The Lockridge device

Author Topic: The Lockridge device (Read 1277 times)

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #300 on: 2013-01-08, 06:04:03 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Interesting, electrical tape is a dielectric, that is, it does not allow static to pass through it as well as just insulating. It could be that there is a static build up in this device, dare I say radiant?

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #301 on: 2013-01-11, 01:28:15 »

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I have been working on the mechanical pulser. just about have that finished. Need to file off the extra JB weld and fit it to the shaft.

I think I figured out how to do the other 2 brushes to get them on the commutator section next to the other ones. Its going to be a tight fit, but it should work. Have to just move the 2 that are the original ones over 1 section and grind off some of the brush support on all of the holders to get them close enough and narrow up the 2 auxillary brushes to fit on the comm sections. The angle they lay at, next to one another theres onlly room enough to slide a couple peices of paper through. So it is a tight fit. the other 2 brush holders will have to be turned upside down. So hopefully it will work for what we need to test out. will let you know when I get that done.

Hiwater	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #302 on: 2013-01-11, 01:36:20 »
Full Member Posts: 137	Yes that black tape was a puzzler. What i didnt understand was why the feild pole wouldnt charge the coil. So there must be some kind of electricity inside the housing that helps charge those generator coils. I believe there is a lot of radiant energy coming off that armature. Will see what happens when i get those other brushes in.

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #303 on: 2013-01-11, 13:28:13 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Best not to go arround shouting radiant, the scientific community don't really like that term and we also have to prove it. A pic of the brushes would be nice. I might not be n line for a week or so, splitting up with the missis

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #304 on: 2013-01-21, 03:11:35 »

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Sorry to hear about you and the Mrs. Hope the transition goes ok.

Havent got much of anything done in the shop. Just have the one brush In is all. havent got the pulsing unit finished yet either. Ive been doing some research in to the 3rd brush on some of these older generators. Quite interesting how itis used to control the amps in the armature with the cutout. So maybe if time permitting i can try some experiments this week using the 3rd brush. i want to see how it acts under load. Whether or not it willl slow the motor down or not and try adjusting it in different places. So thats all i have for now.

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #305 on: 2013-01-21, 23:40:43 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Keep up the good work, although I believe the armature and brush arrangement is different, we have to eliminate all other possibilities to be sure. I posted the FEMM picture on the lockridge thread but alas no response so it seams we are still alone doing this.

mbrownn

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #306 on: 2013-01-28, 02:53:30 »

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Posts: 246

Update from Pault

Quote

Subject: scope traces

Hi Mike,

I've been out of the loop for a while. Got some time today, but will be out of the loop again for another week or two.

I've attached a scope trace that I think you wanted.

2-pole universal motor, bottom coil disconnected.

Pulsed at about 1000 RPM (16Hz) using 555's, 33% duty cycle and a relay. If I have time, I'll post all of the details to EF tomorrow. Otherwise, when I return in a week or so (remind me :-).

Top trace is across the modified motor. 50V/div.

Middle trace across the 2nd coil (disconnected, acting in transformer mode). 5V/div

Bottom trace is the dual-555 driver circuit hitting a relay, switching 24VDC pulses across the motor (major sparking across the contacts of the relay).

400V spikes on the motor side. 10X less on the 2nd coil side.

I also did scope shots before modifying the motor and not much was different (400V spikes). The results were essentially the same as the top trace. (The 400V spikes are barely visible, but they are there).

pt

Quote

Hi Paul

Interesting, looking at the scope shots I would say you need pulses of no more than half the duration you have, probably 1/3rd. As the motor runs on current we might need current traces. To do this you just place the scope in series by placing a shunt resistor in series with the coil and measure that.

These 400v spikes will be passed into the armature via transformer action and will charge the armature up. This is how we are getting the voltage increase in the armature I believe but it may be that these spikes originate in the armature too.

Keep me updated

Mike

The Lockridge device

photo.JPG (32.29 kB, 320x240 - viewed 41 times.)

Hiwater	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #307 on: 2013-02-01, 00:23:06 »
Full Member Posts: 137	Been away from the project for a while. I believe pault may be right . the armature does charge up.Realy noticeable when removing the power from the motor coils all kinds of sparks on the brushes as it starts to deaccelerate.

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #308 on: 2013-02-01, 00:29:52 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Yes, I believe it will be proportional to the impedance of the load

Slider2732

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #309 on: 2013-02-02, 23:24:09 »

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... .-.. .. -.. . .-.

Just to say, i'm following along (though infrequently) and hope you get to enjoy the new life ahead Mike.
Looking back, my own divorce was such a fantastic thing to do...not to make light of it, but you know where you wish to be and so does she. Raise a glass to a positive change

Not many glasses though, you'd not see the scope readings correctly !

---------------------------

ʎɐqǝ from pɹɐoqʎǝʞ a ʎnq ɹǝʌǝu

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #310 on: 2013-02-03, 23:30:51 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Thanks slider, for the upbeat message, believe me it helps.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #311 on: 2013-02-14, 14:02:09 »

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Its been a while since i had any real time to work on this project. Yesterday i completed the pulsing unit, I started on a while back. what a disaster.

it drew way too much amps and couldnt get any speed out of the motor. So i made another one. i got the speed up but the pulsing unit got hot as could be woth out melting.
I can see that it probably has to be pulsed as many times as you can find out how to do. So the next one is going to be with a regular commutator on the shaft. To see how that works out.

During the mean time, i thought I would connect up a capacitor to the in put to see how it would react. Still using ac and a diodeon the power side.
To my suprise that motor took aff and increased in rpm dramatically. Had to shut it down. So I put in a switch where I can put the capacitor in and
out of the circuit. So I run it again and checked the rpm with and without the capacitor in there is a 3000 rpm gain. It runs at about 5400 rpms. So reduced the input voltage and the running amps came down to 17 compared to 24-29 amps otherwise.
Funny thing is after i run it on the cap and switch it out of the circuit it stays at the same speed and amperage.
This was late yesterday afternoon so i was kind of excited to see this happen. So going to do some more tests today to see how long the rpm stays up and amps stay down. And see what the generator coils do. So will let you know this evening.

mbrownn

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #312 on: 2013-02-14, 23:46:59 »

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Posts: 246

If your using a pulse circuit start at high frequency to limit the amps and then reduce the frequency as you nead.

Where did you put the cap in the circuit? was it my gray circuit you used? I expect a gain in speed and voltage on the gray circuit.

The advantage to commutation is it is self regulating, can handle huge power and does not have a problem with voltage until we get into the kv range

As speed increases the current will come down just as when frequency increases current comes down. We have been told that the lockridge ran at about 6000RPM so we are getting in the range of speed we need.

Try to do a volts/amps reading on the input and output on each test.

Great work

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #313 on: 2013-02-15, 01:54:08 »

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The pusing unit I had made was a mechanical one. I made 3 in all. The one pulse per revolution worked best as was the easiest to make. It does work but i had some flaws in it. so will resume work in that area with another one.

Ok, the g-m set i tested today had all 4 coils in. The one in the last post only had 2 coils in from a stock GM generator and was wired different.

Tests on the one today. Without the capacitor Input 15 volts dc Amps 29 Gen coil out put 124 volts ac
With capacitor had to drop volts back to 10 volts dc ( otherwise motor would overspeed, wants to run over 9000 rpms)
with increase in rpm input volts climb up to 48 volts dc. So i drop the input volts back to about 10 volts dc to get the rpm
down and the amps shoot through the roof over 40 amps. my meter goes offline ,wont register. but the motor runs free
and doent heat very much at all. Also at this time there is nothing coming out of the 2 generator coils. If I remove the cap
then it charges out the gen coils. the cap is connected to the power live wire and to ground.
Ill have to check on each side of the capacitor tomorrow to see what readings i get. We are getting the amps to run this thing with low voltage. That what suprised me. By lowering the voltage the amps increase. I believe thats what we need. At least it an indication of what needs to be done at this
time.
It seems to be running way advanced being no charging effect with use of the capacitor.So the coils will have to moved to compensate for this, then see if it will charge out the gen coils.. Lots of more tests to do. So stick with me.

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #314 on: 2013-02-18, 00:51:50 »
Newbie Posts: 246	I dont know what circuit you are using so i cant help, what is your circuit? Did you take a look at Tinmans rotary transformer? There are many aspects that are exactly the same as what we are doing.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #315 on: 2013-02-18, 14:22:03 »

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Quote from: mbrownn on 2013-02-18, 00:51:50

I dont know what circuit you are using so i cant help, what is your circuit?

Did you take a look at Tinmans rotary transformer?

There are many aspects that are exactly the same as what we are doing.

After your suggestion, I just now looked through tinmans posts. Looks like he doing close to what we are doing. I still think we need 4 coils to accomplish this. Because you need to split the motor drive and the gen side so theres not much bemf when this is under load. In stock generators the big feild poles cover close to 6 slots on each side leaving 1 slot on each side for the neutral on each side in between the feild poles. Total of 14 altogether. The big wide feild poles are a motor generator on one feild pole in a stock gm dc generator. That is why they have to be split in to 2 feild poles each. one for motor and one for the generator and positioning them on the armature. in there perspective quadrants. Two for generating and 2 for motorising. Ive tried many different ways usin the regular feild poles. It just dont work for me that way. besides you will never get the higher voltage out that way.
Unless you try it the way tinman is doing by using 2 different wire sizes. ! for the gen and 1 for the motor circuit. Which might be harder to do. Then you could raise the voltage up quite a bit. But i think that part of the triffilar coil is for. Understanding these armatures is a bit tricky. Because it has to do with magnetic north an the new neutral planes for the motor and generating unit all in one armature case. It took me a long time to get this idea through my head to understand it. The only way that happened was continuoing to work it through to get to where we are today with it.
Yes theres more to do, but we are on the right track. So the process continues. The FUTURE doesnt come easy there is a price to pay its called PRESEREVERENCE.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #316 on: 2013-02-18, 14:38:03 »

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Posts: 137

Im not using any regular circuit. I just tried a capacitor 80 volts 27000 uf cap in the in put side (power side) on the m-g set. It is connected to where the power supply is connected to the m-g and ground. Thats all. Im still using the variable transformer and diode untill i get my other pulsing unit made out of another commutator. Which i have started on.

When using the capacitor it drops the amperage down going to the motor. I reads 6.72-7 amps on the motor side. The capacitor side is 29 amps. The motor speeds up so much that I need to turn the voltage down to reduce the motor rpm. But now the WHATS HAPPENING PART It does not charge out the generator coils untill I switch the capacitor out of the power going to the motor. There must not be any magnetic feild on the armature using the capacitor even though it shows there is 7 amps going to the armature. Will try to work on this more today to figure it out.
Hope this explains it better for you.

mbrownn

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #317 on: 2013-02-18, 23:08:40 »

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If i understand what you have done, you have converted the half wave rectified AC to pure DC. This will eliminate the transformer action and so reduce the output dramatically. With no transformer action you do not require current for the transformer so the amps drop. Try running the device off a battery and I am sure you will get similar results.

We need sharp switching pulsed DC to get what we want, the half wave rectification is the poor mans way of seeing some of the results we can get.

TinMan

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #318 on: 2013-02-19, 03:05:40 »

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Hi Guy's.
Well i have been slowly makeing my way through the thread here,and there is some very interesting reading indeed.

One thing i have found to be a very important factor in this type of setup ,is the direction of the current you draw your load from on the secondary side.
Always remember that if we load the output coils in one direction-it will produce a magnetic field within the core.
If we load the current from the output coils in the other direction-the magnetic field will be the opposite field.

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Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #319 on: 2013-02-19, 14:39:52 »

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Quote from: mbrownn on 2013-02-18, 23:08:40

If i understand what you have done, you have converted the half wave rectified AC to pure DC. This will eliminate the transformer action and so reduce the output dramatically. With no transformer action you do not require current for the transformer so the amps drop. Try running the device off a battery and I am sure you will get similar results.

We need sharp switching pulsed DC to get what we want, the half wave rectification is the poor mans way of seeing some of the results we can get.

That must be whats happening, Still working on the extra commutator for switching. The material the comm sections are made of are hard to solder wires on to. Think I have it figured out now. Thanks for the reply.

mbrownn	Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #320 on: 2013-02-20, 00:36:30 »
Newbie Posts: 246	Yes we need to try this. At this stage I am not ruling anything out hence we are still using a lap wound armature. there is much to learn.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #321 on: 2013-02-26, 15:21:21 »

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Hello MBrownn. I have been working on the pulsing unit attached to an extended shaft on the m-g. I just cant seem to get it to work properly. Oh it works, but not the way i want it to. The motor rpm slows way down and the voltage drops way down.

The best stabalised rpm is 1900-2200 rpm, at that speed about 30 volts.What I was trying to accomplish was get 60 cylce in to the power side to drive the motor and keep the rpms and voltage up. The on-off time has to be just about perfect to keep this action up. In which I havent succeded.
this leads me to believe the switching is done inside the the m-g with the commutator on the armature.-----It works fine like you say with the poor mans way like we have been doing during the testing. The last try was 1 cycle per revolution and was trying to maintain rpm at at least 3000 rpms. Soon as I connect in the pulsing unit the rpm and volts gradually slow down. I did try to align the switching process with the brushes in side the motor. Still same thing.
So then I attached a flywheel to the pully end on the shaft to try to keep the rpms in a forward motion which did help some. But then because of the narrow comm sections wouldt deliver enough rpm right close to 2900 to heep running. So then i put in an armature with wide comm slots wich would bring up the rpm but then the voltage suffered.
So back to square ONE. I then found an old pwm I had which might have worked, but in the process of spinning the motor up the one hot wire grounded out an that burned out in a flash. So Im right back where I started. this is the reason that I believe the switchin is done on the original commutator inside the m-g. Looks like we have to pull that RABBIT out of the hat again. Im going to try and locate another pwm motor controller that may do the job we need. Any suggestions MIKE? Thanks?

\

mbrownn

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #322 on: 2013-02-27, 03:18:13 »

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Yes, I believe that the switching was done with the internal commutator but that requires a wave wound armature. If the EFV14 video is to believed then the PWM circuit never worked for them, OK electronics have advanced so I am sure it can be done that way.

Lets stick to the K.I.S.S. principal, Keep It Simple Stupid hehe. Its time to rewind an armature alternatively you can continue with the lap wound armature and use PWM.

Either way you chose you need to remember this, the higher the frequency, the higher the voltage required. Now with the original device I believe it was the trifilar coil that supplied the voltage but for now you can use the transformer.

TinMan

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #323 on: 2013-02-27, 09:38:29 »

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Quote from: Hiwater on 2013-02-26, 15:21:21

Hello MBrownn. I have been working on the pulsing unit attached to an extended shaft on the m-g. I just cant seem to get it to work properly. Oh it works, but not the way i want it to. The motor rpm slows way down and the voltage drops way down.

The best stabalised rpm is 1900-2200 rpm, at that speed about 30 volts.What I was trying to accomplish was get 60 cylce in to the power side to drive the motor and keep the rpms and voltage up. The on-off time has to be just about perfect to keep this action up. In which I havent succeded.
this leads me to believe the switching is done inside the the m-g with the commutator on the armature.-----It works fine like you say with the poor mans way like we have been doing during the testing. The last try was 1 cycle per revolution and was trying to maintain rpm at at least 3000 rpms. Soon as I connect in the pulsing unit the rpm and volts gradually slow down. I did try to align the switching process with the brushes in side the motor. Still same thing.
So then I attached a flywheel to the pully end on the shaft to try to keep the rpms in a forward motion which did help some. But then because of the narrow comm sections wouldt deliver enough rpm right close to 2900 to heep running. So then i put in an armature with wide comm slots wich would bring up the rpm but then the voltage suffered.
So back to square ONE. I then found an old pwm I had which might have worked, but in the process of spinning the motor up the one hot wire grounded out an that burned out in a flash. So Im right back where I started. this is the reason that I believe the switchin is done on the original commutator inside the m-g. Looks like we have to pull that RABBIT out of the hat again. Im going to try and locate another pwm motor controller that may do the job we need. Any suggestions MIKE? Thanks?

\

Hi Mike
MrBrownn suggested that we could probably help each other out here,as i am in the process of building something quite similar-although i am going more for reversing magnetic field's with mine.

So i thought i would post this link to a PWM that i bought myself.
It is a very good PWM,and has more features than what is listed on the page bellow.
The frequency is also adjustable(even while being used),with a range between 400Hz to 4KHz.
Hope this helps out.
http://www.altronics.com.au/index.asp?area=item&id=K6005

Brad

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Never let your schooling get in the way of your education.

Hiwater

Re: The Lockridge device « Reply #324 on: 2013-02-27, 14:58:01 »

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Quote from: mbrownn on 2013-02-27, 03:18:13

Yes, I believe that the switching was done with the internal commutator but that requires a wave wound armature. If the EFV14 video is to believed then the PWM circuit never worked for them, OK electronics have advanced so I am sure it can be done that way.

Lets stick to the K.I.S.S. principal, Keep It Simple Stupid hehe. Its time to rewind an armature alternatively you can continue with the lap wound armature and use PWM.

Either way you chose you need to remember this, the higher the frequency, the higher the voltage required. Now with the original device I believe it was the trifilar coil that supplied the voltage but for now you can use the transformer.

Thanks for your reply. I cleaned up my shop yesterday. So I can at least walk around in ther now. took all day to get that done. Ill probably try the pwm method first while thinking of rewinding the armature. Theres a motor rewinder about 30 miles from here. Im going to go talk to him one day soon to get some pointers on these armatures. just to pick his brain a little. He may even offer to help rewind it. but for the time being Ill try the pwm and transformer. To see wher that leads us.