rearrangement of charges in each "plate". The displacement is cancelled by the attraction of electrons to the positive zones created by their absence where they came from. The electric field is cancelled by the new configuration. No electrons have been removed from one plate or added to the other. The charges Q+ and Q- on each plate remain equal, only the electronic distribution in each plate has changed. We have therefore no potential difference between the two. The capacitor is not charged.
A capacitor can only be charged by removing charges from one plate and putting them on the other, so a circuit is needed from one to the other to move them.
https://msuperl.org/wikis/pcubed/doku.php?id=184_notes:examples:week14_b_field_capacitor#:~:text=We%20know%20from%20the%20notes,create%20a%20curly%20magnetic%20field.
Mike
Now to answer the question of, where does the energy come from "OU" in the TPU. Well it is not really "OU", energy comes from the enviorment in the form of the Earth's magnetic field.
The original one toroidal units would only work in one plane, why you may ask!
If in the correct aligment with the Earth field N to toroid S and Toroid N to Earth S then it will work, flip the toroid over and it will stop.
Top and bottom "dual toroid" will work in any plane, look at the attached diagram.
The Earth's fields are pulled in and spun around at supper velocity and spat out to continue on there way to the Earth's other pole. This is equal to a small magnetic field moving at infinite speed across a wire.
A new way of induction has been created, and STEAP was born.
Because of the high angular velocity created, heat is generated at the same time as infinite current within collecting wires. Cooling has to be provided for extended running.
All this has been done and working.
Mike
(//)
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.02.25, 16:59:57
hey f6
so you dont believe electrons are being depleted from the pos plate and extra electrons pumped in to the neg plate when charging?
mags
I don't believe it. I know it. It's just electromagnetism, known for over a century and a half.
Maybe you haven't grasped the context: the absence of a conductive circuit. Read it again.
Or do you believe in the teleportation of electrons? Would an electron disappear from one plate and magically reappear on the other?
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.25, 19:12:05
Of course you need a circuit, how on earth do you think I am charging the capacitor!
...
A circuit is closed on itself, otherwise it's no longer a circuit.
Yours doesn't seem to be closed, in which case it wouldn't be a circuit.
Or maybe you'd like to present us a schematic diagram showing the circuit, so that it's clear to those familiar with the field.
Quote
Now to answer the question of, where does the energy come from "OU" in the TPU.
...
This question is premature. A theory is meant to explain facts, not allegations. The facts are absent, and the alleged ones are non-reproducible.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.26, 10:04:06
https://msuperl.org/wikis/pcubed/doku.php?id=184_notes:examples:week14_b_field_capacitor#:~:text=We%20know%20from%20the%20notes,create%20a%20curly%20magnetic%20field.
...
That doesn't answer any of my objections. Can you comment on your understanding?
I did not supply a circuit, not really needed to show how a curl magnetic field is created in a capacitor when CHARGING, or do you want me to show a battery across the cap!! come on be real and not a p**t. The charging and shorting comes from an external circuit, as does the pulsing of the over wound solenoid coil which forms the other magnetic field, which is perpendicular to the capacitor field.
See the attached, collecting coil not shown, but it is another solenoid where the pulse field is inside.
Mike
This is compared to a pulse jet, but here air is not pulled in, it is a magnetic field that is pulled in.
If you look at the thrust output of a jet engine when at power up you can see what it is like.
Mike
Jet engine pulses
Mike
In science and technology, analogies are misleading or useless, and I still don't see a circuit.
If engineering uses schematics or physics uses maths, there's a good reason. Using the language of the field would help everyone understand what you're talking about, and probably clarify your own ideas too.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.27, 18:49:06
In science and technology, analogies are misleading or useless, and I still don't see a circuit.
If engineering uses schematics or physics uses maths, there's a good reason. Using the language of the field would help everyone understand what you're talking about, and probably clarify your own ideas too.
Agree, a simple experiment to conduct would speak a thousand words.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.02.27, 18:49:06
In science and technology, analogies are misleading or useless, and I still don't see a circuit.
If engineering uses schematics or physics uses maths, there's a good reason. Using the language of the field would help everyone understand what you're talking about, and probably clarify your own ideas too.
You know what a B and E field is, you know the electric field and the magnetic field are at 90 degrees to one another, you know the magnetic field through a solenoid, you may or not it seems, the magnetic field inside a capacitor when Charging, so just don't try being smarter than anyone on an open thread, you are not as smart as you may think or you would understand what I have drawn and said.
I will leave it to you, I am finished explaining, I have better things to do at my age.
Go on pumping and using gas and oil, I am giving you an opportunity to stop doing that.
---------------------------
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860
As a general rule, the most successful person in life is the person that has the best information.
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.27, 19:15:03
Agree, a simple experiment to conduct would speak a thousand words.
Wind a bifilar air coil, 1", 28mm dia with a twin wire, such as speaker cable, 12" long or 300mm.
Place a small compass next to the side of the coil.
Connect the coil as a capacitor only connect in series with a 20uF non polarised cap, speaker cross over cap is good.
Charge with 300v DC or so and watch the compass when charging.
Short through a 10 ohm 5w resistor and repeat.
Using two N mosfets such as IRF840 along with a flip flop or johnson counter clocked at say 10kHz should do the trick. You can change the frequency as needed.
You should see the needle deflection or (spin depending of the frequency), that is the emergent magnetic field between the plates ( turns of the coil )which only happens when charging.
Not complicated, you just have to think about it!
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 10:39:40
You know what a B and E field is, you know the electric field and the magnetic field are at 90 degrees to one another, you know the magnetic field through a solenoid, you may or not it seems, the magnetic field inside a capacitor when Charging, so just don't try being smarter than anyone on an open thread, you are not as smart as you may think or you would understand what I have drawn and said.
I will leave it to you, I am finished explaining, I have better things to do at my age.
...
You don't explain anything, you just repeat the same platitudes over and over again without ever responding to objections.
An electric or magnetic field isn't enough to charge a capacitor, you need a circuit from one plate to the other one.At no point do you show us this circuit, and without it, the capacitor can't charge.
If you don't understand why, review the basics of electromagnetism, and if you don't know what to say to the objections made to you, at least try to understand them rather than denigrate your correspondents.
Giving lessons to others as a self-proclaimed teacher of free energy or esotericism, based on childish analogies or irrelevant assertions, is not the purpose of this forum.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 11:03:08
Wind a bifilar air coil, 1", 28mm dia with a twin wire, such as speaker cable, 12" long or 300mm.
Place a small compass next to the side of the coil.
Connect the coil as a capacitor only connect in series with a 20uF non polarised cap, speaker cross over cap is good.
Charge with 300v DC or so and watch the compass when charging.
Short through a 10 ohm 5w resistor and repeat.
Using two N mosfets such as IRF840 along with a flip flop or johnson counter clocked at say 10kHz should do the trick. You can change the frequency as needed.
You should see the needle deflection or (spin depending of the frequency), that is the emergent magnetic field between the plates ( turns of the coil )which only happens when charging.
Not complicated, you just have to think about it!
The coil is bifilar, so there are 4 connection points. A capacitor has only two, but you don't say how to connect it. Nor do you say which points are to be used for the "Short through a 10 ohm 5w".
Do you want us to play guessing games, or do you think you can communicate to others what's in your head without using a suitable language, like that of engineers who have learned to create schematics?
Quote from: bte on 2025.02.27, 19:15:03
Agree, a simple experiment to conduct would speak a thousand words.
This is true O0, but only among technicians and engineers, whose few words have an operational meaning that can describe an experiment.
Here we see that this is not the case, and so even better than words, a diagram is required.
Best guess as to diagram. C1 20uf
I wasn't thinking of such a simple circuit, from Centralflow, because here everything is so well known and without mystery.
So we do have a circuit in your diagram, which I've reproduced in mine in Nr 1.
If that's right and the coil is carefully wound, with the two wires exactly parallel to each other, there will be no detectable magnetic field at the center of the coil, because the currents in the two wires are opposite.
The other variants 2 to 4 are also compatible with the description. And there are many more.
I hope we've made Centralflow aware of the need for diagrams when talking about science and technology, and that he'll provide us with one to analyze.
How pragmatic. as usual.
So how do you turn 2 coils into a capacitor that has NEAR no inductance. Remember ALL capacitors have inductance.
Now can you see how to turn a bifilar coil into a capacitor? and I'm not going to fall into your games.
If you get to doing that then place the other capacitor in series. :P
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 17:54:09
How pragmatic. as usual.
So how do you turn 2 coils into a capacitor that has NEAR no inductance. Remember ALL capacitors have inductance.
Now can you see how to turn a bifilar coil into a capacitor? and I'm not going to fall into your games.
If you get to doing that then place the other capacitor in series. :P
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
Ok?? No one forces you to login. Best luck
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 17:54:09
How pragmatic. as usual.
So how do you turn 2 coils into a capacitor that has NEAR no inductance. Remember ALL capacitors have inductance.
Now can you see how to turn a bifilar coil into a capacitor? and I'm not going to fall into your games.
If you get to doing that then place the other capacitor in series. :P
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
I think it's the best thing for you to do. Come back when you've got some real material and you're ready to answer the objections of people who know what they're talking about. It's sure to be much more interesting for everyone.
Presenting childish set-ups as brilliant ideas, in a blurred way so that you can show off about them without the risk of appearing incompetent, while evading questions, has nothing to do with the search for free energy.
hey mike... dontt go away yet. ill ve on later. i want to talk about the bifi cap your talking about. ;)
mags
... don't go man..
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 17:54:09
How pragmatic. as usual.
So how do you turn 2 coils into a capacitor that has NEAR no inductance. Remember ALL capacitors have inductance.
Now can you see how to turn a bifilar coil into a capacitor? and I'm not going to fall into your games.
If you get to doing that then place the other capacitor in series. :P
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 17:54:09
How pragmatic. as usual.
So how do you turn 2 coils into a capacitor that has NEAR no inductance. Remember ALL capacitors have inductance.
Now can you see how to turn a bifilar coil into a capacitor? and I'm not going to fall into your games.
If you get to doing that then place the other capacitor in series. :P
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
hey mike
years ago playing with bifi coils, i had a thought on how the coil would act if it already had a charge on it, then shorting the other end. but didnt think to have that cap at the other end. i tried diodes. have to look back and see what i was doing and seeing then on that.
anyway im interested. gotta get some things done tonight, already late, so ill get back tomorrow
mags
Its not that hard
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 11:03:08
Wind a bifilar air coil, 1", 28mm dia with a twin wire, such as speaker cable, 12" long or 300mm.
Place a small compass next to the side of the coil.
Connect the coil as a capacitor only connect in series with a 20uF non polarised cap, speaker cross over cap is good.
Charge with 300v DC or so and watch the compass when charging.
Short through a 10 ohm 5w resistor and repeat.
Using two N mosfets such as IRF840 along with a flip flop or johnson counter clocked at say 10kHz should do the trick. You can change the frequency as needed.
You should see the needle deflection or (spin depending of the frequency), that is the emergent magnetic field between the plates ( turns of the coil )which only happens when charging.
Not complicated, you just have to think about it!
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.02.28, 17:54:09
I will not post anymore here, after nearly 20yrs a member
Peter please remove me from the forum.
Adios.
Why ? Is it because F6 has a different opinion from yours?
Settle it by an experiment - not emotions.
Quote from: nali2001 on 2025.03.01, 00:14:09
https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=53379;image
Contrary to what is written, the coils you showed us are inductive.
Since the number of turns is odd, the magnetic field of one turn is not cancelled out.
You need to add or remove one turn.
Quote from: nali2001 on 2025.03.01, 10:17:47
Its not that hard
Quote from: Centraflow
Wind a bifilar air coil, 1", 28mm dia with a twin wire, such as speaker cable, 12" long or 300mm.
Place a small compass next to the side of the coil.
Connect the coil as a capacitor only connect in series with a 20uF non polarised cap, speaker cross over cap is good.
Charge with 300v DC or so and watch the compass when charging.
Short through a 10 ohm 5w resistor and repeat.
Using two N mosfets such as IRF840 along with a flip flop or johnson counter clocked at say 10kHz should do the trick. You can change the frequency as needed.
You should see the needle deflection or (spin depending of the frequency), that is the emergent magnetic field between the plates ( turns of the coil )which only happens when charging.
Not complicated, you just have to think about it!
Its not that hard
https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=53381;image
https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=53383;image
What's not hard?
Providing images of coils is not difficult, and we could present dozens of others corresponding to Centralflow's text.
Not only do we not know exactly what type of coil he's talking about, but your images lack answers to key questions.
"Connect the coil as a capacitor only": meaningless sentence
How is the 20 µF capacitor or the switch connected?
"Charge with 300v DC": charge what? 'the coil as a capacitor' or the '20uF non polarised cap'?
"Short through a 10 ohm 5w resistor and repeat": short what? How? And repeat what?
"You can change the frequency as needed": what frequency? 0.1 Hz or 150 GHz? The order of magnitude isn't even indicated.
The only thing that's clear is that it's impossible to do, given the thousands of configurations you can imagine apart from this gibberish that makes no operational sense.
When you present an experiment, you have to do it precisely and respond to requests for clarification, otherwise it's really contempt for others. It's easy to see that the guy's not here to build anything, but to show off to the gullible, who will waste their time guessing and conjecturing before the grand master who pulls the mysterious strings and surely has a higher purpose than informing you. That's what we're doing now. The grand master has won, he has his cult.
the question i have is, are some capacitors made with the intention of having self inductance and some not? it would all be determined by what direction currents flow on each plate, or wire, as in bifilar coils.
like an audio crossover cap. 2 long foil plates with dielectric film between, rolled up in a cylinder package. if both external leads, one connected to the end of each plate strip, are both connected at the same ends of the rolled strips, then id say that is a cap that doesnt have self inductance. if one lead of one plates were at the other end of the strip, then id say that there will be self inductance, because current flow through the plates would be in the same direction as in a single wire coil and its inductance.
mags
You are right, I stand corrected sir
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.03.02, 09:13:35
Contrary to what is written, the coils you showed us are inductive.
Since the number of turns is odd, the magnetic field of one turn is not cancelled out.
You need to add or remove one turn.
Good point, maybe this is of some help:
https://chatgpt.com/share/67c4e26c-6944-800b-b75a-a58a9e9db1f8 (https://chatgpt.com/share/67c4e26c-6944-800b-b75a-a58a9e9db1f8)
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.03.02, 20:54:20
the question i have is, are some capacitors made with the intention of having self inductance and some not? it would all be determined by what direction currents flow on each plate, or wire, as in bifilar coils.
like an audio crossover cap. 2 long foil plates with dielectric film between, rolled up in a cylinder package. if both external leads, one connected to the end of each plate strip, are both connected at the same ends of the rolled strips, then id say that is a cap that doesnt have self inductance. if one lead of one plates were at the other end of the strip, then id say that there will be self inductance, because current flow through the plates would be in the same direction as in a single wire coil and its inductance.
mags
from what i understand from Teslas pat on bifi, that the capacitance of the winding allows initial currents to flow negating the impedance of self induction and only the resistance would be in play.
ive had some ideas in the past on what we might be able to do with that, but most of them didnt pan out.
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.03.02, 23:39:18
from what i understand from Teslas pat on bifi, that the capacitance of the winding allows initial currents to flow negating the impedance of self induction...
Why negating? Why can't the two currents flow in parallel ?
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.03.02, 23:39:18
...and only the resistance would be in play.
In such case the current should flow immediately upon application of the voltage, without delay.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.03.02, 20:54:20
...if both external leads, one connected to the end of each plate strip, are both connected at the same ends of the rolled strips, then id say that is a cap that doesnt have self inductance. if one lead of one plates were at the other end of the strip, then id say that there will be self inductance, because current flow through the plates would be in the same direction as in a single wire coil and its inductance.
...
This is correct, but only if the tape is not wound, or is wound like a solenoid, or more precisely with a very low inter-spire capacitance which presents a high impedance at the frequencies used.
If this is not the case, notably if the tape is wound like a flat coil (with an additional insulating strip for isolation between turns), then the inter-turn capacitance may have a low impedance at the frequencies used, and the signal will pass radially through the coil.
Finally, even the first case can give rise to artifacts at high frequencies. If, for example, the length of the inductance is of the order of 1/4 of the wavelength at the working frequency, then we'll have an overvoltage at the open end, and therefore a non-negligible current between plates due to the capacitive inter-turn effect at the end, and standing waves, even if the capacitance is very low.
A bifilar line is only a capacitor when frequencies are low, otherwise it's a transmission line, and we can no longer speak of a single capacitance, but of distributed capacitances, as well as distributed inductances, with interactions between them if they're wound so close. The operation is no longer at all the same.
Quote from: verpies on 2025.03.03, 08:57:05
Why negating? Why can't the two currents flow in parallel ?
In such case the current should flow immediately upon application of the voltage, without delay.
like running parallel speakerr wire, current flows in the opposite direction, so inductive impedance is null between the 2 wires. any inductance would be in the individual wires with multi strands.
supposedly yes. say an ignition spark coil and we put 12v on the primary with the points. when the points open, the condenser is across that open switch. the primary will oscillate with the condenser to about 300v
so if we charge a cap to 300v and connect that across the primary, we ill get as good of a 'multi' spark as with thhe points condenser.
so bifi, we could possibly charge up the bifi capacitance without opposition of inductance, time difference
read the Tesla pat on bifilar coils.
mags
this charging of the bifi coil alone would be in my experience a quick discharge as soon as you put a meter on it. but what mike had shown was a cap at the other end of the winding of which can help hod that charge for longer. dunno
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.03.03, 16:17:43
...
so bifi, we could possibly charge up the bifi capacitance without opposition of inductance, time difference
...
What's the point of charging a capacitor?
Because if we use a bifilar line and consider that its inductance is cancelled, we have a simple capacitor.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.03.06, 11:04:45
What's the point of charging a capacitor?
Because if we use a bifilar line and consider that its inductance is cancelled, we have a simple capacitor.
was just thinkin that if w can charge the bifi without interference of the inductance, then one winding would be depleted of electrons and the other packed with them then we short the open ends of the bifi. would there be anything different than simply a charged cap applied to a normal winding?
mags
Centraflow's post #542 where he suggested a simple experiment and F6's response to that has initiated the downfall of this thread. It is clear to me that F6 did not quite follow what Centraflow was suggesting, which was put a capacitor in series with the bifilar capacitor, then charge followed by a discharge while observing a compass needle showing that there is a magnetic field present both times. Below is my version of what F6 should have shown (ignore the magnetic field line colours and directions that are a hangover from F6's images). There are two possible connections to the bifilar and it is obvious to me that charge and discharge currents will create magnetic fields that will differ depending on which connection is chosen. As C says all capacitors have inductance and his bifilar has serious inductance.
But it is more than that, he has a transmission line. I am 91 and I started in electronics at age 16 so I know a bit about such lines. For distributed lines the main characteristics are inductance and capacitance per unit length, while for lumped constant lines we put L and C components together in a string either in unbalanced or balanced configuration as show in the second image below. Note those inductor components do not have coupling between them. The bifilar line C is using has serious inductive coupling so a more obvious lumped component line would be a line of transformers connected in series wth shunt capacitors across the junctions as shown in my "transformer line". In all my transmission line text books I have never come across "mutual inductance per unit length" as a distributed characteristic. Has anyone ever produced formula for these lines. Is there a whole new area waiting to be explored?
STEAP has more than two conductors wound closely along a cylinder with length and they all have distributed mutual inductance with each other as well as distributed capacitance. And with his pulse waveforms fed at both ends of some it is not surprising that he gets anomalous effects associated with his frequencies and the electrical length of his transmission lines (essentially the length of each conductor). I think the seriously high voltages he observes, meaning significant surface charge on that particular conductor, charge that could be spin polarised by the presence of induced magnetic field, could achieve the right conditions for those spins to be the energy source.
Smudge
Smudge
QuoteSTEAP has more than two conductors wound closely along a cylinder with length and they all have distributed mutual inductance with each other as well as distributed capacitance.
Generalizing is always a mistake imo.
The term "distributed" is just another way of saying we will ignore 99% of what happens between two points and pretend it's all the same. Which is anything but scientific imo.
QuoteAnd with his pulse waveforms fed at both ends of some it is not surprising that he gets anomalous effects associated with his frequencies and the electrical length of his transmission lines (essentially the length of each conductor).
Indeed, I did similar tests about 20 years ago. It goes back to the notion of generalization and supposing everything acts the same. In fact, a circuit can act very different when both circuit legs are switched vs only one. The moment I first saw a circuit by Tesla switching both legs I started doing experiments to prove the matter for myself. When switching both legs we get an large inductive spike on connection and disconnection of the source.
QuoteThe bifilar line C is using has serious inductive coupling so a more obvious lumped component line would be a line of transformers connected in series wth shunt capacitors across the junctions as shown in my "transformer line". In all my transmission line text books I have never come across "mutual inductance per unit length" as a distributed characteristic. Has anyone ever produced formula for these lines. Is there a whole new area waiting to be explored?
In my opinion the terms distributed, lumped and line are generalized 2D effects when we need to be thinking discretely in 3D like nature.
Think of it this way, most can do a basic 2D lumped sum analysis of a circuit like your proposing. Now analyze the circuit in 3D using infinite element analysis and it becomes magnitudes more difficult if not impossible. It's like jumping from a joule thief circuit to a multi layer computer processor having trillions of transistors over countless layers. Centraflow is thinking and building on a completely different level than 99% of people imo.
AC
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.09.21, 14:55:46
I am 91 and I started in electronics at age 16 so I know a bit about such lines.
There is such a device from some old Soviet device. What could it be?
Quote from: chief kolbacict on 2025.09.22, 17:41:03
There is such a device from some old Soviet device. What could it be?
Delay lines
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.09.21, 14:55:46
Centraflow's post #542 where he suggested a simple experiment and F6's response to that has initiated the downfall of this thread. It is clear to me that F6 did not quite follow what Centraflow was suggesting, which was put a capacitor in series with the bifilar capacitor, then charge followed by a discharge while observing a compass needle showing that there is a magnetic field present both times. Below is my version of what F6 should have shown (ignore the magnetic field line colours and directions that are a hangover from F6's images). There are two possible connections to the bifilar and it is obvious to me that charge and discharge currents will create magnetic fields that will differ depending on which connection is chosen. As C says all capacitors have inductance and his bifilar has serious inductance.
But it is more than that, he has a transmission line. I am 91 and I started in electronics at age 16 so I know a bit about such lines. For distributed lines the main characteristics are inductance and capacitance per unit length, while for lumped constant lines we put L and C components together in a string either in unbalanced or balanced configuration as show in the second image below. Note those inductor components do not have coupling between them. The bifilar line C is using has serious inductive coupling so a more obvious lumped component line would be a line of transformers connected in series wth shunt capacitors across the junctions as shown in my "transformer line". In all my transmission line text books I have never come across "mutual inductance per unit length" as a distributed characteristic. Has anyone ever produced formula for these lines. Is there a whole new area waiting to be explored?
STEAP has more than two conductors wound closely along a cylinder with length and they all have distributed mutual inductance with each other as well as distributed capacitance. And with his pulse waveforms fed at both ends of some it is not surprising that he gets anomalous effects associated with his frequencies and the electrical length of his transmission lines (essentially the length of each conductor). I think the seriously high voltages he observes, meaning significant surface charge on that particular conductor, charge that could be spin polarised by the presence of induced magnetic field, could achieve the right conditions for those spins to be the energy source.
Smudge
Smudge
The core bifilar has each coil shorted, the over wound coils are not shorted.
The plates of this capacitor are one shorted coil and one over wound coil.
The thing is there are two capacitors which have two supplies with two separate grounds
Things get complicated , electrons add up.
Mike
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.09.23, 16:29:20
Smudge
The core bifilar has each coil shorted, the over wound coils are not shorted.
The plates of this capacitor are one shorted coil and one over wound coil.
The thing is there are two capacitors which have two supplies with two separate grounds
Things get complicated , electrons add up.
Mike
Yes, I have seen all your circuits posted here. It is very difficult analysing exactly what goes on inside this complex arrangement of conductors in terms of magnetic fields, electric fields and distribution of currents and surface charge along the conductors. I am still working on it!! My post was a nudge to the naysayers to take you seriously. I am pleased that you are still here.
Smudge
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.09.24, 06:19:36
Yes, I have seen all your circuits posted here. It is very difficult analysing exactly what goes on inside this complex arrangement of conductors in terms of magnetic fields, electric fields and distribution of currents and surface charge along the conductors. I am still working on it!! My post was a nudge to the naysayers to take you seriously. I am pleased that you are still here.
Smudge
I am in Llandudno atm. UK
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.09.21, 14:55:46
...
And with his pulse waveforms fed at both ends of some it is not surprising that he gets anomalous effects associated with his frequencies and the electrical length of his transmission lines (essentially the length of each conductor). I think the seriously high voltages he observes, meaning significant surface charge on that particular conductor, charge that could be spin polarised by the presence of induced magnetic field, could achieve the right conditions for those spins to be the energy source.
Smudge
What anomalous effects? When you have circuits with distributed capacitance, distributed inductance, distributed coupling as you said, propagation delays, and perhaps even nonlinear effects due to resonance-related surges, you have to do engineering calculations, or at least model the device before talking about it as a revolution.
"Complex" does not mean "complicated" or revolutionary. The complexity of a device comes from the fact that we no longer have control over anything because there are too many elements, whereas we understand each one or each relationship between each one, each relationship also constituting an element. I don't see why we should assume there is some extraordinary mystery where there is only our ignorance, such as thinking that basic elements known to conserve energy could produce it when combined in any way without any exact idea of the elementary source of the surplus energy. If this is indeed the case, then it can be measured. But this is not the case, with the pitiful excuse that there may have been some OU, but that it is not reproducible (obviously, when nothing is controlled, we can't even see where we're going wrong).
Physics is interesting and effective precisely because, on the contrary, it goes back to the elementary.
Now home again and can use my computer and not a phone.
The problem as always is that certain people have nothing to add, just try to take advancement away.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860
What is not realised by many is that there are TWO grounds from TWO supplies. It is two lots of electrons moving within part of the same circuit but become combined!
So how is this done! Lets look at a transformer which has three coils, say one primary and two secondaries which are equal, like a 240v to two 12v secondaries.
Let us use it in reverse such as in a step up transformer, but we are going to feed the two 12v inputs with two different pulsed supplies.
Each supply has its own electron current which "creates its own magnetic flux" in each of the coils. In a round about way two lots of electrons combine, once converted to the form of "magnetic flux" within the transformer core. "Energy can not be created or destroyed only converted", so this conforms to the laws that exists ATM, but it does not finish there, there still has to be an energy input, that is still to come O0
AH someone is going to say, what about saturation of the core, well that is where frequence and duty comes into play, duty being the cause of the change of frequency so as to create two frequencies from just one, "the clock".
The energy input is all around us, just think what happens inside a compas needle when it alines with the fux lines of the Earth! what happens when you place two bar magnets NSNS! yes there flux adds up and the magnetic field strength has increased.
SM said that if you turned over one of his units it would stop! what he did not say is that if then turned 180º in the same plane it would start again. But it does not end there!
This works because it takes a very very small amount of energy in the form of flux from another source, and adds it to a very efficient converter of flux to current where the flux is more than what the current was to make it in the first place. Convert it all back to a differential current and you have WHAT LOOKS LIKE OU.
Here is a break down of SMs words, it should help you to understand what he was talking about.
Excellent posts Centraflow
There is no need to violate the COE when we are swimming in a sea of energy.
Your descriptions remind me of articles I read years ago by T.H.Moray and Viktor Schauberger. It relates to a "universal" mechanism or process which could extract energy from supposedly stationary fields. Ergo, extracting energy from a constant force acting on something in one direction.
This concept sounds very similar to what you are describing.
Now you should go back in time to here:- Just thinking aloud - TPU
All this is from years back.
It takes a lot of real scientific investigating to get to the end and produce a real working unit.
Dedication to the cause.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.09.28, 16:24:39
...
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer, Philosopher, 1788-1860
...
That's what I read every day, and of course it doesn't prove anything. While some truths have certainly passed through this channel, that doesn't mean that saying anything is truth at the first stage.
It's a simple matter of logic. And when it's used incorrectly, it becomes a fallacy.
I read in the PDF above:
Quote
NOW Here's the REAL trick: Because the power was cut before they reached the Anode, the circuit was never closed and there was never any current flow, only electron flow due to their response to the voltage potential...
Would moving electrons no longer be a current? A current is coulombs per second, regardless of whether the charges are moving in a wire or in a vacuum in ballistic flight.
Next, the electrons must be accelerated, and this energy is taken from the electric field. An anode current flows during this phase and provides the energy.
The electrons then may have enough kinetic energy to reach the plate when the circuit is opened, but this overlooks the fact that if the circuit is open, the plate quickly becomes negatively charged as electrons accumulate, its potential drops rapidly and the electric field may even reverse, slowing down the electrons more and more as they arrive.
These concepts are related to
space charge. It should not be forgotten that the electrons in the vacuum between the electrodes represent a charge. Even if a flow of electrons is indeed a current by definition, we are no longer dealing with a simple current flowing through a wire that remains electrically neutral. We must also address the issues of charged media.
All these questions obviously aroused the interest of engineers and physicists from the very beginning of the first electronic tubes, particularly because space charge limited the performance of the triode, and they have already answered them. There is nothing magical about it, contrary to oversimplifications.
Thanks 6flt,
Your explanation actually is quite useful if we ignore that you have it the wrong way round, which both Mike and SM stated in their explanations.
In time your contributions could be positive when you realize that good information is at your feet , that assumes you can become content with helping others.
Perhaps thinking about hundreds of tiny compass needles (with no mass) in a charged field where the electron flow has switched off leaving behind ,just for an instant,a charged capacitor and displaced compass needles . Discharge this cap(needles move) into another one which is capacitively coupled,rinse and repeat. That is pretty simple but by no means complete.
If one accepts that we are immersed in a dynamo how would you create a sink or source to exploit it ?
This also aligns with Partsman and the anomaly which he and others are investigating.
It really is like a radio receiver but works with/on near field magnetic s which are in abundance in the dynamo of our planet.
35 khz and 5 khz oscillator and I.F. either way around .
Here is something from AI about the interaction between capacitance and magnetic fields which is fundamental to what so may inventors ,past and present exploit.
"A static magnetic field has no direct effect on a capacitor, as a capacitor stores energy in an electric field and blocks DC current. However, a changing magnetic field can induce a voltage across the capacitor's terminals or even change its capacitance if the capacitor contains materials like ferrofluid or has specific structures that are affected by magnetic fields.
No Interaction (Static Fields)
No inherent magnetic effect: A standard capacitor is made of two conductive plates separated by an insulator (dielectric). It stores energy as an electric charge, not a magnetic field.
No magnetic field generated by a charged capacitor: A fully charged capacitor has no moving charges, and it is the movement of charges that creates a magnetic field.
Interaction (Changing Fields)
Induced voltage (Faraday's Law): A changing magnetic field can induce a voltage across the capacitor's terminals, according to Faraday's Law of Induction. This is similar to how a coil in a changing magnetic field generates a voltage.
Displacement Current: The changing electric field between a charging capacitor's plates creates a displacement current, which, according to Maxwell's equations, also generates a magnetic field around the capacitor.
Changes to the capacitor's physical properties:
Ferrofluid dielectric: Capacitors with ferrofluid as their dielectric can have their capacitance altered by an external magnetic field, as the field manipulates the ferrofluid.
Specific capacitor structures: Some capacitors with specialized structures or materials, particularly those in aqueous or electrochemical systems, show changes in their capacitance when subjected to magnetic fields.
Physical Interaction
Attraction: If a capacitor is encased in a ferromagnetic material (like a steel box, as seen in some motor-start capacitors), the box itself may be attracted to a magnetic field"
F6FLT
QuoteThat's what I read every day, and of course it doesn't prove anything. While some truths have certainly passed through this channel, that doesn't mean that saying anything is truth at the first stage.
It's a simple matter of logic. And when it's used incorrectly, it becomes a fallacy.
The phase tells us a great deal about people, https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/cutting-edge-leadership/202408/why-are-people-so-resistant-to-change
I always found it strange how many scientists like to pretend their opinion isn't really their own as if talking in the third person. Pretending new science or technology is impossible because science claims it's so when it seldom if ever is.
It has little do with real science more so psychology and the fear of change imo.
This notion is also reinforced by the fact a majority of the greatest discoveries were found by accident. The person was not intelligent enough to deduce a specific outcome more so they stumbled upon it by blind luck. Only after the accidental discovery was made did they follow through. One could say were trying to do the same thing here.
QuoteAll these questions obviously aroused the interest of engineers and physicists from the very beginning of the first electronic tubes, particularly because space charge limited the performance of the triode, and they have already answered them. There is nothing magical about it, contrary to oversimplifications.
ChatGPT thinks your wrong, "No, while the concept of space charge is well-studied, there are still ongoing research and discoveries related to its effects and applications in various fields, such as electronics and materials science. New insights continue to emerge, particularly in complex systems like semiconductors and dielectrics." You do understand that anyone can ask an AI and get the correct answer don't you?. ;D
As well, it seems very clear the technology in question falls under "complex systems". Hence the reason so few can seem to understand it.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.09.29, 16:53:07
That's what I read every day, and of course it doesn't prove anything. While some truths have certainly passed through this channel, that doesn't mean that saying anything is truth at the first stage.
It's a simple matter of logic. And when it's used incorrectly, it becomes a fallacy.
I read in the PDF above:
Would moving electrons no longer be a current? A current is coulombs per second, regardless of whether the charges are moving in a wire or in a vacuum in ballistic flight.
Next, the electrons must be accelerated, and this energy is taken from the electric field. An anode current flows during this phase and provides the energy.
The electrons then may have enough kinetic energy to reach the plate when the circuit is opened, but this overlooks the fact that if the circuit is open, the plate quickly becomes negatively charged as electrons accumulate, its potential drops rapidly and the electric field may even reverse, slowing down the electrons more and more as they arrive.
In the TPU/STEAP the electrons are accelerated but not in a vacuum. The core of the TPU is made up of two positive plates in the form of a bifiler coil with each coil shorted. the over wound "bifiler coils" form the two negative plates, these coils are coils and not shorted. So you see there are two capacitors but intermixed with one another, and the negative plate/coils have distinct grounds because there are two distinct inputs of power.
SM talked about TUBES and it was not until Mosfets came along that this particular setup could be realised. A triode is a pure switch, no current can pass through it when it is OFF, a mosfet can in one direction, but with an addition of another diode on the drain it also can act as a triode. The function within the overall scheme of this will become aparent later on.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.09.29, 16:53:07
These concepts are related to space charge. It should not be forgotten that the electrons in the vacuum between the electrodes represent a charge. Even if a flow of electrons is indeed a current by definition, we are no longer dealing with a simple current flowing through a wire that remains electrically neutral. We must also address the issues of charged media.
Now you realise that I am not talking about a simple capacitor but a complex capacitor system, this system being charged and discharge all of the time, a system of capacitance which as the charges change, the electric field produces a magnetic field, YES the curl field, ask AI, it is very real in an AC situation.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.09.29, 16:53:07
All these questions obviously aroused the interest of engineers and physicists from the very beginning of the first electronic tubes, particularly because space charge limited the performance of the triode, and they have already answered them. There is nothing magical about it, contrary to oversimplifications.
Of course, but when a system like the TPU is put together correctly with non magical science, it suddenly changes everything.
Quote SM:- this is not rocket science.
The "UNIT" to keep things short, is a generator, it has to be to feed back into its input plus a little extra FROM SOME WHERE.
Foreget the somewhere for now, but how is power generated?
Well it is a sort of AC wave, but a type of sine magnetic wave which is produced from "two" changing charge/discharge voltages inside that special complex capacitor.
One of the give aways to this is all to do with the output taken from TWO POSITIVE lines, no ground as in 0V, but an elevated ground such as 200v in relation to 300v and giving you a 100v+ DC output.
This changing magnetic wave, or I should say waves because there are two generators and two inputs, complicated but cleverly designed to be simple in the end. The input and the output do not really see one another, magical, NO F6, slight of hand as far as the electrons are concerned.
Well this magnetic wave generates current in the negative coil/plate, took me some time to realise what was going on, the negatives of the capacitors were also the generator coils for the input. This was SMs electron party as in 3D magnetics clever story.
As I have said many times, go and look at Prof: Eric Laithwaits Magnetic River university videos, look carefully at his lab tech man ;)
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2025.09.30, 00:48:26
Thanks 6flt,
Your explanation actually is quite useful if we ignore that you have it the wrong way round, which both Mike and SM stated in their explanations.
In time your contributions could be positive when you realize that good information is at your feet , that assumes you can become content with helping others.
...
I responded to a specific point in the PDF, the question of electrons in a vacuum tube, giving refutable arguments demonstrating that the text in the PDF stems from ignorance. I know vacuum tubes well; I was 14 when I started my first radio experiments with them.
You don't respond to this point, but talk about something else as if you were responding to what I said. It makes no sense.
No one disputes the possibility of influencing the dielectric of a capacitor by the electric field induced by a variable magnetic flux, and certainly not me. I have discussed this elsewhere in relation to the polarisation of the dielectric.
It's about time you learned the basics of electronics and physics, so you can finally understand that there is absolutely nothing new in what you're saying, but rather inconsistent interpretations of subjects where you want to see anomalies or discoveries when they are just commonplace effects that you are unaware of or whose limitations you do not understand, such as the question of space charge, and others here too.
I know nothing about medicine, so I don't give medical lessons to others. Unfortunately, when it comes to free energy, that's often what it's all about: ignorant people who think they're experts seriously spouting the worst nonsense. We might believe their childish drivel if they were able to provide experiments that work, but that's not the case either. So a little modesty wouldn't hurt, along with the intelligence to understand that people much smarter than us have already been working on these subjects for a long time, and that it's in our best interest to understand what they have understood before hoping to fly on our own wings. I mean 'understand', not to spin any topic any way you like.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.09.30, 17:44:40
...
This changing magnetic wave, or I should say waves because there are two generators and two inputs, complicated but cleverly designed to be simple in the end. The input and the output do not really see one another, magical, NO F6, slight of hand as far as the electrons are concerned.
...
If the output does not see the input, then why does it behave differently when there is a signal at the input and when there is not?
I can take a lot of crap, but this is just too much.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.09.30, 17:58:33
If the output does not see the input, then why does it behave differently when there is a signal at the input and when there is not?
I can take a lot of crap, but this is just too much.
At which school do you teach F6, of course it is in the UK as you are on a GMT time zone which is one hour behind me, physics department? come on you know who I am, and I have been around the block a long time. But you will have a lot to lose if you expose yourself here.
So who is talking ****, have you read my last post, do you really experiment or just use the internet to find an answer to what I have posted?
I have used an open thread on purpose, though I have posted on a thread you can not see, only for real investigators.
Are you worried, do you have an agender, maybe just loose face.
For years you have been prowling the net on this and that forum, I think it is about time you hung your net days up, you are running out of forums.
@Centraflow
It's funny how you don't respond to any technical objections. Your digressions about me are completely irrelevant to the issues at hand. Have you just discovered space charge, or had you forgotten its role?
Perhaps you missed the last question. Here it is again. If, as you say, "the input and the output do not really see one another", then why does it behave differently when there is a signal at the input and when there is not? Causality, does that no longer apply?
Quote from: 3D Magnetics on 2025.09.30, 00:48:26
Ferrofluid dielectric: Capacitors with ferrofluid as their dielectric can have their capacitance altered by an external magnetic field, as the field manipulates the ferrofluid.
In that case, can we use it as a parametric capacity in the OU parametric generator? Or does it take more energy to change the magnetic field than we get in a parametric circuit? Similar to what happens with a varicap' circuit.
One thing is certain, such a capacitor will be very slow, because it is associated with the mechanical movement of particles in the ferromagnetic fluid.
Centraflow
QuoteThe input and the output do not really see one another
Indeed, this is what many inventors called an energy diode or new kind of induction. It can be traced back to patents in the late 1800's.
My journey started with an idea for a circuit but had no idea what it would do. For me it was strange because I can usually figure out a circuit immediately from years of building and testing. So I built the circuit, fired it up, it went berserk and it took me years of research and testing to figure out why. Of course the answer cannot be found in any textbook and my solution was found in the most unlikely of places. I was researching the Dendera Light in the Hathor temple in Egypt when the answer hit me. What are the odds?, lol.
So there is magic and it is to explore as many truly new and innovative ideas as we can. In effect... to learn.
Quote from: F6FLT on 2025.09.30, 19:21:33
@Centraflow
It's funny how you don't respond to any technical objections. Your digressions about me are completely irrelevant to the issues at hand. Have you just discovered space charge, or had you forgotten its role?
Perhaps you missed the last question. Here it is again. If, as you say, "the input and the output do not really see one another", then why does it behave differently when there is a signal at the input and when there is not? Causality, does that no longer apply?
The problem is F6FLT, you think you are the only one who knows EVERYTHING, which you don't as you are finding out and you don't like it.
I wish I knew everything but of course this is not possible for anyone.
As far as charge separation, this is exactly what I am talking about, after all the basis of the TPU is just that but in a different way than just a capacitor on its own.
As I have said there are two capacitors which are coupled in a very unusual way, each of which have separate charge separation within themselves, and a differential charge separation between the two (separate negative plates), two different voltages.
For now I will keep this to myself and a "few" on this forum. If I disappear the art will not, though it is well kept in other places as well, one of which I am sure is in Germany in the hands of lawyers.
By the way Francis, in French it is spelt two different ways, depends on if you are male or female, and F6FLT could be your car registration number plate, the DVLC could tell me that.
I am an investigative scientist, the tpu is not my invention, I have just been able to find out how it works and renamed it STEAP which is more inline with how it works.
No money making for me, just bills and hard investigating along with many many hours of bench time in my lab.
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2025.10.01, 14:57:02
Centraflow
Indeed, this is what many inventors called an energy diode or new kind of induction. It can be traced back to patents in the late 1800's.
My journey started with an idea for a circuit but had no idea what it would do. For me it was strange because I can usually figure out a circuit immediately from years of building and testing. So I built the circuit, fired it up, it went berserk and it took me years of research and testing to figure out why. Of course the answer cannot be found in any textbook and my solution was found in the most unlikely of places. I was researching the Dendera Light in the Hathor temple in Egypt when the answer hit me. What are the odds?, lol.
So there is magic and it is to explore as many truly new and innovative ideas as we can. In effect... to learn.
Right on AC, it works like a diode.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.10.01, 17:14:43
As I have said there are two capacitors which are coupled in a very unusual way, each of which have separate charge separation within themselves, and a differential charge separation between the two (separate negative plates), two different voltages.
I also had something similar going on back in 2010 with coil-capacitors where induction was made perhaps in similar ways like TPU collectors do.
It was all about causing induction on one of capacitor plates which actually was a coil. Maybe something similar you had in mind?
I like this post from Centraflow
QuoteIt takes a lot of real scientific investigating to get to the end and produce a real working unit.
Dedication to the cause.
Centraflow nailed it imo. "Scientific investigating" is also how I found some success. We could ask what this means, for me it means treating any given technology as a puzzle. It's not my job to judge the technology only to gather as much evidence on it as I can and try to put it into perspective. The people involved, the literature, the technology, the patents, the history, replications and any related science. We should become an expert on the technology to such an extent we can answer almost any questions and begin to understand how it actually works.
For example, by my estimate the Adams motor required about 1500 hours of research and 400 hours of testing before I had anything resembling positive results. Here is how I do it, I pick a few devices and like a computer whenever my mind has any idle time I think about the devices or draw some sketches of it. It may only be an hour a day but over the course of years all the hours add up because it's always in the back of our mind.
We could think of it this way, many people have hobbies and spend literally thousands of hours collecting trinkets, coins, cross word puzzles, miniature railroads, models, golf, fishing, ham radio and so forth. My hobby just so happens to be energy and energy devices and I really enjoy the puzzle aspect of it, the unknown.
Quote from: T-1000 on 2025.10.02, 00:40:42
I also had something similar going on back in 2010 with coil-capacitors where induction was made perhaps in similar ways like TPU collectors do.
It was all about causing induction on one of capacitor plates which actually was a coil. Maybe something similar you had in mind?
Like this.
The pulsed inputs are from a charged common mode choke, charge and discharge, as in DC to DC boost converters. The pulses are out of phase with different duties, hence two different voltages, though in practice it is a little more complicated as you use 3 switches.
This way the voltages are controlled so as they have different voltages, this important because your final output is a differential positive voltage, DC.
This has already been posted on this forum, but I am placing a link here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHykWjtVdNM
It is quite relevent to the TPU because of how it is wound.
Laithwait must have gone through many configurations of coils until he could levitate and move along his maglev train that he invented.
The TPU creates a "magnetic wave", a changing "amplitude" that mirrors an alternating current, so a changing magnetic field.
As we all know, a changing magnetic field will induce a current in a wire.
SM said that you can move a magnet across a long wire slowly or fast across a shot wire, this a just a generator, but think in terms of the TPU construction.
Remember there are no moving parts in the TPU.
Centraflow
QuoteThe TPU creates a "magnetic wave", a changing "amplitude" that mirrors an alternating current, so a changing magnetic field.
As we all know, a changing magnetic field will induce a current in a wire.
This sounds similar to my work with AC induction motors and generators.
Any AC induction motor can become a generator when connected to the grid and run faster than the synchronous speed of 60 Hz here in Canada. Here we can discard most of the often complex AC theory and say when the rotor magnetic field changes slower than the grid it's a motor. When the rotor magnetic field changes faster than the grid it's a generator. Ergo, any magnetic field change faster than the normal system magnetic field change represents a generator function. As well, as Faraday eluded in his lectures, "it does not matter why the magnetic field changes only that it does" as the concept is universal to the process of induction. If the magnetic field changes more for any reason that is the answer we were looking for whether we accept it or not.
Quote from: Centraflow on 2025.10.02, 16:35:15
Like this.
The pulsed inputs are from a charged common mode choke, charge and discharge, as in DC to DC boost converters. The pulses are out of phase with different duties, hence two different voltages, though in practice it is a little more complicated as you use 3 switches.
This way the voltages are controlled so as they have different voltages, this important because your final output is a differential positive voltage, DC.
Thank you CF for such a simple and straightforward experiment. Lot easier building a wright bros. plane than a 747.
When I get some downtime I will have to explore this configuration further O0
It seems like good optical/galvanically-isolated drivers/amplifiers would be ideal for such setups. Or at least proper differential probes to measure with an oscilloscope...
Quote from: Hakasays on 2025.10.05, 02:44:37
Thank you CF for such a simple and straightforward experiment. Lot easier building a wright bros. plane than a 747.
When I get some downtime I will have to explore this configuration further O0
It seems like good optical/galvanically-isolated drivers/amplifiers would be ideal for such setups. Or at least proper differential probes to measure with an oscilloscope...
You use a decade counter, feeding, VOM1271 mosfet drivers. The clock is all you need, a SG is good enough.
The counter breaks up the clock into the frequencies you want, and is the form of duty as well as a sequencer.
Next to no electronics.
Been trying to get up to speed on this again since I Last worked on it. I got Gemini to do a deep research report using videos as the source material then I added that and a link to this thread to NotebookLM. Then I got it to create this podcast so I could listen while driving. This is the video version https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wb3smn_631yxEIoXpsFN1DrjckmdVm6-/view?usp=sharing . I thought some looking in may find it helpful.
Here is the problem: Steven Mark stated he didn't know how the TPU worked only that it did.
Steven Mark is mostly likely dead, this makes replicating the TPU a very hard task.
I've been gone from OUR for a long time, here is a picture of the big TPU and that taped up part is in my opinion a diode (rectifier) that charges the capacitors.
At the time, high voltage capacitors were hard to get, so i think he connected two capacitors in series, to get 800V or so. He used the capacitors he could get. Below are some fotos showing how the diode is connected. In my opinion, the TPU is a pulse device.
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.16, 03:36:37
In my opinion, the TPU is a pulse device.
At what frequency do these pulses occur and is there an active electronic circuit that creates them ?
I made two circuits that produce large current pulses in a coil, it creates a hammering vibration, people that have held a TPU say it vibrates. Experiments I have done indicate that if the pulsing rate is too high you don't feel the vibration, it looks like about 8 to 12 pulses a second. The toroid is the key as to how the TPU works. The TPU amplifies current, there is a lot more to learn as to how the TPU works. I will post more things to set a direction to go. Here is a video I made with more info on the toroid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nDVlwH9vmI&t=335s
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.16, 09:25:57
...it looks like about 8 to 12 pulses a second.
You are being ambiguous about the cause and effect.
The 8 to 12 pulses per second that are audible in the videos apparently are the effect.
But it is not obvious at all whether you are pulsing the device 8 to 12 times per second.
e.g.: you could be pulsing it 10000 times per second (the cause) and still get the audible
effect only 8 to 12 times per second.
You have to understand the enormous task figuring out how to build something that the inventor did not know how it worked only how to build it and that it worked.I go by clues
the vibration was unknown,Jack Durban was fooled,he didn't know what caused the vibration,he was an engineer
it indicated to me, this was an unknown effect to him.The effect I got seems to be the effect,this leads
to the heating problem if high current pulses pass thru copper coils,this is a resistive load
it will heat up.By using this as the basis,the tpu generates high current pulses,the pulses produce a vibration,they cause a heat problem ,they have to to be stored by a diode and a capacitor
to produce useful energy.The gyroscopic effect is not produced
by high current pulses,in my opinion it is an interaction ,from the tpu drawing energy from the gravity field.
One devices circuit uses a flashing led that fixes its pulse rate at 5 flashes a second or 5 pulses a second,the other device is more complex it uses an oscillator to generate 1 to 100 pulses a second it is also more powerful.
The devices I made were to study the toroid under high current low frequency pulses,one was fixed at about 5 pulses
per second.The other one is variable 1 to 100 pulses a second.When you discharge a high
value capacitor across a wire coil you get a vibration along the wire at every point,in my opinion,the
rapid increase in negative charges[electrons] causes the copper to expand, then
contract as the current stops, causing a noise.Here is a video of a new device, the pulsing
is the coil,also the light flashes at a 4 second rate,the rate of pulses is fixed by a flashing led,this fires an SCR ,this was made to have the least amount of parts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rudQORZQg50
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.17, 05:19:02
You have to understand the enormous task figuring out how to build something that the inventor did not know
I understand. You did helluva work figuring this out.
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.17, 05:19:02
One devices circuit uses a flashing led that fixes its pulse rate at 5 flashes a second or 5 pulses a second,the other device is more complex it uses an oscillator to generate 1 to 100 pulses a second it is also more powerful.
The meaning of your words might be obvious to you, but to someone like me none of them exclude a scenario where e.g.: you stimulate the coil with 10kHz and 3.14MHz sine voltage waveforms but the coil outputs 5 binary pulses per second.
Please describe your input to the coil precisely !
This is what "
precisely" means:
- If the input has two levels, i.e. ON/OFF - binary, then state so.
- Assuming that the above is true: state the frequency and duty cycle of the input waveform or express it in terms of time-ON and time-OFF.
- State the current and voltage amplitude of this digital input waveform.
...
- ...if the input waveform is not binary, then describe the shape of this waveform or post its scopeshot with probe positions described.
There seem to be many clues about the TPU which are overlooked.
For example, when the TPU was flipped upside down it apparently stopped working. What does this tell us?. It tells me that the devices position relative to the Earth matters. Ergo, Earths electric, magnetic or gravic fields could play some role in it's operation. Using this line of reason, if the device interacts with Earths fields then the Earths fields could interact with it, equal and opposite.
I think T.H.Moray had the right perspective and his reasoning was flawless imo. Moray implied, forget what you think you know and focus on what is present and available for use. So if the TPU had inertial effects resisting motion and stopped working when flipped upside down it's very easy to assume the device must be interacting with something in the surrounding space like Earths magnetic field.
In fact, Lester Hendershot made this claim about his device and said it was interacting with Earths magnetic field.
Quote: "The fuelless motor works somewhat on the principle of a compass, and the original model would always operate when pointing north or south, as does the compass, but would not move when pointed east or west." Also, Hendershot today stated "there was nothing mysterious about his motor, that the force that energizes it is the "same force that pulls the needle of the compass, and there is nothing mysterious about that".
---https://fuel-efficient-vehicles.org/energy-news/?page_id=1166
So this notion that a device must violate the COE or be a perpetual motion machine is quite absurd. The inventors basically told us where they think the energy comes from.
Verpies,
You have to take a simpler view. My take is: it shows you can have a vibration with just wires, with nothing else, that feels mechanical and fits the description of people who have held a TPU. Other than showing a vibration and showing a magnetic pattern on a toroid wound like the TPU one, the circuit has limited uses.
What the circuit does, is it charges two electrolytic capacitors [1200 mfd] at 170 Volts DC, it puts the charge thru an SCR across a coil [.03 Ohm, 12 micro Hendries].
You have a massive current in one burst going into a coil. Yes you have a big magnetic field, however the hammering effect is felt on all the wires not just the coil.
I have been on OUR in the past for a long time, on Overunity.com for a very long time, I have seen a lot of explanations for the vibration of the TPU, most were silly, some were stupid.
I was on overunity.com when Jack Durban posted for a while, he was baffled by the TPU's vibration.
He described it as a mechanical vibration like a motor, yet the TPU was mainly wire.
Steven Mark was a smart guy, but he didn't just one day say I'm going to make a free energy device. He had a business renting high-end stereo equipment, he had a few stereos that were defective they used toroids as filter chokes in the stereos power supply, they were wound in two different directions, this canceled the induction making it nearly zero. He tinkered with these toroids, from this came the TPU. All the parts to make the TPU came from Radio Shack except the toroids. In a video Steven Mark shows the first TPU, whats on top is the toroid because its the key to the TPU.
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.18, 08:53:45
What the circuit does, is it charges two electrolytic capacitors [1200 mfd] at 170 Volts DC, it puts the charge thru an SCR across a coil [.03 Ohm, 12 micro Hendries].
How often does that happen ?
Quote from: Allcanadian on 2025.11.17, 17:16:39
There seem to be many clues about the TPU which are overlooked.
For example, when the TPU was flipped upside down it apparently stopped working. What does this tell us?. It tells me that the devices position relative to the Earth matters. Ergo, Earths electric, magnetic or gravic fields could play some role in it's operation. Using this line of reason, if the device interacts with Earths fields then the Earths fields could interact with it, equal and opposite.
I think T.H.Moray had the right perspective and his reasoning was flawless imo. Moray implied, forget what you think you know and focus on what is present and available for use. So if the TPU had inertial effects resisting motion and stopped working when flipped upside down it's very easy to assume the device must be interacting with something in the surrounding space like Earths magnetic field.
In fact, Lester Hendershot made this claim about his device and said it was interacting with Earths magnetic field.
Quote: "The fuelless motor works somewhat on the principle of a compass, and the original model would always operate when pointing north or south, as does the compass, but would not move when pointed east or west." Also, Hendershot today stated "there was nothing mysterious about his motor, that the force that energizes it is the "same force that pulls the needle of the compass, and there is nothing mysterious about that".
---https://fuel-efficient-vehicles.org/energy-news/?page_id=1166
So this notion that a device must violate the COE or be a perpetual motion machine is quite absurd. The inventors basically told us where they think the energy comes from.
You are right to bring up the subject of the Earth's magnetic field. Very few people know that this field has a huge scalar magnetic potential, or even know what a scalar magnetic potential is. If you search for this online you will find explanation of scalar magnetic potential in Wikipedia where it has a dimension of Amps (in the same way that scalar electric potential is measured in Volts). But then you also get a ridiculous statement (probably AI generated!!) giving the Earth's scalar potential as its B field in webers per square meter. Its actual value is theoretically zero at the equator and 78
million Amps at the poles. That is not a typo, it is 7.8x10
7 Amps. A magnetic pole (even an induced one in an electromagnet) will inherit an electrodynamic inertia from this scalar potential, an inertia that can be negative in value. In the mechanical world negative inertia is the (deemed impossible) pump of perpetual motion machines. Perhaps the TPU gets its perpetual energy via induced pulses of inertia from this effect. If so the origin of the energy is the rotating liquid Fe core of the Earth which will be slowed down when we obtain energy in that way. So if all the World's energy needs in future were obtained by TPUs we would create, not a Climate crisis, but a loss of Earth's field crisis.
Smudge
when we observe a compass, they are usually weak magnetically and or in a damping fluid in order to not oscillate as shown below in my vid. this vid was made because i was impressed just how strong the earths mag field is.
was trying some things and couldnt seem to get this magnet to stand on edge on the bench. checked for screws in the wood and looked to see if i had a large magnet around. tried it in different locations
same thing.
now, if we want to see just how strong the earths field is, we could position some of the same magnets, one north and one south, earth N and S, and set up to counter earths field affecting the compas magnet, then the distance of these 2 counter magnets, and at that distance, measure how strong the field is from one of these magnets viahall sensor, etc, and then we can know the strength of the earths field and its possible effects on such devices. not sure a hall effect can detect at such a distance. if the compas magnet wer countering earths field, then the sensor should read null field at the distance found earlier.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6gOO7OHHeMM
mags
Verpies,
The pulse repetition frequency is set by the flashing LED from 1 to 6 flashes per second, depending on the LED type.
When the LED turns on, it drops the resistance of a photoresistor. This triggers the SCR to turn on.
The SCR then discharges the capacitors across the coil. After the SCR's current drops below its holding
current, the SCR turns off and the cycle starts over - the capacitors keep charging...
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/hG2bAu44uxs
Here is a paper that I wrote about 7 years ago on a computer that has since gone to the scrap heap. With my life in turmoil since then, and several different computers later, I have just found this on a memory stick. I don't remember writing it and I probably never published it online. It shows that the weird internal structure of the original TPUs with wires on flexible cork formers could really create energy from the Earth's magnetic field and exhibit the noted inertial and orientation effects.
If you search online for magnetic scalar potential you are likely to turn up this lecture https://courses.washington.edu/ess502/Lect2_EarthMagneticField.pdf (https://courses.washington.edu/ess502/Lect2_EarthMagneticField.pdf). This gives the formula and also the values of the Earth's magnetic characteristics for that formula but doesn't calculate the scalar potential or use it in the lecture. That huge 78,000,000 Amps value is hidden from sight so it is little wonder that no one has looked into using it.
Smudge
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.19, 07:52:09
When the LED turns on, it drops the resistance of a photoresistor. This triggers the SCR to turn on.
The SCR then discharges the capacitors across the coil. After the SCR's current drops below its holding current, the SCR turns off and the cycle starts over - the capacitors keep charging...
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/hG2bAu44uxs
Like this ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54833)
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.19, 07:52:09
The pulse repetition frequency is set by the flashing LED from 1 to 6 flashes per second, depending on the LED type.
What makes the LED flash 1-6 times per second ?
Also, does your SCR look like this ? :
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54830)
Also, does your SCR look like this ? :
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.17, 05:19:02
When you discharge a high value capacitor across a wire coil, you get a vibration along the wire at every point. In my opinion,the
rapid increase in negative charges[electrons] causes the copper to expand, then contract, as the current stops, causing a noise.
So you think that the thermal expansion of copper causes the vibrations?
Quote from: bfulmind23 on 2025.11.19, 14:31:37
So you think that the thermal expansion of copper causes the vibrations?
could be thermal. but that much of an expansion would most likely be the only vibration caused, as i dont think it could cool down fast enough to be part of the vibration noticed.
what i believe he is describing is that either an excess of free electrons in the winding enables and expansion of the copper, or, possibly a contraction during that period. possibly. either way, it could be a reason for the effect.
another possibility is the configuration IS messing with earths field. pushing, pulling, etc. that, in my opinion would be a fascinating find, and more probable being the said alignment in certain ways affects the function.
mags
Verpies, certain types of leds have a built in circuit to pulse the led at different
speeds,you simply add a resistor and voltage and it flashes,the purpose of this circuit was to
use as few components as possible.If you use a different circuit
it would require a circuit to pulse the led or the SCR directly.Heres a picture of the SCR and bridge rectifier I use.
Here is the schematic,the light bulb is to prevent damage to the circuit,it can be replaced
by an inductor.
Copper atoms are held to each other by an electrostatic force when you pass a gigantic current of negatively charged particles [electrons] you create a repelling force this causes the the atoms to move away from each other [expand]. When the current stops the force keeping the atoms close to each other,begins to pull them together. The atoms are under a lot of tension so they snap back strongly [contract]. The noise occurs at every point on the wire not just on the coil.
Here is a video I made a long time ago, this uses a different device more powerful and has a faster pulse rate. If you hold the coil you would think its a mechanical device not a bunch of wires. Keep in mind most people in here have never seen a TPU, including me.
How do we know for sure that the TPU was not a fake? If this effect is one of the described effects of the TPU then the odds increase that it is real.
Is it a thermal expansion, no, it would have to heat up and cool, the wires generate no heat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wt7DoR0qtzo
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.20, 06:37:37
Copper atoms are held to each other by an electrostatic force when you pass a gigantic current of negatively charged particles [electrons] you create a repelling force this causes the the atoms to move away from each other [expand]
I agree with the metal expansion and contraction, but I disagree with their thermal and electrostatic mechanisms.
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.20, 06:37:37l
Is it a thermal expansion, no, it would have to heat up and cool, the wires generate no heat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wt7DoR0qtzo
questions...
is there a core?
which coil is being pulsed?
if only the red winding is being pulsed, is the other winding loaded?
if you flip it upside down, or any other orientation, is there any difference?
thanks for showing
mags
Magluvin,
There is no core, it is an air core coil. I ran out of red wire so I used speaker wire.
It is simply wire wrapped around a circular form, a vacuum hose. I did check to see if there was a gyroscopic effect - there was none.
I think it goes like this: primary effect - gyroscopic effect, secondary effect - high current pulses, vibration.
Have you checked the vacuum cleaner hose? Many are Steel wire reinforced.
Cheers Graham.
Quote from: Grumage on 2025.11.22, 12:00:50
Have you checked the vacuum cleaner hose? Many are Steel wire reinforced.
O0
so if it is said that there was an aidio amplifier that was found to have its power supply transformer wound incorrectly that started this all, id have to say that for that time period, it would have had a core.
mags
Yes, coreless transformers exist predominantly in RF world.
All power supply transformers have a ferri/ferromagnetic core.
Audio transformers, mostly too ...but I heard of some freaky audiophiles using huge wardrobe-sized step-down audio transformers after the HV output out of vacuum tubes. Never saw such a monstrosity though.
Grumage,this is a cheap vacuum hose,all plastic,the steel wire vacuum hoses are used in
expensive vacuum
cleaners for flexibility,I also used wire wrapped around a pvc pipe and also wire in coils held
together with black tape.You get the same result,good question.Here is a video
no core,the vibration happens at every point on the wire.
https://youtube.com/shorts/DyHplljl5-A
Magluvin,the toroid is the core,why they used this as a filter choke is strange,in
the past,in the vacuum era ,they used filter chokes.they had an input capacitor,hooked
to a filter choke,which hooked to an output capacitor.Sometimes the filter choke
shorted,this caused a loud hum on the audio.In a stereo you would get a loud hum
if the toroid lost its inductance or it dropped to a low amount,it would act like a
shorted filter choke. In the pictures there are 2 toroids both use the same type
of core,same number of turns,one is wound in a standard way,the other is wound like
the tpu one.The standard one reads `19.2 millihenries,the other one reads
.019 milliheries,it lost most of its inductance it will not work as a filter choke.
The toroid with half its winding reversed will not only exhibit low inductance but when energised will also throw its flux outside the core, mostly across the central hole. That flux can intercept conductors placed in the hole. If the two windings are separate and used as primary and secondary of a transformer, when the secondary is loaded that also throws flux outside the core into the hole. When I was at Delft University to witness the Yildiz magnetic motor a Delft Professor of Physics had made that (startling to him!) discovery that he was keen to show me.
Smudge
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.11.23, 14:34:39
The toroid with half its winding reversed will not only exhibit low inductance but when energised will also throw its flux outside the core, mostly across the central hole.
I agree.
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=53515)
Hello,
way back in 1998 , Gennady A. Markov, filed a patent of transformer which uses these two coils in the same way S.Marks
is supposed to have used in his TPU.
Thanks to Cheappower2012 for your hard work-analysis which was a real surprise for me.
Please find attached an english translation ( disregard the first paragraphs and start after the picture of Markov)
Here is a webadress (russian) where there is the original description in shorter version
https://studfile.net/preview/8200970/][url]https://studfile.net/preview/8200970/
(http://[url)[/url]
If witnesses reported about a humming sound the puls-repetition must certainly be higher than 10 HZ otherwise we would see a flicker of the light or he rectified the output.
Now looking at the active transformer one can see two different windings, the right winding having much more turns than the left. Does this mean that this winding is applied on one of the two "compensating" windings (primaries) and used as a secondary coil ?
Mike (ger)
10k is a pretty high freq to be considered a hum. ive had a pic of that pat depiction on my laptop desktop for years and didnt know the source of it. thanks for that. lenzless it says. maybe one of the toroids in the middle of the tpu is wound similarly.
maybe if the input pulse were as short as a 10k half cycle, with a time period between, then maybe a hum in vibration could be cansidered. in doing so, that pulse should work in the teansformer depicted.
interesting stuff.
mags
Heres a video of a toroid ,its wound like the one in the tpu,it is pulsed,iron powder is put on to
trace the magnetic field.Notice that in the center, a lot of activity is happening,Seven Mark
placed a white wire across the toroid.This is the key to the tpu,as to what powers the tpu
it must be local to the tpu.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/-oVOgS88iU4
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.24, 07:49:07
Heres a video of a toroid ,its wound like the one in the tpu,it is pulsed,iron powder is put on to
trace the magnetic field.Notice that in the center, a lot of activity is happening,Seven Mark
placed a white wire across the toroid.This is the key to the tpu,as to what powers the tpu
it must be local to the tpu.
That merely confirms the field lines shown in Verpies reply #629 that any good finite element simulator will show. And yes, you can put coils there to use that field to good effect, but that is merely a complicated form of transformer. While it may be part of the overall TPU circuit, it needs a more detailed analysis to verify your claim that this powers the TPU.
mags
I wrote 10 Hz not 10 KHz
Mike(ger)
says here in your pdf that the transformer will not work below 10khz and min 40v
mags
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.24, 07:49:07
Heres a video of a toroid ,its wound like the one in the tpu,it is pulsed,iron powder is put on to
trace the magnetic field.Notice that in the center, a lot of activity is happening,Seven Mark
placed a white wire across the toroid.This is the key to the tpu,as to what powers the tpu
it must be local to the tpu.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/-oVOgS88iU4
hmm. looking at the pdf, i would have guessed the outer winding would have been the input just looking at the depiction. but it describes it the other way around.
claiming lenzless, my logical reasoning would have been that since the outer winding does not go through the hole of the core, i had assumed the outer winding to induce the 2 core windings and not affecting the outer winding as it isnt wound through the core.
the 40v min claim seems odd.
no trying to derail here. just trying to put the facts together for more understanding. just wondering what would happen if the outer coil were used as the primary..
mags
mags,
correct, but this is true for the Markov-Transformer. Might be different with Marks Device.
I just referred to the Markov Transformer because he obviously uses the secondary wound around the whole Transformer,
capturing the Flux-Ejection around the device.
We cannoot claim that Marks uses a similar setup, its too early ...anyway an interesting find
Mike (ger)
from what i had heard over the years was that SM was into audio. that he was working on quadraphonic ideas.
then i had heard something about a crt tv exploding and there was ideas aroused from that.
but now i hear it was a power transformer in an audio amp.
now im unsure about any of that. i sort of leaned toward the crt, maybe having something to do with the yolks causing some undesirable effects that shed light on an idea.
if anyone can elaborate on these, please do.
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.11.25, 18:14:22
but now i hear it was a power transformer in an audio amp.
...and I heard that it was an incorrectly wound inductor in the speakers (sounds like a crossover filter component).
on the audio thing, i had a few long talks with erfinder some years ago. the subject of dual voice coil subwoofers came up. he hinted toward some specific gains that might be had if it were bifilar wound. most that i have encountered were layered coils, not typical bifi as we might think of.
i havnt gotten into that yet, but i just may to see what he might have been alluding to. it was more on the subject of controling impedance and getting more output, sound energy.
he was always about getting rid of impedance, subverting, whatever.
with his motor ideas it was about having little to no cemf, where as the motor would not level out to a particular rpm due to counter emf 'generated' by the motor in opposition to the input. but instead would just keep accepting more current and going faster with healthy output all the way to where resistance was the only factor of limitation.
as for the bifi sub coils, he suggested that same goal in reducing the counter emf limitations.
i know it most likely is not related here, but maybe it can help with some understanding.
mags
just a few thoughts
the main tip and question is how inrush current interact with Earth magnetic field to produce small kick of current ?
then method is used to squeeze current like water in hose which means the setup is probably extremally simple like single loop of wire. remember it works like accelerator in some strange recurrent. Probably Tito L.Oracion would explain it better :-) hope he is well today
hey forest. how have you been?
my thoughts on whether the tpu was sensitive to orientation of the earth, be it its mag field or gravity, for that to be i would think that maybe fine tuning of the tpu, be it resonance or just its open field magnetics were affected. i could imagine the earths field could affect one or both.
mags
Quote from: forest on 2025.11.25, 20:32:31
the main tip and question is how inrush current interact with Earth magnetic field to produce small kick of current ?
Electric currents do not interact with Earth's magnetic field to produce additional "kicks of current".
When electric currents interact with magnetic fields, they generate mechanical forces.
For example, a 10cm diameter copper loop (1mΩ), rotating around its diameter in Earth's strongest magnetic field (60µT) 15100 times per second, requires 1 Watt of additional mechanical power to rotate, due to that field.
Another example: A 3500 turn coil (a practical maximum for a 10cm OD coil) having resistance of 22kΩ requires 5.8 Watts of additional mechanical power due to Earth's field, in order to rotate at the same speed. ...and you can only get up to 6.1 Watts at the same speed, when you take the inductance of that coil to the theoretical limit: infinity.
FYI: A single turn loop (10cm OD) rotating at the same speed would need to have an impractical resistance of 234nΩ in order to dissipate this 5.8W (of course 15100rps is impractical, too). Maximum dissipation or max additional mechanical power required to maintain that speed due to Earth's field, occurs when R = ωL. When R is 0 or R is ∞ then this requirement is 0, i.e.: the rotation does not require any additional mechanical power due to the external magnetic field.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.11.25, 22:14:40
Electric currents do not interact with Earth's magnetic field to produce additional "kicks of current"
Magnetic "currents" (movement of magnetic poles) interact with the Earth's magnetic field but you need very high speeds to get usable effect. You can induce magnetic poles into a loop of Fe wire with suitable coil arrangements, and you can get those poles to move along the wire at great speed far in excess of anything you can do mechanically moving actual magnets.
Smudge
Quote from: Smudge on 2025.11.26, 07:22:00
Magnetic "currents" (movement of magnetic poles) interact with the Earth's magnetic field...
But "magnetic currents" are not electric currents.
If I could get moving magnetic poles, their changing magnetic field would induce current.
My focus would be on any and all things that SM claimed to have given him the insight to begin with. Pics are helpful, but as said before, the build we see could be deceptive. Nonetheless, the device is contained in what we see so far. It's possible that in the beginnings of SM presenting the idea, he may have been more forthcoming with truth rather than later on.
I'd say if we can come to some agreement on what it was that led him to this, then we may gain better perspective.
Like i remember talk of rotating fields. To me, I am not sure audio circuits would do that. but, with a CRT yoke, it definitely could be done. With speakers it could be done with phase shifting arrays, but i see no speakers in the TPU's shown.
Just thinkin'
Mags
Hello,
Dont know, If this was already.posted:
[https://www.doctorkoontz.com/Scalar_Physics/Steven%20Mark/Steven_Mark.htm]
Mike(ger)
Another File
https://www.calameo.com/read/001092958bccf599df62a
Any Downloader I tried failed.. using my phone
Mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.27, 16:36:48
https://www.calameo.com/read/001092958bccf599df62a
Any Downloader I tried failed.. using my phone
I guess you are not a German hacker if you're using a phone for such tasks.
FYI: These Calameo folks serve all their content in the SVG format. All the SVG files of this document can be downloaded here (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54929). You can unpack them (not on a phone!) with your trusty unrar or winrar and then open them in your web browser.
If you want to convert them to the PDF format, you can use a free online converter like Convertio (https://convertio.co/svg-pdf/), or a desktop utility like Inkscape (https://inkscape.org/release/) ...or others. The result should resemble something like this (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54930).
P.S.
If you do not know how to unpack the .RAR archive then study or ask someone else.
Verpies,
thank you....very helpful as always.
Me..a hacker :-[...no, I used my phone because i have issues with the user interface of my old 18.04 Linux...probably a java-problem
Now I have to comment about some detail in the aforementioned document;
I stopped reading the document on page 11. On this page a picture is shown with yellow note reading
QuoteFront-Left Coil
How is it that he confuses these two separate windings with a bifilar winding?
Am I completely wrong? To me, it looks exactly like two parallel or antiparallel turns as cheappower2012 stated in one of his posts.
Anyway it is clear to me now that this document is gaslighting and misleading the community into believing that this is a technique similar to the MEG, also using the Tesla-Patent to divert the attention.
I didnt read further because once I sense the smell of intelligence work or at least gatekeeper activity I dont want to waste my time.
I also wonder whether I should remove the document.
mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 00:32:28
Me..a hacker :-[...no, I used my phone because i have issues with the user interface of my old 18.04 Linux...probably a java-problem
Well, with a Haxor name like this....
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 00:32:28
I stopped reading the document on page 11. On this page a picture is shown with yellow note reading How is it that he confuses these two separate windings with a bifilar winding?
Over the years I have learned that people can mean the following four different winding arrangements by the word "bifilar".
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54933)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 00:32:28
Am I completely wrong? To me, it looks exactly like two parallel or antiparallel turns as cheappower2012 stated in one of his posts.
That photo depicts a winding made with two different wires of 2 different colors. Depending on how the ends of these wires are connected, it can be any of the four topologies depicted above.
Starting from page 33 the author appears to consider all ways the ends can be connected which make sense.
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 00:32:28
Anyway it is clear to me now that this document is gaslighting and misleading the community into believing that this is a technique similar to the MEG, also using the Tesla-Patent to divert the attention.
It may or maybe it is just the way the author sees it, considering the limited visual data.
You should endeavor to not reject anything off hand just because it conflicts with a cherished narrative or interpretation.
Verpies
You are correct with me having a possible narrative ...but looking again at the related picture I see two separate coils side by side , the one above right is partly covered by a white material (Tape ?)
I do not see two wires side by side wound in any configuration that you've showed
Mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 15:39:06
Verpiß,
You are correct with me having a possible narrative ...but looking again at the related picture I see two separate coils side by side , the one above right is partly covered by a white material (Tape ?)
I do not see two wires side by side wound in any configuration that you've showed
The two separate terminals (circled in red) and the wide gaps between the white turns of the "FRONT-LEFT COIL" are indicators that this is one of the four winding arrangements depicted here (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54933).
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54941)
Cropped illustration from Pg.11 (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54930)P.S.
I know what Verpiß means in German. I'll let it slide ...this time.
seeing the size of the wire and not that many turns, those windings may be just circuit isolation or cmc as mike has shown in most every circuit he has presented. :o :P
mags
verpies,
I apologize...terrible mistake...my bad. :-[
On my Notebook this letter here "ß" is on the number-line of my keyboard on the extreme right side.This number-line is on top. The "s" is on the far left side" on the second letter-line.
It is almost impossible that this can happen. I noticed on my phone that words are altered by AI while typing and if I am not attentive a slip like this could happen....and it did because I used my phone for this last post of mine...what a mess. It might lead to me being kicked
out here.
Still I can not see the coil-setup in the pic on your scheme, as the two coils I see are not wound on the same axis....but will stop arguing because of the bad quality of the vid.
I just saw another video here:
https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?si=Tzl091dmYOtfLNfu&t=358 (https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?si=Tzl091dmYOtfLNfu&t=358)
..and here I see only one coil on the base-plate.
@mags: your post "..as mike has shown " you certainly meant Marks ;). By the way do you speak russian or ukrainian language ?
..and yes Marks used thick cables used for transmission of NF power from amplifier-output stage to the speaker-box
mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.29, 23:27:43
Still I can not see the coil-setup in the pic on your scheme, as the two coils I see are not wound on the same axis....but will stop arguing because of the bad quality of the vid.
I just saw another video here:
https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?si=Tzl091dmYOtfLNfu&t=358 (https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?si=Tzl091dmYOtfLNfu&t=358)
..and here I see only one coil on the base-plate.
Do you see the two terminals of that winding which I have marked with two red lines below ?
Do you see the air gap between these terminals as he moves the device around ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54943)
This screenshot was taken from the video at 10:07 (https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?t=606), which you have posted above.
as in mike, centralflow
mags
Verpies,
yes I can see it know. The white strip is just the white background ( white wand shining through) ...solved. Thank you.
What is your assessment : is he rotating all 4 coils in successive order endlessly like a chasing LED light like this ?:
https://youtu.be/Jra0rFpwy1o?si=PnSbDlH77aE6W0Ph&t=550 (https://youtu.be/Jra0rFpwy1o?si=PnSbDlH77aE6W0Ph&t=550)
... and where is the energy coming from? He clearly had issues with eddy currents as Jack Urban wrote which is to be exspected with this speaker-plate he used
Mike(ger)
He never checked the plug outlet for ac voltage it was assumed it was there because the lamps
lit.If the lamps were simple lamps with no area to hide anything then this tpu could be real
also this tpu never appears ever again.
I have replicated this illusion[f2],the two lamps have room for a 12 volt battery and a small
12 volts to 110 ac inverter.The one end of the inverter is hooked to the 12 volt battery,the
other end of the inverter is hooked to one side of the ac cord of the lamp.The other side of the
battery goes to the other side of the ac cord.When you short the ac cord the 12 volts
powers the inverter and the lamp lights.On the wall socket he simply put a wire across the
socket
this shorts it,if you plug in the ac cord from the lamps they will light this creates an
illusion there's 110 ac there.On the device there are reed switches that turn on with a magnet
and it supplies
a voltage from a battery[f1],the connection that goes to the lamps is just a short.In my opinion
this device is a fake.Heres an other that I think is fake[F3],it is a small tpu,its 12, 9 volt
batteries
connected in series,I have done this it lights a lamp as in the video.Steven Mark was a sort of
con man,these fakes were to appeal to the investor's greed as this was in hes investor video,its
Just basic greed.
In my opinion some of the TPUs are real and some are fake. If you focus on a fake TPU, you will get nowhere. That's why I tried to see which ones are possibly real.
I'm not wasting my time on fakes. You guys can believe what you want. SM was a very smart but tricky guy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhEUx24fyXU
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.30, 01:46:17
What is your assessment : is he rotating all 4 coils in successive order endlessly like a chasing LED light like this ?:
https://youtu.be/Jra0rFpwy1o?si=PnSbDlH77aE6W0Ph&t=550 (https://youtu.be/Jra0rFpwy1o?si=PnSbDlH77aE6W0Ph&t=550)
I do not know. I was just pointing out the winding topology as seen on these screenshots.
This does not mean that I subscribe to the other points of Razvan Niculae's analysis like his terminal connection diagram nor his proposed gain mechanism.
I can confirm that when four windings are arranged and connected in pairs, like he proposes, then the following flux distribution is correct when one pair is fully energized.
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54951)
Additionally, I can confirm that when two pairs of windings are arranged and connected in that manner and they are energized by 2-phase sinusoidal AC current (90º out of phase) then a uniformly rotating magnetic field is generated.
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.11.30, 01:46:17
... and where is the energy coming from?
I have my pet theory but I will not post it here as it tends to upset people ...especially those who believe in an aether.
Quote from: Cheappower2012 on 2025.11.30, 02:51:56
In my opinion some of the TPUs are real and some are fake. If you focus on a fake TPU, you will get nowhere. That's why I tried to see which ones are possibly real.
I'm not wasting my time on fakes. You guys can believe what you want. SM was a very smart but tricky guy.
It is possible to fake the demo with fat lamps like you have described.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.11.30, 08:48:44
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54951)
Additionally, I can confirm that when two pairs of windings are arranged and connected in that manner and they are energized by 2-phase sinusoidal AC current (90º out of phase) then a uniformly rotating magnetic field is generated.
Is it possible to create a rotating field with two phases? The direction of rotation will be arbitrary. At least three are needed.
Quote from: chief kolbacict on 2025.11.30, 15:46:21
Is it possible to create a rotating field with two phases? The direction of rotation will be arbitrary.
No, because 90° phase shift is distinct from a 270° phase shift.
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54981)
This does not matter for a squirrel cage rotor in an induction motor, though.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.11.30, 21:23:47
I'm leaning with the Chief. With only 2 sets of coils, i cannot see the field rotating no matter what phase degree applied.
for example, what direction of rotation does your example go in the coil example shown??? clockwise? counterclockwise? :-\
Clockwise.
I'm leaning with the Chief. With only 2 sets of coils, I cannot see the field rotating no matter what phase degree applied.
for example, what direction of rotation does your example go in the coil example shown??? clockwise? counterclockwise? :-\
If it were only 2 windings, not 4, rotation still couldn't be had. Chief is correct, 3 would be needed with 3 phases of input.
I've been working with. brushless motors for e-bikes for over 20yrs. 3phase even 7phase. Not seeing your logic.
mags
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.11.30, 00:24:20
Do you see the two terminals of that winding which I have marked with two red lines below ?
Do you see the air gap between these terminals as he moves the device around ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54943)
This screenshot was taken from the video at 10:07 (https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?t=606), which you have posted above.
i dont think this is confirmation of a gap between terminals.
'looks' more like reflection by the wires insulation, just like the reflection on the turns of the winding. looks like that end of the winding you have marked is the last turn over the top of the core, from the winding, over the top from the outer dia to the inner dia then bent up, thus having similar reflection as we see on the winding.
mags
the square protruding into the top ring.. are there 4 of these and 4 separate windings on the bottom ring?
if so, then i have some educated guesses as to a few things im seeing....
i would say that the rings are cores and the squares are also cores with windings wound on them. the top core is just a pathway for the tops of the square cores to complete the magnetic circuit on the top end.
if opposite windings, the yellow to yellow and grey to gray, on the bottom core are in series or parallel, im leaning series, then the 2 sets of windings are driven so that where the ends of the yellow and grey meet are in phase magnetically at the square cores, now we have an actual transformer. the lower core windings are the primary and the square cores are the secondary with the upper core ring as the path for flux between the tops of the square cores.
mags
and what would be an advatage of this transformer configuration? each secondary is being induced from 2 sides. each square core winding is being hit by 2 opposite sides. like romeros motor, the upper and lower coils are in series but each is getting flux induced by the same magnet via the magnets opposite poles, where as the coils are wired accordingly to provide output. similarly with romeros driver coils, they add up to 2 drivers, one for the top and one for the bottom of the driven magnet.
same as speakers. 1 speaker for example say 100w produces 100db, now ad another speaker, 50w each, still 100w in tot, we get 103db out. 4 speakers, 25w each, 106db out, still only 100w in.
mags
mags
and if the orange sec coils are in series, may be a possible 9db eff increase if the speaker analogy applies.
mags
as for the application of the flat square magnets, if the primaries are pulsed, then it would have some effect, if one knows about magnet biased pwm inductors and transformers.
mags
finally, if the ring cores are iron, solid, then that is the overheating problem, which can be corrected.
mags
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.11.30, 00:24:20
Do you see the two terminals of that winding which I have marked with two red lines below ?
Do you see the air gap between these terminals as he moves the device around ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54943)
This screenshot was taken from the video at 10:07 (https://youtu.be/cRJHtl6LyP4?t=606), which you have posted above.
I believe that's standard lamp cord from the looks of it. Bifilar of course.
Quote from: bte on 2025.12.01, 03:09:43
I believe that's standard lamp cord from the looks of it. Bifilar of course.
honestly, i cant be sure. not enough to say i believe....
to say it is bifilar is possible. with so few turns, even if all of those windings we see are in series, the freq of resonance would be way high for. a transformer/inductor with such, lets say, not so tight core configuration in my opinion.
now, maybe there could be an effect involving bucking that may enhance the bifilars effect. we see many examples of ideas that suggest setups that the resonant ring gains amplitude on its own once started, holy grail, but none that describe really how to... only diagrams that show this resonant gain in amplitude in graphs. i havnt been able to acomplish that, but have seen these subtle claims for many years now.
if the gain funtion was discovered in an audio amp power transformer(incorrectly wound at factory) or something that involved a crt yolk, then id have to say that bifilar was not a gain function ingredient. if it was something to do with speakers, quadraphonic development, maybe there were voice coils that were experimentally wound bifilar and some effect was found there, but all dual voice coils ive seen were 2 layers, not bifi as we know them.
if it was something to do with quadraphonic developement that brought on the idea, id have to say there was a gain seen in the audio output where the sound waves combined in space, similar or exactly the way i described a gain function by multiplying the number of drivers and sticking with the same power input for each multiple test. i see no speakers here, so maybe he had wisdom to apply this to a solidstate configuration.
either way, i believe the many ideas of how the tpu worked over all these years were way off base and way over complicated, either on purpose 8), or just wishfull thinking...
im in the belief as of now it is all just much simpler. if you look at my 3d representation again, imagine the lower ring windings set up for a bucking configuration. all of them driven at once via pulse. those bucking sections of that lower ring have a path back through the square cores and the upper ring. this example of the tpu we are looking at is the only one that shows the most. the other tpus, larger ones, the same configuration is most likely hidden within all the black tape and maybe shape formers to give one other ideas of whats going on. totally possible.
one thing that has me going with the multiple driver gain theory is the fact that there are 4 separate windings on the bottom ring, not just 1 or even 2, but 4. if there were another gain functtion other than multiple drivers, then it should be capable to be done with 1 or 2. i would venture to say that maybe some of the large tpus had possibly 8 or even 16 sections. needs to be an even number to gave a buck at the ends of every lower ring winding. even thought why not similar windings on the top ring, but that would ruin the mag field affect on the square core windings. ive put a lot of thought into this the last few days. im thinking this is it. and it is much simpler and more easy to understand than the many configurations i have encountered over the years.
for now, ill let that sink in a bit...
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.11.30, 21:23:47
I've been working with brushless motors for e-bikes for over 20yrs. 3phase even 7phase.
...Not seeing your logic.
You are projecting your experiences with motors onto a device that is not a motor. Most likely the projection refers to 2 diametrically opposite stator coils/windings connected together and powered by 1-phase AC.
2 coils/windings <> 2-phase AC.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.11.30, 21:23:47
With only 2 sets of coils, I cannot see the field rotating no matter what phase degree applied. If it were only 2 windings, not 4, rotation still couldn't be had.
Below are two contrasting cases of clockwise and counterclockwise rotations caused by 2-phase inputs with different phase shifts between them (90° and 270°).
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54981)
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54983)
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=55256)
If these animations don't cause you to see the logic, then I don't think more words will help.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.01, 23:03:06
Clockwise.
You are projecting your experiences with motors onto a device that is not a motor. Most likely the projection refers to 2 diametrically opposite stator coils/windings connected together and powered by 1-phase AC.
2 coils/windings <> 2-phase AC.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.01, 23:03:06
Below are two contrasting cases of clockwise and counterclockwise rotations caused by two-phase inputs with different phase shifts between them (90° and 270°).
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54981)
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4525.0;attach=54983)
If these two animations don't cause you to see the logic, then I don't think more words will help.
ok. say that those coils, as i show, yellow and green were 4 independent, individually colored coils, can you show how you would drive them, series, parallel, even individually driven or individually driven pairs, in order to get a smooth rotating magnetic field? please show that. and im not an ether guy. ^-^ see, cant even spell it or i would be. ^-^ being you are only showing 2 out of phase inputs, then it could only be driven in pairs, not individually. that i need to see...
then once that is revealed to work as you imply, what do you do with that? where is the gain function in that? if driven as you contemplate, where does your output come from? and if what you say works as you claim to understand it to, what makes that better than just rotating a magnet? input is required for each. just saying that im not in on the rotating field that some have suggested over the years. how it could do any good in producing any gain has never been explained. if it can be done as you say, then at the least there would only be larger exibitions of dense flux between the windings, then 'maybe' stretching wider and weaker density exhibitions as 'the' rotation happens. other wise a see just repeatedly squeezing a bloob as far as field be seen as.
anyway, im interested. how is it wired and driven to get an even rotating field with the 4 coils, bifilar, whatever, and then explain how that gives us an output with gain function described. then im in.
magluvin is the name. magnets are my game. ;)
mags
having what i have, this is what im going to build with. core halves that mate very flush that i took from induction driven fluorescent doughnut bulbs. literally power induced into the inards of the glass tube. anyway, ill easily wind 2 halves then bind the halves together and thread in the other 2 windings. still working on what for the 4 secondary winding cores. going for a pulse driven input to the yellow and green windings wired in series to buck fields.
the red winding on the half core is not what im going to use. was the begining of another project of just some test ideas, but this stands more important for now. so ill go for 10 turns each green and yellow, and 30 turns each for the secondary orange cores, in series for 10v in, 120v out. lol. just silly aint it? C.C. yeah... ^-^ silly.
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 01:23:26
... and if what you say works as you claim to understand it to, what makes that better than just rotating a magnet?
It doesn't and I do not know how the TPU works.
I was just confirming two points (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117625#msg117625) of the analysis made by the author of that document (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117613#msg117613) and I explicitly stated that it does not mean that I subscribe to the remainder of his analysis.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.11.30, 08:48:44
I do not know. I was just pointing out the winding topology as seen on these screenshots.
This does not mean that I subscribe to the other points of Razvan Niculae's analysis like his terminal connection diagram nor his proposed gain mechanism.
However, this motor with two 90 coils, always spin to single side. I don't know why.
Quote from: chief kolbacict on 2025.12.02, 09:08:38
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=54995)
However, this motor with two 90 coils, always spin to single side. I don't know why.
Most likely because the white box shifts the two phases by 90º wrt one another.
The magnetic fields generated by the orthogonal pairs of coils sum vectorially like this:
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1541.0;attach=10529)
Notice that the B-field Vector Sum has no problems achieving angles like 45º or 135º, despite that the coils are arranged only orthogonally and driven in pairs.
Full explanation would involve making a magnetostatic animation to visualise the evolving magnetic flux. I am not on a device that can support an EM simulator now. Maybe ask Itsu - I think he is near a device with a suitable simulator.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.02, 09:24:41
Most likely because the white box shifts the two phases by 90º wrt one another.
That's right. Exactly. It is a capacitor connected in series with one pair of coils. Between the stator and the squirrel-cage rotor there is a thin steel ring.
For some reason, the engine always starts rotating in one direction, and never the other. Could this ring be the cause?
Yes, but the fields induced in the rotor are a different issue than the field geometries generated by the stator lest you conflate the interacting fields between the stator and rotor with the fields generated by the stator alone.
The TPU does not have a rotor.
EDIT: I have modified this post to prevent flame wars in a hope such things will not happen again...
Gyula
Well then just delete the whole thread. your saying that the 2 phase shifted inputs would make a rotating field with the 4 windings shown on the bottom ring, but that is just an unproven theory, correct????
you are playing god here and not a fair one. you brought up the pet theory thing and any response to it gets the boot because most likely it was just balony.
now everyone has to walk on eggshells here or fear to post as deletion by a biased judge is sure to come.
but i guess your the boss now, i guess. do as you will. ive said enough here. i quit.
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 20:22:07
well then just delete the whole thread. your saying that the 2 phase shifted inputs would make a rotating field with the 4 windings shown on the botom ring, but that is just an unproven theory, correct????
you are playing god here and not a fair one. you brought up the pet theory thing and any response to it gets the boot because most likely it was just balony.
now everyone has to walk on eggshells here or fear to post as deletion by a biased judge is sure to come.
but i guess your the boss now, i guess. do as you will. ive said enough here. i quit.
mags
Mags, Have you read the thread in my bench, Large signal reciever, I explain the 2 phase rotation and I have built a number of rotating fields and there is a schematic in there to build your own and I show how to connect the windings together for rotation. All talked about over the years, please do a little research before whining.
Room3327
Quote from: Room3327 on 2025.12.02, 20:46:54
Mags, Have you read the thread in my bench, Large signal reciever, I explain the 2 phase rotation and I have built a number of rotating fields and there is a schematic in there to build your own and I show how to connect the windings together for rotation. All talked about over the years, please do a little research before whining.
Room3327
here is a quote from your thread in a screenshot. seems you and ac concure that it is not a true rotating field being had, 'specifically 2 phase as you say above here'... i havnt even built it and knew the answer as i have been saying here in this thread. furthermore nothing had ever come of it as i read in your thread. time for new thinking. i think i have brought that. completely different than anyone has posed before. simple to understand also.
mags
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.02, 18:18:43
Hi Gyula,
Quote from: gyula on 2025.12.02, 16:13:13
I hope this post will not get deleted.
And I hope that you delete it yourself as it does not help to further research on the TPU and leads to no good.
Verpies, I agree. With my post above I did not want any quarrel either. I objected the way the posts got deleted without a word.
Done.
Gyula
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 21:16:51
here is a quote from your thread in a screenshot. seems you and ac concure that it is not a true rotating field being had, 'specifically 2 phase as you say above here'... i havnt even built it and knew the answer as i have been saying here in this thread. furthermore nothing had ever come of it as i read in your thread. time for new thinking. i think i have brought that. completely different than anyone has posed before. simple to understand also.
mags
Hi Mags, No argument here, so what are you meaning when you say a true rotating magnetic field, as far as I know a magnetic field does not rotate as in the faraday disk sense, I thought everyone concurs the field itself does not rotate but is stationary, the only way I know of to create a rotating magnetic field is to set it up, as in several coils, electronics etc. With a 2 phase rotating field using 4 coils it travels around like a bar magnet. Each cycle the field makes one complete revolution which is handy for speed, to increase rotation you just increase frequency and RPM goes up. Millions of RPM can be reached, but you probably know this already. So what do you mean when you say a true rotating magnetic field?
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.02, 08:59:19
It doesn't and I do not know how the TPU works.
I was just confirming two points (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117625#msg117625) of the analysis made by the author of that document (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117613#msg117613) and I explicitly stated that it does not mean that I subscribe to the remainder of his analysis.
ok. im just replying to a few posts where i believe i have a right to do so....
nobody knows how the tpu works that i know of. to the limits of 'my' history in ou research, i know nobody. but there may be some.
the issue i have is that if i hadnt interjected that the 2 phase cannot work to make a rotating magnetic field after you presented you could as fact, read it again, then it would have been left here on these pages as fact and lets move on. i say no to that, if i can. and my arguments have finally boiled it down to your post above in quote. so now we know. was not a fact and beleivers who think it was fact and still do, well then let them have at it and prove it. i knew the outcome in my head. most here may think mags is an amature wannabe wizkid. my experience in this field, electronics, mechaninics and magnetics is beyond where i used to be since my last yt posts.
in an earlier post, you implied that knowing about ebike bldc motors is not enough to understand what were looking at here. hmm
3 phase. has asymmetrical number of magnets vs stator coils. uses hall sensors to time stator coils switching, but there are new controllers that now prepulse the stators to find timing position of the magnets, initially to figure out which direction of rotoation needs to go, which would be forward. genius stuff.
7 phase, 7 stator series connected pairs, 16 magnet rotor all optical timing. a genius ebrake system that sent genrated current back to the battery pack and a charge controller would sequentially sent that ebrake charge to 1/3 of the battery pack at a time. 36v pack. a motor that would have to be rotating faster than max driven to produce higher than 36v to be effective. so sending that generated ebraking currents to 12v portions of the 36v pack is very effective. 30 nimh d cells in series, 50amp continuous output, 100amps peak.
magnetics? my yt ch should show a lot of experiments that over those years. i was an amature to begin with, but then i progressed. since then even further.
like room hitting me up that i should stop whining and do some research. well son, i have. and i think you should reread your own thread before sending me there to prove you wrong. i saw zero examples of a real life rotating field presented. i would have though i might see some iron filings showing a rotating field or something. even a compass needle wouldnt rotate in that situation.
anyway, i have responded to several post in one post. i should have the right to do so. i havnt called anyone a name or used curse words nor have i brought God into it. so hopefully the post remains and others get to read it, as it should be.
mags
Quote from: Room3327 on 2025.12.02, 21:34:03
Hi Mags, No argument here, so what are you meaning when you say a true rotating magnetic field, as far as I know a magnetic field does not rotate as in the faraday disk sense, I thought everyone concurs the field itself does not rotate but is stationary, the only way I know of to create a rotating magnetic field is to set it up, as in several coils, electronics etc. With a 2 phase rotating field using 4 coils it travels around like a bar magnet. Each cycle the field makes one complete revolution which is handy for speed, to increase rotation you just increase frequency and RPM goes up. Millions of RPM can be reached, but you probably know this already. So what do you mean when you say a true rotating magnetic field?
hey room.
what im thinking is, by an interpretation of 'rotating magnetic field' is just that. i agree with the need for individually driven windings and many in order to produce the desired effect, so, you already know what i mean. O0
say we have an armature from a standard dc motor. make it vertical axis and rotate the brushes instead. that would be a perfect example of a true rotating field. or as you say, drive the individual windings electronically. you should have a pretty nice, smooth looking rotating field around that stationary armature. so beyond that, how do we use that to get ou? like i said earlier, this top and bottom ring tpu example, if it worked, has the most clues of all. if it had a suggested rotating field, assuming that the only windings are the 4 on the bottom, that we can actually see, then the only way i see that is to drive the windings individually, sequentially, whether it be pulsed or ac driven in a manor that still only, as ac had said in the post from your thread, wouldnt be an actual rotating of the field but more of a shifting from here to there, but what happend between here and there is not the same as an actual rotation.
im not saying that my theory, of which IS yet unproven, is the answer. but it is fresh. only within the last week it has come to mind and is making more sense to me as i go. but, here is where unproven theories should be presented, tested and laid to rest once proven wrong, or upheld as fact once proven right. but its not just the man with the theory that has to prove his argument, it will take others to prove it wrong also in order to put it to rest.
as i said before, im not seeing the rotating field idea having any key to gains of any sort. my example of seeing gains in multiplying the number of speaker drivers using the same tot power input for each test and increasing 3db output for each doubling of drivers should have the hairs on the back of everyones neck arise. if sm was into audio, working with quadraphonic developements, its very possible he was on to that gain function. recovering that gain via sound wave energy can be tricky. as i said earlier, if sm had the wisdom to convert the gain function in solid state form, this could be it. im giving it a simple shot with what i have and see. if the top and bottom rings were iron, i can see the creative, intuitive thought of the circular bulges around the 4 squares, which i assume are rectangle cores, to make a better magnetic circuit between the cores and the rings. the 4 cores being wound with secondary receivers, pulsing the 4 ring windings in bucking config hits up both sides of the secondaries, adding up to the secondaries being driven by 2 drivers. 3db increase per say to the analogy of the speakers.
the turning the thing upside down and the possibility that the earths field affected it or gravity doesnt jive with me. id think that somebody over all these years with experiments would have encountered such effects. as strong as the earths field is, as i know it is, im not seeing that happening here with those fat few turn windings. dunno. my opinion. for now i stand on that.
mags
e
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 20:22:07
Your saying that the 2 phase shifted inputs would make a rotating field with the 4 windings shown on the bottom ring, but that is just an unproven theory, correct????
Incorrect. That is not my theory and it is not a theory at all. The phenomenon of rotation from 2-phase inputs in quadrature has been proven mathematically and physically by many engineers and scientists and now is in the realm of facts.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 22:21:48
in an earlier post, you implied that knowing about ebike bldc motors is not enough to understand what were looking at here. hmm
I did not use the word "enough". More like overapplying your practical experience with BLAC motors to the TPU and RMFs. e-Bike motors have rotors with physics of their own - the TPU does not.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 22:21:48
the issue i have is that if i hadnt interjected that the 2 phase cannot work to make a rotating magnetic field after you presented you could as fact, read it again, then it would have been left here on these pages as fact and lets move on. i say no to that, if i can. and my arguments have finally boiled it down to your post above in quote.
You have not provided any technical arguments that refute my following statement:
Quote from: Verpies
two pairs of windings are arranged and connected in that manner and they are energized by 2-phase sinusoidal AC current (90º out of phase) then a uniformly rotating magnetic field is generated.
I on the other hand, provided 3 technical animations that support that statement with technical descriptions involving the vector addition (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117652#msg117652) of the individual B-fields.
Chief Kolbacist has shown you a photo of a working motor with two pairs of coils:
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=54995)
If you wait, I will show you empirical proof too, where two pairs of coils create a rotating magnetic field to spin up a pole-less ferromagnetic projectile (a sawed off nail) for my nephew's coil-gun, so it does not tumble in flight.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.02, 22:21:48
so now we know. was not a fact
Did you come to that conclusion by ignoring my arguments ?
...and Chief's ?
Quote from: Room3327 on 2025.12.02, 21:34:03
...so what are you meaning when you say a true rotating magnetic field,
That's a good question for you Mags.
Do you think that rotating magnetic fields do not exist at all or that they do but are real only if they are generated by mechanically moving sources ?
If it is the latter than show me one experiment where a rotating magnetic field generated by mechanically moving sources is distiguishible from RMFs generated by stationary sources (the experiment did not have to performed by you).
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.02, 23:27:30
Incorrect. That is not my theory and it is not a theory at all. The phenomenon of rotation from 2-phase inputs in quadrature has been proven mathematically and physically by many engineers and scientists and now is in the realm of facts.
well then id like to see that. the only rotation i can see is some sequential driving of the 4 windings presented in the video being discussed as of late. and that would be a broken circle of rotation in 4 parts. now, if we can see any evidence that the bottom ring had any windings on it before the thick supposed speaker wire was wound on that in 4 sections, similar to the tesla pat depiction, then id lean into looking at that. we have to agree that it doesnt seem to be the case here. maybe.
the 4 squares, i once saw a pic pointing to one and was said to be a capacitor. strange for one to say it even looked like a cap, to me anyway. i lean heavily on that they were ferite cores. having caps there or cores should probably rule out the idea of an underlying winding on the bottom ring, that protrude through that ring. would seem a quite odd situation.
im looking at having some iron rings made that emulate what we see in that particular tpu. with no actual measurements, it wont be exact. nobody could do that. looks like could be 1/4in thick. will have to obtain some cores first to work out the dimentions of the rings and bulges around the core ends to and bottom. thought of round instead, but the difference should be apparent when considering having the windings flat and straight on each side of the cores would be more receiving of the fields inducing them on either side. thinking
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 00:10:33
well then id like to see that.
Why isn't Chief's photo enough ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=54995)
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 00:10:33
...and that would be a broken circle of rotation in 4 parts.
Why would you think that ?
Is it because you think that these windings must be energized all or nothing ?
It is the only situation in which the rotation of the field would consist of 4 steps (broken into 4 parts).
However, if the windings are energized by an analog current then the number of field's angular positions is infinite because of continuous vector addition (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=403.msg117652#msg117652).
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.03, 00:18:40
Why isn't Chief's photo enough ?
(https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=403.0;attach=54995)
Why would you think that ?
Is it because you think that these windings must be energized all or nothing ?
It is the only situation in which the rotation of the field would consist of 4 steps (broken into segments).
ok
what is the arrangement of the armature? if the 2 opposite stators are driven out of phase, would that be an actual rotation or shifting of the field?
didnt you say to me that i was projecting experiences with motors into a device which is not a motor?? are you now doing the same??
mags
I'll add my 2 cents, take it o leave it.
I have build dozens of rotating field devices. 2 phase with 2 coils alone will work IF you use both sides of both coils. One such configuration what absolutely causes rotation is attached. (although the reluctance path between the coils will cause stronger spots than others).
If only one side of the coils are used, then usually 4 coils are needed so you not only get 0,90 , But the same phases can be used on the other 2 coils for 180,270 to complete the 360 rotation.
The special thing of rotation is - If done right, the output "CAN" be decoupled from the input. Meaning the input does not scale linearly with output. I can explain this all in my way, but it's long winded. And many ways to create this rotation do not result in complete decoupling. I believe the 90 degree phases CAN decouple if the geometry and setup is right.
BUT this alone does not produce Overunity. In fact, the output of a virtually rotating field is usually horrible. That brings us to the next piece..
If the input coil is decoupled and there is no physical rotor to oppose - then Lenz Law is not fulfilled. Contrary to most understandings, Lenz Drag is not a negative manifestation of power output. Lenz Drag is actually WHY the large output power in a generator DOES manifest.
So a virtual rotating field alone will not produce a large output unless the output magnetic field is opposed. An induced coil with no opposition becomes a choke. And you know what happens in a choke, the reactance is not squashed. hence the output coil produces minimal output.
To understand this, picture yourself hanging in the air trying to walk. You will jiggle around a little, but you have no solid ground to push off of, so you don't really move much. In order to actually move with real force, you MUST push off something solid (your foot's action must be opposed).
Back to the rotating field, this "Opposition" also has to be isolated from the primary rotating field.
I have been working on this a while now, how to geometrically arrange a decoupled rotating field that also fulfills Lenz, while NOT allowing the opposition coil to be induced by the rotating field.
I've tried dozens of ways and discovered many ways that don't work and my reasoning why it doesn't work. And I am in the process of trying a new way.
hey flood
the tpu we are looking at has 4 coils, 4 quadrants, with the ends of the windings on the bottom ring as shown below. there is considerable spacing between coil poles. if the ring is magnetic or not, can you see a rotating field happening in this situation?
mags
looking at more shots of the tpu we are looking at, im now only seeing maybe 2 square cores opposite one another. in the other 2 corners of the rings i see what looks like a tan tubular component with radial axis, top and bottom in and out, and the other with a more small wall transformer look to it.
still looking
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 01:40:09
hey flood
the tpu we are looking at has 4 coils, 4 quadrants, with the ends of the windings on the bottom ring as shown below. there is considerable spacing between coil poles. if the ring is magnetic or not, can you see a rotating field happening in this situation?
mags
I believe YES, but not uniform smooth rotation throughout. But I think it can create almost perfect magnetic rotation if we only look at the 4 equal points within that structure.
My methods to truly know if a magnetic field is rotating (and how smooth), I hook up 1 scope channel on a control phase running at the same frequency. Then use an output coil so slowly move around the rotating field while watching the phase shifts. If the output coil's phase slowly and meticulously shifts from 0 through the spectrum back to zero while moving - compared to the control phase, it is indeed rotating. This also shows you the hot magnetic hot spots, etc. A perfectly rotating field will have equal potential shifting sine as you move it around the ring.
Here are some pictures showing how high energy pulses [CFL], thru a bifilar coil can light a CFL
[CFL2].
You could use lamp cord wire, the wires have to be close to each other. It is possible that the TPU generates large current pulses during its operation and this is how you could change this to a usable form. In a video SM uses a clamp-on meter to wrongly measure the current from the large TPU - he puts the clamp-meter on top of the TPU, across the gap. Could it be that is a coil in a circle where the poles ends meet at the gap?
In this picture you see the meter SM used, react to a magnet near its center. It would also react if it were a pulsing magnetic field. The changing reading in the video indicates a magnetic field varying in strength vs a static field from a permanent magnet.
Yes!
How did the trial of Dr. Holocomb end?
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 00:35:16
what is the arrangement of the armature?
In Chief's motor, a pair of stator coils consists of 2 coils diametrically opposite coils connected in series. Uniformly RMF occurs when perpendicular pairs of coils are driven with two sinusoidal currents 90° or 270° out of phase.
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 00:35:16
Didnt you say to me that i was projecting experiences with motors into a device which is not a motor?? are you now doing the same??
Yes, because that is the only way I can find some common language with you.
You seem unable to conceptualize rotating fields outside of motors, as if RMFs were virtual/unreal/without consequences, meaning and properties unless they cause the rotation of a ponderable ferromagnetic rotor (...iron filings included).
Mags,
You seek a video demo of a rotating field using a toroid- Here is one I made that undoubtablely shows a virtual rotating field that is very responsive to a compass.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mD3sZdVnIrs
A rotating magnetic field can be created with any combination of phases that equals 360. As for the case of 0 and 90, you also have to use the mirror phases 180 / 270 , meaning both sides of the 2 coils OR 4 coils.
Also a rotating field can either be designed so the flux rotates outside the core OR inside the core. Using polyphase usually results in the field rotating outside the core.
Quote from: floodrod on 2025.12.03, 12:17:51
You seek a video demo of a rotating field using a toroid- Here is one I made that undoubtablely shows a virtual rotating field that is very responsive to a compass.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mD3sZdVnIrs
Thank you for that video, but it's likely that Mags is going to reply that this is nothing unusual with 36 coils (probably not even connected as 18 diametrically opposite pairs in series) but with 4 coils (connected as 2 diametrically opposite pairs in series) it:
- would not work, or
- would work stepwise, or
- the direction of rotation would be nondeterministic.
Guys,
I have moved the "Lenz Drag" discussion to the thread "I Got a Speedup Effect (https://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=4810.msg117689#msg117689)". It did not belong in this TPU thread.
Quote from: Verpies on 2025.12.03, 20:13:39
Thank you for that video, but it's likely that Mags is going to reply that this is nothing unusual with 36 coils (probably not even connected as 18 diametrically opposite pairs in series) but with 4 coils (connected as 2 diametrically opposite pairs in series) it:
- would not work, or
- would work stepwise, or
- the direction of rotation would be nondeterministic.
first off, thanks for the continued belittlement of me. thats you i guess.
maybe you dont really read my posts. my earlier suggestion of a standard dc armature that is stationary and just rotate the brushes would be a nice example of field rotation. but that is in the wind now i suppose.
being that flood has done many experiments with rotating fields and claims no evidence of any gains, ill ride with him on that. so you keep rotating your fields and ill keep on with what im contemplating. the rotation of the field this way is nothing more than an emulated spinning magnet. thats all you got.
magluvin
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 20:43:03
hey flood.
that vid is a perfect example of what i explained earlier. beautiful representation. but, with the coil setup of the tpu bottom ring coils cannot accomplish that. the arrangement of where the poles of the windings with only 2 phased inputs cannot even drive that motor presented earlier. that motor is an altered example that i cannot accept in this case of the tpu windings. that is my arguement.
i had to recover this post from your thread and cut the half out that reffered to verp. i dont like this bs with moving posts between threads. he started the super conducting crap in the first place. should have known better then.
in my reply above, that was posted before verp posted what i quoted above. thats where it should have stayed. im just stating this to have continuity of context showing i did like your presentation before he belittled me. down right bs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-nAh9TMM30
Folks
3-Phase Vector Simulation
Could not find a similar one for 4-Coils
https://www.geogebra.org/m/mszjnmkz (https://www.geogebra.org/m/mszjnmkz)
mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.12.03, 22:35:29
Folks
3-Phase Vector Simulation
Could not find a similar one for 4-Coils
https://www.geogebra.org/m/mszjnmkz (https://www.geogebra.org/m/mszjnmkz)
mike(ger)
thanks for that. im done with rotating field here. im on another path. have been and i believe the rotating field is a distraction.
mags
Quote from: Magluvin on 2025.12.03, 20:43:03
hey flood.
that vid is a perfect example of what i explained earlier. beautiful representation. but, with the coil setup of the tpu bottom ring coils cannot accomplish that. the arrangement of where the poles of the windings with only 2 phased inputs cannot even drive that motor presented earlier. that motor is an altered example that i cannot accept in this case of the tpu windings. that is my arguement.
i had to recover this post from your thread and cut the half out that reffered to verp. i dont like this bs with moving posts between threads. he started the super conducting crap in the first place. should have known better then.
in my reply above, that was posted before verp posted what i quoted above. thats where it should have stayed. im just stating this to have continuity of context showing i did like your presentation before he belittled me. down right bs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-nAh9TMM30
mags
I am not clear on what motor you were trying to drive and how you were tryiong to drive it. I have not attempted to decode the TPU so I do not want to redirect the flow of the convo. But I have studied and built many rotating field devices, which related to your questions.
The problem with 2 phase rotating field (or any rotating field in general) --> when used to induce output it fails to deliver impressive results because the lack of magnetic opposing force against the output field. The output coil has nothing (or very little) to push off of.
Think of a choke.. When driven by AC, the coil has no other field to oppose so it makes it extremely reactive which impedes the pipeline. This is exactly what happens when we induce a coil with a virtual rotating field. The output coil has nothing to oppose, so the output power is trivial at best.
I personally think it is solvable by instituting a shorted coil somehow into the setup which it's only purpose is to oppose the output coil. We basically give the output coil 2 roles, not only is it an output coil, but it also takes the role of a primary which induces the shorted coil. But it has to be done in such a way what the shorted coil remains blind to the primary fields rotating flux.
The geometry to make this work remains elusive to me as of yet. But I have a new idea I started to build out which I have hope accomplishes it..
Regarding your toroid pic, your coil setup may do it, but as I see, the primary rotating field would need to be 4 pole virtual rotation and only have 2 output coils connecting to the upper ring. The 2 output coils should be induced with the same polarity on the same phase. They should then oppose each other through the top ring and scalable output may be possible.
But if the output coils are induced with different polarities at the same time, the flux of the outputs are not opposed and the output will suck. 2 properly opposed output coils will produce MUCH MORE energy than 10 non-opposed chokes.
the motor doesnt matter to me really. to me the rotating field in that thread is a null point in my case. dont worry about that.
sorry this all got posted here...
mags
I agree with Mags that a rotating magnetic field (RMF) is not worth considering as a torque generator in the TPU because the TPU does not have a rotor that could be affected by such torque.
However unipolar RMF is worth considering for other reasons, because it separates charged particles of different polarity. Like a Lorentz fan...
RMF also affects the precession of some nuclei.
Hello Folks,
I continued my research and found this here from a pastor Bruce who had a youtube-channel TPUBruce which does not exist any longer.
In the archive there is just the first Video left which works, he had a series of 7 in the section "TPU Theory Videos"
https://web.archive.org/web/20160315111024/http://tpupower.net/tpu-theory-videos.php (https://web.archive.org/web/20160315111024/http://tpupower.net/tpu-theory-videos.php)
Now this guy has a new channel with just one TPU-related video here (sound-volume is very low)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pux_QHARA5Y (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pux_QHARA5Y)
He is describes the perpendiculat blow-out along high-current inrush into cables as this occured in heavy DC-motors which was experienced by Edison which might cause induction in other cables which are nearby.
Suggestion: Perhaps the moderator could contact this pastor and invite him here to share his insights or reload these 7 parts on his new channel ?
I remember very long time ago a report with detailed pictures on this phaenomenon but am unable to find it
mike(ger)
Quote from: Kator01 on 2025.12.06, 00:16:03
Hello Folks,
I continued my research and found this here from a pastor Bruce who had a youtube-channel TPUBruce which does not exist any longer.
In the archive there is just the first Video left which works, he had a series of 7 in the section "TPU Theory Videos"
https://web.archive.org/web/20160315111024/http://tpupower.net/tpu-theory-videos.php (https://web.archive.org/web/20160315111024/http://tpupower.net/tpu-theory-videos.php)
Now this guy has a new channel with just one TPU-related video here (sound-volume is very low)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pux_QHARA5Y (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pux_QHARA5Y)
He is describes the perpendiculat blow-out along high-current inrush into cables as this occured in heavy DC-motors which was experienced by Edison which might cause induction in other cables which are nearby.
Suggestion: Perhaps the moderator could contact this pastor and invite him here to share his insights or reload these 7 parts on his new channel ?
I remember very long time ago a report with detailed pictures on this phaenomenon but am unable to find it
mike(ger)
Spherics stated that you can reproduce this effect by applying a high voltage over a lower voltage, across a coil. When the lower voltage is around 500v and the upper voltage is around 10kv, you get the tesla stinging rays and cooling breezes. Also, apparently from him, 15khz hurts like hell, like a heating effect. The lower voltage would always be applied to the coil, but isolated via diodes. One of his units used a minimum of 50 volts for the lower level and at least 400 volts above that for the higher level, could produce the same radiant effect.
looks like the runaway situation
inrush current produce radiant energy which induce more current which is used to create bigger inrush current and so on
radiant energy being vibrational wave in Earth field
Kator
I remember every Christmas "Bruce TPU" would come into Stephen's ( overunity.com) and give kind of an update
and I also believe he had a membership group that helped finance his TPU research and builds ?I believe it was a membership group ( like today's patreon) that he shared information with.
I'm not sure where it eventually ended up?
but I will absolutely reach out to him and see if I can get him on the phone and report back.
I'll do that this coming week.( I believe i did speak with him years ago ( maybe a decade or ??
Will be fun to speak with him..
Respectfully
Chet K
Ps
yes I will ask about These 7 videos...( or whatever he can share...and report back here .
@chet, thank you for your effort.
There are two files I attach here, one is the full document starting with a text of SM himself which I have extracted - annoying 8 point
letter size :( - and put this text into the second document SM-TPU-Start-Article.pdf.
In this text SM reports about a deadly accident with a color tv satting that this "had impact on me at that time"
That is the reason I remembered the blow-out-effect and after that found BruceTPUs vid.
https://www.perplexity.ai/search/if-there-is-a-high-current-inr-ZF51wDBlQDOL0qeWL4DkNw?sm=d (https://www.perplexity.ai/search/if-there-is-a-high-current-inr-ZF51wDBlQDOL0qeWL4DkNw?sm=d)
mike(ger)
i remeber hearing some of the things in the second 'start' pdf. but as i read it, things seem a bit outlandish, with the tv exploding..once i had gotten to the last page, it seemed like the person talking was on drugs. jump from this subject to that subject sentences. some of it was intriguing but ill have to read again to see if i buy into it
reading the other one now.
mags