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Author Topic: Dally, Shark & Ruslan workbench  (Read 55409 times)
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Posts: 288
Itsu,

When you were looking for phase shifts, which did not appear, roughly, what was the phase relationship between the two loops?

PW
   
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I don't want interfere, but I think it is too early do these measurement.
Without proper tuning results will not be useful.

Vasik

I agree with Vasic, it is time to try tuning while he is available...

PW

 
   

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Vasik,
I could not find your translation of this video in your documentation thread.
Perhaps I have overlooked it.  Could you please direct me to the translation?
PW

PW,

This video consists of many short videos glued together. It appeared that I translated only first fragment (which I actually wanted to show).
Translation (attached) not in documentation thread because it's Alexeev's materials.
I will translate fragment with kacher on/off later today.

Vasik


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   
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Posts: 288
PW,

This video consists of many short videos glued together. It appeared that I translated only first fragment (which I actually wanted to show).
Translation (attached) not in documentation thread because it's Alexeev's materials.
I will translate fragment with kacher on/off later today.

Vasik

Thanks Vasik...

I have seen and read all the material in your document thread...

Greatly appreciated,
PW
   

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I agree with Vasik, it is time to try tuning while he is available...
PW

I can't say that I like how discussion going here, but yes, I am still available.

From my point of view there is very little value in theorizing how thing works until it is actually works  >:-)


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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Itsu,

When you were looking for phase shifts, which did not appear, roughly, what was the phase relationship between the two loops?

PW

They are practically zero or 180° depending on how i put the current probe or current transformer around the wires.

Itsu
   

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PW,

This video consists of many short videos glued together. It appeared that I translated only first fragment (which I actually wanted to show).
Translation (attached) not in documentation thread because it's Alexeev's materials.
I will translate fragment with kacher on/off later today.

Vasik

Vasik,


thanks again for the translation  / pdf.


First thing that strikes me is the blue collector voltage shown which is far more cleaner and regular then mine.
I don't think the elaborate circuit with the 3 MOSFETs is used, so it could be the problem i have.

Is there a circuit available of the used Kacher driver in this video which i can build to compare?


Itsu
   

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After Itsu's experiments, does anyone here have any doubts that the Yoke's material is subjected to MHz E-field and H-fields powered by the Kacher (indirectly or directly) ?

It does show we have MHz E-field and H-fields, but if it the cause of any power generating effect i don't know.

I still think the earth wire is the primary cause for generating/supplying power somehow.


Itsu
   

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From my point of view there is very little value in theorizing how thing works until it is actually works  >:-)
I only asked a question about any doubts regarding my conclusions about the E & H fields that the yoke is subjected to.
Only Picowatt wrote a valid doubt, making and alternative proposition that the PP is the source of the energy for the E-field between L2 and L3 - not the Kacher alone.

I did not ask what is the response of the ferrite to these E & H fields.  I asked you (plural) to consider that there could be an unexpected response.

  • I am not proposing changing the tuning motions that you had translated. By all means go ahead and do all that.
  • I am not proposing changes to the circuit at this time.
  • I am not leading Itsu and other builders to use different components.

However anyone (including you) you that does not insist that the ferrite material is exactly the same as the author's is effectively leading builders to use a different component and deviate from the original design.

If you reply that the yoke is just a simple transformer where nothing unusual happens or the material of the ferrite does not matter or it only needs to be LF, then it will be you who is theorizing.

Just remember that if you (plural) fail to make the Output power > PP power + Kacher power (or the sought intermediate waveforms) then the most likely culprit is the imprecise replication of one key component, namely the Yoke.

FYI: Even a conventional cored transformer is a very complicated device.
   

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And one more thing, noticing that the gain must happen in the red circuit is not theorizing.  It is schematic analysis.

Also, noticing that the red circuit is designed to carry two different frequency signals which become split at the cap and where the LF is routed to power conditioning components: L6, FWBR and caps that follow it, is not theorizing - it is circuit analysis.
   

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Vasik,
thanks again for the translation  / pdf.
First thing that strikes me is the blue collector voltage shown which is far more cleaner and regular then mine.
I don't think the elaborate circuit with the 3 MOSFETs is used, so it could be the problem i have.
Is there a circuit available of the used Kacher driver in this video which i can build to compare?

Itsu,

Most of Alexeev's circuits use controlled Tesla coil.
I am attaching one with kacher, it's a kacher variant with MOSFET (see green box on the left).
Probably he use something like this in this video.

Vasik

PS found another really old schematic with kacher, attached


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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It does show we have MHz E-field and H-fields,
Does the energy to construct these fields across the yoke come from the Kacher or from the PP ?

...but if it the cause of any power generating effect i don't know.
You are not certain about that one way or the other....and that's good.

I still think the earth wire is the primary cause for generating/supplying power somehow.
Wouldn't that mean that since only the Kacher's BJT emitter is grounded, then the extra energy must flow from the ground wire to the emitter and through the BJT to the collector and to the Kacher's secondary winding and to the rod-gizmo and to the spiral antenna and finally into the red circuit through the air gap ?
   

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I am attaching one with kacher, it's a kacher variant with MOSFET (see green box on the left).
Tell us more about the slotted aluminum tube or foil roll in this Alexeev's device (razrezanaya aluminivaya truba ili folga).

PS found another really old schematic with kacher, attached
Is it Alexeev's ?
« Last Edit: 2021-07-02, 11:48:33 by verpies »
   

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PW,

here is updated translation for the video.

Vasik


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

Hero Member
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Posts: 738
I only asked a question about any doubts regarding my conclusions about the E & H fields that the yoke is subjected to.
Only Picowatt wrote a valid doubt, making and alternative proposition that the PP is the source of the energy for the E-field between L2 and L3 - not the Kacher alone.

I did not ask what is the response of the ferrite to these E & H fields.  I asked you (plural) to consider that there could be an unexpected response.

  • I am not proposing changing the tuning motions that you had translated. By all means go ahead and do all that.
  • I am not proposing changes to the circuit at this time.
  • I am not leading Itsu and other builders to use different components.

However anyone (including you) you that does not insist that the ferrite material is exactly the same as the author's is effectively leading builders to use a different component and deviate from the original design.

If you reply that the yoke is just a simple transformer where nothing unusual happens or the material of the ferrite does not matter or it only needs to be LF, then it will be you who is theorizing.

Just remember that if you (plural) fail to make the Output power > PP power + Kacher power (or the sought intermediate waveforms) then the most likely culprit is the imprecise replication of one key component, namely the Yoke.

FYI: Even a conventional cored transformer is a very complicated device.

verpies,

both Stalker and Alexeev said that all kind of ferrite cores can be used instead of TV yoke, so perhaps, there is no need to worry about it's material now.

And about leading, I don't want to lead anybody. My idea was to make information about this device available to everyone. Unfortunately went way too far and in a wrong direction.

Regards,
Vasik

PS as an entertainment https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHbzSif78qQ  ;)


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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Tell us more about the slotted aluminum tube or foil roll in this Alexeev's device (razrezanaya aluminivaya truba ili folga).
I don't have much to tell. Some Alexeev's coils contained aluminum foil. To increase capacitance and apply HV static voltage as I understand.

Quote
Is it Alexeev's ?
Supposingly yes.


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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Itsu,

Most of Alexeev's circuits use controlled Tesla coil.
I am attaching one with kacher, it's a kacher variant with MOSFET (see green box on the left).
Probably he use something like this in this video.

Vasik

PS found another really old schematic with kacher, attached

So does this mean that the shorting with the tweezers is done on a MOSFET?

Itsu

   

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Does the energy to construct these fields across the yoke come from the Kacher or from the PP ?
You are not certain about that one way or the other....and that's good.
Wouldn't that mean that since only the Kacher's BJT emitter is grounded, then the extra energy must flow from the ground wire to the emitter and through the BJT to the collector and to the Kacher's secondary winding and to the rod-gizmo and to the spiral antenna and finally into the red circuit through the air gap ?




Quote
Does the energy to construct these fields across the yoke come from the Kacher or from the PP ?


When testing with the neon across the Yoke secondaries, i was not using the Push Pull (disconnected /open), just the Kacher, so for me these fields across the yoke come from the kacher.

Quote
Wouldn't that mean that since only the Kacher's BJT emitter is grounded, then the extra energy must flow from the ground wire to the emitter and through the BJT to the collector and to the Kacher's secondary winding and to the rod-gizmo and to the spiral antenna and finally into the red circuit through the air gap ?

Well, not only the  Kacher's BJT emitter is grounded, the whole return plane is, so there are many places this extra energy can enter the system.

Itsu


   

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So does this mean that the shorting with the tweezers is done on a MOSFET?
No, because he clearly says that he is shorting the base and emitter in this video.
I think I posted about this here.
   

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both Stalker and Alexeev said that all kind of ferrite cores can be used instead of TV yoke,
Easy to say when they are all using the same ferrite core from that old Russian TV. Namely the ОС-90.38ПЦ12.

Is it Alexeev's ?
Supposingly yes.
That Alexeev's schematic also has that ОС-90.38ПЦ12 core listed on it.

There are other examples, too:
For example the functional STAAAR yoke device also used the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 core:



Note the same scheme repeating over and over - two different frequency currents + HV applied to that core.

The same guy who got it working with the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 yoke core could not repeat his success with another core, listen to him saying that explicitly in this video.

...and then there is the self-running device by another author shown in this video which is using the same yoke core, too.

That's 4 anomalous devices using the same Russian core !   
It is no wonder that only people from the former Soviet Union eastern block are having success replicating these devices.





   

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So does this mean that the shorting with the tweezers is done on a MOSFET?

Itsu

He clearly says shorting base - emitter, but who knows.

Vasik


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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Posts: 738
Easy to say when they are all using the same ferrite core from that old Russian TV. Namely the ОС-90.38ПЦ12.
Supposingly yes.

That Alexeev's schematic also has that ОС-90.38ПЦ12 core listed on it.

There are other examples, too:
For example the functional STAAAR yoke device also used the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 core:



Note the same scheme is repeated over and over - two different frequency currents + HV applied to that core.

...and then there is the self-running device shown in this video which is using the same yoke ferrite, too.

That's 4 anomalous devices using the same Russian core !   
It is no wonder that only people from the former Soviet Union eastern block are having success replicating these devices.

Rulslan use in many devices other core than yoke
Stalker use ring cores
Alexeev use other cores

It will work without moon soil  :)

BTW most yoke core obtained nowadays from old monitors, not TV's


---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   

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Rulslan use in many devices other core than yoke
Stalker use ring cores
Alexeev use other cores
They have tried using other cores but the working devices use the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 yoke core.

It is the same with the guy who got one device working with the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 yoke core but could not repeat his success with another core, listen to him saying that explicitly in this video.

It will work without moon soil  :)
Derision is not an argument.
4 functional devices which use this core is not a coincidence.

The ОС-90.38ПЦ12 yoke core is not made out of moon dust. It is a high-resistivity ceramic that just has properties that have been proven to work.
I have verified one unusual ferroelectric property of this core, myself and I already wrote about it in this thread.
It is quite likely that there are other cores that posses all the desirable properties...but why take the chance that they do not?

   

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They have tried using other cores but the working devices use the ОС-90.38ПЦ12 yoke core.

When you stretch facts to fit your point I smile  :)



---------------------------
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.
   
Sr. Member
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Posts: 288
PW,

here is updated translation for the video.

Vasik

Greatly appreciated Vasik.

Thank-you very much...

PW

   
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