Bedini 10-Coil Alternative Discussion

[muDped]

Hi folks!
...
If there was any substance to the claims that pulse-charging a battery with "radiant energy" produced by sudden discharges produced more energy in the battery than was required to generate the pulses then why, oh why, do they need all the contraptions, ferris wheels, battery swappers, complex multiple coils and control electronics?

Why not a simple black box with two leads coming out that you just attach to any partially-charged battery and it takes in some energy and then returns it to the same battery in a pulsed fashion?  If the theory they espouse actually worked, there is no obstacle to building battery chargers that were powered by the very battery they were charging!  Take the root theory at the simplest form and directly implement it.  No Rube Goldberg stuff.
...

Excellent point and questions.

In fact, this sort of "build" is easily and inexpensively accomplished.

Inductive Discharge (flyback) pulses are easily produced
and maximized.  Their restorative effects upon the lead
acid battery are often quite amazing (desulfation.)

The "pushers" at the Forum in Question do tend to "milk it"
for all it's worth as they do their gigs with their sideshows.

Welcome!

[Bits-n-Bytes]

Finally, I found the 'smoking gun' Jeff:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/6516-renaissance-november-workshop-convention-12.html#post117738

This is a direct quote from you:

You got your quote.  So what about your data to back up your claim?

MileHigh

No smoking gun here. No where in here do I say the "Battery Swapper" is OU. I will stand on what I say, that "No one Device will produce OU, but it will take multiple Devices to that". Now Milehigh, you can quote me on this statement. You see, I have just clearly illustrated that you are the one, making your own assumptions and twisting what is really said. You should be a news reporter. You didn't even attend the conference, and I seriously doubt you'll attend the next, but if you want to speak as if you were there, why don't you stop misleading the folks and state that upfront.  I demo'ed the 10 coiler running on its own for the whole conference but I still fail to see the quote you are referencing. You are only comfortable when you can spew out falsehoods on your own assumptions. You have built nothing, yet you speak as if your an expert. Two sides of the street here. Aussie, over at EF it was $10,000.00, now $20,000.00. Once again a lie, even exaggerated. You have no money to spend, else you would of spent it already. Enjoy your DEBATE club. It is clear that NO  devices, OU or OTHERWISE will be invented here by you. Oh ya, almost forgot about the lawn mower statement, were you there to take the measurements of what energy was being recovered to make YOUR claim the lawn mower would eventually run down. More assumptions and spew. I was there, I wired it, I took measurements. Why don't you show up at the next, you might learn something.

[aussieaussieaussie]

Looks like we can add never ending sidestepping to bait & switch.  :

Jeff you spend all day attacking us potential buyers on these forums, why?
Because we asked how you came to your conclusion?
Because we asked how you tested it and what the measurements were?
You are either an idiot or the worse sales rep for bedini co ever!

So whats your answer? "We are not worthy"
Get off your high horse, I only have one word to describe people who know how to make an OU device and are keeping it a secret... A&%HOLE!!!
You should be hanged when we hang bush, cheney & co.

With regard to your comment:
"Aussie, over at EF it was $10,000.00, now $20,000.00. Once again a lie, even exaggerated. You have no money to spend, else you would of spent it already."

Did it ever occur to you that I might have an interested neighbor now?
Did it ever occur to you that I, unlike you, require at least a shred of evidence before spending $5000 on a 'maybe free energy device' thats why I haven't spent it yet.

There are many words to describe you Jeff,

Fraud, Idiot, Victim, Egotist, Lier, Con Artist - We will let history decide.

Or,

Maybe you would like to spend your 'precious' time telling the world about your device and what tests you have conducted that lead you to believe that it is operating OU???

Ozy

[MileHigh]

Jeff:

You are clearly learning the art of deflection and diversion from John Bedini and Rick Friedrich.  You demoed the 10-coiler running on batteries, not running "on it's own."

You have built nothing, yet you speak as if your an expert.

I am more of an expert than you with respect to Bedini motors, that's for sure.  Your statements about subtracting the voltage spike peak voltage from the supply battery voltage was your big downfall Jeff, clearly demonstrating that you are clueless with respect to how the 10-coiler actually works.  You certainly know how to design an intelligent battery swapper, but you are out of your element when it comes to electronics and Bedini motors.

Oh ya, almost forgot about the lawn mower statement, were you there to take the measurements of what energy was being recovered to make YOUR claim the lawn mower would eventually run down. More assumptions and spew. I was there, I wired it, I took measurements.

Yes, I know that the lawn mower will loose total battery energy while it runs even though you were there and you wired it and you took measurements.  Something about the laws of thermodynamics comes into play there.  Did you actually measure the power drain on the source battery bank and the charging power going into the charging battery bank?  I seriously doubt it.  Didn't I read that that project was finished off at the last minute?  Has Rick been puttering around on a converted lawn mower that never needs recharging or is it just sitting in his garage waiting for a recharge so it can be brought out for the next conference?  The whole deal with the lawn mower was nothing more than a cheap stunt.

In looking at your YouTube clips and reading your technical statements I have amassed enough information about you to do a decent job of qualifying you Jeff.  You are fine programming microcontrollers and stuff like that but you are not truly competent it comes to real electronics but sometimes you can wing it.  For you the 10-coiler is just something that you hook your battery swapper up to, you don't really understand the dynamics of how it works.  In some of your YouTube clips you move your pointer around almost aimlessly and make feeble attempts to describe the circuitry.  In my opinion, based on your inability to articulate what you were showing in your clips, most of "your circuits" were just a copy/paste from somewhere else, like a nice fat juicy listing of microcontroller app notes.  You don't really and truly understand electronics, that's clear as a bell to me.

Meanwhile, you have read this thread and you know for sure that I know 10 times more about electronics than you do, but you will never admit that.  You are definitely fully plugged into the "Bedini Zone" Jeff with all the personal comprises that implies.  You have sold out.

MileHigh

[Bits-n-Bytes]

Jeff:

You are clearly learning the art of deflection and diversion from John Bedini and Rick Friedrich.  You demoed the 10-coiler running on batteries, not running "on it's own."

I am more of an expert than you with respect to Bedini motors, that's for sure.  Your statements about subtracting the voltage spike peak voltage from the supply battery voltage was your big downfall Jeff, clearly demonstrating that you are clueless with respect to how the 10-coiler actually works.  You certainly know how to design an intelligent battery swapper, but you are out of your element when it comes to electronics and Bedini motors.

Yes, I know that the lawn mower will loose total battery energy while it runs even though you were there and you wired it and you took measurements.  Something about the laws of thermodynamics comes into play there.  Did you actually measure the power drain on the source battery bank and the charging power going into the charging battery bank?  I seriously doubt it.  Didn't I read that that project was finished off at the last minute?  Has Rick been puttering around on a converted lawn mower that never needs recharging or is it just sitting in his garage waiting for a recharge so it can be brought out for the next conference?  The whole deal with the lawn mower was nothing more than a cheap stunt.

In looking at your YouTube clips and reading your technical statements I have amassed enough information about you to do a decent job of qualifying you Jeff.  You are fine programming microcontrollers and stuff like that but you are not truly competent it comes to real electronics but sometimes you can wing it.  For you the 10-coiler is just something that you hook your battery swapper up to, you don't really understand the dynamics of how it works.  In some of your YouTube clips you move your pointer around almost aimlessly and make feeble attempts to describe the circuitry.  In my opinion, based on your inability to articulate what you were showing in your clips, most of "your circuits" were just a copy/paste from somewhere else, like a nice fat juicy listing of microcontroller app notes.  You don't really and truly understand electronics, that's clear as a bell to me.

Meanwhile, you have read this thread and you know for sure that I know 10 times more about electronics than you do, but you will never admit that.  You are definitely fully plugged into the "Bedini Zone" Jeff with all the personal comprises that implies.  You have sold out.

MileHigh

Have a most enjoyable time on your arm chair.

[MileHigh]

Have a most enjoyable time on your arm chair.

Awesome comeback Jeff!

[Hoppy]

I've built and extensively tested several Bedini devices over the last few years and can confidently say there is no OU to be had. Jeff is unlikely to have any real idea about the performance of his setup because he is probably frightened to run his very expensive setup until it drops, in the fear that his worst fears will be realised. Jeff has been hauled in by JB hook line and sinker, along with many others. Also the more complicated a system is, the harder it is to see the wood from the trees and this is a particular problem for Jeff's setup!

I have an artistic looking Bedini wheel energiser running in my workshop, which I look at from time to time to remind me of the huge amount of hours I have spent building and testing Bedini machines. I had a lot of fun in the process but am now relieved that after all this time I have proved to myself that it is not possible to get OU from batteries charged with systems built with Bedini energisers or other motor /generators . I suggest Jeff carefully studies the 'Puekert Effect' which explains why so many experimenters have been fooled into thinking that their batteries are delivering more energy to a load than was input into their systems.

Hoppy

[humbugger]

In the context of the claims that the rotary mechanical output of the Bedini machines should be counted as part of the OU equation, I agree that this is foolish given an empty shaft without load.  Being a nit-picker for proper terminology, I have heard several mentions of a "pony brake" to measure loaded mechanical shaft power.  

The actual proper name for this is a DeProny Brake.  It's not at all uncommon to see it mis-called; I have, in fact, never seen it given correctly in the various forums...I thought I'd set the record straight.

//http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Prony_brake

It is clear what Jeff has found himself in the middle of.  He now has a significant expectation that he will be able to sell a lot of his battery switchers (which I'm sure work well for what they do) based on his "belief", however unfounded, that the remainder of this complicated system will provide a genuine useful free energy source.  He is, as someone has already mentioned, deeply afraid of actually testing it now that he has invested so much time, money and effort and probably has developed a good amount of future expectation of profits, fame, whatever as well.  Those things are hard to relinquish, and it is very much human nature to find some reasons to dismiss those who keep telling you to do some basic testing before getting too far invested if you are already way too far invested.

It is sad to watch someone doing this...their illogic and arrogance grows the deeper into hot water they swim.  "Belief" becomes the battle-cry, "Insult" the weapon and, in the ensuing battle of ad hominem attacks, all logic and reason is forgotten by the faithful belivers.  And all because they want to prolong their cozy and exciting delusions.  As has been repeatedly suggested, a week or more of very simple "self-running" will cut the BS and end the debate.  But this is the last thing the belivers want!  It would ruin the delusion!  It would show the sad truth that they have, once again, wasted huge resources, both tangible and emotional, on a false belief.  Entirely typical, I'm afraid.

It should be clear to all observers that these tired bitter name-calling insultive arguments put forth by the OU-claiming believers who will not do the basic real-world tests are desperate face-saving efforts looking for any reason to avoid being honest with themselves.  They are seeking  money, fame and glory, not the answers to scientific dilemmas or the world's energy problems.  If they were dedicated to the latter pursuits, it would be easy to admit when they were wrong and pursue a new approach.  They would be eager to do all reasonable tests suggested. This has hardly been the case here.

[MileHigh]

Humbugger and Hoppy::

Humbugger thank you again for the great comments and thanks for the clarification on the DeProny Brake.  Thanks also Hoppy for your comments about your real-world experimenting on Bedini motors.  It backs up my "armchair" perspective.  After watching a few hundred Bedini motor clips I knew that there was no point in me building one for myself.

I just checked on Google and this thread comes up within the first three pages of results if you are searching on "Bedini 10-coil."  I think that it's fair to assume that anyone seriously considering buying a 10-coiler and battery swapper and other components to "power their house" will find this thread.  They would be wise to read it!

Rick Friedrich claimed that he lost $50,000 putting on the November Renaissance workshop.  They had about 300 people at $250 per head so that's $75,000.  They had to rent a hall in a hotel in a relatively obscure town off the beaten track and I don't see their expenses being in the region of $125,000 to put on this event.  This whole game is so crazy sometimes!

Rick and his associates are apparently eager now to "loose even more money" after the "financial disappointments" of the November workshop and are positively rushing to do it again!  They are adding one extra day and upping the price from $250 per head to a cool $480 per head and they upped the capacity to 1000 people!  They are looking for a "big score" to loose even more money!

RENAISSANCE CDA FREE ENERGY CONVENTION JULY 2011

A Convention giving people a chance to spend time with John Bedini and others of like-mind in actual Assembly and Discussion of Cutting Edge Alternative Energy Technology.

Focus is on:

   * Practical and Efficient Alternative Energy Solutions,
   * Quality Workshop building of such systems,
   * Theory,
   * How to run your vehicles on Bedini Technology and keep your Batteries.

Location: Coeur D'Alene Resort http://www.cdaresort.com See Tour of Resort

Date: Weekend of July 29, 30, 31.

Registration: 7:30-8:30AM July 29. Limit of 1000 persons. Payments must be made at least 3 months in advance of event. Register now as it may fill up by February.

Cost: $480 person. Send to:

                   Renaissance Charge, LLC
                   10183 N Aero Dr. Ste 3
                   Hayden, ID 83835

The July convention will be a clone of the November convention with a few extra tidbits thrown in.  Can't forget "Revenge of the Lawn Mower" either...

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

I will do some speech to text transcribing on one of Rick Friedrich's latest YouTube clips about the "Renaissance Charge 2011 Free Energy Convention:"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryEAPkLsTfg

"This special announcement is brought to you by Renaissance Charge.

Have you ever wondered if you can make your car run in 100% electric power - for free?  It is now possible.

How about a simple device that is a super-efficient motor and a free energy generator, at the same time?  What if this could also be used to restore useless batteries and save you lots of money?

Because our customers asked for it we have organized a Renaissance Charge conference workshop on July 29th to July 31st at the beautiful Coeur d'Alene resort in Idaho.

Not only will you see these fascinating energizers but you will be able to build some alongside genius inventor John Bedini.

Participate in this truly historic event featuring our cutting-edge alternative energy Tesla technology....."

This is the free energy cottage industry in action.

We see the allegation that you can have an electric car running on free energy, presumably from "Bedini technology."  That statement is an absolute lie.

Then there is the statement that a Bedini motor is a "free energy generator" which is another absolute lie.

This conference is an attempt to cash in on the fact that the November conference worked out for the Bedini group, and they are attempting to cash in and make an even bigger score.  They think that they have some momentum, and they are trying to ride that wave.

It is highly doubtful that there will be anything new to "learn" at this conference in comparison to the November conference.  I predict that people that attend both conferences will be very disappointed because the new conference will be a repeat of the November conference.

The most ironic thing about the whole deal is that people that attend this conference will not actually be taught how a Bedini motor works.  They will not be taught that the battery energizes the main coil by applying voltage across the terminals of the coil, and the coil charges up like a standard RL circuit with an exponentially increasing current waveform.  They will not be taught that when the coil discharges through the diode that the coil acts like a current source, which explains why you get high voltage spikes if the charging battery is not there as a load.  They will not be taught that the energy stored in the coil came from the supply battery, and then when the coil discharges into the charging battery is transfers the supply battery's energy into the charging battery less the losses.

So, I predict the attendees that leave the July conference will have no more understanding about the core energy concepts that explain how a Bedini motor works as compared to before they attend the conference.  And that, my friends, is the free energy cottage industry in action.

It's a deplorable farce, a cynical attempt to cash-in on the "Bedini phenomenon" by making false claims about the "technology."

MileHigh

[muDped]

...

It is highly doubtful that there will be anything new to "learn" at this conference in comparison to the November conference.  I predict that people that attend both conferences will be very disappointed because the new conference will be a repeat of the November conference.

The most ironic thing about the whole deal is that people that attend this conference will not actually be taught how a Bedini motor works.  They will not be taught that the battery energizes the main coil by applying voltage across the terminals of the coil, and the coil charges up like a standard RL circuit with an exponentially increasing current waveform.  They will not be taught that when the coil discharges through the diode that the coil acts like a current source, which explains why you get high voltage spikes if the charging battery is not there as a load.  They will not be taught that the energy stored in the coil came from the supply battery, and then when the coil discharges into the charging battery is transfers the supply battery's energy into the charging battery less the losses.

So, I predict the attendees that leave the July conference will have no more understanding about the core energy concepts that explain how a Bedini motor works as compared to before they attend the conference.  And that, my friends, is the free energy cottage industry in action.

It's a deplorable farce, a cynical attempt to cash-in on the "Bedini phenomenon" by making false claims about the "technology."

MileHigh

What the inexperienced "Noob/Noobie/Nooby" may learn at
such a "conference" will not "sink in" until quite some time
afterwards.  It's not quite as instantly felt as "buyers
remorse."

When infected with the "zeal" and the "hope" all normal
skepticism is overwhelmed.  It's somewhat akin to what
is felt with "love" or "lust" or "infatuation."

It will take a string of disappointments for those now
infected to finally come to appreciate the wisdom you've
laid out here...

A deceived mind is very resistant to common sense as it
defends the deception.

Whoever it was that said "No Pain - No Gain" truly did
understand.

[confgoer]

I propose a UBOT-- Unified Bedini Output Test

Decide on a specific industry standard battery. Same brand. New. Conventially charged. Note its specific gravity. Connect a one amp light to it. Draw it down for so many Amp-Hours. Note its specific gravity. Recharge it conventially until starting specific gravity is reached.

Attach it to a Bedini 10 coiler of any design. Charge as many batteries (same brand as original) as permitted until the previously annotated low specific gravity is reached on the host battery, with each destination battery (one or more) reaches the high specific gravity identical to the host battery.

Test B. Attach a fully charged Bedinized identical specific gravity battery to the same 10 coiler as host battery and note how many (one at least hopefully) destination batteries reach the standard high specific gravity figure by the time the Bedinized battery reaches its low specific gravity figure.

Test C. Draw this battery down with a one amp light and note how many amp hours until it again reaches its low specific gravity figure.

Also come up with a Standardized Load Test.

[MileHigh]

Confoger:

Tests based on specific gravity of the electrolyte also have merit.  It's not something that I personally am familiar with.  It's highly doubtful that a fully-charged battery can even fully charge a single fully discharged battery on the far side of the 10-coiler because the current assumption is that roughly 70% of the source battery energy is lost in powering the 10-coiler and only 30% of the energy makes it into the charging battery.  This simple fact can be masked by the use of misdirection.  If you only look at the voltages of the target charging batteries then one source battery can bring up the voltages of several charging batteries so it appears that they are fully charged.  Certainly looking at the specific gravity of the charging batteries would show that they are far from fully charged.

To date, we have no data at all about the 10-coiler's performance in a scenario where you take one source battery and attempt to charge multiple depleted charging batteries.  They only thing that exists is hearsay that alleges this can be done.

MileHigh

[confgoer]

I will research Industry Standard Battery Manufacturers tests.  There must be a "Battery Council' out there.

I just want something agreed upon so this site can finish with the Nattering Nabob thang.

By the way I won't be going to the next Conference.  If there is a cross the boards conference somewhere I would be interested, and no, I don't want to go on the little boat out on the lake.  I want to meet the  scientists of the New Breed.

[confgoer]

O.K. here are some preliminary findings.  There are LOTS of sites with info.  One called the "Battery University."   I have years of experience with batteries in the Automotive industry.  I have a battery just like the guy that designed the Space Shuttle.  I even have the same battery as the president of the united states.  My battery is bigger then most college professors!  My battery is bigger than Hugh Hefner's!!

But I digress.  Batteries are handy as a scientific tool because if the temperature is the same and the weight of lead is the same and the volume of sulfuric acid is the same one can arrive at a Constant.  Just like they agreeded upon Horsepower (how much bullcrap from these rants could one horse pull one lightyear.)

I worked a long time at a Chrome plating plant.  It is the same in any electrolysis process that an Anode and a Cathode, positive and negative item is placed in a soup of sulfuric acid or somesuch, in the case of nickle plating you aquire Nickle Sulphate.  In batteries you have  Lead Sulphate.  Fully charged (1.265 reading specific gravity) you will get a reading due to the condition of the sulphuric acid.  Scratch my head here I believe a specific gravity reading of 0.00 is water- the Constant.  A fully discharged battery will now contain Hydrogen Peroxide.

Automotive starters cause the plating (ion transfer) to jump across in big globs- not smooth.  Then the Alternator kicks in and more big globs the other way.  This is why I believe the discharge test should happen at 1 Amp because it is smooth and batteries are rated at Amp Hours- One Amp produced for 200 say hours.  The "Battery University" site points out that batteries need 12-16 hours to achieve full charge and speak about charging at vaariable rates.  So: full 1.265   3/4 charge: 1.230  1/2: 1.200.  See the sign it says NEWBIE so I welcome correction from any of you eggheads.  Love 'Ya Buddy!

[MileHigh]

In five days it will be one year since the uploading of the "OFFICIAL BEDINI 10 COIL KIT INFOMERCIAL" clip shown above.

The question of the hour is has anyone out there done a project with the 10-coiler that they would like to share with us now that it's one year since the kit became available?

Some people on the EF are still doing some preliminary experimenting with their 10-coilers and I will patiently wait to see if they have any interesting results.  Our friend Jeff, a.k.a. "Bit's-and-Bytes" uses a 10-coiler with his battery swapping system but unfortunately there is no data forthcoming from him about his system.

Anybody out there that has a 10-coiler and wants to discuss it here is welcome.

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

Well, another visit back to my old friend the good old 10-coiler.  It's been more than a year since this device have been made available.  My gut feeling is that Rick Friedrich has sold six or less units over the past year.  There is a small active group on the Energetic Forum still discussing this device.  I think most of the early participants in that thread have all moved on.

I'll lay down the challenge again:  Any of the EF participants are welcome to come here and discuss your 10-coiler or regular Bedini motor.

So a few comments for what it's worth, responding to Plazma's posting:

Greetings and thanks for the interesting questions. I can only respond by stating what I am doing.

1. Sweet Spot(s) - R Friedrich has stated specifically that there are at least 2 sweet spots ref the 10-coiler - one easy to find and one that is more hidden but can give exceptional performance. One assumes that the higher the speed and lower the amp draw the more efficient the charging but that depends on the charging battery. Testing time will tell. 1 amp per coil, to me, is a rough cut because the system is dominated by the charging battery dynamics and, to a degree, by the flywheel effects of a) the rotor, and b) the whirling magnetic vortex. Good (meaning great) bearings have a big effect ref a) and materials of construction (and rotor gap, even the phase of the moon) has an effect on b). And then there is the decision about what do I want? A motor, a generator, or both?! These all interact. I'm working to characterize the switching and trigger dynamics on my 10-coiler as a start to develop meaningful insight (for me) to answer my own questions. This involves building a fair amount of test equipment.

I don't believe Rick Friedrich when he says that there are two sweet spots.  What you really want to do is make your own measurements of average power in and average power out to characterize the device.  I know that's a radical concept, actually measuring the input and output power, but I hold out hope that one day somebody will step up to the plate and actually do that most basic of all measurements.

One assumes that the higher the speed and lower the amp draw the more efficient the charging but that depends on the charging battery.

Your assumptions here would have to be checked with real measurements.  The charging battery will not have any effect on the the charging itself.

the system is dominated by the charging battery dynamics and, to a degree, by the flywheel effects of a) the rotor, and b) the whirling magnetic vortex.

I don't really know what you mean by "charging battery dynamics."  What do you mean by "flywheel effects of the rotor?"  There is no "whirling magnetic vortex."  That looks like a classic example of self-invention.  Seriously, where exactly is the whirling magnetic vortex and why does it whirl?

even the phase of the moon

Not a chance in hell.  That comment is ridiculous.

I'm working to characterize the switching and trigger dynamics on my 10-coiler as a start to develop meaningful insight (for me) to answer my own questions. This involves building a fair amount of test equipment.

Looking forward to seeing the test equipment.  You really should read this thread and the Bedini measurements thread to give you some ideas for test equipment.

MileHigh

[MileHigh]

More commenting on Plazma's posting:

2. Inverters - They have capacitors on their front end inputs - its my understanding that capacitors transform the negative radiant into hot, positive energy. Cap pulsing a charging battery keeps that battery in the so-called 'positive energy' domain - however, the sharp pulsations can induce desirable effects internal to the battery - so, I have a large cap pulser under construction to interface between my 10-coilers output and the charging batteries to help test out and quantify such interface performance, and do so on a large scale, irrespective whether the front end amp draw is 2 amps or 10 amps, or whatever.

The "negative radiant into hot, positive energy" stuff is absolute nonsense.  You are welcome to come here to understand why.

Converting the current pulses from your 10-coiler into voltage pulses is rather ironic.  It would be another interesting discussion if you signed up here and we could explore this further.

2. Battery Impedance - just what is it (0.002 ohm ref the Tesla Switch Thread), is it a static value, or does it change with the degree of charge and the METHOD of charge that the load battery is subjected to? How about lets all devise a standard test that everyone can agree to and get busy building and testing? What are the measurement standards? How many pure resistive ohms does the battery beast have? How many milliHenries does it demonstrate and at what frequency, and how many Farads does it exhibit and, again, at what frequency? Is it a negistor - show me the numbers and what the conditions are that are conducive to negistor behaviour - and be sure to measure and publish the plate thickness, plate surface area, and plate porosity for every cell in the battery while your at it  . . . a very tough and expensive job. No pat answers to this one - just hints.

Batteries don't possess the properties of inductance and capacitance when you look at them under their normal operating conditions.  This is a grave error that I have read many times on the forums.  Your questions about frequency for any alleged capacitive and inductive battery effects is misplaced at best.  It's a long story if you want to get very precise but I am pretty sure I know where you are coming from with respect to that question and it's all wrong.

Plazma, you have some wrong preconceptions and a lot to learn if you want to understand your 10-coiler.  I could offer you and the others some help but it would have to be done on this forum.

MileHigh

[Hoppy]

Bits & Bytes appears to have gone to ground on this one.

Hoppy

[MileHigh]

I agree Hoppy.  Jeff is certainly one of the "high profile" 10-coiler owners but he has had very little to say for several months.  You can't forget the half-dozen or so pretty basic questions that he has been asked multiple times that he has chosen to ignore.  I also doubt that he has sold a single battery swapper at the price of $1200 USD.

I can envision the upcoming July Renaissance conference getting a lot of tepid and even poor reviews.  This would especially be the case for the people that attended the conference last November.  For a three-day conference they are charging almost double the price.  It's basically going to be a repeat of the November conference that will have to be stretched out over three days.  If there are more attendees then they will get less individual attention.  Naturally they will burn off a whole day getting a bunch of grown men to assemble little Bedini motor kits.

And of course nobody will actually be be taught how a Bedini motor really works.  The big Ferris Wheel thing will be there turning slowly but there will be no specifications or performance numbers for it and nobody will know what it is really supposed to do.

MileHigh

[Bits-n-Bytes]

I agree Hoppy.  Jeff is certainly one of the "high profile" 10-coiler owners but he has had very little to say for several months.  You can't forget the half-dozen or so pretty basic questions that he has been asked multiple times that he has chosen to ignore.  I also doubt that he has sold a single battery swapper at the price of $1200 USD.

I can envision the upcoming July Renaissance conference getting a lot of tepid and even poor reviews.  This would especially be the case for the people that attended the conference last November.  For a three-day conference they are charging almost double the price.  It's basically going to be a repeat of the November conference that will have to be stretched out over three days.  If there are more attendees then they will get less individual attention.  Naturally they will burn off a whole day getting a bunch of grown men to assemble little Bedini motor kits.

And of course nobody will actually be be taught how a Bedini motor really works.  The big Ferris Wheel thing will be there turning slowly but there will be no specifications or performance numbers for it and nobody will know what it is really supposed to do.

MileHigh

Still quite comfortable in your arm chair I see MileHile. I haven't had much to say because I have been very busy building devices. You might want to take a look at the new Rejuvenator. No it's not OU, but it does a very nice job on restoring heavily sulfated batteries. You may want to purchase one. Oh but you wouldn't know how to do that, build that is. You hide behind a stage name, sit in your arm chair and spew all kinds of garbage. You are truly a piece of work. Grow up man. Man up, tell us who you are really are. We already know that you cannot build any device that you want to so joyfully bash. Is it because you are a failure and therefore want to see everyone else fail? In your own words, you cannot forget the half dozen questions I asked you about YOU building these devices. It's clear you are a cowered and can only hide behind a forum to spew out your garbage. You may gain some respect if you practice what you preach. Build, test, and report. That is what you are asking everyone else to do. Once again and in your own words (that you told Lawrence) the proof is on your shoulders and only your shoulders. So get out of your ARM Chair, tell us who you really are and build something. If you cannot do these basic things, then just shut the fuck up!

[MileHigh]

Jeff,

It's just more of the same hot air from you.  I am not making any claims and I am certainly not spewing any garbage.  You are the one making the claims and spewing the garbage.  You hide behind your "I'm a builder and you're not!" argument which is a joke.  What I do have to say comes from honest conviction and I stand by it.  

You are the one building stuff and making the claims and I am the one asking you questions about your claims.  That's the way the world works but you can't seem to cope with that fact.  If I was the one building stuff and making claims and you were the one asking the questions I would certainly try to answer them.  So there is your big FAIL Jeff.  What I would be prepared to do if I was in your shoes you cower and hide away from.

And because it's a big FAIL you try to hide that fact by repeatedly saying that I am not building stuff as if that makes any difference.  It DOESN'T make any difference and the unanswered questions remain.  I'll be watching in July to see if any more unsubstantiated claims are made about your stuff and the rest of the stuff presented at the conference.

The person that has lost respect is you.  It's not about me shutting the f@#k up, it's all about you speaking the f@#k up and growing up!

MileHigh

[Grumpy]

If any of Bedini's devices or replications produces radiant energy, radiant electricity, or anything remotely related to that, then you will be able to detect the charge-inducing products.  The simplest detectors are shown in Tesla's Radiant Energy Patents:  U.S. Patent No. 685,957 - Apparatus for the Utilization of Radiant Energy and U.S. Patent No. 685,958 - Method of Utilizing Radiant Energy.

[Bits-n-Bytes]

Jeff,

It's just more of the same hot air from you.  I am not making any claims and I am certainly not spewing any garbage.  You are the one making the claims and spewing the garbage.  You hide behind your "I'm a builder and you're not!" argument which is a joke.  What I do have to say comes from honest conviction and I stand by it.  

You are the one building stuff and making the claims and I am the one asking you questions about your claims.  That's the way the world works but you can't seem to cope with that fact.  If I was the one building stuff and making claims and you were the one asking the questions I would certainly try to answer them.  So there is your big FAIL Jeff.  What I would be prepared to do if I was in your shoes you cower and hide away from.

And because it's a big FAIL you try to hide that fact by repeatedly saying that I am not building stuff as if that makes any difference.  It DOESN'T make any difference and the unanswered questions remain.  I'll be watching in July to see if any more unsubstantiated claims are made about your stuff and the rest of the stuff presented at the conference.

The person that has lost respect is you.  It's not about me shutting the f@#k up, it's all about you speaking the f@#k up and growing up!

MileHigh

Once again you have failed to answer the question. Here, I will restate it, WHO ARE YOU? Real name please, credentials, etc. I have shown you mine, my work and my inventions. So Man Up, stop deflecting.

[MileHigh]

Once again you have failed to answer the question. Here, I will restate it, WHO ARE YOU? Real name please, credentials, etc. I have shown you mine, my work and my inventions. So Man Up, stop deflecting.

I've already posted a few times on the site that I am not revealing my name.  That's my right and my choice.  That's not deflecting.  I have seen a few postings over the years by whackadoos on the forums stating that they are armed to the teeth and prepared to fight to the death if the MIB does a raid to capture their experimental apparatus.  I am not putting myself in potential danger by exposing myself to any possible nutcases out there.

When Bedini alleges that he has been roughed up by the MIB or when he said this about the Ferris Wheel thing, "I was offered mucho money to sell this machine and shut up, I will not take it. as I think it is very important for others to do it," I think that he is lying.  Bedini has never demonstrated over unity and nobody in government cares about him.  The real danger out there is from the armed and rabid free energy whackadoos.

So no deflection, the only real outstanding issues relate to all of the basic questions about your setup that were never answered by you.  I will quote you, "Redrechie, you are right, just imagine your car with a 10 coiler in it as you pass the fueling stations AND the power pedestals for charging. We have shown all this is possible with just a few items at the conference."

You have not shown this is possible Jeff.  You have never presented a single shred of data to support this claim.  The 10-coiler is an under unity device and will never be able to power a house or power a car.  It's a lie that you in conjunction with Rick Friedrich alleged was true at the November conference with the little computer animation showing a 10-coiler in the basement of a house swapping back and forth between two battery banks.  The clip is still there on Rick's YouTube channel.

MileHigh