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Author Topic: Serbian Professor Savic Sonic water heater replication COP 12  (Read 294182 times)
Group: Guest
Quote
For rising up 1kg water from 15°C to 90°C in 1s, you need 313 KW. This rules out a Cop 6.

Indeed.  4.19 Joules equals one Calorie of heat.  I think I learned that in grade 10 Chemistry in 1973.

I am not really following this thread but it appears that two members here are "channeling" comments and responses from the YouTube "Waterenergy1" dude.

It reminds me of the "experimenters" that talk about their systems outputting 10, 20 or 50 kilowatts of power with no sign of a load that actually demonstrates that kind of power output.  I would not want to be in the same room as a 50-kilowatt load, even if it was just for a one-second test.

Just think, with a "magic" system that outputs 313 kilowatts of equivalent power you are just a fraction of a second away from the 90°C water becoming an explosive blast of 100°C steam.  He must have really good reflexes for his on/off switch.

He should get a contract with Con Edison in New York City for doing commercial steam production.
   
Group: Guest
2.1mm Scenario (Shared in Early Correspondence)

I think this 2.1mm measurement is the distance from the tip of the open ended can back to the ring around the can.  I think our contact is telling us that our negative ring electrode has to be back from the open face of the can 2.1mm.  This has to be what he is saying.  So, the ring would have to be around the top of the can as shown in his diagram and we still have the problem of trying to keep the can from touching the ring.  Mica is sounding better all the time.

« Last Edit: 2011-09-11, 17:05:14 by Slovenia »
   
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Exnihiloest
Appologies
Two different Devices
the PDF that Slovenia is composing from "scratch" is from an Engineer in Serbia![COP 6+]

The Vid of the very high heating elements 1 sec etc............ is from another group that has been working with acoustic resonance and heating water [as per their movie]

They returned my Email yesterday promising to share more shortly!

Sorry for this Mixup

Chet
PS
Yes MH its freakin amazing if true ?
And I completely believe its possible [of course=}]
   
Group: Guest
I just added a pick about Chet's last post which illustrates what I meant about the 2.1mm scenario.
   
Group: Guest
Screw Clamp

A screw clamp might make a good expedient ring to get started with.  At least it would be an expedient method of finding the inside diameter for our ring.
   
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Slovenia
this post from Core at energetic shines this in the Acoustic resonance light !!

I am liking this a lot more!!!

Quote,

According to your contact a beer can is not the only thing you can use. One only requirement appears to be that the metal fundamental resonate frequency of 60Hz or 50Hz. To get this the cylinder has to be honed/sanded until it rings.
This can be checked by mounting your cylinder on a rod next to a speaker that is sounding a 60Hz frequency. According to him if a nail is suspended very close to the open end it will ring when the can vibrates. The nail acts like an amplifier.

So step one, and the most important, is that the cylinder regardless of material used is 'tuned' to your line frequency. If this step is not completed everything else is a wash.

-Core

------------------------
More on the cathode ring......
@Sovenia
We wrap the finished [tuned]can in the proper shim ,coating both with a release agent [no stick]
Then we wrap our Ring around ,then surround the ring with dialectric epoxy ?

Slide it off when cured we fuss with the epoxy annulus so it maintains the space plus allows water flow.
Yeah its tricky but its cool [preferably Hot]

Tuning I believe will be done by sanding the end till the ring??

Chet
   
Group: Guest
Chet,

I think you are right on it!!  Yes, if we don't get the can to resonate properly the whole endeavor is a waste of time.

Regards,
Slovenia


Slovenia
this post from Core at energetic shines this in the Acoustic resonance light !!

I am liking this a lot more!!!

Quote,

According to your contact a beer can is not the only thing you can use. One only requirement appears to be that the metal fundamental resonate frequency of 60Hz or 50Hz. To get this the cylinder has to be honed/sanded until it rings.
This can be checked by mounting your cylinder on a rod next to a speaker that is sounding a 60Hz frequency. According to him if a nail is suspended very close to the open end it will ring when the can vibrates. The nail acts like an amplifier.

So step one, and the most important, is that the cylinder regardless of material used is 'tuned' to your line frequency. If this step is not completed everything else is a wash.

-Core

------------------------
More on the cathode ring......
@Sovenia
We wrap the finished [tuned]can in the proper shim ,coating both with a release agent [no stick]
Then we wrap our Ring around ,then surround the ring with dialectric epoxy ?

Slide it off when cured we fuss with the epoxy annulus so it maintains the space plus allows water flow.
Yeah its tricky but its cool [preferably Hot]

Tuning I believe will be done by sanding the end till the ring??

Chet
   
Group: Guest
Quote
I think you are right on it!!  Yes, if we don't get the can to resonate properly the whole endeavor is a waste of time.

You guys are amazing and I guess this fantasy about resonance will never die.  Resonance is nothing more than the temporary storage of energy that circulates back and forth between two storage elements.  It doesn't create energy and never will create energy out of nothing.  Just look at the recent Romerouk example, and you can connect the dots all the way back right to the beginnings of the online free energy forums.  No project that has had the same resonance fantasy has ever produced excess energy.

Plus as was indicated earlier in the thread by others, the YouTube guy is not credible and he presents silly data that makes no sense.

This is also a dangerous endeavour, playing with water and mains power.  Stay safe.

MileHigh
   
Group: Guest
As per usual Chet you seem to be getting over-excited about something that seems to have little substance and as yet no grounding in reality.

As someone already pointed out, why in the diagram are anodes and cathodes (+ & -) depicted when it is supposedly driven from an AC source?

And can someone please tell me where the 300Hz or 400Hz comes from... what's that all about?  Clearly there's a serious lack of good, reliable information and a total lack of data on this, which tends to always be the case when someone is leading the gullible down the proverbial garden path. This reeks of nonsense to me... it hasn't come from IST, has it?

And let's just be honest for a moment Chet, that Youtube vid you're raving about could be absolutely anything, including an electrolyser firing up... it's meaningless rubbish! No data, no cct, diddly-squat!

I agree with MH, as simple as this is, it has the potential to be lethal if not constructed with care and precision. :'(
   
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Farrah
Can't argue to much with you or MH ! [still gonna play with it]


Tonywoodside   8xA circuit
have you seen anything credible?

Claims

HEAT / STEAM RESONATOR (ELEMENT) STAN MEYER STYL ....CIRCUIT TEST
90VDC / 1000MA ...AT 1.2 KHz

WE ARE TESTING THIS ELEMENT FOR THE HOME HEATING BOILER.....HEATUP 1LITER WATER FORM 15C TO 90C CELSIUS IN JUST 1 SEC ....THAT IS FASTER THAN A MAGNETRON......ELEMENT IN THIS TEST IS 3XXX 3#INCH....WE US A NEW CIRCUIT FOR THIS TEST


Thanks
Chet
   

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This device is reminiscent of a room humidifier
which I purchased in 1965.  It was a glass jar with
a screw on bakelite lid which supported two
stainless steel electrodes spaced about 1 inch
apart which extended down into the jar vertically.

The jar was filled about 70% with tap water, lid
screwed on to immerse electrodes, then plugged
into the AC outlet.  100/120 Volts AC was applied
directly to the two electrodes which resulted in
a small amount of current flow through the tap water.

After about 20 minutes the water was hot enough to
begin boiling and steam/water vapor would exit the
jar through a vent in the lid into the room to humidify
it in the dry winter months.  At the time I was in Honshu,
Japan where the power was 100 Volts/50 Hz.  The device
also worked well in Kyushu, Japan with 100 Volts/60 Hz.

After weeks of use the stainless steel plates would become
coated with minerals from the water and would have to
be scrubbed clean to restore normal operation.  It consumed
little power and worked quite well but did have certain
potential hazards.  I doubt whether the device is available
anywhere nowadays.  I still have one but haven't used it in
years.


---------------------------
"The best teachers are those who show you where to look, but don't tell you what to see." - Alexandra k. Trenfor.
   
Group: Guest
...
Resonance is nothing more than the temporary storage of energy that circulates back and forth between two storage elements.  It doesn't create energy and never will create energy out of nothing.
...

I don't agree, it does create energy. "Resonance" is a magic word, like "scalar wave", "hocus pocus", "lenz-less" or "abracadabra". You can build any device of whatever kind, then you say out loud "resonance! resonance! resonance!" while skipping around and invoking Tesla's spirit, and free energy appears!   :D ;D


   
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"After being constructed, the Davey's telekinetic heater must be "tuned" in two different manners. The first tuning depends on providing the hemispherical bowl (1) with such frequency of the own oscillations, that makes this bowl to resonate acoustically when a sound of the frequency 50 Hertz is emitted nearby. The second tuning of the heater depends on appropriate selecting the distance "L" between both bowls (1) and (2). On this distance depends the formation of the standing wave between both bowls. Thus it decides about the energy efficiency of the entire heater."


http://www.rexresearch.com/davey/davey.htm

http://www.totalizm.nazwa.pl/boiler.htm

   
Group: Guest

In the Davey's device, it is not clear why the heating is attributed to the sound.
There are two electrodes immersed in water. Ordinary water is a resistive conductor. Therefore current flows through the water and can heat it. This is the simplest explanation following from Okkham's razor, because we have no evidence of a real effect from the sound.

   
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Quote
The second tuning of the heater depends on appropriate selecting the distance "L" between both bowls (1) and (2). On this distance depends the formation of the standing wave between both bowls. Thus it decides about the energy efficiency of the entire heater."


A quarter standing wave of 50 or 60Hz is over a million, yes, ONE MILLION, metres in length... how far are these bowls apart???  C.C

Clearly if there is any truth in this thing actually working then resistive heating, possibly along with a little cavitation - if the beer can actually vibrates - would seem to make more sense.
   
Group: Guest
A quarter standing wave of 50 or 60Hz is over a million, yes, ONE MILLION, metres in length...
...

Only for EM waves at speed c, not for sound waves in water. 
The general formula is: L=v/F, L= wave length, F: frequency, v: speed of the wave in the medium (For sound waves in water, v=1450m/s. For EM waves, v=c=3*108m/s)

The quater wave of a 50 hz sound wave in water  is: 1/4*1450/50 =7.25 mtr. In any case, it is much larger than the dimension of the device, therefore there is no standing wave at this frequency.

If we consider a quater standing wave along a beer can of length around 15cm, the frequency should be: F=v/(4*0.15)=2417 Hz.

If we consider a standing wave in the 2.1mm gap, it will be a half-wave because there is no open end, so the frequency should be F=v/(2*2.1*10-3)=345Khz.


   
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Right you are EXN, I'd neglected to consider that we are not talking about EM wavelengths.  :-[
   
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Farrah
HHO tech is your passion ,I know you feel Meyer was dubious ,however you seem to be  witholding comment on this
{very unusual for you] .

TONYWOODSIDE 8XA Circuit

Now I see its for sale on Ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanley-Meyer-8XA-Circuit-HHO-Generator-/160607306490
Under the Mans own name and 100% pos feedback??

The Vid I reposted from energetic of the Wild Temp Claims ,I believe they are using this 8XA circuit?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsmdSkYEp6M

H

Text,

Uploaded by THEWATERENERGY1 on Jul 18, 2011

HEAT / STEAM RESONATOR (ELEMENT) STAN MEYER STYL ....CIRCUIT TEST
90VDC / 1000MA ...AT 1.2 KHz

WE ARE TESTING THIS ELEMENT FOR THE HOME HEATING BOILER.....HEATUP 1LITER WATER FORM 15C TO 90C CELSIUS IN JUST 1 SEC ....THAT IS FASTER THAN A MAGNETRON......ELEMENT IN THIS TEST IS 3XXX 3#INCH....WE US A NEW CIRCUIT FOR THIS TEST

WHAT WE DOING IS TESTING A CIRCUIT AT SEVERALS FREQENCY AND VOLTAGE,,
IN ORDER TO FIND OUT WHAT THE EXACT COMBINATION IS TO FIND RESONANCE IN THE WATER AND HEAT IT VERY QUIKLY,AT THE RIGHT RESONANCE IN THE CIRCUIT,AT THE LOWEST AMP / CANCEL OUT THE AMP.....

THE REASONS WHY WE NEED A HEAT RESONATOR IS, TO DEFROST THE
YOUR WATERFEULTANK IN THE WINTER, INCASE THE WATERFEULTANK IS FROZEN.
AND WE WILL US THE HEATRESONATOR IN A HOMEHEATING BOILER TO HEAT UP THE WATER AND PUMP THE WATER A ROND YOUR HOUSE SO
WE HAVE A WARM HOUSE IN THE WINTER FOR LAST ENERGY AND EMISSIONS....IN EUROPE WE US A LOT PROPANE AT THIS TIME....TO WARMUP YOUR HOUSES

IN THE FUTURE WE WILL POST MORE INFORMATION AND THE SYSTEM AT WORK.

-------------------------------

Just asking??
[for a comment]
   

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Frequency equals matter...


Buy me a drink
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanley-Meyer-8XA-Circuit-HHO-Generator-/160607306490
That is a computer generated circuit board picture. CGI!
And No returns accepted.
The website: http://www.GlobalKast.com 404
Quote
Up for auction is the Stanley Meyer 8XA Circuit. This is the circuit that Stanley Meyer used in his Variable Plate setup. This circuit comes completely assembled just as you see in the image above. If you have any questions feel free to ask. Thanks, GlobalKast.com

Up for auction? There is only one?
No other listings.
Other items for sale is ZERO! with a 100% Feedback?

Sorry I can not navigate this to research. The listing is disfunctioning.
Don't even get caught on this one.
This guy sells sports cards.

Here is a user feedback: http://myworld.ebay.com/mizumoauto/

I watched the video. He is blowing smoke, or ink into soapy water?

Git the F**k outa here, clowns.



---------------------------
   
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HHMM
I see he's over at Stevie1001's place?

http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,510.0.html

Chet
   
Group: Guest
Farrah
HHO tech is your passion ,I know you feel Meyer was dubious ,however you seem to be  witholding comment on this
{very unusual for you] .

TONYWOODSIDE 8XA Circuit

Now I see its for sale on Ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanley-Meyer-8XA-Circuit-HHO-Generator-/160607306490
Under the Mans own name and 100% pos feedback??

The Vid I reposted from energetic of the Wild Temp Claims ,I believe they are using this 8XA circuit?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsmdSkYEp6M

Nothing to say Chet. As GK says it is not even a photo of a genuine cct board. Doesn't even say exactly what it is supposed to do! Clearly he is trying to make a sale relying on a gullible Meyer fanatic. Look at the other stuff he has sold - it's all just junk sales.  C.C

And that youtube video is meaningless trash, it could be anything in anything connected to anything, with the operater doing anything! Pointless utter bullshit.
   
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Wow, I just strolled out of this topic on another forum,
into the same topic on this forum noting near verbatimism,
and I feel like I'm (now) stuck in a hall of mirrors of sorts.

All the same answers are not being addressed
and all the obvious failure points aren't either
Gosh that makes it so hard to help at all.

Farrah's being farrah to expected high standards,
exnihiloest is on the mark with whiplash math,
Wings right there with relevant quote and links,
and dumped made me realize how old I am now
(yep dumped, had one of those too, along with the hotdog cooker...)
and even exnihiloest's sardonic humor was met with an equal temperment of safety.

Then at the center is slovenia trying to piece it together without electrical knowledge,
with chet along for the ride hoping "This" one might (finally) be the real deal.

Can't find fault with any of you really.

But, that this amused me on the last forum,
and I was relaxed enough to say so (dumb move),
almost caused me to alienate slovenia by accident.

I'll repeat the way I explained it where I just came from...



copy/paste:
Quote from: Slovenia;157510
If people think this is to funny, I'll stop wasting my time posting here!!

heheh, relax, it wasn't that specific.

It just got funny for a moment.

The analogy might be like taking a dozen puppies for a walk,
you all start out in the same general direction essentially,
but at some point free-will takes over on an individual basis
and puppies take off in all kinds of unexpected directions,
and as a result the net gain isn't one step further down the sidewalk...



That didn't happen here of course,
everyone here are straight-shooters.
But am I wrong that this actually happens
way to much on projects these days ?


   
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Compu
Oh that was you!!
[the new kid "peeps"]

thanks for your help [really]

And as far as the Puppy syndrome...........
Yes it happens most of the time
in this case a true "replication " will be attempted with the help of Mr.C [the contact]

Yes Grumpy I am actually gonna build something :P

@EM
I have a few antenna questions please?

We are attempting to tune the can ,I know you have an opinion on this device being "resistive"in nature.

However ,I have a tuning question,the inventor says hang a nail till you get it shaking in the presence of 60hz speaker/amplfyer ,while you sand and tune the can [I assume for mass as well as length]

If you were to humor me,  I feel this  device is Parabolic by design [sort of]?,how would an antenna man use this technique to the maximum benefit[most sensitive] for tuning purposes?

Hang the nail in front ?on the side ? a given distance ?ETC.
Any help will be appreciated.
Thanks
Chet
PS
On another note
Farrah
Tony woodside does have something special going on with high voltage , milli amps and  water/no electrolyte
I am going to try and get his # and more info

« Last Edit: 2011-09-18, 21:40:16 by ramset »
   
Group: Guest
Yes, I'm here too.  That's why it looks similar.  Chet brought me over here because there are a lot of builders here.

I haven't posted here for a while for another reason though which I won't go into.


Wow, I just strolled out of this topic on another forum,
into the same topic on this forum noting near verbatimism,
and I feel like I'm (now) stuck in a hall of mirrors of sorts.


Then at the center is slovenia trying to piece it together without electrical knowledge,
with chet along for the ride hoping "This" one might (finally) be the real deal.

Can't find fault with any of you really.

But, that this amused me on the last forum,
and I was relaxed enough to say so (dumb move),
almost caused me to alienate slovenia by accident.

I'll repeat the way I explained it where I just came from...


copy/paste:
heheh, relax, it wasn't that specific.

It just got funny for a moment.

   
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Posts: 61
I have a basic question that some one might have an answer.

As we all know, water is not conductive.
Addition of salt or wat ever allows water to be broken to H2O.

Exactly what is happening at atomic/molecular  level to allow break down of water to occur in the presence of
say KOH or NaCl? and electric current?
   
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